ProteinMurder
Member
I agree with some of what you say mate, I guess everyone has some kinda agenda generally. But it's a sad day if we the consumer has gotta get pre/post bloodwork done to see if we are being lied to or not!
iForce Nutrition - Tropinol - THE CHAMP IS HERE!(free bottles inside!)
- Thread starter VaughnTrue
- Start date
I agree with some of what you say mate, I guess everyone has some kinda agenda generally. But it's a sad day if we the consumer has gotta get pre/post bloodwork done to see if we are being lied to or not!
chocolatemilk
Well-known member
Vaughn has handled this very well.
Steve, whatever you have to say, save it for your site. It honestly looks like a little marketing preview on your end. Just saying. I look forward to what you are doing, but this thread is not the place for what you are trying to do. This is an iforce thread and it looks like you are coming to them and bashing them. If you have an opinion... and it is a genuine opinion of caring for customers and the supplement industry, then you should act like and simply voice your opinions on your home court for people to see. This was not the place for all this you started. You look like an aggressor right now.
Vaughn good job of being a gentlemen.
Steve, whatever you have to say, save it for your site. It honestly looks like a little marketing preview on your end. Just saying. I look forward to what you are doing, but this thread is not the place for what you are trying to do. This is an iforce thread and it looks like you are coming to them and bashing them. If you have an opinion... and it is a genuine opinion of caring for customers and the supplement industry, then you should act like and simply voice your opinions on your home court for people to see. This was not the place for all this you started. You look like an aggressor right now.
Vaughn good job of being a gentlemen.
Mr.50
Board Supporter
lol ok, here are my responses for you despite it doing absolutely nothing to further this conversation.
1. We claimed a 347% increase may be possible. Our alpha testers showed increases of 300%+ which is right there. Can every single person gain a 347% increase? Nope...not possible. However can every single person who uses ANY drug see the desired effects? Nope...not possible.
2. You are correct. Blood tests are more precise than saliva testing. We used saliva testing for reasons of price, usability(we had alpha testers from all over the country, and had to send them hormone tests. This was the best option at the time).
3. I've already given my response to why I included AR's name...read above a few posts.
edit: I'd also like to mention that the user who posted bloodwork voluntarily used blood testing...not saliva. >1200 test level, 32 e2 on a scale of 20-82.
way higher than normal test, lower than normal estrogen...
yup, that blood test must be off!
Vaughn,
Not to get too involved here, and remember I have purchased the product and I am going to give it a full fair run, but again SS's results are for soemone who has artificially depressed test levels (he is in PCT) so I am just wondering if there is blood work of anyone who has had an increase in test that started with a normal test level prior to using BN? (so no medical conditions that made test lower then norm, and no PCT). Just wondering? BN might have a great application for PCT but I am wondering if it is more of a PCT compound or if it is more of a true test booster (which can provide effects even for those who are between ph cycles etc but not in PCT).
Mr.50
Vengeance187
Member
:dead:I'm not sure if this is how it works or not, but wouldn't the entire injected 300mg dose of test be free test? 98% of endogenous test is bound test. If this is the case, then even if the total test was the same 1,300ng/dl for both, the exogenous subject would have 3,200% more free test right? Like I said, I don't know how the injection stuff works but if 100% of the injected test stays free test, then yes, that would be the case, and no, they wouldn't even be close to the same.
steveironman
Banned
Your assumptions are incorrect.
steveironman
Banned
Every point i made here was and is, valid , legitimate and true. Sorry if some of you dont like it. Its time to open all our eyes to facts and see through bs and hype. Sorry if some of you like Vaughn ..or this company. Thats ok ..they may both overall be good - but this product and the tactics used to market it are wrong.
My final Reiteration:
Look Bottom Lines:
1- Claims are unfounded (test methods are not only antiquated..with no medical credibility - but summaries provided by a chiropractor for gods sake..A guy on/starting pct - starting at zero - i sure as hell hope his levels increased - with or without your supplement)
2-Free Test - The test responsible for all the benefits you claim this product will yield..isnt even tested..wait cant even be tested by the method you are using.
