Trying to Upregulate Beta Receptors

[baitslinger]

Had a great two weeks of Clen. Only dropped a few pounds on the scale (about 4 lbs, from 202 to 198), but that’s OK since I’m doing a gradual cut. Most importantly, I’m firming up in the waistline, and seeing 4 abs plus delt striations. Strength has not dropped at all, and is actually up a bit in some exercises. Basically just eating all whole foods, and running about 2400-2700 cals a day. Dropped most all of the protein drinks and getting most of the pro from chicken, fish, and meat
Anyway, I’m taking a week break in the Clen, in an effort to re-up my Beta Receptors. I don’t have any Ketotifen, so I’m trying 25-50 mg of Benadryl before bed. So a 1 week break from Clen and some anti-histamine therapy, so that next week, I can get some shakes from 20 mcg again.

My question is this:
Will I still up-reg Beta receptors if I take Yohimbe, Geranium Stem or other popular thermogenic herbs in my “off week” from Clen? Or do they have a similar (downregulating) effect on Beta Receptors, like Clen or Ephedrine do?
Thanks in advance, my bruthas!

 

[baitslinger]

Well, I took a week off Clenbuterol, and took 25-50 mg Benadryl every night.
I did take some OEP and Yohimbe last week. I read somewhere that Yohimbe acts on alpha receptors, so I figured it would not hit my (already hurting) Beta Receptors. I got effect off the Yohimbe - jittery, you know?

So today I go back down to 40 mcg Clen, and guess what - I got the warm feeling back, and some mild hand shakes (which I actually like - lets you know its working). Also, I sweated like a pig doing a variety of deadlifts, hams, and Cardio today

Don't know if it was the 1 week break, or the 1 week break plus Benadryl that did the trick for me. Patrick Arnold does not put faith in Benadryl for cleaning Beta Receptors. Said it is nothing like Ketotifen, pharmacologically. But it is way cheaper! I think my sinuses were so "anti-histamined up" that it made my nose run excessively.

Any similar experiences with Clen cleaning?

 

[vein5]

Dnp upregulates receptors while burning fat.

 

[rochabp]

Dnp upregulates receptors while burning fat.

nice

 

[jbryand101b]

Dnp upregulates receptors while burning fat.

:lmao:

 

[baitslinger]

I am curious about other anti-histamines.

Is this beta receptor cleaning helped out by other OTC antihistamines? I am convinced that Benadryl helps.

 

[ruffrhyder]

Has anyone used the ketotifen eye drops? Those are OTC, I can't find tablets anywhere.

 

[Magg0078]

Why Benadryl? Why not just take a two week break? I don't understand why take Benadryl if you aren't running straight thru.

 

[ruffrhyder]

Why Benadryl? Why not just take a two week break? I don't understand why take Benadryl if you aren't running straight thru.

I've heard by people who use it say 3-4 weeks is the sweet spot to obtain max fat loss, unfortunately around the 2 week point is when receptors are down regulated, so the theory is that Diphenhydramine in Benadryl upregulates the receptors (even Benadryl is questionable, most say ketotifen is the way to go) to allow the longer cycle to obtain maximize fat loss. I've been told taking 2 weeks off isn't enough time to up regulate receptors without any meds. Half life of the clen is about 34-38 hours, a saturated body will still have clen in the system for about 1 week, only giving the body just about 1week to bounce back, which IMO isn't enough time.

 

[baitslinger]

Why Benadryl you ask? Well, like everything else around here, you give it a try and see if it works. Benadryl is cheap as nuts, and it help you sleep too. Thinking out loud, I'm not sure what the downside is (like does Bendryl hit the Kidneys, Liver, or something like that?) Not sure.

But as I found through self experimentation, 1 week off Clen w/ 50 mg Benadryl nightly (after 3 weeks on Clen to 80 mcg), and I was able to go back to 40 mcg, after only one week off, and get the effects at a reasonably low dose.

