Tr1iump and d1methadrol

[yates84]

I know the goal is to keep estrogen under control not completely kill it. So from what Im reading Letrone and exemestane would be good for controlling estrogen right?

If you want to use Letrone then just keep the exemestane on hand in case of any high estrogen sides. No need to use exemestane if the Letrone has your estrogen under control

 

[zman86]

I'm gonna have both adex and exem OH. Should i use adex ON and save exem for PCT or vice versa? Which is optimal

 

[gagandugan]

Yeah vujade, I think you used something natural to recover in PCT. Probably Rebirth. Anyway, I agree with yates here: use Letrone, it's a solid product. But have exemestane just in case. If you don't need it, keep it for next itme. It's cheap anyway.

 

[Misfits88]

iExotherm is not as strong as Letrone. It has the same ingredients, but at a lower dosage, plus the added fat burners.

Letrone would probably be a better fit @ 2 caps a day. But truthfully, you may end up not needing an AI
while on Trest while using DHT Based PH/DS/AAS...

I initially started my Trest run with Formestane, but ended up dropping it because it became unneeded
because i was running 1000mg of Stano per day, which converts to DHT. DHT will work like an AI, and
keep estrogen low. When i came off my cycle, my E2 levels were only @ 5, which is below normal for
a male. I seriously believe this to be, because of the DHT.




Thanks for the mention bro.. :biggthumpup:




I didnt use Letrone while on Trest. It wasn't available at the time. I beta tested Letrone during my PCT.

And then used it for another month or two while doing some natty cycles.

I know the goal is to keep estrogen under control not completely kill it. So from what Im reading Letrone and exemestane would be good for controlling estrogen right?

Just read vujade post. Thanx for the heads up and education. I will keep letrone as an AI in case I flare up and need to use it. Im also gonna be using Arimacare Pro for cycle support.

as for PCT is Super PCT, Rebirth, Viron and follidrone good for this or should I still get some clomid.

btw cycle is trest, triumph, mass gh

 

[yates84]

I'm gonna have both adex and exem OH. Should i use adex ON and save exem for PCT or vice versa? Which is optimal

Save exemestane for pct, it's a suicide inhibitor so you won't have to worry about rebound estro as much. Tapering off adex is a pain in the a$$

 

[vujade]

I know the goal is to keep estrogen under control not completely kill it.
So from what Im reading Letrone and exemestane would be good for controlling estrogen right?

If you want to use Letrone then just keep the exemestane on hand in case of any high estrogen sides.
No need to use exemestane if the Letrone has your estrogen under control

Exactly what yates said above..!

Yeah vujade, I think you used something natural to recover in PCT. Probably Rebirth.
Anyway, I agree with yates here: use Letrone, it's a solid product. But have exemestane just in case. If you don't need it,
keep it for next itme. It's cheap anyway.

 

[Jebrook]

i was under the impression that BLR exotherm is an AI (transdermal AI) . is this not sufficient? or should I use Letrone instead? (oral AI)

Misfits88 I agree with everything that has been suggested. I haven't broke into my Dermatrest stash yet so I'll be very curious as to how it treats ya. Some seem to react very different to it as far as levels of aromatization and estrogen related sides. If you go with Letrone you ought to be prepared to go to 3-4 caps just in case. If not you have something stronger as back up like T-Bone and everyone else has suggested. That's a helluva stack! Trest and Triumph has been run successfully but not with LGD and Ibutamoren like that to my knowledge. Probably no one can tell you exactly what to expect so it's good to be over prepared.

 

[gagandugan]

Speaking of this recent re-emerging of Tr1umph - you guys should produce a limited edition of Stenabol and sell it through NV. That stuff will sell. Two weeks on the shelves and gone. What do you think? Are any other - still legal - products possible?

 

[yates84]

Speaking of this recent re-emerging of Tr1umph - you guys should produce a limited edition of Stenabol and sell it through NV. That stuff will sell. Two weeks on the shelves and gone. What do you think? Are any other - still legal - products possible?

Those bottles of triumph were produced pre ban, there was no new release on it. Legal products like that are always a possibility but they will carry the Olympus UK label from now on

 

[gagandugan]

OK, let me rephrase: Do you have some old limited stash of Stenabol that could be sold now? Also, are you guys preparing something hormonal for 2015-16? I know there will be products like the new Conqu3r and Test1fy - and no one really knows what Test1fy is. :thinking:

 

[yates84]

OK, let me rephrase: Do you have some old limited stash of Stenabol that could be sold now? Also, are you guys preparing something hormonal for 2015-16? I know there will be products like the new Conqu3r and Test1fy - and no one really knows what Test1fy is. :thinking:

Nutriverse did that, not us. Not really sure what the boss has up his sleeves atm. So...you don't know what TESTify is yet?

