Building Back Up

Weight: 212.0

New low! This is after a weekend with 2 large meals (unsure of how high the calories were though, since neither were full on pizza-type binges).
 
Congrats man, really impressed with the current progress. You seem to be pretty lock in.
 
Weight: 212.0

2 more days to hit another new low, but 5 hours sleep from the calorie deficit is wrecking me.

Also, I’ve been dealing with some forearm pain down the line where the biceps ties in towards the wrist. It’s been going on on and off for months, but here recently pretty consistent and completely prevents any type of curls. Pull ups and rows only marginally aggravate it so I can work through those.
Either the Brachioradialis or something under it.
 
Hey, new low, so crongrats there. You never know, this could be what you need to see a bit of a whoosh after, dropping you into newer lows. Sometimes it works it that way.
 
MrKleen73 said:
Hey, new low, so crongrats there. You never know, this could be what you need to see a bit of a whoosh after, dropping you into newer lows. Sometimes it works it that way.
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Actually, that’s exactly what happened Sunday morning. I’ve been eating 2500 kcal most days, Saturday I ate 3k, and woke up lighter Sunday. It’s not the first time I’ve noticed this. Does it have something to do with leptin?
 
GreenMachineX said:
Actually, that’s exactly what happened Sunday morning. I’ve been eating 2500 kcal most days, Saturday I ate 3k, and woke up lighter Sunday. It’s not the first time I’ve noticed this. Does it have something to do with leptin?
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I don't think leptin so much as stress / cortisol levels dropping from the body relaxing a bit that it finally got calories instead of being in a perceived state of emergency due to the forced deficit. Leptin is more of a metabolism reset kind of thing when it gets lower the metabolism goes down and a surplus of calories and more specifically carbs increase leptin levels which tells the body it isn't starving or in danger of starving and it is safe to increase the metabolism. Similar cause, but a different effect. The leptin helps burn more fat again, the whoosh is more water based weight.
 
MrKleen73 said:
I don't think leptin so much as stress / cortisol levels dropping from the body relaxing a bit that it finally got calories instead of being in a perceived state of emergency due to the forced deficit. Leptin is more of a metabolism reset kind of thing when it gets lower the metabolism goes down and a surplus of calories and more specifically carbs increase leptin levels which tells the body it isn't starving or in danger of starving and it is safe to increase the metabolism. Similar cause, but a different effect. The leptin helps burn more fat again, the whoosh is more water based weight.
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Gotcha. Sounds good.
 
Weight: 212.8 (if I recall correctly)

Switched from 1cc insulin syringes to .5cc insulin syringes for my daily test cyp shots, and made a dumb mistake today and did a double dose. Dumb mistake; hope I don’t get any sides from it.

Will be eating closer to maintenance to circumvent any additional anxiety or whatever from the mistake.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Dumb mistake; hope I don’t get any sides from it.
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do you have some good methods of meditation to help alleviate when your brain is maybe over thinking things like this? I think you and I share a trait of hypersensitive mental acuity on things like anxiety. It doesn't mean that that anxiety isn't real, only that sometimes I think you and I both are similar in that being aware of a "slight" change, can create anxiousness that > then creates the anxiety that maybe never would have unfolded if our brain wasn't already over thinking it. know what I mean? I say that with all humbleness since I myself have been in the ER with a simple panic attack many moons ago. so differentiating a real issue from one that my mind is creating is a challenging skill at times.
 
Dustin07 said:
do you have some good methods of meditation to help alleviate when your brain is maybe over thinking things like this? I think you and I share a trait of hypersensitive mental acuity on things like anxiety. It doesn't mean that that anxiety isn't real, only that sometimes I think you and I both are similar in that being aware of a "slight" change, can create anxiousness that > then creates the anxiety that maybe never would have unfolded if our brain wasn't already over thinking it. know what I mean? I say that with all humbleness since I myself have been in the ER with a simple panic attack many moons ago. so differentiating a real issue from one that my mind is creating is a challenging skill at times.
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I have attempted prayer/meditation many times, unsuccessfully. But you hit the nail on the head…the “awareness” is a blessing and a curse, but moreso a curse. I’ve been to the ER with simple panic attacks several times but it’s been 3 years since the last one for the same thing (testosterone induced panic). I’m in a better place than I was back then for sure though.

