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Gyno Surgery (Pre-Op Questions & Post Op Results)

I guess I don’t understand why you would train forearms 5 days per week. That’s not enough time for the muscles or grip to recover. Who has bigger forearms - a mechanic who uses them every day at work, or a strongman who uses them hard about 3 days per week?

I was a mechanic for nearly 5 years and my forearms did improve, but not nearly as much as when I began spending time holding heavier objects for strongman while working a career in IT.
 
The RP plans for progression are sound, will you be deloading at the end of the 4 weeks?

I also agree with @Hyde holding heavy things is going to get that grip and forearm taken care of. You can add some direct brachialis work in like reverse curls or whatever but gripping heavy stuff is how you get a stronger grip, and larger forearms. I don't think it needs to be more than a few times a week. You don't want minor soreness of lack of recovery causing your grip to be the failing point on your other training either, which is more likely with too frequent of training.
 
MrKleen73 said:
The RP plans for progression are sound, will you be deloading at the end of the 4 weeks?

I also agree with @Hyde holding heavy things is going to get that grip and forearm taken care of. You can add some direct brachialis work in like reverse curls or whatever but gripping heavy stuff is how you get a stronger grip, and larger forearms. I don't think it needs to be more than a few times a week. You don't want minor soreness of lack of recovery causing your grip to be the failing point on your other training either, which is more likely with too frequent of training.
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Hammercurls and reverse curls with an axle/fat grip are #1 size builders for me, and Farmers walks or any work with a sandbag or doing your free weights with fat gripz are all great things.

The big thing is you aren’t going to be able to ever progress these in any fashion if the muscle never rests enough. It’s like people who think that squatting every day is the optimal answer to either a maximal squat or leg size; it’s not for either because it is limited by recovery that could easily be remedied with eod training instead.

Mikereyn513 said:
I'm single so I workout my forearms more than I want to
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I’m married with a toddler and take gear, so I feel you We have each other, but having energy & time when we both aren’t working and the kids aren’t underfoot can be a tough thing to line up!
 
Hyde said:
I guess I don’t understand why you would train forearms 5 days per week. That’s not enough time for the muscles or grip to recover. Who has bigger forearms - a mechanic who uses them every day at work, or a strongman who uses them hard about 3 days per week?

I was a mechanic for nearly 5 years and my forearms did improve, but not nearly as much as when I began spending time holding heavier objects for strongman while working a career in IT.
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MrKleen73 said:
I also agree with @Hyde holding heavy things is going to get that grip and forearm taken care of. You can add some direct brachialis work in like reverse curls or whatever but gripping heavy stuff is how you get a stronger grip, and larger forearms. I don't think it needs to be more than a few times a week. You don't want minor soreness of lack of recovery causing your grip to be the failing point on your other training either, which is more likely with too frequent of training.
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Regarding the forearms, I basically neglected them this whole last year of training. Like I occasionally lifted heavy (mostly barbell shrugs, and some light deadlifting), but I typically don't lift very heavy because I've never been really strong and overall strength has never been my focus. I'm perfectly content with being fake-strong, which probably doesn't make sense to most of you guys but it's just part of who I've grown to be I suppose. So getting forearm progress from lifting heavy stuff probably won't pan out for me the way it does for guys who are trying to progress in strength and strongman comps.

So the 5 times a week strategy was designed with the intent of working different parts of the forearms throughout the week, so each small muscle group, theoretically, should have sufficient time to recover before it is worked again. It's not the same two exercises each and every day.

If cutting the forearm training down to 2 or 3 times a week would be a better idea, considering what I said above, I certainly could be easily convinced to give that a try (if only to reduce the overall workout length because my biggest concerns right now are possible overtraining, and spending so much time in the garage that I end up frustrating the family). I don't want to neglect my forearms this year, but I hesitate to think that the amount of weight that I'm lifting will be sufficient to make real progress on them.

MrKleen73 said:
The RP plans for progression are sound, will you be deloading at the end of the 4 weeks?
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Yeah, each mesocycle will deload back to the week 1 plan, after week 4 (so on week 4 I'll be doing anywhere from 2-5 sets with zero reps in reserve, and the following week I'll drop everything back to 2 sets with 3 RIR, but theoretically the weights will be heavier than the previous week's starting point).
 