 

[Volvo140G]

Goooooooooo NUTRIVERSE!!!!!!

 

[yates84]

Goooooooooo NUTRIVERSE!!!!!!

That was a very nice suprise from NV, I thought those were dead and gone forever

 

[afluck410]

What is TESTify?

 

[gagandugan]

I... do not know anything about Test1fy. It is shrouded in mystery. I guess it's a new natty test booster.

 

[yates84]

What is TESTify?

A new OL product that is coming real soon. I can't give any more details but think about it a little bit. The name gives it away

 

[T-Bone]

So seeing Trest isn't on the ban list, and it was actually re-released by olympus UK, Nutri-verse will keep it in stock?....I'm just saying with all these newbies to Trest, you know they are all gonna want to run it again.

 

[afluck410]

I'm hoping its some sort of anabolic and not a natty test booster lol

 

[yates84]

So seeing Trest isn't on the ban list, and it was actually re-released by olympus UK, Nutri-verse will keep it in stock?....I'm just saying with all these newbies to Trest, you know they are all gonna want to run it again.

This is a limited release, stock up while you can. When nutriverse runs out, trest will be moving to the uk permanently

 

[T-Bone]

This is a limited release, stock up while you can. When nutriverse runs out, trest will be moving to the uk permanently

Don't let it run out!. Don't have the money to get more right now thanks to Nutri-verse and all their crazy sales! Oh and Volvo140G being a pimp!

 

[goodvibes]

This trest game have me broke.. consolidating two bottles into one to save space in my stash box.

 

[gagandugan]

Hehe, limited release... well, that's exactly what I am saying: you did it with Trest, now do Stenabol. I'm sure there is a customer somewhere... :wave2:

 

[gagandugan]

This trest game have me broke.. consolidating two bottles into one to save space in my stash box.

Smart. I did the same with 1 1/2 bottles of Super Mandro. It fits, but barely. I had to put a label on it too: 135 capsules!

 

[jbryand101b]

OK, let me rephrase: Do you have some old limited stash of Stenabol that could be sold now? Also, are you guys preparing something hormonal for 2015-16? I know there will be products like the new Conqu3r and Test1fy - and no one really knows what Test1fy is. :thinking:

Ol UK is going to be busting out some goodies soon

 

[Misfits88]

Misfits88 I agree with everything that has been suggested. I haven't broke into my Dermatrest stash yet so I'll be very curious as to how it treats ya. Some seem to react very different to it as far as levels of aromatization and estrogen related sides. If you go with Letrone you ought to be prepared to go to 3-4 caps just in case. If not you have something stronger as back up like T-Bone and everyone else has suggested. That's a helluva stack! Trest and Triumph has been run successfully but not with LGD and Ibutamoren like that to my knowledge. Probably no one can tell you exactly what to expect so it's good to be over prepared.

Thanx for the advice Jebrook, my goal is to put on some lean mass but have that shredded dry look. So I guess to be safe I should run two seperate cycles. One with trest and triumph once done. take a small break clean my system out then start the Mass GH cycle with something else. Would this be more appropriate? Im still pretty new to PH. Ive ran a bunch of natty cycle by OL and BLR with great result my most recent cycle was an AMS 1-andro, 4-ad, arom-x + ostarine... got nice lean mass with this

thanx for all the input and advice and suggestions from all you guys. Ive done quite a bit of reading and research but also like to hear from different users experiences and such.

 

[Jebrook]

Thanx for the advice Jebrook, my goal is to put on some lean mass but have that shredded dry look. So I guess to be safe I should run two seperate cycles. One with trest and triumph once done. take a small break clean my system out then start the Mass GH cycle with something else. Would this be more appropriate? Im still pretty new to PH. Ive ran a bunch of natty cycle by OL and BLR with great result my most recent cycle was an AMS 1-andro, 4-ad, arom-x + ostarine... got nice lean mass with this

thanx for all the input and advice and suggestions from all you guys. Ive done quite a bit of reading and research but also like to hear from different users experiences and such.

