Bobo and anyone else's opinion on Waxy Maize PWO?

glenihan

Registered User
I've been reading a TON lately about using waxy maize immediately after workout then taking whey 20 minutes later .. a lot of people including some very respected trainers and prep guys swear by it

just curious what people have to say about it?

i currently use oats and whey pwo
 
glenihan said:
I've been reading a TON lately about using waxy maize immediately after workout then taking whey 20 minutes later .. a lot of people including some very respected trainers and prep guys swear by it

just curious what people have to say about it?

i currently use oats and whey pwo
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Reposted quote of mine:

Ah, the hope & promise (AND PRICE) of the Swedish high-molecular mass waxy maize derivative called Vitargo. As far as I know, this product has one single solitary study backing it up:

Invalid Link Removed

Notice in the above abstract that a whopping 300g of micronutrient-free Vitargo versus 300g obviously micronutrient-free glucose/glucose polymers was used! The Vitargo had about a 19% faster rate of glycogen resynthesis. Yes, that's a significant difference, but there remains a huge question mark about the real world applicability of the study design. Keep in mind this trial was carried out after glycogen depletion, & as I mentioned earlier, relative glycodepletion will vary among bodybuilding protocols. Last but not least: 300 effin' grams of carbohydrate? Can we get just a little closer to what typical non-triathlete trainees would ingest in the 4 hour period postexercise? I already mentioned that this stuff is expensive for what it actually is. For me personally, I'll literally & figuratively stomach the higher osmolality of other carb sources. If you have money to burn, and don't mind staking your finances on a single study whose reults haven't been replicated, & whose solitary research was more than likely funded by the Swedish manufacturer of Vitargo, then be my guest. I'd like to see some replication of results by some legit researchers who have no ties with the company. If I could get some free Vitargo, I'd yell out my window "Viva Sweden" or something like that.
 
LOL I'm sensing that it may not be cost effective. Damn those swedes to hell. So it's like when muscletech has pictures of the "scientists" doing research in there ads. Are you saying those scientists work work the company so they may be biased? NO way Alan. Your way off brother.:D
 
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1st IKEA, then waxy maize? When will the Swedes draw the line? :D

I just don't see how a single (likely manufacturer-funded) study comparing 300g of postworkout glucose versus 300g of waxy maize starch is applicable outside of ultra-endurance athletes.
 
Pricing

Vitargo is expensive. However there are others selling wazy maize starch. I haven't checked pricing on the said vendor I have in mind but I would have to think it's much less, thus possibly falling reasonable into a cost/effeacy realm. No?
 
It's about $7 per lb. at the only site I found that sells it in bulk. I've used it only post workout for a month or so and have seen good results w/ it.
 
mywetnightmares said:
Where can you get it in bulk?
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It's not from a board sponsor so I don't think it can be posted. Not sure to be honest and don't feel like reading the rules over. But if you Google it I think you'll get to some.
 
glen, i'm a traditional oats and whey guy as well. been using waxy with 20grams of BCAA's PWO for about a week now so it's still too early to tell but i will say this - it's messy as fvck.
 
Beelzebub said:
glen, i'm a traditional oats and whey guy as well. been using waxy with 20grams of BCAA's PWO for about a week now so it's still too early to tell but i will say this - it's messy as fvck.
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Yeah, I second the messy and clumpy as all hell notion. I will say that I feel fuller/harder after and for a good while after my workout.

I typically hit weights:

drink 50-60 grams Waxy Maise Starch
20 grams BCAAS

then do cardio for 30 minutes

then take down about 50 grams WPI

then 45min - hr later, take down a solid meal containing some slow releasing carbs..thing is for me that I have not been able to get to gym till 7-8 pm,so personally not likeing all the carbs that late, but physique still looking good, so....
 
What I do is put 1.5 scoops (traditional size protein scoop) 1 serving of creatine (usually Xpand) and 5 or 10 grams of glutamine.

I think the key difference is I make mine in the Blender Bottle w/ enough water. I never have clumping or mess issues. Try it that way, and I think you'll be fine.
 
it's cost-effective at a certain store that is not a sponsor.

Been saving mine for a while now... until the moment is right.

let me know what you think Glen.
 
