Which oral to kickstart upcoming test e cycle

ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
Ok desk job makes sense. I'm on my feet all day and up and down ladders a couple days a week as well
There's so many days that I wish I had a physically demanding job, so I could enjoy a bit more food through the day. In all reality, I could just do more cardio but ever since seperating from the military I despise it haha
 
Hyde

Hyde

Legend
Awards
5
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • Best Answer
  • First Up Vote
I used to have a physical career when I was younger and it was just a chore to eat. Hot as hell in the summer & getting dehydrated made it so hard to eat, and you’re always packing all of your food and often don’t even have time to heat your food, if you get to eat on schedule at all.
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
I used to have a physical career when I was younger and it was just a chore to eat. Hot as hell in the summer & getting dehydrated made it so hard to eat, and you’re always packing all of your food and often don’t even have time to heat your food, if you get to eat on schedule at all.
But there's a silver lining; ripped abs! lol.
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
I used to have a physical career when I was younger and it was just a chore to eat. Hot as hell in the summer & getting dehydrated made it so hard to eat, and you’re always packing all of your food and often don’t even have time to heat your food, if you get to eat on schedule at all.
You nailed it, every day I eat breakfast, pack 2 full meals and have 2 meals after work. But, theres sooo many days that I cant easily get lunch number 2 in at work so I eat it on my way home and then I'm not hungry for my next meal and I'm cramming meals together or skipping one. Labor jobs make cutting calories easy but not bulking which us probably why I tend to get fat when I bulk. Il grab a high calorie fast food meal in place of my 2 normal size meals or skip a meal and binge late night thinking il be fine but it doesn't work well. Sticking to a healthy high calorie diet is demanding when your running around all day and it takes a lot of will power and dedication and I dont got it in me unfortunately and il never be as big and lean at the same time because of it
 
MadStax

MadStax

Member
Awards
3
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • Established
All jokes aside, I believe kangaroo is probably the leanest, most protein rich meat available. I once watched one bounce off the front of a semi and hop away like it was heading to Sunday church in its best clothes. The semi was effed! The meat isn't much good unless you stuff it into a sausage though. Even then it's not fantastic.
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
All jokes aside, I believe kangaroo is probably the leanest, most protein rich meat available. I once watched one bounce off the front of a semi and hop away like it was heading to Sunday church in its best clothes. The semi was effed! The meat isn't much good unless you stuff it into a sausage though. Even then it's not fantastic.
I've ate many different wild animals, kangaroos were definitely not one of them.

I have eaten black bear, snake, squirrel, Canadian goose which is surprisingly like red meat and not like regular goose, beaver, pheasant, ostrich, black bird, moose and I'm sure I've accidentally eaten dog and cat from the Chinese spots in New York
 
MadStax

MadStax

Member
Awards
3
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • Established
I've ate many different wild animals, kangaroos were definitely not one of them.

I have eaten black bear, snake, squirrel, Canadian goose which is surprisingly like red meat and not like regular goose, beaver, pheasant, ostrich, black bird, moose and I'm sure I've accidentally eaten dog and cat from the Chinese spots in New York
I've eaten a lot of beaver as well. Don't tell the missus.
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
I've eaten a lot of beaver as well. Don't tell the missus.
I knew that was coming. But seriously, had beaver baked beans at a game dinner once, was surprisingly tasty. But then again I know theres a skill to cooking wild game. I'm sure if half these things were sold at my local grocery store and you just grilled it up it would be horrible
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
Just a small update, as today marks 6 complete weeks on test. Another 4-6 weeks to go. Will be adding superdrol in the coming weeks, as well. Will start with 10mg and may go up to 20 if feeling good. ("Good" being a relative term, lol)

Strength is most certainly up. That's the biggest takeaway so far. Overall, feeling very good. I'm only doing 12.5mg of aromasin twice a week, as I haven't felt or seen the need for more. Weight is staying the same (around 222-223 upon waking) but I appear to be losing fat, which is awesome since diet hasn't changed much. I could increase calories, but happy with a "recomp" effect, given the little bit of fat I gained when gyms closed earlier in the summer.

