The Lean Gains / IF learning and Discussion Log

[EArch]

Frank... a diet is a diet, whether it is the traditional bodybuilder-esk diet that I follow (6 small meals throughout the day) or the LG with the fasting or not, a diet is a diet and unfortunately we as society (because I have been guilty of this in the past as well, we all have at one point in time) will let just about any excuse deter us from doing what is hard and we would rather not do (diet and exercise included). There will always be obstacles, if you want it bad enough, you will find a way to over-come these obstacles and do what is necessary to achieve your goals. And also like the old cliche, "Excuses are like A$$holes, everyone has one!"

But hey, back on point to what you said, I agree 100% that LG would definitely be a very easy diet to follow when traveling and have time restraints, etc.

It's hard because I'm traveling on a bus with a d1 hockey team, hotels, dinners, lack of anything resembling a decent gym, sensitive time tables, not knowing what time of food you'll be able to get, trust me its not like I am going to day bussineaa meetings and sitting around my hotel.

Edit; submitted early on smart phone more below

 

[monstermash]

And also like the old cliche, "Excuses are like A$$holes, everyone has one and they all stink!"

Fixed.

 

[EArch]

Frank... a diet is a diet, whether it is the traditional bodybuilder-esk diet that I follow (6 small meals throughout the day) or the LG with the fasting or not, a diet is a diet and unfortunately we as society (because I have been guilty of this in the past as well, we all have at one point in time) will let just about any excuse deter us from doing what is hard and we would rather not do (diet and exercise included). There will always be obstacles, if you want it bad enough, you will find a way to over-come these obstacles and do what is necessary to achieve your goals. And also like the old cliche, "Excuses are like A$$holes, everyone has one!"

But hey, back on point to what you said, I agree 100% that LG would definitely be a very easy diet to follow when traveling and have time restraints, etc.

It's hard because I'm traveling on a bus with a d1 hockey team, hotels, dinners, lack of anything resembling a decent gym, sensitive time tables, not knowing what time or type of food you'll be able to get, trust me its not like I am going to day bussiness meetings and sitting around my hotel most of the day. Lots of improv and making crap up as you go.

I could try it but feel like it could be a recipe for disaster. Too many unkowns in this line of work, and the places teams eat are not physique friendly.

Like I said I will be able to go 100% in a few weeks after season.

 

[ScottyDoc]

It's hard because I'm traveling on a bus with a d1 hockey team, hotels, dinners, lack of anything resembling a decent gym, sensitive time tables, not knowing what time or type of food you'll be able to get, trust me its not like I am going to day bussiness meetings and sitting around my hotel most of the day. Lots of improv and making crap up as you go.

I could try it but feel like it could be a recipe for disaster. Too many unkowns in this line of work, and the places teams eat are not physique friendly.

Like I said I will be able to go 100% in a few weeks after season.

OK, I apologize if I was coming down too hard, just trying to make the point of... "Where there is a will there is a way!" Now I understand that some people who travel their whole lives may not have access to a gym at all times, but there are many things you can do in your hotel to at least maintain your physique until you get back in town or someplace where a gym is accessible and the same goes with your diet, I know it is boring, but when out to eat, you can get a chicken salad (double breast) with just oil & vinegar. Or grilled fish with just lemon juice and seasonings and a sweet potato, or small portion of brown/wild rice, there are always healthy choices, you just have to buckle down and stick to them! Good Luck my Friend!

 

[EArch]

OK, I apologize if I was coming down too hard, just trying to make the point of... "Where there is a will there is a way!" Now I understand that some people who travel their whole lives may not have access to a gym at all times, but there are many things you can do in your hotel to at least maintain your physique until you get back in town or someplace where a gym is accessible and the same goes with your diet, I know it is boring, but when out to eat, you can get a chicken salad (double breast) with just oil & vinegar. Or grilled fish with just lemon juice and seasonings and a sweet potato, or small portion of brown/wild rice, there are always healthy choices, you just have to buckle down and stick to them! Good Luck my Friend!

Yeah man lol its tough but I do need more discipline on the road for sure, we eat so much Italian food with hockey teams. Appreciate your response and good lifting/dieting!

 

[ScottyDoc]

Yeah man lol its tough but I do need more discipline on the road for sure, we eat so much Italian food with hockey teams. Appreciate your response and good lifting/dieting!

Yes sirrr, just wanted you to know it was just me trying assert some "Tough Love" as some would put it vs. me just being an A$$!

