The Best Insulin Mimicker?

[MAxximal]

YES I LOVE insulin mimickers!

:439:

 

[corsaking]

whens the best time to take ALA?

my tabs are 200 mg so i would like to split and take 2 x 100mg -just wondering whens the best time to do this. I assume also to take with or before a meal with low fat or even none , otherwise arent you going to get fat shuttled into the muscle as well as carbs /protein? Advice please , thanks

 

[freezito]

I'm lonin slin

 

[crazyfool405]

Have you tried out glycobol? The only thing with glycobol is that ur stool will be soft but it will also be green...or at least mine was. I havent tried glycobol in caloric maintenance of above but if it worked during a cut it should work otherwise. But right now im using Anabolic Pump specifically to lose fat and gain muscle while at maintenance.


As long as u dont have diarrhea i dont think soft stool should be much of a concern.

Anyone think otherwise?

not usually the problem

you mainly see it for the first 3 days, after that most people are good to go. but you may notice aspargus smell in your urine even if you havent eaten it. pretty weird, but i found it amusing bc it really made me think if i ate it.

your stools will only be loose with the HIGH doses, otherwise some traditional medicine has used the berberine to treat diareah

takes getting used to but effects are benificial

 

[andrew732]

whens the best time to take ALA?

my tabs are 200 mg so i would like to split and take 2 x 100mg -just wondering whens the best time to do this. I assume also to take with or before a meal with low fat or even none , otherwise arent you going to get fat shuttled into the muscle as well as carbs /protein? Advice please , thanks

take it 25-30 minutes prior to each meal.

 

[MAxximal]

Until i got 1 box of P-slin i will give a try!

 

[saggy321]

haha gotta find it first!! Honestly ive never heard of someone attaching a potassium salt to ALA....u always have these interesting tid bits adams....

TO THE RESEARCH LAB!!!

Guys....

Managed to find a supplier of Ka - ALA in the UK. Do you think its worth trying it? How does it compare to Na -ALA? I used glycobol and liked but I need to buy some more for my upcoming bulk. Just trying to work out what to go for.

 

[oufinny]

Guys....

Managed to find a supplier of Ka - ALA in the UK. Do you think its worth trying it? How does it compare to Na -ALA? I used glycobol and liked but I need to buy some more for my upcoming bulk. Just trying to work out what to go for.

I don't see why not... post up some info on where you found it or if you can PM me the link I would appreciate it. After reading DAdams comments I have to try this.

 

[MAxximal]

maybe this can help you:http://rlipoic.net/

 

[MAxximal]

Punica Granatum Extract

Active Ingredient : Ellagic Acid 20%, Ellagic Acid 40% & Tannins 25%

Common Name : Pomegranate

Chemical Constituents and Components : Main chemical constitutes are punicalagin, ellagic acid, luteolin, quercetin, kaempferol, ellagitannins, anthocyanins (delphinidin, cyanidin, and pelargonidin) and EA-glycosides

Peroxisome proliferator-activated receptor (PPAR)-gamma activators are widely used in the treatment of type 2 diabetes because they improve the sensitivity of insulin receptors.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16102567

 

[MAxximal]

I will try this stack:

Adrenosterone (a.ka. ) 11-oxo, as an 11b=HSD1 inhibitor,has the potential to lower your blood sugar and increase insulin sensitivity. (This is a post by PA on another forum)
cortisol increases circulating insulin and increases fat accumulation

Chromium Polynicotinate:

Chromium plays a role in the metabolism of glucose, and is necessary for energy production. Since this mineral assists in the production of insulin, it helps to stabilize blood sugar levels and can be beneficial both for people with hypoglycemia and diabetes. It is also critical to the synthesis of cholesterol, fats, and proteins.

Chromium polynicotinate is more effective than any other type of chromium, as it binds the elemental chromium to niacin (vitamin B-3). This provides a biologically active form of chromium, which is more absorbable in the body.


Vanadium Citrate, bismaltolato oxo vanadium (an organic vanadyl complex)
A major advance in the use of vanadium as an insulin-mimetic has been the development of organic vanadium complexes which are 2 to 3 times as potent as inorganic vanadium

http://www.jacn.org/cgi/content/full/17/1/11

but i will use Vanadyl Sulfate in safe dose

 

[MAxximal]

I need some opinions here guys???

:food:

 

[DAdams91982]

I need some opinions here guys???

