Trenavar equilibrium

[IBE]

sure was I was and I did not forget about your promised tren I willl be sending monday

Id like to think my prediction on the dosing was pretty good.

 

[oli]

IBE's definitely trying to be a stand-up company [ reps for that ] - people asking left & right for free packets so they can "test out" the product and find the right dosages. Whatever happened to taking a risk and buying it? There's another guy who's 'testing' Trenavar with the mindset to disprove IBE & dudes already jumping the gun with the dosages. Some people might be forgetting that whatever works or doesn't work for them may not hold true with somebody else.

:thumbsdown:

 

[3clipseGT]

IBE's definitely trying to be a stand-up company [ reps for that ] - people asking left & right for free packets so they can "test out" the product and find the right dosages. Whatever happened to taking a risk and buying it? There's another guy who's 'testing' Trenavar with the mindset to disprove IBE & dudes already jumping the gun with the dosages. Some people might be forgetting that whatever works or doesn't work for them may not hold true with somebody else.

:thumbsdown:

Not sure if this was directed at me or not, but i ran a log for them to beta test it, so IBE said hed send me some packs for that, i also did buy my own, bought three packs worth.

 

[madchemist]

How about I send you 3 packs for you to run solo and I bet you will be say defferenly. then why do you feel it on the first day?

I'll take you up on this offer.

 

[CopyCat]

Not sure if this was directed at me or not, but i ran a log for them to beta test it, so IBE said hed send me some packs for that, i also did buy my own, bought three packs worth.

I think he's directing that more towards shwellington.

 

[henryv]

How about I send you 3 packs for you to run solo and I bet you will be say defferenly. then why do you feel it on the first day? I am talking real life here not paper you and I both know paper compared to real life pretty showed us all it;s not always right. I did not do the write up henry V did why don't you talked to him about this. I have taken tren at very high dosage and I can tell you that there is a high conversion with trendione or it;s active on it;s owne and then you are wrong. I can care less what you are saying but the results are going against what you are trying to to say.

The day before this thread mentioned it I arrived at a similar conclusion to CM (suspected conversion to epitren through 17a-HSD). The writeup was written over a year ago.

 

[IBE]

I will leave at this I don't think no one can say exactly what is going on but something is and it seems there is alot of tren in there or trendione is active on it;s owne. right now it;s paper against real life so we will see who wins.

The day before this thread mentioned it I arrived at a similar conclusion to CM (suspected conversion to epitren through 17a-HSD). The writeup was written over a year ago.

 

[MidwestBeast]

Very interested in hearing more of the loggers' experiences. It seems very few are logging solo, but there are a few out there.

 

[Patrick Arnold]

I will leave at this I don't think no one can say exactly what is going on but something is and it seems there is alot of tren in there or trendione is active on it;s owne. right now it;s paper against real life so we will see who wins.

if it works it works. i wouldnt get all caught up in theory.

 

[IBE]

I agree if works it works. so far it;s working ...thank god....lol

if it works it works. i wouldnt get all caught up in theory.

 

[chocolatemilk]

Pat... Just to shoot the sh!ts for a second... Sodium borohydride reduction done in cold dilute methanol would yield trenbolone in good purity... Could one elute the solution through aluminum (III) oxide (alumina) to filter out excess NaBH4 and NaBH3 followed by gentle heating above 60 dgC of trenbolone plus methanol solution (if one was able to attain this solution through the column chromotography) to get rid of methanol?

Ibe, I will run 60mg and up from there if needed and put up picture results if good enough when I get the packets. I personally f!cking hate short cycles but whatever I'll run it solo 30-45 days depending on how/if I increase dose

Henry........ Go back to whence you came... lol, Jk

 

[Patrick Arnold]

Pat... Just to shoot the sh!ts for a second... Sodium borohydride reduction done in cold dilute methanol would yield trenbolone in good purity... Could one elute the solution through aluminum (III) oxide (alumina) to filter out excess NaBH4 and NaBH3 followed by gentle heating above 60 dgC of trenbolone plus methanol solution (if one was able to attain this solution through the column chromotography) to get rid of methanol?

Ibe, I will run 60mg and up from there if needed and put up picture results if good enough when I get the packets. I personally f!cking hate short cycles but whatever I'll run it solo 30-45 days depending on how/if I increase dose

Henry........ Go back to whence you came... lol, Jk

this is in regards to borohydride reductions of water insoluble organics in general

borohydride and oxidized borohydride by product (borate salts) are water soluble. your product isnt

simply dilute with an excess of water and the product should precipitate out. filter the solid off and wash with water.

 

[chocolatemilk]

this is in regards to borohydride reductions of water insoluble organics in general

borohydride and oxidized borohydride by product (borate salts) are water soluble. your product isnt

simply dilute with an excess of water and the product should precipitate out. filter the solid off and wash with water.

got it... for some reason i thought trenbolone would be soluble in water due to the polarity induced by the electronegativity of oxygen at c17 and c3

question tho, why is the final product not a racemic mixture?

and you probably saw this coming, but what agents can you use for a specific alklylation of the product?

 

[jbryand101b]

well, i cant speak for everyone else, but i never thought it would "just" convert into trenbolone, so i dont feel mislead.

