Undermethylation and OverMethylation?

[Gutterpump]

I feel great / better whenever I go on a keto diet. I also pay more attention to eating properly when I diet like this (nutritious). I make everything count. I don't see how it can cause diabetes. It helps to prevent and to cure type-II diabetes / insulin resistance.

I also make sure to have a lot of evoo,coconut oil and MCT's. They make up the greater portion of fat when I diet like this.

I could see someone getting a fatty liver if they are eating far too much fat. But if your consuming enough where your body feeds on it's own fat stores often enough, then there shouldn't be much internal (visceral) body fat present. CKD is where it's at =D and switching between CS + CR diets.

 

[Gutterpump]

Methylation question for anyone here....

I have been taking a lot of Betain HCL and didn't quite clue in until recently that this is actually TMG, which is a methyl donor. I take about 5-7 grams per day spread out with my meals to aid digestion.

I am also taking 400mg (active) SAMe and feel fine at this dose, never felt bad from SAMe. Is it safe to increase my active dose of SAMe even though I am taking this much TMG? I am also taking methylcobalamin + NAC daily. If I increase my SAMe, is this too much of a good thing?

 

[MetalMX]

Methylation question for anyone here....

I have been taking a lot of Betain HCL and didn't quite clue in until recently that this is actually TMG, which is a methyl donor. I take about 5-7 grams per day spread out with my meals to aid digestion.

I am also taking 400mg (active) SAMe and feel fine at this dose, never felt bad from SAMe. Is it safe to increase my active dose of SAMe even though I am taking this much TMG? I am also taking methylcobalamin + NAC daily. If I increase my SAMe, is this too much of a good thing?

I think 400mg of SAMe per day is fine probably no need to increase it as your already taking other supplements which improve methylation.


I feel a lot better when i take Betaine HCL digestion improves 100% as well as other things, gota remember to pick some up.

Also i would pick up some Sytemic Enzymes a product called Vitalzym is very good. These enzymes are involved in thousand of reactions in the body. Contains protease, lipase, amylase, cellulase and a few others.

Vitamins function as co-enzymes, these work directly.

 

[Gutterpump]

Ya I am using other enzymes besides betain HCL. I am double dosing, taking four of these with every meal

http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/store/en/browse/sku_detail.jsp?id=VS-1195

I want to try increasing SAMe though because I have been spending a lot of money on stablon as an aid for seratonin/dopamine. SAMe is so much cheaper in comparison, and hopefully it can make my caber work better as well by allowing me to produce more dopamine.

 

[MetalMX]

Ya I am using other enzymes besides betain HCL. I am double dosing, taking four of these with every meal

http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/store/en/browse/sku_detail.jsp?id=VS-1195

I want to try increasing SAMe though because I have been spending a lot of money on stablon as an aid for seratonin/dopamine. SAMe is so much cheaper in comparison, and hopefully it can make my caber work better as well by allowing me to produce more dopamine.

What are you taking/how many supplements are you on?

I wouldn't go crazy with supplements. Im the type of person who would take 300 supplements per day but ive stopped that now i realise that could lead to a lot more harm then good.

Im still in the process of testing to figure out what i need to be on exactly.


What do you think about this product called NT Factor?... worth getting?

https://www.prohealth.com/shop/product.cfm/product__code/PH195/tab/Label#title

 

[MetalMX]

What im confused about when i read about undermethylation and high histamine on some sites it says treatment is centered around antifolates such as calcium which bind histamine and release it into the blood stream as well as methionine which acts as a methyl donor.

Then i have read elsewhere folic acid is used for undermethylation So should we be using folate or not for undermethylation?

I have already know i have the MTHFR gene mutation. Soon i will know everything with genome testing.