:food:

You know me.. I am a big proponent of Pomegranate. I never had great success with any chromium, never tried 11-oxo, but vanadium always had a place in my insulin stacks.

 

[crazyfool405]

Becareful with the organic vanadium salts as they are more potent and better absorbed into vanadium sensitive tissues as opposed to sulfate which seems to be excreted pretty regularly and doses are able to give you best effect

20mg of bmov is equivelent to 50mg vanadykl sulfate

 

[MAxximal]

You know me.. I am a big proponent of Pomegranate. I never had great success with any chromium, never tried 11-oxo, but vanadium always had a place in my insulin stacks.

i will try it

p.s. wich brand of vanadium you use?

 

[MAxximal]

A Natural Approach To Lowering Blood Sugar


http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2000/sep2000_report_blood.html

 

[DAdams91982]

i will try it

p.s. wich brand of vanadium you use?

My last few stacks have come from Custom Capsule.

 

[DAdams91982]

A Natural Approach To Lowering Blood Sugar


http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2000/sep2000_report_blood.html

Man I love LEF. Their product and knowledge far surpasses anything you will find in the BB community.

 

[MAxximal]

Becareful with the organic vanadium salts as they are more potent and better absorbed into vanadium sensitive tissues as opposed to sulfate which seems to be excreted pretty regularly and doses are able to give you best effect

20mg of bmov is equivelent to 50mg vanadykl sulfate

:sad3: good to know!!!

Thanks crazyfool405

 

[MAxximal]

Chromium and polyphenols from cinnamon improve insulin sensitivity

http://www.cinsulin.com/Anderson Nutrition Society Feb 08.pdf

 

[MAxximal]

List of Glucose Disposal Agents
BY Druss

1. R-ALA R-Alpha Lipoic Acid (R-ALA), an active isomer of Lipoic Acid, is easily synthesized and metabolized by the body. R-ALA is 2 times more effective than regular (RS) Alpha Lipoic Acid and is a key component of mitochondrial dehydrogenase, which may help to slow the natural aging process in animals. Alpha lipoic acid is known as the "universal antioxidant" because of its unique solubility in both water and fat. It has the ability to conserve and prolong the life of vitamins C & E in the body, increasing their effectiveness. Alpha lipoic acid is also an excellent metal detoxifier, particularly for mercury and cadmium, which it binds to and neutralizes for excretion.

2. Bitter Melon contains four very promising bioactive compounds. These compounds activate a protein called AMPK, which is well known for regulating fuel metabolism and enabling glucose uptake, processes which are impaired in diabetics. "We can now understand at a molecular level why bitter melon works as a treatment for diabetes," said David James, director of the diabetes and obesity program at the Garvan Institute of Medical Research in Sydney. "By isolating the compounds we believe to be therapeutic, we can investigate how they work together in our cells." Bitter melon contains a lectin that has insulin-like activity. The insulin-like bioactivity of this lectin is due to its linking together 2 insulin receptors. This lectin lowers blood glucose concentrations by acting on peripheral tissues and, similar to insulin's effects in the brain, suppressing appetite. This lectin is likely a major contributor to the hypoglycemic effect that develops after eating bitter melon and why it may be a way of managing adult-onset diabetes. Lectin binding is non-protein specific, and this is likely why bitter melon has been credited with immunostimulatory activity - by linking receptors that modulate the immune system, thereby stimulating said receptors.

3. Gymnema Sylvestre is native to India, and its leaves are a traditional folk medicine for diabetes. Several studies in humans and animals have confirmed it can improve glucose control, possibly by inhibiting glucose uptake in the small intestine and enhancing insulin release. It may even have positive effects on lipid metabolism and has potential for use in treating diabetes and obesity.

4. Phellodendron amurense is otherwise known as "Amur Cork Tree." A native of Asia, the bark has been used in Chinese traditional medicine to treat gastrointestinal problems, ulcers, diabetes and infections.Berberine is the best characterized of the compounds that have been identified. Berberine has antibacterial, anti-tumor and antioxidant activities. It may also have anti-diabetic activity: in one study, it decreased body fat and fasting glucose levels in rats. This work is not conclusive, however, as the berberine was administered by injection, not consumed orally. Unfortunately, we don't have many other in-vivo studies on berberine or Phellodendron.