Ubiquitous said:
it's cost-effective at a certain store that is not a sponsor.

Been saving mine for a while now... until the moment is right.

let me know what you think Glen.
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That's "TRUE". I thought the price there was reasonable. Plus it's not like you go through it that fast. I bought 5 lbs. and it's lasted me quite a while, taking it strictly post workout.
 
it's not as messy as it was when i started. i dug into it the first day like it was protein powder and the crap stuck to everything like glue. now, i just carry a separate protein shaker with the waxy already mixed up with water ready to go for PWO. the chocolate flavor with splenda is pretty tasty.
 
even my NOW carbo gain clumps like that... it's like marshmellow clumps of sweet sweet heaven in my protein.

So I'll be well adjusted to my wazy maize when the time comes.
 
Tastes like watered down glue too. I didn't notice any huge effect from it when I was training with a certain someone who pushes it. I like my malto/dextrose combo just the same and it's even cheaper. That and it stains the **** out of about anything you wear if you spill it.
 
I've been using WMS for the last 3 weeks and I love this stuff!!! My muscles stay fuller longer and I don't stay sore for 2-3 days after a workout. 50-80G PWO followed 20 mins later by 40-60g whey.

Here's the way you mix it, warm the water up and use one of the little handheld blenders, I have a Braun and it works like a charm. Otherwise, you end up with some nasty a$$ed tasting wallpaper paste with chunks of wax in it.

As for that study, yes, like all of them it was funded by the makers of the product. 300g, WTF? Sounds like a Cell Tech study to me, lol!!

Oh yea, one final thought. DON'T PUT IT IN YOUR CAMELBAC, LOL!! I did this during my 2 long races this year and it ruined the bladder in it. I personally feel that this stuff is the reason I won the second 50 mile race. With regular carb sources I was getting bloated and felt like bloody sh!t, not the case with WMS.
ROB
 
Beelze....when you ordered your WM did you have them throw in the BCAA's to the mix or did you add them yourself seperately?
 
Beelzebub said:
ordered BCAA's separately. they don't mix for sh!t.
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I mixed up Crowler's BCAA's (excell) with my WM and it mixed up just fine. 2 Scoops WM and 2-3 tablespoons of excell and it wasn't that bad.
 
BCAA's, more notably Leucine, are hydrophobic.. won't mix unless you leave to sit and saturate. This was brought up recently in another post.

I wanted to add, I wonder how someone can really guage much of a difference in their gains/improvements between maltodex, WM, or any other post workout carb. Are some people really that tuned into their bodies to notice that? After all, it's just another carb that is assimilated fast.
 
Too late now, I already ordered a mix of 80% WM to 20% BCAA's which amounts to about 69 grams carbs to 18 grams BCAA's.....

I'll let ya know what I think.

-Ryno
 
I love that ****! I take it both pre and post workout and have been having great results with it. I feel fuller and stronger while using it. Definitely much better that malto.
 
NickW said:
I love that ****! I take it both pre and post workout and have been having great results with it. I feel fuller and stronger while using it. Definitely much better that malto.
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good to know.. methinks it's time for me to dip into my stores.
 
glenihan said:
I've been reading a TON lately about using waxy maize immediately after workout then taking whey 20 minutes later .. a lot of people including some very respected trainers and prep guys swear by it

just curious what people have to say about it?

i currently use oats and whey pwo
Click to expand...


Its funny, the more things change, the more they stay the same.

I can find several threads on other forums in wihch people are swearing resuilts using NO carbs post workout. So you have one extreme to another and both sides swear it works.

I think the question I have is, why use this?
 
the only difference i can report so far is that it 'feels' to digest quicker than oats, big break through there, lol.
 
Beelzebub said:
the only difference i can report so far is that it 'feels' to digest quicker than oats, big break through there, lol.
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Well yeah, but so do smarties...

lol


Damn, I want some candy.
 
dude, every grocery store/corner store in the country apparently has BAGS of candy.. I heard Canada has a buttload of Smarties.. it's crazy.. I've never seen anything like it before.. for something called "hallowe'en".. I'm stumped.. but doesn't mean I'm not happy. Bring on this new thing called Hallowe'en I say.. bring it on.
 
traditional with a twist.. cinnamon nut crunch.. I bite down hard at the end.

