Umm, I know what it is but I don't wanna say it - boro's log

I cant wait to hear those numbers, always makes me want to push harder.
 
Standing Shoulder Press
135x5
155x5
175x5

Dips, Pressdowns, Pulldowns, Abs.......

Just wasnt in to it today - weird...
 
borobulker said:
Standing Shoulder Press
135x5
155x5
175x5

Dips, Pressdowns, Pulldowns, Abs.......

Just wasnt in to it today - weird...
Click to expand...

Don't sweat it, it happens. Some days you just cant shrug that off. You still got one in and consistency is the key.
 
Its normal to have those days where you do not feel like training, do not sweat it, as long as you got done what you were suppose to, that is all that matters. I always tell myself to make the most of the workout no matter who crappy I feel.
 
andrew732 said:
Its normal to have those days where you do not feel like training, do not sweat it, as long as you got done what you were suppose to, that is all that matters. I always tell myself to make the most of the workout no matter who crappy I feel.
Click to expand...

Yah my theory is that we overdo it when we are "Primed" and we just get to the point where were exhausted and can't get the feeling back. I myself thought the current workout of slow reps would help recover my CNS but it still caught up to me ... it's ok I have a rest coming. I hate this inexplicable sharp pains that I randomly get.
 
borobulker said:
This is very good for me but I believe I had more in me. I still feel like **** from my little trip last weekend.
Click to expand...

Sounds like the body was ready to respond but your head just wasn't in it. Easier to recover from that way. THose weekend vacations can really throw us off track eh? I know mine do. If Monday wasn't a cardio day I would have been hating life trying to lift.
 
borobulker said:
This is very good for me but I believe I had more in me. I still feel like **** from my little trip last weekend.
Click to expand...

You too? The PEC-shock was not worn off for me, either. My aesthetics have still not recovered: flatter, less all-day pump - bleh. I love my glycogen, and Orlando stole it.
 
8/5/2009
Conventional Deadlift
315x5
365x5
405x9

This was the first time I pulled conventional in probably 6 months... ouch.
 
DreamWeaver said:
Interested in why you dropped AP ?
Click to expand...

I have been using it for well over a year, i was requiring around 6-8 per day. Just wanted take a 4-5 week break from it. It is one of those supplement that are very hard to break from! haha
 
borobulker said:
I have been using it for well over a year, i was requiring around 6-8 per day. Just wanted take a 4-5 week break from it. It is one of those supplement that are very hard to break from! haha
Click to expand...

Ok the reason I was asking is that it is a good staple but yah a year is a while. I have so far seen no reason to increase dosage unless where talking big meal...
 
DreamWeaver said:
Ok the reason I was asking is that it is a good staple but yah a year is a while. I have so far seen no reason to increase dosage unless where talking big meal...
Click to expand...

It is a killer staple! I miss it dearly. It will be back in 3 weeks, I promise. haha
 
borobulker said:
It is a killer staple! I miss it dearly. It will be back in 3 weeks, I promise. haha
Click to expand...

From what I understand it is the Lagerstroemia Speciosa that our body gets used too and needs the absence of to increase sensitivity. The PSlin does not down regulate so I was told. That being the case you could still take bulk PSlin couldn't you? You wouldn't get the benefit of the glut 4 receptors being shut off in the fat cells but the increase in absorbsion from the Slin would still be there. I took vanadium and ate a lot of cinnamon when I was off for my month. Seemed to help a little but not like AP.
 
MrKleen73 said:
From what I understand it is the Lagerstroemia Speciosa that our body gets used too and needs the absence of to increase sensitivity. The PSlin does not down regulate so I was told. That being the case you could still take bulk PSlin couldn't you? You wouldn't get the benefit of the glut 4 receptors being shut off in the fat cells but the increase in absorbsion from the Slin would still be there. I took vanadium and ate a lot of cinnamon when I was off for my month. Seemed to help a little but not like AP.
Click to expand...

<hijack> I'd understand better if I knew what AP was?</hijack>
 
MrKleen73 said:
From what I understand it is the Lagerstroemia Speciosa that our body gets used too and needs the absence of to increase sensitivity. The PSlin does not down regulate so I was told. That being the case you could still take bulk PSlin couldn't you? You wouldn't get the benefit of the glut 4 receptors being shut off in the fat cells but the increase in absorbsion from the Slin would still be there. I took vanadium and ate a lot of cinnamon when I was off for my month. Seemed to help a little but not like AP.
Click to expand...

Yep - I am using P-Slin twice per day.
 
