OUFINNY transformation with NeedToBuildMuscle and MrSupps!!!

[DreamWeaver]

It would not be that extensive had this run not been so long and suppressive. And yes, I got some of those for free so I am running it all, got 15 pounds of gains to keep dang it!!!!

Yes, 15 pounds gained!

Yah EPI puts chunkc of mass on me too....:biggthumpup:

 

[oufinny]

Yah EPI puts chunkc of mass on me too....:biggthumpup:

For clarifications sake, I gained the majority of the weight on the DMZ, the last 5 pounds came from the Epi and today I was up to 217 so if that holds, it will be 7 pounds. I wouldn't be surprised if this is mass getting added on as I really look bigger these last two days than I did all of last week.

Epi is great and I would think as a stand alone it can be a great bulker or cutter, just depends on your diet and goals. If you are doing something like UD2.0 or Leangains, expect to add some mass and definitely cut fat. The fasted period really seemed to help me eat up bodyfat like I have never seen before.

 

[BarbellBeast]

Awesome gains finny!

 

[MrKleen73]

Awesome Fin, well the gains anyway not the pain or feeling blah. That was a hell of a cycle especially for the first time with DS. Definitely different than the prohormones like Androhard. I hope your back gets better quickly. PCT looks strong too! Up 15-17 lbs is damn impressive too. I am surprised you made it that far with the two compounds on your first run. I pussed out just after 3 weeks on just the DMZ... didn't like the way I felt anymore.

 

[oufinny]

Awesome Fin, well the gains anyway not the pain or feeling blah. That was a hell of a cycle especially for the first time with DS. Definitely different than the prohormones like Androhard. I hope your back gets better quickly. PCT looks strong too! Up 15-17 lbs is damn impressive too. I am surprised you made it that far with the two compounds on your first run. I pussed out just after 3 weeks on just the DMZ... didn't like the way I felt anymore.

That feeling you talk about is why I have high hopes for the AndroSeries and of course the goodness of the darkside. :arms: :arms:

 

[oufinny]

Just an update, managed to not get sick on cycle but I knew something was stirring and I was right. Have a mild/moderate upper respiratory infection that is irritating my sinuses as well. This sounds worse than it is and the laundry list of meds she gave me we shall see about, I may take 1, maybe 2 of them, not all 4. I did get a shot of prednisone before I left which makes me feel better but is not good for helping test recover; it seems a little prudent when you can't breath to fix that problem first!

Anyways, going to do cardio today most likely or just rest, then lift Friday and Saturday. Actually, a few days off is not hurting me, my body outside of the illness, is feeling much better and my BP is 120/70 today so that rocks!

Side note, have my blood work scheduled for 3 weeks from today, by that point if test is not out of the dumps then I can make adjustments in my PCT to fix it. Getting a complete hormone panel, cholesterol, liver function, CBC, and she adds a few others in that are part of the yearly work up. If all goes well here, at least I know I did things right and didn't hurt my body too bad.

 

[mich29]

Just an update, managed to not get sick on cycle but I knew something was stirring and I was right. Have a mild/moderate upper respiratory infection that is irritating my sinuses as well. This sounds worse than it is and the laundry list of meds she gave me we shall see about, I may take 1, maybe 2 of them, not all 4. I did get a shot of prednisone before I left which makes me feel better but is not good for helping test recover; it seems a little prudent when you can't breath to fix that problem first!

Anyways, going to do cardio today most likely or just rest, then lift Friday and Saturday. Actually, a few days off is not hurting me, my body outside of the illness, is feeling much better and my BP is 120/70 today so that rocks!

Side note, have my blood work scheduled for 3 weeks from today, by that point if test is not out of the dumps then I can make adjustments in my PCT to fix it. Getting a complete hormone panel, cholesterol, liver function, CBC, and she adds a few others in that are part of the yearly work up. If all goes well here, at least I know I did things right and didn't hurt my body too bad.

sucks bout the upper respiratory infection I had this for 2 weeks and it sucked,good to hear everything else is in order though.

