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Lets talk COVID-19

Right now I'm taking Shield and Defend with Prolactrone, which has ECGC. The combo is a great anti viral.
 
GreenMachineX said:
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This is the same as the first link Brundel posted in this thread. They are the only ones proposing isoquercetin as a possible solution and in spite of their accomplished backgrounds they cannot seem to get funding.

This doesn't mean they are wrong. It just means they haven't been able to gather evidence they are right....it is just a theory.
 
HIT4ME said:
This is the same as the first link Brundel posted in this thread. They are the only ones proposing isoquercetin as a possible solution and in spite of their accomplished backgrounds they cannot seem to get funding.

This doesn't mean they are wrong. It just means they haven't been able to gather evidence they are right....it is just a theory.
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When in doubt anecdotal it out ;)
 
HIT4ME said:
This is the same as the first link Brundel posted in this thread. They are the only ones proposing isoquercetin as a possible solution and in spite of their accomplished backgrounds they cannot seem to get funding.

This doesn't mean they are wrong. It just means they haven't been able to gather evidence they are right....it is just a theory.
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Oh, that’s okay. It’s a theory that supports my decision to continue using DCP and FD2.0 consistently 😂
 
ValiantThor08 said:
When in doubt anecdotal it out ;)
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Lmao, I love that.

GreenMachineX said:
Oh, that’s okay. It’s a theory that supports my decision to continue using DCP and FD2.0 consistently 😂
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That is cool, and I am fine with that. I am all for someone using quercetin here too - just trying to keep things realistic as far as what is going on. Quercetin, luteolin, fisetin, apigenin, etc. - they are all interesting and have potential uses.

I am also fine with people believing in unproven strategies - look at me with vitamin C. That isn't "proven". But I am against undertones that a certain unproven strategy is proven when evidence is weak at best.

AHCC has made it to Phase II clinical trials for viral infections. Quercetin hasn't made it through any human trials. Sure, neither has any proven use in Covid - but to apply a standard to AHCC and then ignore the fact that Quercetin is even further from that same standard of evidence strikes me as disingenuous. If it is serious, provide some real evidence and I am cool. Not, " oh, these people think it will work."
 
HIT4ME said:
Lmao, I love that.



That is cool, and I am fine with that. I am all for someone using quercetin here too - just trying to keep things realistic as far as what is going on. Quercetin, luteolin, fisetin, apigenin, etc. - they are all interesting and have potential uses.

I am also fine with people believing in unproven strategies - look at me with vitamin C. That isn't "proven". But I am against undertones that a certain unproven strategy is proven when evidence is weak at best.

AHCC has made it to Phase II clinical trials for viral infections. Quercetin hasn't made it through any human trials. Sure, neither has any proven use in Covid - but to apply a standard to AHCC and then ignore the fact that Quercetin is even further from that same standard of evidence strikes me as disingenuous. If it is serious, provide some real evidence and I am cool. Not, " oh, these people think it will work."
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I don’t know where that is coming from...but there’s lots of evidence that quercetin (and EGCG which I’ll be adding too) is antiviral. I don’t even know what AHCC is to say it will or won’t do anything. But I also like those ingredients because they can reduce proinflammatory cytokines which potentially kill during cytokine storm. Got any links I can read about AHCC?
 
I just bought some bottles, planning to stack it with SNS Immune Support XT

I'm already taking CEL Anabolic Effect which has AstraGin so hopefully that increases the absorption of these.
 
HIT4ME said:
I don't know...are they the same?
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Isoquercetin is 3-0 glucoside quercetin.
Nearly identical. The reason isoquercetin is used by the canadians is because the ec50 is slightly higher and the solubility is slightly higher. But to us this is negligible.
Quercetin has approx 1 to 2% oral bioavailability. So if you get an additional 10% its 1.1% or 2.2% max. You need too much of it to get an effect and as a result there are side effects.

Shield and defend uses quercetin niacin which we expect maybe 10x bioavailability min.

The version we are working on for a therapy or adjunct has a min of 20x increasenin bioavailability. So if its 1 we achieve 20.
If its 2 we see 40% bioavailability.

Why we don't use isoquercetin and do the same?
Quercetin is super easy to make and cheap as hell.
Isoquercetin is hard to make and 20x the price.
Our goal is to be able to offer the gov an option that can be easily and cheaply made, rapidly deployed, easily administered by the patient with no supervision or hospital, no injections, very low side effect profile and high user retention. Meaning people don't stop treatment due to hating injections or having to go to hospital etc.