8/6/2009
Flat Bench Press
215x5
245x5
280x11

Low Pin Lockouts
225x10
275x10
295x10
275x8

Accessories - Facepulls, Press downs, Band Ab's
 
MrKleen73 said:
From what I understand it is the Lagerstroemia Speciosa that our body gets used too and needs the absence of to increase sensitivity. The PSlin does not down regulate so I was told. That being the case you could still take bulk PSlin couldn't you? You wouldn't get the benefit of the glut 4 receptors being shut off in the fat cells but the increase in absorbsion from the Slin would still be there. I took vanadium and ate a lot of cinnamon when I was off for my month. Seemed to help a little but not like AP.
Click to expand...

Fug ... I didn't want to hear that :18:
 
Generally speaking, there are two scenarios in which Anabolic Pump [...specific to its effect on GLUT4...] would become less effective over-time: a) a down-regulation of cell-surface GLUT4 activity, or; b) reduced whole-body absorption of the active compounds. In terms of a), this is unlikely to occur: while cytosolic conditions are very difficult to recapitulate in the lab-setting, most evidence points to Berberine increase GLUT4 gene-promoter activity [evidence by an increase in GLUT4 mRNA]. Over time, this would actually increase the amount of post-administration cell-surface GLUT4. Additively, the likely reduction in plasma Insulin levels induced by Berberine would further mitigate GLUT4 mRNA reduction, by promoting co-factors and gene promoters [Insulin decreases these conditions]. In fact, it is far more likely that chronic use of AP will improve one's "Insulin sensitivity", rather than reduce it, as other AMPk-agonist have displayed glucose transporting effects even in the presence of persistent Insulin administration,

In respects to b), this is far more likely: as a foreign compound, your body will eventually seek homeostasis, and become far more efficient and metabolizing the product/steroid/plant you are taking. This is unfortunately inevitable. However, in regards to GLUT4 phosphorylation down-regulating, that scenario is unlikely.
 
Mulletsoldier said:
Generally speaking, there are two scenarios in which Anabolic Pump [...specific to its effect on GLUT4...] would become less effective over-time: a) a down-regulation of cell-surface GLUT4 activity, or; b) reduced whole-body absorption of the active compounds. In terms of a), this is unlikely to occur: while cytosolic conditions are very difficult to recapitulate in the lab-setting, most evidence points to Berberine increase GLUT4 gene-promoter activity [evidence by an increase in GLUT4 mRNA]. Over time, this would actually increase the amount of post-administration cell-surface GLUT4. Additively, the likely reduction in plasma Insulin levels induced by Berberine would further mitigate GLUT4 mRNA reduction, by promoting co-factors and gene promoters [Insulin decreases these conditions]. In fact, it is far more likely that chronic use of AP will improve one's "Insulin sensitivity", rather than reduce it, as other AMPk-agonist have displayed glucose transporting effects even in the presence of persistent Insulin administration,

In respects to b), this is far more likely: as a foreign compound, your body will eventually seek homeostasis, and become far more efficient and metabolizing the product/steroid/plant you are taking. This is unfortunately inevitable. However, in regards to GLUT4 phosphorylation down-regulating, that scenario is unlikely.
Click to expand...

I must have misunderstood you when told me that was the reason to cycle off of Anabolic Pump was that my system would get used to the berberine and would need a break. I asked you about it because of the banaba in both Anabolic Pump and PSlin. So is there another reason why you told me my body would lose sensitivity to the Berberine in Anabolic Pump, and the GYM in PSlin if not cycled?

Just a little confused and want to make sure I am properly educated. I definitely listen to your suggestions and spread the good word when I have oppurtunity.
 
Last edited:
MrKleen73 said:
So is there another reason why you told me my body would lose sensitivity to the Berberine in Anabolic Pump, and the GYM in PSlin if not cycled?
Click to expand...

Just reason b) above, MK. IIRC, I said the optimum approach is to use P-SLIN and AP in a staggered fashion - i.e., weeks 1-4 AP, weeks 4-8 P-SLIN, weeks 8-12 AP and so forth; in this way, you reap the glucose disposal properties of AP/P-SLIN without overusing either.

At some point, your body will normalize itself to any compound, and this is particularly true for herbals.
 
Mulletsoldier said:
Just reason b) above, MK. IIRC, I said the optimum approach is to use P-SLIN and AP in a staggered fashion - i.e., weeks 1-4 AP, weeks 4-8 P-SLIN, weeks 8-12 AP and so forth; in this way, you reap the glucose disposal properties of AP/P-SLIN without overusing either.

At some point, your body will normalize itself to any compound, and this is particularly true for herbals.
Click to expand...

I had to reread your post again. I think the last statement in your post had me a little confused. I thought you were refering to B as being unlikely as well. It didn't click you referred back to A again.