 

[Frank Reynolds]

Frank... a diet is a diet, whether it is the traditional bodybuilder-esk diet that I follow (6 small meals throughout the day) or the LG with the fasting or not,

I understand your sentiment especially when you are getting down to the nity gritty, low BF, but it is just not so in most cases. Eating 6 meals on the road according to an exact meal plan, is MUCH more difficult and takes much discipline then can be had with LG. I will explain below.

Yeah man lol its tough but I do need more discipline on the road for sure, we eat so much Italian food with hockey teams. Appreciate your response and good lifting/dieting!

It's hard because I'm traveling on a bus with a d1 hockey team, hotels, dinners, lack of anything resembling a decent gym, sensitive time tables, not knowing what time or type of food you'll be able to get, trust me its not like I am going to day bussiness meetings and sitting around my hotel most of the day. Lots of improv and making crap up as you go.

I could try it but feel like it could be a recipe for disaster. Too many unkowns in this line of work, and the places teams eat are not physique friendly.

Like I said I will be able to go 100% in a few weeks after season.

All that is the part of the reason why THIS type of eating is FAR more suited for this type of thing, and much more forgiving.

No offense but I think sometimes you guys make too much of this.

Bottom line is if you are on the road on the weekends, and you are on "low days" where you can eat 2k calories. Do you understand how EASY that is to do on the road? Sit on a bus all day, fasting, eat a 2k calorie dinner at Vinny's house of meat balls and call it a day. If that is at 9pm it doesn't make a difference.

I mean it is not rocket science. Fast from the night before, until later in the day, when the team eats EAT a meal. Even if you eat your 2k calories in Mcdonalds chicken nuggets. It is what it is.

It is so forgiving because you can limit it to 1-2 meals. Hard to **** that up.

If you are eating 6 meals a day for example, 350 cal a meal, and you have eaten 5 meals(1750cal), you slip up, and eat 1k calories of Taco Bell you are now well over your calories. Where as you can eat 2k in taco bell on IF and be perfectly fine. It may not be "optimal".

I just can't grasp why this would be difficult in this situation. It is pretty much perfectly suited for this. I mean you can be "dieting" and still enjoy some meals with your team. You don't have to eat at specific times, or 3 exact meals to exact macros, etc.

I would eat 1 meal, with maybe one snack on the bus even if it was a shake and some damn sunchips. Then for the actual meal, just EAT something. Use some common sense, you can get something semi decent anywhere. With such a huge surplus of calories you will be FINE.

Stop thinking with a traditional BB mindset, that "this and that" is not allowed, etc. Keep your food "BB clean" during the week if you choose, and on the weekend just get through it, trying to stay within your calorie target.

Let me ask you this. What would your alternative to this be? How do you plan to eat on the road?

Again, don't overthink this. A while back I was in a VERY busy state of life, and I was in the best shape of my life eating panda express, or chipotle 4 nights a week.. I would fast all day, with maybe a couple small shakes early, and then have a huge ass dinner.

 

[ScottyDoc]

I understand your sentiment especially when you are getting down to the nity gritty, low BF, but it is just not so in most cases. Eating 6 meals on the road according to an exact meal plan, is MUCH more difficult and takes much discipline then can be had with LG. I will explain below.



All that is the part of the reason why THIS type of eating is FAR more suited for this type of thing, and much more forgiving.

No offense but I think sometimes you guys make too much of this.

Bottom line is if you are on the road on the weekends, and you are on "low days" where you can eat 2k calories. Do you understand how EASY that is to do on the road? Sit on a bus all day, fasting, eat a 2k calorie dinner at Vinny's house of meat balls and call it a day. If that is at 9pm it doesn't make a difference.

I mean it is not rocket science. Fast from the night before, until later in the day, when the team eats EAT a meal. Even if you eat your 2k calories in Mcdonalds chicken nuggets. It is what it is.

It is so forgiving because you can limit it to 1-2 meals. Hard to **** that up.

If you are eating 6 meals a day for example, 350 cal a meal, and you have eaten 5 meals(1750cal), you slip up, and eat 1k calories of Taco Bell you are now well over your calories. Where as you can eat 2k in taco bell on IF and be perfectly fine. It may not be "optimal".

I just can't grasp why this would be difficult in this situation. It is pretty much perfectly suited for this. I mean you can be "dieting" and still enjoy some meals with your team. You don't have to eat at specific times, or 3 exact meals to exact macros, etc.

I would eat 1 meal, with maybe one snack on the bus even if it was a shake and some damn sunchips. Then for the actual meal, just EAT something. Use some common sense, you can get something semi decent anywhere. With such a huge surplus of calories you will be FINE.

