Team Juggernaut ft. Booneman77 - 3 months to Mass!

[Driven2lift]

At least buddy came through with a diet more in line with your thinking. Hopefully you get some amount of value out of him before this is through.

I’ve actually dropped below 200 for protein now too. 1g/lb. is more than enough IMO but I would just never take any macros from protein further than that as you cut down here.

 

[MrKleen73]

At least buddy came through with a diet more in line with your thinking. Hopefully you get some amount of value out of him before this is through.

I’ve actually dropped below 200 for protein now too. 1g/lb. is more than enough IMO but I would just never take any macros from protein further than that as you cut down here.

As long as he is withing the .4-.8g / lb of body weight he is going to be perfectly fine and capable of growth or muscle maintenance. Trust me the need for higher protein is driven by the industry and not science or even anecdotal evidence. Actually them lowering it closer to .4 might help with the fat loss as some people can break down protein so easily for gluconeogenesis that extra protein is treated as carbs and broken down for energy and not as a building block. It is still easier to break down ingested protein than it is to burn body fat especially during anaerobic work which needs a fast source of ATP. So some people who have issues burning fat will actually do better on lower protein. Plus what it does for gut health is pretty awesome.

Keep in mind that every time the body breaks down muscle tissue, or ingested protein that whatever amino acids are in there are stored in the amino acid pool in the blood. When protein is broken down like catabolized muscle whatever wasn't used goes right back into the amino acid pool. The body recycles the proteins nonstop. It is an even more efficient process in experienced lifters, so the idea that you need to eat a lot of protein to sustain or build muscle is really just a money grab pushed by supplement salesmen.

You can read up on when all the higher protein nonsense started, it was pushed heavily until the world thought if you want to grow you need to be eating mostly protein. I lived by this for years and years.

I am 213 now but my average protein intake is 130-150 a day. I do go up to 200 and over sometimes. Mostly because I enjoy meat and shakes, not because if higher protein needs.

 

[Driven2lift]

^And look at your lean mass on that diet. You’re walking proof of most overthinking it.

I don’t think I’ll grow out of the habit anytime soon regardless, I love meat and the satiety benefits are so desperately needed for me personally while dieting. The multitude of studies showing additional lean mass retention with higher protein macros don’t hurt.

For Dan here though potatoes as main carb source + veggies should be a great help for satiety

 

[booneman77]

Full hormone panel... really nothing shocking. Test is obviously lower than ideal but not what I would call crazy dramatic, estrogen is slightly low which is not really good or bad, was def surprised to see all the thyroid numbers actually look great.

The cholesterol that was high on the first test weeks ago has gone down by almost 30% in those 3 weeks so clearly something related to the keto as that was the only change between then and this.

 

[booneman77]

Really having a generally bad day today. Weight was up over 2lb (186.5) inexplicably- this with an added cardio session and identical workouts to last week along with a 100 cal drop. I’m dumbfounded and frustrated and the rest of the day has gone awful on top of it. Chalking it up to a shiit day and moving on.

 

[Driven2lift]

Should level out, eyes ahead

 

[MrKleen73]

Man I feel for you and the frustration levels you must be feeling right now. Keep your head up!

 

[booneman77]

Appreciate the support guys.

Diet tweaked this week again. Removed carbs and replaced with more oils and nuts. Going to try out another iteration of keto without any of the saturated fats. We will see how this goes. Food volume is wayy down as almost 1/3 of my daily cals are in the form of olive oil and protein (170ish) is as low as its been outside of my death stint of keto last summer ha.

Only 4 workouts this week and 6 cardio (2 stepmill, 2 ellip, 2 cycling - off days)

 

[MrKleen73]

Appreciate the support guys.

Diet tweaked this week again. Removed carbs and replaced with more oils and nuts. Going to try out another iteration of keto without any of the saturated fats. We will see how this goes. Food volume is wayy down as almost 1/3 of my daily cals are in the form of olive oil and protein (170ish) is as low as its been outside of my death stint of keto last summer ha.

