Unanswered Matthersby log: Old man on a mission

MrKleen73

MrKleen73

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@MrKleen73 any tips or tricks for keeping the traps popping while you’re in a full lat spread??
Honestly the traps have to be relaxed and stretched to get a full lat spread in the rear lat spread. You can raise the shoulders a bit and make an effort not to round the shoulders and thoracic spine too much. Doing that too much puts them at an angle that almost makes them invisible. Also on stage or any time the camera is lower you need to arch your back more, remember you are showing people below you the muscle so hunching forward is going to lose a lot of the visibility of well everything you are trying to show off. I was told to act as if I had a flash light on my back and was trying to point it toward the judges or camera. However as far as traps go in a rear lat spread, the reality is that if you want to spread the lats as far as possible you have to relax the traps and let your scapula come out away from the center line of your body. Trying to contract the traps will pull them in and you end up having a much narrower spread.

A rear double biceps is where you show your traps, or the rear "relaxed" stance you can contract a bit as long as you already know how to drop the lats as that should show off more of the back musculature but a rear lat spread is only to highlight the total width of the lats, V taper, lower back for upper body and then the best calf, and separation between the quads and hamstrings. Only people with massive traps are going to show much trap in a rear lat spread.

What most people do to show the traps and back detail when going into the rear lat spread is give the inner back a good squeeze showing off all of that musculature then put their hands on their hips and spread wide into the lat spread.
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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Honestly the traps have to be relaxed and stretched to get a full lat spread in the rear lat spread. You can raise the shoulders a bit and make an effort not to round the shoulders and thoracic spine too much. Doing that too much puts them at an angle that almost makes them invisible. Also on stage or any time the camera is lower you need to arch your back more, remember you are showing people below you the muscle so hunching forward is going to lose a lot of the visibility of well everything you are trying to show off. I was told to act as if I had a flash light on my back and was trying to point it toward the judges or camera. However as far as traps go in a rear lat spread, the reality is that if you want to spread the lats as far as possible you have to relax the traps and let your scapula come out away from the center line of your body. Trying to contract the traps will pull them in and you end up having a much narrower spread.

A rear double biceps is where you show your traps, or the rear "relaxed" stance you can contract a bit as long as you already know how to drop the lats as that should show off more of the back musculature but a rear lat spread is only to highlight the total width of the lats, V taper, lower back for upper body and then the best calf, and separation between the quads and hamstrings. Only people with massive traps are going to show much trap in a rear lat spread.

What most people do to show the traps and back detail when going into the rear lat spread is give the inner back a good squeeze showing off all of that musculature then put their hands on their hips and spread wide into the lat spread.
Great info brother. After a few weeks of assessing my back with these shots I kinda figured it’s one or the other. I am a trap junkie and they are hands down my favorite muscle. Always trying to find ways to get the bigger and better.
 
MrKleen73

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For example look at how "small" or flat Dorian's Traps look here


Compared to here where he is about to go into his rear lat spread.

 
Alchemist11

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I used to feel you can’t gain any muscle while in a deficit until I saw it with my own eyes on slin/DHT/Trest. I’m so psyched to dial all this in the next 19 weeks.
Oh man, that sounds sweeeet! DHT and Trest by itself equals gains IMO. Slin is scarry af to me, but you know what you are doing and gains will be lean and plenty, I'm sure! I'm watching you 👀👀
 
MrKleen73

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Great info brother. After a few weeks of assessing my back with these shots I kinda figured it’s one or the other. I am a trap junkie and they are hands down my favorite muscle. Always trying to find ways to get the bigger and better.
Push Press, Overhead Shrugs, Overhead and Farmers Carries for cardio / conditioning with shoulder carriage held elevated. Creates a lot of TUT and a bit of Occlusion as well.
 
ZOO

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@ZOO Has some posing experience, maybe he can help ??
It's kind of hard to give tips via written explanation so hopefully I make sense enough haha. Some things I learned are:
- In the lat spread, relax the back. It'll allow the lats to open up further. Flexing will tighten and contract the back preventing proper width.
- In side shots (or any shot that shows the glute/ham), flex the glute but relax the hamstring. Flexing the hammy will pull it in and make it appear smaller. Only contracting the glute allows the hamstring to have that hanging effect while having good separation at the ass.
- For the front double biceps, pull the hands back while pushing the elbows forward. It'll help open the lat while also showing off those sick guns.

