How to "pulse" orals

xtraflossy said:
Just a thought here Doc,

What about a pulse using 11oxo/ 3-AD ?
I'm thinking maybe it can be taken ED, but only using anabolic doses EOD..

Thoughts as to why this would or wouldn't work?
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the dosing schemes for these products are vastly different.........

ours is recommended at the 450mg per day level.......

theirs..........well.........theirs is much lower! Plus the side-effects are virtually nill and the shutdown is real mild, so i don't see the benefit of pulsing it..........but D, may have other suggestions..........
 
macedaddy said:
the dosing schemes for these products are vastly different.........

ours is recommended at the 450mg per day level.......

theirs..........well.........theirs is much lower! Plus the side-effects are virtually nill and the shutdown is real mild, so i don't see the benefit of pulsing it..........but D, may have other suggestions..........
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Well, it wouldn't so much be an actual pulse,.. your basicly just altering between anabolic doses, and anti cort/e doses.
Also, it appears that shutdown from epi has bee n reported on the mild side too, yet it's pulsed.

Plus, for anabolic pur[poses, I'm seeing possible 600mg dosing myself,... I know it's used at higher then that :twisted:

(lol- and Its not so much a which product to use,.. as I will be picking up the AX version,. .unless you just want to send me a bottle :trout: )
 
xtraflossy said:
Well, it wouldn't so much be an actual pulse,.. your basicly just altering between anabolic doses, and anti cort/e doses.
Also, it appears that shutdown from epi has bee n reported on the mild side too, yet it's pulsed.

Plus, for anabolic pur[poses, I'm seeing possible 600mg dosing myself,... I know it's used at higher then that :twisted:

(lol- and Its not so much a which product to use,.. as I will be picking up the AX version,. .unless you just want to send me a bottle :trout: )
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the highest i hve gone so far is 600, and at your wieght, it would most likely be great for you at that doseage (if your wallet can handle it).....

we'll have to see what D says, you may just be on to something! :think:
 
xtraflossy said:
... has anyone pulsed ummm,.. NOT epi before, and then pulsed with epi? ..and what were the differences that were noticed?
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I didn't pulse Havoc but took it two weeks straight. It is more suppressive than epi for sure (see my comparison of the two a few pages back) at least at the 2wk mark. I have pulsed Epi with daily MFX and again with daily 3AD no prob. I have not tried adding HD or Retain on off days since I had the 3AD and MFX goin' on anyway, but would have used them otherwise probably.
 
haroldjg said:
... IMO the two day lay-off is very important in limiting suppression.
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Yes, couldn't have summarized any better! Taking an extra day off every now and again as needed keeps the bounce strong with 2-3 consecutive off days.
 
xtraflossy said:
Just a thought here Doc,

What about a pulse using 11oxo/ 3-AD ?
I'm thinking maybe it can be taken ED, but only using anabolic doses EOD..

Thoughts as to why this would or wouldn't work?
Click to expand...

I've done that, it works well! The 3AD covers all your bases for libido, recovery, anti-cort on the off and on days with extremely low suppression potential and the orals are just give the extra boost on w/o days. It's not really a pulse though, a modified pulse I guess that's closer to a real cycle, but the results are nice. Like stacking no bloat test or test and an AI with an oral, but without the heavy suppression. 3AD, 3caps/day and 40-50mg Epi 3-4.5x/wk (basic 3/2 work out split.) Goooood stuff. I plan on doing a little PCT anyway, but suppression is honestly not bad I am still big ballin' after my 2 off days. Taking Ora too, maybe that's keeping me bouncing also, but Epi and 3AD are just inherently less suppressive than most.
 
getreal said:
20mg is not enough for var doc
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I doubt it my friend. 20g of var never even phased me taking it every day! Seriously, I could not even tell I was on anything, and it came from the pharmacy so I know it was legit. Taking 8 of those little footballs a day and nothing. I'd say 40 minimum, especially if pulsing.
 