Stop thinking with a traditional BB mindset, that "this and that" is not allowed, etc. Keep your food "BB clean" during the week if you choose, and on the weekend just get through it, trying to stay within your calorie target.

Let me ask you this. What would your alternative to this be? How do you plan to eat on the road?

Again, don't overthink this. A while back I was in a VERY busy state of life, and I was in the best shape of my life eating panda express, or chipotle 4 nights a week.. I would fast all day, with maybe a couple small shakes early, and then have a huge ass dinner.

Frank... I only said a diet is a diet in the sense of people making excuses not to adhere to it, because I do know enough about LG and IF to know that you are 100% right it is a way better diet for someone who is on the road and can be happy with 1 or 2 larger meals vs. my stereotypical 6 meals a day (much harder when traveling)... So I agree completely!!!

 

[Frank Reynolds]

Frank... I only said a diet is a diet in the sense of people making excuses not to adhere to it, because I do know enough about LG and IF to know that you are 100% right it is a way better diet for someone who is on the road and can be happy with 1 or 2 larger meals vs. my stereotypical 6 meals a day (much harder when traveling)... So I agree completely!!!

Oh I understand, for sure. A diet is a diet, but with LG it can be made to where it doesn't have to be a diet. It can be just EAT. Fast......EAT....Repeat. lol

Especially in a case like this where you are strict M-f for example. **** I might even take only 2 "build days" during the week, and save one "high calorie" day for Saturday when I am on the road. Then I can pretty much eat whatever the eff I want, and it won't matter..haha

I am like you where I like things to be very detailed, and enjoy it. But we are freaks..lol

 

[Vote4pedro]

Soooo I'm on day 2 ... And I'm hungry as **** hahaha I'll break fast in about 2 hrs ... Sipping on Modern BCAAs by USPLabs every 2 hours .... Had some coffee this morning cuz of lack of sleep (gf just got back from a month long trip so we had some catching up to do)

How long till I'm not starving in the mornings? Like I'm about to eat my arm hungry? U know like till my body gets used to it?

I'm liking it, cuz instead of semi small 6 meals a day and shakes, I eat like a champ 3 times a day ... But this mornings, damn lol

I'm cutting my calories cuz ain't no way I can eat 500g of carbs a day on my lift days ... I got to like 300 yesterday and I was a balloon hahahaha

Any thoughts on any of this? I plan on sticking to it like I stuck to my last 3 years of 6 meals and 2 shakes a day diet ... I hope to see some good results

 

[EArch]

I understand your sentiment especially when you are getting down to the nity gritty, low BF, but it is just not so in most cases. Eating 6 meals on the road according to an exact meal plan, is MUCH more difficult and takes much discipline then can be had with LG. I will explain below.

All that is the part of the reason why THIS type of eating is FAR more suited for this type of thing, and much more forgiving.

No offense but I think sometimes you guys make too much of this.

Bottom line is if you are on the road on the weekends, and you are on "low days" where you can eat 2k calories. Do you understand how EASY that is to do on the road? Sit on a bus all day, fasting, eat a 2k calorie dinner at Vinny's house of meat balls and call it a day. If that is at 9pm it doesn't make a difference.

I mean it is not rocket science. Fast from the night before, until later in the day, when the team eats EAT a meal. Even if you eat your 2k calories in Mcdonalds chicken nuggets. It is what it is.

It is so forgiving because you can limit it to 1-2 meals. Hard to **** that up.

If you are eating 6 meals a day for example, 350 cal a meal, and you have eaten 5 meals(1750cal), you slip up, and eat 1k calories of Taco Bell you are now well over your calories. Where as you can eat 2k in taco bell on IF and be perfectly fine. It may not be "optimal".

I just can't grasp why this would be difficult in this situation. It is pretty much perfectly suited for this. I mean you can be "dieting" and still enjoy some meals with your team. You don't have to eat at specific times, or 3 exact meals to exact macros, etc.

I would eat 1 meal, with maybe one snack on the bus even if it was a shake and some damn sunchips. Then for the actual meal, just EAT something. Use some common sense, you can get something semi decent anywhere. With such a huge surplus of calories you will be FINE.

Stop thinking with a traditional BB mindset, that "this and that" is not allowed, etc. Keep your food "BB clean" during the week if you choose, and on the weekend just get through it, trying to stay within your calorie target.

Let me ask you this. What would your alternative to this be? How do you plan to eat on the road?

