How to "pulse" orals

[ImJ2x]

Just curious but with your pulsing style are you taking the SD 3 days straight with 4 off days then repeat?

Hey j -- yes, that's exactly what I'm doing. And I think DrD's right -- you may be able to run this type of cycle almost indefinitely. (I'm at the 4 month mark, and showing no signs of shutdown. I think D's "bounceback" explanation is accurate.)
I'm currently closing out with a short, quick 2on/3off Phera pulse, just to see how I react to the stuff. Then I'll run a precautionary, light PCT (though I really don't think I need it), and take a little time off, just to give my liver and lipids a break.
And then my next experiment will be the hypothetical perpetual cycle -- 2on/5off, as follows:

Mon: PH/PS, OTC-PCT, Test Booster, Support Supps, Lift
Tues: PH/PS, OTC-PCT, Test Booster, Support Supps, Lift
Wed: OTC-PCT, Test Booster, Support Supps
Thurs: OTC-PCT, Test Booster, Support Supps
Fri: No supps at all, Cardio, Abs
Sat: No supps at all
Sun: No supps at all, Cardio, Abs

This protocol really is like a "micro cycle," complete with hormonals, PCT, and even 3 days totally off, each week. The hardest part is coming up with a decent routine to get a full-body workout in 2 consecutive days. But I think I've got that figured out.

 

[EasyEJL]

Dr. D or Easy, or any body else for that matter,
Any particular brand of adrenosterone that you recommend?

Don't buy androXtreme, I've yet to see positive results from anyone taking it at any dose. if you want it precapped then 11-oxo is the only choice today otherwise Custom Nutrition Warehouse has it in bulk powder, but it goes in and out of stock frequently.

 

[jminis]

Yeah, it does make a slight difference in the long run. These are the most optimal:

M,W,F - Can't go wrong with this one!

2 days on, 2-3 days off - Great if you w/o 3.5-4x/wk instead of 3.

3 days on, 4 days off - I like this one best because the consecutive doses further support the previous days w/o recovery. You can still train hard with no DOMS until the ~5th day instead of the 2nd or 3rd day. Plus you get a nice long off time to bounce. If you're smart with a handful of healthy supps everyday and just lift for good strength maintenance, you might could do this one indefinitely.

Sounds good D. Thanks and again welcome back.

 

[coops]

Would i be wasting my time taking 20mg of epistane everytime i trained (4-6 times a week) 10mg before and 10 mg after. Rather than running higher doses on courses? I ask this as i ran a 2 week course stepping upto 40mg daily a bit ago, my muscles reponded really well but i couldn't get an erection in the 2nd week! and after about a week later slight gyno increase. In every other way i felt great on them and like i said i was very impressed with the results on my muscles. I still have 3 bottles left and i'd like to use them as more of a supplement when i train. Is there any merit in doing this?

 

[maynehood171]

Yes, it's been debated vigorously yet sporadically in many places on and off this thread! People complain that this is a flaw to the method, but it's actually an essential character of it. Fluctuation is not a problem with the pulse method, it IS the pulse method.

People used to say, "yeah, but it causes a lot of brief hormonal fluctuation..." Well no duh! That's why it's called 'pulsing' lol I don't hear this argument much anymore though. I think there's plenty of feedback validating the claims of the protocol now. Those claims being that it is more safe and economical than standard cycles and still amazingly effective with minimal libido, liver and HDL impact. It's not for all but it's very suitable for many.

Thanks VERY MUCH for taking the time to respond and clarify! I love pulsing but this argument just had me worried...info coming from the reputable creator is good enough for me! Thanks again and God Bless!

 

[ImJ2x]

And don't forget -- these are minor fluctuations, unlike a "straight" cycle, where you get much more extreme, long-term fluctuations. Think of the roller-coaster analogy: A regular cycle is like a vicious ride, with very high climbs and very steep drops. Whereas the pulse cycle is more like a kiddie-coaster, with more frequent, but much less extreme climbs and drops. Easier on you system, if done right.

 

[ImJ2x]

Thanks VERY MUCH for taking the time to respond and clarify! I love pulsing but this argument just had me worried...info coming from the reputable creator is good enough for me! Thanks again and God Bless!

PS: DrD's cool, but I'm not sure I'd call him "the Creator," lol.

 

[maynehood171]

PS: DrD's cool, but I'm not sure I'd call him "the Creator," lol.