I'm not sure if I hit on any of the poses that you were wanting to see but if there are any particular ones that you'd like info on I'll try. Not much of a posing expert myself but I did take a class once with Dave Kalick and Stan McQuay. Got some good info from them.
 
Matthersby

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It's kind of hard to give tips via written explanation so hopefully I make sense enough haha. Some things I learned are:
- In the lat spread, relax the back. It'll allow the lats to open up further. Flexing will tighten and contract the back preventing proper width.
- In side shots (or any shot that shows the glute/ham), flex the glute but relax the hamstring. Flexing the hammy will pull it in and make it appear smaller. Only contracting the glute allows the hamstring to have that hanging effect while having good separation at the ass.
- For the front double biceps, pull the hands back while pushing the elbows forward. It'll help open the lat while also showing off those sick guns.

I'm not sure if I hit on any of the poses that you were wanting to see but if there are any particular ones that you'd like info on I'll try. Not much of a posing expert myself but I did take a class once with Dave Kalick and Stan McQuay. Got some good info from them.
Thanks again for the great info.
Since you’re around, I’ve been meaning to ask. I have some Dien enth made by a company you probably know. Have you ran that? I’m considering it as an alternative to Tren pre-show. Have not met one person that’s ran the E version.
 
Cmseabee24

Cmseabee24

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Thanks again for the great info.
Since you’re around, I’ve been meaning to ask. I have some Dien enth made by a company you probably know. Have you ran that? I’m considering it as an alternative to Tren pre-show. Have not met one person that’s ran the E version.
What is different between dien and tren? I’ve never really read up on dien.
 
Matthersby

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What is different between dien and tren? I’ve never really read up on dien.
Way more tolerable. A little wetter and a little less anabolic. At least that’s many’s experience with it. Nicknames diet-Tren
 
Matthersby

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Hey Matt, I have a bottle of DHB you can have if you want to throw it in for shits and giggles.
I sold my 40ml’s from that same source. If guys like you are abandoning cycles of it, I ain’t even tryna be tougher, I know I’m not.
 

CroLifter

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Matt, was that you who said that you cant tolerate any kind of oral and that even on the anavar run you lasted like 1 week?
 
Codybenz

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I sold my 40ml’s from that same source. If guys like you are abandoning cycles of it, I ain’t even tryna be tougher, I know I’m not.
Yeah that was 100% a joke. I need to throw the damn thing away but I just can’t make myself do it
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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Matt, was that you who said that you cant tolerate any kind of oral and that even on the anavar run you lasted like 1 week?
Ya and I think a big part of it is my kratom intake which may take a lot out of my detoxification system. That’s my guess
 
Matthersby

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Yeah that was 100% a joke. I need to throw the damn thing away but I just can’t make myself do it
I mean how bad is the pain? ItalOne had pics from the ER that sealed my fate ever wanting to fck with the stuff. Plus you abandoning that run and you’re pretty tough.
 
Codybenz

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I mean how bad is the pain? ItalOne had pics from the ER that sealed my fate ever wanting to fck with the stuff. Plus you abandoning that run and you’re pretty tough.
With the exception of one of the knots which was like an 8 on a 1-10 scale, the pain was only about a 4-5, the problem is the pain was constant and made it really uncomfortable to sit down, and forget about trying to lay down on a bench and workout. It just wasn’t worth the discomfort. And the knots just stayed and would not go away.
 
Matthersby

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With the exception of one of the knots which was like an 8 on a 1-10 scale, the pain was only about a 4-5, the problem is the pain was constant and made it really uncomfortable to sit down, and forget about trying to lay down on a bench and workout. It just wasn’t worth the discomfort. And the knots just stayed and would not go away.
I can totally get that. I think that’s what we need to remember with the guicanol versions.
Another example is I always tell people tattooing is super easy.
For 45 minutes.
Try getting 6 hours on your sternum or armpit and have gnawing pain that won’t stop and people who think tattoos don’t hurt would realize they do.
 

trumac

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I can totally get that. I think that’s what we need to remember with the guicanol versions.
Another example is I always tell people tattooing is super easy.
For 45 minutes.
Try getting 6 hours on your sternum or armpit and have gnawing pain that won’t stop and people who think tattoos don’t hurt would realize they do.
I have a considerable amount of tattoos and have sat for many 8 hour sessions and I always laugh when people say they don’t hurt. Yeah Becky I’m sure the infinity symbol on your wrist that took 10 mins wasn’t that awful.
 