The only issue I've had thus far is a "tweak" in my shoulder, which occurred a couple nights ago. Worked my way up to 225 for 10 reps on flat barbell bench. Felt good, so did a few sets of heavy DB press. Wanted to finish with incline on the smith (which normally goes without a hitch)... managed to strain a muscle in my lateral delt during the negative portion of the rep. Couldn't do much afterward, so called it an early night. Planning to take the rest of the week off, will monitor this potential injury and be selective on exercises from here forward, to ensure I don't further aggravate it. The LAST thing I want right now is more time out of the gym, just as the cycle is about to get juicy. We will see!
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
Just a small update, as today marks 6 complete weeks on test. Another 4-6 weeks to go. Will be adding superdrol in the coming weeks, as well. Will start with 10mg and may go up to 20 if feeling good. ("Good" being a relative term, lol)

Strength is most certainly up. That's the biggest takeaway so far. Overall, feeling very good. I'm only doing 12.5mg of aromasin twice a week, as I haven't felt or seen the need for more. Weight is staying the same (around 222-223 upon waking) but I appear to be losing fat, which is awesome since diet hasn't changed much. I could increase calories, but happy with a "recomp" effect, given the little bit of fat I gained when gyms closed earlier in the summer.

The only issue I've had thus far is a "tweak" in my shoulder, which occurred a couple nights ago. Worked my way up to 225 for 10 reps on flat barbell bench. Felt good, so did a few sets of heavy DB press. Wanted to finish with incline on the smith (which normally goes without a hitch)... managed to strain a muscle in my lateral delt during the negative portion of the rep. Couldn't do much afterward, so called it an early night. Planning to take the rest of the week off, will monitor this potential injury and be selective on exercises from here forward, to ensure I don't further aggravate it. The LAST thing I want right now is more time out of the gym, just as the cycle is about to get juicy. We will see!
If your weight is up, strength is up and your looking leaner then it sounds like everything is going well. As far as the shoulder thing, it happens to me, my left shoulder specifically. Your moving weights that your muscles can handle but your ligaments and joints ect might not be ready for. I always want to bench heavy so I do and I always pay for it lol. If you can put ego aside which is very hard for me personally, start chest day with some 5lb db rotator cuff warm ups, move on to a pec deck or machine fly. By this time everything should be warmed up and the bloods pumping and as you move on to bench you wont be able to handle as much weight but you can still get a great chest workout this way. Follow up your bench with whatever else.

I do this and it eliminates the shoulder problem. But like the idiot I am, every time the shoulder feels better I go back to doing bench first and the process repeats itself:(
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
If your weight is up, strength is up and your looking leaner then it sounds like everything is going well. As far as the shoulder thing, it happens to me, my left shoulder specifically. Your moving weights that your muscles can handle but your ligaments and joints ect might not be ready for. I always want to bench heavy so I do and I always pay for it lol. If you can put ego aside which is very hard for me personally, start chest day with some 5lb db rotator cuff warm ups, move on to a pec deck or machine fly. By this time everything should be warmed up and the bloods pumping and as you move on to bench you wont be able to handle as much weight but you can still get a great chest workout this way. Follow up your bench with whatever else.

I do this and it eliminates the shoulder problem. But like the idiot I am, every time the shoulder feels better I go back to doing bench first and the process repeats itself:(
I appreciate the info, brother. I try to do some warm up sets, but I do have a tendency of pushing a bit hard early on.

So, I've dealt with a very specific shoulder pain since my first deployment in 2009. The military doc called it an AC Joint impingement. The pain comes and goes depending on the exercise, but I can generally keep pushing without worsening it. Whatever occured on Tuesday night, however, was pretty rough. Pain shot through my delt and into my tricep. Moved onto flies and couldn't keep my arm at a 90 degree angle. Could barely move my arm upon waking the following morning. Feels a bit better today, so hopefully a few more days of rest will prove to be helpful. Ice and heat FTW!
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
I appreciate the info, brother. I try to do some warm up sets, but I do have a tendency of pushing a bit hard early on.

So, I've dealt with a very specific shoulder pain since my first deployment in 2009. The military doc called it an AC Joint impingement. The pain comes and goes depending on the exercise, but I can generally keep pushing without worsening it. Whatever occured on Tuesday night, however, was pretty rough. Pain shot through my delt and into my tricep. Moved onto flies and couldn't keep my arm at a 90 degree angle. Could barely move my arm upon waking the following morning. Feels a bit better today, so hopefully a few more days of rest will prove to be helpful. Ice and heat FTW!
The pain shooting down the arm could be a pinched nerve, I've definitely had that happen a few times as well. I'm no dr. So I cant say anything for sure but so far everything you mentioned about your shoulder I can relate to.