DR.D said:
I've done that, it works well! The 3AD covers all your bases for libido, recovery, anti-cort on the off and on days with extremely low suppression potential and the orals are just give the extra boost on w/o days. It's not really a pulse though, a modified pulse I guess that's closer to a real cycle, but the results are nice. Like stacking no bloat test or test and an AI with an oral, but without the heavy suppression. 3AD, 3caps/day and 40-50mg Epi 3-4.5x/wk (basic 3/2 work out split.) Goooood stuff. I plan on doing a little post cycle therapy anyway, but suppression is honestly not bad I am still big ballin' after my 2 off days. Taking Ora too, maybe that's keeping me bouncing also, but Epi and 3AD are just inherently less suppressive than most.
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ora????.......... oratropin??
 
TripDog said:
ora????.......... oratropin??
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Yeah, sorry about that ora = Oratropin.

I have cleaned out the frig again! I swear, that product doesn't give me the peaceful hypo that lr3 does, but it increases my appetite like crazy so I know it must be lowering my blood sugar just as much if not more.
 
So Doc, what if you work out 3x a week but there 3 days in a row, should you take Superdrol/ErgoMax first workout and third? And one more dose 2 days after. Correct? I have bunch of extra SDrol And Ergo so im trying to mix it up and get rid of it. But was'nt sure about dosing with 3wo days in a row. I work 12hrs so cant spread out workouts.:goodpost: THANKS GREATLY APPRECIATED! Read all 14 pages too.
 
TravisCoSheriff said:
So Doc, what if you work out 3x a week but there 3 days in a row, should you take Superdrol/ErgoMax first workout and third? And one more dose 2 days after. Correct? I have bunch of extra SDrol And Ergo so im trying to mix it up and get rid of it. But was'nt sure about dosing with 3wo days in a row. I work 12hrs so cant spread out workouts.:goodpost: THANKS GREATLY APPRECIATED! Read all 14 pages too.
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that seems the way to go...give a day off at least!!.....i'm a big fan of the pulse method...i'm sure the doc is lurking somewhere here...good luck bro :thumbsup:
 
DR.D said:
Yeah, sorry about that ora = Oratropin.

I have cleaned out the frig again! I swear, that product doesn't give me the peaceful hypo that lr3 does, but it increases my appetite like crazy so I know it must be lowering my blood sugar just as much if not more.
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How does the oratropin work? havn't heard alot about it.
 
TravisCoSheriff said:
So Doc, what if you work out 3x a week but there 3 days in a row, should you take Superdrol/ErgoMax first workout and third? And one more dose 2 days after. Correct? I have bunch of extra SDrol And Ergo so im trying to mix it up and get rid of it. But was'nt sure about dosing with 3wo days in a row. I work 12hrs so cant spread out workouts.:goodpost: THANKS GREATLY APPRECIATED! Read all 14 pages too.
Click to expand...

That's what I do: 3on, 2off and start over again. So 4.5 w/o (doses) per week. About once or twice a month, I just add a 3/3 run for an extra day or two off, that keeps it an honest pulse if I start feeling a bit suppressed. Everyone reacts differently but people seem to be getting really good results with pretty diverse pulsing protocols once they find what works for them. Everyone I've talked to so far has verified the major lack of shut down also.
 
hman85 said:
How does the oratropin work? havn't heard alot about it.
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It works a lot like lr3 but with more hunger and no dizziness or overt hypo. If you're on a diet, stay away from Oratropin! Seriously, I was amazed at how well it worked. I thought yeah, oral peptide, whatever.. but it's for real if you don't like pins. I was quite impressed. I am not a big breakfast guy, usually have a big shake and that's it till later, but I had to eat all day on that stuff! Made good gains too, not a lot of fat just a huge appetite.
 
LowKeyLifter said:
Wk 1: (Tue: 10 mg/pre) (Thurs: 10 mg/pre 10 mg/post) (Saturday: 20 mg/pre 10 mg/post)

Wk 2: 20 mg/pre - 10mg/post

Wk 3: 20 mg/pre - 10mg/post

Wk 4: 20 mg/pre - 20mg/post

Wk 5: 20 mg/pre - 20mg/post

Wk 6: 30 mg/pre - 20mg/post

Wk 7: 30 mg/pre - 30mg/post

Wk 8: (Tues: 30 mg/pre - 20mg/post) (Thurs: 20mg/pre 10 mg/post) (Saturday: 10 mg/pre)
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I am thinking of pulsing this:

* Do I need a serm?

