Superdrol is BACK - What does the new formula look like? BRAND NEW PROHORMONE

Aaron.Cole said:
This. You can have the best product in the world, but no one would know if your marketing sucks or brand label is junk.

On the reverse, you can have overhyped products (e.g., MuscleTech) but they really got there because their marketing was really, really solid.
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MT spent over 1/2 a million a month in magazine publications. that's 6 million a year- that isn't solid marketing, that's propaganda brainwashing.
 
smith_69 said:
MT spent over 1/2 a million a month in magazine publications. that's 6 million a year- that isn't solid marketing, that's propaganda brainwashing.
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I said solid marketing, not ethical. I don't agree with how they marketed, but what they did worked for them.


Except for Iovate being sued. But who really knows about that?


At any rate, is it really that bad if they spent that much? Nike spends billions and they're going to make that all back.
 
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Im very curious to see how this product works out ... With all due respect, I find it a bit tough to believe you can get Superdrol like gains with a mash of different DHEA products.. But I have certainly been wrong before. I would buy and test it out.... but .. umm I kinda have a bunch of real Superdrol lying around:silly:
 
Tiocfaidh said:
no, they didn't spend 1/2 million a month.
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2010 cost to advertise in 1 mag for 4-5 pages 100K- 6 mag at least- 500k look even if im off by 50k regardless, they forced this down your throat- it was every, like a really bad version of the Matrix

don't want to hijack this thread- lets agree they spent money and got sued
 
smith_69 said:
2010 cost to advertise in 1 mag for 4-5 pages 100K- 6 mag at least- 500k look even if im off by 50k regardless, they forced this down your throat- it was every, like a really bad version of the Matrix

don't want to hijack this thread- lets agree they spent money and got sued
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you're not off by 50k, you're off by about 80k per month. A 4-5 page spread cost around 20k. you're simply wrong, by a lot.
 
Darlz said:
Im very curious to see how this product works out ... With all due respect, I find it a bit tough to believe you can get Superdrol like gains with a mash of different DHEA products.. But I have certainly been wrong before. I would buy and test it out.... but .. umm I kinda have a bunch of real Superdrol lying around:silly:
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What did SD provide users? 15lbs+ in a month, right?

1-dhea on its own has been clinically shown to increase weight by 10lbs+ in a month.

This product has 1-dhea, 4-dhea, 6-oxo delta 4, and more.


It will blow you away and make you a believer :)
smith_69 said:
2010 cost to advertise in 1 mag for 4-5 pages 100K- 6 mag at least- 500k look even if im off by 50k regardless, they forced this down your throat- it was every, like a really bad version of the Matrix

don't want to hijack this thread- lets agree they spent money and got sued
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your magazine prices are higher than reality. I only know because Hi-Tech advertises heavily in magazines, and I have seen the purchase order totals.
 
Aaron.Cole said:
What VaughnTrue just posted, along with the fact that they're banking on the Cyclosome delivery system being superior over SEDDS.
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Well going off of the super mandro is still the best product then as it's at the same dosage and cheapest price. As OL hasn't proved SEDDS either. I'm not trying to dis on either but I think it's very arrogant to hold HTP to a higher standard then everyone else and just expect that OLs stuff works when there is no evidence proving it just like HTP as no evidence on there delivery system

PS sorry for horrendous use of grammer and spelling as I have had 3 hours of sleep in the past 3 days.
 
rtmilburn said:
Well going off of the super mandro is still the best product then as it's at the same dosage and cheapest price. As OL hasn't proved SEDDS either. I'm not trying to dis on either but I think it's very arrogant to hold HTP to a higher standard then everyone else and just expect that OLs stuff works when there is no evidence proving it just like HTP as no evidence on there delivery system

PS sorry for horrendous use of grammer and spelling as I have had 3 hours of sleep in the past 3 days.
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The only proof I have with OL is that Ive used several different products of theirs and had great results with all of them....
 