3-You claim labwork and bloodwork ...yet neither have been posted. (not that it matters without free test even being tested or results of that being increased)
Vaughn - I wont buy the hype....why the innuendo ? why the unfounded claims? Why using testing method that doesnt even test the effective hormone? It will all be exposed as BS Vaughn....Unfortunately just like all other herbal test boosters..i fear this one is useless as well. You guys are using all the crappy marketing techniques and lies that have historically proved a product useless and a company ..well lets just say - lacking moral fiber. I mean you KNOW Free test is what matters - yet you dont test for it...You KNOW blood work is accurate and provides concrete data ...but you dont use it. You KNOW it wont raise test like test e ..but your claims indicate it will . You claim: "Users of Tropinol get expect to have the most exciting cycle of their lives. Increases in strength, libido, power, and muscle mass will come quickly. Users can expect muscle mass gains upwards of 6-9lbs, significant strength gains, reduced recovery times, as well as an incredible increase in libido." - isnt it true without an increase in free test this isnt a valid claim ..yet you have no idea if your product increases free test Vaughn - Do you ?
I could go on and on..I think intelligent , well informed people, get the gist. I encourage the supp buying public to exercise caution here and hold on to your money. If not i suspect another tribulus like, ineffective , over-hyped , useless for muscle building - supplement.
My final Reiteration:
Look Bottom Lines:
1- Claims are unfounded (test methods are not only antiquated..with no medical credibility - but summaries provided by a chiropractor for gods sake..A guy on/starting pct - starting at zero - i sure as hell hope his levels increased - with or without your supplement)
2-Free Test - The test responsible for all the benefits you claim this product will yield..isnt even tested..wait cant even be tested by the method you are using.
3-You claim labwork and bloodwork ...yet neither have been posted. (not that it matters without free test even being tested or results of that being increased)
Vaughn - I wont buy the hype....why the innuendo ? why the unfounded claims? Why using testing method that doesnt even test the effective hormone? It will all be exposed as BS Vaughn....Unfortunately just like all other herbal test boosters..i fear this one is useless as well. You guys are using all the crappy marketing techniques and lies that have historically proved a product useless and a company ..well lets just say - lacking moral fiber. I mean you KNOW Free test is what matters - yet you dont test for it...You KNOW blood work is accurate and provides concrete data ...but you dont use it. You KNOW it wont raise test like test e ..but your claims indicate it will . You claim: "Users of Tropinol get expect to have the most exciting cycle of their lives. Increases in strength, libido, power, and muscle mass will come quickly. Users can expect muscle mass gains upwards of 6-9lbs, significant strength gains, reduced recovery times, as well as an incredible increase in libido." - isnt it true without an increase in free test this isnt a valid claim ..yet you have no idea if your product increases free test Vaughn - Do you ?
I could go on and on..I think intelligent , well informed people, get the gist. I encourage the supp buying public to exercise caution here and hold on to your money. If not i suspect another tribulus like, ineffective , over-hyped , useless for muscle building - supplement.
VaughnTrue
Well-known member
And have u read WHY it's in there?
For the 50th time, its got as much caffeine as a can of diet soda...u don't drink diet soda or coffee do u? Lol
I'm done defending the best test booster this industry has ever had. U don't like the product? Don't buy it.
Everyone who has and everyone who will is going to love it!
If you hate it, we get it. Feel free to keep reporting the EXACT same points I've already proven nonsense.
Have a nice day now!
bdcc
Legend
I am genuinely interested in how this product pans out. Any natural athlete is going to be happy to get an edge if an interesting new ingredient comes out.
That being said, saying it is "the best test booster this industry has ever had" is ridiculous. You have only received results from two alpha testers who were below the minimum acceptable testosterone level to begin with and now one other person who was in PCT and used a SERM as well prior to this (from what I understand- I may be wrong). If more results come in and it shows promise then I will give it a go but the arguments you are receiving are largely due to overhyping a product. This kind of comment isn't going to help the cause.
Still, I am in to see more results and appreciate any honest debate as well as honest reviews.
That being said, saying it is "the best test booster this industry has ever had" is ridiculous. You have only received results from two alpha testers who were below the minimum acceptable testosterone level to begin with and now one other person who was in PCT and used a SERM as well prior to this (from what I understand- I may be wrong). If more results come in and it shows promise then I will give it a go but the arguments you are receiving are largely due to overhyping a product. This kind of comment isn't going to help the cause.
Still, I am in to see more results and appreciate any honest debate as well as honest reviews.
thebigt
Legend
wow-after reading this entire thread i am just plain floored by how well vaughn has kept his cool.
not taking sides here, i just wanted to give vaughn credit for his very grown up behavior.:biggthumpup:
VaughnTrue
Well-known member
Has there ever been a NATURAL(no illegal AI's or non-dshea compounds) that was able to show 300% test increase ever? We have 3x now!