5. chromium picolinate or Chromium Polynicotinate or Chromium FTG or chelated Chromium a nutritional form of the essential mineral chromium, as a safe nutritional supplement that may reduce the risk of insulin resistance and possibly type 2 diabetes. One small study suggests that chromium picolinate may reduce the risk of insulin resistance, and therefore possibly may reduce the risk of type 2 diabetes. FDA concludes, however, that the existence of such a relationship between chromium picolinate and either insulin resistance or type 2 diabetes is highly uncertain. Chromium Polynicotinate is a niacin bound form of chromium picolinate which is considered less potentially toxic with better absorbsion qualities while FTG and the chelated form of chromium are from organic sources and considered the safest of all.

6. Vanadyl Sulfate Under normal conditions, the body contains 20 to 25 mg. of vanadium, and the average diet supplies about 2 mg. of vanadium per day. Food sources rich in vanadium include pepper, dill, radishes, eggs, vegetable oils, buckwheat and oats. Because of their organic environment, these natural sources are likely to be safer than over the counter preparations.

7. Cinnamon There has been a lot of talk these days about cinnamon. According to some studies, cinnamon may improve blood glucose and cholesterol levels in people with Type 2 diabetes. The results of a study from 2003 in Pakistan showed lower levels of fasting glucose, triglycerides, LDL cholesterol and total cholesterol after 40 days with levels continuing to drop for 20 days after that.

8. Vinegar You can lower blood sugar with apple cider vinegar, which has long been valued for its nutritive properties as a folk remedy. The health benefits and effect of apple cider vinegar on blood glucose levels has been clinically researched.

9. Corosolic acid, a triterpenoid found in the leaves, helps regulate blood sugar by stimulating glucose uptake. This blood sugar lowering effect is similar to that of insulin - which induces glucose transport from the blood into body cells. In a study of humans with type-2 diabetes, banaba extract showed a 30% reduction in blood glucose levels. It is considered a natural plant insulin, can be taken orally, and has no side effects, according to Japanese research. Corsolic acid also appears to have strong antioxidant properties.

10. Extracts of Fenugreek The chemical compounds found in fenugreek have the ability to aid the digestive process. Consequently, when taken with meals it is believed that fenugreek is able to slow down the rate at which sugars are absorbed into the body, whereby regulating blood sugar levels. Additionally, studies indicate that 4-hydroxyisoleucine (an amino acid) found in fenugreek may induce or promote the production of insulin when blood sugar levels are elevated.

11. Cissus quadrangularis is also known as "Veld Grape." It's another medicinal plant native to Africa, India, and other parts of Asia. Cissus has traditionally been used to treat a variety of ailments such as bone fractures, ulcers, wounds, indigestion and asthma. Animal studies have shown Cissus extracts may have gastroprotective effects, contribute to bone health, and have antioxidant/antimicrobial activities. A number of people swear by Cissus as an analgesic and use it to treat weight lifting injuries. Lately, Cissus has also been touted as a fat loss agent, thanks to two studies.The first was discussed by Paul in his review of Cylaris. Of course, this study actually tested the entire Cylaris formula—which makes it difficult to draw conclusions about Cissus itself. A second study, however, did test a proprietary Cissus extract (CQR-300) and concluded it "...brought about significant reductions in weight and blood glucose levels, while decreasing serum lipids thus improving cardiovascular risk factors."

12. Phellodendron extract Anti-inflammatory, antipyretic, cholagogue, antibacterial, lowers blood sugar.

13. BMOV (Bis-Malto-Oxovanadium) BMOV is an organic form of the mineral vanadium. Although elemental vanadium and inorganic salts of vanadium show significant biological potential, it has a poor therapeutic index due to low gastrointestinal absorbance. BMOV is recognized as safer, more absorbable, and able to deliver a therapeutic effect up to 50% greater than the inorganic forms. (9) Vanadium is one of the rare microelements that can promote a profound boost in endurance and strongly support anabolism. BMOV can give muscles a hardness like you have never experience before. The form of vanadium used in this formula is one of the very best you can find, if not the best.

14. Na-R-ALA(Na RALA is the sodium salt form of R-Lipoic Acid) Sodium R-Lipoate (Na-r-ALA)
ALA is naturally produced in the body as a mitochondrial enzyme cofactor. It is important to aerobic metabolism. ALA has been shown to increase cellular uptake of glucose to cell membranes by recruiting the glucose transporter GLUT4. ALA improves skeletal muscle glucose transport, resulting in desirable blood glucose disposal and increased muscle glycogen concentrations. (1) Studies also indicate that in muscle, ALA is a potent anti-oxidant which protects cells from oxidative stress-induced insulin resistance. (2) The ALA used in this formula is chemically stabilized and of the highest quality. It?s the most active isomer and the highest potency salt commercially available. ALA is an invaluable addition that offers a multitude of benefits plus countless extras for any serious athlete.

