NOOTROL FAQ!
- Thread starter brundel
- Start date
brundel
Board Sponsor
The brain is an exceptionally complex and delicate system. As many of you know there are endless supplements are dozens of compounds reported to be "nootropic" or to increase memory and learning. Many of these supplements simply increase acetylcholine (ACH). Unfortunately increasing ACH is a poor way to increase brain power when it is solely employed. In fact your more likely to have unfavorable side effects and reduced brain function, over time, when using racetams, Noopept etc without the proper ancillaries. Increased ACH is indicated in multiple brain disease states including Parkinsons. Taking a product that only increases ACH and doesnt balance out the other neurotransmitters involved can be hazardous. A testament to this is the widespread comments online regarding negative effects of Nootropic products.
"libido-killing/depression-inducing side effects have been one of the greatest obstacles standing in the way of trying to use any of the racetams consistently (not to mention the emotional dulling)"
"The imbalance between cholinergic activity and dopaminergic activity in the striatum causes a variety of neurological disorders, such as Parkinson's disease."
Invalid Link Removed
"many people mention depression symptoms when using racetams, noopept and other things that increase ACH specifically."
Initially with increased ACH there may be an increase in Dopamine and Serotonin but this quickly leads to depletion and side effects related to low dopamine and serotonin levels. NOOTROL, unlike most nootropic products, addresses these deficiencies with additional ingredients included specifically to balance out the high ACH levels. Every action has a reaction and in the brain its no different. Cognitive function involves the participation of many different neurotransmitter systems in a variety of brain areas. The centerpiece of investigation regarding cognitive function has classically been the cholinergic system, but it has become increasingly clear that other transmitter systems interact with cholinergic systems to provide the neural basis for cognitive function. In order for a nootropic product to work well the formula must be well balanced and each effects side effects must be addressed. Many/most nootropic products are either a single ingredient or a mix and match of random "nootropic" ingredients with little rhyme or reason. NOOTROL has been balanced perfectly. Now, everyone can improve their lives by harnessing the power of higher intellect.
Nootrol works in multiple ways to increase cognitive function and brain health. Increased acetylcholine is a part but so is increased cerebral circulation, antioxidant activity and optimizing of neurotransmitters involved in memory, learning and brain power. Nootrol also increases neurotrophic factors such as BDNF and NGF.
BDNF- Brain derived neurotrophic factor
Brain-derived neurotrophic factor (BDNF) is a key protein in brain plasticity and is particularly important for survival of dopaminergic neurons.
BDNF is involved in new neural network formation, neuroplasticity, Long term memory formation, helps to support the survival of existing neurons and encourages the growth, regeneration and creation of new neurons and synapses.
BDNF increases energy metabolism in obese diabetic animals, partly through activating the stress response and inducing UCP1 – an uncoupling protein that creates brown fat, which is easily burned for fuel. BDNF can help with sleep, is antidepressant and can decrease insulin resistance. Unfortunately BDNF decreases with age. Increases in this neurotrophic factor are beneficial to health and cognitive function.
NGF- Nerve growth Factor
Nerve growth factor (NGF) is one of a group of small protein like molecules called neurotrophins (BDNF is another) that are responsible for the development of new neurons, and for the health and maintenance of mature ones.
NGF promotes growth, maintenance, and survival of neurons and axons (part where electrical signal passes). It also helps repair myelin sheath, the coating around the axons (R).
Animal testing has shown that as production of NGF decreases in the brain, one’s ability to form new connections and to retain and access memories is impaired. NGF can save degenerating nerves and restore function. On top of NGFs effects regarding nerve regeneration and neural protection it can help increase serotonin and reduce depressive symptoms. Recent animal studies show that NGF selectively protects acetylcholine activated neurons.
"libido-killing/depression-inducing side effects have been one of the greatest obstacles standing in the way of trying to use any of the racetams consistently (not to mention the emotional dulling)"
"The imbalance between cholinergic activity and dopaminergic activity in the striatum causes a variety of neurological disorders, such as Parkinson's disease."
Invalid Link Removed
"many people mention depression symptoms when using racetams, noopept and other things that increase ACH specifically."
Initially with increased ACH there may be an increase in Dopamine and Serotonin but this quickly leads to depletion and side effects related to low dopamine and serotonin levels. NOOTROL, unlike most nootropic products, addresses these deficiencies with additional ingredients included specifically to balance out the high ACH levels. Every action has a reaction and in the brain its no different. Cognitive function involves the participation of many different neurotransmitter systems in a variety of brain areas. The centerpiece of investigation regarding cognitive function has classically been the cholinergic system, but it has become increasingly clear that other transmitter systems interact with cholinergic systems to provide the neural basis for cognitive function. In order for a nootropic product to work well the formula must be well balanced and each effects side effects must be addressed. Many/most nootropic products are either a single ingredient or a mix and match of random "nootropic" ingredients with little rhyme or reason. NOOTROL has been balanced perfectly. Now, everyone can improve their lives by harnessing the power of higher intellect.
Nootrol works in multiple ways to increase cognitive function and brain health. Increased acetylcholine is a part but so is increased cerebral circulation, antioxidant activity and optimizing of neurotransmitters involved in memory, learning and brain power. Nootrol also increases neurotrophic factors such as BDNF and NGF.
BDNF- Brain derived neurotrophic factor
Brain-derived neurotrophic factor (BDNF) is a key protein in brain plasticity and is particularly important for survival of dopaminergic neurons.
BDNF is involved in new neural network formation, neuroplasticity, Long term memory formation, helps to support the survival of existing neurons and encourages the growth, regeneration and creation of new neurons and synapses.