Haha! He has been the only one I've seen to initialize the idea...maybe call him the originator? lol

 

[maynehood171]

And don't forget -- these are minor fluctuations, unlike a "straight" cycle, where you get much more extreme, long-term fluctuations. Think of the roller-coaster analogy: A regular cycle is like a vicious ride, with very high climbs and very steep drops. Whereas the pulse cycle is more like a kiddie-coaster, with more frequent, but much less extreme climbs and drops. Easier on you system, if done right.

This is how I see it...not fluctuating that bad compared to straight cycle...just too much hype from skeptics that I thought I'd just ask "the man" himself haha...good analogy too!

 

[young4life]

Would i be wasting my time taking 20mg of epistane everytime i trained (4-6 times a week) 10mg before and 10 mg after. Rather than running higher doses on courses? I ask this as i ran a 2 week course stepping upto 40mg daily a bit ago, my muscles reponded really well but i couldn't get an erection in the 2nd week! and after about a week later slight gyno increase. In every other way i felt great on them and like i said i was very impressed with the results on my muscles. I still have 3 bottles left and i'd like to use them as more of a supplement when i train. Is there any merit in doing this?

Same thing happened to me. I was on a 4 week straight Epi cycle running 20-30-30-40 each week. By day 14, I was shut down, balls and all. The last 10 days I've been running Tamox at 20mg the first week and 10 the second, MassFX MS, Retain2, Anabolic Pump and started HD2 on day 7. Taking HD2 3 times per day and will stop the Tamox after tomorrow. I'm back up and running so I think I don't need the Tamox. So far I've been on 2 weeks of Epi and going into 2 weeks of the MassFX stack.

Dr D, EASY or anyone with good knowledge, my question is: when can I start a pulse of Epi? I workout on T-TH-S-SU and will take it on T-TH-S. ED I will use MassFX MS, Retain2 and HD2 because I shut down easily. Off days will include the above plus CS. Thinking of using 30 - 40mgs on the three day split. B/W - 215 - 217

PLease add or subtract from the above. Looking for help!:welcome::wave:

 

[maynehood171]

Same thing happened to me. I was on a 4 week straight Epi cycle running 20-30-30-40 each week. By day 14, I was shut down, balls and all. The last 10 days I've been running Tamox at 20mg the first week and 10 the second, MassFX MS, Retain2, Anabolic Pump and started HD2 on day 7. Taking HD2 3 times per day and will stop the Tamox after tomorrow. I'm back up and running so I think I don't need the Tamox. So far I've been on 2 weeks of Epi and going into 2 weeks of the MassFX stack.

Dr D, EASY or anyone with good knowledge, my question is: when can I start a pulse of Epi? I workout on T-TH-S-SU and will take it on T-TH-S. ED I will use MassFX MS, Retain2 and HD2 because I shut down easily. Off days will include the above plus CS. Thinking of using 30 - 40mgs on the three day split. B/W - 215 - 217

PLease add or subtract from the above. Looking for help!:welcome::wave:

IMO...I'd wait since you were shutdown...balls and all. There is actually a general formula Dr. D has said to use depending on the amount of time on cycle...I'll find it and post it again...

Edit:

Quote Response from Dr. D:

Toff = (Ton + PCT) 2

Now, if you're on 3-4 days per wk (x = 3 or 4) the original equation is modified to this:

Toff = [Ton (X/7)] 2

Of course, the new equation does not account for PCT since you are pulsing. So if you do an 8wk pulse dosing @ 3x/wk, time off = 6 weeks and 6 days, so ~ 7wks. This is twice as much off time as is needed IMO, but I definitely like your methodology.

 

[ImJ2x]

Haha! He has been the only one I've seen to initialize the idea...maybe call him the originator? lol

That works.

 

[DR.D]

Dr.D--- Good test boosters are as hard to come by as good women it seems these days. What exactly would you consider a "good" test-booster:think:? I've tried many, and disliked most!! I'm experimenting with bulk testofen powder right now. It's early, but it seems to be working better than divanil, icariin, and some of the other popular items. Do you have any preferences?

I like fenugreek cycled 3-4wks on, then 1-2wks off, then repeat. Testofen (50% fen saps) seems to be one of the strongest available right now. The batches I've tested are usually about 2.5-3.0x stronger than standard fenugreek.

I like to stack that with an AI too. My favorite/cleanest AI is 6-Br, but micronized formestane is a close second. If you haven't tried Hyperdrol yet, you may want to give it a shot. It's got a good dose of 6-Br in it.

