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i am for phil

This may be a stupid question but since this thread has gotten really nasty at times does this mean we will not help and support each other for AAS and body building ? I hope not.
I started a thread a couple of days ago to give free tax advice to any who have a question. So far no one has taken me up on it.
Its my way of saying thank u. I know accounting and taxes better than AAS and as many of u know I have been many stupid mistakes.
In addition, since my divorce 5 years ago I have been a back slidden Christian and a bad example and as JimBuick said: "...a hypocritical piece of ****." Thank God Jesus died for hypocritical pieces of **** like me. That statement convicted me and I have been back on the road to being a better Christian. Thank u all for all the help you guys have given this retarted Italian from Brooklyn. :)

When did I ever say that?


It doesn't sound like something I would say (on this board, during a heated debate IRL maybe) and I certainly couldn't find any post saying that ITT.
 
When did I ever say that? It doesn't sound like something I would say (on this board, during a heated debate IRL maybe) and I certainly couldn't find any post saying that ITT.

Dude, Im so sorry, it was Kisaj. Please forgive.
So I have to thank kisaj :)
 
i can be an alcoholic and choose not to drink. it is my choice. thinking about drinking isn't a choice, but acting on it is!!!




i was once told we always have a choice....they may not be good choices, but still choices.


i was also once told that just because everyone is doing it doesn't make it right.....i see a lot of behavour that society accepts today that would have been considered bad behavour a generation ago...because society accepts something does that make it right?

morals and values and standards were slowly disappearing, but in the last few years society seems to be in a rush to away with the morals, values and standards of our forefathers which made this country free so that we could have this very debate. i can think of many countries in which this exchange of opinions would be forbidden, even illegal. society shouldn't be so eager to call our forefathers bigots and racists, it is those same morals and values and standards that made this country free enough for todays society to voice it's distaste for those very same morals and standards and values. bigots and racists they may have been, but just think how lucky we were to have had them as OUR bigots and racists....i don't care what race, gender, religion or sexual persuasion i think you have more freedom here than anywhere else in the entire world thanks to those who society would call racists and bigots....

If you think homosexuality is a choice that's fine you just happen to be wrong. I've already laid out why. Was heterosexuality a choice for you? Or were you just born being attracted to women like I was? If you think choosing who attracts you is a choice again I ask you to TRY and make yourself be attracted to men. I can't do it. Bet you can't either. And neither can gay people.

Because society accepts something doesn't make it right, but it doesn't make it wrong either. Society accepted black people in chains. Society ****ed that up. It's STARTING not to mess up homosexuality. You aren't thankful for that, but you should be. I have a 1 year old niece. She has two straight uncles and 1 gay uncle who LOVE HER TO DEATH. She will always have that. I hope like hell she never has to be on a message board explaining why she loves one of her uncles who happens to be gay. I think it would be awesome if she could say I love all three of my uncles and one of them is gay and he's awesome. Because he is. And she will think that. Everyone who meets him thinks that.

Does that really sound like such an awful world? Does that future REALLY sound terrible? I have no idea how anyone could say yes. To her at (almost 2 really) she just knows she is loved by three uncles. She doesn't give a crap that I like girls and he likes men. Doesn't mean anything to her. She just knows her eyes light up and she is happy when we are around. Again I ask is this a change in society that should be feared? Really? People WANT her to dislike her uncle because he's gay? What a weird and twisted hope.
 
i have given this some thought....at the very most homosexuality represents 5% of the population. the idea of homosexuality seems to stir passions in people although the attention it gets seems out of proportion to the numbers. i have thought for a long time now that the government was all about keeping the masses divided, what better way than gender/race/sexual orientation/religion. those seem to be the big 4 that even the most placid of people can get stirred up about, imo....what this does is distract from my passion, the plight of the working poor in america:

24 million WORKING americans are at or below poverty level....this means that for every job in america 1 is below poverty level, this is unacceptable to me. i think my passion is better spent on what really is important to me, this being a working person who has to be on entitlements to make ends meet. how can wall street and the money people report record gains, yet say they are unable to hire or raise wages? the answer is, because they don't have to....and i think this needs to change....i am not changing horses in mid-stream, this is truely were i am at...check out my thread 'obamacare-just a smokescreen' and you will see that i am disgusted with american business/government, and the american people for their shallowness on the subject...just because today you have a good job and are living well, don't think even for a minute that abject poverty doesn't effect you.

