Is it worth it? Warning, ranting ahead

[Jinsun]

You know what funny "we should probably start a separate thread for this" based on my firsthand observation, most ppl on gear in my opinion don't show many mental changes. But usually when they do it's heard twords being a little more agressive or a shorter fuse. "No not roid rage" but just being more edgy.

When I started using testosterone I almost immediately noticed that I felt calmer, less angry, less likely to snap over something stupid. More mindfulness and more emotional, even with estrogen 100% in check. Oddly enough I can also fall asleep after large amounts of caffeine, many OTC and prescription medications either have no effects on me or a opposite effect then there supposed to. Painkillers, from the very first time I ever used one had no effects on me until I took too much and then just threw up. When I was in my drinking and party days I could sniff cocaine and fall asleep .

I also have add or ADHD, at least that's what they told me as a kid. I wonder if all this is related. I also don't have much of a dopamine response. Even tho I almost always feel content, it takes something extreme for me to get that feel good dopamine buzz/high. I get it from setting a PR on a big lift if a bunch of ppl saw it, skydiving definitely did it. Knocking someone out in a fight use to do it. I'm talking about a real fight, boxing, or MMA, whatever. I'm not going around starting fights lol. But I could equate a knockout to the feeling you get hitting a walk off home run in a baseball game

I'm jealous hearing how testosterone calms you down. I'm the opposite. I get impulsive on cycle and anxiety also elevates substantially. Only adding an SSRI or some other serotonergic drug fixes that for me. But elevated serotonin makes me even less capable of concentrating on anything, so it's a toss up between being a zombie, capable of doing only manual labor, but having big muscles, or being a functional human being, able to do art and science, but not having big muscles. We all differ very much. In my case, this is all dependent on the state of my HPA axis, which is most of the time dysregulated and SSRI's help a lot in that regard, so I can tolerate aas like a normal person.

But one thing is very important, and that is the dose of aas and the duration of the cycle. While you might have such a response on 1500 - 2500 ng/dl, your response might be different on 5000 ng/dl. The other thing, the duration of the cycle, constant activation of the HPA axis eventually leads to neurological depression. I'm saying neurological, because functionally you wont be depressed, you wont be sad or nonfunctional, you'll be just negative (at least in the beginning), but you will be normally functional, able to hold down a job, a relationship, be assertive, dominant, etc. But neurological depression and an dysregulated hpa axis, will lead to all sort of trouble and that will make you aas tolerance much worse. This wont normally happen on 6 to 12 month cycles, of just test on low to medium dosages (for some it might), but on longer cycles, this almost certainly will happen, unless you employ other drugs to help with, in a broad sense, with neuroinflammation. And yes, I'm talking about TRT + regimens here. People running 1200 ng/dl test + 100mg primo ad nauseum or even more then that. Also talking about pro's, who cruise on 250 - 500 mg's of test.

 

[Jinsun]

Oh to add to that, I was very agressive and quick to snap before gear use, and now I'm not. My point was many drugs seem to have a reverse effect on me.

It's not reverse, not really. A lot of ppl feel calmer on masteron or test. It's partly related to enhanced dopamine transmission (and the state of your amygdala, the fight or flight central, which is high in AR's). It's also why you sleep better if you take coke. I also sleep better on coke, if I manage to fall a sleep that is.

 

[Smont]

I'm jealous hearing how testosterone calms you down. I'm the opposite. I get impulsive on cycle and anxiety also elevates substantially. Only adding an SSRI or some other serotonergic drug fixes that for me. But elevated serotonin makes me even less capable of concentrating on anything, so it's a toss up between being a zombie, capable of doing only manual labor, but having big muscles, or being a functional human being, able to do art and science, but not having big muscles. We all differ very much. In my case, this is all dependent on the state of my HPA axis, which is most of the time dysregulated and SSRI's help a lot in that regard, so I can tolerate aas like a normal person.

But one thing is very important, and that is the dose of aas and the duration of the cycle. While you might have such a response on 1500 - 2500 ng/dl, your response might be different on 5000 ng/dl. The other thing, the duration of the cycle, constant activation of the HPA axis eventually leads to neurological depression. I'm saying neurological, because functionally you wont be depressed, you wont be sad or nonfunctional, you'll be just negative (at least in the beginning), but you will be normally functional, able to hold down a job, a relationship, be assertive, dominant, etc. But neurological depression and an dysregulated hpa axis, will lead to all sort of trouble and that will make you aas tolerance much worse. This wont normally happen on 6 to 12 month cycles, of just test on low to medium dosages (for some it might), but on longer cycles, this almost certainly will happen, unless you employ other drugs to help with, in a broad sense, with neuroinflammation. And yes, I'm talking about TRT + regimens here. People running 1200 ng/dl test + 100mg primo ad nauseum or even more then that. Also talking about pro's, who cruise on 250 - 500 mg's of test.

I may experiment with that down the road. My doses are typically what I would consider low. My cruise dose is 150mg of test. My cycles are 300-450mg. I don't use 19's because they give me prolactin gyno and prami makes me a degenerate gambling fool.