BDNF increases energy metabolism in obese diabetic animals, partly through activating the stress response and inducing UCP1 – an uncoupling protein that creates brown fat, which is easily burned for fuel. BDNF can help with sleep, is antidepressant and can decrease insulin resistance. Unfortunately BDNF decreases with age. Increases in this neurotrophic factor are beneficial to health and cognitive function.
NGF- Nerve growth Factor
Nerve growth factor (NGF) is one of a group of small protein like molecules called neurotrophins (BDNF is another) that are responsible for the development of new neurons, and for the health and maintenance of mature ones.
NGF promotes growth, maintenance, and survival of neurons and axons (part where electrical signal passes). It also helps repair myelin sheath, the coating around the axons (R).
Animal testing has shown that as production of NGF decreases in the brain, one’s ability to form new connections and to retain and access memories is impaired. NGF can save degenerating nerves and restore function. On top of NGFs effects regarding nerve regeneration and neural protection it can help increase serotonin and reduce depressive symptoms. Recent animal studies show that NGF selectively protects acetylcholine activated neurons.
Johnybgood
New member
Nice work Brundel! I love the label as well. Speaking of I see serving size is 2 capsules (1 cap 2X daily). So each bottle is 15 day supply?
brundel
Board Sponsor
Ok...so I needed to get the basic info out there. On to the ingredient panel and BF7.
Ill try to keep this short but BF-7 is worth some interest. Have a look.
The Silkworm connection.
Silkworms are the larva of the silk moth, whose Latin name is Bombyx mori, which means “silkworm of the mulberry tree.” As you can imagine, the leaves of the mulberry tree are the preferred food of the worms.
As obvious as the second half of the name is, the first half also tells you quite a bit about this insect, as it is a primary producer of silk.
Cultivating silkworms for the production of raw silk has been practiced in China for more than 5,000 years.
While in the larvae stage, the silkworms create an insoluble protein known as silk fibroin. The fibroin is the structural center of
the raw silk the worms create to build their cocoon.
Researchers have found that if you take the silk fibroin and filter it, purify it and hydrolyze it—or break it down into its component amino acids—it has several medicinal and therapeutic benefits, primarily related to brain health. This purified silk fibroin is called Brain Factor-7 (BF-7) for short.
BRAIN FACTOR 7 (BF-7) has been shown to=
Increase IQ in normal healthy subjects.
Improve Learning
Improve Working memory
Improve attention
Increase reaction times
Is antioxidant
Reduces amyloid plaques
Reduces ROS (reactive oxygen species)
Prevents brain cell death
Improves concentration
Increases Brain circulation
""Previous studies indicate that BF-7 enhances learning and memory in normal and elderly individuals. Here, we evaluated whether milk containing BF-7 (BF-7 milk) could improve the brain function, with thirty normal university students (21 ± 1.2 years). Two versions of the Paced Auditory Serial Addition Test were used under double-blinded conditions to measure the efficacy of BF-7 milk on learning and memory, especially working memory and attention, and on mathematical ability. As a result, BF-7 milk improved the accuracy of the task more than 3-fold. Furthermore, BF-7 milk protected cultured neu-ronal cells from 3-hydroxykynurenine, a normal endogenous brain stress agent. These results indicate that BF-7 milk enhances memory, attention and mathematical ability in normal persons."
"INCREASED REACTION TIME AND TEST SCORE ACCURACY=
"Results showed that BF-7 reduced the response time by an average of 23% for the Color Trails Making Test. Moreover, BF-7 improved the accuracy of the task around twofold. The results reveal that BF-7 improves brain function for attention and cognitive flexibility"
"BRAIN ANTIOXIDANT-
"BF-7 play a role in the improvement of brain functions by removing oxidative stress, and provide therapeutic potential role of BF-7 to protect nervous system from oxidative damage."
GREATLY ENHANCED MEMORY.
"his results strongly represent that the BF-7 play effectively positive role in the improvement of brain function including learning and memory. Taken together, our results suggested that the BF-7 should be useful for developing strategies protecting nervous system and improving brain function.
In a study published in 2004, researchers divided 98 people between the ages of 19 and 64 into three groups.6 One group received 200 mg of BF-7, the second group took 400 mg of BF-7 and the third group had a placebo every day for three weeks.
At the end of the study period, researchers found that all subjects taking the BF-7 (regardless of dosage) saw an average improvement in the memory index from 105 to 126.6. Similarly, the memory maintenance index in both groups increased from 52 percent to 61 percent.
The 200 mg group specifically saw an increase in memory recall efficiency from 31 percent to 59 percent, as well as a boost in the Intelligence Quotient and Memory Quotient consensus score from 53 percent to 79 percent.
The 400 mg group was even more impressive, boasting an increase from 41.5 percent to 66.5 percent in memory recall efficiency, and increases in the Intelligence Quotient and Memory Quotient consensus score rom 52.5 percent to 91 percent.
Circulation to Brain
Studies have shown that Bombyx mori, as silk fibroin, can increase blood flow to critical areas of the brain involved in memory and learning. This was specifically seen in one study published in 2004, where researchers tested the effects of BF-7 on four normal, healthy students.5
After treating the students with 400 mg of BF-7, researchers tested for improved learning and memory using the K-WAIS scale. They found BF-7 treatment raised IQs from 103 on average to 114.
Researchers then tested blood flow to the brain, particularly those areas associated with learning and memory—the paraphippocampal gyrus and medial temporal area—using the Single Photon Emission Computed Tomography (SPECT). They found that blood flow was, in fact, increased in both areas. Additionally, blood supply also increased.
===================================
Centella asiatica/GOTU KOLA
This is a great overall brain supplement but its power lies in its ability to counterbalance the increased acetylcholine levels. Increase Dopamine, increased serotonin as well as a host of other brain benefits.
