Celorza

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R3ACTION said:
Just to keep things relevant to the OP lets overlook a thread entitled Hemoval is the ****! I guess fair and balanced would be insulting the handicapped and calling black people brutes. You thought maybe he really did feel bad and change his original post because he had a change of heart?

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplements/216187-hemoval.html
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Wow didn't kno about this thread....Ceasar I didn't expect this from you bro...I remember when you talked first and you were different but this is unexceptable...all I have to say you get big and smarter and plz think twice before you speak or write or do anything...good luck!!!
 
I had never seen that thread before, wow.

I have nothing constructive to reply regarding it so I shall keep my mouth shut.

Perhaps others will learn from this and do the same. ;)
 
Ladies and gentlemen: the reason behind my boycott of SNS products.
 
This is not directed at this situation necessarily, the last couple of posts made me think back to a discussion that went on here a while ago as events unfolded.

A company rep does not change the profile of the products. If a company has great products no rep will alter that and they are still worth buying.

On the other hand, using the phrase "these are only my opinions and do not reflect those of <company>" doesn't mean you don't associate the two. For example, if I was rude or abusive to people on here it is fair to assume it would tarnish their view of the company who chose to let me represent them.

This is why I make a specific point of not engaging in arguments on the board. I personally (I know not everyone agrees with this) that reps are always reflecting their company, whether they are posting their own views or not. They should uphold professionalism.
 
punjabimunde said:
Wow didn't kno about this thread....Ceasar I didn't expect this from you bro...I remember when you talked first and you were different but this is unexceptable...all I have to say you get big and smarter and plz think twice before you speak or write or do anything...good luck!!!
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Wow. It just keeps getting worse. I thought we were supposed to learn teach lead here. Sure I'll mess with people a little sometimes if they post something all out uninformed but always try to point them in the right direction and NEVER call people "retard" that word makes me a whole different kind of pissed.

Just flaming people and pretending you're king sh!t because you have 8,000,000 post on a forum is kinda sad.

Edit: just so there's no mistake I'm obviously talking about cel, not you Punjab! Lol
 
Piston Honda said:
Ladies and gentlemen: the reason behind my boycott of SNS products.
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To be fair, sns has some great reps and good supps. Just definitely not this guy.
 
bdcc said:
This is not directed at this situation necessarily, the last couple of posts made me think back to a discussion that went on here a while ago as events unfolded.

A company rep does not change the profile of the products. If a company has great products no rep will alter that and they are still worth buying.

On the other hand, using the phrase "these are only my opinions and do not reflect those of <company>" doesn't mean you don't associate the two. For example, if I was rude or abusive to people on here it is fair to assume it would tarnish their view of the company who chose to let me represent them.

This is why I make a specific point of not engaging in arguments on the board. I personally (I know not everyone agrees with this) that reps are always reflecting their company, whether they are posting their own views or not. They should uphold professionalism.
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You can't just allow your reps to be racist, disrespectful, rude, and arrogant towards the same people that you want to buy your supps though. That is if you still want people to buy them. I support the companies I do because of great products, the reason that I know the products are great are good reps. Reps that won't hesitate to answer your questions, and that don't call you "dumbass" or "kid." Reps that are respectful and informative, that care about the customer. These are the supplement companies that stick out to me and make me want to use their products, thus validating the reps and the job they have done. I also will not support a company that allows a forum member who repeatedly acts this way to represent them it's ridiculous. Why attach the SNS name to someone who will act in such an unprofessional and rude manner, when you are trying to sell them to the same people that you allow your rep to put down as you sit idly by while this happens over and over?
 