Only 4 workouts this week and 6 cardio (2 stepmill, 2 ellip, 2 cycling - off days)

WHAT???? NO saturated fats? You are natural, how are you supposed to produce testosterone without saturated fats? I mean you will get minimal amounts from meat sources and the like but that is pretty interesting. I guess it probably has to do with the liver and metabolism?

 

[booneman77]

WHAT???? NO saturated fats? You are natural, how are you supposed to produce testosterone without saturated fats? I mean you will get minimal amounts from meat sources and the like but that is pretty interesting. I guess it probably has to do with the liver and metabolism?

this was my choice as the sat fats seemed to be what spurred the huge spike in my cholesterol during my first bloodwork. limiting them to only the trace amounts from chicken and other meats and getting the rest of my fats via almonds and olive oil has faired me far better both in terms of bloodwork and overall "feel". basically monounsaturated fats compromise 90%

 

[Driven2lift]

^ nothing wrong with 90% mono, your joints will love you for this too. EVOO on meats and almond butter + hot sauce on veggies

Definitely some truth to saturated fats supporting hormone production but if they are 10% within a keto diet I bet that’s plenty.

 

[booneman77]

^ nothing wrong with 90% mono, your joints will love you for this too. EVOO on meats and almond butter + hot sauce on veggies

Definitely some truth to saturated fats supporting hormone production but if they are 10% within a keto diet I bet that’s plenty.

yeah, im going to keep an eye on my "feels" over the next week+ and see how adding fattier chicken/turkey effects things as necessary. Frankly though, I'm more concerned about the high LDL in the short term vs test levels as I already know they're sub-optimal ha. 325 vs 300 isnt going to matter much if they dip a bit and they're not going to tank since sat fats have literally never been high for me outside of a few short stints of keto that I used a lot of fatty meats (aka 4-8weeks max/yr)

 

[MrKleen73]

Should work, not like there are not any saturated fats in meats or almonds...

 

[Driven2lift]

Well he gets 10%

And I’m just making a joke there too as those were some of my go-to meals for me while on keto. I know Dan knows how to track his saturated fats

And as dumb as it will sound to some I used lean meats during keto. So I dodged saturated fats there. I would prefer make a killer sauce on the dish with some oils and spices, than eat a chicken thigh over a breast,
Or a fatty roast vs. a lean cut, etc.

Just a habit I’ve always had.

Come time for a steak however... standard thick cut T-bone untrimmed, zero sauce touches my steak.

Curry is a solid choice Dan, I do my sauces without any coconut milk though. Naturally I do it spicy as hell, made good use of the ghost pepper flakes here thanks again Dan. I just add veggies to meet my food bulk needs and diced, pan-fried chicken.

 

[booneman77]

Well he gets 10%

And I’m just making a joke there too as those were some of my go-to meals for me while on keto. I know Dan knows how to track his saturated fats

And as dumb as it will sound to some I used lean meats during keto. So I dodged saturated fats there. I would prefer make a killer sauce on the dish with some oils and spices, than eat a chicken thigh over a breast,
Or a fatty roast vs. a lean cut, etc.

Just a habit I’ve always had.

Come time for a steak however... standard thick cut T-bone untrimmed, zero sauce touches my steak.

Curry is a solid choice Dan, I do my sauces without any coconut milk though. Naturally I do it spicy as hell, made good use of the ghost pepper flakes here thanks again Dan. I just add veggies to meet my food bulk needs and diced, pan-fried chicken.

that curry sauce sounds awesome! think I know what i'll be making for dinner tonight ha. Man I totally forgot about the ghost pepper flakes... they got buried in my cabinet... I've been using this amazing spice that Nicole brought back from Thailand last spring (in a 3lb bag haha). Its some type of blend with just enough falvor and a TON of heat... so good. Very fine too with is nice as it mixes into anything. I actually use it in some sweet stuff too for a little "afterburn"

 

[Driven2lift]

Oooooh.

A single spice or a blend?
Forever expending the spice stash...

What brought her to Thailand?
I wish I could just up and go on a worldwide food sampling tour

 

[booneman77]

Oooooh.

A single spice or a blend?
Forever expending the spice stash...