As far as going too hard too fast on bench. Guilty, yesterday I was supposed to do 4 warm up sets before my working set. I went from the bar to 135, 205, 245 which was my working set. I failed at 8 and instead of resting 2min or so I waited 30 sec did 2 more, waited 30 sec did to more and so on till I couldn't get a rep. Guess what, today my shoulder hurts lol
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
Sd is going to jack up your lifts even more, might be a good idea to save it or to switch to higher reps. But it's really hard to not add weight to the bar when your 225 for 10 reps starts feeling like light a warm up set
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
Sd is going to jack up your lifts even more, might be a good idea to save it or to switch to higher reps. But it's really hard to not add weight to the bar when your 225 for 10 reps starts feeling like light a warm up set
Very good point. I think dropping the weight and focusing on volume may be wise, given the circumstance. If my shoulder is still pissed off by the time I intend to start SD, I may just hold off.

Will follow up in here, for sure (y)
 
MadStax

MadStax

Member
Awards
3
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • Established
I've found that my guys who actually listen, arrive early for training, do the stretching, cardio and warm-up sets, are far less likely to be injured or bothered by these little niggles. I occasionally come in cold and crush a heavy compound movement, but nearly always pay the price!
Very good point. I think dropping the weight and focusing on volume may be wise, given the circumstance. If my shoulder is still pissed off by the time I intend to start SD, I may just hold off.

Will follow up in here, for sure (y)
Are you stretching and doing at least one warm-up set? Maybe try drop sets or pyramid sets if you're already doing the stretching and warm-up. Find what works for you, carefully.
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
Very good point. I think dropping the weight and focusing on volume may be wise, given the circumstance. If my shoulder is still pissed off by the time I intend to start SD, I may just hold off.

Will follow up in here, for sure (y)
Sd, high carbs and high reps will blow you the fluck up
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
I've found that my guys who actually listen, arrive early for training, do the stretching, cardio and warm-up sets, are far less likely to be injured or bothered by these little niggles. I occasionally come in cold and crush a heavy compound movement, but nearly always pay the price!


Are you stretching and doing at least one warm-up set? Maybe try drop sets or pyramid sets if you're already doing the stretching and warm-up. Find what works for you, carefully.
I definitely find warm ups helpful but not stretching the muscle I'm about to work out. I use to always do that and pull muscles left and right. Once I stopped stretching that muscle before I trained it. I stopped pulling it. Especially with legs.

I do lots of stretching, I just wont stretch hamstrings before deadlifts or stretch chest before benching ect
 
MadStax

MadStax

Member
Awards
3
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • Established
I definitely find warm ups helpful but not stretching the muscle I'm about to work out. I use to always do that and pull muscles left and right. Once I stopped stretching that muscle before I trained it. I stopped pulling it. Especially with legs.

I do lots of stretching, I just wont stretch hamstrings before deadlifts or stretch chest before benching ect
My formula is: stretch the entire body, do cardio, warm-up set, and finally working sets.

I agree, stretching immediately before hitting a heavy set is not a great idea.
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
Are you stretching and doing at least one warm-up set? Maybe try drop sets or pyramid sets if you're already doing the stretching and warm-up. Find what works for you, carefully.
Yessir, I generally do a minute of very light stretching, prior to my warmup set, just to get the blood flowing.

Not sure that the warm up was an issue, considering the amount of sets/reps completed prior to my little issue. It's possible that my shoulder was just fatigued and didn't like the angle of the incline. I've never personally had an issue with the Smith Machine before this, but I've heard people argue against it because of movement restrictions.
 
MadStax

MadStax

Member
Awards
3
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • Established
Yessir, I generally do a minute of very light stretching, prior to my warmup set, just to get the blood flowing.

Not sure that the warm up was an issue, considering the amount of sets/reps completed prior to my little issue. It's possible that my shoulder was just fatigued and didn't like the angle of the incline. I've never personally had an issue with the Smith Machine before this, but I've heard people argue against it because of movement restrictions.
I detest the Smith Machine myself! It forces unnatural movements that cause unnecessary strain. I'd suggest shying away from it to see if the issue resolves itself. If you aren't able to do the movement with control, you need to drop the weight, not rely on a machine.
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
I detest the Smith Machine myself! It forces unnatural movements that cause unnecessary strain. I'd suggest shying away from it to see if the issue resolves itself. If you aren't able to do the movement with control, you need to drop the weight, not rely on a machine.
Differen't strokes for different folks, I suppose. I've never had so much as a hiccup utilizing the smith, until Tuesday that is. While I don't rely on it regularly, it has been a beneficial tool for the most part. Same with other machines... not my go-to, but it's nice to switch things up on occasion.
 