Hyde

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With the exception of one of the knots which was like an 8 on a 1-10 scale, the pain was only about a 4-5, the problem is the pain was constant and made it really uncomfortable to sit down, and forget about trying to lay down on a bench and workout. It just wasn’t worth the discomfort. And the knots just stayed and would not go away.
How long did they take to go away for real? And is the consensus to pin smaller doses more frequently then or as few pins as possible? Does adding test or other additional oil to the shot help the site any?
 
Codybenz

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How long did they take to go away for real? And is the consensus to pin smaller doses more frequently then or as few pins as possible? Does adding test or other additional oil to the shot help the site any?
Each knot was there for about 2 weeks. I ran out of injection spots pretty quick.

I never tried mixing with other oils. I did play around with the temp of the oil before injecting but that made no difference.
 
Rocket3015

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No Thank You !!
 
bigbeaph

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Each knot was there for about 2 weeks. I ran out of injection spots pretty quick.

I never tried mixing with other oils. I did play around with the temp of the oil before injecting but that made no difference.
Did the knots show up a day or 2 after poke or almost immediately?
 

jrock645

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Each knot was there for about 2 weeks. I ran out of injection spots pretty quick.

I never tried mixing with other oils. I did play around with the temp of the oil before injecting but that made no difference.
The pain with the dhb from my source is pretty minimal, but it is leaving knots so finsing places to inject can get a little tricky. Im doing dhb 4x’s a week and test the other 3 days. So far, its manageable but im not quite 4 weeks in. I hope nothing changes and im able to finish this out because its going well so far.
 
Codybenz

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The pain with the dhb from my source is pretty minimal, but it is leaving knots so finsing places to inject can get a little tricky. Im doing dhb 4x’s a week and test the other 3 days. So far, its manageable but im not quite 4 weeks in. I hope nothing changes and im able to finish this out because its going well so far.
Glad you found a good batch
 
Cmseabee24

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So, I know we’ve talked extensively on this, but does your source for dhb use a different carrier? Why is it so much less pip?
I know some people running IA super pharma that day the DHB is so smooth. A little pip but nothing like golf ball knots.
 
Matthersby

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I’m going to wait until this lands on my lap. I ended up with 40ml of 1-test that I ended up selling and I’m going to wait until everyone has completed a cycle of dhb, what brand, why it’s pipless, etc etc before I ever buy any more of it.
 
Matthersby

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On another note. All my gear is here for the next several months.
50ml Mast Prop
3 kits Black Top GH
100 Proviron tabs
1 humalog pen and box of disposable needles - also buying a vial on the 7th, not sure I love the pen and it’s going to expire quickly.
Test E for a year at least.
Stockpile for the comp of Proviron, anavar, winny, and Dienolone E
 
bigbeaph

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On another note. All my gear is here for the next several months.
50ml Mast Prop
3 kits Black Top GH
100 Proviron tabs
1 humalog pen and box of disposable needles - also buying a vial on the 7th, not sure I love the pen and it’s going to expire quickly.
Test E for a year at least.
Stockpile for the comp of Proviron, anavar, winny, and Dienolone E
I dont remember seeing you address this earlier...so hopefully I'm not being redundant here.

But why dien? Since your going into a contest why did you opt for that over a low dosed tren?
 

CroLifter

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He doesnt wanna **** with tren because of the sides
I understand him even i am reconsidering my idda about running tren a next year.
i mean anecdotally it builds muscle at a rate of 2-3x that of test. Ok. But if i can run 5-600 test with some proviron and be side free is better for gains then if i cant eat and cant sleep.

if you cant eat and sleep you wont grow. I mean pre contest it may not matter as much as you aint growing pre contest anyway butni can see it being detrimental to a lean bulk.

Idk man vasoconstriction, high bp, potential neurodegeneration, lack of sleep...what could possibly wrong, especially in ones 40's ?

ahhh i am probably going to change my mind 10x before the cycle begins who knows what am i going to run...test is the only definitive one.
 
Matthersby

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I dont remember seeing you address this earlier...so hopefully I'm not being redundant here.

But why dien? Since your going into a contest why did you opt for that over a low dosed tren?
I may use Tren. Coach really is excited I have Dien E and hasn’t brought up Tren at all. But it’s usually his go-to. If he wants me to use it 6 weeks prior to the show, I’ll suffer through it. I just don’t like the insomnia above all else. Anxiety is a little bad but not much more than high mast. We will see, every time I think I know what’s next, he has me do something different. And he doesn’t give me much of a heads up, but when we spoke about what I have in my arsenal 12 weeks ago, he seemed thrilled about Dien.
 