rtmilburn said:
Well going off of the super mandro is still the best product then as it's at the same dosage and cheapest price. As OL hasn't proved SEDDS either. I'm not trying to dis on either but I think it's very arrogant to hold HTP to a higher standard then everyone else and just expect that OLs stuff works when there is no evidence proving it just like HTP as no evidence on there delivery system

PS sorry for horrendous use of grammer and spelling as I have had 3 hours of sleep in the past 3 days.
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Super mandro is actually a bit more expensive than sup3r 1. And the logs on the LG andros (cyclosome?) seem to be showing better results than previous andro logs. Anyway, I ran super mandro and andro the giant a couple months ago and was happy with the results. Plan to do another cycle later this year. I was considering OL but 1-testosterone looks like the better deal. Superdrol will be pricey but if it lives up I'd gladly pay for it. I guess we will know how these delivery systems stack up in a couple months.

The marketing is a bit silly but that applies to any product/marketing in general. The educated consumers (the people on AM) are going to do their research regardless. Personally I just want better products that work.
 
rtmilburn said:
Well going off of the super mandro is still the best product then as it's at the same dosage and cheapest price. As OL hasn't proved SEDDS either. I'm not trying to dis on either but I think it's very arrogant to hold HTP to a higher standard then everyone else and just expect that OLs stuff works when there is no evidence proving it just like HTP as no evidence on there delivery system

PS sorry for horrendous use of grammer and spelling as I have had 3 hours of sleep in the past 3 days.
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You do realize that just about every PH company is putting out Andro products with some neat new delivery system. And all of them claim to be the better product. Thats nothing new.
 
Tiocfaidh said:
i always love guys who get angry at marketing. who cares how it works, you offend me sir with your marketing.

get the **** over it.
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Who says I'm angry? LOL. I just point and laugh at the products/marketing and shake my head. Stay tuned for my upcoming sleep product. It's just Melatonin with Valerian root, but I'm calling it 'Diazepam 100' - I bought the rights to the name. Like I've said before, to some, it's an ethics/character thing... some people don't care. Fine by me, but we can call it out just as they can sell 'Superdrol' - even playing field.

Edit: VVVVV 1000Xtreem :)
 
The_Old_Guy said:
Who says I'm angry? LOL. I just point and laugh at the products/marketing and shake my head. Stay tuned for my upcoming sleep product. It's just Melatonin with Valerian root, but I'm calling it 'Diazepam 100' - I bought the rights to the name. Like I've said before, to some, it's an ethics/character thing... some people don't care. Fine by me, but we can call it out just as they can sell 'Superdrol' - even playing field.
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Diazepam 1000
 
Better delivery "systems" *should* work better, but do they really, and how much? Sub-Lingual and Trans-Dermal have been around forever as well. As a matter of fact, prescription AndroGel is trans-dermal... you'd think if something was better, they'd go to an oral Liposome/SEDDS delivery for the Testosterone? Any Bio-Chemists please feel free to tear me a new one on that one < While I hope the "new" delivery systems work more/better/faster, do we have any proof? Logs are all fine and good but what is 10lbs in a month? Water? Was there DEXA involved? What was the BF% trend in relation to the scale weight gain? Pretty sure I can gain 10lbs in month without any PH's. I'd actually rather see strength increase numbers on the 'Big 3', rather than scale weight, if we can't have DEXA. You can't fake a 25lb greater 1RM squat in 4 weeks, or 50lbs in 8 weeks.
 
The_Old_Guy said:
Who says I'm angry? LOL. I just point and laugh at the products/marketing and shake my head. Stay tuned for my upcoming sleep product. It's just Melatonin with Valerian root, but I'm calling it 'Diazepam 100' - I bought the rights to the name. Like I've said before, to some, it's an ethics/character thing... some people don't care. Fine by me, but we can call it out just as they can sell 'Superdrol' - even playing field.