 

[Patrick Arnold]

got it... for some reason i thought trenbolone would be soluble in water due to the polarity induced by the electronegativity of oxygen at c17 and c3

question tho, why is the final product not a racemic mixture?

and you probably saw this coming, but what agents can you use for a specific alklylation of the product?

that ketone and hydroxyl is nowhere near enuff to render it water soluble with those 20 carbon atoms arranged the way they are

the reduction of the 17-ketone is stereospecific due to steric hindrance from the c18 carbon

you cannot selectively alkylate this dione. you would have to first protect the 3-ketone somehow and I dont think there is a way to do that really

 

[chocolatemilk]

that ketone and hydroxyl is nowhere near enuff to render it water soluble with those 20 carbon atoms arranged the way they are

the reduction of the 17-ketone is stereospecific due to steric hindrance from the c18 carbon

you cannot selectively alkylate this dione. you would have to first protect the 3-ketone somehow and I dont think there is a way to do that really

ohh got you

i was asking about alkylating the trenbolone produced from the trendione reduction not alkylating the dione to begin with..... if that makes a difference

 

[Patrick Arnold]

ohh got you

i was asking about alkylating the trenbolone produced from the trendione reduction not alkylating the dione to begin with..... if makes a difference

you cant alkylate a hydroxyl group. unless you convert it to a ketone.

i suppose if you took trenbolone, protected the 3-ketone group as an oxime or something, oxidized the 17b-OH (perhaps using IBX) then you could use either grignard or alkylithium reagent.

removing the oxime would be the last step

i dont think it would be worth the effort though and its highly illegal anyway

 

[chocolatemilk]

you cant alkylate a hydroxyl group. unless you convert it to a ketone.

i suppose if you took trenbolone, protected the 3-ketone group as an oxime or something, oxidized the 17b-OH (perhaps using IBX) then you could use either grignard or alkylithium reagent.

removing the oxime would be the last step

i dont think it would be worth the effort though and its highly illegal anyway

the end product is extremely tempting....

so a hydroxylamine to form an oxime with the 3-ketone... It will not do this with the 17-ketone because of steric hindrance

Oxidize 17-oh and a simple grignard with CH3MgBr to alkylate c17

remove oxime... which i don't know how, but ill figure it out

eeeeeenteresting

 

[Patrick Arnold]

the end product is extremely tempting....

so a hydroxylamine to form an oxime with the 3-ketone... It will not do this with the 17-ketone because of steric hindrance

Oxidize 17-oh and a simple grignard with CH3MgBr to alkylate c17

remove oxime... which i don't know how, but ill figure it out

eeeeeenteresting

ur second sentence makes no sense. There is a hydroxyl at 17


it sounds easy doesnt it. try it and you will see there is alot more to synthesis than you think. it might not even work

 

[Patrick Arnold]

remove oxime... which i don't know how, but ill figure it out

that may be the hardest part. oximes dont hydrolyze easily

 

[chocolatemilk]

ur second sentence makes no sense. There is a hydroxyl at 17


it sounds easy doesnt it. try it and you will see there is alot more to synthesis than you think. it might not even work

oh i thought i was working with trendione, not trenbolone at that point

i want to try it, but i wouldnt even be able to check myself regardless, and thats the most important thing. i just wanted the information for the future when i might have personal access to GC and NMR... any access i have now is under supervision lol... the chemicals are accessible

and it does sound easy lol... that sucks about the oxime :godf*ckingdamnit:

 

[sly]

On the note that everyone responds differently. I just finished week 4 at 60mg. I have only gained 2lbs with no noticeable strength gains. I have leaned out some and muscles appear fuller, so it is doing something. I will up to 75mg for a week, then jump to 90 if no noticeable improvements. If nothing at 90mg for me after 2 weeks, then I will consider if a flop for me. Just to note my diet and training are spot on. I have also ran just about every PH/PS over the years and typically need the higher dosages I wish I
was responding as well as others, hoping to respond well to Ment.

 

[chocolatemilk]

View attachment 51948

below is more relevant... but we're beating a dead horse at this point

View attachment 49212

 

[Patrick Arnold]

oh i thought i was working with trendione, not trenbolone at that point

i want to try it, but i wouldnt even be able to check myself regardless, and thats the most important thing. i just wanted the information for the future when i might have personal access to GC and NMR... any access i have now is under supervision lol... the chemicals are accessible

and it does sound easy lol... that sucks about the oxime :godf*ckingdamnit:

there is so much more to chemical synthesis than people think. its as much of an art as a science in many respects. it really takes some years of practice to get the hang of it. i wouldnt waste your material trying to learn

 

[Patrick Arnold]

View attachment 51948

I dont think there are much hydroxylated metabolites from trenbolone in humans, so the relevance of this flowchart is probably limited

And and what is with metabolite number 3? no enzymes cant add tack on carbon carbon bond like that (the 2 methyl)

 

[Patrick Arnold]

this may be a dumd question but why is the shape of the d ring illustrated differently in some diagrams of steroid molecules?

its five carbons either way. some just like to draw it differently

 

[chocolatemilk]

there is so much more to chemical synthesis than people think. its as much of an art as a science in many respects. it really takes some years of practice to get the hang of it. i wouldnt waste your material trying to learn

you're not the first person to tell me it's more of an art

ill take your advice, thanks for answering my questions Pat