It looks very interesting. Not saying it isn't a good idea as I don't have firsthand experience with each of those compounds. Unless some of the Other guys thinks it's a bad idea you could do it if you want to. Would be interesting to see the results! However, with only one Andro/SARM cycle under your belt might be jumping in too deep. I'd like to hear the others' more informed opinions myself. However you decide, we're all here to help you get it squared away.

 

[T-Bone]

It looks very interesting. Not saying it isn't a good idea as I don't have firsthand experience with each of those compounds. Unless some of the Other guys thinks it's a bad idea you could do it if you want to. Would be interesting to see the results! However, with only one Andro/SARM cycle under your belt might be jumping in too deep. I'd like to hear the others' more informed opinions myself. However you decide, we're all here to help you get it squared away.

Well a lot of people say Trest isn't for a beginner. It is a very powerful compound. Triumph on the other hand is very mild and fine for a first cycle. I've read it sometimes referred to as "one step above epistane". Once you run Trest though you won't really want to run anything else or anything else without it added. It's up to Misfits88 though. Maybe he could run the Triumph with some dermacrine and save the Trest for a rainy day. It's almost bedtime for me here though so I've got to log off for now.

 

[Misfits88]

I think ill do that what T-bone suggested, run triumph with dermacrine just to test the waters, then run the more powerful trest on another cycle with tr1umph maybe next year. Ill log my cycle which will be triumph,dermacrine, mass gh and see where it takes me.

 

[Volvo140G]

Dermacrine's great and that'll be a fine run!

 

[Joedoubledose]

Ohhhh what the future may hold for OL UK

 

[Misfits88]

CYCLE:
Mass Gh week 1-6
Dermacrine week 1-8
Triumph week 1-8
arimacare pro 1-8
letrone 1-8 ....I will keep exemestane OH just in case
Follidrone or Epic Unleashed

PCT:
Super PCT
Nolva or Clomid
Rebirth
Viron
Exemestane
Follidrone

Final decision I think haha...thank you everyone for helping me make an informed dicision. any additional comments/suggestions are greatly appreciated

 

[Bunshichi]

For what purpose do you add the Letrone?
I guess the AIs in Ar1macare will easily be sufficent for the Dermacrine as it is added to a non aromatizing compound.

 

[yates84]

Dropping trest = dropping letrone. Without the trest this cycle is dry as fuk, you have 2 dht compounds and 2 ai's in armicare pro. I would not add another ai to this cycle, your estrogen would likely tank. Low estrogen means a limp noodle and sore joints

 

[Jebrook]

Dropping trest = dropping letrone. Without the trest this cycle is dry as fuk, you have 2 dht compounds and 2 ai's in armicare pro. I would not add another ai to this cycle, your estrogen would likely tank. Low estrogen means a limp noodle and sore joints

Hadn't considered that. Good catch. Something to consider.

 

[yates84]

Hadn't considered that. Good catch. Something to consider.

Never hurts to have a few ai's in the stash! They do keep quite well

 

[MrKleen73]

iExotherm is not as strong as Letrone. It has the same ingredients, but at a lower dosage, plus the added fat burners.

Letrone would probably be a better fit @ 2 caps a day. But truthfully, you may end up not needing an AI
while on Trest while using DHT Based PH/DS/AAS...

I initially started my Trest run with Formestane, but ended up dropping it because it became unneeded
because i was running 1000mg of Stano per day, which converts to DHT. DHT will work like an AI, and
keep estrogen low. When i came off my cycle, my E2 levels were only @ 5, which is below normal for
a male. I seriously believe this to be, because of the DHT.




Thanks for the mention bro.. :biggthumpup:




I didnt use Letrone while on Trest. It wasn't available at the time. I beta tested Letrone during my PCT.

And then used it for another month or two while doing some natty cycles.

DHT actually has no effect on estrogen levels, it has a higher affinity to the AR, than estrogen, especially in breast tissue. You could say that it has anti-estrogen properties similar to epistane, but it does not lower or control estrogen levels like an Aromatase Inhibitor. It simply binds the the androgenic receptors that estrogen would typically at a much higher affinity so the estrogen has no where to bind and can not take action. If he chose to control the estrogen sides via DHT alone he would need to be extra careful coming off due to the likelihood of estro rebound. Estro levels would be higher at that point since not able to bind, once the DHT levels dropped the heightened estro levels would have a party rushing into the newly freed up AR. So he just needs to be aware that Estro control during PCT would need to be immediate as opposed to waiting further into PCT to add one.