For now isoquercetin is not the better choice.
 
Notice the articles starting to pop up regarding quercetin as a treatment. That's not coincidence. Others are seeing what I see.
 
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brundel said:
Easiest to just place second order because your order has likely already been shipped or has been processed and is headed to USPS.

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Facebook group.
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Thanks I placed a second order so 2 orders for 2 bottles each also sent FB group request

Thanks again
 
dollar662 said:
Thanks I placed a second order so 2 orders for 2 bottles each also sent FB group request

Thanks again
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Awesome bro
We see both. I have upgraded shipping to priority and included a free amino infusion for you.
Thanks for your support my friend.
 
I had a nice surprise for me when my shipment of 3 bottles had a free bottle of amino fusion inside. Mucho thanks!
 
max silver said:
I had a nice surprise for me when my shipment of 3 bottles had a free bottle of amino fusion inside. Mucho thanks!
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Same here.

This is a great company.
 
brundel said:
Awesome bro
We see both. I have upgraded shipping to priority and included a free amino infusion for you.
Thanks for your support my friend.
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I got mine yesterday and took my first dose. I experienced some flushing, I believe. Is that normal? Anyone experience this? Felt very hot moreso than flushed. Likely the added niacin?
 
ironkill said:
I got mine yesterday and took my first dose. I experienced some flushing, I believe. Is that normal? Anyone experience this? Felt very hot moreso than flushed. Likely the added niacin?
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I admittedly don’t know much about the utilization of Co-Crystals, but niacin alone causes a flush for some people
 
brundel said:
Isoquercetin is 3-0 glucoside quercetin.
Nearly identical. The reason isoquercetin is used by the canadians is because the ec50 is slightly higher and the solubility is slightly higher. But to us this is negligible.
Quercetin has approx 1 to 2% oral bioavailability. So if you get an additional 10% its 1.1% or 2.2% max. You need too much of it to get an effect and as a result there are side effects.

Shield and defend uses quercetin niacin which we expect maybe 10x bioavailability min.

The version we are working on for a therapy or adjunct has a min of 20x increasenin bioavailability. So if its 1 we achieve 20.
If its 2 we see 40% bioavailability.

Why we don't use isoquercetin and do the same?
Quercetin is super easy to make and cheap as hell.
Isoquercetin is hard to make and 20x the price.
Our goal is to be able to offer the gov an option that can be easily and cheaply made, rapidly deployed, easily administered by the patient with no supervision or hospital, no injections, very low side effect profile and high user retention. Meaning people don't stop treatment due to hating injections or having to go to hospital etc.

For now isoquercetin is not the better choice.
Click to expand...

I haven't even really been sure where to begin with this? The EC50 is slightly higher for isoquercetin? EC50 for what?

Simple research seems to indicate that Isoquercetin has about 5X the bioavailability of quercetin (which is what I think you meant with the EC50 - but that is not my definition of slightly more). Also, quercetin, as an aglycone, is converted to a number of other metabolites, including isoquercetin after it is absorbed. So even if you assume 50% conversion rate (which is high) - you would essentially need to increase the absorption of quercetin by 10-20X most likely just to be on par with isoquercetin.

And wait, you get side effects of something that isn't absorbed? What side effects? Because the listed sides of quercetin seem to be systemic - flushing, sweating, nausea, vomiting, difficulty breathing, tingling of the arms - most of which would require absorption from the gut? So if you take 1 gram and get 10 mg (your 1%) in your system - you will have less of those side effects than if you take 500 mg with 10X more absorption and get 50 mg in your system? I could agree if we were talking about the nausea, vomiting and GI sides. But what about the flushing, sweating, difficulty breathing, tingling, etc. And those sides are usually with injection, not oral, so even more indication it's the absorption that is the issue and not the "high unabsorbable dose".

Next up, you might be actually onto something - isoquercetin is hard to make and 20X the price. Quercetin is super easy to make (and source) and cheap as hell. Your "goal is to be able to offer the gov an option that can be cheaply made, rapidly deployed" - so why aren't you using straight quercetin? Oh yeah, because bioavailabiity. Right.

Since there is no supplier right now offering quercetin co-crystals as a stocked item and they would need to be custom manufactured for your product - which somehow you got done in less than a couple of weeks, kudos - it would require a significant change in manufacturing to source large amounts of these quercetin co-crystals. They aren't "cheap and readily available". But regular quercetin is. So, using your logic - you are not using the most tested, bioavailable source because you wanted to use something easier to manufacture so you went with a less tested, almost as difficult to source ingredient as the solution.

