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Dear Moderators..........

Xodus said:
I think he got caught trying to sell them too, IIRC...
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I don't know if he was or not, but this looked suspicious after he was banned-
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You'd have to ask the guy who he was supposedly trading supplements with. I seriously would not doubt that one of those supplements was probably something that he got from this forum to log. For those wondering, he was given about four or five chances by us and basically refused to ship HemodrauliX back, b/c he was going to start it when he felt like it(his words). He was very rude to us and said that he felt that we were very "cut throat" in our attempts to get him to log the product. He also said that our badgering of him to begin the log made him lose confidence in Axis Labs as a company. I also want everyone to know that he was given HemodrauliX about two weeks before anyone could even buy it in stores. His excuse all along was that he could not afford a membership to a gym, although I'm sure everyone saw his numberous posts and pictures of his recent supplement purchases.
 
slow-mun said:
I don't know if he was or not, but this looked suspicious after he was banned-
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You'd have to ask the guy who he was supposedly trading supplements with. I seriously would not doubt that one of those supplements was probably something that he got from this forum to log. For those wondering, he was given about four or five chances by us and basically refused to ship HemodrauliX back, b/c he was going to start it when he felt like it(his words). He was very rude to us and said that he felt that we were very "cut throat" in our attempts to get him to log the product. He also said that our badgering of him to begin the log made him lose confidence in Axis Labs as a company. I also want everyone to know that he was given HemodrauliX about two weeks before anyone could even buy it in stores. His excuse all along was that he could not afford a membership to a gym, although I'm sure everyone say his numberous posts and pictures of his recent supplement purchases.
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thats f**ked up. What a tool. He'll probably go on bb.com and try to get stuff off guys there as well. Thats a complete dooshbag for you, seriously. What has it been, like 3 months since his start date? Maybe more?
 
Mun (and Axis also) - sorry. Honestly.

That's not how I and the other upstanding members of AM.com do biz. I log my products. (Though - I may not follow my diet 100%....that's a detail though.)

We've got a lot of other guys that do also. Hopefully this retard doesn't taint your opinion of the members here.
 
jmh80 said:
Mun (and Axis also) - sorry. Honestly.

That's not how I and the other upstanding members of AM.com do biz. I log my products. (Though - I may not follow my diet 100%....that's a detail though.)

We've got a lot of other guys that do also. Hopefully this retard doesn't taint your opinion of the members here.
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Don't worry, it certainly doesn't change my opinion about anyone that's still on the forum. Had I known anything about that guy's personality before he was picked, Clickster wouldn't have picked him. That guy had more issues than just trying to scam us(Pedo much?). I've since made it possible for two other forum members to log HemodrauliX for us. I also hope that we can still get some testers on here for our upcoming product releases as they filter down the pipeline.
 
I said a few months back, Sponsored loggers should be required to BUY the supps directly from the company, on their dime, and when they are finished with a completed log, they get reimbursed for the product..

Sure it is a bit more work, but IMO it would cut down on the amount of FLAKERS.
 
if we had a list telling us who these guys were that bailed on providing their end of the bargain we could fill their private message box with gay porn.
 
I think companies need to put some type disclaimer of contractual obligation and penalities incurred for breach in all potential testing threads. Anyone who posts an app has to agree to these terms. Perhaps the guy gets banned from AM but honestly he could probably just start a new username. We should publicly shame the offender and post their address. This will help to prevent them from starting a new account or even going to other forums and pulling the shame stuff. Hell, that muscleguy reminded me of martel from another forum.
 
slow-mun said:
I don't know if he was or not, but this looked suspicious after he was banned-
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You'd have to ask the guy who he was supposedly trading supplements with. I seriously would not doubt that one of those supplements was probably something that he got from this forum to log. For those wondering, he was given about four or five chances by us and basically refused to ship HemodrauliX back, b/c he was going to start it when he felt like it(his words). He was very rude to us and said that he felt that we were very "cut throat" in our attempts to get him to log the product. He also said that our badgering of him to begin the log made him lose confidence in Axis Labs as a company. I also want everyone to know that he was given HemodrauliX about two weeks before anyone could even buy it in stores. His excuse all along was that he could not afford a membership to a gym, although I'm sure everyone saw his numberous posts and pictures of his recent supplement purchases.
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lol at "cut throat" when it comes to being given free supplements that aren't even out yet, what a ****. probably should make sure you have access to weights before you are on the internet offering to do 2 or 3 logs.
 
I must lookup this MuscleguyinNY........... So we need s sticky version of a callout thread that companies PM a designated mod with the reasoning a certain person should be added. an ongoing list will result in called out names getting lost in the shuffle.

Then we send all forum members within driving distance to collect our supps.
 
hey lany. PM me muscleguys addy. Ill go kick him in the balls for you. I live in ny too so ill find the tool and give em what he deserves :]
 
I can't find him in any of my lists... but if someone else has his info and could PM it to me.... I'd love to see if it jogs my memory. The whole "guy in New York who can't afford the gym thing" seems vaguely familiar...........
 
ReaperX said:
I agree with Dave @ PAL/imprezivr that some type of deposit or payment would be the best way to secure a log. Even some type of contract in writing would work, however, legal fees would easily exceed the product cost.

The issues with doing logs is people are going to come up with some lame excuses about not having money or not having a credit card, whatever. They'll even be more inclined to be biased since the company has their money.
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I agree on the potential bias thing in regards to a deposit.
 
I've seen quite a few negative logs... and feel that most are accepted gracefully. But there is a difference between testers who discuss without bias and those that negatively judge without providing much worthwhile info.