And yes, differentiation of a real issue vs. my mind is a battle.
 
GreenMachineX said:
I have attempted prayer/meditation many times, unsuccessfully. But you hit the nail on the head…the “awareness” is a blessing and a curse, but moreso a curse. I’ve been to the ER with simple panic attacks several times but it’s been 3 years since the last one for the same thing (testosterone induced panic). I’m in a better place than I was back then for sure though.

And yes, differentiation of a real issue vs. my mind is a battle.
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knocking out one of my morning walks the other day a wasp flew down the back of my damn shirt. I had an undershirt on, then my button down dress shirt, he got under both and stung my trap. I couldn't find it anywhere but I knew what happened. got back to office took off shirt in bathroom, swollen already size of a quarter. threw down antihistimine and ibuprofen. each year I react to them a little worse (one year one stung my knee, my wife didn't take it serious until the next day when it started getting veiny and super itchy) my dad is deathly allergic and has been in the hospital after numerous bee stings. so I had all those things in my head and I could feel my brain doing that stupid thing so I turned on some angry rock and did what I could to distract myself until it passed... I was totally fine, but I 100% understand how once the body has accepted panic or anxiety in the past, it can rear it's ugly head sometimes and you have to out muscle it our out calm it. I find out muscling and fighting back works best for me.
 
Dustin07 said:
knocking out one of my morning walks the other day a wasp flew down the back of my damn shirt. I had an undershirt on, then my button down dress shirt, he got under both and stung my trap. I couldn't find it anywhere but I knew what happened. got back to office took off shirt in bathroom, swollen already size of a quarter. threw down antihistimine and ibuprofen. each year I react to them a little worse (one year one stung my knee, my wife didn't take it serious until the next day when it started getting veiny and super itchy) my dad is deathly allergic and has been in the hospital after numerous bee stings. so I had all those things in my head and I could feel my brain doing that stupid thing so I turned on some angry rock and did what I could to distract myself until it passed... I was totally fine, but I 100% understand how once the body has accepted panic or anxiety in the past, it can rear it's ugly head sometimes and you have to out muscle it our out calm it. I find out muscling and fighting back works best for me.
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That’s how I attempted muscling through the fear of flying and heights on vacation in EU. We did lots and things that tested my fear of heights and it was exhilarating and hellish at the same time. This is different though…there’s no upside here lol
 
the upside is you don't feel like you're dying lol. I haven't had a bad attack in many years now, like circa 2016 but I remember when I didn't know what they were, experiencing them for the first time, they'd knock me TF OUT for like 4hrs. once I fell asleep my body was TRASHED for hours.
 
Dustin07 said:
the upside is you don't feel like you're dying lol. I haven't had a bad attack in many years now, like circa 2016 but I remember when I didn't know what they were, experiencing them for the first time, they'd knock me TF OUT for like 4hrs. once I fell asleep my body was TRASHED for hours.
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Well, that’s the thing here…that last time I went to the ER for a test induced panic attack, it was started about 12 hours after the dose of this same level…but this time I do have lunesta which actually really helps with night time anxiety.
 
Weight: 212.0

Slept great with 2800 kcal. And like it should be, one 2x dose of test didn’t matter. Phew.

Might stay around 2700-2800 kcal for a couple days though with the increase in cardio I’ve been doing.
 
This is my breakfast the past few days. I feel so much better throughout the day so far eating this much and less hungry in the evening. It’s a lot of fat though 😂
IMG_3933.webp
Edited : see below for updated and more accurate breakfast foods and macros. Made a mistake here.
 
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My wife has the same situation with her anxiety, she notices it then gets anxious about how bad it might be compaounding how bad it is. It is a vicious cycle when she gets in it. Often I can help her by just going to her and giving her a really long tight hug. Sometimes she doesn't even realize she needs it but then will just melt into me after a few seconds, and start to relax. Sometimes having a person who means something to you and that you really trust just come and hold you is enough.