Again, don't overthink this. A while back I was in a VERY busy state of life, and I was in the best shape of my life eating panda express, or chipotle 4 nights a week.. I would fast all day, with maybe a couple small shakes early, and then have a huge ass dinner.

Fantastic post thanks for the details really explained it well and now I just need to plan in my head how to put it into action. I'll be repping you and scottydoc when j get my hands back onto a computer and not a phone.

You guys have been a big help.

 

[Frank Reynolds]

No problem. If you need any help just ask.

I think sometimes the simplicity is lost and we tend to complicate it.

An example could be to bring a scoop of protein and some nuts for s small 300 cal snack on the bus, then hammer down a big dinner. You have such a stored budget of calories at that point.

 

[FlawedGrunt]

Soooo I'm on day 2 ... And I'm hungry as **** hahaha I'll break fast in about 2 hrs ... Sipping on Modern BCAAs by USPLabs every 2 hours .... Had some coffee this morning cuz of lack of sleep (gf just got back from a month long trip so we had some catching up to do)

How long till I'm not starving in the mornings? Like I'm about to eat my arm hungry? U know like till my body gets used to it?

I'm liking it, cuz instead of semi small 6 meals a day and shakes, I eat like a champ 3 times a day ... But this mornings, damn lol

I'm cutting my calories cuz ain't no way I can eat 500g of carbs a day on my lift days ... I got to like 300 yesterday and I was a balloon hahahaha

Any thoughts on any of this? I plan on sticking to it like I stuck to my last 3 years of 6 meals and 2 shakes a day diet ... I hope to see some good results

It took me about a week and now I rarely ever get hungry before noon

 

[mkretz]

u guys are realyl making me want to jump back on this!!!

 

[Vote4pedro]

It took me about a week and now I rarely ever get hungry before noon

Thanks man, good to know I'm not an Alien then

Any thoughts on the Modern BCAAs by USPlabs tho?
Which ones do u guys use?
Purple Wrath is off the chain over priced

 

[FlawedGrunt]

Thanks man, good to know I'm not an Alien then

Any thoughts on the Modern BCAAs by USPlabs tho?
Which ones do u guys use?
Purple Wrath is off the chain over priced

Im an avid Xtend whore... I've heard good things about Modern BCAAs tho

 

[Vote4pedro]

Im an avid Xtend whore... I've heard good things about Modern BCAAs tho

Same here, only big diff I saw was the added electrolytes I guess ...
How much does that run?
I payed $27 for 35 servings ... Seemed pretty good price
PW was at $43 for 45 servings

 

[Vote4pedro]

So Im a lil confused ...
I keep finding articles that say u need BCAAs during fasting, and some that say they r a waste of money ....
So if Im working out at 5pm (2 meals pre)
Do I need any in the morning? I've been taking about 10grams every 2 hours while I'm awake before I break fast ...
Is this needed or am I wasting money? Am I messing up the fasting point?
I know if I train fasted I gotta down 10grams 5-15 mins before (I do this on cardio days and I mix it up with some Jack3d
But on lifting days and off days do I need any BCAAs?

 

[indysoccer16]

Ive been using the modern Bcaa that are discounted right now for the 1kg jug on nutraplanet.
I like them, I have noticed that during my workouts I have a little more in the tank if you will for my last lifts. I have also cut out my pre workout drink and have just been sipping 12g of Bcaa throughout the day between meals, and then I take 4g right before my workout and then during/post I drink 8g more.
The taste is a little weird for chugging the 4g, but the 12g I sip through the day I mix with a half gallon of water and it taste fine in there.

Thanks man, good to know I'm not an Alien then

Any thoughts on the Modern BCAAs by USPlabs tho?
Which ones do u guys use?
Purple Wrath is off the chain over priced

 

[mattrag]

I am sure this was discussed but please humor me

Has anyone tried to do this diet with targeted keto? Something like 50/40/10 (fats, protein, carbs) on rest days and a 30/40/30 on workout days? I am not sure if the carbs NEED to be introduced for thyroid and glycogen synthesis as well as leptin receptor upregulation and perhaps insulin sensitivity (as keto makes one insulin resistant)? Currently I take in around 3-3.2k on rest days and 3.8-4k on workout days and i was wondering if intaking my post workout meal or fast breaking meal with a balance of something like 100g carbs, 100g protein and 50g fat would be detrimental if I used a starch like white rice (brown rice doesn't digest in me, i'm VERY lectin sensitive to all grains it seems).
Also, if it matters if my fast breaking meal has the carbs? Or my PWO meal? As I will most likely train in the evening AFTER my fast breaking meal.