Hyde

Hyde

Legend
Awards
5
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • Best Answer
  • First Up Vote
Get the muscles warm. Look at the Wenning Warmup if you need guidance. Light high rep easy movements like Facepulls, Pullaparts, tri extensions, Hammercurls, lat Pulldowns for upper body.

Then do mobility on warm muscles. We’re talking a few minutes of stretches for pecs, tris, lats, rotator cuff drills. Hold a Db behind your head like the bottom of a standing ovh tri extension and let it gently pull your upper arms backwards slowly. You will figure out what is more helpful to you over time with experimentation.

Do multiple short rest warmups of the main movement you are beginning. Begin work.

This shouldn’t take more than 20 minutes, potentiates performance (read: GAINZ), and greatly reduces chance of injury and discomfort. It also can add easy total volume for things like triceps and rear Delts.

Lower body, I prefer De Franco’s Agile 8. It sucks but it’s hugely mobilizing in a short timespan.
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
I like incline bench in the Smith machine, but I have to spend a lot of time getting the bench set in the right position. Once I do it's perfect, but even moving the bench a half inch can take that perfect position and turn it into a painful one
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
Get the muscles warm. Look at the Wenning Warmup if you need guidance. Light high rep easy movements like Facepulls, Pullaparts, tri extensions, Hammercurls, lat Pulldowns for upper body.

Then do mobility on warm muscles. We’re talking a few minutes of stretches for pecs, tris, lats, rotator cuff drills. Hold a Db behind your head like the bottom of a standing ovh tri extension and let it gently pull your upper arms backwards slowly. You will figure out what is more helpful to you over time with experimentation.

Do multiple short rest warmups of the main movement you are beginning. Begin work.

This shouldn’t take more than 20 minutes, potentiates performance (read: GAINZ), and greatly reduces chance of injury and discomfort. It also can add easy total volume for things like triceps and rear Delts.

Lower body, I prefer De Franco’s Agile 8. It sucks but it’s hugely mobilizing in a short timespan.
Great info. Much appreciated!
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
I like incline bench in the Smith machine, but I have to spend a lot of time getting the bench set in the right position. Once I do it's perfect, but even moving the bench a half inch can take that perfect position and turn it into a painful one
Agreed. I find it beneficial toward the end of a chest session, to really isolate upper chest. But as you mentioned, not a ton of room for error lol.
 
Codybenz

Codybenz

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Not sure how I have been missing this thread. How many weeks you plan on running the superdrol?
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
Not sure how I have been missing this thread. How many weeks you plan on running the superdrol?
Not sure yet. I'm torn between 10mg for 5-6 weeks, or 20mg for 4 weeks. I think a lot of it will depend on if the sides are manageable.

EDIT - - As much as I prefer to go into a cycle with a plan, it's tough to say which route will be more effective since I've never utilized this specific compound.
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
Not sure yet. I'm torn between 10mg for 5-6 weeks, or 20mg for 4 weeks. I think a lot of it will depend on if the sides are manageable.

EDIT - - As much as I prefer to go into a cycle with a plan, it's tough to say which route will be more effective since I've never utilized this specific compound.
How many mg are the caps? If there 10mg each I wouldn't bother with 10per day. I mean it will still work but sd has a short half life, like 6 or 8 hrs, better off dosing 2-3x per day.
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
How many mg are the caps? If there 10mg each I wouldn't bother with 10per day. I mean it will still work but sd has a short half life, like 6 or 8 hrs, better off dosing 2-3x per day.
They are 10mg per capsule. SD-10 from LGI. If it's more productive to dose multiple times a day, I'll likely do 20mg for 4 weeks.
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
They are 10mg per capsule. SD-10 from LGI. If it's more productive to dose multiple times a day, I'll likely do 20mg for 4 weeks.
Ya, theres more then 1 way to skin a cat, but keeping steadier levels of the given drug seems to always work better.

