How to "pulse" orals

[nycste]

Bump been 0outta this a while sent some of my boys a PM... whats the best cheap test boosters these days I still have 2 alpha drive XLs which i am hesitant to use during my pulse due to the DMT topic. Anything else out there and cheap I can use on off days or at night.

things i have been eyeballing but dont fully understand atm are

Erase products and clones
DAA products and clones

otherwise all the normal stable supps

 

[S8NFORCE667]

Advice on 2 week on 2 week off cycle

Hi,

Great post.

I am a complete noob in relation to steroid use of any form. I have been training for 5 years now and have tried my best with diet and workout routines. I feel that my gains have been minimal and i just cant change my diet or work out anymore than I am.

I have ordered 100 dianabol 10mg tabs and about to start my first cycle. I dont have a lot of money so apart from the protein shakes and diet I want to get maximum value at the cheapest cost. From what Ive read It seems that you must take an anti estrogen when doing a 6 week on 6 week off oral dbol cycle along with a liver cleanser. the stack would cost more than I can afford 6 weekly but ive read that a dbol 2 week on 2 week off cycle you wouldnt need an anti-estrogen. is this true is my main question? Also after reading what you have published and not sure if my understanding is entirely correct (mixed with other info I have gained off Google), Pulse cycling is not optimal. Does the this apply to a 2 on 2 off cycle ( or even a 4 on 4 off)?

Obviously, I want to get the best out of the product at a price I can afford and dont want to damage my health. Any advice will be much appreciated as most things that I read seem to contradict each other!

Thanks in advance!

 

[shaan]

hey...so i have decided to go on havoc and was thinking of doing it everyday for 4 weeks. but, after reading this thread, chagned my mind and instead will do the pulsing method, 4/days per week. Day 1 will be 10mg, day 2 20mg, day 3 &4 30mg. weeks 2 & 3 will be 30 mg. weeks 4 through 6, 40mg. With havoc, I will also be taking AI Sports Nutrition Cycle Support (2 scoops/day); fish oil, multi vitamins, taurine (2g/day), whey protein, & bcaa.
PCT: either nolva or clomid or both for about 4 weeks (haven't decided on dosage, up for suggestions), Cycle Support (as from above), whey protein, creatine, fish oil, multi vitamins, bcaa

Please let me know what you think of the above. THanks

 

[shaan]

Hello,

Need some serious advice from you experienced bros. I'm planning on running my first anabolic cycle and want to keep the sides to the minimum. First and foremost, my stats:

Age: 25
Weight: 160 lbs
Height: Almost 5'11
Body Fat: 10%
Weight training: on and off since 4 years
Diet: Try 5-6 meals a day, around 200 grams of protein, a good amount of carbs, try to stay away from oil and sodium as much as possible.

Aim: Lean gains, 15-20 lbs on a 12 week cycle

What I plan to run is test e (not running test p as i've heard it hurts plus it being a short ester, don't want to be pinning every day). I've been told that i should add stan or winny or masteron to it to keep my gains lean and avoid the water weight. On top of that I plan on adding an hcg and an AI serum to help kick start my natural test back on. For pct, i was thinking nova/clomid. Please let me know how to manage this 12 week cycle, i can cut the cycle short to 7-8 weeks if necessary. I have access to any sort of gear so please feel free to throw in suggestions about products and the dosages. Another suggestion i got was to run sust 250 and dbol but i think that would be a little harsh for it being my first cycle.

Awaiting your replies,
Thanks!

 

[murk01]

Y did u post on pulsing orals

 

[rump11]

MWF with bloodwork

Okay, so I finally did a M/W/F pulse with blood work.


DOSAGES:

MONDAY:
5x 10mg (50mg) BP Anavar taken in single AM dose.

TUESDAY:
Off.

WEDNESDAY:
5x 10mg (50mg) BP Anavar taken in single AM dose.

THURSDAY:
Off.

FRIDAY:
5x 10mg (50mg) BP Anavar taken in single AM dose.

SATURDAY:
Off.

SUNDAY:
Off.