Increased BDNF, NGF
Neurite outgrowth
At least one study has traced back the increase in BDNF to CREB phosphorylation, and the CREB phosphorylation to the activation of MAPKs.
Oral ingestion of centella asiatica has been confirmed to increase dendritic arborization
Neuroprotective.
Reduces amyloid plaques.
Antioxidant.
Anxiolytic/ anti anxiety. Comparable to valume.
Reduced stressed
Reduced Depression
Reduced pain and inflammation.
Increased calmness, Contentment and alertness.
Increased Dopamine, Serotonin and Norepinephrine.
RESULTS: Significant reduction of the corticosterone level in serum and increase of the contents of 5-HT, NE, DA and their metabolites 5-HIAA, MHPG in rat brain were observed. CONCLUSION: The antidepressant effect of total triterpenes of Centella asiatica may be involved in ameliorating the function of HPA axis and increasing the contents of monoamine neurotransmitters.
====================================
salidroside
A very solid addition to the mix Salidroside is included for several reason. Of great importance, as we have discussed, is the importance of catecholamine homeostasis.
Its irresponsible at best to increase only acetylcholine in the hopes of increasing memory at the cost of losing Dopamine and Serotonin. Salidroside increases Norepinephrine, Dopamine and Serotonin which balances out the increase in Acetylcholine. In short we are turning up all of primary neurotransmitters save GABA as GABA is inhibitory and can reduce memory and cognitive function.
Salidroside also increases BDNF, NGF and increases brain health.
" increased expression of brain-derived neurotrophic factor (BDNF), neurotrophin-3 (NT-3) and nerve growth factor (NGF) mRNAs, and promoted the secretion of these growth factors. The expression of dopamine neurons markers, such as dopamine-beta-hydroxy (DBH), dopa decarboxylase (DDC) and tyrosine hydroxylase (TH), was significantly upregulated after treatment with salidroside for 1-12 days. DA steadily increased after treatment with salidroside for 1-6 days. Thus salidroside can induce rMSCs to differentiate into dopaminergic neurons. "
"stimulated norepinephrine (NE), dopamine (DA), serotonin (5-HT), and nicotinic cholinergic effects in the central nervous system (CNS). It also enhanced the effects of these neurotransmitters on the brain by increasing the permeability of the blood brain barrier to precursors of DA and 5-HT. "
Research has also shown salidroside to help preserve serotonin by inhibiting the activity of COMT (catechol-o-methyl transferase.) Salidroside can increase serotonin by 30% and decrease COMT by up to 60%.
Salidroside can also increase MTOR expression, endurance, strength and a host of other benefits to us as athletes.
==============================================
TYROSOL
Salidoside is Tyrosol with a sugar molecule attached.
Salidroside is a prodrug to tyrosol.
Tyrosol is basically a much stronger version of Salidroside.
Many of Rhodiola and Salidrosides effects are due to Tyrosol. Using Tyrosol is like cutting out the middle man!
========================
Caffeine is there in very low doses just for a slight boost and for its cognitive benefits. The dose is low enough that it should not be stimulating for most. There is less than what is in a can of coke/ diet coke etc.
Ill try to keep this short but BF-7 is worth some interest. Have a look.
The Silkworm connection.
Silkworms are the larva of the silk moth, whose Latin name is Bombyx mori, which means “silkworm of the mulberry tree.” As you can imagine, the leaves of the mulberry tree are the preferred food of the worms.
As obvious as the second half of the name is, the first half also tells you quite a bit about this insect, as it is a primary producer of silk.
Cultivating silkworms for the production of raw silk has been practiced in China for more than 5,000 years.
While in the larvae stage, the silkworms create an insoluble protein known as silk fibroin. The fibroin is the structural center of
the raw silk the worms create to build their cocoon.
Researchers have found that if you take the silk fibroin and filter it, purify it and hydrolyze it—or break it down into its component amino acids—it has several medicinal and therapeutic benefits, primarily related to brain health. This purified silk fibroin is called Brain Factor-7 (BF-7) for short.
BRAIN FACTOR 7 (BF-7) has been shown to=
Increase IQ in normal healthy subjects.
Improve Learning
Improve Working memory
Improve attention
Increase reaction times
Is antioxidant
Reduces amyloid plaques
Reduces ROS (reactive oxygen species)
Prevents brain cell death
Improves concentration
Increases Brain circulation
""Previous studies indicate that BF-7 enhances learning and memory in normal and elderly individuals. Here, we evaluated whether milk containing BF-7 (BF-7 milk) could improve the brain function, with thirty normal university students (21 ± 1.2 years). Two versions of the Paced Auditory Serial Addition Test were used under double-blinded conditions to measure the efficacy of BF-7 milk on learning and memory, especially working memory and attention, and on mathematical ability. As a result, BF-7 milk improved the accuracy of the task more than 3-fold. Furthermore, BF-7 milk protected cultured neu-ronal cells from 3-hydroxykynurenine, a normal endogenous brain stress agent. These results indicate that BF-7 milk enhances memory, attention and mathematical ability in normal persons."
"INCREASED REACTION TIME AND TEST SCORE ACCURACY=
"Results showed that BF-7 reduced the response time by an average of 23% for the Color Trails Making Test. Moreover, BF-7 improved the accuracy of the task around twofold. The results reveal that BF-7 improves brain function for attention and cognitive flexibility"
"BRAIN ANTIOXIDANT-
"BF-7 play a role in the improvement of brain functions by removing oxidative stress, and provide therapeutic potential role of BF-7 to protect nervous system from oxidative damage."
GREATLY ENHANCED MEMORY.
