SARM's, MK, & GW : A User's Guide

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Originally Written by Yates84

Ok....due to an abundant amount of misinformation out there, I decided to put together a SARM, PPAR modulator, and GH secretagogue HOW TO! Here is all the info I find to be beneficial and have decided to share with everyone.....

SARMS, or selective androgen receptor modulators, provide the benefits of traditional AAS (more muscle, less fat, and better bone density) while producing significantly less unwanted side effects (estrogen related sides and water retention). SARMS are a unique class of molecules that are currently being developed to treat diseases that are currently being treated with AAS. Some SARMS have even gone to trial as TRT. When SARMS bind to the receptor they demonstrate anabolic and hypertrophic activity in both muscle and bone. This makes them ideal candidates for TRT, osteoporosis treatment, as well as muscle wasting treatment. SARMS can have as high as a 10:1 anabolic to androgenic ratio. That 10:1 ratio is what allows them to build muscle with little to no side effects. SARMS, also, typically display a high bioavailability.

Let's discuss the benefits of SARMS over traditional AAS. SARMS are nontoxic to the liver, and have little effect on blood pressure. As a result, this eliminates the for preloading and on cycle support supplements. Subsequently, a SARM cycle will ultimately be less expensive than a traditional AAS/Ph cycle. The chances of estrogen related sides an water retention is significantly lower than a AAS/Ph cycle, as well.

Now....let's get familiar with SARM's, PPAR modulators, and GH secretagogues!!

LGD 4033 - a SARM like Ostarine, but 12 times as powerful at only 1/3 the dose! Consequently, this makes it more suppressive to the HPTA. So, a SERM post cycle therapy is recommended. LGD has proven itself as a good bulking agent, where Ostarine is better used in a cutting cycle. LGD has a half life ranging between 24 and 36 hours. So, once daily dosing is optimal. A study performed at Boston University showed that healthy men who were given 1mg of LGD daily gained, on average, about 3 pounds in 3 weeks. No clinically significant changes in liver function tests, PSA (prostate issue/functions test), hematocrit, or ECG were seen or noted. Due to the possibility of high estrogen sides while using LGD, it is recommended that you have an AI, like Exemestane, on hand.

LGD example cycle:
Beginner
LGD 4/4/4/8/8/8
OL Eliminate 2/2/2/2/2/2
PCT:
Clomid 50/25/25
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
AI of choice on hand

Advanced
LGD 4/4/8/8/8/8/12/12
OL Eliminate 2/2/3/3/3/3/3/3
PCT:
Clomid 50/50/25/25
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
AI of choice on hand
*Armicare Pro can be substituted for Eliminate during cycle for full protection

MK 677 (Ibutamoren) - is a non-peptidic, orally active and selective agonist of the growth hormone secretagogue receptor. MK 677 mimics the action of ghrelin in the stomach. As a result this raises growth hormone and IGF-1 levels, but does not affect cortisol levels. Human studies have shown it to increase both muscle mass and bone mineral density. At 25mg daily, Ibutamoren has been shown, in humans, to increase IGF-1 levels 60%in 6 week. A 72% increase in IGF-1 levels was seen after 12 months. MK 677 is non-hormonal, and therefore requires no PCT after cycle is over. MK 677 can best be utilized in at least a 3 month cycle with dosage increasing each month. The optimal dosing time for MK 677 is at night directly before going to bed. One should start notice a deeper sleep almost immediately. If one should
wake up with numb or tingly hands, do not worry. This is a common side effect of the extra GH in the
system.

MK 677 example cycle:
Month 1 - 10mg once daily
Month 2 - 20mg once daily
Month 3 - 30mg once daily

GW 501516 - is actually not a SARM. In fact it is a PPAR Delta Modulator....this means it is a selective agonist with a high affinity for the PPAR. As a result, this modulation allows the body to utilize more glucose and to allows it to create more muscle tissue. GW also regulates the various proteins that the body uses for energy. What does this mean for the user? It means an increase in energy and endurance. Additionally, it may also mean an increase in muscle mass. It is possible that GW may have a positive affect on blood pressure and lipid profile. Dosing is in the 7mg to 21mg range, with 14mg being the "sweet spot". The average GW cycle is typically 4 to 12 weeks. GW is non-hormonal, and therefore requires no PCT. However, it does stack well with SARMS to further increase fat loss and endurance.