Maybe after the new year il experiment with some high dose test only and see what happens

 

[Rich Tits]

This is a joke right? This can't be for real...

And she had kids...

The "kids" are plants

http://imgur.com/mwVPnEI

 

[Jinsun]

prami makes me a degenerate gambling fool.

Yes, prami is a dopamine receptor 2 agonist. And excess D2 agonism causes impulsivity and novelty seeking behavior. So yes, stay away from it, unless you have Parkinson's or RLS or some other dopamine system dysfunction. Also, yes, plz stay away from 19nor's, their effects on neurobiology are far worse then test or dht's ...

 

[GreenMachineX]

I may experiment with that down the road. My doses are typically what I would consider low. My cruise dose is 150mg of test. My cycles are 300-450mg. I don't use 19's because they give me prolactin gyno and prami makes me a degenerate gambling fool.

Maybe after the new year il experiment with some high dose test only and see what happens

Do you measure hematocrit and hemoglobin? How high does yours go on cycle?

 

[cruze1911r1]

I definitely think it's a joke lol. The article story sounds crazy

Ya it's far fetched I'll agree. However... Trannies are real and they're probably more prevalent than we think...

 

[Smont]

Do you measure hematocrit and hemoglobin? How high does yours go on cycle?

Haven't checked in a while but I've never had it go high enough to worry me. Low 50's

 

[Smont]

The "kids" are plants

http://imgur.com/mwVPnEI

Yep, all kinds of fruits lol

 

[Smont]

I got a friend that's gay and even he thinks all this modern he/she/it/them nonsense is absolutely rediculous

 

[Hyde]

Most people have no idea on all the mechanism's of action that androgens have in the body, and thus, their decision making process, the logic it uses, can't possibly be valid. Thus, it's all rather a "gut process" of thinking. Even we, that have been doing this for some time, have no clue on all the action's androgens have in our body. For instance, I just read today that tamoxifen is PKC inhibitor. It's actually usable for amphetamine addiction, subsequently, it will lover dopamine transmission in all users, those that aren't neurotypical, like in the ADHD spectrum, will notice it a lot more then others. Continuing this line of discourse, estrogen it self promotes dopamine release, as do androgens. But they also severely upregulate the HPA axis. That coupled with higher dopamine transmission leads to higher impulsivity, aggression, blunted emotional spectrum, etc. It also leads to neuroinflammation, which subsequently leads to something, that neurobiologically, looks very similar to depression. A depressed brain will then be much more prone to negative encoding of ... well ... basically everything; it's world around it, it's thoughts, life, etc. Now couple all that negativity with impulsivity and aggression, and you got fubar.

While there is a lot more then that, I bet you that most people who are considering use of AAS do not know this. And besides, people who have a problem with their brain reward system, ie. the dopamine system, will be more drawn to drug use and abuse as is, because all these drugs impact the dopamine reward system. So just at the start, we already have a potential problem, as half of these young folks have some sort of an unstable personality disorder or adhd. And when they add androgens to the mix, they become a total hyperactive, impulsive mess. And that wrecks havoc on their lives. (speaking from personal experience here)

So being cognizant on ones emotional and cognitive processing while on cycle is very important. This is one of the reason why I dismiss people who like to say that aas have no perceivable impact on their mental state. It's simply not true and the reason why they think that is simply because they aren't cognizant of it. Besides, aas usage circles are still, funnily enough, very conservative circles of garage folk bro's where just talking about mental stuff is kinda stigmatized, yet alone them admitting to them selfs, that they are taking mind altering substances when they are injecting aas. And let's just be honest, how many people here actually know how to meditate, or practice mindfulness or have done any sort of cognitive behavioral therapy, etc.? Not many. So it's fair to assume not many are actually acute observers of what's actually going in their heads in the first place.

Anyway, this discourse is a slippery slope and I'm going to stop here, before it morphs in to a total rant.

People don’t often want to reckon with truth, because it’s tough taking ownership of the idea that things have a cost, and what you are exposed to on a chemical and hormonal level does shape your development, in conjunction with your life experiences and the way you do or do not direct your mental state.

I think most people can still be overall good people on AAS, maybe in a lot of ways truly better overall, but there are certainly trade offs and concessions, indisputably.

Like you said, that’s a rabbit hole beyond the scope of this thread, but we inherently can’t know all of the ramifications, and certainly on a general level people don’t really know what they are getting into entirely using this stuff. That can probably be said for a lot of things, I suppose.

 

[nightcrawler22]

It's not reverse, not really. A lot of ppl feel calmer on masteron or test. It's partly related to enhanced dopamine transmission (and the state of your amygdala, the fight or flight central, which is high in AR's). It's also why you sleep better if you take coke. I also sleep better on coke, if I manage to fall a sleep that is.
[/QUOTE
Cocaine is a stimulant. There is not a stimulant in the world that is known to help you sleep and cocaine sure as hell does not.

 

[Smont]

@nightcrawler22 Stimulants have a calming effect on most people with ADHD. That's what he's talking about. No cocaine does not help you sleep. But if your someone with ADHD. It can have a reverse effect and make you tired.

