Building Back Up

GreenMachineX said:
Feeling decent today. PEM is at a minimum consisting of just feeling a little tired. Slept pretty hard, only woke up a few times. I ate about 3500 kcal yesterday, with maybe 1000 of that coming from cheesecake and double stuff Oreos 😆
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Maybe double stuff Oreos is the secret!!
 
GreenMachineX said:
Today's WO:

BB Bench 5x215, 5x225, 5x235, 2x240
Incline Cable Press 12x22 5, 12x27.5, 8x37.5
Cable Upright Row 3 x 12, 12, 12 x 42.5
Overhead Cable Extensions 3 x 12, 8, 8 x 30

5x235 for bench! I may have gotten 3 or 4 of 240, but I lost my nerve and didn't trust that I had the safety bars set correctly. I checked afterward with just the bar and should've been fine. Anxiety creeps in still occasionally. Everything moving up still.
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Just a placeholder so I don't have to find this workout again later 😆
I'll edit this with today's Workout.

Edit:

BB Bench 8x205, 7x210, 6x215, 5x220
Incline Cable Press 2 x 12 x 17.5
Cable Upright Row 12x27.5, 12x32.5, 10x37.5
OH Cable Extension 3 x 10, 10, 9 x 30

I held back a little on bench because I could still feel the close grip bench from Monday, but still was 2-3 RIR on all sets I think. I held a set back on incline cable press for the same reason. Upright row and extension hit failure on last set. Lots of Cable stuff in this workout 😆
 
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Segansational said:
My favorite indulgence road trip/camping snack is still pizza flavored combos.
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Mine might be Buccee's Beaver Nuggets. Its a sweet snack that is both crunchy and still somehow disintegrates in your mouth. It is an amazing indulgence for sure! I showed the link on the picture if anyone wants to order some to try. You can also get them from Amazon and probably directly from the Buccee's site.

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MrKleen73 said:
Mine might be Buccee's Beaver Nuggets. Its a sweet snack that is both crunchy and still somehow disintegrates in your mouth. It is an amazing indulgence for sure! I showed the link on the picture if anyone wants to order some to try. You can also get them from Amazon and probably directly from the Buccee's site.

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Yeah I got to try these on your recommendation on a road trip somewhere with my wife a while back - did not disappoint!
 
Hyde said:
Yeah I got to try these on your recommendation on a road trip somewhere with my wife a while back - did not disappoint!
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The way they just melt in your mouth once you bite into them is just amazing!
 
Back and legs still feeling beat up from Mondays DL amrap, so only did a couple sets of light squats, and an easy set of Assisted pullups and cable row, followed by incline walking on the treadmill. I'm going to have to take it down a notch on the DL amrap if I want to be able to squat and row on time.
 
so I'm not a fan of anything in the mobility or stretching world. it probably has it's place and I'm probably lazy, but maybe you would be a good candidate for something like the supple leopard stuff post squats/deadlifts to see if it alleviates the DOMs and maybe even the PEM.

I will admit that I used to occasionally do yoga once a week when I was both running and lifting very very hard and I think it was a major cure for some of my issues even though as a rule of thumb I hate yoga lol
 
Dustin07 said:
so I'm not a fan of anything in the mobility or stretching world. it probably has it's place and I'm probably lazy, but maybe you would be a good candidate for something like the supple leopard stuff post squats/deadlifts to see if it alleviates the DOMs and maybe even the PEM.

I will admit that I used to occasionally do yoga once a week when I was both running and lifting very very hard and I think it was a major cure for some of my issues even though as a rule of thumb I hate yoga lol
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Yeah, I know there's some stretches I need to do, for example the couch stretch for my quads and hip flexors, but I just hate it lol. On the other hand, I'm pretty sure I just get overreached too easily. I also get bizarre muscle symptoms from this whole b12/folate balance I have to do every day, and sometimes unsure what's actually going on (need more recovery, or nutrient out of balance causing extra muscle pain/fatigue/soreness). I also hate yoga 😆
 
GreenMachineX said:
Yeah, I know there's some stretches I need to do, for example the couch stretch for my quads and hip flexors, but I just hate it lol. On the other hand, I'm pretty sure I just get overreached too easily. I also get bizarre muscle symptoms from this whole b12/folate balance I have to do every day, and sometimes unsure what's actually going on (need more recovery, or nutrient out of balance causing extra muscle pain/fatigue/soreness). I also hate yoga 😆
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Have you experimented with instead of doing amrap just capping at 2-3 reps do that for a few weeks, let’s say 3 and at week 3 you peak and go amrap or up the weight then repeat?
 
akboom87 said:
Have you experimented with instead of doing amrap just capping at 2-3 reps do that for a few weeks, let’s say 3 and at week 3 you peak and go amrap or up the weight then repeat?
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Do you mean still follow the 5/3/1 percentages, but only do the minimum reps per workout instead of amrap?
 
