HIT4ME
Well-known member
This is kind of what I expected. When I started the 6 day a week protocol, I was actually dropping volume but also dropping intensity - but the fact is, I just mentally like pushing hard and I think I was getting up there again with the heavier weights and intensity and you just can't do hard, volume and frequent.
You are one of the people on here who is willing to go into a large deficit and keeps control - I suspected you are managing your volume/frequency/intensity in a way that keeps you from over training.
I am thinking that over training actually has a MORE profound and dramatic impact on leptin levels than diet, by quite a bit actually. When I started out, I was training infrequently and just doing my thing, but then went on the PSMF and let the diet do the work. I wasn't trying to burn extra calories through activity - only use the activity to maintain muscle tissue. When I started trying to increase activity (in my insane, all out way) - I was no longer able to stick to the diet and I think my results have actually faltered. This actually is in line with beliefs I've held for almost 20 years now - but recently started to question and test and look for different ways.
See, this type of training is actually something I've espoused for YEARS. I've followed Mentzer since I was a teenager and he had people doing workouts once every 4 days and sometimes less. I think a lot of people revolt against his ideas, but there are a LOT of programs out there that pick up on theories he really pushed forth. Arthur Jones started the trend, Mentzer really pushed it. I think your training style can be highly effective - even in young people. I think the only thing about you being older is that, you are less ego driven (wiser?) and willing to accept that doing less may be all that is needed. At 37 years old, I'm still trying to push and test and discover.
And - just in case you are wondering, I'm still going slightly larger deficit than most but I'm not really doing the PSMF on this run. I'm between 1000-1500 calories/day. My BMR should be around 1750 and my fitbit TYPICALLY tracks me around 2000-2200 calories on most work days and around 2500-3000 calories on most weekends. I just don't burn many calories, but I'm still probably at about 1000 calories/day. I'm not quite as crazy as I was - it just isn't as necessary at this point.
Like you said, different journeys and different places. What a lot of people don't see is - those pictures of me at 215 in my last log; those WERE after a BIG improvement. It is easy to forget that I was up around 300 pounds for OVER a decade of my life. I was also fat as a child (200 pounds in 6th grade) - lost it in junior high school, kept it off through my soph year in college, gained it, lost it quickly in college (owning a supplement company at the time and having Lipokinetix, Adipokinetix, Tiratricol, etc. on the market at the time helped) and then about a year out of college, once I got in the real world, I started packing it on good.
My family is ALL fat. I was raised with really bad eating habits. Something I have noticed is that almost all of the members of my family have no "off switch" with food. My dad, for instance, is CONSTANTLY eating. Way out of control. My mom isn't much better. I don't ever really get "too full" when I eat. I could eat a pint of ice cream, a piece of cheese cake, a bunch of chips - and then if you put something in front of me I could still eat it. Not even a joke. I'm not saying I DO that. Just that I have to consciously stop myself, my body doesn't ever tell me it's over. This could be genetic, or it could be the bad habits of my family instilled as a child, or it could be a combo thereof. It's something I've been researching the heck out of and learning about.
But, given that background, the PSMF was actually really good for me. Anyone who says it is unhealthy is actually naive. It dramatically improves your health in a short time frame - not just your bodyfat levels but all kinds of blood test results. My gf was on it for 3 months with me and lost 30 pounds and her doctor was astounded with her blood test results. Told her she was a totally new person. Every drug they wanted her to take was no longer necessary. This is also backed by a number of clinical studies in cancer patient and the general population. Is it a good long-term strategy and a permanent solution? No. But that's the thing - there is no "permanent solution". Look at BEAST73. He keeps saying, "The struggle is real" - he knows.
The PSMF taught me a lot, actually helped me control my hunger (since I lack an off switch, it isn't the same as you might expect), and got me to a better place. But, you are right - it probably isn't needed so much anymore in my case. I'm an aggressive guy - hell, I had one of the wealthiest men from Germany once tell me that when we first met he thought I was intimidating and too aggressive - so I will always push, but it's just me and part of what makes this fun for me.
So, at the end of the day, I really enjoy your disagreeing with me on things - because we don't disagree as much as you think, but the only way to find new paths is to see different angles and you, my friend, are often the other angle. I hope that in the end, it expands horizons as much for you and others as it does for me.