 

[RickRock13]

Man I think just about everyone has something going on right now. People getting sick right and left

 

[oufinny]

Man I think just about everyone has something going on right now. People getting sick right and left

I escaped a lot of sickness for a long time, it was inevitable I would lose the battle eventually and at the tail end of a 5 week cycle you are about as immuno-suppressed as you will ever be so there you go. I already feel better, now if the damn Dr. didn't prescribe an anti-biotic that interacted with my asthma medication, then I would at least have two doses in me by now but no, dumb ass screwed up.

 

[punthra]

Don't feel bad bro....You could be like my wife and be on immuno-suppressants which means you catch everything and anything. You'll have this bug beat in no time!!!

 

[oufinny]

Don't feel bad bro....You could be like my wife and be on immuno-suppressants which means you catch everything and anything. You'll have this bug beat in no time!!!

That sucks for your wife, yikes, I got a full body shiver when I read that. I dealt with some people who were on those when I was in the hospital working, always fighting something off (felt so bad for them!). I don't feel bad which is pretty darn weird considering that my lungs are trashed but this Mucinex DM is working pretty darn well at keeping the congestion at bay. This morning I was very lethargic after waking which is not normal for me so I know I am battling something fierce but I will prevail. Heck, I am going to do a dang leg workout today just in spite of this bug! :squintfinger: :squintfinger: :squintfinger:

 

[punthra]

She's doing good now but cold and flu sean for her was brutal...Hopefully will have her off the meds sometime this year, it all depends on her bloodwork.

 

[oufinny]

Update is in order since I am doing a whole lot of jack shiznit at the moment, well watching 2001 A Space Odessey does count as something I suppose. Had two great workouts these last two days, strength is staying strong even though I am getting over being sick.

So my weight is leveling off at 213... lower carbs and the gym being so hot is sucking the extra water weight out and I am continuing to lean out. Actually, I am thinking that staying at 210 is going to be a challenge as my diet is going to be focused on fat loss while maintaining as much mass as possible, the creatine nitrate should help once I get it next week.

Lean gains works and I highly suggest you all try it, I am going to move to a more Primal style diet while using the lean gains eating time frame, well close to it. Being that I am going to get rid of most complex carbs, I really am not as concerned about meal timing that lean gains entails.

I like the idea of a higher fat diet that has at least 1 gram of protein per pound and about 60-100 grams of carbs per day, mainly from fruits and veggies.

 

[MrKleen73]

Good stuff Fin, I am whooped I just finished a workout and am checking a few things then updating my log. I can't wait to see how that change in diet treats you. I am sticking with Lean Gains for a while but I understand the reason for the switch as well and can't wait to see the result of it.

 

[DreamWeaver]

Update is in order since I am doing a whole lot of jack shiznit at the moment, well watching 2001 A Space Odessey does count as something I suppose. Had two great workouts these last two days, strength is staying strong even though I am getting over being sick.

So my weight is leveling off at 213... lower carbs and the gym being so hot is sucking the extra water weight out and I am continuing to lean out. Actually, I am thinking that staying at 210 is going to be a challenge as my diet is going to be focused on fat loss while maintaining as much mass as possible, the creatine nitrate should help once I get it next week.

Lean gains works and I highly suggest you all try it, I am going to move to a more Primal style diet while using the lean gains eating time frame, well close to it. Being that I am going to get rid of most complex carbs, I really am not as concerned about meal timing that lean gains entails.

I like the idea of a higher fat diet that has at least 1 gram of protein per pound and about 60-100 grams of carbs per day, mainly from fruits and veggies.

I just got some Creatine Nitrate in today, saving it for PCT....

 

[pilip99]

hang in there matt!! hope you're feeling better broski; i too, started the lean gains diet, I'm liking it already

 

[mich29]

I'll have to remember lean gains when one day I have to cut this program sounds awesome

 

[RickRock13]

I'll have to remember lean gains when one day I have to cut this program sounds awesome

Yeh it does look pretty damn good. I'm starting my own lean gains diet next week

 

[DreamWeaver]

Yeh it does look pretty damn good. I'm starting my own lean gains diet next week

Yep sounds like the perfect off season recomp type diet for and endo like myself. You could use it to cut up as well, maybe not for prep but early prep would likely be ok..

 

[Milas]

I'm thinking about switching to Lean Gains after the contest. It seems pretty good! I just don't know how well I'll do with fasting all day!!!