If you took 10mg at say 8am, 8 hours later you got 5mg and by the time you took your dose the next day its pretty much non existent. I wish I could find sd in 5mg caps but lately I only see them in 10 and 20mg capsules and 50mg pills
 

trumac

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
it’s a sweet shortcrust pastry with dried fruit and spices. Ironically has no meat at all bro. Really traditional English thing

but I’d also do some chicken pot pie 👍
I read everything up until here and had to stop to respond to this. It’s delicious and we have it here in the states too! My gramma has been making it since before my time. I grew up on it at Christmas time
 
Codybenz

Codybenz

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Plan on finishing my cycle with superdrol too. That’s why I was wondering. I think I’m going to do 10mg for 2 weeks then 20mg for 3 weeks. Never used it before. Wanna see what all the fuss is about
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
Plan on finishing my cycle with superdrol too. That’s why I was wondering. I think I’m going to do 10mg for 2 weeks then 20mg for 3 weeks. Never used it before. Wanna see what all the fuss is about
same. I’ve used a handful of PH/DS with good success over the years, the latest being M-Sten. I remember picking up my first few bottles of SD nearly a decade ago, but never got around to trying it. Looking forward to finally giving it a shot
 
Dagron

Dagron

Member
Awards
0
Fellas, will be starting a test enanthate run in the coming months. Plan is 500mg (250 twice per week) for 12 weeks. This will be my first injectable cycle. I have, however, done numerous PH/DS runs over the past decade with no serious negative side effects worth noting. I’m just ready to take the plunge.

I know that the recommendation is typically to run test by itself first, to see how ones body reacts. However, to be completely transparent/honest, I fully intend to kickstart with an oral (4-6 weeks, depending on the chosen compound). My hope is that by utilizing an oral at the beginning, I will see some nice results by the time the testosterone starts to really shine. I have the following on hand; SD, M-Sten, M1A and DMZ. Which oral would you personally choose?

I've done a lot of research over the years, to ensure that by the time I pin I would be ready for any issues that could (and very well may) arise. I've got everything else needed, on hand; proper cycle support, clomiphene (plus additional OTC post cycle goodies) exem as needed and some other misc ancillaries.

Looking forward to your thoughts/suggestions. Thanks!
Using a "Kickstarter" is backwards; why would you want to add a compound in then drop it once you begin to adapt to the higher androgens? It's completely incorrect usage but somehow 'kickstarters' worked their way into everyone's vernacular and are widely done to this day. Then of course the inevitable "why did my gains stop after 8 weeks" post happens and everyone is dumbfounded.

TLDR; add the oral in it toward the end of your cycle to defeat downregulation/homeostasis. I like superdrol. I like it a lot. 20-30 mg and you'll be blasting PRs all over the place mid cycle even on reduced calories.
 
Hyde

Hyde

Legend
Awards
5
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • Best Answer
  • First Up Vote
Using a "Kickstarter" is backwards; why would you want to add a compound in then drop it once you begin to adapt to the higher androgens? It's completely incorrect usage but somehow 'kickstarters' worked their way into everyone's vernacular and are widely done to this day. Then of course the inevitable "why did my gains stop after 8 weeks" post happens and everyone is dumbfounded.

TLDR; add the oral in it toward the end of your cycle to defeat downregulation/homeostasis. I like superdrol. I like it a lot. 20-30 mg and you'll be blasting PRs all over the place mid cycle even on reduced calories.
IMG_4107.JPG
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
Using a "Kickstarter" is backwards; why would you want to add a compound in then drop it once you begin to adapt to the higher androgens? It's completely incorrect usage but somehow 'kickstarters' worked their way into everyone's vernacular and are widely done to this day. Then of course the inevitable "why did my gains stop after 8 weeks" post happens and everyone is dumbfounded.

TLDR; add the oral in it toward the end of your cycle to defeat downregulation/homeostasis. I like superdrol. I like it a lot. 20-30 mg and you'll be blasting PRs all over the place mid cycle even on reduced calories.
Live and learn. It is what it is; luckily some members here educated me on the matter, prior to starting the cycle. Really looking forward to adding the SD. Just under three weeks away (y)
 
Hyde

Hyde

Legend
Awards
5
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • Best Answer
  • First Up Vote
Since starting this Anavar cycle, I've actually given this careful consideration. There are studies that looked at doses of up to 10mg/day for extended periods.
I am being tongue in cheek, but the truth is you can stay on orals. For literally as long as your organs can tolerate. But even if you keep bp down & keep kidneys filtering happily, even if you have an iron liver and respond well to x compound, you need to consider the arterial health ramifications of having a **** lipid profile for a very extended period. That is not healthy at all. And staying on any blast indefinitely, even a baby one, just means your body accommodates to what you are taking as your new maintenance, until you drop down to reset.