Also urine kryptopyrroles is the diagnosis in pyroluria. According to proponents, one of the pyrroles (kryptopyrrole or mauve factor) is a by-product of improper hemoglobin synthesis.[5][6] However, other pyrroles have been implicated, and what literature exists on this topic is unclear.[7] These pyrroles are then said to bind to vitamin B6, and zinc and are eliminated through urine, potentially causing deficiencies of these compounds. If deficiency is maintained then this leads to ADHD, schizophrenia etc...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyroluria

Does genova do the urine kryptopyroles test?

 

[dsade]

Methylation question for anyone here....

I have been taking a lot of Betain HCL and didn't quite clue in until recently that this is actually TMG, which is a methyl donor. I take about 5-7 grams per day spread out with my meals to aid digestion.

I am also taking 400mg (active) SAMe and feel fine at this dose, never felt bad from SAMe. Is it safe to increase my active dose of SAMe even though I am taking this much TMG? I am also taking methylcobalamin + NAC daily. If I increase my SAMe, is this too much of a good thing?

there are actually TWO betaines out there - Betaine HCl (digestive aid) and Betaine (which is TMG).

 

[EasyEJL]

there are actually TWO betaines out there - Betaine HCl (digestive aid) and Betaine (which is TMG).

i had wondered that during this conversation, as i have powdered TMG and it tastes NOTHING like the betaine hcl tabs

 

[Gutterpump]

What are you taking/how many supplements are you on?

I wouldn't go crazy with supplements. Im the type of person who would take 300 supplements per day but ive stopped that now i realise that could lead to a lot more harm then good.

Im still in the process of testing to figure out what i need to be on exactly.


What do you think about this product called NT Factor?... worth getting?

https://www.prohealth.com/shop/product.cfm/product__code/PH195/tab/Label#title

I don't know anything about NT factor.

I'm not on many supplements, just the basics and a few drugs.

Here is my regime:

MST's MVP/ZMK combo (the best enhanced multi-vitamin and mineral complex out there, great products)
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/millennium-sport-technologies/mvp-120-cap.html
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/millennium-sport-technologies/zmk-120-tabs.html
Multi-Enzyme complex
Betain HCL
NAC
Liv.52
Now's Thyroid Energy (natural/nutritional thyroid support)
Pro Health Extreme B-12

Occassionally taking Pro Health NADH (10mg or 20mg), depending on how I feel. Taking this with the sublingual B-12 is good for natural energy when needed.

HCG - 450iu eod
Arimidex - .5mg eod
Caber - 500mcg 2-3x per week
Isocort - 6 tabs per day

SAMe - 400mg active pd (going to increase this to 800mg pd)

Adaptogens:
Ashwaganda
Rhodiola
Schizandra


Things I have stopped: deprenyl and stablon. Deprenyl wasn't good for me on an ongoing basis. Didn't work as planned. Stablon is amazing but it's underdosed at the recommended daily intake. Have to increase the dose and it works amazingly well, but it's cost prohibitive.

 

[Gutterpump]

I should also mention that I occassionally take ALCAR (taken with a special type of vit C) and NA-R-ALA. ALCAR is great stuff.

 

[Gutterpump]

there are actually TWO betaines out there - Betaine HCl (digestive aid) and Betaine (which is TMG).

The Betaine HCL that I have, says digestive enzyme on the bottle, and also says in brackets (trimethyleglycine TMG). So now I am confused.

http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/store/en/browse/sku_detail.jsp?id=VS-1196

It's betain HCL + Pepsin. In yellow at the bottom of the bottle, it says (trimethyleglycine TMG).

 

[dsade]

The Betaine HCL that I have, says digestive enzyme on the bottle, and also says in brackets (trimethyleglycine TMG). So now I am confused.

Someone didn't know what they were doing, labelwise

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trimethylglycine

 

[Gutterpump]

Yeah, I think I should stick to NOW brand products for staple supps like this. I'm pretty sure what I've been taking is not TMG then.. Thanks.

 

[jinxie]

Yeah, I think I should stick to NOW brand products for staple supps like this. I'm pretty sure what I've been taking is not TMG then.. Thanks.