Dropping trest = dropping letrone. Without the trest this cycle is dry as fuk, you have 2 dht compounds and 2 ai's in armicare pro. I would not add another ai to this cycle, your estrogen would likely tank. Low estrogen means a limp noodle and sore joints

No doubt, he would have been very unhappy running it like that. Also he needs to make sure to put the Dermacrine on the upper back and traps so it gets converted into the correct target hormone and not directly converted to estrogen. There are certain compounds in different areas of the skin that break things down differently. The ones that convert to more Andro than estro are located in the upper back, traps and shoulders. Anywhere else in the body and you will get a higher estro conversion rate.

 

[yates84]

DHT actually has no effect on estrogen levels, it has a higher affinity to the AR, than estrogen, especially in breast tissue. You could say that it has anti-estrogen properties similar to epistane, but it does not lower or control estrogen levels like an Aromatase Inhibitor. It simply binds the the androgenic receptors that estrogen would typically at a much higher affinity so the estrogen has no where to bind and can not take action. If he chose to control the estrogen sides via DHT alone he would need to be extra careful coming off due to the likelihood of estro rebound. Estro levels would be higher at that point since not able to bind, once the DHT levels dropped the heightened estro levels would have a party rushing into the newly freed up AR. So he just needs to be aware that Estro control during PCT would need to be immediate as opposed to waiting further into PCT to add one.



No doubt, he would have been very unhappy running it like that. Also he needs to make sure to put the Dermacrine on the upper back and traps so it gets converted into the correct target hormone and not directly converted to estrogen. There are certain compounds in different areas of the skin that break things down differently. The ones that convert to more Andro than estro are located in the upper back, traps and shoulders. Anywhere else in the body and you will get a higher estro conversion rate.

Solid info like always!

 

[Misfits88]

so what you are saying is that Arimacare Pro is enough for this cycle (triumph,dermacrine,mass gh). Save letrone and exemestane for trest cycle next year?

I also read that nolva and exemestane are used as pct together? any thoughts on this...

 

[jbryand101b]

Look MrKleen73
https://www.urmc.rochester.edu/george-whipple-lab/documents/miya-papers/3.pdf
Busting out the schience

 

[afluck410]

Which part am I focusing on ^

 

[jbryand101b]

Which part am I focusing on ^

That estrogen binds with an interacts with the androgen receptor.

 

[Misfits88]

So much info this is awesome. You guys are great.

Cycle:
triumph
dermacrine
mass gh
arimacare pro
follidrone

PCT:
Super pct
rebirth
viron
follidrone
letrone for an AI


mod edit: and you shouldn't ask.

 

[zman86]

So much info this is awesome. You guys are great.

Cycle:
triumph
dermacrine
mass gh
arimacare pro
follidrone

PCT:
Super pct
rebirth
viron
follidrone
letrone for an AI

If you have no idea where then drop the triumph

 

[afluck410]

mod edit: no

 

[MrKleen73]

so what you are saying is that Arimacare Pro is enough for this cycle (triumph,dermacrine,mass gh). Save letrone and exemestane for trest cycle next year?

I also read that nolva and exemestane are used as pct together? any thoughts on this...

There is a good PCT thread somewhere on this site that explains things a lot more but yes Arimicare Pro will be plenty during the cycle. Nolva and Exem work well together but you have to consider when to use these things. You would want to start the SERM aka Nolva first then add in the exemestane a couple weeks into PCT. No need to be on it in the beginning. Especially with your supplement line up for PCT.

Look MrKleen73
https://www.urmc.rochester.edu/george-whipple-lab/documents/miya-papers/3.pdf
Busting out the schience

Gracias Sir!

So much info this is awesome. You guys are great.

Cycle:
triumph
dermacrine
mass gh
arimacare pro
follidrone

PCT:
Super pct
rebirth
viron
follidrone
letrone for an AI

PCT Supps - I don't know if you already have everything in hand but you are overkill here. If you have not purchased everything I would make some decisions on what you want to run and save the rest or save the money on it. I will explain why and hope I don't get slapped around for proper education instead of supplement sales.

Super PCT - Strong AI, Mucana for Prolactin support, SHGB Binders to free testosterone, estrogen modulator in I3C, general nutrients for testosterone support like ZMA, magnesium, B6, and liver support which helps with the SERM which is liver toxic anyway. A solid product by itself.