What brought her to Thailand?
I wish I could just up and go on a worldwide food sampling tour

some kind of blend... no idea what all is in there tho since I can't read a single thing on it ha.

She just went on a tourist trip... she loves to travel just to see places

 

[MrKleen73]

Well he gets 10%

And I’m just making a joke there too as those were some of my go-to meals for me while on keto. I know Dan knows how to track his saturated fats

And as dumb as it will sound to some I used lean meats during keto. So I dodged saturated fats there. I would prefer make a killer sauce on the dish with some oils and spices, than eat a chicken thigh over a breast,
Or a fatty roast vs. a lean cut, etc.

Just a habit I’ve always had.

Come time for a steak however... standard thick cut T-bone untrimmed, zero sauce touches my steak.

Curry is a solid choice Dan, I do my sauces without any coconut milk though. Naturally I do it spicy as hell, made good use of the ghost pepper flakes here thanks again Dan. I just add veggies to meet my food bulk needs and diced, pan-fried chicken.

That doesn't sound dumb to me. I don't dodge saturated fats, but I don't go out in search of fattier cuts of meat either. My #1 source of protein is 93/7 ground turkey as a matter of fact. I haven't used ground chuck in years, but have been considering some grass fed for a little bit. Than again that has less saturated fat then normal chuck... I also use whipping cream or other things like that also. When it comes to that, it is about taste for me.

I need to look into some recipes for sauces that would be good with keto... if you have any let me know.

Oh it is funny on the steak... I love a good TBone, but my go to is always sirloin. I like the flavor, and the lack of gristle and fat. If cooked right a nice sirloin makes me very happy! I am the same regarding the sauce though. If you see me putting steak sauce or something on my steak then I am not happy with it. I often will get the mushroom toppers but have them put on the side so I can just eat the mushrooms but the steak itself only needs salt, pepper, and sometimes garlic if I am in the mood for it.

 

[booneman77]

Had my ultrasound today and got exactly the news I expected: “you have a slightly bigger than average liver”. Otherwise no concerns though so all is well... unfortunately it cost $560 to have then confirm that but whatever. There’s always more time to make money when you’re healthy.

Workout was a bit tough to swallow tonight. Had rack pulls on deck for the first time since like December (racks or deads) and man has my strength taken an absolute nose dive. I could tell from the first rep that my form was off and that I just didn’t have the groove from not practicing in so long. Had to decrease the weight by over 40lb just to get my reps which bummed me out / frustrated me.

After the workout I texted my coach just to let him know my thoughts and that I was frustrated and generally mood and motivation has been very bad far too often lately. More just want him to know where my head is at. He said he’d give me a call tomorrow so I’m looking forward to that just to hear his thoughts and whatnot. He also expressed that he’s been feeling the heat/frustration as well on his end as he is not used to having this much difficulty for as long as we have. We will see how the talk goes and hopefully we can make some progress as at this stage the mental game is equally important to the physical stuff.

 

[Driven2lift]

Mannn get those tests while in Canada next time

You can actually get away with a lot even without a health card, some weird law about them not being able to force you to produce it. For a walk-in at non-emergency anyways, where they can ultrasound and more.

Great to hear that man.

As for the lift, if it’s been a while since deads felt right don’t sweat a 40lb. Drop for comfort, not one bit man. I know it makes you feel awful at the time but give it a few sessions, recover, muscle memory will get you there.

Gl on the call!

And to the ^^
I will share some curry sauce recipes I like for sure, and that’s funny about the lean ground turkey. It’s the exact same price per gram here as ground beef so I have a freezer full of both ground turkey and chicken. In most recipes using ground meat you really can’t tell the difference anyways I find.

Sirloin is another top choice, and yeah if I happen to be in a restaurant I can/will order a seasoned or topped steak if it sounds good. Eating out is a rarity for me though, maybe once every 6-8 weeks. Last time was V-day and before that I had a meal out with my buddy visiting from China who missed “real meat” in his words.

 

[booneman77]

Weight back on track today at 183.4lb. Glad to see the scale move the right way but I did cut carbs out so there’s a bit of caveat to that number.