i am tired of arguing over a subject that in the larger scope of things is irrelevant, and i seen now plays into the governments plot to keep the masses divided!!!

like the old canned heat song 'lets work together'...'united we stand, divided we fall'
 
imo....what this does is distract from my passion, the plight of the working class poor in america:

" imo....what this does is distract from my passion, the plight of the unsaved in america"fixed

the poor class need pity nor patronage whether mid stream change or politicking

they some of the most upholding of values among us all
 
The majority of guys I have known who take a strong stance against homosexuality are closet queens.People who are secure in their sexuality really don`t give a damn.Just my humble observation.
 
" imo....what this does is distract from my passion, the plight of the unsaved in america"fixed

the poor class need pity nor patronage whether mid stream change or politicking

they some of the most upholding of values among us all

some whould argue that religion is the opiate of the masses...i don't have statistics to back this up, but i 'think' there are more people following the priciples of religion [be that their religion of choice] who are poor than rich. most don't get rich by following the golden rule of 'do unto others as you would have them do unto you'....rather the golden rule the rich follow is 'he who has the gold makes the rules'.
 
some whould argue that religion is the opiate of the masses...some like Here to Studyi don't have statistics to back this up, but i 'think' there are more people following the priciples of religion [be that their religion of choice] who are poor than rich. most don't get rich by following the golden rule of 'do unto others as you would have them do unto you'"The poor in spirit are blessed, for the kingdom of heaven is theirs".....rather the golden rule the rich follow is 'he who has the gold makes the rules'
"....rather the golden rule the rich follow is 'he who has the gold makes the rules "

i understand why you say what you say
 
The majority of guys I have known who take a strong stance against homosexuality are closet queens.People who are secure in their sexuality really don`t give a damn.Just my humble observation.

does this theory only apply to homosexuality? or does it mean that everyone who has a stance on something secretly believes the opposite?

someone who says they are anti-war is actually a pro-war hawk?

people need to have opinions on things going on around them, apathy is what will bring all of us down. i just wish people took a stronger stance on the things that really count, like poverty!!! like i said, i believe that the government promoting pro-homosexuality in society is just a means of distracting from the things that really matter.
 
does this theory only apply to homosexuality? or does it mean that everyone who has a stance on something secretly believes the opposite?

someone who says they are anti-war is actually a pro-war hawk?

people need to have opinions on things going on around them, apathy is what will bring all of us down. i just wish people took a stronger stance on the things that really count, like poverty!!! like i said, i believe that the government promoting pro-homosexuality in society is just a means of distracting from the things that really matter.

I think you will be hard pressed to find ANY example of the government taking a pro-homosexuality stance in the sense of more gay people. No one (not even gays) is out there saying WE NEED MORE GAY PEOPLE! They are just saying why be so against us? Who are we hurting anyways? No gay person tries to make you gay. No government is out there saying "go be gay right now and not straight." That just isn't happening. What SOME in the government (and some gay people) are saying is who cares?

Seriously though...who cares? I mean honestly who cares? If anyone in this thread is gay I won't be gay because of it. If anyone in this thread is straight I won't be straight because of it. We are born a certain way and we can't really change it. So accept and leave alone. Everyone in this thread who has something downstairs to work with is not effecting me in ANYway. If everyone in this thread was gay I'd be straight. If everyone in this thread was straight I'd be straight still.
 
This is the threat they pose Geoforce

[video=youtube;X-YCdcnf_P8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-YCdcnf_P8[/video]
 
I think you will be hard pressed to find ANY example of the government taking a pro-homosexuality stance in the sense of more gay people. No one (not even gays) is out there saying WE NEED MORE GAY PEOPLE! They are just saying why be so against us? Who are we hurting anyways? No gay person tries to make you gay. No government is out there saying "go be gay right now and not straight." That just isn't happening. What SOME in the government (and some gay people) are saying is who cares?