If Tropinol does what we say it can, is it NOT the best one around? It is/would be.
You guys keep saying the exact same things! I don't believe you Vaughn! Not possible! So then we show proof and u want end user proof...we can't get that to you until you all CALM down and wait for the results! We can't get them to you ANY quicker than it takes! Plain and simple.
About 3 years ago no one believed me Reversitol could be used as OTC pct. After page after page of drama, and people actually waiting for end user reports, it became the #1 selling PCT product for a reason...I was right!
Then we released Dymethazine. Page after page of doubts and yet again, Vaughn was a liar. Then after user reports started pouring in, Dymethazine was proven to do EXACTLY what we claimed it would.
Anyone remember Protodrol? SAME story.
Can anyone name a SINGLE iForce product they used that they thought was a rip off? We release TOP quality products that always live up to their "hype".
Tropinol will live up to it and then some. Despite me HATING this ridiculous banter, it will be nice to re-read it in 4 months when there is no more drama and YET AGAIN Vaughn was right and never lied.
If Tropinol does what we say it can, is it NOT the best one around? It is/would be.
You guys keep saying the exact same things! I don't believe you Vaughn! Not possible! So then we show proof and u want end user proof...we can't get that to you until you all CALM down and wait for the results! We can't get them to you ANY quicker than it takes! Plain and simple.
About 3 years ago no one believed me Reversitol could be used as OTC pct. After page after page of drama, and people actually waiting for end user reports, it became the #1 selling PCT product for a reason...I was right!
Then we released Dymethazine. Page after page of doubts and yet again, Vaughn was a liar. Then after user reports started pouring in, Dymethazine was proven to do EXACTLY what we claimed it would.
Anyone remember Protodrol? SAME story.
Can anyone name a SINGLE iForce product they used that they thought was a rip off? We release TOP quality products that always live up to their "hype".
Tropinol will live up to it and then some. Despite me HATING this ridiculous banter, it will be nice to re-read it in 4 months when there is no more drama and YET AGAIN Vaughn was right and never lied.
VaughnTrue
Well-known member
I'm a pretty big hot head, but it was obvious that Steve is simply trying to promote his own website to make some extra cash.
Can't get angry at a snake, no point
bdcc
Legend
I will assume this rant wasn't directed at me. I am only saying it is a premature claim to make (only have blood tests from three people, two were below minimum levels and one was in PCT with SERM usage) and is probably one of the reasons you are getting so much grief from steveironman.
If it delivers results in people with normal levels, like Mr 50 keeps asking then I am more than happy to agree.
Dwight Schrute
I am faster than 80% of all snakes
Everyone needs to relax.
AZMIDLYF
Legend
Agreed,the other poster needs some work on his delivery. I for one am turned off by his attitude. Keep the emotions out of it and let the facts speak for themselves.
schizm
Well-known member
SynergyIre
Active member
I'm a pretty big hot head, but it was obvious that Steve is simply trying to promote his own website to make some extra cash.
Can't get angry at a snake, no point
More kudos to you! Definitely, gained more respect for you and for iForce!
jimmyinkedup
Banned
Wow - So everything he told me is true. Well an FYI to everyone in this thread.
Every single point Steve made is correct.
Saliva tests suck and are unacceptable in the medical / scientific community. The are unreliable and inaccurate. One of the main reasons they are particularly bad in this instance is that certain supplements provide false #' as far as hormones go. Obviously not good at all, especially in this circumstance.
Also - Free test is the only number that matters when it comes to test levels for our benefits. Saliva tests do not test free test at all.
The claims of a 347% increase are def misleading ...the formula Steve used (test enanthate i believe) is a very real life example of how that information is very misleading to consumers.
To claim the benefits claimed by this product with no research whatsoever to back it up would be considered irresponsible in my opinion.
So to sum up what I see here. A guy makes several valid , correct points regarding information being relayed to consumers by a supplement company. Now the points he makes cast huge amounts of discredit on the product...yet they are true. He doessnt call anyone any names - he just states fact (thats more than the rep can say in this case). Now he is made out to be the bad guy. I dont get it???
I mean sure this is a Supplement Manufacturers Sponsored site so there will be bias and nonsense backing and butt kissing but that should be, and is to me, transparent.
