All-Day Nutrient Timing

timepoint 3. Taking caffeine and arginine at the same time? Dont they cancel each other out? One dialates blood vessels and the other contracts them.
 
Interesting find.

I also found Timepoint 3 interesting.... one because of the antagonistic action between caffeine and arginine and two because to the best of my knowledge the synthesis of NO within the body isn't limited by the amount of raw substrate available...

And Timepoints 7 & 8... To play the devils advocate; would 45 minutes be enough time for ZMA to be absorbed without hindrance by the calcium in casein?

Questions like this really do keep me awake at night.
 
I've moved away from ZMA at night. I now take it during the day and I take calcium plus magnesium at night. Works better that way for me. I still get the vivid dreams from time to time. Zinc seems to have a stimulant effect on me and actually keeps me awake longer.
 
A good read for the most part. I would think that the prebreakfast arginine wouod be useless though.
 
wearedbleedblue said:
Not everybody lives in Texas unfortunately so we need supplemental forms. I like to take larger doses, once a week, with a meal containing some fat.
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i heard that Vit D was fat soluble so you arent supposed to take it with any source of fat? no? is it the other way around?
 
lonewolf0420 said:
I usually take one with my three main meals - breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

Do many take multiple multivitamins?
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I take a multi everyday along with fish oil
 
What about the claim that NO inhibits lipolysis? I've read this a few times by Lyle McDonald. I've found some conflicting data, though I can not find the link at present. Most pre-workout supps contain Arginine, which is a NO precursor. Any thoughts??
 
MattyMatty2x4 said:
What about the claim that NO inhibits lipolysis? I've read this a few times by Lyle McDonald. I've found some conflicting data, though I can not find the link at present. Most pre-workout supps contain Arginine, which is a NO precursor. Any thoughts??
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Invalid Link Removed
 
Thanks for the quick reply! I read this one last week and was left a bit confused.

So this study relates only to lipolysis stimulated by the drug isoproterenol? Not by "natural" release of the catecholamines?
 
I'm a newb, so AM won't let me post links, so please excuse the lengthy paste:

Abstract

Nitric oxide (NO) may be an important modulator of sympathetic tone. We used im and sc microdialysis in humans to characterize the interaction of NO synthase inhibition and adrenoreceptor stimulation on tissue perfusion, metabolism, and norepinephrine release. Microdialysis probes were perfused with L- or D-nitro-L-arginine-methyl-ester (100 µmol/L) followed by incremental doses of isoproterenol, epinephrine, or nitroprusside. Blood flow was estimated based on the ethanol dilution technique. In muscle, the increase in blood flow with isoproterenol was abolished by L-NAME. The ethanol ratio was 0.03 ± 0.011 with D-NAME and 0.075 ± 0.014 with L-NAME during isoproterenol treatment (1 µmol/L). The effect was less pronounced in adipose tissue. The vasodilatory effect of nitroprusside was similar with D- and L-NAME. L-NAME augmented isoproterenol- and epinephrine-induced glycerol release. Dialysate glycerol during 1 µmol/L isoproterenol was 47 ± 6.7 µmol/L with D-NAME and 72 ± 15 µmol/L with L-NAME. In skeletal muscle, dialysate norepinephrine during 1 µmol/L isoproterenol treatment was 0.73 ± 0.17 and 1.3 ± 0.15 nmol/L with D- and L-NAME, respectively. We conclude that NO synthase inhibition attenuates ß2-adrenoreceptor-mediated vasodilation and enhances ß-adrenoreceptor-mediated lipolysis. These effects are in part mediated through an increase in interstitial norepinephrine concentrations. The data are consistent with the idea that in humans, NO is important in modulating and ameliorating sympathetic effects in peripheral tissues.
 
MattyMatty2x4 said:
What about the claim that NO inhibits lipolysis? I've read this a few times by Lyle McDonald. I've found some conflicting data, though I can not find the link at present. Most pre-workout supps contain Arginine, which is a NO precursor. Any thoughts??
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I'm pretty sure that arginine doesn't promote NO. At least that's the news going around this board for a while now. Some ppl have given references. They say GPLC is the only supplement that promotes NO.

Can a veteran member chime in here with their thoughts? I'd like to know more detail about this.
 
funkd0c said:
I'm pretty sure that arginine doesn't promote NO. At least that's the news going around this board for a while now. Some ppl have given references. They say GPLC is the only supplement that promotes NO.

Can a veteran member chime in here with their thoughts? I'd like to know more detail about this.
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The people who created GPLC even admit that Glycine and PLCAR(which make GPLC) both stimulate NO, so they contradict themselves. On top of that, I can't find a scientific explanation for how glycine, which can make paople sleepy, is supposed to enhance the affects of PLCAR.
 
kingdong said:
The people who created GPLC even admit that Glycine and PLCAR(which make GPLC) both stimulate NO, so they contradict themselves. On top of that, I can't find a scientific explanation for how glycine, which can make paople sleepy, is supposed to enhance the affects of PLCAR.
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Ok, well then. But arginine still first promote NO, right?
 
I thought the benefit of Arginine and Caffeine was that the caffeine could still supply its stim and other effects without constricting the blood vessels...

I was reading in one of the more prominent muscle mags(forget which one now) that its generally good to take 2 other supplements(also forgot, now I am searching my magazine stacks) with caffeine that will headlock its vaso-constriction while allowing it to still provide effects.
 
arganine- I use it along with two packets of unflavored gelatin (proven to help raise GH by 50%)- a trainer I know was telling me about this- so I tried it- well I have CRAZY dreems- deeeepppp sleep and I wake up feeling sluggish for about 30 mins then im g2g!


I use arganine for HGH thats it

for pumps my new found friend is gplc
 
schwellington said:
arganine- I use it along with two packets of unflavored gelatin (proven to help raise GH by 50%)- a trainer I know was telling me about this- so I tried it- well I have CRAZY dreems- deeeepppp sleep and I wake up feeling sluggish for about 30 mins then im g2g!


I use arganine for HGH thats it

for pumps my new found friend is gplc
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what type of arginine did you use?
 
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