So I guess what I am saying is it sounds like maybe you just need a big hug from me! ;)
 
GreenMachineX said:
This is my breakfast the past few days. I feel so much better throughout the day so far eating this much and less hungry in the evening. It’s a lot of fat though 😂View attachment 252100
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so whats the actual food? LOL
basically it sounds like you struggle most with sleep when you simply don't eat enough?


MrKleen73 said:
My wife has the same situation with her anxiety, she notices it then gets anxious about how bad it might be compaounding how bad it is. It is a vicious cycle when she gets in it. Often I can help her by just going to her and giving her a really long tight hug. Sometimes she doesn't even realize she needs it but then will just melt into me after a few seconds, and start to relax. Sometimes having a person who means something to you and that you really trust just come and hold you is enough.

So I guess what I am saying is it sounds like maybe you just need a big hug from me! ;)
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you might have to go into business, you can get people off their anxiety meds with a good 'ol bear hug!! haha.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Weight: 211.4

Matched my previous low, 2 days to hit a new low before next planned “large” meal. Easy.
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Weight: 211.4 again today. Surprised since I hit a lot of steps overall, 30 minutes incline walking plus workout. But, scale battery died so unsure how much of dinner I actually ate. I should hit a new low tomorrow though.
 
Weight: 211.6

Didn’t hit a new low this week after all, oddly enough. Oh well. Weekly cheat/large meal tonight then back on tomorrow. Wont be a gorge though.
 
Trying something different this week. The goal is push/pull/repeat as often as I can. If I can do that 6 days in a row, that’ll be great. It’s what I attempted to do many years ago but never successfully did it mostly due to not appropriate nutrition and low T. I was remotivated to try it because I’m bored of what I’m doing now and read this:
www.scribd.com

Best Damn Workout for Natural Lifters | PDF | Physical Exercise | Sports

This document provides a training plan and guidelines for natural bodybuilders. It recommends a push/pull split training each muscle group 3 times per week. Workouts should consist of low volume with 2 warm-up sets and 1 high-intensity set using techniques like rest-pause, drop sets, or...
www.scribd.com www.scribd.com

Today’s WO as an example:

Low Incline DB Press 3 x 7 x 70’s
Leg Press 1 hard set
ROC-It OHP 3 x 8 x 198
EZ Upright Row 3 x 8 x 60
Cable Pressdowns 3 x 8 x 49

30 minutes incline walk.

Didn’t push the weights too hard so I could see how recovered I am in 48 hours to hit the same muscles again.

Pull WO tomorrow.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Trying something different this week. The goal is push/pull/repeat as often as I can. If I can do that 6 days in a row, that’ll be great. It’s what I attempted to do many years ago but never successfully did it mostly due to not appropriate nutrition and low T. I was remotivated to try it because I’m bored of what I’m doing now and read this:
www.scribd.com

Best Damn Workout for Natural Lifters | PDF | Physical Exercise | Sports

This document provides a training plan and guidelines for natural bodybuilders. It recommends a push/pull split training each muscle group 3 times per week. Workouts should consist of low volume with 2 warm-up sets and 1 high-intensity set using techniques like rest-pause, drop sets, or...
www.scribd.com www.scribd.com

Today’s WO as an example:

Low Incline DB Press 3 x 7 x 70’s
Leg Press 1 hard set
ROC-It OHP 3 x 8 x 198
EZ Upright Row 3 x 8 x 60
Cable Pressdowns 3 x 8 x 49

30 minutes incline walk.

Didn’t push the weights too hard so I could see how recovered I am in 48 hours to hit the same muscles again.

Pull WO tomorrow.
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Alternate train of thought: complete sessions as often as you can, but start by increasing your training days per week by 1 for a week or 2 before going up to 6/wk. Gives you a better chance of adapting than an immediate all-or-nothing.

Most people think about training as all or nothing, while in reality it’s usually finding the optimal dose for you.
 
Plus it adds more points of adaptation on the way to 6 times a week. Nott only could you hit a wall going for 6 at first, but you could skip right over the intermediate adaptation points and have to work twice as hard for the same gains the whole time which is more wear and tear. You could think of it as a meso of sorts, start with 4 days, then add a day 1-2 weeks later, then another 1-2 weeks later finally getting to 6, deload and start back over at 4 with heavier weights but less overall volume throughout the week and work back up to 6 days for a week or two. You might find 6 is too much but 5 is perfect to cap it off at, or that you can only do 4 without your injuries starting to bother you.
 