Further, it is interesting that when quercetin is questioned as having little data - you fall back on "these people think it is, so there's my proof" - but then when it is questioned why they are using isoquercetin and you are not - suddenly the sole group you are basing all your evidence on isn't good enough?

Also interesting - so now you're claiming outright that this is therapy? "The version we are working on for a therapy or adjunct"?

This is all very comical.

brundel said:
Notice the articles starting to pop up regarding quercetin as a treatment. That's not coincidence. Others are seeing what I see.
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It isn't a coincidence - ONE source has been used to write multiple articles. There are no studies in Korea being done on this for Covid-19. There isn't even a study being done in China on this, per your original link. The group needs to raise funds to do it, they have just been offered access to 1000 patients. And since China is claiming they have control, other sources are saying the group may have to move the study back to Canada.

If I am wrong about ANY of this, post up some original sources showing there is an actual study under way, or that there is a single human trial for this being used as virucidal treatment.
 
ironkill said:
I got mine yesterday and took my first dose. I experienced some flushing, I believe. Is that normal? Anyone experience this? Felt very hot moreso than flushed. Likely the added niacin?
Click to expand...

What would be really interesting is if this happened on some doses and not others...
 
ironkill said:
I got mine yesterday and took my first dose. I experienced some flushing, I believe. Is that normal? Anyone experience this? Felt very hot moreso than flushed. Likely the added niacin?
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Might be vasodilation.
But the niacin should not cause this.
In this case it is not normal niacin as it is chemically bonded to the quercetin. This significantly delays the absorption and metabolism. I flush at 45 to 50mg niacin.
I can take 300mg of the quercetin niacin with non flush.
None the less you may experience some vasodilation and flush. If so its 100% safe.
 
Is it possible anything in this can be energizing and/or stimulating in any way? I took my second dose before going to bed and found myself wide awake when hitting the pillow.
 
Typically, niacin makes me flush and feel a bit uncomfortable. This product (Shield & Defend) hasn’t made flush or feel uncomfortable. I take 1 capsule in the morning and the other capsule with dinner.
 
ELROCK said:
Typically, niacin makes me flush and feel a bit uncomfortable. This product (Shield & Defend) hasn’t made flush or feel uncomfortable. I take 1 capsule in the morning and the other capsule with dinner.
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Same here. My wife and I both take two a day with food.
No problems here either.

I love the Niacin flush however, in my FADE OUT (Sleep aid)
 
HIT4ME said:
This is the same as the first link Brundel posted in this thread. They are the only ones proposing isoquercetin as a possible solution and in spite of their accomplished backgrounds they cannot seem to get funding.

This doesn't mean they are wrong. It just means they haven't been able to gather evidence they are right....it is just a theory.
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or possibly, the money is in a mass produced vaccine and not something so easily accessible
 
Brundel,

How quickly are orders going out?
 
megadeth said:
Brundel,

How quickly are orders going out?
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48 hrs or less.
Only 2 of us working so.....its been rough. Sun up to 30 min before sleep for the last week or so.
We have a big batch shipping today. Prob 150 packs.
 
Also the new batch of Shield and Defend is at 35%. So 65% sold.
So if you plan on purchasing some I would do it asap.
 
Does this actually help with allergies from the quercetin? They have been bad since spring started.
 
I was just informed all orders have shipped.
It may be a tracking issue with USPS, but we are 100% all orders shipped.

For sure also in future use the contact page on our site to communicate your order and information please.
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patrick25 said:
Anyone else not receiving the order got two bottles on the 30th and it isn't moving?
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100% of ordered packs have been shipped. USPS is a mess though.
I shipped something overnight to a family member and it took 6 days to arrive. Paid 34$ for a 3oz pack overnight. 6 days.
I ordered something from another company 0 update from the company ever. 0 update to tracking from Fedex. Just arrived after a week or so.
Obviously this is not normal.
Hang in there, this is a very unusual time and everything is a mess.
I can tell you absolutely that all packs ordered from BLR have shipped.
As far as I can see based upon a few emails I have received USPS has not updated anything for days.
I would tack at least 2 days onto normal shipping times maybe more depending on where you live. NY for example is in major crisis.
 
Also we have presently 1000 units of hand sanitizer. Will go up on BLR site tomorrow.
Gonna go fast so letting everyone know now.
 
brundel said:
Also we have presently 1000 units of hand sanitizer. Will go up on BLR site tomorrow.
Gonna go fast so letting everyone know now.
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What's the word on the sanitizer?
 
I dont think it ever went up
 
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