"his results strongly represent that the BF-7 play effectively positive role in the improvement of brain function including learning and memory. Taken together, our results suggested that the BF-7 should be useful for developing strategies protecting nervous system and improving brain function.
In a study published in 2004, researchers divided 98 people between the ages of 19 and 64 into three groups.6 One group received 200 mg of BF-7, the second group took 400 mg of BF-7 and the third group had a placebo every day for three weeks.
At the end of the study period, researchers found that all subjects taking the BF-7 (regardless of dosage) saw an average improvement in the memory index from 105 to 126.6. Similarly, the memory maintenance index in both groups increased from 52 percent to 61 percent.
The 200 mg group specifically saw an increase in memory recall efficiency from 31 percent to 59 percent, as well as a boost in the Intelligence Quotient and Memory Quotient consensus score from 53 percent to 79 percent.
The 400 mg group was even more impressive, boasting an increase from 41.5 percent to 66.5 percent in memory recall efficiency, and increases in the Intelligence Quotient and Memory Quotient consensus score rom 52.5 percent to 91 percent.
Circulation to Brain
Studies have shown that Bombyx mori, as silk fibroin, can increase blood flow to critical areas of the brain involved in memory and learning. This was specifically seen in one study published in 2004, where researchers tested the effects of BF-7 on four normal, healthy students.5
After treating the students with 400 mg of BF-7, researchers tested for improved learning and memory using the K-WAIS scale. They found BF-7 treatment raised IQs from 103 on average to 114.
Researchers then tested blood flow to the brain, particularly those areas associated with learning and memory—the paraphippocampal gyrus and medial temporal area—using the Single Photon Emission Computed Tomography (SPECT). They found that blood flow was, in fact, increased in both areas. Additionally, blood supply also increased.
===================================
Centella asiatica/GOTU KOLA
This is a great overall brain supplement but its power lies in its ability to counterbalance the increased acetylcholine levels. Increase Dopamine, increased serotonin as well as a host of other brain benefits.
Increased BDNF, NGF
Neurite outgrowth
At least one study has traced back the increase in BDNF to CREB phosphorylation, and the CREB phosphorylation to the activation of MAPKs.
Oral ingestion of centella asiatica has been confirmed to increase dendritic arborization
Neuroprotective.
Reduces amyloid plaques.
Antioxidant.
Anxiolytic/ anti anxiety. Comparable to valume.
Reduced stressed
Reduced Depression
Reduced pain and inflammation.
Increased calmness, Contentment and alertness.
Increased Dopamine, Serotonin and Norepinephrine.
RESULTS: Significant reduction of the corticosterone level in serum and increase of the contents of 5-HT, NE, DA and their metabolites 5-HIAA, MHPG in rat brain were observed. CONCLUSION: The antidepressant effect of total triterpenes of Centella asiatica may be involved in ameliorating the function of HPA axis and increasing the contents of monoamine neurotransmitters.
====================================
salidroside
A very solid addition to the mix Salidroside is included for several reason. Of great importance, as we have discussed, is the importance of catecholamine homeostasis.
Its irresponsible at best to increase only acetylcholine in the hopes of increasing memory at the cost of losing Dopamine and Serotonin. Salidroside increases Norepinephrine, Dopamine and Serotonin which balances out the increase in Acetylcholine. In short we are turning up all of primary neurotransmitters save GABA as GABA is inhibitory and can reduce memory and cognitive function.
Salidroside also increases BDNF, NGF and increases brain health.
" increased expression of brain-derived neurotrophic factor (BDNF), neurotrophin-3 (NT-3) and nerve growth factor (NGF) mRNAs, and promoted the secretion of these growth factors. The expression of dopamine neurons markers, such as dopamine-beta-hydroxy (DBH), dopa decarboxylase (DDC) and tyrosine hydroxylase (TH), was significantly upregulated after treatment with salidroside for 1-12 days. DA steadily increased after treatment with salidroside for 1-6 days. Thus salidroside can induce rMSCs to differentiate into dopaminergic neurons. "
"stimulated norepinephrine (NE), dopamine (DA), serotonin (5-HT), and nicotinic cholinergic effects in the central nervous system (CNS). It also enhanced the effects of these neurotransmitters on the brain by increasing the permeability of the blood brain barrier to precursors of DA and 5-HT. "
Research has also shown salidroside to help preserve serotonin by inhibiting the activity of COMT (catechol-o-methyl transferase.) Salidroside can increase serotonin by 30% and decrease COMT by up to 60%.
Salidroside can also increase MTOR expression, endurance, strength and a host of other benefits to us as athletes.
==============================================
TYROSOL
Salidoside is Tyrosol with a sugar molecule attached.
Salidroside is a prodrug to tyrosol.
Tyrosol is basically a much stronger version of Salidroside.
Many of Rhodiola and Salidrosides effects are due to Tyrosol. Using Tyrosol is like cutting out the middle man!
========================
Caffeine is there in very low doses just for a slight boost and for its cognitive benefits. The dose is low enough that it should not be stimulating for most. There is less than what is in a can of coke/ diet coke etc.
brundel
Board Sponsor
Each bottle is 30 days. 60 caps. 1 cap twice per day.
I want to make sure you guys have a month supply.
Perhaps I should clarify on the label.
Serving size is daily intake.
Like Follidrone serving size is 3 caps but you take them 1 or 2 at a time.
Johnybgood
New member
brundel
Board Sponsor
Sorry misread. Keeping an eye out for release. Ready to test for you
Were you around for the public trial we ran?
brundel
Board Sponsor
jgntyce
Board Sponsor
Black Lion Research...quality....Yup.....except this one wont rot your brain out
Johnybgood
New member
I am in on that thread but missed the first trial. I thought you were still running trials! Regardless I am ready to get stated.
brundel
Board Sponsor
jgntyce
Board Sponsor
Make it so and give me some credit for That!Fixed...