TMG and Betaine HCL are the same thing. Usually, when TMG is mixed with pepsin, it's called Betaine HCL. I used to just take TMG, until I read what Janz linked about the combined product.

 

[jinxie]

I don't know anything about NT factor.

I'm not on many supplements, just the basics and a few drugs.

Here is my regime:

MST's MVP/ZMK combo (the best enhanced multi-vitamin and mineral complex out there, great products)
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/millennium-sport-technologies/mvp-120-cap.html
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/millennium-sport-technologies/zmk-120-tabs.html
Multi-Enzyme complex
Betain HCL
NAC
Liv.52
Now's Thyroid Energy (natural/nutritional thyroid support)
Pro Health Extreme B-12

Occassionally taking Pro Health NADH (10mg or 20mg), depending on how I feel. Taking this with the sublingual B-12 is good for natural energy when needed.

HCG - 450iu eod
Arimidex - .5mg eod
Caber - 500mcg 2-3x per week
Isocort - 6 tabs per day

SAMe - 400mg active pd (going to increase this to 800mg pd)

Adaptogens:
Ashwaganda
Rhodiola
Schizandra


Things I have stopped: deprenyl and stablon. Deprenyl wasn't good for me on an ongoing basis. Didn't work as planned. Stablon is amazing but it's underdosed at the recommended daily intake. Have to increase the dose and it works amazingly well, but it's cost prohibitive.

Gutter, I take rhodiola. What do you find the other 2 adaptogens do for you. As I recall, they are for adrenal support, I think. Thanks.

Also, I find my Betaine HCL + Pepsin smells sulfurous, like TMG.

 

[Gutterpump]

Since taking the isocort and adding in ashwaganda + schizandra, and really reducing carbs to less than 20grams per day, I feel awake all day.

Before this, I used to fall asleep at my desk in the afternoon and fight to keep my eyes open.

This is a really good thing considering that I don't sleep very well at night. I am still waking up early in the morning. At least 2-3 times that I know of. I try to go to sleep by 10:30 most nights and am up by 6, but I still consciously wake up in between the times of 3-5am, sometimes more often earlier in the night. I am not having any troubles falling asleep though. The interesting thing is that I consciously awaken, but I fall asleep easily again..

Honestly, I can't speak about individual effects of these herbs though. I am just taking them in the hopes they can help balance me out somehow since I have crappy sleep and a stressful life/job.

 

[jinxie]

I don't know anything about NT factor.

I'm not on many supplements, just the basics and a few drugs.

Here is my regime:

MST's MVP/ZMK combo (the best enhanced multi-vitamin and mineral complex out there, great products)
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/millennium-sport-technologies/mvp-120-cap.html
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/millennium-sport-technologies/zmk-120-tabs.html
Multi-Enzyme complex
Betain HCL
NAC
Liv.52
Now's Thyroid Energy (natural/nutritional thyroid support)
Pro Health Extreme B-12

Occassionally taking Pro Health NADH (10mg or 20mg), depending on how I feel. Taking this with the sublingual B-12 is good for natural energy when needed.

HCG - 450iu eod
Arimidex - .5mg eod
Caber - 500mcg 2-3x per week
Isocort - 6 tabs per day

SAMe - 400mg active pd (going to increase this to 800mg pd)

Adaptogens:
Ashwaganda
Rhodiola
Schizandra


Things I have stopped: deprenyl and stablon. Deprenyl wasn't good for me on an ongoing basis. Didn't work as planned. Stablon is amazing but it's underdosed at the recommended daily intake. Have to increase the dose and it works amazingly well, but it's cost prohibitive.

TMG and Betaine HCL are the same thing. Usually, when TMG is mixed with pepsin, it's called Betaine HCL. I used to just take TMG, until I read what Janz linked about the combined product.