Backing out of the thread for good. :D
 
I was reading that over at intensemuscle they were going to be doing an experiment w/ WMS using a blood glucose meter to see the blood sugar response.

I'm guessing the reason to use it is that the proposed theory is that you get very rapid movement out of the stomach, but you're SUPPOSED to be able to get this effect w/o the big sugar spike and potential fat gain that comes from malto/dextrose, etc.

I may be wrong, but that's what I gather from it. If that experiment is able to show that this really happens the way they think it does, that would make for a very attractive PWO carb, I think.
 
the experiment already started and is almost done on intensemuscle. each person bought a blood glucose meter w/strips and is taking waxy in different ways - first thing in the morning by itself, PWO by itself, PWO with BCAA's, PWO with BCAA's and CEE, etc. results should be interesting.
 
Ubiquitous said:
dude, every grocery store/corner store in the country apparently has BAGS of candy.. I heard Canada has a buttload of Smarties.. it's crazy.. I've never seen anything like it before.. for something called "hallowe'en".. I'm stumped.. but doesn't mean I'm not happy. Bring on this new thing called Hallowe'en I say.. bring it on.
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Do I smell Ubi's Canadian Invasion?

Man, that could be a movie.


I agree that the cost-effectiveness of this product is simply not enough to sway me away from methods which I know beyond a doubt are effective in my current application of them.
 
nightfly71 said:
I was reading that over at intensemuscle they were going to be doing an experiment w/ WMS using a blood glucose meter to see the blood sugar response.

I'm guessing the reason to use it is that the proposed theory is that you get very rapid movement out of the stomach, but you're SUPPOSED to be able to get this effect w/o the big sugar spike and potential fat gain that comes from malto/dextrose, etc.

I may be wrong, but that's what I gather from it. If that experiment is able to show that this really happens the way they think it does, that would make for a very attractive PWO carb, I think.
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And this would benefit you how?

The same arguement goes for just about every insulin mimicker.
 
Beelzebub said:
the experiment already started and is almost done on intensemuscle. each person bought a blood glucose meter w/strips and is taking waxy in different ways - first thing in the morning by itself, PWO by itself, PWO with BCAA's, PWO with BCAA's and CEE, etc. results should be interesting.
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Why?
 
thanks for everyone's input!

Bobo i agree with you ... i'm not sure all this mumbo-jumbo amounts to anything (you can be sure because you know a hell of a lot more than i do ... so i'll just take your word for it) and while i greatly respect a lot of you that are getting good results from this (especially my BFFs Ubi and beelze) i'm not sure the results in terms of long-term gains are going to be any different

i've gotten great gains from my oats and whey and why fix what ain't broken?
 
It's more better sugar, man. If you're not using the latest sugar, you're just not hip enough to hang at BB.com. Oh wait, where AM I again?
 
waxy maize?

corn starch?

Discuss :)



CROWLER
 
glenihan said:
thanks for everyone's input!

Bobo i agree with you ... i'm not sure all this mumbo-jumbo amounts to anything (you can be sure because you know a hell of a lot more than i do ... so i'll just take your word for it) and while i greatly respect a lot of you that are getting good results from this (especially my BFFs Ubi and beelze) i'm not sure the results in terms of long-term gains are going to be any different

i've gotten great gains from my oats and whey and why fix what ain't broken?
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I just remember them saying the same thing about Maltodextrin. Its faster, quicker and its a complex carb.

We know how that went.

I just don't understand why they used glucose meters when the fundamental question remains, where does it go? Faster absortion doens't mean increased skeletal muscle uptake and glycogen synthesis is not proportional to protein synthesis.
 
MethylSugar is the next big thing.. I invented it.. but it's just a segue for my Robotic Vagina machines... which will soon be in stores near you!

MethylSugar is a trademark of UbiCorp Enterprises.

Robotic Vagina is trademark of UbiSex Enterprises, a subsidiary of UbiCorp Enterprises.

I'm going to start cross promoting with Crowler. He's good with these types of things.
 
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