LAB RESULTS:

FRIDAY - BASELINE BEFORE PULSE:
Testosterone: 403 ng/dL
LH: 10.2 mIU/mL
FSH: 9.7 mIU/mL
Estradiol: 25.9 pg/mL

TUESDAY - 24 HOURS AFTER 1st DOSE:
Testosterone: 579 ng/dL
LH: 10.3 mIU/mL
FSH: 9.9 mIU/mL
Estradiol: 33.6 pg/mL

MONDAY - AFTER PULSE AND 2 DAYS OFF:
Testosterone: 466 ng/dL
LH: 6.3 mIU/mL
FSH: 5.7 mIU/mL
Estradiol: 49.2 pg/mL


NOTES:

- BP Anavar blues. I have the GC/MS report showing legit. They're most accurately dosed and the highest quality of anything I've ever had tested.

- When I received the results the morning after the first dose, I was very excited and thinking this might actually work for long term use. My T/LH/FSH increased, apparently a rebound effect from the 1st dose.

- By the end of the first week, my T was still above my baseline but had dropped ~100 from the rebound. More importantly, my LH/FSH were cut in half in only 1 week and 3 doses and 150mg total of Anavar and my estrogen doubled. I'm sure these changes would eventually lead to dramatically reduced T.

- Anavar doesn't aromatize but apparently all AAS will increase the aromatization of endogenous testosterone.

- My AST/ALT and Comprehensive panel all were unaffected.

- I had good pumps in the gym and added 5kg to both my OHP and FS in this week which is more than typical. It felt like a very modest/slight edge but all I would need over the course of 1-2 years to make some dramatic gains.

- Gained 2lbs but looked noticeably leaner.

- My feeling is the result would have been very similar had I dosed every day - I'm not sure the body can differentiate time on and off with such short pulses. I'll be following up with more tests. I'm interested in 3 days on 4 days off, 1 week on 1 week off, 2 weeks on 2 weeks off, 3 & 4.


Everyone should grab blood work at privatemdlabs.com for only $51 (Menopause panel, with coupon) and get objective about their experiments. Please report back your findings so we can find the best protocols. Personally, I'm looking for a way to healthfully stay on year round (time on < time off) for moderate athletic & strength gains.

 

[RL88]

Hi,

I was planning of pulsing superdrol with the 3x/week mon, wed, fri

my stats are: height 185cm weight 82kg and age 26 been lifting weights for 6 years. Cycle history is first cycle bold200, second cycle trenavar, third cycle mithras and recent cycle methyl clostebol all have been normal straight cycles never pulsed anything before.

My question is can i run this sort of cycle whit out SERM? and also dosing recommendations would be helpful.

 

[chris223]

Hi, I was planning of pulsing superdrol with the 3x/week mon, wed, fri my stats are: height 185cm weight 82kg and age 26 been lifting weights for 6 years. Cycle history is first cycle bold200, second cycle trenavar, third cycle mithras and recent cycle methyl clostebol all have been normal straight cycles never pulsed anything before. My question is can i run this sort of cycle whit out SERM? and also dosing recommendations would be helpful.

Just run a straight cycle.

 

[djremix]

well,

try both. if both give you good results. like what happened with me

then pusling (or even switching to pulsing during a cycle) can be usefull and less side effects

 

[LegendaryCY]

Hey doc, been reading this thread for days and was trying to find some info about pulsing 50mg of anadrol eod 4 times a week. Im planning to do it for around 4 weeks or so. Will that be long enough to make some lasting gains? I just need about 5kg or so. Also, will this cycle shut me down? (Got some liv52 and nolva on hand too)

 

[Jebrook]

Hey doc, been reading this thread for days and was trying to find some info about pulsing 50mg of anadrol eod 4 times a week. Im planning to do it for around 4 weeks or so. Will that be long enough to make some lasting gains? I just need about 5kg or so. Also, will this cycle shut me down? (Got some liv52 and nolva on hand too)

The OP hasn't posted in years. This thread hasn't been active in years. Your best bet for an answer is to read through the thread (141 pages lol) or post up the question in a new thread in anabolics. Cheers.