 

[EasyEJL]

I keep finding articles that say u need BCAAs during fasting, and some that say they r a waste of money ....

I'd think that most people who would say they are a waste of money just don't have the extra $40 a month to spend on them. There's plenty of evidence that BCAAs or even separately just leucine have significant value, fasting or not.

 

[Vote4pedro]

Ive been using the modern Bcaa that are discounted right now for the 1kg jug on nutraplanet.
I like them, I have noticed that during my workouts I have a little more in the tank if you will for my last lifts. I have also cut out my pre workout drink and have just been sipping 12g of Bcaa throughout the day between meals, and then I take 4g right before my workout and then during/post I drink 8g more.
The taste is a little weird for chugging the 4g, but the 12g I sip through the day I mix with a half gallon of water and it taste fine in there.

Thanks bro, but u train fasted then right?

I'd think that most people who would say they are a waste of money just don't have the extra $40 a month to spend on them. There's plenty of evidence that BCAAs or even separately just leucine have significant value, fasting or not.

Ok, so there's nothing wrong with sippin on the BCAAs in the morning even tho Im working out in the afternoon?? I mean is it affecting the fast?
I did read mike said as long as its liquid and doesn't go past 50 Cals ull be good, but he was talking about Energy Drinks in this article I'm mentioning ... Does it apply all around?

 

[EasyEJL]

Thanks bro, but u train fasted then right?



Ok, so there's nothing wrong with sippin on the BCAAs in the morning even tho Im working out in the afternoon?? I mean is it affecting the fast?
I did read mike said as long as its liquid and doesn't go past 50 Cals ull be good, but he was talking about Energy Drinks in this article I'm mentioning ... Does it apply all around?

yeah, anything less than 50 calories in an hour or so is pretty irrelevant as far as breaking the fast. so no more than 10g of bcaas to be on the safe side.

 

[Vote4pedro]

yeah, anything less than 50 calories in an hour or so is pretty irrelevant as far as breaking the fast. so no more than 10g of bcaas to be on the safe side.

Hahaha damn, I'm already at 12 this morning lol ... Ok I wont have anymore today then ... Just water and a cup of much needed coffee

 

[mkretz]

he means no more than 10g in an hour or 2 window, so if u had 12 g earlier ur fine for some now....

 

[RickRock13]

I myself do 6g BCAAs preworkout, post workout, and again 2 hours later before breaking my fast. Heavier guys might want 8-10g, but I think mine is sufficient

 

[Vote4pedro]

he means no more than 10g in an hour or 2 window, so if u had 12 g earlier ur fine for some now....

So ur telling me I'm good drinking 10 BCAAs every 2 hours in the am, even tho I don't work out till later on in the day?

 

[EasyEJL]

So ur telling me I'm good drinking 10 BCAAs every 2 hours in the am, even tho I don't work out till later on in the day?

Yep, it doesn't break the bodily processes of fasting

 

[ScottyDoc]

Attention...
Today's Trivia will be held at 2:00pm Eastern Standard Time

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[Cptsteele]

Long time lurker here and I have read this whole thread and Martins blog etc. I am not stranger to alternate day fasting intermittent fasting, its all quite easy for me. My current fatness (actually I have always carried the same fat regardless of how skinny I was) is not from over eating. Eating for me has always been a challenge but eating bull**** that has made me hold weight in my waist has been the issue. I started lifting in 99 at 165 lbs and been as heavy as 255 and have never seen abs, even when I was in the Corps I was in good shape but skinny fat.

My question is for all of the reformed fatty's and hyper carb sensitive guys, what has been the range to work best for you? and how do you do a reefed?

My express plan has me on

BD TD
1751 and 2252

and I adjusted the carbs to under 50 on bd, and around 80 on TD




Im just coming off a month of doing a carb reset of eating nothing but high fat and spinach more or less. I also eat Paleo so I dont eat any grains or anything man made essentially.

Im 6'2" 220 around 19% . I hadnt trained in 2 years and started back training at home the beginning of November and I am down 15 lbs and 4" off my waist. This week I have just started back in the gym for the first time in 4 years so i am doing a very basic strength routine with the 4 staples in a reverse pyramid. Prior to my layoff I was boxing and 200lbs but as lean as i would like.

Last, I have personally found that until you get your body lean (10% and under) youre metabolically messed up. You get under and maintain you can do any sort of exercise style lift routine whatever and make gains and or stay lean but to get there requires some fanciness. I base this on when I was boxing I started out from bodybuilding squatting 455 for 8 but not being able to do foot work drills, to being able to run 3 miles sub 20 etc etc and still looked exactly the same, and not lean lol .