Whoops, as dsade posted, looks like Betaine (not Betaine HCL) is the same as TMG. It does seem like TMG gave me more of a SAMe effect than does Betaine HCL, which is what I take now, along with SAMe. I don't have digestive problems, so I may return to TMG for better methylation.

See this:
http://www.raysahelian.com/betaine.html

 

[EasyEJL]

i'm doing 800mg a day active SAMe now, only about 5 days in from a month of 400/day

 

[Gutterpump]

I started at 200mg for one week then went to 400mg in the am for this past week.

Maybe I will wait a couple more weeks before increasing again. 400 early am 400 in early pm sounds good.

 

[EasyEJL]

yeah, I found a reliable place where i could manage 800 a day for $1/day finally, that was why i went up

 

[The Matrix]

yeah, I found a reliable place where i could manage 800 a day for $1/day finally, that was why i went up

God damn I started a freaken trend again .
Reason why sam-e works is because it replenish glutathione levels in hard working athletes. Creatine is the main fuel that is used up to produce sam-e. So people that are undermethylated need more creatine then usual because of hard traniing and increase need for sam-e production to produce gluthione to combat free radicals. Make sense. All hard working athletes should be on a small dosage of sam-e just to keep things balanced. No wonder athletes end up with depression because of depletion of sam-e. No need for paxil..

Here is a letter i recieved from a freind I was helping

Hey Shawn,

Sorry for bothering you again, but in case you have time to comment this, I would be grateful. Just wanted to tell you that things are getting better.

I've been taking 400 mg Sam-e for nearly two weeks now and I have improved a lot. I haven't noticed any adverse effects yet, besides slight gastric discomfort. I don't need sleep aids anymore, but I take melatonin, as it is an antioxidant too.

I feel normal feelings again and I can make plans. I've learned a lot of stress management, thanks to you too. I'm still rather tired on occasion, but not as much anymore. I'm not anxious anymore and my vision is much clearer, which is great.

My cortisol tests came back, not the 24 h urine yet, but the AM cortisol value was 433 (150-650). Plus normal reaction to dexamethasone suppression test, which was no wonder at all, of course.

I've been taking 1/2 grain armour up to now. I'm still waiting to get fT3, rT3 and DHEAS results. fT4 was 13.9 (11-20), but I know that it's mostly due to armour that fT4 is down a bit. The doc told me that I can basically do what I want with armour, either continue taking it or drop it off if it doesn't make me feel better. Yep, that's very professional, ain't it

I have hypothyroid symptoms, but at least my mood is brighter. One doc told me that it's all in my mind if I can't run or work out. He said I'm just so afraid of it and that it's a psychological burden for me. Yeah right. He also told me that there's no use taking antioxidants. He also thinks it's placebo if Sam-e helps me. Screw those docs, I know better and I'm so damn confident about it now.

I'm having my fatty acid, mineral and vitamin balance checked. Plus Ferritin, as well. It's quite exciting to see the results actually. I considered having my autonomous nervous system balanced with acupuncture. I finally found a doc that wanted to help me. Too bad he's not such an expert in hormonal balance or endocrinology.

Well, have a good day and thank you so much for having faith. I'm starting to get my life back and after all I've learned so many exciting things about the human body and myself, that I'm grateful for this terrible experience. Now I understand how much positive thinking can help. I've become much stronger.

-Sofia-

 

[EasyEJL]

I'm doing it largely for the joint support, my thumb arthritis is nearing the point of needing surgery

 

[dsade]

yeah, I found a reliable place where i could manage 800 a day for $1/day finally, that was why i went up

PM me on that one....I loves me some SAMe

 

[Gutterpump]

That's about what I'm paying for my proSAMe

 

[The Matrix]

But will it do the same job as other brands..Thats the question..800 mgs is a good dosage no need to go any higher.

Pm me as well i be interested in checking it out..

 

[MetalMX]

there are actually TWO betaines out there - Betaine HCl (digestive aid) and Betaine (which is TMG).

:smokin: Ugh... well this i didn't know.