GW 505516 example cycle:
Beginner
GW 7/7/14/14/14/14

Intermediate
GW 7//14/14/14/14/21

Advanced
GW 14/14/14/14/21/21/21/21

RAD 140 - is very new! Therefore, there isn't a lot of real world data on it yet. However, it does look very promising!! RAD 140 has an impressive anabolic to androgenic ratio of 90:1! Resulting in one experiencing all the muscle building effects without all the androgenic side effects. RAD is powerful enough to limit the effect of testosterone on the prostate and other unwanted areas. RAD 140 has even been shown to be more anabolic than testosterone, as well. Dosing appears to be in the 4mg to 12mg range, with optimal cycle length being 4 to 6 weeks. Due to its shorter half life (16 hours) RAD needs to be dosed at least twice daily.

RAD 140 example cycle:
RAD 140 4/4/8/8/12/12
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid (if needed) 50/25/25
*Also have AI of choice on hand
*Armicare Pro can be used during cycle for full protection

More to come soon.....
 
AustBenny

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Awesome info, thanks for putting together Yates.

Don't suppose OL are coming out with the RAD 140, are they? ;)
 
yates84

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Awesome info, thanks for putting together Yates.

Don't suppose OL are coming out with the RAD 140, are they? ;)
Anything is possible my friend
 

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Nice work!

I thought about trying RAD140, but because there isn't a lot of real-world data on it, I don't feel very comfortable being a lab rat as an early user. I'm sure it would be fine, but it leaves something for the future. I'll be anxious to start to see some reviews come in.

I wish you'd include an ostarine section. It seems to be the most popular and a lot of supp companies have an osta product in their line. I'd be curious about whether you think an AI is useful on cycle with osta like you suggest with LGD.
 
yates84

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Nice work!

I thought about trying RAD140, but because there isn't a lot of real-world data on it, I don't feel very comfortable being a lab rat as an early user. I'm sure it would be fine, but it leaves something for the future. I'll be anxious to start to see some reviews come in.

I wish you'd include an ostarine section. It seems to be the most popular and a lot of supp companies have an osta product in their line. I'd be curious about whether you think an AI is useful on cycle with osta like you suggest with LGD.
Ostarine section and a stacking guide are going up today. Also going to discuss some other pct options. Just a lot of typing for one day!
 
clown007

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Amazing write up Yates!
Great to have a go to thread of information.
Thanks for your hard work and knowledge.
 
fro60ol

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Great amount if information here. Love it thanks!!
 
yates84

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Let's talk Osta....

Ostarine - is, probably, the most well known SARM's. It is best used to preserve muscle mass, while in a caloric deficit. Ostarine can, and will, suppress your natural testosterone production in longer higher dosed cycles. So, a SERM PCT is needed. Ostarine can also cause gyno in some users. So, it is recommended that you have an AI, like Exemestane, on hand. The average cycle length is 6 to 10 weeks at a dosage range of 10mg to 25mg.

Ostarine example cycle:
Beginner cut
Ostarine - 15/15/15/15/15/15
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
*AI of choice on hand

Advanced Cut:
Ostarine - 15/15/15/15/15/20/20/20/20/20
OL Eliminate - 2/2/2/2/2/3/3/3/3/3
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/25/25

Recomp cycle:
Ostarine - 20/20/20/20/25/25/25/25
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/25/25


Now, here are some SARM cycle Stacks that I've come up with....

Cut to Bulk:
Ostarine -15/15/15/15/15/15/0/0/0/0
LGD - 0/0/0/0/4/4/8/8/12/12
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/25/25

RAD/Osta Recomp:
RAD - 4/4/8/8/12/12/0/0
Ostarine - 20/20/20/20/25/25/25/25
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/25/25

RAD/LGD Bulk:
RAD - 4/4/8/8/12/12/0/0
LGD - 4/4/4/8/8/8/12/12
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/50/25/25

**MK 677 and/or GW would stack great with these cycles, as well, and would help with endurance, sleep, and overall muscle gain. (Refer to MK 677 and GW dosing at top of thread).**

Coming tomorrow...other PCT options!
 
AndroRage

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Great work, thanks for taking the time the put together some information on the aforementioned compounds. I have not read yet but will dedicate some time to read in detail.
 