Edit: VVVVV 1000Xtreem :)
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****ing lol. "Diazepam 100"
 
VaughnTrue said:
I know we're going to take heat for the name, thats what AM likes to do with HT products...buttttttt


this is going to give similar weight gains as the original. People can expect 15lbs+ in a 4 week cycle.
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Lol you read my mind when I read superdrol is back. But if it lives up to the claim that's damn impressive. So I'm excited to see some logs.
 
The_Old_Guy said:
Who says I'm angry? LOL. I just point and laugh at the products/marketing and shake my head. Stay tuned for my upcoming sleep product. It's just Melatonin with Valerian root, but I'm calling it 'Diazepam 100' - I bought the rights to the name. Like I've said before, to some, it's an ethics/character thing... some people don't care. Fine by me, but we can call it out just as they can sell 'Superdrol' - even playing field.

Edit: VVVVV 1000Xtreem :)
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Im actually gonna concur here. I have no personal issue with Hi-Tech and Ive even seen some quality logs so I dont doubt the potency of their products. But Id be lying if I said I wasnt turned off by the way some of them are being marketed. If the product is legit, there is no need to misrepresent it.
 
Darlz said:
You do realize that just about every PH company is putting out Andro products with some neat new delivery system. And all of them claim to be the better product. Thats nothing new.
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Delivery system science is pretty easy to find. Check out my old write up on the 2 ones being touted by companies lately

I have been talking a lot about delivery systems as of late, so I wanted to try and help explain what I've been talking about. The info below is something I put together this week to help explain the differences between what will undoubtedly become the two most popular ones out there. I want to make this thread as much about discussion of delivery systems as possible, and NOT discuss specific companies/manufacturers so we can have a legit discussion, and talk about the positives and negatives of delivery systems as a whole.

This discussion will be centered specifically around the 1-DHEA style products currently available, however I'd love to discuss any and all compounds being utilized.











Why use a delivery system?​

Delivery system technologies are used primarily for two distinct purposes:

1. Blood hormone levels – The key to hormones is to getting them into your bloodstream where they can interact with androgen receptors. The higher you can get your blood hormone levels, the better results you can theoretically get while on cycle. To put this into perspective, imagine you are consuming a hormone at the rate of 100mg/day. If you can get 25% of this hormone into your blood stream, you will have 25mg of the compound able to produce its anabolic and muscle growing benefits for you. The remaining 75% will offer you no added benefit. This means that by increasing the rate at which the hormone can enter your blood stream, the higher the total amount of hormone you have to exert its power in your body.
2. Mitigating unwanted/undesirable effects – This issue encompasses two major issues.

The first issue is the same for all hormones. The higher the dose taken the more potential for side effects. For example, if the same compound is being used (as described above) at a rate of 100mg/day, it will yield 25mg of the active hormone. Now, the other 75mg will not be able to impact the body for anabolic purposes, but it still impacts the body in ways such as liver toxicity. This means that for every 100mg you ingest, 25% if going to its intended “good” purpose, and 75% is going to unwanted “bad” result.

The second issue is specific to DHEA and its various anabolic isomers. DHEA converts to numerous different hormones, some of which are beneficial (anabolic), and some of which are not (estrogenic). Studies have shown that when specific DHEA dosage thresholds are broken, virtually all DHEA taken beyond that amount converts to the negative/estrogenic hormones. This means that by utilizing a lower overall dose that offers a higher bioavailability you are able to reap much larger benefits, while reducing or completely eliminating unwanted estrogenic conversion.



No Delivery System​

When 1-DHEA and 4-DHEA products first hit the market, they were sold by themselves without any delivery system, just the hormone in a capsule. Despite using no delivery system, it is worthy to note that users experienced significant results, as backed by clinical studies performed at West Texas A&M University.
The various forms of DHEA being discussed follow similar absorption and bioavailability of traditional DHEA. Studies which look to discern the potencies of DHEA have found it to be absorbed at a very low rate when taken orally. For example:

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As this study shows, when you consume DHEA and its various isomers(like 1-DHEA or 4-DHEA) you’re left with around a 3%-6% rate of bioavailability(underlined in red above).
To put this into perspective, if you were taking the manufacturers recommended daily dosing of 330mg/day of 1-DHEA, your body would be absorbing only 9.9-19.8mg of the active hormone itself! And even at these low doses the results seen were impressive, including significant gains in lean mass, reductions in fat, and strength.
In addition to the low blood hormone levels which are offered from having no delivery system, this issue is also coupled with the fact that the small % of conversion to active hormones leaves a high % of the compound left over that has no pathway left to convert besides estrogenic hormones(unwanted). One example of these unwanted side effects can be seen in the lowering of LDL or “good cholesterol” in the Texas A&M study.