Thanks for clarifying.

Your explanation of how it effect insulin sensitivity is more detailed than I knew. I knew the lower insulin levels would increase sensitivity, but I didn't realize that it had a lasting positive effect on the glut 4 reaction ie... "Over time, this would actually increase the amount of post-administration cell-surface GLUT4" That is awesome to know.
 
MrKleen73 said:
I had to reread your post again. I think the last statement in your post had me a little confused. I thought you were refering to B as being unlikely as well. It didn't click you referred back to A again.

Thanks for clarifying.

Your explanation of how it effect insulin sensitivity is more detailed than I knew. I knew the lower insulin levels would increase sensitivity, but I didn't realize that it had a lasting positive effect on the glut 4 reaction ie... "Over time, this would actually increase the amount of post-administration cell-surface GLUT4" That is awesome to know.
Click to expand...

Well, just think NIDDM: chronic exposure to Insulin will ultimately down-regulate the PI3K/Atk pathway of GLUT4 phosphorlyation, leading to, "insulin insensitivity". Many trials have subsequently found the opposite to be true.
 
So if i understand this correctly, after about 4 weeks of either AP or Pslin the body will begin to reduce the amount of active ingredient it absorbs? Or is the 4 week cycling to optimize the efficacy of each product?


Boro how did you know to increase the dosage of AP while u were taking it?
 
GoHardOrGoHme said:
So if i understand this correctly, after about 4 weeks of either AP or Pslin the body will begin to reduce the amount of active ingredient it absorbs? Or is the 4 week cycling to optimize the efficacy of each product?


Boro how did you know to increase the dosage of AP while u were taking it?
Click to expand...

I believe the gist of their exchange was that the original concern was discussing the potential for reduced absorption in 4 weeks and Mullet brought up the scenario that although that "could" happen, a more likely outcome is that AP may actually improve in efficacy with increased duration of use.

You need at least 10 college units in microbiology, biochemistry and a 5 unit post grad course in MMA Theory, with lab to understand half of Mullet's posts.
 
****... all i have is B.S. majoring in neuroscience and behavioral biology...time to go back to school!
 
GoHardOrGoHme said:
****... all i have is B.S. majoring in neuroscience and behavioral biology...time to go back to school!
Click to expand...

I have a PHD in BS ;), but I had to go look up what he meant on some of it, and try to apply context to the rest of it. However I am still unsure of the entire meaning of his last post. If I understood right about the last statement the thoughts that the constant presence of excess insulin will lower insulin sensitivity is now being disproven in some trials?

Sorry Mullet, I got totally lost so if I am completely off base here you will have to reiterate without the technical jargon. I couldn't even find a definition on google for PI3/Atk pathway, and what exactly it does or is responsible for. I tried to do my own research but you are WAY out of my league bro.

The information I have gotten from this are: It is not a down regulation of the receptors that causes the eventual loss of efficacy, if it occurs, it is the body's constant adaption to achieve homeostasis that makes it adapt to how it processes the Anabolic Pump, or any other external compound and not due to actual receptor sensitivity.

2, and this one I am really not sure I understood but what I think I got from it is: that the line of thought that continuos high levels of insulin being present causes insulin insensitivity is now being disproven in some studies????

Sorry if I seem dense about this last one, if I understood it right then everything I thought I knew about insulin sensitivity is incorrect. From all of my family as well as myself having issues with hyper-insulemia, hypoglycemia, and type II diabetes that it came from chronic over exposure to excess insulin from too many simple sugars being ingested. All of my family has been able to get control of thier blood sugar by going on a keto for a month or so then slowly adding better carb choices back in.

However admittedly I have suggested to many of them to use Anabolic Pump to control this better and increase thier insulin sensitivity. My sister used it for 2 months and now that she is off and eating better her blood sugar is rock solid when she tests it.
 
MrKleen73 said:
I have a PHD in BS ;), but I had to go look up what he meant on some of it, and try to apply context to the rest of it. However I am still unsure of the entire meaning of his last post. If I understood right about the last statement the thoughts that the constant presence of excess insulin will lower insulin sensitivity is now being disproven in some trials?
Click to expand...

That was a typo. It was supposed to read, "Many trials with Berberine have shown the opposite to be true".

Sorry Mullet, I got totally lost so if I am completely off base here you will have to reiterate without the technical jargon. I couldn't even find a definition on google for PI3/Atk pathway, and what exactly it does or is responsible for. I tried to do my own research but you are WAY out of my league bro.
Click to expand...