Darned straight DennisTheDane! You only have two choices in life - lay there and let them kick you in the teeth, or come back up swinging. This is what it is - just a bad week. If everything went as planned all the time, life would be boring! Thanks for the support!
I think you're right! But now I have a better idea of those limits. I also have some new insight into exercise and leptin, and dieting, etc. Looking back, letting the diet do the work was both easier AND more effective. Thanks for all that you do SFreed, for real, you are a huge supporter and I really appreciate it.
Hey man, thanks for this. I prefer to think of it as "forging steel" rather than beating to a pulp
haha. But....what is this "sane" approach you speak of? Tell me more.... hahaSee, this fits like MA70's approach and the approach I started with - don't try to burn calories through activity. Focus on using weights to maintain muscles, let the diet burn the fat.
Oh, he will. I've never met someone so determined. And stubborn!
Yes. And Yes. Again, thank you for this. This is where I need to point out that my determination isn't JUST me. It's good to have such an awesome and supportive community. You guys REALLY do drive me. It is amazing how guys on this board pop into my head ALL THE D#MNED TIME. When I have to go to the gym and don't feel like it, I think about everyone here who is working hard and I don't want to be the slacker that lets everyone down. When I get under the bar to bench, I think of you, KAPrice - not because it's really a competition with you, but because I want us both to get better and I don't want to let you down. When I squat, FireTitan pops into my head. When I fall off my diet, I think of SFreed and hairygrandpa a lot.
The one thing that's a little concerning though, is that when I do military presses, I think of a guy with underwear on his head (@tank999).
But I thank you ALL for everything you do for me. Really, I'm just a guy trying to be better and hoping to help others along the way, and that wouldn't be possible with out this board. It's truly amazing. And every log I have will have these same sentiments over and over again because I just can't express how much this isn't ME, this is all of US.
In closing - and getting back to my discussion of me not having an "off switch" when I eat - I've been discussing this with dsade. I've been REALLY hoping the epitome would help fix this, and in his experience he has seen appetite suppression in people like me that comes on pretty strong and fast. It's only been 10 days, but this has NOT been the case with me.
Dsade is well aware of my situation and we started talking about it. Matt is CONSTANTLY researching and I try to do the same. I found a study and asked him about it, and it turns out I'm catching up to him - I think I'm only about 8 years behind on his research. As we started discussing it, he has let me in on some secrets and some potential upgrades he has been looking at for Epitome (sorry Dsade - hope it's not too early to mention).
My issue probably isn't leptin levels as much as it is leptin sensitivity - something many obese people and formerly obese people face. Dsade mentioned a couple of potential upgrade ingredients he has been looking into; which I can't share. But, as it turns out - one of these ingredients happened to be something I had a ton of in my supplement stash. It isn't something most people on here probably stock, but about a year ago I read a study on it, found some really cheap, and bought a pound of it. I took 1 spoonful and it then wound up in the back of my cabinet and I never used it again. Turns out, this ingredient may improve leptin sensitivity in addition to the reasons I purchased it.
So, last night I took 2 g of it before bed with Ammo and Gut Health. I also took 2 g of it this morning with my morning dose of DCP, BMP, Ammo, and Epitome. I took another 2 g this afternoon with DCP. I will take another 2 g tonight with Epitome. I'm also going to increase the epitome to 3X a day with this new ingredient.
It may just be coincidence - but I've had 2 shakes today (1 tbsp coconut oil, 2 tbsp cocoa powder, 1 scoop Select, in coffee and blended) and I can't even think about eating. Honestly. I'm not sure if it's because I had a couple of days of not dieting very well, or if it's this, or what yet. On the weekends I help my gf clean an office building and they usually have a TON of candy in this office. I normally wind up sneaking 2-3 pieces (like a mini tootsie roll) and if I'm being good on my diet I avoid it, but I WANT it. Today, didn't even want it.
The thing is, the way this ingredient works, I wouldn't think it would work in 1 day. It actually should help repair a malfunctioning part of your brain and I would think that should take time. Maybe coincidence, but I'm going to keep commenting on it if it keeps up. Matt could be about to take Epitome to the next level for real.