BTW- Women are like test boosters, you got that right brother! You have to try a lot of them, then the best you can hope for is to narrow it down to one with the least amount of issues and the best results.

 

[ImJ2x]

...or Alba.

 

[DR.D]

...or Alba.

I forgot about that one alright.

Science is great, but some mysteries just defy logic don't they?
:chick:

 

[ImJ2x]

D -- I just noticed your "rep" is down to 474. That's almost my level, lol. We can't have that. I think rep is retarded, but if anyone should have it, it's you. So...
Everyone who reads this seminal thread by DrD should hook him up with a little rep. I'll start.

 

[coops]

Would i be wasting my time taking 20mg of epistane everytime i trained (4-6 times a week) 10mg before and 10 mg after. Rather than running higher doses on courses? I ask this as i ran a 2 week course stepping upto 40mg daily a bit ago, my muscles reponded really well but i couldn't get an erection in the 2nd week! and after about a week later slight gyno increase. In every other way i felt great on them and like i said i was very impressed with the results on my muscles. I still have 3 bottles left and i'd like to use them as more of a supplement when i train. Is there any merit in doing this?

bump.

 

[maynehood171]

D -- I just noticed your "rep" is down to 474. That's almost my level, lol. We can't have that. I think rep is retarded, but if anyone should have it, it's you. So...
Everyone who reads this seminal thread by DrD should hook him up with a little rep. I'll start.

I'm with you on this! Was wondering the same thing...he should have the most rep in this joint...though my rep won't bring him up much since it's lower than his haha

 

[thundergod]

I like fenugreek cycled 3-4wks on, then 1-2wks off, then repeat. Testofen (50% fen saps) seems to be one of the strongest available right now. The batches I've tested are usually about 2.5-3.0x stronger than standard fenugreek.

I like to stack that with an AI too. My favorite/cleanest AI is 6-Br, but micronized formestane is a close second. If you haven't tried Hyperdrol yet, you may want to give it a shot. It's got a good dose of 6-Br in it.

BTW- Women are like test boosters, you got that right brother! You have to try a lot of them, then the best you can hope for is to narrow it down to one with the least amount of issues and the best results.

Thank you very much kind Dr. I do use an Ai with the testofen. I use transdermal formestane. I love it too! Thanks for your time and input!:clap2:

 

[maynehood171]

BTW- Women are like test boosters, you got that right brother! You have to try a lot of them, then the best you can hope for is to narrow it down to one with the least amount of issues and the best results.

:toofunny: I like these kinds of jokes...hopefully Crader doesn't come in and see this D haha...

 

[thundergod]

:toofunny: I like these kinds of jokes...hopefully Crader doesn't come in and see this D haha...

Not to worry. Crader is a smokin' hot Babe!!:chick:

 

[maynehood171]

Not to worry. Crader is a smokin' hot Babe!!:chick:

OMG I know...not like I'm jumping through my computer screen over this but I saw some pics and...VERY NICE! haha. I need a woman who will work out with me :sad:

 

[dust]

will superdrol come up postitve in urine tesst??????????

 

[maynehood171]

will superdrol come up postitve in urine tesst??????????

I've seen this asked before but don't remember where or what the answer was...I'm curious myself...

 

[mersberg]

Dr D

Dr D,
Could you critique my pulse . Also what is your thoughts on delayed gyno from SD? Would the HDX2 and ATD cause that or do its job of suppression. Thanks

Ok about start my 6 wk SD pulse. 32Y/o 230 17%BF. Lift 5 days a week
Flaxseed Oil 2x 1000mg/ED
Multi/ED Protein/ED BCAA/ED
ON M W F
1 10 20 20 On days HDX2 2Bedtime(AI)
2 30 30 30 Alpha drive 3x(TB)
3 30 30 30
4 30 30 30 OFF days HDX2 1am 1pm 2Bedtime
5 30 30 30 DHEA 50-200mg 1am 1pm(Cort Cont)
6 30 30 30 Alpha DriveXL 3x
PCT
7 SNS PCT STack (Inhibit E + Reduce XT) Alpha DriveXL 3x(ATD,Cort Cont,TB)
8 SNS PCT STack (Inhibit E + Reduce XT) Alpha DriveXL 3x

Creatine/ED during PCT
Let me know how this sounds and if you would recommend any changes.

 

[hman85]

will superdrol come up postitve in urine tesst??????????