 

[biglibido]

I would recommend injectable SOD.

BL

 

[aisstea]

God damn I started a freaken trend again .
Reason why sam-e works is because it replenish glutathione levels in hard working athletes.

Well, I took it also to rise my glutathione back in the days... but had the strange side effects like many other people here. The only one good way for me was very high NAC+Glutamin (well, don't know the english name). Felt after a time (2-3 months) great benefits in my immune system.

 

[Gutterpump]

I was doing some research and came across this great post by someone online, some interesting facts and advice concerning SAMe (the original post is about 4 yrs old though):

Two forms of SAM-e are available, sulfate-p-toluenesulfonate (also called tosylate) and butanedisulfonate. The oral bioavailability of the tosylate salt is 1%, and the oral bioavailability of the butanedisulfonate salt is 5%. (Stramentinoli G, Gualano M, Galli-Kienle M. Intestinal absorption of S-adenosyl-L-methionine. J Pharmacol Exp Ther 1979;209:323-6.) For this reason lots of people have recommended the butanedisulfonate form, and GNC and Nature Made both used to sell that form. But they have both switched to selling the tosylate form as far as I can tell. The only source I have been able to find for the butanedisulfonate salt is a site called Young Again, which sells it for arthritis (http://www.youngagain.com/same.html). It costs about 50 cents per 400mg pill. You can reduce the price a bit by buying two bottles at a time, for which they will give you a third bottle at no extra charge. Of course, that still works out to be quite a lot, since for many people the antidepressant effect does not kick in until the 1600 mg per day level. If you do start taking SAM-e, but sure to get enough B vitamins, especially folate, B6 and B12. There is some evidence that SAM-e does not work as well without enough B vitamins. And take SAM-e on an empty stomach about half an hour before a meal to increase absorption. You might also try supplementing with a gram or so of methionine. There was a recent animal study that indicated that taking methionine might increase the level of SAM-e in the brain. (The effect of methionine and S-adenosylmethionine on S-adenosylmethionine levels in the rat brain)

I've also read that it can be fairly common for SAMe to cause Akathisia....and that it may take a long time after discontinuation for this to disappear or improve.

 

[thenxtgrt1]

I believe I'm about to re-start a Sam-e protocol and also add in a few more ingredients. I'm not well-versed in under/over methylation. When I took sam-e in the past, I did notice positive well-being from it. And it seemed to help slightly with moderate back pain at the time.

What I'd like to know presently...how does methlyation relate to inflammation? I haven't seen any literature that speaks directly on this. But I assume there is a correlation. A benefit often mentioned of Sam-e is reduction in joint pain. If I'm an under-methylator and I improve this, would inflammation also be reduced?

 

[The Matrix]

I believe I'm about to re-start a Sam-e protocol and also add in a few more ingredients. I'm not well-versed in under/over methylation. When I took sam-e in the past, I did notice positive well-being from it. And it seemed to help slightly with moderate back pain at the time.

What I'd like to know presently...how does methlyation relate to inflammation? I haven't seen any literature that speaks directly on this. But I assume there is a correlation. A benefit often mentioned of Sam-e is reduction in joint pain. If I'm an under-methylator and I improve this, would inflammation also be reduced?

SAm-3 increases glucosamine which helps in joint pains.
I have all my athletes take it because it helps replenish gluthione stores
along with 600-1200 mgs NAC.

 

[coolhammer]

I really find this information to be really informative. I suffer from Hg toxicity as I had amalgams in my mouth. ALso Cu i really high. I am taking Mo(Molybdenum) and VitC for this. Definitely, I am undermethyled as I have food allergies and MCS(mild). My eyes get really red when I go to the mall or shops. I have couple of questions

1. Whenever I eat fatty foods evenlittle bit extremeties of my hand and feet get numb which to me is very clear from "Low Bile flow". I am sensitive to soy it effects my thyroid right away, i feel it. Took Milk thistle in the past now my saliva gets really foamy whenever I take it.
What should I do.