 

[oufinny]

I'm thinking about switching to Lean Gains after the contest. It seems pretty good! I just don't know how well I'll do with fasting all day!!!

It is not all day by any means, most people break the fast between 11-2 PM. I never went past 1:30, that was just fine with me. After a few days, you are good to go.

Workout updates: a few PRs have crept into my PCT

DB Military Press - 80x8x2 sets, got 80x6 on set 3 all while sick
V-bar rows (BB between legs) - 170x8x3 sets, no straps. Done the weight, never without straps though so I was pumped I managed this with my bad back
Standing DB Rows (leaning on weight rack) - 100x8x2 That was enough for my back, but it was toasted from the other work.

Chest is working its way back up as well, got incline BB up to 205x8x2 last week and will be pushing it to the limit this week again.

Weight is still above 215 which is awesome, but PCT is not going that great on the recovery front. I talked with my guys on a different forum who use gear a lot and I picked up some Clomid to run 50 each day for 3-4 weeks, and dropped the AI Post Cycle to make sure I wasn't crusing estrogen too much (something I fear is happening). So gym wise PCT is great, bedroom wise PCT is not cool, my GF is none too pleased as she wants some ****.

More to come on that as it develops, looking forward to getting my Mesomorph and creatine nitrate, hopefully it shows up this week, I trust JudgmentDay, it is APS that is taking forever.

 

[DreamWeaver]

yah that's an easy fasting schedule and simple to adjust to...

 

[mich29]

everybody lean gaining it.hmmm I thing this could be turned into a song.

 

[oufinny]

I am doing a more primal/keto diet actually though I may switch between the two as I think there is a lot of efficacy to LeanGains. I can use primal to stay lean pretty much all the time, not hyper lean but if I can hover at 10% I will be really happy. Leangains works great for bulking and/or cutting, just depends on your approach and how many carbs are in play.

Another great workout last night, hit chest and tris instead of legs otherwise I would only have one day between chest and shoulders, not a good plan. Weights are staying where they were on cycle and my incline press is continuing to be strong, actually stronger than on cycle.

A few highlights from memory:
DB Bench Press - 2 WU sets 95x8x2 60x10
Incline BB Press - 1 WU, 205x8x3 -->135x10
Dips - BW+heavy chainx10x3 sets
CGBP - WU, 165x7, 165x6

By the time I got to close grip bench, I was fried and my chest was pumped to the uncomfortable level. Make note of that last sentence, I get in about 70-100 grams of carb, fibrous and from fruit, still get a crazy pump. To all of those people out there that think you don't get a pump on a keto style diet, if I can get a pump doing this, ANYONE can.

No sign of my Mesomorph or creatine nitrate... starting to get annoyed with APS. Good thing I have nearly a full tub of my go to, AS-GT, it is treating me well in the mean time. Creatine would be nice though, I could use some extra to help me keep weight on.

AM weight - 213.8

 

[DreamWeaver]

I am doing a more primal/keto diet actually though I may switch between the two as I think there is a lot of efficacy to LeanGains. I can use primal to stay lean pretty much all the time, not hyper lean but if I can hover at 10% I will be really happy. Leangains works great for bulking and/or cutting, just depends on your approach and how many carbs are in play.

Another great workout last night, hit chest and tris instead of legs otherwise I would only have one day between chest and shoulders, not a good plan. Weights are staying where they were on cycle and my incline press is continuing to be strong, actually stronger than on cycle.

A few highlights from memory:
DB Bench Press - 2 WU sets 95x8x2 60x10
Incline BB Press - 1 WU, 205x8x3 -->135x10
Dips - BW+heavy chainx10x3 sets
CGBP - WU, 165x7, 165x6

By the time I got to close grip bench, I was fried and my chest was pumped to the uncomfortable level. Make note of that last sentence, I get in about 70-100 grams of carb, fibrous and from fruit, still get a crazy pump. To all of those people out there that think you don't get a pump on a keto style diet, if I can get a pump doing this, ANYONE can.

No sign of my Mesomorph or creatine nitrate... starting to get annoyed with APS. Good thing I have nearly a full tub of my go to, AS-GT, it is treating me well in the mean time. Creatine would be nice though, I could use some extra to help me keep weight on.