This should be on the labels.
brundel
Board Sponsor
Im sure we will run some contests and other things.
Either way if your an entrepreneur you really want to get in on this stuff.
In the last few days I designed the new logo, created all of the new labels, wrote the writeup, designed most of the sales website, on top of product manufacturing and some other daily things........Brain on full tilt. This stuff is no joke.
I wear alot of hats. On top of it I am normally more on the mellow side. Im not one of those go go go people.
Nootrol has made a HUGE difference for me personally.
This stuff really is sort of like a limitless pill. Over the first 2 weeks things really open up. But after a month or 2 I realized that things were really different.
Youll see.
Oh....and its not a stimulant.
I know alot of people take things like adderall with the impression that stimulants are the key to success.
If this was true we would have tons of super successful meth addicts.
There are none
CNS Stimulants DO rot your brain.
Neurotransmitter stimulants.
Cerebral blood flow
Brain antioxidants.
Thats where its at.
brundel
Board Sponsor
Ive filled in some more info regarding the ingredient panel. In the first couple of posts.
Br1ck_Sh1thouse
Well-known member
Pricing? purchasing time frame? How long to kick in? Cycling required?
If this is in the write up and I missed it, sorry just tell me and I'll reread it.
If this is in the write up and I missed it, sorry just tell me and I'll reread it.
ELROCK
Well-known member
Very impressed by the profile! I figured you would bring the innovation! I have played with many noots (some hits & many misses) and seem to get side effects from even the fairly basic ones like bacopa, Noopept and even alpha GPC (in higher doses). I am a business owner/entrepreneur so I am constantly testing new nootropics for the brain power boost. Really looking forward to this one!
abformulations
Legend
Quality at its best
muscleupcrohn
Legend
Nice profile. I've always been a big fan of rhodiola, and BF-7 is definitely a novel addition. I'm thinking of picking up some standalone BF-7 to try, then trying Nootrol after that.Im sure we will run some contests and other things.
Either way if your an entrepreneur you really want to get in on this stuff.
In the last few days I designed the new logo, created all of the new labels, wrote the writeup, designed most of the sales website, on top of product manufacturing and some other daily things........Brain on full tilt. This stuff is no joke.
I wear alot of hats. On top of it I am normally more on the mellow side. Im not one of those go go go people.
Nootrol has made a HUGE difference for me personally.
This stuff really is sort of like a limitless pill. Over the first 2 weeks things really open up. But after a month or 2 I realized that things were really different.
Youll see.
Oh....and its not a stimulant.
I know alot of people take things like adderall with the impression that stimulants are the key to success.
If this was true we would have tons of super successful meth addicts.
There are none
CNS Stimulants DO rot your brain.
Neurotransmitter stimulants.
Cerebral blood flow
Brain antioxidants.
Thats where its at.
Regarding stimulants, I completely agree that a good nootropic formula isn't just a ton of stimulants thrown together with a dusting of "cognitive/nootropic" ingredients added to fluff up the label, but there have been, and still are, a good number of successful people who use some pretty strong "stimulants," not that I support it, or think it's a good idea.
brundel
Board Sponsor
Im not sure if you could tolerate the long winded writeup but exactly this^^^^ is the problem with "nootropic" products.
All of those things, Bacopa, Noopept, Alpha GPC, etc all cause side effects that are intolerable and in some cases hazardous. Lots of reports of long term negatives just form short term Noopept use for example or short term racetam use. Same happens for me. Even a bit too much choline and I feel TERRIBLE. The key lies in balancing the other neurotransmitters. Salidroside and of course the Tyrosol coupled with the centella works this out for us.
This is why youll see that all of the testers in the trial we ran mentioned feeling great. Increased mood, better social interaction etc, on top of increased scores across the board.
This stuff really is unique in spite of some of the ingredients being well known.
GoHardOrGoHme
Board Sponsor
More interested in trying the salidrosides at 10% and tyrosol. Ceretropic has a product that reminds me of this with 10mg tyrosol and 10mg salidrosides.
Not too thrilled about it being proprietary, but I can understand the reasoning. May want to try this out for my board prep/exam if it comes out soon enough.
Not too thrilled about it being proprietary, but I can understand the reasoning. May want to try this out for my board prep/exam if it comes out soon enough.
brundel
Board Sponsor
50mg
Enough to do what we want from caffeine without much stimulation. If your SUPER sensitive to caffeine you may not want to take before bed.
Keep in mind most pre workout products have 300mg.
A large starbucks on ice is 450mg.
brundel
Board Sponsor
Everything is in there at full doses. You have my word, nothing is shorted, except the caffeine which I mentioned is 50mg. per cap.
Here is the thing...there is no product that has BF7, Salidroside and tyrosol, centella and caffeine. You might be able to find them separate but not combined.
Also...not all extracts are made equally.
BF7 is very touchy. Ive heard reports of the most common BF7 on the market and people saying it didnt work for them.
Buyer beware. This same company also sells cheap, poor, underdosed ecklonia.
For those looking to try the ingredients solo, remember the whole point of the ingredient panel is that each counteracts the sides from each other.
So taking 1-2...is nothing like taking Nootrol.
brundel
Board Sponsor
Be sure to also buy some ancillaries. Unless you want nothing but a headache and brainfog.
Out of balance acetylcholine is rough.
of course the stimulant comment was a general statement.
I def wouldnt recommend it.
ucheoma
Active member
Would like to know caffeone content as well. It seems caffeine is indispensable for nootropics these days. Im trying to wean myself off caffeine so slightly dissapointed its in this otherwise novel product.
brundel
Board Sponsor
I drink the weakest coffee known to man. My GF makes coffee in the morning and I cut it with 75% hot water before I drink it.