2. Tried taking TMG 50mg but experienced lot of anger so stopped. Why??? and what should I do???

3. DIM makes my eyes red and feeel lot of burning. Isn't suppose to be good for you than why am I reacting to it????

4. Wake up every night 3-4 hrs and can't go back to sleep.

Thanks for listening !!!!
Regards

 

[JanSz]

I'm doing it largely for the joint support, my thumb arthritis is nearing the point of needing surgery

Investigate Natural Stem Cell Theraphy.

look at web site of
dremagaziner.com

or any similar

get you self a booklet ($2.95)

Natural Stem Cell Therapy Testimonial Book $2.95 each
http://healthnewsweb.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_8_48&products_id=130

I was talking with Dr E. Magaziner after my distal biceps tendon surgery.
This theraphy was not applicable to speed healing of my tendon,
but if I had a sprain it would work.
I also have arthritis in my thumb, so I asked about it.
He said yes, that would be good application.
I am retired, this thing is not paid by insurance,
it does not hurt al the time.
So I am waiting.

It is 5-6 sessions, $700 each

He also does prolotheraphy, similar in application, $500 per session.
From point of view of mechanics it is wery similar procedure.
But he have to buy $200 kit that he uses to extract cells from your blood for that injection.
.
.

 

[jmh80]

Matrix - do you agree SAMe should be taken on an empty stomach??

 

[coolhammer]

Matrix - Need your input

I really find your post about methylation to be very informative. I suffer from Hg toxicity as I had amalgams in my mouth. ALso Cu i really high. I am taking Mo(Molybdenum) and VitC for this. Definitely, I am undermethyled as I have food allergies and MCS(mild). My eyes get really red when I go to the mall or shops. I have couple of questions

1. Whenever I eat fatty foods evenlittle bit extremeties of my hand and feet get numb which to me is very clear from "Low Bile flow". I am sensitive to soy it effects my thyroid right away, i feel it. Took Milk thistle in the past now my saliva gets really foamy whenever I take it.
What should I do.

2. Tried taking TMG 50mg but experienced lot of anger so stopped. Why??? and what should I do???

3. DIM makes my eyes red and feeel lot of burning. Isn't suppose to be good for you than why am I reacting to it????

4. Wake up every night 3-4 hrs and can't go back to sleep.

Thanks for listening !!!!
Regards[/QUOTE]

 

[The Matrix]

I really find your post about methylation to be very informative. I suffer from Hg toxicity as I had amalgams in my mouth. ALso Cu i really high. I am taking Mo(Molybdenum) and VitC for this. Definitely, I am undermethyled as I have food allergies and MCS(mild). My eyes get really red when I go to the mall or shops. I have couple of questions

1. Whenever I eat fatty foods evenlittle bit extremeties of my hand and feet get numb which to me is very clear from "Low Bile flow". I am sensitive to soy it effects my thyroid right away, i feel it. Took Milk thistle in the past now my saliva gets really foamy whenever I take it.
What should I do.

2. Tried taking TMG 50mg but experienced lot of anger so stopped. Why??? and what should I do???

3. DIM makes my eyes red and feeel lot of burning. Isn't suppose to be good for you than why am I reacting to it????

4. Wake up every night 3-4 hrs and can't go back to sleep.

Thanks for listening !!!!
Regards

[/QUOTE]


Dim can be over loading the liver and methylation cycle. If you are already low on methylation you are getting over flood of the bad estrogens that are being recirulated back in to blood stream and not being escorted out proprely so you are getting an estrogen over load from the metabolites lingering around. This is putting more stress on your liver. I would swith to i50 mgs od iodoral which converts the bad estrones into estriol which is the protective kind. This would reduce liver stress tremendously by reducing stress on methylation cyles

When ever my e2 goes high my eyes will start burning at night time for no reason once e2 is in check that stops the next night. You can also look at the bowel as primary source of estrogen because dyboisis will increase cirulatng estrogens as well which have not been properly packaged for removal.