GreenMachineX said:
Do you mean still follow the 5/3/1 percentages, but only do the minimum reps per workout instead of amrap?
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I think he meant leaving 2-3 in the tank on your "AMRAP" sets and then toward the end of your program coming up on the deload add in some actual AMRAPS to finish out the mesocycle.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Do you mean still follow the 5/3/1 percentages, but only do the minimum reps per workout instead of amrap?
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Yes still following the percentages, but when you get to the amrap set don’t go to failure. Or sometimes I’ll just do 3 reps and call it quits to not over tax. But at the end of the cycle I will take it all the way. Running 5/3/1 myself for reference.
Here is something I copied off another site I was reading. Invalid Link Removed
 
akboom87 said:
Yes still following the percentages, but when you get to the amrap set don’t go to failure. Or sometimes I’ll just do 3 reps and call it quits to not over tax. But at the end of the cycle I will take it all the way. Running 5/3/1 myself for reference.
Here is something I copied off another site I was reading. Invalid Link Removed
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Gotcha. Good call. I'll take it back a notch. Thanks.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Yeah, I know there's some stretches I need to do, for example the couch stretch for my quads and hip flexors, but I just hate it lol. On the other hand, I'm pretty sure I just get overreached too easily. I also get bizarre muscle symptoms from this whole b12/folate balance I have to do every day, and sometimes unsure what's actually going on (need more recovery, or nutrient out of balance causing extra muscle pain/fatigue/soreness). I also hate yoga 😆
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I hate it so much that it's the number one reason I don't go to xfit anymore. back in the old days of blood, sweat, and sports bras we would just crush ourselves for 2 hours at the box. now days it's 20 minutes of weird warm up crap I just don't want any part of.

akboom87 said:
Yes still following the percentages, but when you get to the amrap set don’t go to failure. Or sometimes I’ll just do 3 reps and call it quits to not over tax. But at the end of the cycle I will take it all the way. Running 5/3/1 myself for reference.
Here is something I copied off another site I was reading. Invalid Link Removed
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so true.
in the past if I pulled over 400lbs I couldn't even attempt it again for at least 2 weeks if not 3. so I'd cycle every 3rd week to a 405+ variation (conventional or block, etc)
 
GreenMachineX said:
Yeah, I don't know how @Dustin07 fasts for so long and feels fine :(
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Fasting is totally different than low carb. Low carb (vs no carb) makes me feel absolutely horrible. ..

Number one supplement I added to my routine past six months was about 150g+ of additional carbs. I hate low carb so much. Like yoga hate it.
 
Hyde or MrKleen need to explain Grehlin, I don't fully understand it's relationship with food/carbs. I've read contradicting information in that regard, but it seems like once the insulin magic is done and i'm in a fully fasted state, hunger just isn't an issue anymore for me. Also MrKleen talks a lot about mental clarity when fasting.

Oddly enough, I can relate.
Now, if I'm cutting super damn hard and my carbs are down to like a 1/2 cup of jasmine rice at breakfast and lunch, I feel like crap. my brain is foggy, it's horrible.

Vs the last 6 months where it was like 1 cup of jasmine rice at breakfast. 71g of carbs + banana pre workout, and another 1/2 cup to 1 cup of jasmine rice at lunch. mental clarity was on fire.

long story short... lots of carbs, I feel great. zero carbs I feel great. low carb I feel like crap.
 
Ghrelin is supposed to be a “hunger hormone”. It’s an integral part of telling your body it’s time to eat. I’ve never looked into the mechanisms, that would be super interesting. It’ll start going up after eating and of course make you hungry, but it levels off and will actually start going back down. That’s why for most people when fasting, there’s a sort of “hump” to get over before you feel better.

There’s a lot more to it with leptin and such I believe. One of these days, I’d like to do some intensive research on these, but I definitely don’t know much.
 
@Dustin07 Yes, Ghrelin is the hunger hormone and it runs off of your circadian rhythm. So after a few days of breaking your fast around the same time your ghrelin release begins to adjust to your feeding schedule. It will start to be produced just before your normal feeding time once the adjustment occurs. Once you get really metabolically flexible it allows more comfortable and longer fasts as well. However the big thing is that your hunger / ghrelin release is to stimulate hunger and it follows your patterns of feeding and will adjust to new feeding frequencies after a period of them being adhered to.