By the way, I'm doing a two week break in Clen this time. With Benadryl

 

[damage007]

This article should answer all of your questions.
Area-1255: How to Upregulate Beta-Adrenergic Receptors (To improve Energy , Fat Loss etc) (Increasing B3,B2 Receptors)
How To: Upregulate Beta-Adrenergic Receptors

Supplements Proven to Upregulate Beta Adrenergic Receptors

 

[john.patterson]

Why don't you buy some Ketotifen from a chem site? Keto works wonders for up-regulating your receptors, and you'll sleep like a baby

 

[rochabp]

Why don't you buy some Ketotifen from a chem site? Keto works wonders for up-regulating your receptors, and you'll sleep like a baby

They actually believe benadryl upregulates beta receptors.

 

[Magg0078]

5 year second breath of life for this thread! LOL

 

[rochabp]

This article should answer all of your questions.
Area-1255: How to Upregulate Beta-Adrenergic Receptors (To improve Energy , Fat Loss etc) (Increasing B3,B2 Receptors)
How To: Upregulate Beta-Adrenergic Receptors

Supplements Proven to Upregulate Beta Adrenergic Receptors

Heads up play with the article tho, didnt know testosterone and DHT played a role in upregulating receptors

 

[goodvibes]

Heads up play with the article tho, didnt know testosterone and DHT played a role in upregulating receptors

Reboot with test/DHT/dhea post eca/clen cycle? Whaaat? Sounds like my log

 

[jaces]

Heads up play with the article tho, didnt know testosterone and DHT played a role in upregulating receptors

i dont know about beta receptors but ive seen a study that found test upregulates adrogen receptors?? and proviron also does this

 

[damage007]

Heads up play with the article tho, didnt know testosterone and DHT played a role in upregulating receptors

Yup, DHEA as cited in the studies increases beta-3-densities, testosterone upregulates all of them , especially in adipose/BFT/BAT - and DHT preserves beta receptors or at least prevents them from being downregulated by some biochemical interferences. Of all of these, it's most likely that testosterone plays the biggest role , seeing as it has a potent lipolytic effect; superior to all three...but DHT can help nervous system strength too. You've all seen the DHT role in CNS / Brain article right?

 

[damage007]

Why Benadryl you ask? Well, like everything else around here, you give it a try and see if it works. Benadryl is cheap as nuts, and it help you sleep too. Thinking out loud, I'm not sure what the downside is (like does Bendryl hit the Kidneys, Liver, or something like that?) Not sure.

But as I found through self experimentation, 1 week off Clen w/ 50 mg Benadryl nightly (after 3 weeks on Clen to 80 mcg), and I was able to go back to 40 mcg, after only one week off, and get the effects at a reasonably low dose.

By the way, I'm doing a two week break in Clen this time. With Benadryl

Benadryl isn't really the best agent for doing this, I would use ketotifen...also , benadryl isn't purely an antihistamine, it is also a serotonin reuptake inhibitor (mild) and anti-muscarinic agent..the SRI/antimuscarinic properties are the ones that you should be worried about. Antihistamines themselves aren't that bad, if they don't cause you that much lethargy.

Also, if you are going to Zambia..ditch the benadryl, apparently it's illegal there. :trink26::rofl:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diphenhydramine#Mechanism_of_action
http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1010513-overview
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10511010

 

[damage007]

Metals play a role..minerals...magnesium and Zinc can UR beta-adrenergic receptors..though magnesium decreases net norepinephrine levels..so only in coordination with *certain* stims it yields these benefits..but mag has other benefits like anti-cortisol and neuroprotection etc...!

 

[Gutterpump]

though magnesium decreases net norepinephrine levels..

I like to use TD magnesium oil before bed. Great stuff

 

[damage007]

Zinc (Zn2+) also increases the function of beta-receptors by acting as a ''positive allosteric modulator''.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11752207
Dose at 30-35 mg a day or 50 mg a day.

 

[damage007]

Turning off the signal: desensitization of beta-adrenergic receptor function.
W P Hausdorff, M G Caron and R J Lefkowitz

 

[damage007]

The above is a good read, as it goes into not just how the receptors become desensitized (unable to respond to agonists like albuterol or lessened at least, even in response to natural adrenaline/epinephrine), and downregulated (decreased in number), but also the exact mediators and this gives insight, further, into possible methods to reverse the reduction in function of beta-receptors.

