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Why some look for OTC products for PCT instead of SERMS

DGA3

Member
If you stick around AM long enough and read enough, you will see that the majority of those who discuss PCT recommend a SERM as opposed to an OTC PTC products (or products). There is no doubt that SERMS are the most effective way to go in this respect.

However, the whole SERMS thing makes some people uncomfortable, so I understand why they look for OTC products for their PCT. In reading a thread today, I came upon two explanations as to why it is OK/legal to purchase SERMS:

1) We are told that it is legal to purchase SERMS, but that it is illegal to possess them without a prescription. Well, once a SERM gets to your home and is stored somewhere, you are (technically) committing an illegal act. Right?

and/or

2) We are told that SERMS are legal to purchase, but illegal to consume (except for rats). Since a SERM is ultimately consumed (by most - some say they have it on hand "just in case"), once again, you are (technically) committing an illegal act.

Will anybody in law enforcement come looking for you because of this? Probably not - there are much more serious problems to be taken care of by our law enforcement agencies. However, the whole "illegal" part of SERMS is probably what scares some away and makes them look for an effective OTC product instead. That, and the possible toxicity of SERMS.

I'm not implying that SERMS don't work, or denying that many around here have successfully purchased and used them (because they have). I'm just saying that when I see a post from someone looking for an OTC alternative, I totally understand where they are coming from.
 
one point you didn't point out is quality control, or lack of when it comes to research chems- since they are technically putting out products intended for at home research on rats.
 
When I'm working I'm out looking for the gear-heads.. That's right I'm only stopping meatheads weighing in at 265 plus....
Yawn...
 
Thats pretty much it! For those of us international where laws can be stricter, it's even more reason to stay away from SERMS. For that reason, along with not hitting my natural peak yet, I'm staying away from prohormones. Would much rather being able to buy something over the counter, for knowing what I'm getting and staying out of legal trouble.
 
thebigt said:
one point you didn't point out is quality control, or lack of when it comes to research chems- since they are technically putting out products intended for at home research on rats.
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Good point - hadn't thought of that one.

Thanks!
 
SynergyIre said:
Thats pretty much it! For those of us international where laws can be stricter, it's even more reason to stay away from SERMS. For that reason, along with not hitting my natural peak yet, I'm staying away from prohormones. Would much rather being able to buy something over the counter, for knowing what I'm getting and staying out of legal trouble.
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I was completely joking... I wouldn't even know what serm looks like. Anyway, if I did happen to run into a meathead with serm or some gear I think a verbal warning would be fine with me. Lol
 
Just for thought, when have you ever heard of anyone getting in trouble for strictly SERMs (tablet OR research)? I personally have never heard anyone even claim it. As far as quality control, if they are reputable there are few problems as it's super easy to make these chems and faking them would lose your rep and cost probably the same haha

Just throwing the other side out there for discussion. Its up to the individual what they want to do. If I'm using steroids (I'm including PHs here as most on the market are designer steroids and even PH are the same in the end) Ill use the most effective thing available to me and won't play around.
 
Grambo said:
Just for thought, when have you ever heard of anyone getting in trouble for strictly SERMs (tablet OR research)? I personally have never heard anyone even claim it. As far as quality control, if they are reputable there are few problems as it's super easy to make these chems and faking them would lose your rep and cost probably the same haha

Just throwing the other side out there for discussion. Its up to the individual what they want to do. If I'm using steroids (I'm including PHs here as most on the market are designer steroids and even PH are the same in the end) Ill use the most effective thing available to me and won't play around.
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if i have a lot of this, and little of that. and everyone wants that-plus this is cheaper. whats to stop me from adding a bunch of this to that, and just chalking it up to a 'BAD BATCH'.:sly:


i think this happens all the time with unregulated research chems, imo.
 
thebigt said:
if i have a lot of this, and little of that. and everyone wants that-plus this is cheaper. whats to stop me from adding a bunch of this to that, and just chalking it up to a 'BAD BATCH'.:sly:


i think this happens all the time with unregulated research chems, imo.
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You might be correct with some research chem companies. However, some are very good at providing quality chemicals. As always, there are companies and distributors that provide these chemicals in a none "research" based form and will meet pharmaceutical standards.

Possession of a SERM will not land you in jail. Purchasing and possession of illegal steroids will if caught.