AustBenny

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Has anyone found GW to make them REALLY thirsty? I'm only on my third day and my mouth is constantly dry and I'm guzzling water like no tomorrow, it's sloshing around in my belly!!!
 
goodvibes

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Awesome thread! LGD stacked with MK677 sounds sweet but if you think about it we can benefit by running it on pct and off cycle.

MK677 + (-)-epicathecin + PA + E9. Sounds like I'm going to have a year long bulking cycle ahead of me. Then finish the year strong with a 12 weeker LGD/Trest/Msten/DMZ.
 
yates84

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Awesome thread! LGD stacked with MK677 sounds sweet but if you think about it we can benefit by running it on pct and off cycle.

MK677 + (-)-epicathecin + PA + E9. Sounds like I'm going to have a year long bulking cycle ahead of me. Then finish the year strong with a 12 weeker LGD/Trest/Msten/DMZ.
I like the way you think goodvibes.....
I should have stated that mk would be perfect on and off cycle. I love the deep sleep and the vivid dreams that mk provides, you wake up feeling brand new
 
yates84

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Has anyone found GW to make them REALLY thirsty? I'm only on my third day and my mouth is constantly dry and I'm guzzling water like no tomorrow, it's sloshing around in my belly!!!
That's a new one but I'm always thirsty! I notice gw the most by my blood pressure. GW makes my bp really low but since I usually have real high bp in pct it is perfect for me. Just ran out yesterday, need more!
 
AndroRage

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Awesome thread! LGD stacked with MK677 sounds sweet but if you think about it we can benefit by running it on pct and off cycle.

MK677 + (-)-epicathecin + PA + E9. Sounds like I'm going to have a year long bulking cycle ahead of me. Then finish the year strong with a 12 weeker LGD/Trest/Msten/DMZ.

Hi bro,

What are "E9 & PA"?
 
yates84

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AndroRage

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Ergonine and phosphaditic acid (soy lecithin)
Thanks for that, not sure how I missed the "E9" lol

I wonder when Olympus will be bringing some more UK products you spoke of previously... I have a tingle it could be some PH/DS & some sarm stack products :)
 
yates84

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Thanks for that, not sure how I missed the "E9" lol

I wonder when Olympus will be bringing some more UK products you spoke of previously... I have a tingle it could be some PH/DS & some sarm stack products :)
We are releasing 6 products this month, can't say exactly what they are but I think you will like them :)
 
AndroRage

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We are releasing 6 products this month, can't say exactly what they are but I think you will like them :)

It's about 1 on average per day as there is only 6 days left in month if I'm right :)

Or you meant July?

Will these be for us in UK only? :D
Any hints (not asking for specifics)
 
yates84

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It's about 1 on average per day as there is only 6 days left in month if I'm right :)

Or you meant July?

Will these be for us in UK only? :D
Any hints (not asking for specifics)
The boss said this month (june) so it will be real soon! Check out the OL UK sub forum, plenty of hints on there. This thread should provide some good hints too....
 
yates84

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All OL UK products will be available in the us
 
AndroRage

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The boss said this month (june) so it will be real soon! Check out the OL UK sub forum, plenty of hints on there. This thread should provide some good hints too....

Can you supply a link?

I'm interested, I'm just picked up OL The 1 so interested in how that goes may use with Ostarine & Dermacrine for a mild recomposition based run...
 
AndroRage

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Thanks for that. Would Tudca be necessary for the 1? Any advice appreciated/input on how to run it to maximise effectiveness of the compound bro.

Edit: inbox if it's easier
 
yates84

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Thanks for that. Would Tudca be necessary for the 1? Any advice appreciated/input on how to run it to maximise effectiveness of the compound bro.

Edit: inbox if it's easier
The 1 is pretty mild so tudca is not necessary imo. With OL the 1 you get enough caps to dose 100mg for 6 weeks and that is the perfect dose and duration. It is a dht derivative so a test base isn't necessary. If you want to cut and have good gym aggression and energy you picked the perfect compound
 
ZackD89

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Awesome post.

Any feelings on stacking Ostarine with an EC stack or clen/albuterol?
 
yates84

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Awesome post.

Any feelings on stacking Ostarine with an EC stack or clen/albuterol?
I think that it isn't a problem as long as you watch your bp. Bp is the only problem that I forsee, just ease into it slowly and check bp daily
 
zcol94

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Awesome post.