* Do I need cycle support if doing it this way?

* I just dose pre and post within three hours of each other?

* On my off days I just take some form of test booster?

Anything else Master D?
 
neoborn said:
I am thinking of pulsing this:

* Do I need a serm?

* Do I need cycle support if doing it this way?

* I just dose pre and post within three hours of each other?

* On my off days I just take some form of test booster?

Anything else Master D?
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Your getting a little on the higher end of things towards the last week. But, I am going to ASSUME your refering to epi here...

Im going to go with All that has been answered to death in this thread.
..
Have a SERM on hand just in case (like a condom- when yo uleave the house, you probably should take it with you,.. just in case)

YEah, test booster or AI or both on off days. Depends on what you can get $$

You might as well take a week or two after the pulse cycle and run something of a post cycle therapy.
You can get away with just the SERM if thats all you have.
You will probably have to buy a second bottle of whatever you get (test booster/AI) anyways, so save some to run for a week or two after your done.

No problem on your dosing times, cycle support optional,..


Since your pulsing, I don't know if yo uneed those dramatic increases in dosing though. It might just be a waste of chem, more supression, and more sides with no added anabolic kick beyone what maybe 40-50 can offer... but thats just somethign to keep in mind, as Im sure at some point durring your 7 weeks SOMETHING will be adjusted anyways.
 
Dr. D,
I am wanting to pulse Epi or Havoc as to cut down on the sides and not having to PCT with a SERM. how does this look for strength and mass gains...
wk 1 10-20-30
wk 2 40-40-40
wk 3 no epi take 2 TZ3 daily
wk 4 10-20-30
wk 5 40-40-40
wk 6 2 TZ3 daily

would i need any supprt supps besides multi and maybe some taurine?
 
DR.D said:
3-4 days a week is just right.

Yes, always start low and only take as much as you need. If 30mg works, keep it there and don't go higher!

I'd take the bigger dose before a w/o, but it's important to take a dose after too, even if it's the lesser of 2 doses (with methyls at least).

A test booster on off days is fine. So is an anti-cort and/or anti-e.
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How do you guys tell if you have found your "as much as you need" and " if "x" amount works don't go higher"?
 
neoborn said:
How do you guys tell if you have found your "as much as you need" and " if "x" amount works don't go higher"?
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For me the sides usually begin to increase. I will get headaches, or wont be able to sleep, or will sleep way too much or excruciating back pumps. Or whatever it may be for you. I ramp up until I get to that point then I back down. I usually just take it to a point just below where the negative sides begin to appear. This helps me have enjoyable cycles rather than blow up feel like crap cycles. As well, I usually feel an "on" feeling when I am at the right dose.
 
lambo said:
Dr. D,
I am wanting to pulse Epi or Havoc as to cut down on the sides and not having to post cycle therapy with a SERM. how does this look for strength and mass gains...
wk 1 10-20-30
wk 2 40-40-40
wk 3 no epi take 2 TZ3 daily
wk 4 10-20-30
wk 5 40-40-40
wk 6 2 TZ3 daily

would i need any supprt supps besides multi and maybe some taurine?
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I would change wk4 to 20,30,40 but the rest looks good. No support needed, but I still take a handful of vitamins every day anyway whether needed or not. :)
 
DR.D said:
Hey Peece! I still don't know what it is. If M-TRN is Methoxytrenbolone, I am guessing M-TST may be Methoxytestosterone. I will extract some caps next week and at least throw a sample on the IR to look for the 'triene' part of it. That would be easy to confirm. The nomenclature on the label suggests it contains a triene structure.
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Anyone interested- DR. should have some idea what it is very soon (TST)

:)
 
Hell ya Doc,i think were dyin to know what the hell tst is...crack that code buddy :thumbsup:
 
So Doc, what would you recommend for someone like me. I'm trying to keep sides to a minimum, especially long term.