PI3K [phosphatidylinositol 3-kinase] is part of a family of enzymes that are activated by hormones, cytokines, growth factors and so on. After being activated by a hormone, say, Insulin, PI3K causes the phosphorylation of Akt[2] to the membrane periphery, where it in turn phosphorylates several proteins which are involved in cell growth and function; most important to us weight-lifters, GLUT4 [glucose transport] and mTOR [protein synthesis]. Akt[2] is necessary for Insulin-induced translocation of GLUT4 to the plasma membrane of cells. PI3K itself is mediated by tyrosine phosophorylated IRS-1.

My point was that hyperInsulinemia and/or hyperglycemia have both been shown to impair PI3K-Akt dependent signaling pathways, leading to a reduction in "insulin sensitivity", by way of decreased cell-surface GLUT4.

The information I have gotten from this are: It is not a down regulation of the receptors that causes the eventual loss of efficacy, if it occurs, it is the body's constant adaption to achieve homeostasis that makes it adapt to how it processes the Anabolic Pump, or any other external compound and not due to actual receptor sensitivity.
Click to expand...

I think so. This was honestly worded confusingly!

2, and this one I am really not sure I understood but what I think I got from it is: that the line of thought that continuos high levels of insulin being present causes insulin insensitivity is now being disproven in some studies????
Click to expand...

Nope.
 
Excellent thanks for the info. I am also happy to see I misunderstood that last part. I was thinking I needed to relearn everything I knew about insulin.
 
the amount of hard science on this forum makes me hard...i love it! I mean...uhhh dam...
 
Well for reference's sake, you both have me handily beat in terms of scientific accreditation: the last formal science-based class I took was in grade ten or eleven [can't really remember].
 
Mulletsoldier said:
Well for reference's sake, you both have me handily beat in terms of scientific accreditation: the last formal science-based class I took was in grade ten or eleven [can't really remember].
Click to expand...
Can you recommend of the places you research that also explain what the processes and what not are. Something I can research to learn what those processes and pathways are so that so I can understand the medical studies better. I would love to do some more self study in this area but have no idea where to find that info. You must if you have educated yourself on all of this to get to your level of knowledge.

Why do I feel I should be whiping the brown off of my nose now. ;)
 
In all honesty, I acquired what relatively little knowledge I do have due to working with USPlabs. A customer would ask a question which I did not understand in some way - whether it was a term [most common], pathway, physiological consequent and so on. So, in response, I would read for 4-6 hours until I knew everything about that particular topic they were inquiring about; and, along the way, you begin to intuitively realize patterns. For example, I knew how my Fasted Training Protocol would be beneficial re: AMPk-induced substrate selection prior to ever reading about fasted-state substrate selection. I realize that is not helpful in anyway, but it is an honest answer. I would just recommend paying for a database subscription - I had one from my university - as full-studies contain wonderful information.
 
Mulletsoldier said:
In all honesty, I acquired what relatively little knowledge I do have due to working with USPlabs. A customer would ask a question which I did not understand in some way - whether it was a term [most common], pathway, physiological consequent and so on. So, in response, I would read for 4-6 hours until I knew everything about that particular topic they were inquiring about; and, along the way, you begin to intuitively realize patterns. For example, I knew how my Fasted Training Protocol would be beneficial re: AMPk-induced substrate selection prior to ever reading about fasted-state substrate selection. I realize that is not helpful in anyway, but it is an honest answer. I would just recommend paying for a database subscription - I had one from my university - as full-studies contain wonderful information.
Click to expand...

Thanks, good to know, I will look into the database subscription.
 
jakellpet said:
so, nerds. What's Boro up to? :hammer:
Click to expand...

Too funny... he is probably already skimming those databases. :lol5: Back to you Boro...
 
hahah wow... busy weekend for you guys ehh? I was road-trippin' it all weekend for USP. We freakin rocked it, great weekend even though I drove around 900 miles RT...

Friday kicked ass in the gym, prior to leaving for the trip. Check it -

Wide Stance, Parallel Squats
315x5
365x5
405x11 (could have gotten more but I got scared... haha)

Green Band Ham Curls
5 sets ~10 each

Double Green Band GM's
4 sets of 10-15

Hammer Curls
Various weights/reps...


I want to catch yall up on my current stack.
PRIME - 8 (800mg) caps per day
Cissus - 8 (800mg) caps per day
NP Divanex - 4 (400mg) caps per day
NP Coleus - 5 (20%, 100mg) caps per day
NP EGCG - 1 (50%, 500mg) cap per day
NP CLA - 6 (75%, 1000mg) caps per day
3) scoops DominATP w/ 5g 4:1 BCAA pre-workout
thats about it...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top