So my personal goal is to get and maintain under 10% .

 

[EArch]

I am impressed the quality of my workouts has not gone down yet, its only day two, but still I would have expected poor lifts after 13+ hours fasted with nothing more than two scoops of recoverpro pre workout.

 

[hypo]

Simple question that is driving me a little crazy...

I'm counting all my calories and trying to stick to my prescribed macro and calorie breakdowns. However, sometimes on a food label, when I add up (9*fat) + (4*carbs-fiber) + (4*protein), I do not get the same caloric figure as is on the package. Over an entire day the difference can be several hundred calories.

The only thing I can think of is that the food labels are counting some of the fiber as caloric. Should I be subtracting ALL fiber from total carbohydrates, then multiplying by 4? Or should I trust the labels' calorie totals? I have read that soluble fiber does contribute food energy (like 2 calories per gram), however most of my food does not break total fiber into soluble and insoluble so I can't do the calcs myself.

​

 

[Frank Reynolds]

Simple question that is driving me a little crazy...

I'm counting all my calories and trying to stick to my prescribed macro and calorie breakdowns. However, sometimes on a food label, when I add up (9*fat) + (4*carbs-fiber) + (4*protein), I do not get the same caloric figure as is on the package. Over an entire day the difference can be several hundred calories.

The only thing I can think of is that the food labels are counting some of the fiber as caloric. Should I be subtracting ALL fiber from total carbohydrates, then multiplying by 4? Or should I trust the labels' calorie totals? I have read that soluble fiber does contribute food energy (like 2 calories per gram), however most of my food does not break total fiber into soluble and insoluble so I can't do the calcs myself.

You are over analyzing and making your life harder then it needs to be my man.

Count it by total calories or just macros and ALWAYS count it that way.

Consistency in how you calculate/track your food is what matters.

 

[Rosie Chee]

I am impressed the quality of my workouts has not gone down yet, its only day two, but still I would have expected poor lifts after 13+ hours fasted with nothing more than two scoops of recoverpro pre workout.

Doing your training fasted does NOT mean that the quality of your training is going to suffer. Honestly, from someone who has done BOTH fasted and unfasted training (some just after finishing eating), I PREFER FASTED training (preferably first thing), and my performance has little difference either way, aside from the fact that I FEEL better training fasted.

~Rosie~

 

[hypo]

You are over analyzing and making your life harder then it needs to be my man.

Count it by total calories or just macros and ALWAYS count it that way.

Consistency in how you calculate/track your food is what matters.

I know brother, I know, lol.

You're right, I'll just continue what I've been doing, which is looking at the macro break downs, using carbs-fiber=net carbs (not the label's listed calories). I am sure there is a lot more variance in figuring your maintenance calories "multiplier", as each tenth is several hundred calories. I used 1.2, anyway, so I can afford to be a little less conservative on the carb counting I suppose.

 

[Frank Reynolds]

I know brother, I know, lol.

You're right, I'll just continue what I've been doing, which is looking at the macro break downs, using carbs-fiber=net carbs (not the label's listed calories). I am sure there is a lot more variance in figuring your maintenance calories "multiplier", as each tenth is several hundred calories. I used 1.2, anyway, so I can afford to be a little less conservative on the carb counting I suppose.

It just doesn't matter. Your body counts calories. As progress dictates add/decrease them, count them as you always do and it all works itself out.

I would track them in the easiest possible fashion.

 

[Vote4pedro]

Simple question that is driving me a little crazy...

I'm counting all my calories and trying to stick to my prescribed macro and calorie breakdowns. However, sometimes on a food label, when I add up (9*fat) + (4*carbs-fiber) + (4*protein), I do not get the same caloric figure as is on the package. Over an entire day the difference can be several hundred calories.

The only thing I can think of is that the food labels are counting some of the fiber as caloric. Should I be subtracting ALL fiber from total carbohydrates, then multiplying by 4? Or should I trust the labels' calorie totals? I have read that soluble fiber does contribute food energy (like 2 calories per gram), however most of my food does not break total fiber into soluble and insoluble so I can't do the calcs myself.

I noticed this as well but didnt read into it much ... I rather hit my calories even if that means going above my grams in carbs by 20 ... I think the more I over think this diet the more frustrated I will get ... I've been counting Cals and Macros for ages and I chose this for an easier lifestyle of less but larger meals also meaning more foooooodddssss

Doing your training fasted does NOT mean that the quality of your training is going to suffer. Honestly, from someone who has done BOTH fasted and unfasted training (some just after finishing eating), I PREFER FASTED training (preferably first thing), and my performance has little difference either way, aside from the fact that I FEEL better training fasted.