Leg day was just ok. Weights are still a bit lower than normal which sucks and a ton lower than they were prior to starting. Strength was never the goal but to lose strength and have a worse physique is the complete opposite. At least one win would have been ok

 

[MrKleen73]

Has been a rough go of it. Good to see you making more progress, and yeah that has to be frustrating. Hopefully your conversation goes well today.

 

[booneman77]

Got the all-too-standard "Still haven't figured out what's wrong... anyone else who's stuck it out this long has seen dramatic results." in-app message late sunday night. No call, just a bs message with a "sorry i didn't call".

Supps still didn't arrive (he had told me the y shipped weds or thurs but nothing shows tracking on any of my UPS/USPS/FedEx accounts) so even if they do I am another full week behind.

I'm officially done wasting my time reaching out for anything general. Zero conversation or effort to help me in that regard.

 

[MrKleen73]

Got the all-too-standard "Still haven't figured out what's wrong... anyone else who's stuck it out this long has seen dramatic results." in-app message late sunday night. No call, just a bs message with a "sorry i didn't call".

Supps still didn't arrive (he had told me the y shipped weds or thurs but nothing shows tracking on any of my UPS/USPS/FedEx accounts) so even if they do I am another full week behind.

I'm officially done wasting my time reaching out for anything general. Zero conversation or effort to help me in that regard.

Well until now he wouldn't even let you drop calories to where you needed them and the workouts he has you doing are just plain Jane workouts compared to how you trained which used a ton of energy.

I honestly think you are better off on your own here. You know what you need to do and what works for you. Just do your thing and IF he sends the stuff then great, if not then you make your progress anyway.

 

[nicksox15]

I haven’t checked in for a month and even deleted the app. Still haven’t gotten a single message asking how it was going, where I’m at. Keep getting the generic workouts updated though, haha. Been doing my own workouts now with far better results

 

[booneman77]

Such a shame. what a complete waste of time and effort.

and whats even worse is the awful taste it now leaves for so many people of what an online coach is

 

[MrKleen73]

Yeah that is just messed up.

 

[Godstrength]

Its just bizarre to me to have this opportunity for loggers and then completely drop the ball and make yourself look bad as a coach and company.

I guess you call that anti-promotion? Lol

 

[jtmass]

Such a shame. what a complete waste of time and effort.

and whats even worse is the awful taste it now leaves for so many people of what an online coach is

I feel you will do much better without this "Coach". Are you still waiting for the supp to come in and continuing with him?

 

[booneman77]

Its just bizarre to me to have this opportunity for loggers and then completely drop the ball and make yourself look bad as a coach and company.

I guess you call that anti-promotion? Lol

Seriously... I think there was maybe 1-2 posts in here or any of the logs from the rep(s)? what a huge waste of time. Honestly, it looks awful from M&M, the coach, and anyone associated with either of them. Certainly one of the oddest things I've ever seen.

I feel you will do much better without this "Coach". Are you still waiting for the supp to come in and continuing with him?

Waiting for the supps (this will be the last week I wait) as I was told they shipped last week (skeptical). For the most part, I don't mind the workouts as they've been decent and it is nice to have the weekly changes and such, diet has been straying to my own more and more this week (more due to work and necessity than anything though) but overall cals and macros are basically where I would have had them anyway so really nothing to change. The week he didn't update my diet when I was told by the doc to I did it myself and since then we have basically just followed that since I was consistently losing for those couple weeks and the one he changed it to "his" style, I got bloated AF and gained 2lb so he changed it back to the cals and macros that I had been using ha. thanks for the help, coach.

 

[kjscatch]

Seriously... I think there was maybe 1-2 posts in here or any of the logs from the rep(s)? what a huge waste of time. Honestly, it looks awful from M&M, the coach, and anyone associated with either of them. Certainly one of the oddest things I've ever seen.



Waiting for the supps (this will be the last week I wait) as I was told they shipped last week (skeptical). For the most part, I don't mind the workouts as they've been decent and it is nice to have the weekly changes and such, diet has been straying to my own more and more this week (more due to work and necessity than anything though) but overall cals and macros are basically where I would have had them anyway so really nothing to change. The week he didn't update my diet when I was told by the doc to I did it myself and since then we have basically just followed that since I was consistently losing for those couple weeks and the one he changed it to "his" style, I got bloated AF and gained 2lb so he changed it back to the cals and macros that I had been using ha. thanks for the help, coach.