Shouldn't unles it ia a very extensive test, they have to be testing for steroids and it is very expensive. I don't think most government jobs even test for it. You can also always say its legal because you can buy it anywhere!

 

[maynehood171]

Shouldn't unles it ia a very extensive test, they have to be testing for steroids and it is very expensive. I don't think most government jobs even test for it. You can also always say its legal because you can buy it anywhere!

It technically is still legal but not because you can buy it anywhere I know what you are saying though haha.

 

[thundergod]

It technically is still legal but not because you can buy it anywhere I know what you are saying though haha.

Most drug tests are for jobs and they DON'T include steroids! They are testing for illicit "street" drugs like coke, meth, crack, and pot. Don't worry about a little superdrol or something in your system!!

 

[sharky]

i am starting my 8 week (instead of 12 wk) in about a week. i will be hitting 750mg sust the first 2 weeks and 500mg/wk there after. i am going to run d-bol with it and after reading this i believe i will pulse the d-bol. probably 25mg week 1/ 30mg week 2/ 35mg week there after all being 3xweek. (m/w/f) sounds like a plan. i was planning on running provirone throughout. do you think this will change anything?

 

[ImJ2x]

i am starting my 8 week (instead of 12 wk) in about a week. i will be hitting 750mg sust the first 2 weeks and 500mg/wk there after. i am going to run d-bol with it and after reading this i believe i will pulse the d-bol. probably 25mg week 1/ 30mg week 2/ 35mg week there after all being 3xweek. (m/w/f) sounds like a plan. i was planning on running provirone throughout. do you think this will change anything?

The whole reason for pulsing is to avoid shutdown. You won't be able to avoid shutdown with this cycle, because of the test. But I still think it's a good idea to pulse the Dbol, just to minimize the other sides (liver, lethargy, etc.). So I think I approve of your plan. Just know that you'll still need a full PCT to restart your HPTA.

 

[sharky]

yeah

yeah i realize that but i do think as you do. it should be a little easier on my body.

 

[dust]

I've seen this asked before but don't remember where or what the answer was...I'm curious myself...

i kno the test is a urine test where they dip a little piece of paper in the urine and send that out, can that type of test even be used to detect steroids??

 

[FOOFAC]

Yes if they are screening for it. BTW oral steroids take 14 days to clear for a litmus paper test.

 

[hman85]

I am not sure if they have that i could be wrong but thought it was alot more of an extensive. btw there are lots of threads about this so lets keep it to pulsing

 

[glipp]

What do people think of Powerfull as a test booster for off days on a pulse? I am thinking of using this on my epi pulse.

 

[RBKing]

What do people think of Powerfull as a test booster for off days on a pulse? I am thinking of using this on my epi pulse.

Personally, I've never found it much of a test booster, but I think it really does increase GH, and it sure does help you
sleep well. I LOVE the supplement, but not as a test booster.

 

[RBKing]

I take Powerful on ON days as well as OFF days!

 

[thundergod]

I'll drop a little suggestion and recommend you guys give bulk testofen powder a try next time. I really like it compared to the other "test-boosters" out there right now. Do a little searching!:gotsearch

 

[glipp]

I take Powerful on ON days as well as OFF days!

Thanks for the replies. I am a regular Powerfull user and will probably run it throughout as well. I will look elsewhere for a test booster, maybe bulk testofen powder as thundergod recommends. How much do you take on off days when you take it?

 

[MacTech]

Prolonged use of endogenous steroids will shut your HPTA down, pulsed or otherwise. To think it won't, is silly. It may not happen as fast doing a pulse, but you are also not replacing the missing hormone your own body is being instructed not to produce.

I need to have my endocrinologist friend join these forums. I am fortunate to be able to get his free advice at the gym, in person from a real doctor.

A SERM is the best test booster anyways, so why not take it after your cycle, pulsed or not? That is why they are so highly recommended for PCT.

The next dispute is how long can you take a SERM without sides.

 

[maynehood171]

Prolonged use of endogenous steroids will shut your HPTA down, pulsed or otherwise. To think it won't, is silly. It may not happen as fast doing a pulse, but you are also not replacing the missing hormone your own body is being instructed not to produce.

I need to have my endocrinologist friend join these forums. I am fortunate to be able to get his free advice at the gym, in person from a real doctor.

A SERM is the best test booster anyways, so why not take it after your cycle, pulsed or not? That is why they are so highly recommended for PCT.