~Rosie~

For me Fasted Cardio/Abs so I ain't got a big belly while trying to do some running

But a belly full of carbs when I do my heavy lifting feels good

Even I seem to be going down on my leg strength ... Imma wait till next week see how this suffered ...

 

[DreamWeaver]

But a belly full of carbs when I do my heavy lifting feels good

Even I seem to be going down on my leg strength ... Imma wait till next week see how this suffered ...

I am the opposite the less I have in my stomach the better I lift. Once I got used to the fast a lot of things were different.

 

[houstontexas]

My workout is in the evening but I like to keep my belly close to empty for the training. I eat at noon and then let it empty out before my training later. Eating close to training, especially on leg day, makes me want to throw up actually.

 

[EasyEJL]

Simple question that is driving me a little crazy...

I'm counting all my calories and trying to stick to my prescribed macro and calorie breakdowns. However, sometimes on a food label, when I add up (9*fat) + (4*carbs-fiber) + (4*protein), I do not get the same caloric figure as is on the package. Over an entire day the difference can be several hundred calories.

The only thing I can think of is that the food labels are counting some of the fiber as caloric. Should I be subtracting ALL fiber from total carbohydrates, then multiplying by 4? Or should I trust the labels' calorie totals? I have read that soluble fiber does contribute food energy (like 2 calories per gram), however most of my food does not break total fiber into soluble and insoluble so I can't do the calcs myself.

i'd really like to see some examples of how that could add up to several hundred calories. Can you point to any one specific food item from a label (not from a website that estimates it) that has it that way? Just as a thought for it to add up to 200 calories that would mean 50g of fiber counted as carbs, and not too many people take in that much fiber a day total.

 

[Vote4pedro]

I am the opposite the less I have in my stomach the better I lift. Once I got used to the fast a lot of things were different.

Well unfortunately because of work I can only fit my cardio days on for fasted training ... Not enough time for heavy lifting ...

My workout is in the evening but I like to keep my belly close to empty for the training. I eat at noon and then let it empty out before my training later. Eating close to training, especially on leg day, makes me want to throw up actually.

Actually from the second I break fast my belly stays pretty full until the next day hahahah my body still getting used to this diet ... But yeah cramming all this food sometimes gets a lil painful

 

[Vote4pedro]

Ok so this is a break down of my diet ... What I eat, when, how much, etc etc ....
On WO day I work out between my 2 meal and my post work out meal (last of the day) rest days I do a lil HIIT and and which is Thursday an Sundays

My stats
24
5'11
200lbs
BF- around 14%
Lifting and training for 6 years
And currently on the HSS-100 work out routine but finally starting to cut down

I also take Jack3d pre workout, Animal Pack multivitamins, and a liver protectant

I sip on BCAAs in the AMs before I break fast as well

Invalid Link Removed

 

[mkretz]

good stuff!

 

[Vote4pedro]

good stuff!

Thanks bro, appreciate the compliments and reputation ...
Figured if it's good, why not share it I'm sure some ppl could use it as well

 

[hypo]

i'd really like to see some examples of how that could add up to several hundred calories. Can you point to any one specific food item from a label (not from a website that estimates it) that has it that way? Just as a thought for it to add up to 200 calories that would mean 50g of fiber counted as carbs, and not too many people take in that much fiber a day total.

Well, for example, today I ate a box of Great Value (walmart brand) whole wheat rotini. The label indicates (per serving):

1.5g fat
41g carb
5g fiber
7g protein

Adding up (1.5*9)+((41-5)*4)+(7*4)= 185.5 calories per serving. The box label indicates, however 210 calories per serving. There are 7 servings in the box, and I ate all of them today, which makes a ((210-185.5)*7) calorie difference = 171.5 calorie difference.

Note however, that if we count the fiber as 4 cal each gram, it would equal 5*7*4= 140 cals, which does not add up to the 171.5 difference.

With the pasta I also had a can of Prego sauce. I'll save the you the math, but taking out the fiber it adds up to a 43 calorie difference. So for the pasta and sauce I am 214 cals off from what the labels say if I use the "fiber=no calories" arguement. Which is 8% of my workout say calories, so it's not insignificant.

BTW, just in this meal, I got exactly 50g of fiber. It's really not that hard to do.