AM weight - 213.8

Every time I try Keto it reverts to recomp after the first month, it's good for short blasts but I don't like being on it for extended periods. It is a good recomp if you can handle it indefinitely..

 

[oufinny]

Every time I try Keto it reverts to recomp after the first month, it's good for short blasts but I don't like being on it for extended periods. It is a good recomp if you can handle it indefinitely..

If you are wanting to cut those last few percent, many say it is extremely effective. I keep reading more and more that pros use it and their main protein source is fish to get the omega 3:6 ratio in check. I see it being used near the end of prep actually as you will be very, very insulin sensitive after 2-3 weeks on keto and low cals. Would make for a crazy carb up peak week. I know the owner of Metroflex where I workout [that competes] goes to it the last few weeks of his prep to get that last bit of fat off him and after seeing him yesterday, he is very thin skinned and once he fills up it will be quite the site!

 

[DreamWeaver]

If you are wanting to cut those last few percent, many say it is extremely effective. I keep reading more and more that pros use it and their main protein source is fish to get the omega 3:6 ratio in check. I see it being used near the end of prep actually as you will be very, very insulin sensitive after 2-3 weeks on keto and low cals. Would make for a crazy carb up peak week. I know the owner of Metroflex where I workout [that competes] goes to it the last few weeks of his prep to get that last bit of fat off him and after seeing him yesterday, he is very thin skinned and once he fills up it will be quite the site!

Yah that's about what I am doing now with only 2.5 grapefruits for carbs... and there's plenty of fish in the diet. I opted for lean beef as an accompaniment instead of milk fed veal largely due to the price of veal but don't be surprised to see me go the veal route near the end. I jumped into this diet a week early due to the fact taht the prep time was short for me and I had to get more sttict more quickly than I would have liked.

 

[oufinny]

Yah that's about what I am doing now with only 2.5 grapefruits for carbs... and there's plenty of fish in the diet. I opted for lean beef as an accompaniment instead of milk fed veal largely due to the price of veal but don't be surprised to see me go the veal route near the end. I jumped into this diet a week early due to the fact taht the prep time was short for me and I had to get more sttict more quickly than I would have liked.

Doug you know what works for you and I imagine that plus the anabolics you are running will work some magic.

 

[DreamWeaver]

Doug you know what works for you and I imagine that plus the anabolics you are running will work some magic.

BCAA's are helping too and my protein intake is still around 300... desperate times call for desperate measures...:blink:

 

[MrKleen73]

I'll have to remember lean gains when one day I have to cut this program sounds awesome

Yeh it does look pretty damn good. I'm starting my own lean gains diet next week

I'm thinking about switching to Lean Gains after the contest. It seems pretty good! I just don't know how well I'll do with fasting all day!!!

Guys, I think you may be missing something with this, it is not just for cutting. The very name of it is Lean GAINS, yeah you can eat to gain, and just by the very nature of the diet you will stay lean while gaining. It is by no mean a cutting only diet. However typically people will gain some LBM while cutting. I really suggest going to read at www.leangains.com to get a better overall picture of the diet, the reasoning, and some of the science behind it. You will be able to get better results this way.

Yep sounds like the perfect off season recomp type diet for and endo like myself. You could use it to cut up as well, maybe not for prep but early prep would likely be ok..

I think you could get pretty close to contest shape with Lean Gains easily. Martin maintains a lower body fat than a lot natural guys get to for competitions. He stays around 5-6%.

 

[DreamWeaver]

Guys, I think you may be missing something with this, it is not just for cutting. The very name of it is Lean GAINS, yeah you can eat to gain, and just by the very nature of the diet you will stay lean while gaining. It is by no mean a cutting only diet. However typically people will gain some LBM while cutting. I really suggest going to read at www.leangains.com to get a better overall picture of the diet, the reasoning, and some of the science behind it. You will be able to get better results this way.



I think you could get pretty close to contest shape with Lean Gains easily. Martin maintains a lower body fat than a lot natural guys get to for competitions. He stays around 5-6%.

Yah but is he an Endo, that's ok even if I could use it to maintain 8 or 9% think how close that would be, then you could tighten it up a bit maybe squeeze a bit more that would make for 8 to 10 week preps, sure beats the hell out of 20 weeks.