 

[Jebrook]

Hey doc, been reading this thread for days and was trying to find some info about pulsing 50mg of anadrol eod 4 times a week. Im planning to do it for around 4 weeks or so. Will that be long enough to make some lasting gains? I just need about 5kg or so. Also, will this cycle shut me down? (Got some liv52 and nolva on hand too)

Oh, and I see you're a newbie. Welcome to AM

 

[LegendaryCY]

Aw okay then lol...and thanks fr the warm welcome!

 

[vidapreta]

I miss Dr. D

 

[yates84]

What are we trying to achieve by pulsing? Mitigate hpta interruption? Mitigate toxicity? The concept makes very little sense to me, run your cycle and dose every day. When the cycle is over pct and move on. I guess I have some reading to do in this thread because it doesn't make a lot of sense to me atm.

 

[LegendaryCY]

What are we trying to achieve by pulsing? Mitigate hpta interruption? Mitigate toxicity? The concept makes very little sense to me, run your cycle and dose every day. When the cycle is over pct and move on. I guess I have some reading to do in this thread because it doesn't make a lot of sense to me atm.

Yea the idea is to reduce toxicity and hpta suppression. Doc did raise the example of reducing hpaa suppression in pulse dosing corticosteroid and it does seem to make sense. However most of the pulse cycle experiences shared here are with superdrol dbol etc...Sounds positive but Im not sure if similar results can be derived from a harsher oral like anadrol (nt sure if its over-exaggerated but everyone's been pretty negative towards anadrol). Hopefully someone with actual experience with this method of administration can come and shed some light on the validity of this theory

 

[jonpaulevans]

Hey doc, been reading this thread for days and was trying to find some info about pulsing 50mg of anadrol eod 4 times a week. Im planning to do it for around 4 weeks or so. Will that be long enough to make some lasting gains? I just need about 5kg or so. Also, will this cycle shut me down? (Got some liv52 and nolva on hand too)

I can offer some basic info on how pulsing was approached using Epi/Havoc.
1) you use the higher end of the dosing recommendation
2) take EOD.
3) run full length - 8 weeks or so. Some have run longer.
4) have a pct even though the idea behind pulsing is it "prevents" shut down thats not entirely true. It may reduce it. We all have diff experiences.

Bottom line. Research your compound and similar.
See how others dosed it.
Run supports and have pct on hand before cycle starts (rule of thumb)

And finally...if youre going to take it no matter what - try pulsing it. Then post your experience. Were all learning.

 

[LegendaryCY]

I can offer some basic info on how pulsing was approached using Epi/Havoc.
1) you use the higher end of the dosing recommendation
2) take EOD.
3) run full length - 8 weeks or so. Some have run longer.
4) have a pct even though the idea behind pulsing is it "prevents" shut down thats not entirely true. It may reduce it. We all have diff experiences.

Bottom line. Research your compound and similar.
See how others dosed it.
Run supports and have pct on hand before cycle starts (rule of thumb)

And finally...if youre going to take it no matter what - try pulsing it. Then post your experience. Were all learning.

Pretty curious, why is it taken at a higher dose?

 

[jonpaulevans]

Pretty curious, why is it taken at a higher dose?

Really? Cmon.
Every day: 1 a day is 7 in a week
EOD: 1/ea is 3 or 4 a week.

Think, McFly.

 

[yates84]

Really? Cmon.
Every day: 1 a day is 7 in a week
EOD: 1/ea is 3 or 4 a week.

Think, McFly.

Doesn't that completely defeat the purpose of pulsing? What's the difference if I dose 20mg ed or 40mg eod? I think the man's question was pretty valid.

 

[Jebrook]

Pretty curious, why is it taken at a higher dose?

I believe the theory is that that you can reap more acute workout intensity and recovery benefits on training days with the high dose, yet limit toxicity and suppression by spiking the steroid levels at key times rather than maintaining a stable level constantly. I do believe this would lessen toxicity. But I'm not convinced it would truly lessen suppression. I've never tried it though. I know some guys who have. Their results from their runs were not as significant as a traditional cycle. I think the spiked hormone levels would lead to a hormonal roller coaster. My guess is that it's a trade-off. Less gains but maybe better on the body.