Seriously though...who cares? I mean honestly who cares? If anyone in this thread is gay I won't be gay because of it. If anyone in this thread is straight I won't be straight because of it. We are born a certain way and we can't really change it. So accept and leave alone. Everyone in this thread who has something downstairs to work with is not effecting me in ANYway. If everyone in this thread was gay I'd be straight. If everyone in this thread was straight I'd be straight still.

you are so hung up on promoting the acceptance of gays that you missed the entire point of my post.

the obama administration has done many things to promote division among the masses, i believe this is to distract from the issues that they are trying to sweep under the rug. same sex marriage, and legislation to give gays equal rights as minorities was something i think the obama administartion knew beforehand would cause division within the masses, look at this thread as evidence. go back and read post number 508, and stop being so darned hardheaded!!!

promoting of gay rights is only one way obama has tried to divide us, look at the zimmerman case...i have never seen a persident speak out on a criminal case while it was still ongoing, i think the obama administration did everything it could to stir racial tension to distract from the issues that were harmful to the administration...all of a sudden bengazi and the irs scandal were gone from the scene.

divide and conquer, and we fall for this everytime because the government is a master at playing off emotional issues to distract us from the things that should really matter...rampant poverty in america and the diminishing bill of rights under the freedom act are of much greater concern to me in the large picture than what homosexuals do for entertainment....i fell for this also and got caught up in it and got distracted from my true passion, the poor and disadvantaged in this country.
 
i have given this some thought....at the very most homosexuality represents 5% of the population. the idea of homosexuality seems to stir passions in people although the attention it gets seems out of proportion to the numbers. i have thought for a long time now that the government was all about keeping the masses divided, what better way than gender/race/sexual orientation/religion. those seem to be the big 4 that even the most placid of people can get stirred up about, imo....what this does is distract from my passion, the plight of the working poor in america:

24 million WORKING americans are at or below poverty level....this means that for every job in america 1 is below poverty level, this is unacceptable to me. i think my passion is better spent on what really is important to me, this being a working person who has to be on entitlements to make ends meet. how can wall street and the money people report record gains, yet say they are unable to hire or raise wages? the answer is, because they don't have to....and i think this needs to change....i am not changing horses in mid-stream, this is truely were i am at...check out my thread 'obamacare-just a smokescreen' and you will see that i am disgusted with american business/government, and the american people for their shallowness on the subject...just because today you have a good job and are living well, don't think even for a minute that abject poverty doesn't effect you.

i am tired of arguing over a subject that in the larger scope of things is irrelevant, and i seen now plays into the governments plot to keep the masses divided!!!

like the old canned heat song 'lets work together'...'united we stand, divided we fall'

geo...i guess you missed this post

please read carefully
 
does this theory only apply to homosexuality? or does it mean that everyone who has a stance on something secretly believes the opposite? someone who says they are anti-war is actually a pro-war hawk? people need to have opinions on things going on around them, apathy is what will bring all of us down. i just wish people took a stronger stance on the things that really count, like poverty!!! like i said, i believe that the government promoting pro-homosexuality in society is just a means of distracting from the things that really matter.

Yes, this is just another leftist debating tactic to silence those they disagree with. When i was growing up in the 80s nobody talked about homosexuality because it wasnt an issue but if you bring it up and demand people take a stand then they will. That doesnt mean they are closet homosexuals. I dont have a strong opinion about eating snotts out of my nose but if people kept talking about it and it kept coming up i sooner or later would have a strong opinion.
 
The Bible says in the end times the days will literally be acclerated. I believe that's why we are seeing such a change in society so quickly
 
you are so hung up on promoting the acceptance of gays that you missed the entire point of my post.

the obama administration has done many things to promote division among the masses, i believe this is to distract from the issues that they are trying to sweep under the rug. same sex marriage, and legislation to give gays equal rights as minorities was something i think the obama administartion knew beforehand would cause division within the masses, look at this thread as evidence. go back and read post number 508, and stop being so darned hardheaded!!!

promoting of gay rights is only one way obama has tried to divide us, look at the zimmerman case...i have never seen a persident speak out on a criminal case while it was still ongoing, i think the obama administration did everything it could to stir racial tension to distract from the issues that were harmful to the administration...all of a sudden bengazi and the irs scandal were gone from the scene.

divide and conquer, and we fall for this everytime because the government is a master at playing off emotional issues to distract us from the things that should really matter...rampant poverty in america and the diminishing bill of rights under the freedom act are of much greater concern to me in the large picture than what homosexuals do for entertainment....i fell for this also and got caught up in it and got distracted from my true passion, the poor and disadvantaged in this country.