Yeah, you really shouldn’t train forearms 5 times a week, even with hitting different parts. I used to arm wrestle, and would train forearms only twice a week, but I didn’t use straps on pull exercises like deadlifts, rows, pull-ups etc., and developed really strong forearms. You would be surprised what can be accomplished with just a couple days a week hitting forearms directly, and then how well the indirect work from a good workout will build them.
 
As far as forearm training goes, I would look at which exercises you have that give the most bang for the buck and use those in 2-3 sessions. Hammer Curls are always nice, but can be done as part of the arm workout, kind of killing two birds with one stone there. They do a lot for upper arm size as well as the forearms. After that if you want to specialize maybe some grip work or wrist curls for the inside of the forearm, and then wrist extensions or reverse curls. Both will really get the outside of the forearm nicely. Like Hyde said if you can use fat grips it is also a game changer for the forearm work.
 
match said:
I have fat grips, a wrist roller, and grippers.
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Those fat grips should help a lot. I have never used a wrist roller long enough to give much feedback on them, and unless heavy duty grippers that are challenging to close I don't feel that grippers have ever improved my forearm size. Just a way to fidget, or get a bit of a forearm pump. I still think a heavy-ish carry, or holding a loaded barbell for time is more effective.
 
MrKleen73 said:
Those fat grips should help a lot. I have never used a wrist roller long enough to give much feedback on them, and unless heavy duty grippers that are challenging to close I don't feel that grippers have ever improved my forearm size. Just a way to fidget, or get a bit of a forearm pump. I still think a heavy-ish carry, or holding a loaded barbell for time is more effective.
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That's how I've used the fat grips so far, just load up the bar on the safety rails like I'm gonna do barbell shrugs, throw on the grips, and hold for time.
 
A lot of good tips on grip strenght and forearms here.

One cool thing we did for grip strenght in my BJJ/sub wrestling days, was to throw the gi over a pull up bar and do pull ups hanging from the gi. You could do that with a towel as well.
 
KvanH said:
A lot of good tips on grip strenght and forearms here.

One cool thing we did for grip strenght in my BJJ/sub wrestling days, was to throw the gi over a pull up bar and do pull ups hanging from the gi. You could do that with a towel as well.
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I have done these with the towel, they are pretty challenging.
 
Do not think about it in terms of absolute weight you lift; hypertrophy occurs as a necessary response when an appropriately challenging stimulus is presented.

Look at how you intend to increase your pec size - do you not have to find a way to increase weekly/total volume, load, or TUT over time? You can’t just incline bench X for 3x10 for a 1010 tempo with 150 seconds of rest between sets once a week indefinitely and expect any growth. Even if you do not care what the numbers are for incline, they are very important for progress. More sets, or reps, or lbs, or slower tempo, or greater work density must occur. You have to do more work over time to continue forcing adaptations.

You sound like you have lots of good ideas for training them, just realize that 3x a week is probably more than enough. Being able to train them hard when you do is more important than lots of easier “work”.
 
Hyde said:
Do not think about it in terms of absolute weight you lift; hypertrophy occurs as a necessary response when an appropriately challenging stimulus is presented.

Look at how you intend to increase your pec size - do you not have to find a way to increase weekly/total volume, load, or TUT over time? You can’t just incline bench X for 3x10 for a 1010 tempo with 150 seconds of rest between sets once a week indefinitely and expect any growth. Even if you do not care what the numbers are for incline, they are very important for progress. More sets, or reps, or lbs, or slower tempo, or greater work density must occur. You have to do more work over time to continue forcing adaptations.

You sound like you have lots of good ideas for training them, just realize that 3x a week is probably more than enough. Being able to train them hard when you do is more important than lots of easier “work”.
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Yeah, I get 100% what you're saying.

My main explanation for training forearms so often was that I'd read/heard from a few sources that forearms, being a smaller muscle group, tend to recover quickly, enabling them to be trained more frequently.

The consensus here though is that 5 times a week is excessive and will likely adversely effect recovery, thus slowing progression (if not halting it outright). I think I'd be foolish to not heed the advice I'm being given and tweek the plan for forearms a bit, which will benefit a few of the workouts in reducing their overall length. So I'll do that next opportunity I have to look things over and make the adjustment.

Really appreciate the responses guys. You've poured wisdom into me and I'll do my best to make the most of it!
 
Next follow up appointment is tomorrow afternoon. Not sure anything much will happen, they might take the tape off (incision sites each have about 3 pieces of taps on them holding the skin in place). Aside from that IDK what else they could tell me that they haven't already. Will update tomorrow afterwards with any news.
 