I was thinking the same thing about the original reps during the promotion. Can’t remember who it was.

None the less, I enjoyed following along.

 

[booneman77]

I was thinking the same thing about the original reps during the promotion. Can’t remember who it was.

None the less, I enjoyed following along.

I had to look t up but cheftepesh1 and that Eric marchewicz guy. Only made it like 15 posts in and neither was heard from again.

 

[kjscatch]

I had to look t up but cheftepesh1 and that Eric marchewicz guy. Only made it like 15 posts in and neither was heard from again.

That’s what I thought. Is cheftepesh1 even associated with them any more?

It’s not technically their fault but if I was a rep I would be extremely embarrassed or at least apologizing.

 

[booneman77]

Been meaning to add these but these would be the last month of progress... finally some noticeable movement but again a bit slow and damnnnnn late in the game

 

[Godstrength]

View attachment 164730View attachment 164731

Been meaning to add these but these would be the last month of progress... finally some noticeable movement but again a bit slow and damnnnnn late in the game

Looks like your leaning up some and your waist is coming in... Small waist makes everything else look bigger. You'll make it in time for the wedding

I gotta ask though... No more cycling for you Boone??

 

[booneman77]

Looks like your leaning up some and your waist is coming in... Small waist makes everything else look bigger. You'll make it in time for the wedding

I gotta ask though... No more cycling for you Boone??

Thanks man, definitely starting at least see something moving which is good... I'm just peeved becuase I'm basically 4 months behind my own schedule at this point and ahving to be much more drastic which is exactly what I wanted to avoid going into the summer... just annoying to have made so much progress with maintaining over the last year+ only to have it all go to shiit and basically starting over if not worse.

Not sure about the cycling... Certainly still have the itch and a few goodies stashed away but injectibles (which I would far prefer) are 100% out with my travel every week and I'm just really wanting to get more dialed in without them for now. Once life settles more I will definitely be peeking in the closet a bit more often to see what cocktails I can come up with ha

 

[booneman77]

Weight down almost exactly another lb to 182.1lb I had thought it might be a bit more as I was forced to under eat all but 1 day this week due to work/schedule/other people. It may just trickle into next week tho just because I’ve been a bit backed up tho too so not worried. Progress is progress.

Have a fun date day today with the fiancé for cinco. Margaritas and Mexican food all day not worrying about cals or whatever all day and just gonna enjoy it all!

Let’s go pens!

 

[MrKleen73]

Weight down almost exactly another lb to 182.1lb I had thought it might be a bit more as I was forced to under eat all but 1 day this week due to work/schedule/other people. It may just trickle into next week tho just because I’ve been a bit backed up tho too so not worried. Progress is progress.

Have a fun date day today with the fiancé for cinco. Margaritas and Mexican food all day not worrying about cals or whatever all day and just gonna enjoy it all!

Let’s go pens!

Enjoy it brother!!!! Great food and margaritas a hard combo to beat! The extra carbs will help with leptin levels anyway... might even see a little whoosh effect after a couple days.

 

[booneman77]

Ended up basically just drinking my calories all day ha. Ate chips and salsa/guacamole but really not much food otherwise. I did cram down a protein bar and shake before bed tho just to help not be so hungover ha.

 

[Driven2lift]

Oh man should be a fun day for squirty poopin

I need my daily fibre or **** gets bad

Hope you’re feeling good enough to tackle a lift and get in some food today!

 

[booneman77]

Oh man should be a fun day for squirty poopin

I need my daily fibre or **** gets bad

Hope you’re feeling good enough to tackle a lift and get in some food today!

haha I'm usually the opposite... so dehydrated that im quite literally shiitting bricks ha.