I'm glad the poor and disadvantaged are your focus but keep in mind the disadvantaged RIGHT now include gays. Isn't disadvantaged people who don't have the same opportunities as others? Gay people right now don't have the same opportunities as straight people and that is really ALL they are fighting for. The same opportunities.

As for the division of the masses and all that keep in mind Phil Robertson's quote (which is the sole reason for this thread) was quite divisive. I'm not sure why the President deserves all the blame and trust me I'm not a huge fan of President Obama. It's just many people tend to blame him for the rain right now for some reason.
 
The Bible says in the end times the days will literally be acclerated. I believe that's why we are seeing such a change in society so quickly

I would say ending slavery is a much bigger societal change than if gay people can get married. I won't tell you what to believe, but I really don't think society is changing nearly as much as some people want to think. I could point to a lot of times in history with much greater societal change than right now.
 
I would say ending slavery is a much bigger societal change than if gay people can get married. I won't tell you what to believe, but I really don't think society is changing nearly as much as some people want to think. I could point to a lot of times in history with much greater societal change than right now.

Jesus advocated and crusaded for the complete change of the Roman and Jewish states (if history is correct, and if Jesus was even real). Much like Obama, that seemed to be "too much" for society to handle at t he time; "too many changes." What's good for Jesus isn't for Obama...but we're not racist?
 
Jesus advocated and crusaded for the complete change of the Roman and Jewish states (if history is correct, and if Jesus was even real). Much like Obama, that seemed to be "too much" for society to handle at t he time; "too many changes." What's good for Jesus isn't for Obama...but we're not racist?

Women working and running for political office/being allowed to hold power positions is a FAR bigger societal change than a small amount of gay people asking they can't be married? As is ending discrimination with race.

Right now society (imo) isn't really changing much. We aren't doing much that is vastly different from 5 or 10 years ago.

Hell except for using less drugs, aborting less kids, having lower teenage pregnancy.
 
Women working and running for political office/being allowed to hold power positions is a FAR bigger societal change than a small amount of gay people asking they can't be married? As is ending discrimination with race.

Right now society (imo) isn't really changing much. We aren't doing much that is vastly different from 5 or 10 years ago.

Hell except for using less drugs, aborting less kids, having lower teenage pregnancy.

I'm a big fan of how things are going nowadays! No more term limits I say. Obama4Life
 
Invalid Link Removed oh there is no need for that
 
I'm glad the poor and disadvantaged are your focus but keep in mind the disadvantaged RIGHT now include gays. Isn't disadvantaged people who don't have the same opportunities as others? Gay people right now don't have the same opportunities as straight people and that is really ALL they are fighting for. The same opportunities.

As for the division of the masses and all that keep in mind Phil Robertson's quote (which is the sole reason for this thread) was quite divisive. I'm not sure why the President deserves all the blame and trust me I'm not a huge fan of President Obama. It's just many people tend to blame him for the rain right now for some reason.

if anything, this thread tells me gays don't need my help, they have plenty of supporters, and for such a small portion of the population get a disproportionate amount of attention.

i am beginning to agree with other posters in this thread...in the greater sceme of things, gays and their rights are of little consequence to me until we clean up all the real problems this country has.

if gays are living in poverty then that concerns me, if gays are getting beaten or harmed then that concerns me. i have the same concern for gays that i would have for any person, but one thing i have learned about life, it isn't fair....everyone suffers discrimination of one kind or another at some time in their life!!!
 
I would say ending slavery is a much bigger societal change than if gay people can get married. I won't tell you what to believe, but I really don't think society is changing nearly as much as some people want to think. I could point to a lot of times in history with much greater societal change than right now.

You are mistaken friend. Slavery as you know it...Yes....has disappeared but do you have any idea the amount of women and children trafficked each year? This is a definitely a form of slavery and in my mind even more diabolical than what we remember as slavery.
 