Leptin is more of a metabolic regulator, and is stored in fats. As fats are burned the leptin levels go down, this is what makes your metabolism slow down a bit as you lose weight. The fastest way to increase leptin and therefore metabolism is via carbohydrate consumption. This is why on lower carb diets you often see carbohydrate refeeds and is the entire premise for diets like Lyle McDonalds Ultimate Diet 2.0 and John Kiefer's Carb Night Solutions diet which is excellent for those who don't want to fast but want some aggressive weight loss. It is also a big part of why they have you go to maintenance cals for a couple of weeks in the middle of a longer weight loss period to reinvigorate the metabolism. You normally refill the calories with carbs if you have been following a normal caloric cut and caloric rebuilding process.
 
If you feel like you are not getting enough energy out of your current calorie & carb intake, and don’t want to raise it due to composition/health goals, try to improve the bang for buck from your food selection.

Choose less processed, more filling, higher fiber & micronutrient options. White fish slide down like nothing, but chicken breast of the same portion takes much longer to eat. Steak takes way longer to digest than ground meat. Whole grains like quinoa, baked potatoes & sweet potatoes, beans, steel-cut oats (much lower GI than any other oat by a huge margin), veggies, mushrooms, greens, & high fiber fruit like oranges and apples go further to keep your energy stable than processed foods, pasta, white rice, bread, and higher sugar fruits. Always choose nuts, avocado, olives over oils when possible.
 
Dustin07 said:
Hyde or MrKleen need to explain Grehlin, I don't fully understand it's relationship with food/carbs. I've read contradicting information in that regard, but it seems like once the insulin magic is done and i'm in a fully fasted state, hunger just isn't an issue anymore for me. Also MrKleen talks a lot about mental clarity when fasting.

Oddly enough, I can relate.
Now, if I'm cutting super damn hard and my carbs are down to like a 1/2 cup of jasmine rice at breakfast and lunch, I feel like crap. my brain is foggy, it's horrible.

Vs the last 6 months where it was like 1 cup of jasmine rice at breakfast. 71g of carbs + banana pre workout, and another 1/2 cup to 1 cup of jasmine rice at lunch. mental clarity was on fire.

long story short... lots of carbs, I feel great. zero carbs I feel great. low carb I feel like crap.
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So really your saying ketosis feels good, and enough carbs to ride the line of ketosis but not in it feels bad...right?
 
GreenMachineX said:
Nice refeed last night at Cheesecake Factory :cool:

Weight: 218.4

Standing OHP 4 x 8, 8, 7, 8 x 130
Neutral Grip Pullup 5, 5, 5, 4
Close Grip Bench 12x95, 10x135, 8x155
BB Shrug 12x95, 10x135, 8x155, 8x165
DB Lateral Raise 3 x 12 x 15's
DB Curl 15x20's
Planks 1 set x 35 seconds

Great workout. Last set taken to failure on everything.
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Weight: 221

Standing OHP 4 x 6, 6, 6, 7 x 135
Pull Up 4, 4, 4, 4
DB Lateral Raise 3 x 10 x 17.5's, 15 x 10's
BB Shrug 12 x 135, 3 x 8 x 155
DB Curls 15 x 17.5's

OHP finally up to 135 for working weights! Lateral Raise and Shrugs moving up nicely also.
 
GreenMachineX said:
So really your saying ketosis feels good, and enough carbs to ride the line of ketosis but not in it feels bad...right?
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I think what you're saying is correct even though I would never attempt a "keto" diet by mainstream definition again. I've done it probably 3-4 times over the years and always felt horrible on it. Brain fog, and greasy. people don't seem to relate to that greasy part but I swear anytime I attempted keto I'd get greasier skin.

Also ketosis via fasting via ketosis via ketogenic diet... the fasting one yeah, I've been enjoying that. I might get some strips and test to see how long it takes for me to get into keto. It's interesting how low carb / eating keto, I found to be much more difficult from a mental capacity stand point than simply not eating at all.
 
Dustin07 said:
That AMRAP 375 is going to be taxing 🤘🤘🤘🤘
I don't even compete anymore yet I visualize all my training sessions days, sometimes weeks in advance. If I were in your shoes on your program and I knew I had a 375 amrap coming up all of my eating, resting, stretching, and planning would be around that lol.
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That 375 amrap is today, but I can't decide if I'm actually going to do it. I have 15 minutes to decide 😆
 
Weight: 219.4

Close Grip Bench 4 x 7, 7, 6, 6 x 165
Deadlift 1's Week 1x295, 1x335, 3x375
Inverted Row 3, 3
Reverse Cable Fly 3 x 10 x 4
Incline DB Curl 3 x 12 x 20's
Plank 1 x 30 seconds

20 minute walk, 3mph at 5.0 incline.