That's a medical fact by the Way (Stimulants and ADHD

 

[brofessorx]

Steroids are gay.

 

[Jinsun]

@nightcrawler22 Stimulants have a calming effect on most people with ADHD. That's what he's talking about. No cocaine does not help you sleep. But if your someone with ADHD. It can have a reverse effect and make you tired.

That's a medical fact by the Way (Stimulants and ADHD

Fuack that guy. But kind of you to explain.

I would add, dopamine has a calming effect on most people, that are healthy, or don't have pathologies where dopamine is harmful (like schizophrenics). It's just how dopamine works. The dose will determine how stimulated or calm you'll get. Nobody ever takes a really small amount of coke, like 10 - 25mg's ... Off course you'll get overly stimulated by 100mg's or more. But even then, if you manage to fall asleep, chances are you'll sleep good. I always sleep better if I have more then less dopamine in me. But I'm not neurotypical, so there's that.

 

[Oliver Kween]

Megan fox was born Mitchell fox, it's a dude

Sériously ??

 

[Oliver Kween]

@Smont

Remember that those who ask this question are not making any effort.

As we say at home, "they wait for us to put the food all hot and chewed in their beak (mouth)."

Which is pretty dangerous because if he's having trouble digesting it, they're going to blame you.

As I read above, they don't make an effort to search in a search bar and that's true. Soon they may ask if getting a diploma is worth it . ( unless we pass this diploma in their place )

I would be on Smont's side. But it's a shame because it can deter beginners who try the ground before becoming serious...

 

[Smont]

Sériously ??

No, not serious lol

 

[Quest]

I always feel kinda negative I hate it. I’m working on it. Paddle out! I see some sets bro! That makes me happy

Grew up surfing. Been going to my mom's house as she is sick. Ran 12 miles on the beach was watching a guy on a paddle board paddle in way on the outside, then ride all the to shore pound. Was a very high tide.
Thinking I'm getting a paddle board.

Pictures too big damnit

 

[Quest]

Cheers brother, Tom from tampa fl

 

[Quest]

Yessir baseball and golf

 

[delco]

You know what funny "we should probably start a separate thread for this" based on my firsthand observation, most ppl on gear in my opinion don't show many mental changes. But usually when they do it's heard twords being a little more agressive or a shorter fuse. "No not roid rage" but just being more edgy.

When I started using testosterone I almost immediately noticed that I felt calmer, less angry, less likely to snap over something stupid. More mindfulness and more emotional, even with estrogen 100% in check. Oddly enough I can also fall asleep after large amounts of caffeine, many OTC and prescription medications either have no effects on me or a opposite effect then there supposed to. Painkillers, from the very first time I ever used one had no effects on me until I took too much and then just threw up. When I was in my drinking and party days I could sniff cocaine and fall asleep .

I also have add or ADHD, at least that's what they told me as a kid. I wonder if all this is related. I also don't have much of a dopamine response. Even tho I almost always feel content, it takes something extreme for me to get that feel good dopamine buzz/high. I get it from setting a PR on a big lift if a bunch of ppl saw it, skydiving definitely did it. Knocking someone out in a fight use to do it. I'm talking about a real fight, boxing, or MMA, whatever. I'm not going around starting fights lol. But I could equate a knockout to the feeling you get hitting a walk off home run in a baseball game

I live in constant tension between wanting to be chill, but also being type a.

The first four weeks of test/tren, i was totally chill. Nothing rattled me. My wife was amazed.

The next 8 or so were just neurosis. First, i was so attached to her, like it was love potion #9, and all i saw was hearts when i thought of her. But then if she'd say something off, my heart started beating hard, chest got tight, and id get worried like our marriage is over.

Now, at the end of it, i think a lot of those chemicals are readjusting, because of some after cycle issues im dealing with.

If, after all this clears up, i can pin test and keep e under wraps (feel like i aromatize a lot), I'll be up for it. It sure felt nice at the start.

 

[beefyfan]

I'm thinking of buying a penis pump. Is it worth it?

 

[rascal14]

I live in constant tension between wanting to be chill, but also being type a.

The first four weeks of test/tren, i was totally chill. Nothing rattled me. My wife was amazed.

The next 8 or so were just neurosis. First, i was so attached to her, like it was love potion #9, and all i saw was hearts when i thought of her. But then if she'd say something off, my heart started beating hard, chest got tight, and id get worried like our marriage is over.

Now, at the end of it, i think a lot of those chemicals are readjusting, because of some after cycle issues im dealing with.

If, after all this clears up, i can pin test and keep e under wraps (feel like i aromatize a lot), I'll be up for it. It sure felt nice at the start.

Tren was wild for me as well, and I also wonder if part of my sides came from taking Caber pre emptively.

I couldn’t sleep because I was in a constant panic attack all day and night, truly miserable walking around the living room pacing in circles at 4am having not slept yet.

had to sleep with a night light because I was so fucking scared and anxious, but of what?

I was the same, loved my girlfriend but she could randomly see a guy at the store and I was convinced she was cheating on me. Horrible compound I took for granted too early and too high a dose, and it likely fucked my anxiety up for life. It certainly ruined lifting for me for several years.