I've been on a regular Pheradrol cycle for 12 days now starting off slow @ 10 mg/day for the first 5 days and 20 mg/day for the past 7. I was planning on bumping to 30 mg/day for 2 weeks on day 14 but I'm very interested in maintaining my gains as much as possible and keeping sides low.

Would it be okay to begin pulsing at 4x per week (or even 3) now and running the cycle for a little bit longer or should I complete the cycle regularly as planned?
 
GettinSwol said:
So Doc, what would you recommend for someone like me. I'm trying to keep sides to a minimum, especially long term.

I've been on a regular Pheradrol cycle for 12 days now starting off slow @ 10 mg/day for the first 5 days and 20 mg/day for the past 7. I was planning on bumping to 30 mg/day for 2 weeks on day 14 but I'm very interested in maintaining my gains as much as possible and keeping sides low.

Would it be okay to begin pulsing at 4x per week (or even 3) now and running the cycle for a little bit longer or should I complete the cycle regularly as planned?
Click to expand...

Sure, you could switch now to 30mg 4x/wk or 40mg 3x/wk, it's probably not too late to make it a pulser. I think the CS would be best once a day pulsing or off nights only, but if you want to keep using it as you are, that's fine too. It's a great product alright.
 
So how long is it taking you "pulsers" to feel the effects of your androgens and putting on weight? Im still on week one of SD/E..Max at 10mg 3x wk. 20mg next week Whoot!
 
TravisCoSheriff said:
So how long is it taking you "pulsers" to feel the effects of your androgens and putting on weight? Im still on week one of superdrol/E..Max at 10mg 3x wk. 20mg next week Whoot!
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I usually begin to really feel it 3 weeks in. I usually start out at 30mgs though. Its not as dramatic as a regular cycle, but the risk to benefit ratio is much higher.
 
TravisCoSheriff said:
So how long is it taking you "pulsers" to feel the effects of your androgens and putting on weight? Im still on week one of superdrol/E..Max at 10mg 3x wk. 20mg next week Whoot!
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I have already noticed the TRN kicking in for the strength and pumps not the mass of course its not really a mass builder. I am taking 6mg of TRN with 20mg superdrol post workout. I am 2 weeks in.

The best thing is I feel great. No sides at all, I know its 2 weeks in but with the tren alot of users have BP issues often and early.
 
when u pulse do u split up the doseage or do u take all of it pre workout??? cuz im takin 30 mg's pre workout
 
DR.D said:
Sure, you could switch now to 30mg 4x/wk or 40mg 3x/wk, it's probably not too late to make it a pulser. I think the CS would be best once a day pulsing or off nights only, but if you want to keep using it as you are, that's fine too. It's a great product alright.
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Thanks Dr. D.

I'm going to try it. I like to do 4 days on 2 days off. Would I be better off going 4 days straight then taking two days off and getting back on again for say 6 rotations or should I go 2 on, 1 off, 2 on, 2 off

1-on
2-on
3-on
4-on
5-off
6-off
repeat

vs.

1-on
2-on
3-off
4-on
5-on
6-off
7-off
repeat
 
hey guys had some great results from my pulse Dr D thanks for the continuous insight. I had lost my pc twice due to my girlfriend downloading stuff. It was a nightmare since I work fulltime, had to go to school to use pc lab, and of workout. Well all and all first 3.5 wks did as initally planned 6000 cal a day realized I could go 30PP and 40SD daily without too much back pump until week 4. Gained 18lbs and had to drop back down to around 3250 calories a day since knees started bothering me. Went from 275 flat bench (6) to 300lbs (12), squat went up to 495 (8) etc. All around 155 strength increase and some damn fine cuts and mass with minimal sides. Great! will finish bottles if needed later down the road. I tried to post a daily log but went 2.5 wks w/ no pc then another wk but posted 16 logs or so wt and reps
 
GettinSwol said:
Thanks Dr. D.

I'm going to try it. I like to do 4 days on 2 days off. Would I be better off going 4 days straight then taking two days off and getting back on again for say 6 rotations or should I go 2 on, 1 off, 2 on, 2 off

1-on
2-on
3-on
4-on
5-off
6-off
repeat

vs.