Every 3-4 hours is a sign your liver is imbalanced or your cortisol/thyroid is out of wack. Simple cortisol saliva test would answer that. in order to interpret your thyroid function you need to have proper lab work done. Please start a new thread so it could be easier to follow.

Moly, seleneium are essential for proper methylation as b-12, folonic acid, p5p,

if you are serious about your health and want to get better PM

 

[The Matrix]

Matrix - do you agree SAMe should be taken on an empty stomach??

Yes 20-30 minutes before meals best time are before breakfast and mid afternoon give good stablility.

 

[health4life24]

Yes 20-30 minutes before meals best time are before breakfast and mid afternoon give good stablility.

Hey bro, have a question. When people come out to see you, do you muscle test with foods and supplements to see what someone needs?

 

[The Matrix]

Hey bro, have a question. When people come out to see you, do you muscle test with foods and supplements to see what someone needs?

Muscle testing I have mastered to accuracy of 98% as i have proved time and time again. Even the skeptics minds are changed. The technique I use is not used by traditional testers and allows me to further assesment.

 

[health4life24]

Muscle testing I have mastered to accuracy of 98% as i have proved time and time again. Even the skeptics minds are changed. The technique I use is not used by traditional testers and allows me to further assesment.

That's cool! So through muscle testing, you know what supplements and diet someone needs to be on? I used to go to a holistic doctor that did muscle testing. I'm wondering that if you put different food and supplement items within someone's energy field if you could tell whether it was beneficial or not. Would help eliminate allot of guessing.

 

[MetalMX]

Some more info regarding this topic.

I have been looking into P5P. The active form of Vitamin B6.

If you have Mortons toe , toe next to big toe is longer than big toe ,this means you can't convert pyrodoxine into pyrodoxine 5 phosphate.

I have this.

I have figured out that folic acid is useless for those who have high histamine as this increases histamine levels even further. Also if you have MTHFR mutation this form of folate will do you no good. So you need to be using L-5-methyl tetrahydrofolate (L-5-MTHF).


And in regards to vitamin B6 many people cannot convert it into its active form P5P in the liver due to medications (high blood pressure, arthritic meds), genetics, and any diseases they may have. So the P5P form needs to be used.

P5P is the coenzyme for all enzymes involved in the conversion process for amino acids. P5P is also needed for hemoglobin production as well as for fatty acid and prostaglandin metabolism. It is also necessary for neurotransmitter production. It is also necessary for healthy functioning of the immune system and proper production of Red Blood Cells.

Finally cyanocobalmin on its own isnt effective because the liver converts this to the active form methycobalamin. And this conversion again isnt always good depending on the individual. Methycobalamin protects brain cells, regenerates nerve tissues, improves methylation and gives you energy. So you need something like B12 Extreme or Methy B12 injections.

 

[The Matrix]

Some more info regarding this topic.

I have been looking into P5P. The active form of Vitamin B6.

If you have Mortons toe , toe next to big toe is longer than big toe ,this means you can't convert pyrodoxine into pyrodoxine 5 phosphate.

I have this.

I have figured out that folic acid is useless for those who have high histamine as this increases histamine levels even further. Also if you have MTHFR mutation this form of folate will do you no good. So you need to be using L-5-methyl tetrahydrofolate (L-5-MTHF).


And in regards to vitamin B6 many people cannot convert it into its active form P5P in the liver due to medications (high blood pressure, arthritic meds), genetics, and any diseases they may have. So the P5P form needs to be used.

P5P is the coenzyme for all enzymes involved in the conversion process for amino acids. P5P is also needed for hemoglobin production as well as for fatty acid and prostaglandin metabolism. It is also necessary for neurotransmitter production. It is also necessary for healthy functioning of the immune system and proper production of Red Blood Cells.