Rebirth - Estrogen Modulator to help increase natural production, it is basically a natural SERM. - You will already be taking a real SERM in Nolva r Clomid - this would be ideal if you are not planning on starting out with a real SERM and want to see if you can recover naturally. However probably not much use if you are going to actually take a SERM like Nolva or Clomid. So that leaves you with a few decisions, go no SERM and use this, go with a SERM and this, or use SERM & save the money on this or use it on a weaker cycle down the road like recovering from Ostarine or something. The product is solid but the need for it in this instance... that is something for you to ponder.

Viron - Viron is a pretty bad ass SHGB binder! It increases your free testosterone levels without having to increase total serum levels. Unbound testosterone is the only active form of testosterone. Taking an SHGB will make you feel like your test levels are much higher than they are because free test is much higher. This is excellent for how you FEEL during a PCT, however it also falsely reports to your HPTA that you are back up to normal Serum Test levels because the free levels are high enough. So as great as they can make the beginning of PCT feel they are actually making the recovery less efficient. You can actually cause some shut down just using an SHGB product for too long. This is exactly why most test booster bottles say run them for no longer than 8 weeks. You can gradually step your natty production down by fooling the system to think there is more than there is. If going to run this in PCT I would only run it the first 2 weeks then drop it.

Letrone - Strong AI with lots of other benefits. This would be something to consider here, I highly doubt you will need this if you are running SuperPCT. Between the two of them you would drop your estro uncomfortably low. I would pick one or the other.

As far as exem, I HIGHLY doubt you will have any need for it. You have 2 strong AI's here in your list and coming off a basically non aromatizing cycle except for the dermacrine your estro levels should not be that high. I can't imagine you needing this just to combat estro rebound unless it was your only AI. However again, if you are purchasing a research / pharma AI anyway why not use it instead of spending more money on supplements you already know won't do as good of a job as it will? I mean spending money on the actual medicine just to have it incase a supplement doesn't work doesn't make a lot of sense financially. That would be like running a fever going to the doctor to get on antibiotics, buying the prescription and going home putting it in a cabinet just in case the OTC fever meds didn't kill the bacterial infection. Doesn't make a ton of sense does it?

In the end supplement wise, both companies are legit and have great products. You should decide if you want an all in one product like Super PCT, or each thing being taken care of by a individual product using the BLR set up for your PCT and make your purchases accordingly. Both have advantage and disadvantages.

If it were me I would do this. Pharma Grade Nolva, arimidex, and an Anti cortisol supplement for the first 2-3 weeks of PCT with some NAC, fish oils, and perhaps TUDCA which are often staples for me. Other than that I might add in some MK-677 and an epi product, and that would be it.

 

[Jebrook]

So much info this is awesome. You guys are great.

Cycle:
triumph
dermacrine
mass gh
arimacare pro
follidrone

PCT:
Super pct
rebirth
viron
follidrone
letrone for an AI

Also, you have Follidrone listed twice, on cycle and during pct. it would be a waste to run it on cycle. Just thought I would point that out in case it wasn't a typo.

 

[Jebrook]

There is a good PCT thread somewhere on this site that explains things a lot more but yes Arimicare Pro will be plenty during the cycle. Nolva and Exem work well together but you have to consider when to use these things. You would want to start the SERM aka Nolva first then add in the exemestane a couple weeks into PCT. No need to be on it in the beginning. Especially with your supplement line up for PCT.


Gracias Sir!


PCT Supps - I don't know if you already have everything in hand but you are overkill here. If you have not purchased everything I would make some decisions on what you want to run and save the rest or save the money on it. I will explain why and hope I don't get slapped around for proper education instead of supplement sales.

Super PCT - Strong AI, Mucana for Prolactin support, SHGB Binders to free testosterone, estrogen modulator in I3C, general nutrients for testosterone support like ZMA, magnesium, B6, and liver support which helps with the SERM which is liver toxic anyway. A solid product by itself.

Rebirth - Estrogen Modulator to help increase natural production, it is basically a natural SERM. - You will already be taking a real SERM in Nolva r Clomid - this would be ideal if you are not planning on starting out with a real SERM and want to see if you can recover naturally. However probably not much use if you are going to actually take a SERM like Nolva or Clomid. So that leaves you with a few decisions, go no SERM and use this, go with a SERM and this, or use SERM & save the money on this or use it on a weaker cycle down the road like recovering from Ostarine or something. The product is solid but the need for it in this instance... that is something for you to ponder.