1-on
2-on
3-off
4-on
5-on
6-off
7-off
repeat
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This one would be best:

1-on
2-on
3- off
4-on
5-on
6- off
7- off


I do:

1-on
2-on
3-on
4- off
5- off
6-variable (on/off every other time or off as needed)
7- repeat..
 
Nogrinia said:
hey guys had some great results from my pulse Dr D thanks for the continuous insight. I had lost my pc twice due to my girlfriend downloading stuff. It was a nightmare since I work fulltime, had to go to school to use pc lab, and of workout. Well all and all first 3.5 wks did as initally planned 6000 cal a day realized I could go 30PP and 40SD daily without too much back pump until week 4. Gained 18lbs and had to drop back down to around 3250 calories a day since knees started bothering me. Went from 275 flat bench (6) to 300lbs (12), squat went up to 495 (8) etc. All around 155 strength increase and some damn fine cuts and mass with minimal sides. Great! will finish bottles if needed later down the road. I tried to post a daily log but went 2.5 wks w/ no pc then another wk but posted 16 logs or so wt and reps
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That's great! Sorry about the pc, I know it's a pain when that happens. I finally had to blow the cash and get one just for me fighting with my wife over it too, of course I can't blame her for crashing it looking up porn anymore! j/k

That's awesome with those results though. That shows you must have done things very well if you could go to school, have a challenging diet and still make such impressive gains from your training. I'm glad it worked well for you. :)
 
UNCfan1 said:
I'll send u some TRN and Trenadrol if U can find out what it really is.
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You're right UNC, I need to test them all now to really have a solid understanding of the data I got. Some have 2mg, some have 30mg... dude, somebody is prevaricating! (I'm trying to use a pretty word for it, lol)
 
vlad878 said:
would my pulse work im doin 30mg's of pheraplex EOD

1-on
2-off
3-on
4-off
5-on
6-off
7-on
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Yes, Leggo is correct, that's just right. Every now and then, maybe once or twice a month take that day 7 off if shutdown starts creeping in.
 
DR.D said:
You're right UNC, I need to test them all now to really have a solid understanding of the data I got. Some have 2mg, some have 30mg... dude, somebody is prevaricating! (I'm trying to use a pretty word for it, lol)
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D, the whole 30mg still is a misunderstanding to me too, from what I gather and seen from a post @DA from Voodoo, the FDA made kilosports up the dose on the label to show that its that strong:frustrate I don't understand it myself. But let me know if u want to test them I can send u some.
 
Pre-Pulse
Squat 385 (7) *3
BB Curl no cheat form 115 (12) *3
widegrip row 175 (5) *2
narrowgrip row 205 (50 *2
flat 285 (5) went to 300 (8)
Post-Pulse
Squat 495 (8)
BB curl perfect form no cheat 145 (8)
Wide-grip row 225 (10) *2
Narrow-grip row 245 (7) *2
Flat bench to 300 (8) *2 due to elbow tinnitus did not go any heavier same applies
To tri & bi workout by wk 4 workouts just increased reps and added addtl to superset
Tris sprset used to be 8 balls to the wall hits increased it to 12 exercises per set finishing as always by tricep isolation dips until complete failure did the same for shoulders all the way down to 7.5lbers. I tried to add pics to my log at Invalid Link Removed but could not figure out how to do so I added to the gallery in "disguise". Will do some measurements soon too. Keep up the great thread Dr. D. Reccomend pulsing highly
 
DR.D said:
Yes, Leggo is correct, that's just right. Every now and then, maybe once or twice a month take that day 7 off if shutdown starts creeping in.
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well im only doin a 4 week pulse but do u think i can still gain on it and keep all of gains?
 
UNCfan1 said:
D, the whole 30mg still is a misunderstanding to me too, from what I gather and seen from a post @DA from Voodoo, the FDA made kilosports up the dose on the label to show that its that strong:frustrate I don't understand it myself. But let me know if u want to test them I can send u some.
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That sound too bizarre! VD better PM with with the low down before I pop the top on all this, that's all I know. Thanks for the offer my friend, I'll go ahead and order it myself though. What are all the brands of this stuff out right now?
 
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