 

[ironranger]

The OP hasn't posted in years. This thread hasn't been active in years. Your best bet for an answer is to read through the thread (141 pages lol) or post up the question in a new thread in anabolics. Cheers.

I remember this thread from years ago lol, went on for eternity
DR.D still calls in from time to time, pm him...very knowledgeable, helpful guy

 

[LegendaryCY]

I remember this thread from years ago lol, went on for eternity
DR.D still calls in from time to time, pm him...very knowledgeable, helpful guy

Haha I tried but was prompted that I need 50posts to pm him

 

[Jebrook]

Haha I tried but was prompted that I need 50posts to pm him

DR.D. Paging DR.D! Maybe he gets push notes for tags. There you go buddy.

 

[LegendaryCY]

DR.D. Paging DR.D! Maybe he gets push notes for tags. There you go buddy.

Thanks! Hopefullt he'll be able to c it haha

 

[jonpaulevans]

I believe the theory is that that you can reap more acute workout intensity and recovery benefits on training days with the high dose, yet limit toxicity and suppression by spiking the steroid levels at key times rather than maintaining a stable level constantly. I do believe this would lessen toxicity. But I'm not convinced it would truly lessen suppression. I've never tried it though. I know some guys who have. Their results from their runs were not as significant as a traditional cycle. I think the spiked hormone levels would lead to a hormonal roller coaster. My guess is that it's a trade-off. Less gains but maybe better on the body.

Great answer. Maximum benefit with minimizing sides. It is about the sustained level vs fluctuating. Pulsing reduces REDUCES! shutdown bc eod your body has to do it on its own.
Above all. When doing orals you are really kicking your livers ass. So if no other reason, pulse to give your liver a break.
You can still take the weekly or 8 week total dose, just divide it into eod doses.

 

[jonpaulevans]

Doesn't that completely defeat the purpose of pulsing? What's the difference if I dose 20mg ed or 40mg eod? I think the man's question was pretty valid.

Every day our body hits peaks and valleys in hormones. Eod we spike our test extra high.
Pulsing is economical.
Also, most of us train eod on bulking phases so pulsing fits in nicely.

 

[yates84]

Every day our body hits peaks and valleys in hormones. Eod we spike our test extra high.
Pulsing is economical.
Also, most of us train eod on bulking phases so pulsing fits in nicely.

I'm riding long esters e3d so not an issue for me. Maybe this is an economical way to dose harsher orals like sd or m1t but I prefer more mild orals and don't see this being a good option for that application. I still foresee hpta suppression being on par with ed dosing. I'm glad this works out for you and appreciate the deeper explanation for this method.

 

[Dma378]

Every day our body hits peaks and valleys in hormones. Eod we spike our test extra high.
Pulsing is economical.
Also, most of us train eod on bulking phases so pulsing fits in nicely.

Any idea how it would work for someone who trained 5 consecutive days per week? (Mon-Fri)

Would a single high dose per day for 5 consecutive days also reduce toxicity? Not concerned about the shutdown aspect as I'll always use Test.

My last ph run was unpleasant as I was unable to get my BP under control. Someone recommended pulsing, just not sure 5 days in a row is still considered pulsing.

 

[jonpaulevans]

I went with:
On: mon. Tue
Off: wed
On: thur. Fri
Off: sat. Sun
Was too much for me.
Just do eod and lift as you always would. Remember, it isnt as much about what you do in the gym its what you and your body do out of it. Rest. Eat right. Supplement.

 

[jonpaulevans]

In fact. My theory to on cycle lifting is higher volume not higher intensity.

 

[B5150]

It's all theory! The suppression, the toxicity, the anabolism, the recovery...all of it. None of it is supported by data unless you run bloods before, during day by day or week by week and after on all bio parameters.

If you are afraid to run orals but do t have the bloodwork to support your fear your fear is unmerited. If you have run orals and you have run blood work that confirms it than your fear is merited. It's safe to say without blood it's going to be hard but without blood you're only guessing how it will effect you.