I have know at least 2 pro strongwomen who never came off Var for over a year. They were fine, at least what we can see now - we can’t see their arteries without a calcium channel scan. But they were also top world level, same as a pro bodybuilder who never cruises at anything close to a replacement dose. That is a limited timeframe power move at the peak of an athletic career. It can’t last forever, and it has longterm ramifications.
 

saderboy80

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Using a "Kickstarter" is backwards; why would you want to add a compound in then drop it once you begin to adapt to the higher androgens? It's completely incorrect usage but somehow 'kickstarters' worked their way into everyone's vernacular and are widely done to this day. Then of course the inevitable "why did my gains stop after 8 weeks" post happens and everyone is dumbfounded.

TLDR; add the oral in it toward the end of your cycle to defeat downregulation/homeostasis. I like superdrol. I like it a lot. 20-30 mg and you'll be blasting PRs all over the place mid cycle even on reduced calories.
In my opinion a Kickstarter is utilized as it says to kickstart a cycle. Orals take effect instantly while injectables (unless it’s a propionate) take 3-4 weeks to start. So people want to start getting results right away and not waiting until the injectable kicks in.

Personally, I like the idea of a 12-16 week cycle of injectables. Then use a Kickstarter oral for 4 weeks, take 4-8 weeks off of orals (just when the injectables are starting to shine) then finish the cycle with 4 weeks of another oral. Because there seems to be a tendency after 8-10 weeks for progress to start slowing down.
 
Hyde

Hyde

Legend
Awards
5
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • Best Answer
  • First Up Vote
In my opinion a Kickstarter is utilized as it says to kickstart a cycle. Orals take effect instantly while injectables (unless it’s a propionate) take 3-4 weeks to start. So people want to start getting results right away and not waiting until the injectable kicks in.

Personally, I like the idea of a 12-16 week cycle of injectables. Then use a Kickstarter oral for 4 weeks, take 4-8 weeks off of orals (just when the injectables are starting to shine) then finish the cycle with 4 weeks of another oral. Because there seems to be a tendency after 8-10 weeks for progress to start slowing down.
The thing is, estered oils begin releasing hormone right away; it just takes weeks for peak blood levels to be reached. However, you are getting some androgens very quickly. So if you start with an oral at X dosage, and your oils are continually building up, unless you are lowering your oral dosage (which nobody does because it’s not really an effective strategy) you end up with an ascending total androgen level, then dropping it out right when it’s getting good. It’s like upshifting in your car’s transmission - RPMs drop back down, and you aren’t making as much horsepower as before.

Plus, starting with orals means lipids trash right from the get-go, so they will probably be junk the entire blast now instead of just the end where the finisher was used. That is months of different cholesterol levels to consider.
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
Yep yep. I've ditched the kick start idea. I also think it's the reason I've acquired so many injuries and I think they also have made my progress stall early in a cycle.

Strength goes up way too fast for me and I use weights my joints and tendons cant handle. Then I spend the rest of my cycle trying to maintain or progress past the oral gains while not feeling 100% from a physical snd mental standpoint where I'm kinda burned out early and possibly injured. Injury has ruined my last 2-3 attempts to run a cycle where I pulled the plug early or dropped the dose dramatically and just kinda went through the motions trying not to get hurt.

I'm gonna kick the new year off with a cycle and every will be in baby steps attempting to max out the dose I'm on.

Example. Week 1 bump up from trt to 300 till the progress slows, then add eq and npp for 6 weeks, the eq should be kicking around the time npp ends. Increase test to 500 and Continue with the eq for a total of 16 maybe add a oral if progress slows on the back end.

Not the actual planned cycle. All I'm saying is start low and finish high. Dont use all your weapons in the first 4-6 weeks and have to fight it out the rest of the way
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
If I only had 4-6 weeks to do a quick transformation then I'd go another route and start everything at max dose plus my oral and ease back down to trt levels after but I dont think that's gonna produce a lot of actual tissue, it's just gonna make you look good for a couple weeks while your all glycogen loaded and pumped all the time
 

saderboy80

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
The thing is, estered oils begin releasing hormone right away; it just takes weeks for peak blood levels to be reached. However, you are getting some androgens very quickly. So if you start with an oral at X dosage, and your oils are continually building up, unless you are lowering your oral dosage (which nobody does because it’s not really an effective strategy) you end up with an ascending total androgen level, then dropping it out right when it’s getting good. It’s like upshifting in your car’s transmission - RPMs drop back down, and you aren’t making as much horsepower as before.

Plus, starting with orals means lipids trash right from the get-go, so they will probably be junk the entire blast now instead of just the end where the finisher was used. That is months of different cholesterol levels to consider.
Those are very valid points! Did not really think of it that way. So would you recommend not taking on oral? Or would you take it the last 4 weeks of your cycle?
 

Similar threads


Top