15. Magnolia officinalis Magnolia bark is used as a general anti-stress and anti-anxiety agent - so its claims typically center on general benefits in controlling stress and anxiety. Newer claims are emerging, however, to link magnolia's anti-stress benefits with control of the body's primary stress hormone, cortisol, and the myriad health benefits associated with normal cortisol levels (versus elevated cortisol, which has been associated with obesity, diabetes, osteoporosis, memory problems and suppressed immune function).

15. Lagerstroemia speciosa is Banaba—a tree native to Southeast Asia. The leaves have been used in traditional medicine in the Phillipines as a treatment for diabetes. As it turns out, the leaves are high in corosolic acid, which has been shown to improve glucose control in human and animal studies. It appears to do this by stimulating glucose uptake in muscle cells. Glucose transport is mediated by specific transporter proteins. Corosolic acid acts by increasing the amount of a particular transporter (GLUT-4) on the cell membrane surface. Although more work remains to be done, banaba looks like a useful ingredient for treating hyperglycemia and diabetes.

BY Druss

 

[crazyfool405]

i have never been convinced by bitter melon standardized extract or 10:1 extracts and more, to me it didnt serve any function

want to increase AMPK another way is Goats Rue3% extract methanol aqueous extract which is GALEGINE thats pretty good for that function

another way for AMPK isw berberine HCL

i also havent seen enough human data on Bitter melon to ever use it again unless theres a super special amazing extract (maybe p insulin) that activates both PPARa/y for best effect, but who knows if thats even good orally bc the human studies used in IM or IV

 

[djbombsquad]

Medforman for the win

 

[crazyfool405]

Try recompadrol I've seen some one compare it to metformin and I've seen someone say "closest thing to real slin"

 

[MAxximal]

Try recompadrol I've seen some one compare it to metformin and I've seen someone say "closest thing to real slin"

Really?

 

[MAxximal]

GENERIC NAME: metformin


Metformin lowers the levels of glucose (sugar) in blood in three different ways. First, it reduces the amount of glucose produced by your liver; second, it reduces the amount of glucose absorbed from food through your stomach; and third, it improves the effectiveness of insulin in the body in reducing glucose already in the blood.

 

[crazyfool405]

Yea. I have to find the links. I can't post them here tho due to the rules

 

[crazyfool405]

I loved metformin. Used it with gbol a few times. Since release of recompadrol I haven't had to use either

 

[Rodja]

Metformin KILLS test production.

 

[crazyfool405]

Its not that bad. Its a little blown out of proportion IME. And research doesn't show it haveing a tremendous effect. Just one that was noted

 

[MAxximal]

Metformin KILLS test production.

WHAT???? is a JOKE rigth?

 

[crazyfool405]

Does not kill it it does have an effect on it though. Enough to be noted but not enough to cause issue the way we use it

 

[DAdams91982]

WHAT???? is a JOKE rigth?

Depends on which study you believe. I have read a study that Met induced a 48% drop in T, and another showing a 23% increase in SBHG, then other studies have lower numbers. Most studies are done on women though. There are a few out there on men that do show enough of a lowered total T, and raised SBHG enough to impact free T quite a bit that keeps me from using it. Just other stuff out there that doesnt have the same possible consequences.

 

[Rodja]

Depends on which study you believe. I have read a study that Met induced a 48% drop in T, and another showing a 23% increase in SBHG, then other studies have lower numbers. Most studies are done on women though. There are a few out there on men that do show enough of a lowered total T, and raised SBHG enough to impact free T quite a bit that keeps me from using it. Just other stuff out there that doesnt have the same possible consequences.

Exactly. There are plenty of fantastic repartitioners without the potential to significantly lower test production. K-R-ALA, ALCAR, Banaba, etc. are much better options.

 

[MAxximal]

Cheaters Relief by BSN????

 

[crazyfool405]

Cheaters relief is good I knew a few people who used it

 

[MAxximal]

Cheaters relief is good I knew a few people who used it

is good dosed?

 

[crazyfool405]

is good dosed?

seems like it may be a little underdosed.

the opunita never really appealed to me studies were not extremly convincing.