(Edit: I've good bloodwork from beta testing Superdrol where my liver enzymes actually improved a couple points with using 50mg of it with only 600mg ALA and 1200mg of NAC)

If you are looking to pulse hoping to gain what you can from it and reduces the hit on bio parameters the only way to determine if it is effective and reduces the hit on your bio parameters is to run it and then test your blood before during and after the process.

Then you can compare straight cycle blood to pulse blood to prove the benefits and effectiveness.

Anything else is mental masturbation IMHO.

 

[vidapreta]

Anything else is mental masturbation IMHO.

Does mental masturbation, lead to a mental orgasm?

 

[jonpaulevans]

It is a lot of theory. But with solid fundamental reasoning. I think to go along with DAVID DUNN'S post anyone about to go on cycle needs to be honest with themselves and prepare for negatives. Even with pulsing Havoc - a notable safe compound - i had shut down, sone hair loss and have slight gyno 4 years after 3 pulse cycles. I ran all supports and PCT too. I will say this though. I believe my gyno came from DAA which i took weeks after my last havoc cycle. Thats when gyno started to appear. Anyway. Point is, take all the precautions, but be willing to suffer sides. Nobody on here can promise you anything but we can share our experiences.

 

[B5150]

Does mental masturbation, lead to a mental orgasm?

It can and often does. Depending upon ones control one can go for hours (much evidence here that many fit that category) in some cases. Ultimately, the ultimate goal of a happy ending can be achieved, which will require a sandwich (which - being a masturbater - require one make it for one's self) and a nap.

 

[B5150]

It is a lot of theory. But with solid fundamental reasoning. I think to go along with DAVID DUNN'S post anyone about to go on cycle needs to be honest with themselves and prepare for negatives. Even with pulsing Havoc - a notable safe compound - i had shut down, sone hair loss and have slight gyno 4 years after 3 pulse cycles. I ran all supports and PCT too. I will say this though. I believe my gyno came from DAA which i took weeks after my last havoc cycle. Thats when gyno started to appear. Anyway. Point is, take all the precautions, but be willing to suffer sides. Nobody on here can promise you anything but we can share our experiences.

It is ALL theoretical. The reasoning is speculative and inconclusive. Only blood work will confirm whether the reasoning is indeed logical. Otherwise I agree with what you've shared thus far FWIW.

Please note that anecdotal "experiences" still does no not confirm the theory and still leaves it all pure speculation without any evidence otherwise.

BTW - I am a fond practitioner of pulsing for anti-hypertension intentions. With max dosing and half life it is ultimately unavoidable. But for me it delays the onset by maybe 30-40%.

 

[Dma378]

How to &quot;pulse&quot; orals

It is ALL theoretical. The reasoning is speculative and inconclusive. Only blood work will confirm whether the reasoning is indeed logical. Otherwise I agree with what you've shared thus far FWIW.

Please note that anecdotal "experiences" still does no not confirm the theory and still leaves it all pure speculation without any evidence otherwise.

BTW - I am a fond practitioner of pulsing for anti-hypertension intentions. With max dosing and half life it is ultimately unavoidable. But for me it delays the onset by maybe 30-40%.

Last paragraph is the perfect bit of experience I needed to hear.
It is the one side that I'm looking for a bit of relief. The toxicity and shut down are not concerns for myself. I'm always "shut down"

 

[B5150]

Last paragraph is the perfect bit of experience I needed to hear.
It is the one side that I'm looking for a bit of relief. The toxicity and shut down are not concerns for myself. I'm always "shut down"

Me too. It is a catch 22 situation.

Using max dosing pulsing brings it on, and likely more quickly, but not quite as noticeable as static dosing. There's peaks and valleys because of the pulsing. So you don't notice the sustained hypertension. I take a break from max dosing on weekends with a low dose just to not have the half life fully wash out. I'll start up again after the weekend. Usually after 2 weeks and on the second weekend's break to low dose I'll notice the drop in hypertension and it indicates to me that its creeping up on me. By mid third week...I'm done. Not because I cant handle it but because of my desire to preserve my health.