Any feelings on stacking Ostarine with an EC stack or clen/albuterol?
Osta plus e/c is the only way ill cut now.... i want to give osta plus clen a shot though
 
zcol94

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The boss said this month (june) so it will be real soon! Check out the OL UK sub forum, plenty of hints on there. This thread should provide some good hints too....
I hope the rad 140 guide was a hint
 
liftin_fofive

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Whoever gets to capping the rad first is going to get a lot of business
 
warpyfunch

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Let's talk Osta....

Ostarine - is, probably, the most well known SARM's. It is best used to preserve muscle mass, while in a caloric deficit. Ostarine can, and will, suppress your natural testosterone production in longer higher dosed cycles. So, a SERM PCT is needed. Ostarine can also cause gyno in some users. So, it is recommended that you have an AI, like Exemestane, on hand. The average cycle length is 6 to 10 weeks at a dosage range of 10mg to 25mg.



RAD/Osta Recomp:
RAD - 4/4/8/8/12/12/0/0
Ostarine - 20/20/20/20/25/25/25/25
PCT:
OL Super PCT as indicated on label
Clomid 50/25/25
Regarding the rad/ostarine stack... Can you elaborate on why you'd even include the ostarine at all? Given your write up on rad, it seems to be both more effective and safer than osta in all aspects. Assuming real world experience matches the expectations, what would the osta add that the rad isn't already providing?

Ostarine is the only sarm I've done, and I had great results, but if I could get similar results with less suppression and sides, then why would I ever want to use osta again?
 
Pride89

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Dna already have a 3mg pr cap 90caps bottle of RAD

If i wasnt using LGD right now ill be on that

In the name of science ofc.
 
yates84

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Regarding the rad/ostarine stack... Can you elaborate on why you'd even include the ostarine at all? Given your write up on rad, it seems to be both more effective and safer than osta in all aspects. Assuming real world experience matches the expectations, what would the osta add that the rad isn't already providing?

Ostarine is the only sarm I've done, and I had great results, but if I could get similar results with less suppression and sides, then why would I ever want to use osta again?
There is not a lot of real world data on rad so we don't really know what it will do. I was just throwing out some ideas of stacks that I think will be effective. I actually have a friend that's about to start the rad/osta stack. I will let you guys know what happens.
 
AndroRage

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Dna already have a 3mg pr cap 90caps bottle of RAD

If i wasnt using LGD right now ill be on that

In the name of science ofc.

Yeah I've seen this too in the UK. Which LGD are you using and how is the run going bro?

I'm looking hard and long at this but want a legitimate product for LGD.
 
T-Bone

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GW doesn't do a thing for lipids. At least it didn't for me, had blood work to prove it. I didn't get any endurance increase either. The only thing that it really did for me was lower blood sugar so much I had to constantly eat carbs. I mean 200 grams or more every few hours or I'd felt like passing out. Definitely not worth it. I'll never use it again. The side effects from low blood sugar were just too much, and maybe they didn't all come from low blood sugar.
 
yates84

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GW doesn't do a thing for lipids. At least it didn't for me, had blood work to prove it. I didn't get any endurance increase either. The only thing that it really did for me was lower blood sugar so much I had to constantly eat carbs. I mean 200 grams or more every few hours or I'd felt like passing out. Definitely not worth it. I'll never use it again. The side effects from low blood sugar were just too much, and maybe they didn't all come from low blood sugar.
I had similar sides at higher doses but 10mg treats me very nice. What mg where you running tbone?
 
yates84

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20mg but went down to 10 with the same sides, so I gave up on it. Traded all my 8 bottles I had.
I guess some people are just non responders. The effects it has on my bp are nothing short of miraculous. It is going to be in every pct of mine from now on
 
T-Bone

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I guess some people are just non responders. The effects it has on my bp are nothing short of miraculous. It is going to be in every pct of mine from now on
I don't know if I'd call myself a non-responder. Maybe a "bad responder" though. Yeah it sucks, I had high hopes for it.
 
goodvibes

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I dnt like GW too. I had the sides but no endurance. I can do without it.

EC + ostarine + dermacrine is the best stack I can think of for weight loss. Like zcol the last thing I'd try is clen on top of those 3.
 
T-Bone

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How was the PN? Did you notice a difference when you switched to RC bro?
The PN was just as I described. I noticed when I switched to the RC it had a much stronger effect at half the dosage of what I was taking the PN at. In other words if I had taken the RC at the same dosage as the PN I would have been visiting the ER.
 

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