Part-Time Target Employees Can’t Keep Their Health Care Plans

Another group of Americans is discovering that President Obama’s promise that “If you like your health care plan, you can keep it” simply wasn’t true.
Target announced yesterday that it would no longer offer health insurance for the company’s part-time employees starting April 1.
“The launch of Health Insurance Marketplaces provides new options for health care coverage that we believe our part-time team members may prefer,” Target declared in a post on the company blog. “In fact, by offering them insurance, we could actually disqualify many of them from being eligible for newly available subsidies that could reduce their overall health insurance expense.”
In other words, Target sees no need to help pay for part-time employees’ health insurance when the government is willing to foot the bill instead.
Target isn’t the only company to change its benefits policy thanks to Obamacare: Trader Joe’s and Home Depot have also stopped offering their part-time employees health insurance.-Katrina Trinko






Obamacare: Target, Trader Joe’s Co., Home Depot Inc. to drop healthcare coverage for part-time employees.


Target has announced that the company will stop offering its part-time employees healthcare insurance and will dump them into Obamacare instead.

Target Corp. said it will end health insurance for part-time employees, joining Trader Joe’s Co., Home Depot Inc. and other retailers that have scaled back benefits in response to changes from Obamacare.

About 10 percent of Target’s part-time employees, defined as those working fewer than 30 hours a week, use the company’s health plans now, according to an announcement posted today on the Minneapolis-based company’s website. Target said it would pay $500 to part-timers losing coverage and a consulting firm will help workers sign up for new Obamacare plans.

“Health care reform is transforming the benefits landscape and affecting how all employers, including Target, administer health benefits coverage,” Jodee Kozlak, Target’s executive vice president of human resources, said in the web posting. She cited “new options available for our part-time team, and the historically low number of team members who elected to enroll in the part-time plan.”


The “new options” now available to Target’s employees is naturally Obamacare and the healthcare exchanges. Target had offered its part-time employees healthcare but why should they when the government (the taxpayers) will provide it for them?

The goal of Obamacare is, and always has been, to get as many people as possible dependent on the government for their insurance, with the end game being single-payer, government supplied healthcare coverage and it seems to be going exactly as planned.-http://beforeitsnews.com/
 
The consequence of refusing to be rational and objective about homosexuality

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You are mistaken friend. Slavery as you know it...Yes....has disappeared but do you have any idea the amount of women and children trafficked each year? This is a definitely a form of slavery and in my mind even more diabolical than what we remember as slavery.

Really? I'm fully aware of what you are talking about and it is a huge problem that I'm not making light of. If bigT wants to talk about a small proportion of gay people and then you want to talk about slavery you'd be best off realizing how much LESS of the population is currently a slave in any form than in the past.

The type of slavery you are talking about is by no means new. It isn't something that "just started." I'm fully aware that slavery is not over. Doesn't mean it isn't DRASTICALLY less than at most other times in the last 500 years.
 
The consequence of refusing to be rational and objective about homosexuality

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Forget homosexuality....why can't people be rational and objective on EVERYTHING? Gays, medical marijuana, gun debates, anything you can come up with. An uneducated populace that lacks critical thinking skills is the number one biggest problem this country could ever face. Education, logic, reason are the best tools we have for solving the problems of today. They were the best tools we had for solving the problems of before. And they are the best tools for solving the problems of the future.
 
Here's Christian thinking for you:

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Christian view of the world = opposite of logic, science, common sense, observation, etc...just like the redneck the thread was initially about
 
Here's Christian thinking for you:

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Christian view of the world = opposite of logic, science, common sense, observation, etc...just like the redneck the thread was initially about

If he thinks this then God is a terrorist and I thought we don't negotiate with terrorists? :)

Oh boy, there goes my logic again!
 
Old Testament. New Testament still condones homosexuality, when Christ was born, Old Testament fell to "the wayside" if you would. So, the mixed fibre deal.. Void. We eat shellfish, and things that crawl on the ground (snake, alligator..etcetera). We lust, but do we pull our eyes out or cut off our hand? No, we would remove ourself from the situation or block porn sites on the internet instead..

Again, sin has no hierarchy sin is sin.