 

[oufinny]

Yah but is he an Endo, that's ok even if I could use it to maintain 8 or 9% think how close that would be, then you could tighten it up a bit maybe squeeze a bit more that would make for 8 to 10 week preps, sure beats the hell out of 20 weeks.

I think you would be shocked how well this works for you Doug. Your diet I never have been able to wrap my head around, at least the crazy veggie deal you ran, but I do get the grapefruit one though. If you want to really lean up you can go to fish for all your protein less some eggs in the morning, I know for a fact that is what Jay Cutler and Branch Warren do when they need to get crazy lean. Just thinking out loud.

 

[DreamWeaver]

I think you would be shocked how well this works for you Doug. Your diet I never have been able to wrap my head around, at least the crazy veggie deal you ran, but I do get the grapefruit one though. If you want to really lean up you can go to fish for all your protein less some eggs in the morning, I know for a fact that is what Jay Cutler and Branch Warren do when they need to get crazy lean. Just thinking out loud.

Yah that's what the milk fed veal/ fish thing is about. Damn I'd have to eat about 50 oz of fish ed. if it was just fish. I could check my supplies I guess...

 

[oufinny]

Yah that's what the milk fed veal/ fish thing is about. Damn I'd have to eat about 50 oz of fish ed. if it was just fish. I could check my supplies I guess...

I think that people advocate fish because of the extra omega 3 content and it is more alkaline, hence priming the body for fat burning and eliminating inflammation and I would theorize lowering cortisol levels as well... THAT IS SPECULATION so don't quote me on it. I don't see that being fun at all, I would really get sick of fish, like REALLY get sick of it but if I was going to prep for a contest, I would manage to get through it.

 

[DreamWeaver]

I think that people advocate fish because of the extra omega 3 content and it is more alkaline, hence priming the body for fat burning and eliminating inflammation and I would theorize lowering cortisol levels as well... THAT IS SPECULATION so don't quote me on it. I don't see that being fun at all, I would really get sick of fish, like REALLY get sick of it but if I was going to prep for a contest, I would manage to get through it.

Yah an all fish regime would deplete my supplies inside a week. Fish is easier to chew than lean beef...

 

[Milas]

Guys, I think you may be missing something with this, it is not just for cutting. The very name of it is Lean GAINS, yeah you can eat to gain, and just by the very nature of the diet you will stay lean while gaining. It is by no mean a cutting only diet. However typically people will gain some LBM while cutting. I really suggest going to read at www.leangains.com to get a better overall picture of the diet, the reasoning, and some of the science behind it. You will be able to get better results this way.

I think you could get pretty close to contest shape with Lean Gains easily. Martin maintains a lower body fat than a lot natural guys get to for competitions. He stays around 5-6%.

Nope, not missing a beat in your log or Oufinny's. After my show, I am NOT cutting anymore!!!

I want to put on muscle, while keeping bf% low. It sounds like this does the trick from what I've read. It sounds awesome to keep so low, while gaining.

Thanks to both of you for posting the info!

 

[mich29]

great stuff here.I agree fish is so quick and easy to eat.

 

[RickRock13]

Nope, not missing a beat in your log or Oufinny's. After my show, I am NOT cutting anymore!!!

I want to put on muscle, while keeping bf% low. It sounds like this does the trick from what I've read. It sounds awesome to keep so low, while gaining.

Thanks to both of you for posting the info!

I am starting my lean gains diet today and I'm pretty excited to see what it brings me.

 

[oufinny]

I am starting my lean gains diet today and I'm pretty excited to see what it brings me.

Hope it goes well for you. The first few days get to be a challenge as you aren't used to packing the food in that quickly but your stomach adjusts pretty quick.

 

[MrKleen73]

Yah but is he an Endo, that's ok even if I could use it to maintain 8 or 9% think how close that would be, then you could tighten it up a bit maybe squeeze a bit more that would make for 8 to 10 week preps, sure beats the hell out of 20 weeks.

You and I are both hybrid endo / meso. He is the same actually if you read the site. Not naturally lean at all just stays that way via the IF. Of course he does count his calories too. I have not been as of yet and havin stellar results. After a few more months I will be able to attest to the ability to get lean and stay lean or let you all know it does not work out that way.

Nope, not missing a beat in your log or Oufinny's. After my show, I am NOT cutting anymore!!!