Being a supplement user for a long time prior to joining AN, I always ask that testers stay honest. Companies who are offering logs and expecting nothing but good feedback are using them strictly for marketing. Our philosophy is that the logs are as much for our use as they are for the potential consumers. We look for trends and input in logs to improve on products and improve on the ways we recommend using our products. I truly hope other companies are approaching logs with this mindset.

Your points and ideas above are valid though. I was unaware of the JW log you referenced... I'll have to take a look.
 
A little dramatic don't ya think Reaper? I have read plenty of logs that were quite honest, to the point of calling something near worthless. I find alot of logs informative and entertaining. Sure, some logs are a big brown-nosing session, but some of the 'trusted' bros do damn fine job. I doubt a company loses a significant amount of $$$ sending a few free bottles of product. Either way, there should be more ads with near naked women.

And I do mean women Reap, not Kai Greene and a grapefruit..:run:
 
ReaperX said:
regardless of the logs or not, purely for maximizing profit, don't run logs. Just use that money instead for marketing purposes (mazagines/nutrition websites).
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Yes, that couple hundred dollar in supplements will get approximately 3 pixels in a magazine.


Do you even understand the cost of the things you propose?




On the larger issues, if you want the blacklist, its up to you. We can't keep track of people for 30 companies but we sure can make a thread in which you can track them yourself.
 
ReaperX said:
regardless of the logs or not, purely for maximizing profit, don't run logs. Just use that money instead for marketing purposes (mazagines/nutrition websites).


That dollar will go farther that way and have a better return. Depending on what product it is, every guy that burns that company with not doing a log is losing out on money that adds up over time.
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I don't think that you realize how much an ad costs in a magazine... esp. a large color glossy one, not to mention production costs, etc.


20 bottles of your own $30-$50 (retail) product is MAYBE enough to get a 2" x 3" ad in the back of a mag.

Not to mention you get continued 'word of mouth' advertising on a forum full of your target audience.

I've used lots of products that I purchased on my own dime and I pimp the hell out of them IF I find they work for me. Obviously, YMMV, but I know what does/does not have an affect on me and will say so, good or bad.

Personally, I try to stay out of people's logs, as I think it may cause some placebo/bias when I decide to take the product.

I like more 'mini-review' type of postings, I don't need to see 30 days worth of postings of 'my lifts are keep going up, etc. etc.), just a nice solid recap of the product, sides, pros, cons, would run it again, etc.
 
Xodus said:
Not to mention you get continued 'word of mouth' advertising on a forum full of your target audience.
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Exactly, I have bought all my supps based on peoples review here, not from magazines.

Reapers intension were obviously good, so don't hate on him guys.
 
AlexParty said:
Exactly, I have bought all my supps based on peoples review here, not from magazines.

Reapers intension were obviously good, so don't hate on him guys.
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Not hating, just explaining the 'business reasons' for logs and the holes in his theory. Just part of the discussion.
 

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Logging and forum talk is like an interactive infomercial. Companies and customers in an ongoing discussion with the customers looking for quality and the company looking for sales. When both sides get what they want, everybody is happy. Publicly logging a product can be a good way to do this, if the product does what it is supposed to.
 
mouth to mouth advertisement is the best, I recall when Aspire came out Dave from PAL trusted me and send me a few samples. with those samples i gave away to friends then guys that i didnt know started asking me for bottles or pills cause the guys i gave the pills like them and put out a good word. I dont know af any of you recall but i have posted numerous pics with a **** load of Aspire bottles. That was a best seller between my friends and some of their friends. they ask me for other kind of supps and i hook them up.
 
ReaperX said:
Alex-


You bought Anabolic O.D. by MAP.


I think that's all I need to say. Obviously you were suckered into marketing tactics so spare me.
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Not marketing. I got a sample, LOVED the taste, have money to spend and bought it. I made a log just stating that. So much for backing you up :rofl:
 
ReaperX said:
Obviously you were suckered into marketing tactics so spare me.
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Coming from someone who doesnt have a clue how this industry works yet has the arrogance to think he knows how companies can better market their products.
 
ReaperX said:
There is this segment here that was also included.
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doest really work either (the initial price drop) as again doing the math, say 10 bottles of your stuff at $30/bottle plus shipping is maybe $400. if you ship 2000 bottles out to distributors at a discount you can discount it a whipping 20 cents a bottle for the same cost. The logs are definitely more cost effective. I do read the logs of other products regularly, just you have to take them with a grain of salt sometimes. Generally even if someone is all excited about it, they still dont lie about measurements or scale weight or lifts, so they become the filter
 
ReaperX said:
I'm not claim to 'know' how this industry works. By that I am assuming you are talking about bb'ing and all its aspects. I was just making a suggestion that you obviously took the wrong way and making piss poor assumptions about me.

Fine, so be it. I'll just leave it at that.
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You just condescended me for buying Anabolic O.D as a retaliation to the critic of your marketing knowledge. I haven't said one thing about you. I'm in a business commerce major and know everything about this aspect of advertising and yet I didn't say one thing about your views of how to market a product.
 
ReaperX said:
I'm not claim to 'know' how this industry works. By that I am assuming you are talking about bb'ing and all its aspects. I was just making a suggestion that you obviously took the wrong way and making piss poor assumptions about me.

Fine, so be it. I'll just leave it at that.
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No, I am talking about running a business in this industry and what the costs are.

You suggestions are fine, your statements about how people being suckered are not.
 
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