Definitely could've hit 4 or maybe even 5 on that DL amrap, but did the right thing and held back. Didn't feel right though 😆 Otherwise, last set failure on CG Bench but took it super slow and easy on Inverted row because my lats don't feel right from Saturday's pull up session. Pulled back on reverse cable fly also because I've noticed I'm "heaving/throwing" the weights back too much and really want to make sure the rear delts are working. My planks are a joke.
 
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Nice session, hopefully PEM is not too bad tomorrow. Tweak, Observe, tweak again until we figure out the best situation for your PEM issues.
 
MrKleen73 said:
Nice session, hopefully PEM is not too bad tomorrow. Tweak, Observe, tweak again until we figure out the best situation for your PEM issues.
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Actually feel decent today. Very mild difficulty sleeping for a workout night. Still woke up way earlier then necessary, by only feeling very mild fatigue today...none of the garbage PEM side effects. Finally in a good mood to take my daughter to the bus stop!

So, yesterday's recipe for today's success was:

-plenty of kcal and carbs (still around maintenance though roughly)
-no b12
-no supplemental magnesium
-only 2 eggs
-keeping DL 1-2 RIR and low overall volume
-no food folate

Going to tweak each of those as I go. Those seem to be the most consistent factors resulting in insomnia, PEM and anxiety.
 
It will be interesting to see if your carb situation is similar to mine.
If I'm able to pull off some more successful fasting, and simultaneously keep carbs up on lifting days then life is good 🤘

I can tell you that my symptoms when low carb are severe enough that my wife even noticed, in fact I think she was the one that pointed out "your carbs have been really low lately", that's when I started making the connection between my own poor mood and exhaustion and low carb.
 
Great to hear you are feeling pretty good today and in a good mood!

You might want to consider some Build and Burn Day type of caloric swing. Lower your calories by whatever you increase them on for training days, or even a little lower so you can easily continue your progress on leaning out with less PEM worries. You could even try IF on those days if you wanted. Not a full day but just a 16/8 type of thing where you wait until noon to eat any calories on non training days. That or just spread out throughout the day. Could be a way to incorporate PEM management with your weight loss goals.
 
Dustin07 said:
It will be interesting to see if your carb situation is similar to mine.
If I'm able to pull off some more successful fasting, and simultaneously keep carbs up on lifting days then life is good 🤘

I can tell you that my symptoms when low carb are severe enough that my wife even noticed, in fact I think she was the one that pointed out "your carbs have been really low lately", that's when I started making the connection between my own poor mood and exhaustion and low carb.
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How low was that? What's your minimum carb intake for mood?
 
MrKleen73 said:
Great to hear you are feeling pretty good today and in a good mood!

You might want to consider some Build and Burn Day type of caloric swing. Lower your calories by whatever you increase them on for training days, or even a little lower so you can easily continue your progress on leaning out with less PEM worries. You could even try IF on those days if you wanted. Not a full day but just a 16/8 type of thing where you wait until noon to eat any calories on non training days. That or just spread out throughout the day. Could be a way to incorporate PEM management with your weight loss goals.
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Yeah, good points. That's kind of what I'm doing now, just not 100%. Guess i need to make more rice lol
 
Dustin07 said:
I really love these pre workout! My wife gets them at Costco for me and I keep them stacked up at work Invalid Link Removed
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Are these like the Uncle Ben's premade rice bags? You can leave them at room temp then nuke them for like 90 seconds and whallah!! I often keep a pack or two at work.
 
Dustin07 said:
Pretty much! I leave them in the cupboard then 60 seconds in the nuke machine, boom 71g of carbs
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Quick response, I added that I keep some of those at work, they are a little more expensive, but I like the Uncle Ben's flavored ones a lot! The Spanish Rice one is really enjoyable.
 
MrKleen73 said:
Quick response, I added that I keep some of those at work, they are a little more expensive, but I like the Uncle Ben's flavored ones a lot! The Spanish Rice one is really enjoyable.
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I might have to give that route a try!
We had picked these up at Costco one day sorta on a whim for the sake of pre-workout and then it just became routine that we'd top off with the same ones. I'm not picky if I can save money and get that extra 50-80g of carbs in preworkout then it's solid! I LOVE lifting carbed up.
 
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