What does all of this mean? Simply put, if you’re consuming 1-DHEA or 4-DHEA without a delivery system included in its formulation, you can expect extremely low conversion of the compounds into their target hormones(1-testosterone and testosterone), and a highly level of conversion into unwanted estrogenic hormones. This means you can get solid cycle results, but must deal with some potential negatives.





SEDDS Delivery System​

SEDDS or “Self-Emulsifying Drug Delivery Systems” is a new delivery system which is just about to hit the dietary supplement market. This method of delivery system claims to work as a result of: “SEDDS possess potential to improve oral bioavailability in poorly water soluble drugs. Following their oral administration, these systems rapidly disperse in gastrointestinal fluids, yielding micro- or nano-emulsions containing the solubilized drug. Micro/non-emulsified drug can easily be absorbed through lymphatic pathways, bypassing the hepatic first-pass effect, owing to their miniscule globule size” (National Institute of Pharmaceutical Education and Research).
SEDDS delivery vastly improves the effects from 1-DHEA and 4-DHEA by increasing overall bioavailability up to 9x greater than non-delivery system administration. This claim can be seen below:


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This study showed that when using a hormone (in this case progesterone) SEDDS offers up to 9x greater bioavailability when compared to no delivery system. This means that while no delivery system offers 3-6% bioavailability, SEDDS offers up to 9x that, or a 27-54% bioavailability. Keep in mind however that the higher end of this bioavailability spectrum is highly unlikely for the average user as it assumes perfect conversions in the body, something which never happens in vivo quite the same as it does in vitro. That being said, SEDDS offers a VAST improvement from traditional dosing of these compounds, and users can expect far greater results, fewer side effects, and less overall HPTA shutdown when using the SEDDS delivery method over no delivery method.
In short, SEDDS provides a much higher rate of bioavailability, lesser chance for estrogenic conversion, and a much more effective cycle.






Cyclosome™ Delivery System/Phytosome Delivery System​
 Cyclosome™ delivery system is the first completely pharmaceutical grade delivery system utilized in dietary supplements. Originally designed by Indena® under the name Phytosome®, Cyclosome™ utilizes identical technology to increase the bioavailability and intensity of 1-DHEA and 4-DHEA.
For quick reference, this video briefly explains how the technology works:

[video=youtube;extbuY3CvCk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=extbuY3CvCk[/video]​


Studies on humans (not rats, rabbits, pigs, dogs, or anything else), have shown Cyclosome™ technology to enhance bioavailability 29xhigher than non-delivery system methods, bringing with it a minimum of 90% bioavailability (Source: Invalid Link Removed)

In a comparative study in humans(16), analyzing the absorption of curcumin Phytosome® (Meriva®) and curcumin the overall curcuminoid absorption was about 29-fold higher for Meriva® compared to the unformulated curcuminoid mixture, while a 50 to 60 fold higher absorption has been shown for demethoxycurcumin (DMC) and bisdemethoxycurcumin (BDMC). Furthermore also the absorption was faster with Meriva® the with the unformulated curcumin.
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This type of delivery system showcases what is currently known as the most effective way of increasing bioavailability for compounds such as 1-DHEA and 4-DHEA. This means much more potent and anabolic cycles, little to no estrogenic side effects, and minimal HPTA suppression.