However, it is my opinion that if you don't have the means or desire to use a SERM it is in your best interest to not consider cycling AAS. You're playing a game with your endocrine system by placing your bets that an herbal blend and an OTC steroidal AI will restore your HPTA to it's original status prior to introducing exogenous androgens. This is something you really don't want to mess with. The purpose of PCT is to bring your T & E ratio's safely back to normal in the quickest and safest way possible.
 
Also, I'd like to add that people who are uncomfortable with using a SERM really don't understand it's importance and lack a full or any understanding of how important your endocrine system really is. Restoring it's normal function is critical for many reasons. Without it's proper function and establishment of correct T:E ratio's, muscle mass, strength, and libido will suffer tremendously. I'm not saying you won't eventually recover (As you will) but it will take a much longer period of time and that is not good. In comparison to using a SERM and proven means of recovery, the difference is very significant. Take clomid, for example. It can stimulate LSH and FSH (gonadotropins) at the hypothalamus through inhibiting negative feedback mechanism. OTC AI's cannot accomplish this.
 
TRS (testosterone recovery stack) from PP is nice for boosting test and OTC
stack that with say t-911 for a bit of a viagra effect when needed lol :-)
 
DGA3 said:
If you stick around AM long enough and read enough, you will see that the majority of those who discuss PCT recommend a SERM as opposed to an OTC PTC products (or products). There is no doubt that SERMS are the most effective way to go in this respect.

However, the whole SERMS thing makes some people uncomfortable, so I understand why they look for OTC products for their PCT. In reading a thread today, I came upon two explanations as to why it is OK/legal to purchase SERMS:

1) We are told that it is legal to purchase SERMS, but that it is illegal to possess them without a prescription. Well, once a SERM gets to your home and is stored somewhere, you are (technically) committing an illegal act. Right?

and/or

2) We are told that SERMS are legal to purchase, but illegal to consume (except for rats). Since a SERM is ultimately consumed (by most - some say they have it on hand "just in case"), once again, you are (technically) committing an illegal act.

Will anybody in law enforcement come looking for you because of this? Probably not - there are much more serious problems to be taken care of by our law enforcement agencies. However, the whole "illegal" part of SERMS is probably what scares some away and makes them look for an effective OTC product instead. That, and the possible toxicity of SERMS.

I'm not implying that SERMS don't work, or denying that many around here have successfully purchased and used them (because they have). I'm just saying that when I see a post from someone looking for an OTC alternative, I totally understand where they are coming from.
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I think I have a little more insight on this then many here through personal experience and related events. First off, it depends on where you live. Different municipalities have different laws. In my state, we don't have the law you described in #1 but we do have #2. Yes it is an illegal act to consume it if not prescribed, but it is minor. If someone were to actually charge it (extremely rare), it would just be a citation and a fine.

Would LE come looking for you for this? No. There are much more important and larger scale things to deal with then some minor offense. However, if by some extraordinary circumstance, you somehow are caught abusing it (not just having it but using it), then you could be charged. Highly unlikely and left to officer discretion which will almost always lead to no citation. One case I can think of that might be different is if you were busted with a several items of contraband and illegal drugs, then that could be tacked on. I think you're fine and don't need to stress too much over it.
 
Unless you are selling or have a huge stock pile that could be construed as intent to sell, then you are fine. Most cops probably wouldn't no what a serm was, and if they do they are using as well and as stakedcop said probably just a verbal if anything, but they will take your stash for personal use haha. Depending on what you are using then the trs may or may not be acceptable. For most ph/ps cycles the trs will be fine, but any aas cycle a serm is advised and the trs as an adjunct would be beneficial.
 
kingjameskjf said:
I think I have a little more insight on this then many here through personal experience and related events. First off, it depends on where you live. Different municipalities have different laws. In my state, we don't have the law you described in #1 but we do have #2. Yes it is an illegal act to consume it if not prescribed, but it is minor. If someone were to actually charge it (extremely rare), it would just be a citation and a fine.

Would LE come looking for you for this? No. There are much more important and larger scale things to deal with then some minor offense. However, if by some extraordinary circumstance, you somehow are caught abusing it (not just having it but using it), then you could be charged. Highly unlikely and left to officer discretion which will almost always lead to no citation. One case I can think of that might be different is if you were busted with a several items of contraband and illegal drugs, then that could be tacked on. I think you're fine and don't need to stress too much over it.
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Thank you. Well said and informative. :hump:
 
J2jud said:
You might be correct with some research chem companies. However, some are very good at providing quality chemicals. As always, there are companies and distributors that provide these chemicals in a none "research" based form and will meet pharmaceutical standards.