 

[NutraChem]

This article should answer all of your questions.
Area-1255: How to Upregulate Beta-Adrenergic Receptors (To improve Energy , Fat Loss etc) (Increasing B3,B2 Receptors)
How To: Upregulate Beta-Adrenergic Receptors

Supplements Proven to Upregulate Beta Adrenergic Receptors

Good blog! DHEA is very under-rated.

 

[BlockBuilder]

I'm still very confused as to whether or not it's ok to take oral DHEA because of its supposed suppression etc. I personally would love to take it daily at a dose of 50 mg daily. I'm 30 yrs old but every single time I do some research it's 50 percent saying it's ok to take and 50 percent saying it's not a good idea. It's frustrating

 

[NutraChem]

I'm still very confused as to whether or not it's ok to take oral DHEA because of its supposed suppression etc. I personally would love to take it daily at a dose of 50 mg daily. I'm 30 yrs old but every single time I do some research it's 50 percent saying it's ok to take and 50 percent saying it's not a good idea. It's frustrating

With daily, practical use (100mg or less) DHEA suppression is an urban legend. That's been my observation after playing with it almost 2 decades now. But the legend persists and I'm not sure why. I've even used it successfully in PCT bridges, multiple times. That's how much of a non-issue it is IME. Of course people are different, so the only way to know for certain is to put it to the test and evaluate your own response.

That one guy's link above has a pretty good blog. I've been looking over it and can't find a lot of things I would disagree with. It's also rare to see anyone knowledgeable of the Pauling protocol for vessel repair, but he has an entry about that too. (unrelated - sorry for the hijack!)

 

[damage007]

With daily, practical use (100mg or less) DHEA suppression is an urban legend. That's been my observation after playing with it almost 2 decades now. But the legend persists and I'm not sure why. I've even used it successfully in PCT bridges, multiple times. That's how much of a non-issue it is IME. Of course people are different, so the only way to know for certain is to put it to the test and evaluate your own response.

That one guy's link above has a pretty good blog. I've been looking over it and can't find a lot of things I would disagree with. It's also rare to see anyone knowledgeable of the Pauling protocol for vessel repair, but he has an entry about that too. (unrelated - sorry for the hijack!)

Sometimes you have to wonder if people are psyching themselves into a mild 'shutdown', pseudo-suppression.

 

[rtmilburn]

Sometimes you have to wonder if people are psyching themselves into a mild 'shutdown', pseudo-suppression.

Definitely possible. The brain is a very interesting and powerful organ.

 

[NutraChem]

The more I read on DHEA, the more I'm glad I take it every day. It's just good for practically everything.

It exerts multiple anti-atherogenic effects, it's anti-viral (increases lymphocytes), reduces the incidence of many cancers, heals and strengthens bones almost as good as DHT and E2 all by itself without any conversion, improves glucose metabolism, prevents adrenal stress, cuts the production of enzymes linked to tumor formation (including lung, prostate, testicle, skin, colon, etc.), fights auto-immune conditions, prevents complications from radiation exposure, corrects cytokine storm, protects DNA from damage, I mean the list just goes on and on.

If you don't use it, you might want to at least consider using it. I've used it on and off since the 90's and haven't ever experienced shutdown as a result. Just sayin.

 

[damage007]

The more I read on DHEA, the more I'm glad I take it every day. It's just good for practically everything.

It exerts multiple anti-atherogenic effects, it's anti-viral (increases lymphocytes), reduces the incidence of many cancers, heals and strengthens bones almost as good as DHT and E2 all by itself without any conversion, improves glucose metabolism, prevents adrenal stress, cuts the production of enzymes linked to tumor formation (including lung, prostate, testicle, skin, colon, etc.), fights auto-immune conditions, prevents complications from radiation exposure, corrects cytokine storm, protects DNA from damage, I mean the list just goes on and on.

If you don't use it, you might want to at least consider using it. I've used it on and off since the 90's and haven't ever experienced shutdown as a result. Just sayin.

Between DHEA and Pregnenolone, one can expect massive boosts in cognition.
Anti-Aging benefits are remarkable. Some of the best anti-depressants too.

DHEA Links.
http://www.life-enhancement.com/magazine/article/634-dhea-improves-mental-function-and-combats-depression
http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2010/12/New-Research-Substantiates-the-Anti-Aging-Properties-of-DHEA/Page-01
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0104869
Pregnenolone.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3930995/
http://www.lifeextensionvitamins.com/prcrhoforema.html
http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2007/11/report_pregnenolone/Page-01

 

[NutraChem]

Between DHEA and Pregnenolone, one can expect massive boosts in cognition.
Anti-Aging benefits are remarkable. Some of the best anti-depressants too.

DHEA Links.
http://www.life-enhancement.com/magazine/article/634-dhea-improves-mental-function-and-combats-depression
http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2010/12/New-Research-Substantiates-the-Anti-Aging-Properties-of-DHEA/Page-01
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0104869
Pregnenolone.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3930995/
http://www.lifeextensionvitamins.com/prcrhoforema.html
http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2007/11/report_pregnenolone/Page-01

Fascinating articles, especially the one on DHEA as an anti-distractive. I wonder if this effect is sexually dimorphic, or if the results have been been duplicated in male subjects?

 

[NutraChem]

Here are some more ideas. Also, just updated the main article.
Thyroid hormone regulation of beta-adrenergic receptor number.
L T Williams, R J Lefkowitz, A M Watanabe, D R Hathaway and H R Besch, Jr
Abstract

The effects of exogenous thyroid hormones (thyroxine and triiodothyronine) on beta-adrenergic receptors in the rat myocardium were investigated. The potent beta-adrenergic antagonist, (-)-[3H]dihydroalprenolol, was used to directly estimate the number and affinity of beta-adrenergic receptors in rat heart membranes from control and hyperthyroid rats. Cardiac membranes from hyperthyroid rats contained 196 +/- 7 fmol of (-)-[3H]dihydroalprenolol binding sites/mg of protein which was significantly (p less than 0.005) greater than the number of binding sites (89 +/- 5 fmol/mg of protein) present in control membranes. The equilibrium dissociation constant (KD) for the interaction of receptors with dihydroalprenolol was the same (2 to 15 nM) in membranes from control and hyperthyroid rats. Similarly, there was no significant difference between the control and hyperthyroid membranes in the affinity of the beta-adrenergic receptor binding sites for the beta-adrenergic agonist isoproterenol. The results of this study demonstrate that thyroid hormones can regulate the number of cardiac beta-adrenergic receptors. The increased numbers of receptors may be responsible, at least in part, for the enhanced catecholamine sensitivity of beta-adrenergic-coupled cardiac responses in the hyperthyroid state.

Yes, this is true, but the cardiac upreg in beta adrenergic receptor density is usually a limiting factor with thyroxine treatment. This is why beta-blockers are often stacked with higher dose thyroxine regimens, but that defeats the whole point if upregulation is the goal! Perhaps some other means of cardiac control could be employed to keep pulse rate down, like calcium channel blockers?

 

[NutraChem]

NutraChem, any other ideas to chip in here?

I think I'd keep it simple. Find a dose of T4 that works (I'd avoid T3) and not get greedy with it to keep pulse rate acceptable. If one decided to force the dose or use T3 then maybe adding a touch of a calcium channel blocker (or clonidine) would keep pulse rate in check. The adenosine might work, never tried it like that, but it would be easy enough to dose ATP disodium all day. If you can tolerate salv and it's still legal in your state you may be able to work the kappa angle, but that doesn't seem practical. I could see being chronically depersonalized potentially resulting in semi-permanent psychological changes.

 

[NAO1255]

Wrote the article mentioned on [PAGE 1]. Also updated it recently. How many folks still use Clen? Any new innovations on the Horizon?

 

[AlexPowell]

What are people trying to achieve here? What does upregulating these receptors do? Why bother?
Any before and after pictures?

 

[NAO1255]

What are people trying to achieve here? What does upregulating these receptors do? Why bother?
Any before and after pictures?

It makes Clen more effective or simply work again if it doesn't anymore. Its like reversing the tolerance to Amphetamine, except we are referring to Clen's fat burning/leaning abilities.

 

[Whisky]

This thread simply won’t die, it’s been upregulated itself lol

But I’m personally using clen (built up to 140 a day over the first week) and 2mg ket at night - have to say that the ket seems to maintain the effectiveness of the clen in so much as I’m still getting the jittery shakes pretty much all the way through the 2 weeks (And i have a very high stim tolerance).