I dont even notice the 50mg.
muscleupcrohn
Legend
Thanks for the tips. I always have some high quality rhodiola on hand (it's a great supplement in many ways), and I also have high-quality bacopa (which, although not the same as Gotu Kola, covers a lot of the same bases and has historically, if technically incorrectly, often been used interchangeably with bacopa, and modern research has shown that they have significant similarities).
GoHardOrGoHme
Board Sponsor
this similar to the racetam headache without a choline source?
brundel
Board Sponsor
Lots of people do mistake Centella with bacopa but they are different in alot of ways.
Of course I have reasons for choosing Centella.
I tried both extensively. Bacopa gave me severe gastro distress and even vomiting on one occasion.
It also should be taken with some fats or its actives are not well absorbed. Some people dont seem to experience these sides but....if people start vomiting from a product sales drop pretty quick.
Centella had all the positives I wanted with 0 negatives.
Plus it really makes you feel great.
If you like Rhodiola youll LOVE tyrosol. Its like removing 100% of the BS and just getting right to it.
Or like instead of taking one of the DHEA PHs just injecting test or DHT or 1-test. The effects are vastly increased.
brundel
Board Sponsor
SYMPTOMS OF HIGH ACH=
Subdued or depressed mood
Anhedonia (inability to experience pleasure)
Difficulty concentrating
Difficulty with higher-order or complex thought processes
Mental fatigue
Mental confusion
Memory problems
Decreased motivation
Feeling overly sleepy or tired (particularly in the evening), despite adequate sleep and rest
Difficulty understanding or performing tasks
Pessimistic, negative ideation or rumination
Feelings of helplessnes and hopelessness
Fretfulness
Irritability or anger
Emotional heightening and lability
Sadness, tearfulness
Blurred vision
Headache
Dry mouth
Altered sense of smell; heighted sensitivity to odors; olfactory delusions
Stomach pain or discomfort
Intestinal gas or bloating
Diarrhea or constipation
Nausea, dizziness, and vomiting
Muscle pain or discomfort
Joint pain, discomfort, or swelling
Tooth or jaw pain or discomfort
Tingling or numbness in arms or legs
Muscle weakness
Increased urinary frequency or problems with bladder control
Flu or cold-like symptoms
Weakening of immune system and increased susceptibility to illness
Cough
Nasal discharge
Chills or sensation of cold
Cold feet, hands
Sleep disturbance
Introversion
Anxiety
More and vivid dreaming, and higher incidence of nightmares
Decreased levels in the brain of the neurotransmitters, serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine
Interference with the release of the above brain transmitters, because of higher inhibition
Note: There is an inverse, antagonistic relationship between acetycholine (ACh) and serotonin (SE) in the brain. In other words as the quantity of one increases, the quantity of the other decreases. A certain amount of ACh is necessary for normal, optimal brain function. Memory, motivation, higher-order thought processes, sexual desire and activity, and sleep (among other things) depend on ACh. In lower amounts, ACh can act like a stimulant by releasing norepinephrine (NE) and dopamine (DA). However, those brain chemicals are used up (depleted) in the process; and a deficiency can occur. Too much ACh relative to other brain chemicals such as SE, NE, and DA has an adverse effect on brain function. This is because in larger quantities ACh acts like an inhibitory neurotransmitter, causing increased nervous system inhibition (depression). Important to remember is that, in general, as ACh levels go up in the brain, the levels of the other brain transmitters go down. This must be countered at all costs.
This is why I used the strong doses of other ingredients to crank up antagonistic neurotransmitters.
Without this counterbalance nootropics are faulty and can cause side effects that greatly outweigh the positives.
Subdued or depressed mood
Anhedonia (inability to experience pleasure)
Difficulty concentrating
Difficulty with higher-order or complex thought processes
Mental fatigue
Mental confusion
Memory problems
Decreased motivation
Feeling overly sleepy or tired (particularly in the evening), despite adequate sleep and rest
Difficulty understanding or performing tasks
Pessimistic, negative ideation or rumination
Feelings of helplessnes and hopelessness
Fretfulness
Irritability or anger
Emotional heightening and lability
Sadness, tearfulness
Blurred vision
Headache
Dry mouth
Altered sense of smell; heighted sensitivity to odors; olfactory delusions
Stomach pain or discomfort
Intestinal gas or bloating
Diarrhea or constipation
Nausea, dizziness, and vomiting
Muscle pain or discomfort
Joint pain, discomfort, or swelling
Tooth or jaw pain or discomfort
Tingling or numbness in arms or legs
Muscle weakness
Increased urinary frequency or problems with bladder control
Flu or cold-like symptoms
Weakening of immune system and increased susceptibility to illness
Cough
Nasal discharge
Chills or sensation of cold
Cold feet, hands
Sleep disturbance
Introversion
Anxiety
More and vivid dreaming, and higher incidence of nightmares
Decreased levels in the brain of the neurotransmitters, serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine
Interference with the release of the above brain transmitters, because of higher inhibition
Note: There is an inverse, antagonistic relationship between acetycholine (ACh) and serotonin (SE) in the brain. In other words as the quantity of one increases, the quantity of the other decreases. A certain amount of ACh is necessary for normal, optimal brain function. Memory, motivation, higher-order thought processes, sexual desire and activity, and sleep (among other things) depend on ACh. In lower amounts, ACh can act like a stimulant by releasing norepinephrine (NE) and dopamine (DA). However, those brain chemicals are used up (depleted) in the process; and a deficiency can occur. Too much ACh relative to other brain chemicals such as SE, NE, and DA has an adverse effect on brain function. This is because in larger quantities ACh acts like an inhibitory neurotransmitter, causing increased nervous system inhibition (depression). Important to remember is that, in general, as ACh levels go up in the brain, the levels of the other brain transmitters go down. This must be countered at all costs.