In summation - it sounds like a company was called to task. Confronted with legitimate evidence and points stating something isnt right with the claims being made here as well as the marketing. Facts are being represented as conclusive when anyone with any knowledge in this area knows they are 100% inconclusive. I mean why report this big test increase and tout it when you KNOW that number is meaningless for your consumers purposes. Yet you make it out to be some big thing. Why test using an unaccepted method that doesnt even test for the effective hormone level you wish to see?
"If ones defense it to attack credibility rather than respond to valid points ..then the one who's credibility should be looked at is their own. "
Wise words.
Every single point Steve made is correct.
Saliva tests suck and are unacceptable in the medical / scientific community. The are unreliable and inaccurate. One of the main reasons they are particularly bad in this instance is that certain supplements provide false #' as far as hormones go. Obviously not good at all, especially in this circumstance.
Also - Free test is the only number that matters when it comes to test levels for our benefits. Saliva tests do not test free test at all.
The claims of a 347% increase are def misleading ...the formula Steve used (test enanthate i believe) is a very real life example of how that information is very misleading to consumers.
To claim the benefits claimed by this product with no research whatsoever to back it up would be considered irresponsible in my opinion.
So to sum up what I see here. A guy makes several valid , correct points regarding information being relayed to consumers by a supplement company. Now the points he makes cast huge amounts of discredit on the product...yet they are true. He doessnt call anyone any names - he just states fact (thats more than the rep can say in this case). Now he is made out to be the bad guy. I dont get it???
I mean sure this is a Supplement Manufacturers Sponsored site so there will be bias and nonsense backing and butt kissing but that should be, and is to me, transparent.
In summation - it sounds like a company was called to task. Confronted with legitimate evidence and points stating something isnt right with the claims being made here as well as the marketing. Facts are being represented as conclusive when anyone with any knowledge in this area knows they are 100% inconclusive. I mean why report this big test increase and tout it when you KNOW that number is meaningless for your consumers purposes. Yet you make it out to be some big thing. Why test using an unaccepted method that doesnt even test for the effective hormone level you wish to see?
"If ones defense it to attack credibility rather than respond to valid points ..then the one who's credibility should be looked at is their own. "
Wise words.
Vengeance187
Member
I forgot to account for the shutdown that the test would cause, so only 64% would need to be free for those numbers to be true. I'm not sure how much SHBG increases with injections, but it shouldn't be more or even as much as with an endogenous increase in test with all the other associated increases in hormones(LH, FSH etc.). I'm sure you don't know the answer to that either, so you can't honestly say they're the same.
Edit: actually, I just did a little research, and SHBG is significantly depressed with test-e injections. So you're the one who's wrong in the comparison. With the injections, not only are you getting a 3 fold increase in test, you're also getting a 60+% drop in SHBG. It looks like my assumptions were very correct after all...
Vengeance187
Member
No it's not. Check my post above. There would be approximately 3,200% more free test with test-enanthate injections than with an endogenous increase...
jimmyinkedup
Banned
I wont get involved in others arguments. However , hmm, i want to say this tactfully...you do not know what you are posting about. I see your efforts are to post what you believe to be the truth, however your entire thought process, theory, formula and analogy are incorrect.
Again I have no argument with you or anyone else here...i just happen to agree with the points Steve made and I also happen to have the knowledge base to know he is correct in his statements.
Lets just say for the sake of argument he was wrong in this one statement (which really he isnt - i can 100% see the validity in his analogy). What about all the others?
homes
New member
I started with Tropinol on the 4th, and I can say after running it for a week, I'm definitely starting to feel it more and more at the gym. I've never taken any roid or pro-hormone, this is actually the first time I've taken a product of this category (and forma-stanzol, that I've been taking at the same time) but I must say it's been working well.
Looking to do 12 weeks as the bottle suggests, not sure if I need to do anything after though.
Looking to do 12 weeks as the bottle suggests, not sure if I need to do anything after though.
Vengeance187
Member
Don't just say they're incorrect, point out what's incorrect and why. You supposedly have the knowledge base to do so, so do it...otherwise I can just assume you're talking out of your...
All of the studies I'm finding show a significant drop of SHBG to varying degrees from baseline with any and every type of exogenous steroid administration. Are you saying they're wrong, or what exactly are you saying is wrong?
jimmyinkedup
Banned
2 requests -
1- If you are going to quote me please quote everything i said. Do not edit my posts
2- Why be so nasty with me? I have done nothing other than point out your mathematical and theoretical calculations are incorrect. I have no need to prove anything to anyone. Apparently you do. Apparently you do not know how to correctly and accurately prove your point. Not my fault. How can you possibly base your argument on free and bound test anyway - when there are no studies that show free test levels after taking this supplement?