MrKleen73 said:
Plus it adds more points of adaptation on the way to 6 times a week. Nott only could you hit a wall going for 6 at first, but you could skip right over the intermediate adaptation points and have to work twice as hard for the same gains the whole time which is more wear and tear. You could think of it as a meso of sorts, start with 4 days, then add a day 1-2 weeks later, then another 1-2 weeks later finally getting to 6, deload and start back over at 4 with heavier weights but less overall volume throughout the week and work back up to 6 days for a week or two. You might find 6 is too much but 5 is perfect to cap it off at, or that you can only do 4 without your injuries starting to bother you.
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Well, I’m already hitting everything twice per week with 4 workouts per week, so I’m trying to bump to 3 times per week per muscle. Any thoughts?
 
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GreenMachineX said:
Any thoughts?
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2 a days 😂

honestly though I mean, there are so many schools of thought. Recovery periods, "over training", under training. PEDs, no PEDs. I'm trying to follow Cutlers split right now because I think I'm getting acute results in development, hypertrophy, definition. I'm NOT adding strength, in fact I'm down.

But for a hypertrophy block, I'm loving the results. But even with a very mindful split, without incorporating 2 a days I don't see how I could reach 3 x's per week unless you include accessory type stuff. for instance, my arms day is separate from my back (biceps) and chest (tricep) days, so there indirect work those days. this is what I'm doing. also Jay says he doesn't train traps anymore, but I still like throwing them in.

  • Day 2: Triceps and Biceps
  • Day 3: Back
  • Day 4: Rest Day
  • Day 5: Shoulders and Traps
  • Day 6: Quads, Hamstrings, and Calves
  • Day 7: Rest Day

I was working deadlifts and biceps on my back day because it seemed like an effecient way to center focus on strength (deadlift) and get my bicep/back work in. That's now two completely different days and my lats and arms have both grown more since changing to this new split.

My assumption is at end of summer I'll shift back to a strength cycle but for now I'm really really enjoying this.
 
Dustin07 said:
2 a days 😂

honestly though I mean, there are so many schools of thought. Recovery periods, "over training", under training. PEDs, no PEDs. I'm trying to follow Cutlers split right now because I think I'm getting acute results in development, hypertrophy, definition. I'm NOT adding strength, in fact I'm down.

But for a hypertrophy block, I'm loving the results. But even with a very mindful split, without incorporating 2 a days I don't see how I could reach 3 x's per week unless you include accessory type stuff. for instance, my arms day is separate from my back (biceps) and chest (tricep) days, so there indirect work those days. this is what I'm doing. also Jay says he doesn't train traps anymore, but I still like throwing them in.

  • Day 2: Triceps and Biceps
  • Day 3: Back
  • Day 4: Rest Day
  • Day 5: Shoulders and Traps
  • Day 6: Quads, Hamstrings, and Calves
  • Day 7: Rest Day

I was working deadlifts and biceps on my back day because it seemed like an effecient way to center focus on strength (deadlift) and get my bicep/back work in. That's now two completely different days and my lats and arms have both grown more since changing to this new split.

My assumption is at end of summer I'll shift back to a strength cycle but for now I'm really really enjoying this.
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Gotcha. Did you look at the link I shared?

The layout looks like this:
Day 1: chest, shoulders, quads, tris
Day 1: lats, hamstrings, traps, rear delts, bis

1 exercise per body part, alternate every day. In theory it should work for 6 days in a row, because the total number of sets would only average 10 per week of each body part. I’ll use different exercises each workout…different angles or focus.

Because my personal recovery is so poor, I’m not sure how it will play out, but I’m going to see. It would probably be better to try to implement this when my kcal are higher though.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Gotcha. Did you look at the link I shared?
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to the best of my ability, it was sorta messy and kept blurring wanting me to unlock the document
GreenMachineX said:
Because my personal recovery is so poor, I’m not sure how it will play out, but I’m going to see.
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I think that's going to be key for you. this approach I dont' think would work for me because despite what Christian says, the volume is just way too low for me. We always separate natty lifting from enhanced but even when you really dig into the enhanced lifters and natty lifters nuances there are still very independent requirements and needs. Layne's PHAT routine of course is another one that is designed around a natural lifter (Layne).