This is why I used the strong doses of other ingredients to crank up antagonistic neurotransmitters.
Without this counterbalance nootropics are faulty and can cause side effects that greatly outweigh the positives.
brundel
Board Sponsor
Also I wanted to mention, for those who were not here. We ran a public trial with Nootrol.
5 testers.
We had them all take a battery of tests. Memory, learning, reaction time, IQ.
They then took Nootrol for 2 weeks and retested. 100% had increases across the board. One tester had a 27 point IQ increase...insane.
Ill post the trial results.
5 testers.
We had them all take a battery of tests. Memory, learning, reaction time, IQ.
They then took Nootrol for 2 weeks and retested. 100% had increases across the board. One tester had a 27 point IQ increase...insane.
Ill post the trial results.
blurryimage
Member
How about you post a link for me to buy it 
GoHardOrGoHme
Board Sponsor
Well if you really want to test it, you should give it to med student studying for his board exams :biglaugh:
muscleupcrohn
Legend
Luckily my stomach handles bacopa fine, even upwards of 600mg/day on an empty stomach, so I'm good there, haha.
They have both been historically recommended to be taken with some fats (I think Ghee butter was something that was used a lot).
Regarding rhodiola, not that there's anything wrong with a higher salidroside extract, and tyrosol is definitely great and allows you to use a lower dose, thus saving space and whatnot, but I know there seems to be a point of diminishing returns (there is with everything) in regards to rhodiola doses (I'm sure you dosed it properly, haha), and luckily I have found a good and very affordable extract that I am quite pleased with.
I think what I'll do is try some BF-7 and rhodiola (I'm already taking bacopa, so don't really see a vital need to add any Centella on top of it all), and then after that I'll try Nootrol and report back to you if I notice any differences between the two. I can also play around with the BF-7 and rhodiola doses for fun.
brundel
Board Sponsor
Luckily my stomach handles bacopa fine, even upwards of 600mg/day on an empty stomach, so I'm good there, haha.
They have both been historically recommended to be taken with some fats (I think Ghee butter was something that was used a lot).
Regarding rhodiola, not that there's anything wrong with a higher salidroside extract, and tyrosol is definitely great and allows you to use a lower dose, thus saving space and whatnot, but I know there seems to be a point of diminishing returns (there is with everything) in regards to rhodiola doses (I'm sure you dosed it properly, haha), and luckily I have found a good and very affordable extract that I am quite pleased with.
I think what I'll do is try some BF-7 and rhodiola (I'm already taking bacopa, so don't really see a vital need to add any Centella on top of it all), and then after that I'll try Nootrol and report back to you if I notice any differences between the two. I can also play around with the BF-7 and rhodiola doses for fun.
Im def interested to see what you think compared.
The BF7 extracts currently available dont seem to be great. I dont recommend the SW brand.
Let us know what you think.
brundel
Board Sponsor
I have to get the rest of the results from work but here are a few of the trial results=
Results from initial test; BEFORE NOOTROL
MemTrax test - 92% correct .865 Mean Reaction Time
Human Benchmark tests
1957 points in Visual Memory
41 on Verbal Memory
Reaction Time of 325.0ms
11 on Number Memory
Psychology Today Memory Test - 81
IQ Test - 105
Results from second test; 2 WEEKS NOOTROL
Test results 11/08
MemTrax test - 96% .737 Mean Reaction Time
Human Benchmark Tests
Visual Memory- 6687
Verbal Memory - 47
Reaction Time - 321.0 ms
Number Memory - 10 digits
Psychology Today Memory Test - 84
IQ Test - 115
Results from 11/21 4 WEEKS NOOTROL.
MemTrax Test 96% .728 Mean Reaction Time
Human Benchmark Tests
Visual Memory - 7243
Verbal Memory - 52
Reaction Time - 304.0 ms
Number Memory - 10 digits
Psychology Today Memory Test - 97
IQ Test - 127
===================================================================
Human Benchmark
Number memory: 10 digits, 69%
Reaction Time: 239 ms
Verbal Memory: 22 points
Visual Memory: level 7, score 2698
MemTrax: 90%, mean reaction time 0.827 seconds
Psychology Today: 74
Iqtest: 101
------------------------
Human Benchmark
Number memory: 10 digits, 69%
Reaction Time: 205 ms
Verbal Memory: 46 points!
Visual Memory: level 7,
score 6810!
MemTrax: 98%, mean reaction time 0.768 seconds!
Psychology Today: 90
-though I honestly answered these subjective questions both times, the increased score here is likely reflective of an increased confidence in my memory.
Iqtest: 110
==================================
Human Benchmark-
Number Memory-You scored 7. You're currently in the top 18 percentile for this test!
Reaction Time-You scored 309.0. You're currently in the top 32 percentile for this test!
Verbal Memory-You're currently in the top 17 percentile for this test!
Visual Memory-You scored 5631. You're currently in the top 21 percentile for this test!
Metrax- Mean Reaction Time: 0.979 seconds
Psychology Today- I got 50
IQ Test- 100 IQ(this was so hard in the middle)
------------------------------
Human Benchmark-
Number Memory- You scored 7. You're currently in the top 18 percentile for this test!
Visual Memory- You scored 17723. You're currently in the top 75 percentile for this test!
Reaction Time- You scored 300.0. You're currently in the top 36 percentile for this test!
Verbal Memory- You scored 32. You're currently in the top 42 percentile for this test!