The beef i have with it is chitosan, because it blunts fat absorbtion leading to steatorreah (fat malabsorbtion and loose foul smelling stool worse then normal)

white kidney bean i played around with but i just found in the doses to make effective left me way to bloated, but it does work for carbohydrates.

Cinnulin PF, theres SOME supporting research but not insane amounts, or even very good research on it. I tried looking it up for my research methodology class research paper.

4oh isoluecine is a GREAT supplement however it gets expensive or takes up too much space in the capsule to get the dose you really need which is around 50mg

I think if you really go out on a limb and eat completely ****ty or even not ****ty your going to have ill effect.s

 

[MAxximal]

seems like it may be a little underdosed.

the opunita never really appealed to me studies were not extremly convincing.

The beef i have with it is chitosan, because it blunts fat absorbtion leading to steatorreah (fat malabsorbtion and loose foul smelling stool worse then normal)

white kidney bean i played around with but i just found in the doses to make effective left me way to bloated, but it does work for carbohydrates.

Cinnulin PF, theres SOME supporting research but not insane amounts, or even very good research on it. I tried looking it up for my research methodology class research paper.

4oh isoluecine is a GREAT supplement however it gets expensive or takes up too much space in the capsule to get the dose you really need which is around 50mg

I think if you really go out on a limb and eat completely ****ty or even not ****ty your going to have ill effect.s

look

Directions For BSN Cheaters Relief: Use the chart at the bottom of this page to determine the amount of capsules to take 15 minutes prior to, and 15 minutes after, a meal which corresponds to the carbohydrates and fats listed below. Drink with 8 oz. of water. Any fat-soluble vitamins (A, D, E & K) or essential fatty acids should be taken at least 4 hours before or after ingestion of this product. Do not consume more than 3 servings per day

so is before and after a meal?????:bigeyes:

 

[crazyfool405]

yea i see,the reason for after is for the chitosan i believe, everything else needs to be taken before, however i can see how it can be used after a meal as well to drop sugar levels again,.

http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/30/9/2236.full?ijkey=3669bbe29f9cd0780dad775a7a9fb479a6e1de51&keytype2=tf_ipsecsha

this study was good and spoke about other studies and problems with itr

 

[MAxximal]

yea i see,the reason for after is for the chitosan i believe, everything else needs to be taken before, however i can see how it can be used after a meal as well to drop sugar levels again,.

http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/30/9/2236.full?ijkey=3669bbe29f9cd0780dad775a7a9fb479a6e1de51&keytype2=tf_ipsecsha

this study was good and spoke about other studies and problems with itr

:damnit: this is not deal maybe 4 bottles for a month run????

 

[crazyfool405]

http://www.fasebj.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/24/1_MeetingAbstracts/722.1

 

[crazyfool405]

:damnit: this is not deal maybe 4 bottles for a month run????

that sentance was jambled lol rewrite it in plain english haha

 

[MAxximal]

that sentance was jambled lol rewrite it in plain english haha

:lol:

 

[MAxximal]

http://www.fasebj.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/24/1_MeetingAbstracts/722.1

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to crazyfool405 again

 

[crazyfool405]

i like how they set up their chart, however ive never had a problem consuming 200 carbs for 2 caps of recompadrol so i dont need that supplement

also the way they set up their chart steers me away, what about refeed meals or days when carbs go upwards of 800 carbs, you take the whole bottle that day?

****ty marketing scheme, good idea. Poor directions

 

[crazyfool405]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to crazyfool405 again

oh you like that one? lol its like the newest one out.

 

[John Smeton]

Glycobol simply because the fact it contains NA-R-ALA , which is 10-30 x;s more powerful than the already potent R-Ala.

In fact I have a Life extension magazine that goes in depth on R-Ala , mentions how beneficial it is, and talks about NA-R-Ala. In my opinion from my research less is best with NA-R-Ala because it is super potent.

 

[crazyfool405]

Glycobol simply because the fact it contains NA-R-ALA , which is 10-30 x;s more powerful than the already potent R-Ala.

In fact I have a Life extension magazine that goes in depth on R-Ala and how beneficial it is

yea i love how it works its great my only beef is not everyone can use it due to the effect it has on synthetic t4 (synthroid) which as we age a lot of people end up using

 

[DAdams91982]

Crazy, What type of dosing scheme do you utilize with Recomp to avoid fat gain from one serious cheat meal... I havent used Recomp, so want to know the basics of it.