I also don't really understand what his goal is here, just general health? aesthetics? size? strength?

1747752766687.webp
 
Dustin07 said:
to the best of my ability, it was sorta messy and kept blurring wanting me to unlock the document


I think that's going to be key for you. this approach I dont' think would work for me because despite what Christian says, the volume is just way too low for me. We always separate natty lifting from enhanced but even when you really dig into the enhanced lifters and natty lifters nuances there are still very independent requirements and needs. Layne's PHAT routine of course is another one that is designed around a natural lifter (Layne).

I also don't really understand what his goal is here, just general health? aesthetics? size? strength?

View attachment 252198
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12 sets per week per muscle would be too little for you?

The goal is hypertrophy. He has another separate program for strength (and a separate high volume program for people who love volume).

I think the ideas are sound, but it’s one of those things…we’ve all watched Arnold hit chest for 40 sets per week, so…that’s what we all want to achieve, so none of us ever try high frequency (medium volume). It’s obviously working for the Stronger By Science crew and guys like Jeff Nippard, granted, both of their programs have more total volume than Christian’s, but the high frequency principle is still the same.
 
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Today’s WO:

NG Pull-ups 4x4
Romanian Rack Pull Top Set 4x315
BB Shrugs 8x135, 6x155, 6x165
Machine Preacher Curl 3 x 10 x ?

I do like reduction in workout time, if I’m going to do cardio that is. If for nothing else, this experiment will hopefully get me refueled for the next bigger volume push.
 
GreenMachineX said:
12 sets per week per muscle would be too little for you?
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It wouldn't be enough in a single session for me. I had 17 bicep sets on this session last week, not including the tricep work. and it killed me that I didn't break 20 that day but ran out of time. It was a fantastic session, arms were yoked, veiny, strong, pumped and growing. I have felt like a fool for the past year as I tried doubling down on my arms work but for the first time in my life I actually feel like my arms have grown tremendously well.

Dustin07

Post in thread 'Slicin' and Dicin''

Seated incline DB curls
3 x 15 x 25s

SS with DB skull crushers
3 x 15 x 25s

Preacher DB curls
12 x 27.5s, 30s
10 x 30s
+ 15 x 25s dropset

OH cable ext
20 x 35, 42.5, 50
+ 20 x 30lb dropset

Ez bar
10 x 70, 90, 100
  • 12 x 70 dropset
  • 15 x 50 second dropset

SS with H/S dips
15 x +180, +200,
10 x +230, +280, +320
  • 10 x +270 dropset
  • 10 x + 180 immediate dropset
  • 15 x +90 third immediate dropset.

Rope cable pushdowns
5 x 20

SS with single arm cable curls
5 x 12-15
  • Like


GreenMachineX said:
we’ve all watched Arnold hit chest for 40 sets per week,
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yeah in his documentary we said his goal was 20 sets per session on whatever body part he was targeting. but we know two truths: Arnold lied a LOT so who knows... and enhanced lifters can recover better.

Still, Layne was one of those that said he didnt see massive arm improvement until against his better judgement, he increased volume substantially. My arms grew like crazy when I added volume and when I look over the past 10 years of work, my legs were way thicker when I was 10lbs lighter squatting nearly every single day but my dealdift and squat PR were both 50-100lbs lower.

Thats why I think we can look at basic truths like "enhanced lifters recover better", volume vs lower volume etc and each athlete has to figure out their solution. My son can likely outsquat me for 1rm now, and my buddy is is hitting 500lbs but neither of them can get more reps at 225 than I can, and my arms, shoulders, chest etc are far bigger. they simply can't hang with me on volume. they are stronger, and I'm building more lean mass through volume.
 
Weight: 212.4

Decided doing the every day plan as the PEM has been nasty for the past few days. Might stick with the reduced volume though and build back up.
 
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