Possession of a SERM will not land you in jail. Purchasing and possession of illegal steroids will if caught.

However, it is my opinion that if you don't have the means or desire to use a SERM it is in your best interest to not consider cycling AAS. You're playing a game with your endocrine system by placing your bets that an herbal blend and an OTC steroidal AI will restore your HPTA to it's original status prior to introducing exogenous androgens. This is something you really don't want to mess with. The purpose of PCT is to bring your T & E ratio's safely back to normal in the quickest and safest way possible.
Click to expand...

might i point out that if you are expeienced enough to be able to get aas you should know how to get prescription quality serms, rather than ordering through a research chem site-after all you are already breaking the law with the aas in the first place.
 
thebigt said:
might i point out that if you are expeienced enough to be able to get aas you should know how to get prescription quality serms, rather than ordering through a research chem site-after all you are already breaking the law with the aas in the first place.
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Most users should know this. However, "AAS" encompasses pro-hormones and designer steroids not just illegal steroids. So, many users still fall under the ignorant category.
 
J2jud said:
Most users should know this. However, "AAS" encompasses pro-hormones and designer steroids not just illegal steroids. So, many users still fall under the ignorant category.
Click to expand...

sadly true.
 
J2jud said:
Also, I'd like to add that people who are uncomfortable with using a SERM really don't understand it's importance and lack a full or any understanding of how important your endocrine system really is. Restoring it's normal function is critical for many reasons. Without it's proper function and establishment of correct T:E ratio's, muscle mass, strength, and libido will suffer tremendously. I'm not saying you won't eventually recover (As you will) but it will take a much longer period of time and that is not good. In comparison to using a SERM and proven means of recovery, the difference is very significant. Take clomid, for example. It can stimulate LSH and FSH (gonadotropins) at the hypothalamus through inhibiting negative feedback mechanism. OTC AI's cannot accomplish this.
Click to expand...

Well said.
 
I've always stood by the same position. You have NO way to know what you're getting in that little dropper vial. it could be clen, it could be clomid, it could be horse piss for all you know. if you're going to use a SERM, get pharm grade. If not, go with OTC options that actually work.
 
VaughnTrue said:
I've always stood by the same position. You have NO way to know what you're getting in that little dropper vial. it could be clen, it could be clomid, it could be horse piss for all you know. if you're going to use a SERM, get pharm grade. If not, go with OTC options that actually work.
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you bet, i couldn't agree more!!!
 
J2jud said:
Most users should know this. However, "AAS" encompasses pro-hormones and designer steroids not just illegal steroids. So, many users still fall under the ignorant category.
Click to expand...

+1

This is what I am talking about. Those who use pro-hormones are taking a legal supplement. Consequently, they may want to stay legal during their PCT.

Even though no one has ever been arrested for a SERM, I am guessing that some folks may still not want to take the chance or deal with a guilty conscience.
 
i'v looked up alot on a serm its a must its a need ... but yes people are scared 2 things..

1 they have no clue how to get one, even if they did they would be scared as they don't know its legit or not.

2 the sides i think a serm is great to have yes but blood clarts,heart failer strokes.....shall i gone on?

my brother 22 years of age been working out 4 months in his room took M DROL
(master of gyno ) for 6 weeks took liver suport for 2 weeks thats 4 weeks with out liver suport or anything train only 2 weeks on it and gained a good solid 4 pounds only because he slept all dayy awake all night had no protien shakes barly eating and had no pct stoped taking it 2 months latter his fine??

not saying a serm is a bad thing i my self may want a serm but i dont have a clue where to get 1 id love help off some one for a first ph cycl?? but yh his fine noo tits nonothing.. lost the pounds tho and moree :)
 
DGA3 said:
+1

This is what I am talking about. Those who use pro-hormones are taking a legal supplement. Consequently, they may want to stay legal during their PCT.

Even though no one has ever been arrested for a SERM, I am guessing that some folks may still not want to take the chance or deal with a guilty conscience.
Click to expand...

Guilty for what? Buying something that will be beneficial to your body? I think not.

Get in trouble with the law for buying and using a SERM? I think not.. I am pretty sure nobody ever in the world, ever has gotten in trouble with the law for using SERM..

Also, these are active steroids we are talking about.. Not pro hormones. The only prohormones out are going to be from IBE.. Everything is is an active steroid. And nothing OTC will ever come close to what a SERM can do..

You shouldnt even cycle a legal steroid if you cant or wont get a SERM.
 
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