In any case, the other guy was right in that I should just stick to one method and use it consistently, and gauge progress from there, so I will. It's just a curiosity to me, that's all.

 

[ssbackwards]

for calories if its 1.5g, they round it up to 2g, making it 18 cals.

Fiber isnt subtracted, so new total is about 209-210 cals

 

[EasyEJL]

thats interesting, I've never noticed one off by that much. I've seen some that are in the 5-10 calories off range, and just assumed it was rounding issues. Now I wonder how they calculate the different parts. If the fiber was counted as calories, then the difference left is reasonably in range of rounding errors though, as it would be less than 5 calories per serving.

 

[EasyEJL]

ahhh here it is right here

Invalid Link Removed
7. Round the values according to FDA rounding
rules

The following table provides rounding rules for declaring nutrients on the
nutrition label or in labeling:



[TABLE="width: 700"]


[TR]

Nutrient
Increment Rounding
Insignificant Amount[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]Calories
Calories from Fat
Calories from
Saturated Fat[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]< 5 cal - express as 0
≤ 50 cal - express to
nearest 5 cal increment
> 50 cal - express to nearest 10 cal
increment[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"]< 5 cal[/TD]
[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]Total Fat
Saturated Fat
Polyunsaturated
Fat
Monounsaturated Fat[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]< .5 g - express as 0
< 5 g - express to
nearest .5g increment
≥ 5 g - express to nearest 1 g increment[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"]< .5 g[/TD]
[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]Cholesterol[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]< 2 mg - express as 0
2 - 5 mg - express as "less
than 5 mg"
> 5 mg - express to nearest 5 mg increment[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"]< 2 mg[/TD]
[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]Sodium
Potassium
[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]< 5 mg - express as 0
5 - 140 mg - express to
nearest 5 mg increment
> 140 mg - express to nearest 10 mg increment[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"]< 5 mg[/TD]
[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]Total Carbohydrate
Dietary Fiber[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]< .5 g - express as 0
< 1 g - express as
"Contains less than 1 g" or "less than 1 g"
≥ 1 g - express to nearest 1 g
increment[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"]< 1 g[/TD]
[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]Soluble and Insoluble Fiber Sugars
Sugar
Alcohol
Other Carbohydrate[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]< .5 g - express as 0
< 1 g - express as
"Contains less than 1 g" or "less than 1 g"
≥ 1 g - express to nearest 1 g
increment[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"]< .5 g[/TD]
[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]Protein[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]< .5 g - express as 0
< 1 g - express as
"Contains less than 1 g" or "less than 1 g" or to 1 g if .5 g to < 1 g
≥ 1
g - express to nearest 1 g increment[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"]< 1 g[/TD]
[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]When declaring nutrients other than vitamins and
minerals that have RDIs as a % DV[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]express to nearest 1% DV increment[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"]< 1% DV[/TD]
[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]Vitamins & Minerals
(express as % DV)[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]
< 2% of RDI may be expressed as:
(1) 2% DV if actual amount is 1% or
more
(2) 0
(3) an asterisk that refers to statement
"Contains less than
2% of the Daily
Value of this (these) nutrient(s)"
(4) for Vit A, C,
calcium, iron: statement
"Not a significant source of
(listing the vitamins and minerals omitted)"

≤ 10% of RDI - express to nearest 2% DV increment
> 10% - 50% of RDI -
express to nearest 5% DV increment
> 50% of RDI - express to nearest 10%
DV increment
[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"]< 2% RDI[/TD]
[/TR]

[TR]

[TD="width: 186"]Beta-Carotene
(express as % DV)[/TD]

[TD="width: 310"]≤ 10% of RDI for vitamin A- express to nearest 2% DV
increment
> 10% - 50% of RDI for vitamin A- express to nearest 5% DV
increment
> 50% of RDI for vitamin A- express to nearest 10% DV
increment[/TD]

[TD="width: 164"] [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

So total calories can be a bit different, with calorie amounts < 50 cal being rounded to nearest 5, and over 50 cal being rounded to nearest 10. So in your 1.5g of fat which would be 14.5, it just gets rounded to 15, but the carbs at (lets start with 41) get rounded from 164 to 160, then the protein of 7 gets rounded to 30 so hmm still just 205 not 210. hmm well anyhow at least we know how it rounds them for calories now.

 

[DreamWeaver]

Once you establish your own baselines it doesn't matter as much about the differences. You can really overthink this stuff...

 

[Rosie Chee]

Once you establish your own baselines it doesn't matter as much about the differences. You can really overthink this stuff...

^^^Agreed

~Rosie~