Metrax- Mean Reaction Time:0.925 seconds 86% correct
Psychology Today- 79
IQ Test- 106
===================================================
Pre "Treatment" Test Results:
1. Human Benchmark Tests
a. Number Memory: Level 9 (50%)
b. Reaction Time: Avg - 358 ms (19%)
c. Verbal Memory: 44 points (70%)
d. Visual Memory: Level 8, 8799 points (41%)
2. Mem Trax Test: 92% correct - 0.856 mean reaction time
3. Psychology Today Memory Test: 73
4. General IQ Test: 108 -> finished with approximately 9 minutes left (out of 40).
-------------------------
After two weeks on mystery BLR noot at 1 cap bid:
1. Human Benchmark Tests:
a. Number Memory: Level 10 (69%); +1 Level
b. Reaction Time: Avg of 337 ms (24%); Improvement of 21 ms
c. Verbal Memory: 129 points (98%); improvement of 85 points....
d. Visual Memory: Level 10, Score of 12,873 (59%); +2 levels, 4074 points
2. Memtrax: 96% correct, 0.668 second rxn time; +4% and 0.188 seconds
3. Psychology Today Subjective Memory Questionnaire: Score of 79, 6 point improvement
4. General IQ Test: 126; +18 points -> I forgot to look at how much time was left when I completed it. But, I would guess it was in the 10-15 minute range.
Results from initial test; BEFORE NOOTROL
MemTrax test - 92% correct .865 Mean Reaction Time
Human Benchmark tests
1957 points in Visual Memory
41 on Verbal Memory
Reaction Time of 325.0ms
11 on Number Memory
Psychology Today Memory Test - 81
IQ Test - 105
Results from second test; 2 WEEKS NOOTROL
Test results 11/08
MemTrax test - 96% .737 Mean Reaction Time
Human Benchmark Tests
Visual Memory- 6687
Verbal Memory - 47
Reaction Time - 321.0 ms
Number Memory - 10 digits
Psychology Today Memory Test - 84
IQ Test - 115
Results from 11/21 4 WEEKS NOOTROL.
MemTrax Test 96% .728 Mean Reaction Time
Human Benchmark Tests
Visual Memory - 7243
Verbal Memory - 52
Reaction Time - 304.0 ms
Number Memory - 10 digits
Psychology Today Memory Test - 97
IQ Test - 127
===================================================================
Human Benchmark
Number memory: 10 digits, 69%
Reaction Time: 239 ms
Verbal Memory: 22 points
Visual Memory: level 7, score 2698
MemTrax: 90%, mean reaction time 0.827 seconds
Psychology Today: 74
Iqtest: 101
------------------------
Human Benchmark
Number memory: 10 digits, 69%
Reaction Time: 205 ms
Verbal Memory: 46 points!
Visual Memory: level 7,
score 6810!
MemTrax: 98%, mean reaction time 0.768 seconds!
Psychology Today: 90
-though I honestly answered these subjective questions both times, the increased score here is likely reflective of an increased confidence in my memory.
Iqtest: 110
==================================
Human Benchmark-
Number Memory-You scored 7. You're currently in the top 18 percentile for this test!
Reaction Time-You scored 309.0. You're currently in the top 32 percentile for this test!
Verbal Memory-You're currently in the top 17 percentile for this test!
Visual Memory-You scored 5631. You're currently in the top 21 percentile for this test!
Metrax- Mean Reaction Time: 0.979 seconds
Psychology Today- I got 50
IQ Test- 100 IQ(this was so hard in the middle)
------------------------------
Human Benchmark-
Number Memory- You scored 7. You're currently in the top 18 percentile for this test!
Visual Memory- You scored 17723. You're currently in the top 75 percentile for this test!
Reaction Time- You scored 300.0. You're currently in the top 36 percentile for this test!
Verbal Memory- You scored 32. You're currently in the top 42 percentile for this test!
Metrax- Mean Reaction Time:0.925 seconds 86% correct
Psychology Today- 79
IQ Test- 106
===================================================
Pre "Treatment" Test Results:
1. Human Benchmark Tests
a. Number Memory: Level 9 (50%)
b. Reaction Time: Avg - 358 ms (19%)
c. Verbal Memory: 44 points (70%)
d. Visual Memory: Level 8, 8799 points (41%)
2. Mem Trax Test: 92% correct - 0.856 mean reaction time
3. Psychology Today Memory Test: 73
4. General IQ Test: 108 -> finished with approximately 9 minutes left (out of 40).
-------------------------
After two weeks on mystery BLR noot at 1 cap bid:
1. Human Benchmark Tests:
a. Number Memory: Level 10 (69%); +1 Level
b. Reaction Time: Avg of 337 ms (24%); Improvement of 21 ms
c. Verbal Memory: 129 points (98%); improvement of 85 points....
d. Visual Memory: Level 10, Score of 12,873 (59%); +2 levels, 4074 points
2. Memtrax: 96% correct, 0.668 second rxn time; +4% and 0.188 seconds
3. Psychology Today Subjective Memory Questionnaire: Score of 79, 6 point improvement
4. General IQ Test: 126; +18 points -> I forgot to look at how much time was left when I completed it. But, I would guess it was in the 10-15 minute range.
brundel
Board Sponsor
The murdered motivation is from dopamine dropping as acetylcholine rises. A strong dose of Tyrosol, Rhodiola, centella and caffeine counters that well
.
muscleupcrohn
Legend
Hmm, if that's the same brand I'm thinking of, which it probably is, that's pretty disappointing, as they typically have pretty high quality stuff. I was thinking of starting with 400mg/day BF-7, as studies seem to use 200-400mg, although it seems possible that you may have a bit more than that in Nootrol.
BlackTiger22
Active member
ill give this a go