I reiterate from my previous post:
Again I have no argument with you or anyone else here...i just happen to agree with the points Steve made and I also happen to have the knowledge base to know he is correct in his statements.
Lets just say for the sake of argument he was wrong in this one statement (which really he isnt - i can 100% see the validity in his analogy). What about all the others?
ps - Vaughn posted a chart of test levels with 300mgs/ exogenous test . If the calculation of 347% increase were done on a male with normal test levels..then the analogy Steve made is 100 % correct
more knowledge
Member
They just took delivery on the stuff,give them some time to get some more test results in if you don't like the first few.It would be unreasonable to expect full pre and post bloods 10 days after they recieved the run.I would say give them 12 weeks and watch the logs,if they don't come up with at least an attempt to back some of the claims being made (via bloods,including free test) have this coversation then.
kingjameskjf
Well-known member
Wow, this thread has turned into quite the debacle! I can appreciate the need for scrutiny for a new product making huge claims but I feel VT has responded to all of it the best he possible could and has addressed the issues. As I see it, we have some people who don't believe any of our tests or unaffiliated loggers results, which all have been positive. Including their results, such as SS, the results have been right on with both blood and saliva. Of course bloods are more accurate and VT never invalidated that, but they are a good baseline to see if the individual's test results increased. I will loosely compare it to DUI testing as merely an example. There's the PBT's (Portable Breath Test's) which are used as a presumptive positive. It tells us a story and only takes 10 seconds. It lets the officer know if he's on the right track and gives a good general BrAC, and lets him know if he should continue with the time consuming, and more in depth, process of either blood draws or breath results via the intoxilyzer.
We can't force anyone to believe our tests but invite anyone to try it out firsthand to see for themselves before bashing it based on assumptions and rash generalizations. We gave out several bottles of Tropinol so that we can get some real world results. Does that mean it's going to work just as well for everybody or that all of them are completely unbiased? We can hope but I'm not naive enough to make that claim, however, all of the Tropinol logs I have followed have been positive. I find it hard to believe that every single logger and test done was completely falsified. As VT said, we provided what we could including all the product for loggers and have tried to do more then just make random claims and say "trust me and buy it." I would also like to point out what VT already stated and which I have seen many times in my years with iForce. We have been questioned on many of our products, often by competing companies or those with hidden agenda's. We have always upheld and proved our end. We don't like releasing the same old products that you can already find everywhere else. We love giving the consumer's innovative products!
We can't force anyone to believe our tests but invite anyone to try it out firsthand to see for themselves before bashing it based on assumptions and rash generalizations. We gave out several bottles of Tropinol so that we can get some real world results. Does that mean it's going to work just as well for everybody or that all of them are completely unbiased? We can hope but I'm not naive enough to make that claim, however, all of the Tropinol logs I have followed have been positive. I find it hard to believe that every single logger and test done was completely falsified. As VT said, we provided what we could including all the product for loggers and have tried to do more then just make random claims and say "trust me and buy it." I would also like to point out what VT already stated and which I have seen many times in my years with iForce. We have been questioned on many of our products, often by competing companies or those with hidden agenda's. We have always upheld and proved our end. We don't like releasing the same old products that you can already find everywhere else. We love giving the consumer's innovative products!
Vengeance187
Member
Sorry, I only quote what I'm responding to
Because you're claiming I'm wrong and have the "knowledge base" to know this and yet you STILL won't point out what and why. Then you basically say I'm just not explaining it well enough for you to understand? And yes, you do have to "prove" you have the "knowledge base" or don't claim to and you would have nothing to prove.
I guess you're right about this, I'm assuming the ratio of bound to unbound would stay the same with an endogenous increase.
Steve is claiming that since both would have the same total test that they must be the same and have the same muscle building potential. That is 100% incorrect not the other way around. The injected subjects would have MUCH more active test than the endogenous ones, regardless of total test being the same. That is a wrong and very bad analogy to make.
VaughnTrue
Well-known member
I really appreciate you coming in here to say this. Nothing brings me greater joy than seeing people use my formulas/products and report amazing results and are satisfied with the results.
To all the guys in here tying to learn about Tropinol, don't give up hope. The drama will be gone when more amazing reviews pop up!
As for this new "steve" person posting in here, come on man, we get it. You're promoting your own website.