Finally cyanocobalmin on its own isnt effective because the liver converts this to the active form methycobalamin. And this conversion again isnt always good depending on the individual. Methycobalamin protects brain cells, regenerates nerve tissues, improves methylation and gives you energy. So you need something like B12 Extreme or Methy B12 injections.

i am already light years ahead of you

THis will all be incorportate in to ones recommendations to cicumvent all of these chemical alterations. LET the experts do the thinking and you take a break from things. This will all be explained when time comes. When you are the patient you need to put trust into the treating medical practioner. i am telling you learn from my mistakes because it will only add more stress. ro many people get information over load. i have been to the worlds leading expert on methylation and i was actually a patient many years ago. From that time i have grown leaps and bounds in understanding the genetic mutations that occur and how to circumvent them. just sit back and relax and enjoy life and let the person treating you do their jobs. When it comes to methylation it gets extremely complicated and in some cases certain supplements that are normally used can be poison to the system.

 

[MetalMX]

i am already light years ahead of you

THis will all be incorportate in to ones recommendations to cicumvent all of these chemical alterations. LET the experts do the thinking and you take a break from things. This will all be explained when time comes. When you are the patient you need to put trust into the treating medical practioner. i am telling you learn from my mistakes because it will only add more stress. ro many people get information over load. i have been to the worlds leading expert on methylation and i was actually a patient many years ago. From that time i have grown leaps and bounds in understanding the genetic mutations that occur and how to circumvent them. just sit back and relax and enjoy life and let the person treating you do their jobs. When it comes to methylation it gets extremely complicated and in some cases certain supplements that are normally used can be poison to the system.

Im only in the very beginnings of understanding all this.

Yeah your right im in information overload, time to chilax a bit.

Although once i get cured i will be very interested in possibly studying this. When i see people having so many problems medically and not getting the proper help i feel like i want to help them.

Can you provide some examples of supplements that could be hazardous?

 

[MetalMX]

BUMP.

Any new findings on methylation?

 

[LeanGuy]

Does MSM improve methylation? I've read conflicting studies. I hate swallowing big pills and MSM powder tastes way better than methionine. Methionine is not tolerable as a powder, instant gag reflex! uke:

 

[The Matrix]

Does MSM improve methylation? I've read conflicting studies. I hate swallowing big pills and MSM powder tastes way better than methionine. Methionine is not tolerable as a powder, instant gag reflex! uke:

I think that methylation can be improved if molybednum and MSM are in proper balance because sulfur can deplete moly and moly is needed to keep methylation going as it is needed to convert sulfites to sulfates. But over all sam-e is the best for undermethylators provided proper b-12 and folate levels are present.

 

[LeanGuy]

I think that methylation can be improved if molybednum and MSM are in proper balance because sulfur can deplete moly and moly is needed to keep methylation going as it is needed to convert sulfites to sulfates. But over all sam-e is the best for undermethylators provided proper b-12 and folate levels are present.

Cool, I take moly every day. For me sam-e increases anxiety after a few weeks... probably due to increased norepinephrine.

 

[Gutterpump]

But over all sam-e is the best for undermethylators provided proper b-12 and folate levels are present.

How is the combo of sam-e, methylfolate and methyl b-12 together?

 

[The Matrix]

How is the combo of sam-e, methylfolate and methyl b-12 together?

I recomend people on methy -12 and methyl folate first and then if no better then add in sam-e after a month or so..

 

[MetalMX]

I just started P5P and felt great after first dose. Mood up, my hands and body felt so warm and my muscles filled out, its probably because of my long term B6 deficiency in terms of an inability to convert regular B6 into the active P5P form. So the P5P form is great since it'll be boosting my serotonin as well.

I will also be adding Folinic Acid 1mg and Methylcobalamin 5mg sublinguals + Moly to this undermethylation reigm which im about to order.

Also i will be doing regular vitamin C and Glutathione IV pushes (2 amps) which my doctor thought would be a good idea with my chemical sensitivies and liver detoxification issues.