... Sorry for the rant...
Why then are there teachings and learnings and references to the OLD Testament throughout the New Testament if the OLD testament means nothing? Why are there verses in the NEW testament that reference the OLD testament in proving something wrong or right sinful or christian like?

If you want peas, don't ask for vegetable soup because you have to pick the peas out of the soup.
 
Why then are there teachings and learnings and references to the OLD Testament throughout the New Testament if the OLD testament means nothing? Why are there verses in the NEW testament that reference the OLD testament in proving something wrong or right sinful or christian like?

If you want peas, don't ask for vegetable soup because you have to pick the peas out of the soup.

The real question is: If the Bible is the word of god revealed to man, why does god seem to be so contradictory, hateful, genocidal, vengeful, divisive, misogynist, homophobic, xenophobic, loving, forgiving, peaceful...oh wait, I'm using logic to debate faith. I guess I'll "never understand / appreciate the duality and mystery of the Almighty" blah blah blah...
 
The real question is: If the Bible is the word of god revealed to man, why does god seem to be so contradictory, hateful, genocidal, vengeful, divisive, misogynist, homophobic, xenophobic, loving, forgiving, peaceful...oh wait, I'm using logic to debate faith. I guess I'll "never understand / appreciate the duality and mystery of the Almighty" blah blah blah...
Sounds like man's word revealed in the bible itself...perhaps written by mortal men...

But, I won't disagree with whatever someone believes in. If someone takes the bible as gospel, then so be it; I will not condemn them for that. I have my own perspectives but I won't talk about what is real or not to a christian believer or atheist. I respect them just as much as anyone else. So, in my discussions, I just ask questions as above to try and allow the person being asked to explain to me why they feel a certain type of way about the subject matter.


Although, you make perfect sense.
 
Sounds like man's word revealed in the bible itself...perhaps written by mortal men...

But, I won't disagree with whatever someone believes in. If someone takes the bible as gospel, then so be it; I will not condemn them for that. I have my own perspectives but I won't talk about what is real or not to a christian believer or atheist. I respect them just as much as anyone else. So, in my discussions, I just ask questions as above to try and allow the person being asked to explain to me why they feel a certain type of way about the subject matter.


Although, you make perfect sense.

I will condemn anyone whose faith posits that disease is merely revenge of a creator who supposedly has it in their power to prevent such suffering. It is a warped and dangerous mindset on multiple levels, and should not be condoned nor accepted simply because it's "faith."

Roll through an intersection without brakes and tell me if you have faith you won't get hit. Or do you believe in brakes, the product of scientific progress, inquiry, and innovation?
 
I will condemn anyone whose faith posits that disease is merely revenge of a creator who supposedly has it in their power to prevent such suffering. It is a warped and dangerous mindset on multiple levels, and should not be condoned nor accepted simply because it's "faith."

Roll through an intersection without brakes and tell me if you have faith you won't get hit. Or do you believe in brakes, the product of scientific progress, inquiry, and innovation?

While I would not condemn the faithful for having faith I have no problem condemning those type of outrageous and dangerous positions. I would assume most people of faith do as well. For the most part people agree on far more than they disagree. And most of us, believer and non-believer alike can agree that thinking in that manner is dangerous, unhealthy, and absurd.

I keep in mind that even though I'm an agnostic-atheist that doesn't mean insane agnostic-atheists don't exist. We have plenty of good Christians in the world and plenty of good Muslims in the world. They aren't ALL awful just because I don't believe the same thing.

However, when any of them try and use their book to justify hate I have no problem calling them out on it. Just as I would have no problem with someone calling me out on attempting to justify hatred. We've had a lot of people who have tried really hard in this thread to justify hating someone.
 
The real question is: If the Bible is the word of god revealed to man, why does god seem to be so contradictory, hateful, genocidal, vengeful, divisive, misogynist, homophobic, xenophobic, loving, forgiving, peaceful...oh wait, I'm using logic to debate faith. I guess I'll "never understand / appreciate the duality and mystery of the Almighty" blah blah blah...