According to my last visit, on Monday I should be cleared to do light weight lifting with upper body (max 15 lbs).

Given that my left elbow is still sore (either when holding something laterally, or if I straighten the arm and do a pronated wrist extension), anyone have recommendations as to whether I should do some light arm work or just leave it alone for another week and see how the elbow does? I'll definitely be avoiding anything that involves pecs for at least another week, if not 2 or 3.
 
match said:
According to my last visit, on Monday I should be cleared to do light weight lifting with upper body (max 15 lbs).

Given that my left elbow is still sore (either when holding something laterally, or if I straighten the arm and do a pronated wrist extension), anyone have recommendations as to whether I should do some light arm work or just leave it alone for another week and see how the elbow does? I'll definitely be avoiding anything that involves pecs for at least another week, if not 2 or 3.
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As much as you probably don’t won’t to hear it, rest helps tendinitis. Probably a couple more weeks, but there is a point where you will want to gradually increase activity. Have you ever tried BPC 157? It really helps speed healing, especially with connective tissue and the muscle. It works great for forearms, biceps, triceps, and shoulders.
 
gphagan1 said:
As much as you probably don’t won’t to hear it, rest helps tendinitis. Probably a couple more weeks, but there is a point where you will want to gradually increase activity. Have you ever tried BPC 157? It really helps speed healing, especially with connective tissue and the muscle. It works great for forearms, biceps, triceps, and shoulders.
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I have heard it spoken of many times here, but I haven't pulled the trigger and bought any. I was hoping that 2-3 weeks would have been enough of a rest for the elbow.

I'll probably do a little research on how much to administer and buy some. I know some folks stack it with another peptide, but I can't remember which one and I won't have time to look into it for a few hours.

Would definitely be all ears for advice on dosing and any other recommended peptides/RCs (as long as nothing is potentially suppressive).
 
match said:
By this time tomorrow I should probably be just about done with the surgery and getting ready to be picked up.

Wish me luck bros!

If anyone is interested, I'll update with how things are going over the next few weeks... For science?
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I am
 
match said:
Yeah, I get 100% what you're saying.

My main explanation for training forearms so often was that I'd read/heard from a few sources that forearms, being a smaller muscle group, tend to recover quickly, enabling them to be trained more frequently.

The consensus here though is that 5 times a week is excessive and will likely adversely effect recovery, thus slowing progression (if not halting it outright). I think I'd be foolish to not heed the advice I'm being given and tweek the plan for forearms a bit, which will benefit a few of the workouts in reducing their overall length. So I'll do that next opportunity I have to look things over and make the adjustment.

Really appreciate the responses guys. You've poured wisdom into me and I'll do my best to make the most of it!
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Even if 5x a week eventually makes sense to you, you wouldn’t want or need that level of work initially. You would want to ramp up frequency slowly and assess recovery as you adapt. There’s a lot of mph between 0-100, you know?
 
djbombsquad said:
Hahha. Let me know how it goes. I’m looking my self for surgery but it’s sooooo expensive lol
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The 1 year plan.

Starting first week of the new year put $100 a week into a savings. At the end of the year $5200 is waiting for your surgery. Or if for somehow you can convince your Dr. That the gyno is from puberty you might be able to get insurance to cover it, but it's a tough one
 
Hyde said:
Even if 5x a week eventually makes sense to you, you wouldn’t want or need that level of work initially. You would want to ramp up frequency slowly and assess recovery as you adapt. There’s a lot of mph between 0-100, you know?
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This was also my exact point on starting out with a lot of volume going back into training for hypertrophy overall.
 
Smont said:
The 1 year plan.

Starting first week of the new year put $100 a week into a savings. At the end of the year $5200 is waiting for your surgery. Or if for somehow you can convince your Dr. That the gyno is from puberty you might be able to get insurance to cover it, but it's a tough one
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Can I do cryo laser therapy on my gyno vs my chest as a whole. ?
 
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I always see ads for cryo for fat reduction like for stomach chest etc so I’m wondering if you could use it for gyno .
 
djbombsquad said:
I always see ads for cryo for fat reduction like for stomach chest etc so I’m wondering if you could use it for gyno .
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I don't think you'd want to. I know someone who had the cryo thing done on her waist line, she said it was excruciatingly painful, for almost a full week she was hurting, and she got minimal results (she said they recommended multiple treatments to get noticeable results) and she never went back for another treatment because of the pain.

I can't imagine having someone do that to the nipple area. Yeesh.
 