So in mathematical terms the increase of 30-40% is an actual increase from 2 weeks (14 day) to almost 3 weeks (18-20 days) when I experience the unwanted side. The compound in question is notorious for rapid hypertension. With this compound it is really unavoidable but it is very effective in that short duration. I usually take equal time off and repeat once, maybe twice, and be done with it.

 

[LegendaryCY]

Me too. It is a catch 22 situation.

Using max dosing pulsing brings it on, and likely more quickly, but not quite as noticeable as static dosing. There's peaks and valleys because of the pulsing. So you don't notice the sustained hypertension. I take a break from max dosing on weekends with a low dose just to not have the half life fully wash out. I'll start up again after the weekend. Usually after 2 weeks and on the second weekend's break to low dose I'll notice the drop in hypertension and it indicates to me that its creeping up on me. By mid third week...I'm done. Not because I cant handle it but because of my desire to preserve my health.

So in mathematical terms the increase of 30-40% is an actual increase from 2 weeks (14 day) to almost 3 weeks (18-20 days) when I experience the unwanted side. The compound in question is notorious for rapid hypertension. With this compound it is really unavoidable but it is very effective in that short duration. I usually take equal time off and repeat once, maybe twice, and be done with it.

What about the shut downs? Is it delayed?

 

[B5150]

What about the shut downs? Is it delayed?

I'm shut down on TRT.

 

[vidapreta]

I'm shut down on TRT.

Start taking some Tribulus

 

[B5150]

Start taking some Tribulus

Why would I do something like that?

 

[jonpaulevans]

I'm shut down on TRT.

Any regrets from going that route? What age did you start it?

 

[B5150]

Any regrets from going that route? What age did you start it?

Going that route? I don't follow. I was 43 yrs old with classic symptoms and clinical diagnosis of hypogonadism that were and still are remedied as a result. It was not a result of steroid use or abuse. No regrets at all.

 

[vidapreta]

Why would I do something like that?

It's what Arnold used to win his many Mr. Olympias.. lol

 

[jonpaulevans]

Going that route? I don't follow. I was 43 yrs old with classic symptoms and clinical diagnosis of hypogonadism that were and still are remedied as a result. It was not a result of steroid use or abuse. No regrets at all.

Ok so it wasnt just a choice to help you feel more youthful. Many ppl choose hormone replacement therapy for simple vitality. My dad however has started it after a triple bypass so i understand the many reasons to start it. Im 36 and think about doing it. I just dont know what it would be like having to rely on the treatment for the rest of my life. Anything im saying incorrect?

 

[jonpaulevans]

It's what Arnold used to win his many Mr. Olympias.. lol

I believe his form of shutdown is an anticipated byproduct of his medical treatment. In other words its chronic not acute. He may comment and correct me.

He almost certainly knows what tribulus is.

 

[B5150]

Ok so it wasnt just a choice to help you feel more youthful. Many ppl choose hormone replacement therapy for simple vitality. My dad however has started it after a triple bypass so i understand the many reasons to start it. Im 36 and think about doing it. I just dont know what it would be like having to rely on the treatment for the rest of my life. Anything im saying incorrect?

I don't have to rely on it but the quality of life I have has improved in many markers. I imagine they may not be once the depression and declining body composition and libido return and further advance with age. Vitality is a bonus but for me it was a depression matter, as it was a cure for things that anti-depression treatment medications would not remedy. I guess the absence of those is the definition of vitality?

 

[vidapreta]

I believe his form of shutdown is an anticipated byproduct of his medical treatment. In other words its chronic not acute. He may comment and correct me.

He almost certainly knows what tribulus is.

Yes.... it's called a joke

 

[jonpaulevans]

I don't have to rely on it but the quality of life I have has improved in many markers. I imagine they may not be once the depression and declining body composition and libido return and further advance with age. Vitality is a bonus but for me it was a depression matter, as it was a cure for things that anti-depression treatment medications would not remedy. I guess the absence of those is the definition of vitality?

I dont want to get too off topic of the thread but i want to know more. Especially in regards to treating depression. If you have time please pm me some links on the topic. Maybe i can find a thread on here too.