Subbed
 
cswalczakny said:
To be fair, sns has some great reps and good supps. Just definitely not this guy.
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People have to look at it from the whole perspective not just a small fraction of the equation. SNS still has the same excellent quality products and many good reps. I think most of us can pick out reps that we don't care for with many companies. I won't condone what he did because I think it was brash and unprofessional. Now let's compare this same scenario to a similar concept. Many of us have our sport teams that we love to watch and cheer for. I love the Steelers and think Rothlesburger is a very good QB, but as a person I think he's trash. I still watch the Steeler games and hope they win, but I'll never buy a number 7 jersey and support him but will go to the games and thus support the organization that I like. At the same token, there are amazing players like Polomalu who plays with complete intensity but is always respectful of other teams and has good sportsmanship. Like them or not, they are all part of the same team.
 
kingjameskjf said:
People have to look at it from the whole perspective not just a small fraction of the equation. SNS still has the same excellent quality products and many good reps. I think most of us can pick out reps that we don't care for with many companies. I won't condone what he did because I think it was brash and unprofessional. Now let's compare this same scenario to a similar concept. Many of us have our sport teams that we love to watch and cheer for. I love the Steelers and think Rothlesburger is a very good QB, but as a person I think he's trash. I still watch the Steeler games and hope they win, but I'll never buy a number 7 jersey and support him but will go to the games and thus support the organization that I like. At the same token, there are amazing players like Polomalu who plays with complete intensity but is always respectful of other teams and has good sportsmanship. Like them or not, they are all part of the same team.
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Yup
 
kingjameskjf said:
People have to look at it from the whole perspective not just a small fraction of the equation. SNS still has the same excellent quality products and many good reps. I think most of us can pick out reps that we don't care for with many companies. I won't condone what he did because I think it was brash and unprofessional. Now let's compare this same scenario to a similar concept. Many of us have our sport teams that we love to watch and cheer for. I love the Steelers and think Rothlesburger is a very good QB, but as a person I think he's trash. I still watch the Steeler games and hope they win, but I'll never buy a number 7 jersey and support him but will go to the games and thus support the organization that I like. At the same token, there are amazing players like Polomalu who plays with complete intensity but is always respectful of other teams and has good sportsmanship. Like them or not, they are all part of the same team.
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Just playing devils advocate here.

Its one thing to use the team mate analogy. It makes perfect sense, however big Ben helps his team win. Does someone who consistently bashes others help the sns team win? Look at what happened to players like Terell Owens... They weren't helping Ther teams win but still had huge mouths... They got axed. So I guess it makes u wonder why sns would keep someone "detrimental to the team" "employed"

Celorza has never said anything negative toward me, and in fact I feel bad speaking out regarding someone who has actually helped me and shown me genuine concern. I am simply facilitating further conversation from a neutral view point. I have read some of his satements and agree that he crosses the line far too often when it's come to others on this board.
 
kingjameskjf said:
People have to look at it from the whole perspective not just a small fraction of the equation. SNS still has the same excellent quality products and many good reps. I think most of us can pick out reps that we don't care for with many companies. I won't condone what he did because I think it was brash and unprofessional. Now let's compare this same scenario to a similar concept. Many of us have our sport teams that we love to watch and cheer for. I love the Steelers and think Rothlesburger is a very good QB, but as a person I think he's trash. I still watch the Steeler games and hope they win, but I'll never buy a number 7 jersey and support him but will go to the games and thus support the organization that I like. At the same token, there are amazing players like Polomalu who plays with complete intensity but is always respectful of other teams and has good sportsmanship. Like them or not, they are all part of the same team.
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I have nothing but respect for you James and many other SNS Reps as there are a lot, and some that I don't even know. But the problem with ur analogy is that football is a game about performance. The Steelers have Rothlesburger because he is the best guy they could get for the job, despite what kind of person he is. His job isn't customer service and product education, it's throwing the ball. But when your job on the team is to teach people how a product can help them, or explain the proper way to implement it into a supplement regimen, and you behave in this manner you aren't getting it done. Now in that regard if Rothlesburger went out and wasn't getting his job done he would no longer be a member of the team.
 