Update:

Went back to the doc's office yesterday and they took another look at things.

They took the tape off so now everything is visible. Less noticeable scarring on the right side than on the left. Things look a little assymetrical right now, but there's still some swelling, so that might even out over time. Thet said to start applying some scar treatment cream 2 times a day to each side, and that on Monday I should start massaging any raised (bumpy) or hardened scar tissue to help break things up and smooth things out.

I'm allowed to wear tank tops to bed now, but I actually prefer the vest at this point, it feels more snug and secure than my tanks do, but I wear the tanks for my work outs.

Also allowed to sleep on my side. I did that for a bit last night and it felt great, although there was a little discomfort just under my armpits (like, where the obliques meet the lats) while sleepi g like that. Could still be a little swelling there that caused that, IDK. I ended up just mixing it uo between the sides and I woke up on my back. So I guess I've learned to sleep in a new position. My wife says I don't snore when I sleep on mt back, so that's a relief.

I'm not allowed to submerge in water for 3 more weeks. Have a christian scouts camping trip today/tomorrow w my son and we'll be participating in a canoe race, so I will have to put my competiteness aside so I don't tip us and end up in the river.

I'm now allowed to lift weights with up to 20lbs per side, but not allowed to do any strenuous upper body work, especially chest, so I'm probably going to mix in some light isolated arm movements (preacher curls, lying tricep extensions while holding the elbow in place, thar sort of thing). I might try some crunches and will probably do some neck exercises too, just cause I don't see why those could pose a big risk.

I ordered some BPC-157 for my elbow, and some L-Carn for my fat burning phase (which I'm about 7 weeks out from).

Monday will be the halfway mark for the 6 weeks of recovery. Things are looking great, considering what I just put my body through, and all-in-all I don't think I could have realistically hoped for a better recovery. I have the advice from a lot of you guys to thank for some of that. So: thanks!
 
djbombsquad said:
I always see ads for cryo for fat reduction like for stomach chest etc so I’m wondering if you could use it for gyno .
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Cryo causes the fat cells to release the fat and some of them die off if I remember correctly. I looked into this and basically if you only have psuedogyno IE estrogen sensitive fat then it is not a good solution. It does not have the same effect on mammary glands. Even then after looking at results and reading reviews on the process I saw that for the most part the only people who actually got "decent" results actually continued dieting so there was no way of knowing if they lost the weight from diet and exercise or the process. Just really not impressive enough to spend my money on.
 
Taking it easy paddling will be best for your chest at this point too! Just enjoy the ride with your boy.

Glad everything is healing well for you.
 
Hyde said:
Taking it easy paddling will be best for your chest at this point too! Just enjoy the ride with your boy.

Glad everything is healing well for you.
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Yeah, I thought about that.

We actually played dodgeball at the club meeting on Wednesday night and I got a little rambunctious and overdid it with the throwing. Also took one shot right in the left pec that had me reconsidering what I was doing a bit. 🤣
 
Doc says "Don't lift heavy, we are still in a be careful mode."
You "Okay how about explosive throwing and being battered with balls, that has to be okay right?" :P
 
Match: "Dr. told me to take it easy after the operation"

Also Match:

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It was against elementary schoolers. So it's not like I was really trying hard or getting pelted with a lot of force.

That being said: I dominated. Many tears were shed!

:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 
match said:
It was against elementary schoolers. So it's not like I was really trying hard or getting pelted with a lot of force.

That being said: I dominated. Many tears were shed!

:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
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I quit getting updates 🤷🏻‍♂️
Glad everything is going good…..it’s always a relief when Doctors remove the bandages and it just feels so good. Yeah you might want to take it easy with the Dodgeball, even a shot from a little kid could cause all kinds of pain I’m sure…..

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Got back late last night from our camping. Great time of bonding with my son ans hanging out w other dads and their kids.

Didn't tip over in the canoe and I gave it 100%. Chest is feeling better every day and I'm really looking forward to adding the lifts back in once my elbow is ready.

One of the dads on the trip is a physical therapist so I asked him about my elbow and he gave me some stretches to do, so I've been doing those while I wait for my BPC to arrive.
 
Glad your camping trip went well….I always love getting out with my wife, our kids, and Grandchildren to do anything outside. It’s always a special bonding time that I feel many families in today’s society miss out on. It makes you feel rejuvenated and ready to tackle the week.
 
Sounds like an awesome weekend and first real work put in and you held up quite well.
 
Did some light weight curls and tricep extensions today (just cause I miss doing arms so badly).