Viron - Viron is a pretty bad ass SHGB binder! It increases your free testosterone levels without having to increase total serum levels. Unbound testosterone is the only active form of testosterone. Taking an SHGB will make you feel like your test levels are much higher than they are because free test is much higher. This is excellent for how you FEEL during a PCT, however it also falsely reports to your HPTA that you are back up to normal Serum Test levels because the free levels are high enough. So as great as they can make the beginning of PCT feel they are actually making the recovery less efficient. You can actually cause some shut down just using an SHGB product for too long. This is exactly why most test booster bottles say run them for no longer than 8 weeks. You can gradually step your natty production down by fooling the system to think there is more than there is. If going to run this in PCT I would only run it the first 2 weeks then drop it.

Letrone - Strong AI with lots of other benefits. This would be something to consider here, I highly doubt you will need this if you are running SuperPCT. Between the two of them you would drop your estro uncomfortably low. I would pick one or the other.

As far as exem, I HIGHLY doubt you will have any need for it. You have 2 strong AI's here in your list and coming off a basically non aromatizing cycle except for the dermacrine your estro levels should not be that high. I can't imagine you needing this just to combat estro rebound unless it was your only AI. However again, if you are purchasing a research / pharma AI anyway why not use it instead of spending more money on supplements you already know won't do as good of a job as it will? I mean spending money on the actual medicine just to have it incase a supplement doesn't work doesn't make a lot of sense financially. That would be like running a fever going to the doctor to get on antibiotics, buying the prescription and going home putting it in a cabinet just in case the OTC fever meds didn't kill the bacterial infection. Doesn't make a ton of sense does it?

In the end supplement wise, both companies are legit and have great products. You should decide if you want an all in one product like Super PCT, or each thing being taken care of by a individual product using the BLR set up for your PCT and make your purchases accordingly. Both have advantage and disadvantages.

If it were me I would do this. Pharma Grade Nolva, arimidex, and an Anti cortisol supplement for the first 2-3 weeks of PCT with some NAC, fish oils, and perhaps TUDCA which are often staples for me. Other than that I might add in some MK-677 and an epi product, and that would be it.

This is interesting info about SHBG
binding. Was not aware of this phenomenon. By this token, might it not be better to use it later in PCT after total serum levels have neared the peak? Thoughts MrKleen73 or anyone?

 

[yates84]

This is interesting info about SHBG
binding. Was not aware of this phenomenon. By this token, might it not be better to use it later in PCT after total serum levels have neared the peak? Thoughts MrKleen73 or anyone?

Looks like right after pct would be optimal

 

[MrKleen73]

Also, you have Follidrone listed twice, on cycle and during pct. it would be a waste to run it on cycle. Just thought I would point that out in case it wasn't a typo.

Wouldn't follidrone actually be more beneficial starting in the last few weeks of the cycle? This is often what is done with other myostatin inhibitors. Myostatin levels continue to build up throughout a cycle trying to limit the exponential growth. Toward the end this is a big factor in what limits your growth. Lowering myostatin when it is higher at the end of the cycle should indeed be quite beneficial for that purpose. I know injection forms of myostatin inhibitors work well in this regard anyway. Not sure on the oral administration of this particular one if it would work as well. Also there are some other benefits to the lipids and what not that running on cycle might be beneficial right?

What are your thoughts on that aspect Jebrook

Now I do think that limiting the time of exposure to this would be a god idea. As you lower myostatin you also lower the collagen production in your connective tissue which can make it more brittle. So running it for long periods of time while you are lifting heavier and heavier might not be the best situation. However the connective tissue recovers after you go off since collagen production increases with the its cessation.

 

[MrKleen73]

This is interesting info about SHBG
binding. Was not aware of this phenomenon. By this token, might it not be better to use it later in PCT after total serum levels have neared the peak? Thoughts MrKleen73 or anyone?

Yes exactly, once you are actually recovered then you would want to run it.

Looks like right after pct would be optimal

BINGO!!!!!!!

Basically my stance on it is finish PCT, wait 1 month then hit up a nice little 4-8 week run on one and you will really enjoy your bridge / natty period. You want a month of good base production without any external stimulation other than perhaps vitamin D3, & ZMA in the evening which just supports your natty production but does not induce it. That way you have a full month of it up and running on it's own. Your natty levels should keep climbing after your actual PCT is finished. PCT is just to get you out of the danger zone and close to your normal levels then they continue to slowly rise on their own after PCT. So knowing that I would wait a minimum of 4 weeks post PCT in order not to inhibit the natural recovery process.