chedapalooza said:
Just playing devils advocate here.Its one thing to use the team mate analogy. It makes perfect sense, however big Ben helps his team win. Does someone who consistently bashes others help the sns team win? Look at what happened to players like Terell Owens... They weren't helping Ther teams win but still had huge mouths... They got axed. So I guess it makes u wonder why sns would keep someone "detrimental to the team" "employed"Celorza has never said anything negative toward me, and in fact I feel bad speaking out regarding someone who has actually helped me and shown me genuine concern. I am simply facilitating further conversation from a neutral view point. I have read some of his satements and agree that he crosses the line far too often when it's come to others on this board.
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Randoja said:
I have nothing but respect for you James and many other SNS Reps as there are a lot, and some that I don't even know. But the problem with ur analogy is that football is a game about performance. The Steelers have Rothlesburger because he is the best guy they could get for the job, despite what kind of person he is. His job isn't customer service and product education, it's throwing the ball. But when your job on the team is to teach people how a product can help them, or explain the proper way to implement it into a supplement regimen, and you behave in this manner you aren't getting it done. Now in that regard if Rothlesburger went out and wasn't getting his job done he would no longer be a member of the team.
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I must disagree. It is the same concept without nitpicking details. Are not supplements performance based? If a product doesn't work whatsoever and the whole company is the same then they will not last long. To be part of the team you must contribute something to it. Celly's contribution is something that he would have to defend, not me but is it not subjective? I've seen people say that he's helped them and I've seen people say he's pissed them off and detracted from the goal of delivering helpful product information (arguably the rep's most important function). Again, what he did in that thread and in some other areas I will not support and balk at the idea of it being attached to me be mere association with SNS. I don't know why celly is part of the team, that is not a dig at him, but just that I cannot argue for him, as it is not my place and he has acted unprofessionally. However, I do know the owner and a few of the people who help run the company and I know them to be standup people that I can respect. Therefore, my perspective on SNS is not only what I think about their products, but what I think about those who run it, and not on being pacified by every moving part.
 
More Valdezes, Less Celorzas.
 
kingjameskjf said:
I must disagree. It is the same concept without nitpicking details. Are not supplements performance based? If a product doesn't work whatsoever and the whole company is the same then they will not last long. To be part of the team you must contribute something to it. Celly's contribution is something that he would have to defend, not me but is it not subjective? I've seen people say that he's helped them and I've seen people say he's pissed them off and detracted from the goal of delivering helpful product information (arguably the rep's most important function). Again, what he did in that thread and in some other areas I will not support and balk at the idea of it being attached to me be mere association with SNS. I don't know why celly is part of the team, that is not a dig at him, but just that I cannot argue for him, as it is not my place and he has acted unprofessionally. However, I do know the owner and a few of the people who help run the company and I know them to be standup people that I can respect. Therefore, my perspective on SNS is not only what I think about their products, but what I think about those who run it, and not on being pacified by every moving part.
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Bottom line you are going to gain customers with our without him. However with him you will lose them at least from this community. Defend him all you want... I like you James its sad that someones lack of responsibility puts you in these positions.
 
R3ACTION said:
Bottom line you are going to gain customers with our without him. However with him you will lose them at least from this community. Defend him all you want... I like you James its sad that someones lack of responsibility puts you in these positions.
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I agree. I admire you James for defending a member of your team intelligently and with maturity. Obvious class act is obvious. This type of presence and demeanor is what I would want in a rep if I had a company.
 
R3ACTION said:
Bottom line you are going to gain customers with our without him. However with him you will lose them at least from this community. Defend him all you want... I like you James its sad that someones lack of responsibility puts you in these positions.
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Randoja said:
I agree. I admire you James for defending a member of your team intelligently and with maturity. Obvious class act is obvious. This type of presence and demeanor is what I would want in a rep if I had a company.
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I guess the point I'm trying to make is that I understand that his actions will detract from the image we try to present of SNS. I understand that some of his posts are degrading and even harmful to what I believe SNS's goals ultimately are, but I don't have the right to claim this, being just a rep myself. I can only offer what I know and that I try to uphold a greater name for SNS. I agree that his comments will and have pushed some people away and the only thing I want to say is to try and look past one wayward rep to our team as a whole. I think we offer much more good then otherwise and have some great people who try hard to help others and much better reps then me. I must say that it is refreshing to have good and intelligent conversation here unlike I've often seen on certain other boards, just generally speaking.
 