I hope iforces success can help bring you success as well
VaughnTrue
Well-known member
Lol at Steve on another screen name still not making sense.
The whole 300mg/week of test thing is ridiculous. The study I provided proved that a man taking 300mg/week will have test levels of 1300-1400.
Yet apparently we're still at 345283736292% more effective due to free testosterone or something.
Lol this is funny. I need popcorn.
The whole 300mg/week of test thing is ridiculous. The study I provided proved that a man taking 300mg/week will have test levels of 1300-1400.
Yet apparently we're still at 345283736292% more effective due to free testosterone or something.
Lol this is funny. I need popcorn.
JoHNnyNuTZ
Well-known member
"I need popcorn."
And a big comfy chair!!!!
And a big comfy chair!!!!
Dwight Schrute
I am faster than 80% of all snakes
Of course you would think that. He's you:
* jimmyinkedup **.**.227.246 [Find Posts by User] [View Other IP Addresses for this User]
* steveironman **.**.227.246 [Find Posts by User] [View Other IP Addresses for this User]
VaughnTrue
Well-known member
thebigt
Legend
i gave you a rep-but it didn't seem to change your points any.:lmao:
VaughnTrue
Well-known member
Invalid Link Removed
Vengeance187
Member
You mean, he didn't even bother to post through a proxy like he claimed someone else was doing? lol
kingjameskjf
Well-known member
LOL!
So...you just got caught doing exactly what you claimed others were doing and berated them for it. Seems a little two-faced to me, maybe like having a hidden agenda.
Since you were just exposed...who is the one frauding? I'm sorry but this stunt seems to have backfired.
Now that this issue has been resolved, lets try to get this thread back on track. We welcome all user's personal experiences. With all the great sales Nutra had this month, I'm sure there were plenty of people that picked some up and I think it would be great to see more logs and results.
Vengeance187
Member
I think that works in your favor in that you can very well have test levels in the 1,300-1,400 range and still not get steroid-like results, and you never claimed that to be the case.
Dwight Schrute
I am faster than 80% of all snakes
Doesn't matter...I can see through most of them anyway. Its not my first rodeo...
thebigt
Legend
steriods usually take 2-4 weeks to show results in the gym, sometimes longer-even though test levels will be remarkably higher. i think the mode of action for test boosters is different, but i have no answers-all i can go by is how they effect me personally.
mw1
Sponsor
:spank::hail::bow28:
thebigt
Legend
giddyup
VaughnTrue
Well-known member
Lol exactly.
He's the one who chose to use the 300mg example...I however EASILY disproved it along with every single other theory of his.
Vengeance187
Member
That's not a fair review. You're using formestane at the same time...
more knowledge
Member
lol.Thank you!how ironic,or moronic.Can we get back to the subject at hand now.Also anyone with something substantial to say doesn't have to make up ficticious followers to bring credibility to his point of view!
mw1
Sponsor
Its probably would be better to run it solo as Form is known to boost libido and strength. I was thinking about ordering some Tropinol myself, however there is no time in the near future that I could run it solo
SynergyIre
Active member
Guess he's just pissed away any bit of creditability he had left (which wasn't much really hehe)
scoooter
Well-known member
There is much debate in regards to this compound Bulbine. As a beta test logger I stand by all my previous posts because they are only the true reports of the effects I encountered during my run (cycle). I do not try to hype or promote only to provide an unbiased source of real user feedback. I prefaced my log by stating it was my first and have included details specific to my beliefs. I will rewrite again that this is a Natural supplement. I ran it as prescribed solo 3 caps day. It was my intention to compare the effects of Tropinol to a previous T-booster cycle of DAA which I used at 6G/day with additional support supps B6, L-dopa, and TMG. The effects for me were strikingly similar. Neither of them totally took me by surprise, however I did experience undeniably positive effects for using them without any negative sides or worries when my lifestyle provided the casual party from time to time. Unfortunately, for the hardcore skeptics I do not have any supporting medical testing results of hormone levels to produce as scientific evidence. What I do have are my own positive experiences, which I have enjoyed sharing. It’s only a hobby of mine to experiment with supplements in a never-ending quest to find the right combination (that reads a little too much like Star Trek, but oh well) Tropinol has been a very fun and enjoyable experience, thank you iForce.
Rucksdaddy
Member
Will there be a wheycheap deal?
VaughnTrue
Well-known member
Rucksdaddy
Member
Ahh, thanks.