CroLifter

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I may use Tren. Coach really is excited I have Dien E and hasn’t brought up Tren at all. But it’s usually his go-to. If he wants me to use it 6 weeks prior to the show, I’ll suffer through it. I just don’t like the insomnia above all else. Anxiety is a little bad but not much more than high mast. We will see, every time I think I know what’s next, he has me do something different. And he doesn’t give me much of a heads up, but when we spoke about what I have in my arsenal 12 weeks ago, he seemed thrilled about Dien.
And impact on cardio is what bothers me. Kinda weird, to use a ped that lowers your performance. But as i said i get it for bb'ing, especially pre contest. I do some boxing and grqppling too so it would be a bummer to be "that" guy who is yoked but gets destroyed because of my lack of stamina lol.

btw i hope that you do use tren 😆
then at least i will be able to get an honest feedback from someone who has similar stance on it like me.
 
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danielvp

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On another note. All my gear is here for the next several months.
50ml Mast Prop
3 kits Black Top GH
100 Proviron tabs
1 humalog pen and box of disposable needles - also buying a vial on the 7th, not sure I love the pen and it’s going to expire quickly.
Test E for a year at least.
Stockpile for the comp of Proviron, anavar, winny, and Dienolone E
What dose of GH and injection frequency is your coach recommending? (Just curious).
 
Matthersby

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What dose of GH and injection frequency is your coach recommending? (Just curious).
I will certainly post it. He’s kind of a pain and likes to tell me everything last minute. We start in 3-4 more weeks with pwo insulin and mast prop. I imagine he will fill me in on what dosage will be just prior.
 
bigbeaph

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I may use Tren. Coach really is excited I have Dien E and hasn’t brought up Tren at all. But it’s usually his go-to. If he wants me to use it 6 weeks prior to the show, I’ll suffer through it. I just don’t like the insomnia above all else. Anxiety is a little bad but not much more than high mast. We will see, every time I think I know what’s next, he has me do something different. And he doesn’t give me much of a heads up, but when we spoke about what I have in my arsenal 12 weeks ago, he seemed thrilled about Dien.
FWIW- I didnt cycle tren this summer but played with doses for a few weeks. Try to figure out how it would effect me. From my experience- keeping the dose low enough to skirt any sides (except the ungodly amount of sweating) still seemed to net me much better benefits than dien. I liked dien a lot but it also had a decent load of side effects personally.

Made me wonder if most guys are just running the tren too high. A little goes a long way.

Not trying to pretend like I'm an expert after a few weeks of use - the whole experience just surprised me quite a bit.
 
Cmseabee24

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FWIW- I didnt cycle tren this summer but played with doses for a few weeks. Try to figure out how it would effect me. From my experience- keeping the dose low enough to skirt any sides (except the ungodly amount of sweating) still seemed to net me much better benefits than dien. I liked dien a lot but it also had a decent load of side effects personally.

Made me wonder if most guys are just running the tren too high. A little goes a long way.

Not trying to pretend like I'm an expert after a few weeks of use - the whole experience just surprised me quite a bit.
I agree that people run tren to high. I find 200-350 a week perfect.
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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FWIW- I didnt cycle tren this summer but played with doses for a few weeks. Try to figure out how it would effect me. From my experience- keeping the dose low enough to skirt any sides (except the ungodly amount of sweating) still seemed to net me much better benefits than dien. I liked dien a lot but it also had a decent load of side effects personally.

Made me wonder if most guys are just running the tren too high. A little goes a long way.

Not trying to pretend like I'm an expert after a few weeks of use - the whole experience just surprised me quite a bit.
He may have even forgot I had it. With this goal, I’d be willing to endure the suck to get the best results
 

CroLifter

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Hmm masteron...nothing but sides for me. No benefits at all other than maybe a bit of aggression.

Proviron works so much better for hardening imho.
 
Matthersby

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Hmm masteron...nothing but sides for me. No benefits at all other than maybe a bit of aggression.

Proviron works so much better for hardening imho.
I am a bigger fan of Proviron for sure. Similar results but stacked I’m betting I can get some strength gains and hardening. The benefit will certainly be GH/Slin. I think it’s DHT from here on out all the way to the comp.
 

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