I want to put on muscle, while keeping bf% low. It sounds like this does the trick from what I've read. It sounds awesome to keep so low, while gaining.

Thanks to both of you for posting the info!

Hey I am excited about it so sharing is nothing but a joy to me. I keep getting leaner, noticeable differences already since last weeks pics too.

 

[VolcomX311]

Yah an all fish regime would deplete my supplies inside a week. Fish is easier to chew than lean beef...

So, so true. I can go through 2-3 tilapias (if it's not too, too hot fresh from the oven) in 2-3 min easy, if that.

 

[VolcomX311]

Nope, not missing a beat in your log or Oufinny's. After my show, I am NOT cutting anymore!!!

I want to put on muscle, while keeping bf% low. It sounds like this does the trick from what I've read. It sounds awesome to keep so low, while gaining.

Thanks to both of you for posting the info!

I'm going to give it a read myself.

 

[RickRock13]

Hope it goes well for you. The first few days get to be a challenge as you aren't used to packing the food in that quickly but your stomach adjusts pretty quick.

That's exactly what I underestimated. I started the day starving and by a couple hours into my eating time I'm stuffed and trying to figure out how I'm going to get the rest of the food ate in a few hours ...but I did it and I'm sure it gets a little easier

 

[oufinny]

That's exactly what I underestimated. I started the day starving and by a couple hours into my eating time I'm stuffed and trying to figure out how I'm going to get the rest of the food ate in a few hours ...but I did it and I'm sure it gets a little easier

Your stomach stretches and your body adjusts to the caloric needs. PLus, you start to stay full for long periods of time.

 

[MrKleen73]

Yeah and your hunger patterns adjust so that you may only get hungry for very short periods during the fast like 10minutes and then it passes. It is learned response to the normal feeding times and fades away. However an overly simple carb high cal day will make the next morning a little harder with hunger but nothing like in the first week.

 

[RickRock13]

Yeah and your hunger patterns adjust so that you may only get hungry for very short periods during the fast like 10minutes and then it passes. It is learned response to the normal feeding times and fades away. However an overly simple carb high cal day will make the next morning a little harder with hunger but nothing like in the first week.

Yeh today was easier than yesterday but it was also a cardio/ low Cal day so we will see what tomorrow is like. I am digging this diet though a lot...

 

[oufinny]

Yeh today was easier than yesterday but it was also a cardio/ low Cal day so we will see what tomorrow is like. I am digging this diet though a lot...

The best part is 200 grams of carbs fills you like double or triple that on a normal diet and 100 on low days still has you looking huge. It is a unique idea, I will run it again and will be smarter on what I chose to eat on it as well. If you are disciplined and get your cals right, I could see if being a super good diet for making some serious mass gains without all the extra calories like a traditional bulk. Eating 4000 calories a day for me is ridiculous, I could never sustain that for an extended period of time, I just don't need that much food to grow. Hence, lean gains is perfect for someone like me trying to gain mass.

 

[MrKleen73]

Yeah, and it is doing excellent for the cutting too.

 

[RickRock13]

The best part is 200 grams of carbs fills you like double or triple that on a normal diet and 100 on low days still has you looking huge. It is a unique idea, I will run it again and will be smarter on what I chose to eat on it as well. If you are disciplined and get your cals right, I could see if being a super good diet for making some serious mass gains without all the extra calories like a traditional bulk. Eating 4000 calories a day for me is ridiculous, I could never sustain that for an extended period of time, I just don't need that much food to grow. Hence, lean gains is perfect for someone like me trying to gain mass.

I agree man. That's pretty much where I have adjusted my carbs to and I'm liking it there. 200-250 on high days and 100-150 on low days. I can definitely see this as a diet that could be used to bulk with after some slight changes to it.

 

[oufinny]

I agree man. That's pretty much where I have adjusted my carbs to and I'm liking it there. 200-250 on high days and 100-150 on low days. I can definitely see this as a diet that could be used to bulk with after some slight changes to it.

Actually if your calories are at maintenance on higher days and just under with the carb change on low days, you will gain mass. It depends on how lean the gains are going to be as to how many cals you consume, hence the name. This is not a fast bulker by any means but the gains are solid (unless you run PH/DS then the gains are much quicker!). :firedevil: