I just started an 8 week cycle of lgd and mk677. Im using ar1macare pro. Do i follow the label as indicated? 4 twice a day? Seems like alot.
Its a lot of caps but that is the appropriate dosing.I just started an 8 week cycle of lgd and mk677. Im using ar1macare pro. Do i follow the label as indicated? 4 twice a day? Seems like alot.
Alright, thanksIts a lot of caps but that is the appropriate dosing.
With 25mg for 12 weeks, 4 weeks of PCT seems a little short. 25mg is quite suppressive and you're running it for a fairly long time, not including the Dermacrine.Yeah I will be doing a four week PCT. I am just starting at 30mg of nolva for the first couple weeks with an intention of tapering down. Thanks for all of your advice. I've ordered Sup3r PCT as well. Just take daily at the dose recommendation on the label I assume?
4 weeks pct is plenty, 12 week test cycles usually include a 4 week pct. I would run nolva at 20/20/10/10 and forget about 30mgWith 25mg for 12 weeks, 4 weeks of PCT seems a little short. 25mg is quite suppressive and you're running it for a fairly long time, not including the Dermacrine.
Thanks for the great thread! Last year I had great success with a LGD/Osta/11-andro cut. This year I was thinking of LGD/Osta/MK/GW, I understand from your post that is a nice set-up for a cut?Let's talk Osta....
Ostarine - is, probably, the most well known SARM's. It is best used to preserve muscle mass, while in a caloric deficit. Ostarine can, and will, suppress your natural testosterone production in longer higher dosed cycles. So, a SERM PCT is needed. Ostarine can also cause gyno in some users. So, it is recommended that you have an AI, like Exemestane, on hand. The average cycle length is 6 to 10 weeks at a dosage range of 10mg to 25mg.
Ostarine example cycle:
Beginner cut
Ostarine - 15/15/15/15/15/15
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
*AI of choice on hand
Advanced Cut:
Ostarine - 15/15/15/15/15/20/20/20/20/20
OL Eliminate - 2/2/2/2/2/3/3/3/3/3
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/25/25
Recomp cycle:
Ostarine - 20/20/20/20/25/25/25/25
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/25/25
Now, here are some SARM cycle Stacks that I've come up with....
Cut to Bulk:
Ostarine -15/15/15/15/15/15/0/0/0/0
LGD - 0/0/0/0/4/4/8/8/12/12
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/25/25
RAD/Osta Recomp:
RAD - 4/4/8/8/12/12/0/0
Ostarine - 20/20/20/20/25/25/25/25
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/25/25
RAD/LGD Bulk:
RAD - 4/4/8/8/12/12/0/0
LGD - 4/4/4/8/8/8/12/12
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/50/25/25
**MK 677 and/or GW would stack great with these cycles, as well, and would help with endurance, sleep, and overall muscle gain. (Refer to MK 677 and GW dosing at top of thread).**
Coming tomorrow...other PCT options!
This. Real SERMs get your test up quite quickly.4 weeks pct is plenty, 12 week test cycles usually include a 4 week pct. I would run nolva at 20/20/10/10 and forget about 30mg
I would go for rad in place of the lgd for a cut. Rad will be a great kicker for the osta and get things moving in the right direction pretty quickly. Osta and lgd just don't stack good imo.Thanks for the great thread! Last year I had great success with a LGD/Osta/11-andro cut. This year I was thinking of LGD/Osta/MK/GW, I understand from your post that is a nice set-up for a cut?
Has anybody pinpointed a reason for it making ya feel like sh1t?Rad has been good for recomp when I've ran it . It kinda puffs you up then you start to lean out and when you get off of it a couple days after you lose a tad bit of water weight . It made me look pretty good on my last two runs , only thing is it make me feel like dog **** and quick
I would hold off and get your test situation figured out first. You don't want to cause any deviation in your numbers when your doctor does your bloodwork to compare to previous bloodwork, this could only cause issues for you.Hey guys.
Question for anyone on Trt. I have just been diagnosed with low T and refered to a specialist. My appointment will be 4-6 weeks.
My next cycle is due to start in 10days. Shud I hold off until after I've seen the specialist or continue with cycle? I'm giddy to be starting next cycle as suffered injury at the start of this year.
If I decide to hold off it could be 6-8 months before I jump back on! Thanks
Epic unleashed and conquer sounds like a great stack while you get things in order! I would do something similar for sure.Thanks Yates, I've decided the same. Gunna stick with Epic unleashed as that shouldn't alter my figures I believe. Would you recommend anything else? Use conquer pre workout but not everyday.
I wouldn't use anything right now that can effect any hormone levels until you get your low T taken care of.Would Gharine 10mg have any effect on my results. Not tried it yet was saving the 2 bottles. Cheers again
I started lifting when I was about 105 pounds so I feel your pain! Osta definitely isn't your best option. For a first cycle bulk I would go for lgd. Obtain is great at maintaining muscle mass while in a deficit but not that great at putting on muscle.Yates
I am 27 male lifting a few years, although most of my gains are from this past year and gaining very slowly as I have a hard time gaining and more recently starting to eat more. I'm 140lb (started gaining at 115lbs but have trained previous to that), have always had low bf, starting to get some belly fat from bulking, small strength gains, training intensely, starting to be a lot more dedicated. I was recommended by a friend, Ostalean and have read a thread on here about someone using it which linked me to this thread. So my question was, can I safely start using Ostalean at its recommended dosage even though I am not specifically trying to lose weight, or do you recommend another sarm? I do not have very high expectations, just want a few pounds of muscle mass and get my feet wet with something with low sides. The person in the other thread was directed to take Ostalean, with the free bottle of testoshred (am thinking about buying this combo) and then to take Rebirth as part of the pct with the testoshred. Is this a stack you recommend or are there better options? Also, is there a point to taking testoshred if I'm taking Rebirth? Or vise Vera? I don't know the difference between the test booster and the serm.
Don't get me wrong I could be leaner, all of my fat gain is ending up in my stomach so I always have to tighten my abs to see them like I used to. Maybe caused by GOMAD, mostly just half gomad now
Thanks!
Think it had to do with vitaminsHas anybody pinpointed a reason for it making ya feel like sh1t?
As theoldguy said do your cycle. Have exemestane on hand and use Clomid and nolva for pct. DoneSo is it okay if I just use clomid after LGD cycle, nothing else?
I have both of these so far, will probably get aromasin when I start the cycle
And this will be primeval's LGD so I'm hoping it's not a PH
I was confused because I don't usually hear anyone use both? Even this thread says one or the other. I also ask because I now have clomid not nolva. I'm on here for clear insight not to be annoying.As theoldguy said do your cycle. Have exemestane on hand and use Clomid and nolva for pct. Done
Not sure if there is anything out there saying that stacking SERMs helps at all, imo nolva for 6 weeks would be optimal solo. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.I was confused because I don't usually hear anyone use both? Even this thread says one or the other. I also ask because I now have clomid not nolva. I'm on here for clear insight not to be annoying.
This says there is, so I do it (and because it was pointed out by some knowledgeable members here as well) - and why not? It's cheap (as cheap or cheaper than most of those "OTC SERM/PCT" concoctions) and comparably safe based on small/short dosages/duration that we use SERMs for:Not sure if there is anything out there saying that stacking SERMs helps at all, imo nolva for 6 weeks would be optimal solo. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
Plus, I'm old and scared - stack the deck baby!What's the point of using two different SERMs during PCT?
There are 2 major components involved in recovery. Testosterone production and Spermatogenesis.
LH and FSH are both required for the equation. LH is produced by the pituitary and stimulates the Leydig cells to produce testosterone. Once testosterone is in production it works alongside FSH and stimulates sertoli cells to produce sperm. Sperm production is hindered if either of these are unhealthy. They both work in synergy. You need BOTH to be at healthy levels. Nolvadex is dominant in LH promotion and Clomid is dominant in promoting FSH.
Clomid has multiple effects. It's an anti-estrogen, so it obviously decreases the estrogenic effects in your body by stimulating the Hypothalamus back to life and sending gonadotropin releasing hormone (GnRH) to your pituitary, so that LH/FSH can be secreted.
Nolva boosts the effects of Clomid because it put Clomid into "competition" mode where they both fight for a receptors to bind to. This competitiveness will only occur with the presence of BOTH Nolva/Clomid, and will inevitably resolve the issue of excess estrogen in the Hypothalamus. This will trigger both LH and FSH to crank UP, as the high estrogen in this cluster is suppressive. This entire scenario is not as effective with only one drug.
Furthermore varying the compounds; Since we know both stimulate LH, what most don't know is that the act is different. Clomid boosts the amplitude of LH serum, but has no effect on the frequency. Nolvadex is the complete opposite in that area, where it boosts the actual frequency of LH and has no effect on its amplitude.
You're probably assuming they're identical and overpowering... Clomid is a mixed agonist/antagonist for the estradiol receptor. Nolva is also mixed, however.... it is a pure antagonist in the E receptor in breast tissue. There is a reason that Clomid is not recommended for gynecomastia reversal, but Nolva is.
Can you recover with just Nolvadex, or just Clomid? Well, anything is possible. But why would you take that risk if the combination gives you a much better chance? To save a few bucks and risk your health? Clomid when coupled with Nolvadex is clearly the safer choice over using either compound individually.
*You can substitute clomid with toremifine as well.
Nice post. So I assume a proper plan would be clomid 50/50/25/25 alongside nolva 20/20/10/10?This says there is, so I do it (and because it was pointed out by some knowledgeable members here as well) - and why not? It's cheap (as cheap or cheaper than most of those "OTC SERM/PCT" concoctions) and comparably safe based on small/short dosages/duration that we use SERMs for:
Plus, I'm old and scared - stack the deck baby!
Wow I wasn't aware of this, thanks!This says there is, so I do it (and because it was pointed out by some knowledgeable members here as well) - and why not? It's cheap (as cheap or cheaper than most of those "OTC SERM/PCT" concoctions) and comparably safe based on small/short dosages/duration that we use SERMs for:
Plus, I'm old and scared - stack the deck baby!
Technically, you could lessen the dosages of each (I was told), but that gets into some PITA syringe examination when dosing - I just do like you posted - std dosages. I do go longer though usually - 5-6 weeks doing EOD for the last one to two weeks. Others like doing the lower dosages for longer like 25 and 10 for 6-8 weeks. Due diligence and self experimentation!Nice post. So I assume a proper plan would be clomid 50/50/25/25 alongside nolva 20/20/10/10?
Unfortunately not all states allow you to get blood work without a Doctor approving it. I got blood done pre-cycle because I just so happen to have my yearly physical, but wont be able to get them again for another year.If your not prepared to do bloodwork i dont think you be using this stuff.
Im sorry but this is not true at all.Unfortunately not all states allow you to get blood work without a Doctor approving it. I got blood done pre-sale because I just so happen to have my yearly physical, but wont be able to get them again for another year.
Maryland, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey.Im sorry but this is not true at all.
Intesting. I live in new york and i am very much able to buy blood testing through the life extension website. Its independent bloodwork. Or drive to another state to do it. Or take whatever is marketed to you and suffer from the consequences of not knowing whats going on in your body. Do a pct when you dont need to, or do an improper pct... Its just foolish...Maryland, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey.
Laws in these states require that any lab work be ordered by your personal physician; a copy of this order must be presented at the laboratory.
So you draw your own blood? The only way for life extension to work is that they send a vile and blood draw kit and you draw your own blood and mail it in. Not sure I am qualified to draw my own blood so I will pass on that option.Intesting. I live in new york and i am very much able to buy blood testing through the life extension website. Its independent bloodwork. Or drive to another state to do it.
I would say that 50mg C and 20mg N or less - does not equal overkill for these extremely well tested drugs (developed in the early 60's). They are usually prescribed for *years* to Women (Clomid Off Label to Men). A month or two with tapering dosages is nothing, IMO. And the possible damage that could occur is far greater from the anabolic compounds (SARMs/PHs - They are drugs too, let's not kid ourselves) then the SERMs. But I agree that blood work is the best case scenario....or use serms(which are drugs) to pct and completely overkill it.
I mean i definitely understand your point, but clomid for example has its own sides. Dudes get super emotional lol. My comments are not just about the pct, but the sarms which are compounds. They should be treated like a cycle. Cycles require bloodwork. Anyways who says that after these guys run a sarm they even need a pct in the first place? How do you know? Based on how you feel? Blood work is a no brainer. The issue is these dudes wanna play on the dark side and not take the responsisbilty for thier decision. Get bloods done. Pay the money and stay as healthy as possible while doing it.I would say that 50mg C and 20mg N or less - does not equal overkill for these extremely well tested drugs (developed in the early 60's). They are usually prescribed for *years* to people (Clomid Off Label to Men). A month or two with tapering dosages is nothing, IMO. And the possible damage that could occur is far greater from the anabolic compounds (They are drugs too, let's not kid ourselves) then the SERMs. But I agree that blood work is the best case scenario.
Yes. I get it drawn by a nurse i know. If i couldnt, i would just do it myself.So you draw your own blood? The only way for life extension to work is that they send a vile and blood draw kit and you draw your own blood and mail it in. Not sure I am qualified to draw my own blood so I will pass on that option.
Driving to another state doesn't work since they check your license for residency.
Anyway, I am sure there are options, but it is definitely not an easy process.
I have no issues here in Massachusetts, the last 3 bloods were done with no orders at all.Yes. I get it drawn by a nurse i know. If i couldnt, i would just do it myself.
Its funny because i know this dude who goes to ct to get it done. Maybe it depends on facility... Idk
Based upon what I've read and my past experience with LGD, I'd suggest a 40 or 45 day run, with what you have on hand. I'm guessing you either have 60 5mg caps or you have RC LGD which is 10mg/ml @ 30ml...What is up cool dudes? Started LGD today and I have not tried it before. Anyone like a low dose for about 8 weeks?
Edit- before anyone asks if I've read the thread, I am gonna try 60 days at 5mg but just wondering if 30@10mg would be more effective. I have adex and clomid on hand as always..
No problem. I think 60 @ 10 would be dope. The only thing I regret about my 37 day run was that it wasn't longer. I decided to bridge into PMag/Trest but in hindsight I wish I had just stayed on the LGD as I was still making gains and had no noticeable side-effects to speak of.Thank you guys I appreciate it. It's not outside the realm of possibility to just grab another bottle and go 60 @ 10. Toren I appreciate the break down. I will try 5mg for 20days and bump up then. Thanks.
Yep, I'm convinced. 60 @ 10 it is Haha.No problem. I think 60 @ 10 would be dope. The only thing I regret about my 37 day run was that it wasn't longer. I decided to bridge into PMag/Trest but in hindsight I wish I had just stayed on the LGD as I was still making gains and had no noticeable side-effects to speak of.