All was well the next day (fiance was feeling a bit rough ha). went fo r a nice long walk in the woods with the dog and fiance to sweat out what was left

 

[Driven2lift]

If you had enough alcohol I can see that. My all-inclusive resort visits to Cuba/Mexico were a great time everywhere but in the bathroom lol

Booze and only greasy foods. I mean, salad was there but vacation... “free” food... You indulge and win some $ back at the buffet

On topic have you since last mention had any correspondence with your coach?

 

[booneman77]

If you had enough alcohol I can see that. My all-inclusive resort visits to Cuba/Mexico were a great time everywhere but in the bathroom lol

Booze and only greasy foods. I mean, salad was there but vacation... “free” food... You indulge and win some $ back at the buffet

On topic have you since last mention had any correspondence with your coach?

haha all inclusives in other countries are a whole different level

A few questions/comments from him - he's supposed to be meeting with another dietitian at lunch today and is going to report back. He's been talking about lowering protein even further and replacing with more fats but I did raise the cautionary tale from my last low-protein keto stint last summer and how miserable it was for me. He seems set on going even further into keto at this point so I will wait to see what they say but honestly I'm pretty much assuming I'm basically on my own... still getting the run-around on the beta test stuff (was told it shipped, then a week later told shipments were intercepted so that it could be sent from the lab company thats going to handle ti all now... that was a few days ago again. I dont expect it to ever actually happen so I'm just doing my thing and following what I think is appropriate and communicating my differences from his "plan")

at this point, its free "input" and not much else. I've decided that all decisions will be more mine than "ours" or especially "his" at this point due to the lack of results.

 

[MrKleen73]

I think that is the best way to move forward for sure. At east you are making progress now that you are doing more of what works for you.

 

[booneman77]

I think that is the best way to move forward for sure. At east you are making progress now that you are doing more of what works for you.

Slower than I'd like and waaayyyy late in the game but progress is progress. Was looking at my pics from this weekend and this is where I expected to be by february... not may haha. ugh.

 

[MrKleen73]

Slower than I'd like and waaayyyy late in the game but progress is progress. Was looking at my pics from this weekend and this is where I expected to be by february... not may haha. ugh.

Yeah I imagine you are more than a little disenchanted with the entire thing!

 

[Driven2lift]

Online coaching won’t ever compare.

Certainly when said coach is this... unhelpful

Hey are you doing a Stag and Doe Dan?
I just organized an absurdly successful one if you happen to be and want some ideas. We catered to the fit crowd with a couple games and the profit for the couple was awesome.

 

[booneman77]

Online coaching won’t ever compare.

Certainly when said coach is this... unhelpful

Hey are you doing a Stag and Doe Dan?
I just organized an absurdly successful one if you happen to be and want some ideas. We catered to the fit crowd with a couple games and the profit for the couple was awesome.

I’ve never even heard of such a thing??? Please do tell...

 

[nicksox15]

When’s the wedding again? I’m going to Hawaii end of June to be a groomsman in my buddies wedding. Gonna be a good time!

 

[Driven2lift]

I’ve never even heard of such a thing??? Please do tell...

Really?

Huh.

Basically a celebration hosted by the couple, but typically run and planned by the bridal party. Games of chance or games of skill are set up where people use game tickets for a chance to win or compete.
+ raffles and a 50/50 draw is standard.
Drinks sold give a set portion of the drink ticket to the couple.

Just a fun night to raise $ and help the couple pay for a wedding basically lol. That said everyone here does them rich or poor. Always a fun time for me, I ran a golf putting competition but the show stealer was a “Hulk Hold” game. 2 tickets to play, hold a keg in front of you with arms at 90 deg. And hold it up as long as you can.
We did a women’s and a men’s “top time to beat” and it got damn competitive, drew a crowd and people cheering others on. Winner took home the keg, and there was a one-arm hold as well with some rare Italian cheese (4kg in a bag) that the Italian side donated lol.

Our record for the night was a 4 minute keg hold and a 7 minute one-arm hold. I got asked all night if I was competing lol but my sister (bride) and I agreed I would just do it for fun while we set up so my number wasn’t deterring challengers Honestly though my left shoulder is and was a wreck and the top time beat mine, I was around 3:30 on the keg

Used my right arm for the cheese though, and crushed that top time