How do the 3 types perform when compared using identical doses?​

To help you determine which delivery system (or lack thereof) is best for you in your search for the best cycle possible, here is a quick and easy guide. No delivery system will be abbreviated using “NDS”, SEDDS will be abbreviated as “SED”, and Cyclosome™ technology will be abbreviated as “CST”.
100mg/day dosing:
NDS x 100mg (3-6% bioavailability) = 3-6mg 1-DHEA/4-DHEA in the blood
SED x 100mg (3-6% bioavailability) x 9 = 27-54mg 1-DHEA/4-DHEA in the blood
CST x 100mg (3-6% bioavailability) x >90% bioavailability = greater than 90mg 1-DHEA/4-DHEA in the blood

To understand which delivery system is best for you, it’s crucial that you understand how the product you’re planning on purchasing is dosed, as this varies greatly from manufacturer to manufacturer. For example, if one product gives you 60srv of 50mg capsules, versus 60srv of 100mg capsules, this may play a role in how you decide which is the better overall value.
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The_Old_Guy said:
I don't either. I guess they have non-prop blended 1-Andro. If it is the most 1-AD for the best price/serving - I'd buy it.
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1-Testosterone is our highest dosed 1-Andro product on the market(110mg/cap which no one offers more/cap), and included the cyclosome delivery.

So you can buy 110mg/cap with no delivery system, SEDDS delivery system(see info above, or with Cyclosome delivery.

and each product will cost within ~$5 of one another.

It's a no brainer which is the best value
 
Darlz said:
The only proof I have with OL is that Ive used several different products of theirs and had great results with all of them....
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Yes I agree OL product have treated me as well although their delivery system is no different than HTPs in the sense that it isn't proven if anything it's slightly more proven as cyclodextrin complexs are fairly well proven and this is a step further than that as this is a cyclodextrin complex that is within a liposome complex. I'm by no means saying one is better than other buy more that neither is proven so you shouldn't be dissing HTP for not proven it but support OLs stuff when it isn't proven either but rather wait and see for anecdotal feedback
 
Rand0m said:
Super mandro is actually a bit more expensive than sup3r 1. And the logs on the LG andros (cyclosome?) seem to be showing better results than previous andro logs. Anyway, I ran super mandro and andro the giant a couple months ago and was happy with the results. Plan to do another cycle later this year. I was considering OL but 1-testosterone looks like the better deal. Superdrol will be pricey but if it lives up I'd gladly pay for it. I guess we will know how these delivery systems stack up in a couple months.

The marketing is a bit silly but that applies to any product/marketing in general. The educated consumers (the people on AM) are going to do their research regardless. Personally I just want better products that work.
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I agree with your statements whole heartedly. Although I was not saying super mandro was better but I was rather trying to prove a point that neither are proven and supporting OL just because they are OL is arrogant as non of these new delivery systems are proven and HTP should not be discredited for not proving their delivery systems
 
Darlz said:
You do realize that just about every PH company is putting out Andro products with some neat new delivery system. And all of them claim to be the better product. Thats nothing new.
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Yes I do understand and what I'm saying is that because non of them are proven one should not discredit one companies stuff just because it's not proven
 
I just started my cut last week & now I can't wait to bulk. Wtf supplement industry. It's like you want ALL my money.

This will be a first time run for me so if anybody starts a log I'll definitely be fallowing.
 
Superdrol. Interesting.

Has the 6alpha methyl been replaced with 6-oxo?
 
I tried to find information on the new compound, is there any data on it?

17alpha-hydroxy-6oxo-pregn-4-ene-3,20-dione

In regular progesterone you have 6-alpha methyl, but this is 6-oxo, so was hoping to read some cool data.
 
brofessorx said:
I tried to find information on the new compound, is there any data on it?

17alpha-hydroxy-6oxo-pregn-4-ene-3,20-dione

In regular progesterone you have 6-alpha methyl, but this is 6-oxo, so was hoping to read some cool data.
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Curious about this also
 
brofessorx said:
I tried to find information on the new compound, is there any data on it?