The next dispute is how long can you take a SERM without sides.

Nicely said! That's my feeling on this also. Even have the quote in my sig . IMO (and I'm sure some will say well duh...obviously...but I still don't see it being done)...is that for pulsing I think the SERM dosing protocol should be lower regardless. You are suppressed in one way or another (esp. those who are going 6 weeks +) and may still have your balls also...but saying that your balls are still dragging on the ground behind you when you are walking is not a good indicator of not being suppressed. I love the "I don't feel suppressed" comments also...

I like the (Dr. H.something..? Forgot who) approach of 40/40/40 (Nolva) for 1st 3 days then 20 throughout...(if I remember right with a 48 hour half life it would take almost 2 weeks for the drug to fully leave the body at 40mg). I followed this even after my Havoc pulse of 8 weeks and my natural test went up enough to the point I had oily skin again in 2 weeks and horny as a mothafukcr...my point...I SERM regardless but adjust the dosing protocol accordingly...I may be f'n up my body taking orals but I'll do whatever I need to make sure I try and put my body back in the position I found it in

 

[ManBeast]

From the first post (I'll admit I have not read all 67 pages) it seems as though Dr. D. is not advocating it as a way to stay on indefinitely, but as an alternative dosing method for normal-length cycles. I am very interested in this protocall since it seems to be the best bet with many of the legal compounds being oral and methylated.

MB

 

[MacTech]

I cannot state that pulsing does not have some merit. I would not like the constant fluctuation of hormone levels that would result from it.

However, to skip PCT and to think you are not shutdown is a BIG mistake.

If you are going to take oral steroids then do it correctly and minimize the sides, get your HPTA back in check and work like a mofo in the gym and nutrition to keep those gains.

 

[EasyEJL]

I cannot state that pulsing does not have some merit. I would not like the constant fluctuation of hormone levels that would result from it.

with most of the oral steroids having 4-6 hour half lifes (some shorter), you get the fluctuations even if you do a straight cycle.

 

[MacTech]

with most of the oral steroids having 4-6 hour half lifes (some shorter), you get the fluctuations even if you do a straight cycle.

That is why dosing protocol plays an important part of the success of a cycle.

Compare it to eating 3 meals a day, skip a day, then eat 3 meals the next. How well would that work? I don't see much difference.

 

[maynehood171]

with most of the oral steroids having 4-6 hour half lifes (some shorter), you get the fluctuations even if you do a straight cycle.

Yes sir indeed...IMO also

 

[maynehood171]

I cannot state that pulsing does not have some merit. I would not like the constant fluctuation of hormone levels that would result from it.

However, to skip PCT and to think you are not shutdown is a BIG mistake.

If you are going to take oral steroids then do it correctly and minimize the sides, get your HPTA back in check and work like a mofo in the gym and nutrition to keep those gains.

Well said my friend...my thoughts as well...

 

[EasyEJL]

That is why dosing protocol plays an important part of the success of a cycle.

Compare it to eating 3 meals a day, skip a day, then eat 3 meals the next. How well would that work? I don't see much difference.

can you give an example of your dosing protocol and be particular around a compound? using 20mg of superdrol as an example, there isn't any way to have significantly less fluctuation on a straight cycle than taking 30 or 40 on a pulse. when I say less fluctuation, I mean frequency, not amplitude.

 

[MacTech]

can you give an example of your dosing protocol and be particular around a compound? using 20mg of superdrol as an example, there isn't any way to have significantly less fluctuation on a straight cycle than taking 30 or 40 on a pulse. when I say less fluctuation, I mean frequency, not amplitude.

I have never used Superdrol.

I currently am taking Methyl MasterDrol v2 for 4 weeks, 3 10mgs ED, 7am - preworkout [1pm] and before bed 10 pm.

I can really feel this stuff and can imagine that going an entire day without it, would have an effect on how well it works, for me anyways. This is also what is recommended by the manufacturer.

Only stating you will be putting your body through longer times without peak concentrations in your blood. Much like I wouldn't want to go an entire day without food. It's not like injectable oils that have much longer half lives.

But if pulsing works for others, that's great. I am not saying that is wrong. My motto has always been ' If it feels good, just do it '

 

[EasyEJL]

I just started the methyl masterdrol as well, although I think for me the dosing will be more like 7am/1pm/7pm. Pulsing really is for the more hardcore high side effect hormonal products, largely just to avoid those sides. Theres definitely nothing wrong with doing full cycles