Elbows both felt a little sore on the first set and felt fine on the second set. Gotta love those endorphins!

I know, I know, I shouldn't be doing anything yet, kinda couldn't help myself. BPC should be arriving Wed. Hoping that will help.

The stretches already feel like they're doing some good, so going to keep going w those.
 
Update:

Gotta be short and sweet with this one cause I'm in a hurry.

Took my progress photos today (I take them every 3 weeks). The incision sites have all completely closed and the scars are visible, but only if you get close and know what you're looking for. My wife said she wouldn't be able to tell except that she's looking for them. Surface scars on the left side are less noticeable than the right, but bumpiness under the scars is more noticeable on the left than the right (in the photos the left nipple looks like it's winking ;).

Still some swelling, I can feel it (kinda numb still), but range of motion feels 100% and I feel like I could definitely handle any amount of weight at this point (even on something chest specific), but I'm not going to be dumb and test that theory.

2.5 weeks til I am cleared to go wild and do all the lifting I want. Kept the workout to just legs today because I had some soreness in the elbow after doing arms on Monday.
 
Advice needed (see below)

Been a minute since I last posted but hasn't been much to report really.

I'm doing legs 3 times per week, finishing with some cardio. Chest still has some swelling (I think), and there's still some numbness but it's very gradually going away. At this rate I imagine I'll still have the numbness for another few months before it's gone entirely. No real change visually in the last week. I keep the compression vest on except when I'm working out, showering, or if I want to wear a tighter shirt that it might show through.

I started bpc for my left elbow a week ago. I think things are improving there (feels a little less painful to hold things on that side), but it's definitely not 100%. I've been pinning 500mcg per day, and at that rate I have a 30 day supply. Switching sites between my left delt and my left tricep, because I tried pinning the high forearm near the elbow but I probably knicked a small vein cause I got some bruising, so I'm not gonna pin that close to the site anymore.

The question I have for you guys is this:

I desperately want to begin my new workout routine, on Monday. I don't expect my elbow to feel 100% in just 3 more days, but I would really like to get the routine going again. My upper body feels so deflated (I know that is mostly in my head), but I'm really itching to get back to lifting. I'm completely confident that I am healed up enough that I won't injure my chest at this point (I have full range of motion and can fully contract the pecs again). What do you guys think? Should I start the routine or wait 1 more week? Either way, I intend to run the bpc for the full 30 days.
 
Why don’t you do one EASY session Monday. Absolutely comical effort/loading on it initially (and I mean even in respect to your currently detrained ability). Don’t be afraid to use a 5lb db or a 2.5lb plate, something well within your current strength.

Go through the motions with extremely light loads. If you feel good the next day, turn it up a little. Keep going and use this week as a primer week. It will give results still (I remember getting gains with the empty barbell on bench after 11 weeks off pressing from my bicep repair), and if you have pain after the first day you will know to do nothing else this week still.
 
I was thinking something similar, as Hyde above. I would do the excercises like I would be just trying to learn the motions and techniques, not even trying to create fatigue. And monitor how your chest area reacts and how things feel after WO and on the next day.
 
What Hyde says is what i did Wednesday for the first time doing any arm work on my left arm since my surgery. Just 5lbs on Biceps, and 15 in Triceps getting them used to moving with some mild resistance and just did some volume. I felt great the next day. I will repeat again today and then next week I might test out an 8lb DB on the Biceps since 5 is going so well.

Also, curious, are you still required to where the compression or were you told still wearing it would improve healing to continue wearing it?
 
MrKleen73 said:
What Hyde says is what i did Wednesday for the first time doing any arm work on my left arm since my surgery. Just 5lbs on Biceps, and 15 in Triceps getting them used to moving with some mild resistance and just did some volume. I felt great the next day. I will repeat again today and then next week I might test out an 8lb DB on the Biceps since 5 is going so well.
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Okay, sounds like a good middle ground; thanks guys!

MrKleen73 said:
Also, curious, are you still required to where the compression or were you told still wearing it would improve healing to continue wearing it?
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I was told that i could wear the vest half the day (so either wear it during the day and take it off at night/in bed, or vice versa), and to wear a tight tank top when not wearing the vest (with the exception of showering).

I figured I'd just keep wearing it as much as I can when it's not inconvenient, and that would afford me the freedom to remove it for workouts, or when I want to wear something it would conflict with. So I wear tight tanktops when working out, or underneath my tighter shirts.
 
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