17alpha-hydroxy-6oxo-pregn-4-ene-3,20-dione

In regular progesterone you have 6-alpha methyl, but this is 6-oxo, so was hoping to read some cool data.
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here is some info which explains its formation:

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Abstract
3-Imine formation between primary amines and 3-oxo-4-ene-steroids, followed by hydrolysis of the imines (either spontaneously during work up or induced by acetic acid) has been shown to cause 6-oxygenation of the steroids tested (17β-hydroxy-4-androsten-3-one, 4-androstene-3, 17-dione, 4-pregnene-3, 20-dione and 4-cholesten-3-one). The main products are the 6β-hydroxy- and the 6-oxo-derivatives of the respective steroid. These derivatives were identified by chromatographic mobilities and by gas chromatography-mass spectrometry. The formation of 6β -hydroperoxy -derivatives is suggested and these derivatives were tentatively identified. The highest yields of 6-oxygenated products (30–50%) were found when cadaverine and spermine were reacted with the steroids. The addition of reduced glutathione during hydrolysis of the steroid 3-imines of cadaverine, hexylamine and ethanolamine as well as addition of ascorbic acid during the hydrolysis of the steroid 3-imines ofeadaverine substantially reduced the 6-oxygenation. Steroid 3-imine formation and hydrolysis which yields 6-oxygenated derivatives has also been shown to occur during work up (evaporation) of organic solvent extracts of rat liver microsomes (105,000g sediments) to which 17β-hydroxy-4-androsten-3-one, 4-androstene-3,17-dione, 4-pregnene-3,20-dione or 4-cholesten-3-one respectively had been added. It is concluded that there is a risk that these organic reactions are mistaken for enzymatic conversions during in vitro investigations of 3-oxo-4-ene-steroids.

Abbreviations
testosterone; 17β-hydroxy-4-androsten-3-one; androstendione; 4-androstene-3; 17-dione; progesterone; 4-pregnene-3; 20-dione; 6-oxo-testosterone; 17β-hydroxy-4-androstene-3; 6-dione; 6-oxo-androstendione; 4-androstene-3,6; 17-trione; 6-oxo-progesterone; 4-pregnene-3,6,20-trione
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VaughnTrue said:
here is some info which explains its formation:

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That tells me how to make it.
Cool beans.
:smoker:

Edit: difference is it has other compounds also
 
That was good info. Thanks bro. Shot me in the right direction
 
VaughnTrue said:
it can be used effectively on a cut or a bulk. really comes down to caloric intake.


due to its ability to greatly increase glycogen stores, i think it'd be an awesome option to keep your muscles full while on a caloric deficit.
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Increases glycogen stores is music to my ears!!
 
Very excited for this. People can hate on the name, but old Superdrol is never coming back legally. HT owns the name, put in the effort to get it, and deserves to be able to use it if they've paid the good money to acquire it.

In the end, a name brings attention to it for people who are not regulars in the industry, but you should always conduct your due diligence if you're going to buy something to put in or on your own body. Marketers gonna market, companies gonna use competitive advantages when they can, part of capitalism and business.

I'm pretty excited for the formula and very excited to see logs of the product. You have to respect a company for at least putting out new things and keeping the hormone game alive for people wanting to go that route within the legal limits that they are able to. For that I give HT credit.
 
Preach
 
I don't want to be a hater, just pointing out a consumer pov....

When I saw sd it baited me in quickly as I love the stuff.

Then when I realized the product has nothing to do with sd or isn't anything close, I was let down.

This product must be manufactured by democrats? haha j/k happy Friday, smile!
 
Quest said:
I don't want to be a hater, just pointing out a consumer pov....

When I saw sd it baited me in quickly as I love the stuff.

Then when I realized the product has nothing to do with sd or isn't anything close, I was let down.

This product must be manufactured by democrats? haha j/k happy Friday, smile!
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the ingredients do not resemble superdrol, but they will give very similar overall gains.


The name will help people try the product for the first time(name recognition). The results is what keeps people coming back to Hi-Tech prohormones time after time after time
 
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