First off, arguing from the stand point that your not just being sarcastic...if you created everything the eye can see you can do whatever you please. We aren't God therefore we can't even begin to think like God act like God or even love like God. That's what's wrong with the society. Everyone wants to be their own God and they try to logically explain a being who is leaps and bounds higher in intelligence, power, etc. If science is so perfect than please discredit God once and for all.
 
First off, arguing from the stand point that your not just being sarcastic...if you created everything the eye can see you can do whatever you please. We aren't God therefore we can't even begin to think like God act like God or even love like God. That's what's wrong with the society. Everyone wants to be their own God and they try to logically explain a being who is leaps and bounds higher in intelligence, power, etc. If science is so perfect than please discredit God once and for all.

I believe all my posts discredit god. You can't prove a negative.
 
"What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof"
--Christopher Hitchens
 
First off, arguing from the stand point that your not just being sarcastic...if you created everything the eye can see you can do whatever you please. We aren't God therefore we can't even begin to think like God act like God or even love like God. That's what's wrong with the society. Everyone wants to be their own God and they try to logically explain a being who is leaps and bounds higher in intelligence, power, etc. If science is so perfect than please discredit God once and for all.

Why are Christians so hell bent on getting non-believers to disprove God but yet can't prove God themselves?
 
Why are Christians so hell bent on getting non-believers to disprove God but yet can't prove God themselves?

In before the "JUST LOOK AROUND YOU!" answer
 
Thinking of starting an "I Am For Reason" thread. 3:1 odds Touey would post something within the first 5 posts and ruin it all.
 
""You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving. For this people’s heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them. But blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear. For truly I tell you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see but did not see it, and to hear what you hear but did not hear it."

"The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel that displays the glory of Christ, who is the image of God."

Such confidence we have through Christ before God. Not that we are competent in ourselves to claim anything for ourselves, but our competence comes from God. He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

You want to know who God is then read what Christ had to say. He is the New Covenant - the Old (covenant) Testament is no longer valid. So do not reference it.

Homosexuality, adultery, murder, stealing, envy, gluteny are all sin and seperate us from God. Christ offers all of us sinners reconcilliation with God.

When people who don't know the bible use the bible to invalidate the bible it is quite silly.

Sadly most have no idea of what faith is because it is counter-intellectual and counter-logical/reasonable and therefore they reject it. Sadly far too many very intelligent people are victims of themselves. They have great intellectual capacity to define and metaphore what a paradox principle is yet are completely and hopelessly powerless to live by it.

Inserting religion and mythology into a faith discussion is foolish. Discussing faith with someone who has no idea what faith is or how to practice it is equally foolish.

"Do not deceive yourselves. If any of you think you are wise by the standards of this age, you should become fools so that you may become wise."

I have absolutely the same proof you do. None. But "the substance of things hoped for by the evidence of the unseen" have been abundant in my life. "You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart." It does not say mind, logic, reason or any other faculty. All of those faculties contradict time after time after time. I cannot find Him on my terms.


My God is a creator and nurturer - He created me perfectly and nurtures esteem just as your father should. Do you have a son or daughter whom your brought into the world whom you tell "you are my second or third most greatest". No. That would be counter instinctive and counter productive.


Blaming sin for the absence of a God is naive.

As far as alien life - my faith and knowledge of my God does not cause me to become ignorant nor do I dismiss that there may very well be other life in this vast universe that God created. Alien by definition means foreign. It does not mean that my same creator did not also create them and nurture them just as he has me.

For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known."---All posts made by David Dunn


“You see, gentlemen, reason is an excellent thing, there’s no disputing that, but reason is nothing but reason and satisfies only the rational side of man’s nature, while will is a manifestation of the whole life, that is, of the whole human life including reason and all the impulses. And although our life, in this manifestation of it, is often worthless, yet it is life and not simply extracting square roots.”
― Fyodor Dostoyevsky
 
No; much of that is from the King James Version of the Bible. It has absolutely nothing to do with what we've been posting. Nice cut and paste though. As per usual.
 
Why are Christians so hell bent on getting non-believers to disprove God but yet can't prove God themselves?

I don't have any reason or need to set out and prove God exists. Most athiets and scientists have theories that are generally perceived as true yet they can never repeat or prove their theory. Does Jesus being God really sound more ridiculous than something being created out of nothing?
 
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