kingjameskjf said:
I guess the point I'm trying to make is that I understand that his actions will detract from the image we try to present of SNS. I understand that some of his posts are degrading and even harmful to what I believe SNS's goals ultimately are, but I don't have the right to claim this, being just a rep myself. I can only offer what I know and that I try to uphold a greater name for SNS. I agree that his comments will and have pushed some people away and the only thing I want to say is to try and look past one wayward rep to our team as a whole. I think we offer much more good then otherwise and have some great people who try hard to help others and much better reps then me. I must say that it is refreshing to have good and intelligent conversation here unlike I've often seen on certain other boards, just generally speaking.
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Very well put..2nd best comment on here so far lol
 
cswalczakny said:
Wow. It just keeps getting worse. I thought we were supposed to learn teach lead here. Sure I'll mess with people a little sometimes if they post something all out uninformed but always try to point them in the right direction and NEVER call people "retard" that word makes me a whole different kind of pissed.

Just flaming people and pretending you're king sh!t because you have 8,000,000 post on a forum is kinda sad.

Edit: just so there's no mistake I'm obviously talking about cel, not you Punjab! Lol
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I kno bud...you're a good guy!! :)
 
kingjameskjf said:
I guess the point I'm trying to make is that I understand that his actions will detract from the image we try to present of SNS. I understand that some of his posts are degrading and even harmful to what I believe SNS's goals ultimately are, but I don't have the right to claim this, being just a rep myself. I can only offer what I know and that I try to uphold a greater name for SNS. I agree that his comments will and have pushed some people away and the only thing I want to say is to try and look past one wayward rep to our team as a whole. I think we offer much more good then otherwise and have some great people who try hard to help others and much better reps then me. I must say that it is refreshing to have good and intelligent conversation here unlike I've often seen on certain other boards, just generally speaking.
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Much respect for you and the company James. You are a great contribution to the team. I agree with Piston more Deezy! Hopefully the situation gets resolved. This thread wasn't about SNS and should have stayed that way.
 
Classic cult leader mentality: become the leader of a group of people (Avengers thread). Amass power and influence (rep points / post with RecoverBros). Turn on / abandon that group when they outlive their usefulness (high 6 digit rep). Get protection and intimidation (he rides on Cooper's coat tails regarding supp knowledge and medical terminology; going so far as to sound like him even). Push people around once you amass your power and protection (neg people / report people / ban people).
 
Piston Honda said:
Classic cult leader mentality: become the leader of a group of people (Avengers thread). Amass power and influence (rep points / post with RecoverBros). Turn on / abandon that group when they outlive their usefulness (high 6 digit rep). Get protection and intimidation (he rides on Cooper's coat tails regarding supp knowledge and medical terminology; going so far as to sound like him even). Push people around once you amass your power and protection (neg people / report people / ban people).
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I would like to say that I am part of the Avengers and long ago saw past Celorza. That was when he once negged me for having a convo with another member that he didn't approve of ( Another cult leader point) . I know your post wasn't directed at the subject I have, but I just want to clear it up that the Avengers, atleast the ones I talk to and me, do not support him at all and would appreciate not to be associated with him.
 
chedapalooza said:
Just playing devils advocate here.

Its one thing to use the team mate analogy. It makes perfect sense, however big Ben helps his team win. Does someone who consistently bashes others help the sns team win? Look at what happened to players like Terell Owens... They weren't helping Ther teams win but still had huge mouths... They got axed. So I guess it makes u wonder why sns would keep someone "detrimental to the team" "employed"

Celorza has never said anything negative toward me, and in fact I feel bad speaking out regarding someone who has actually helped me and shown me genuine concern. I am simply facilitating further conversation from a neutral view point. I have read some of his satements and agree that he crosses the line far too often when it's come to others on this board.
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I know you're playing devil's advocate, but look at the flip-side ched. I have actually gotten mad at you via PM and even affected in my personal life because I was worried you were doing things that were destructive to your health. I also happen to be an SNS rep, and I genuinely care about your health to the point I used to get worried whenever we exchange PMs. I'm also delighted things are working out btw :D!

I do this, for you and many, many others, because I enjoy helping others. I get no benefit from it besides satisfaction. SNS does not benefit from it. And I am just one of many SNS reps.

If the purchase of SNS products is contingent on the behavior of the reps, then I urge you to look at the whole picture.
 
mr.cooper69 said:
I know you're playing devil's advocate, but look at the flip-side ched. I have actually gotten mad at you via PM and even affected in my personal life because I was worried you were doing things that were destructive to your health. I also happen to be an SNS rep, and I genuinely care about your health to the point I used to get worried whenever we exchange PMs. I'm also delighted things are working out btw :D!

I do this, for you and many, many others, because I enjoy helping others. I get no benefit from it besides satisfaction. SNS does not benefit from it. And I am just one of many SNS reps.

If the purchase of SNS products is contingent on the behavior of the reps, then I urge you to look at the whole picture.
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One bad rep doesn't spoil the bunch. At least not for me.
 
mr.cooper69 said:
I know you're playing devil's advocate, but look at the flip-side ched. I have actually gotten mad at you via PM and even affected in my personal life because I was worried you were doing things that were destructive to your health. I also happen to be an SNS rep, and I genuinely care about your health to the point I used to get worried whenever we exchange PMs. I'm also delighted things are working out btw :D!

I do this, for you and many, many others, because I enjoy helping others. I get no benefit from it besides satisfaction. SNS does not benefit from it. And I am just one of many SNS reps.

If the purchase of SNS products is contingent on the behavior of the reps, then I urge you to look at the whole picture.
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I know that many of us, including myself and also Cam, ask coop a bucketload of not dumb questions per se, but basic and its reassuring that people CARE for others on here.

SNS is a great co. and as a rep it is not a duty to care, and when it hits you harder, you know there is emotions on here and there is ALWAYS HELP.

I'm sure that the negative and derrogative comments have not tarnished SNS's image as they were already super established prior to cel's promotion.

Best way is to let it die, and move on and not post any more threads about these actions and thoughts that have been conveyed and enjoy each others info and help.

Peace.....

-Chris
EBF Rep
Mobile App
 
Bare with me I have had several cups of coffee, its 430pm here I haven't eaten and we are currently deciding whether our sick puppy needs to be to put to sleep or not...

I have abstained from threads such as this due to the fact that it may be seen as negative in nature. I would not want those view points associated with my name or the company I represent.

First, I realize the concerns that each and every one of you have. I am the type of person that once a company has been soured I refuse to shop there. However, that outcome also comes with different events that can change the course of my decision.

Those being: the action to correct the situation, the products (whether worth it or not), the customer service shown by other individuals associated with the company and the overall reputation of the company.

Action taken - suspension - corrective action was taken. Was it harsh enough considering the nature of the comments? Should more have been done? I'm not going to criticize the decisions made by my supervisors.

The products - The products speak for themselves. Can you get those some of those same products from other companies? Of course you can which leads into this...

Customer Service and overall reputation of the company - this is where being a representative "employee" of a company needs to be treated with a certain level of professionalism. Whether disclaimers are inserted or not essentially you are an extension of the company and that view point will obviously make its way back to negatively impacting the company.

This can be spun any way - using sports teams, previous situations whatever. From the perspective of a consumer, to have an employee working for them that speaks poorly to individuals does impact the company no matter how it is spun.

With that being said, I am not speaking negatively on any of the reps I work with. That choice goes back to professionalism and respect for the company I represent and my supervisors.

Each and every one of you have a choice on which company to buy from and I've spoken to a few of you about this already. I hope that you will not let a few negative incidents impact what the others before me have worked hard to build.

As far as I go, if any of you have any questions or need any help I among the other reps are always around. If your faith in the company was lost give myself and the others a chance to make it right. You guys know me with time we can make this right, no problem.

- Valdez
 
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