Best Daily Multivitamin
- Thread starter liftbig74
- Start date
SilentBob187
Well-known member
Controlled Labs - Orange Triad
snagency
Banned
snagency
Banned
great one as well, super pak is just a little more potent, complete.
i use ultra 4 when i'm just in maintainence mode.
CONTROLLED LABS
PROnom 23.... NOM NOM NOM
yeah, great value and you get all of the following in the same bottle:
multivitamin
joint supplement
digestion and immune aids
MuscleGuyinNY
Banned
I've tried GNC's Mega Men's Sport multi, which I like. I like the fact that the tabs are chocolate-flavored, but you have to take it twice per day and it's quite pricey.
One-A-Day Men's Formula is good, too. I've taken this for a couple of years now.
I've thought about giving the MVP/ZMK stack and Orange Triad a try.
One-A-Day Men's Formula is good, too. I've taken this for a couple of years now.
I've thought about giving the MVP/ZMK stack and Orange Triad a try.
snagency
Banned
dude, 6(!!!) tabs to get me a meager 350mg vitamin C, 200(!!)iu vitamin E, some worthless glucosamine & haluronic acid is NOT what i want to get in a multi.
check the bev profile. now THAT'S what i want in a multi.
6 tabs anything, let alone to get insufficient amounts of the basic necessities, is not "great value" imo.
now, just so you don't go away mad, i will give you guys props for purple wraath...
CONTROLLED LABS
PROnom 23.... NOM NOM NOM
thanks for you opinion, but more is not always better when it comes to these (extra vitamin c and e can be added dirt cheap if you so desire). you may think some ingredients are worthless, but you obviously dont need a joint supp then
snagency
Banned
thanks for you opinion, but more is not always better when it comes to these (extra vitamin c and e can be added dirt cheap if you so desire). you may think some ingredients are worthless, but you obviously dont need a joint supp then
you're sidestepping the issue CL.
1st of all, needing more C & E is my opinion, yes. i kinda LIKE these ALL IMPORTANT antioxidants. i believe hard training bb'ers need as much as they can get, and i personally like a min. 1g vit C/E daily. and i believe if you are a smoker (which 75% of bb'ers seem to be) you would probably help offset those negative side effects somewhat w/ 2g vitamin C min. daily, and even more @ 4g a day.
not recommending here you guys go out & slam a bunch of C and think you can smoke like a freight train, just think it would be beneficial if you do smoke.
and don't rebut me w/ "but large amounts of vit C have been shown to increase hardening of the arteries" either - these studies have been done by the same people who back the RDA's recomendation of intake (60mg - yikes!!!), which is just fine i guess if you're a couch potato. everything we take causes hardening of the arteries anyway; it's a byproduct of life.
2nd - there's not just more of those 2 things in the Bev product, there's more of EVERYTHING! it's more potent, more complete, PERIOD. the thread question was what's the best; there's a reason Bev makes this super potency.
and lastly, no i have no joint issues, but i know a LOT of guys who do, and they've all tried the glucosamine/haluronic therapy, and almost ALL of them have said they've noticed NO relief; the handful that say it's helped are mega-dosing (MUCH more than in triad) & combining w/ ibuprofen -- probably seeing results from the ibu imo.
if you want something for joint issues, i recommend cissus btw...
the whole idea of "all-in-one" products just kill me; just another marketing ploy to up the cost because "this & this" are included in it, and not many people read to see the amounts of these ingredients that are in the product or are informed enough to know the true amount that they require for said purpose.
arjun4
Member
taking 1g of any isolated tocopherol isomer is asking for heart disease
im planning on doing a little writeup about vitamins since there is SO MUCH confusion here about them...
as far as that beverly vitamin... its garbage. i love beverly but that vitamin is formulated HORRIBLY
theres 25,000iu of retinol.. 5,000iu is enough to increase the risk of bone fracture/cause bone density issues.
theres 200iu of isolated alpha tocopherol... megadosing single tocopherol isomers displaces the other tocopherols in cells and creates an unbalanced proportions of alpha to other. this is correlated strongly to heart disease.
theres almost a gram of calcium. most bodybuilders take in more than enough calcium to begin with and shouldnt be supplementing calcium unless they know their not gettinge nough
magnesium oxide is poorly absorbed and suspected to contribute to free radical production
theres is 30mg of iron.. men should *NEVER* supplement with iron unless anemia has been confirmed through blood tests. the idea that 'bodybuilders need more iron' to the extent that they need to supplement it is simply not true and is dangerous.
etc etc etc etc
snagency
Banned
excessive vit E causes heart disease...
please do let me see the write-up for that one, love to see where you pulled that one from (prob. that same study where vit C causes hardening of arteries)...
magnesium in an essential mineral...
super pak contains 18mg iron, not 30 (100% of RDA btw)...
calcium is meets my dietary needs because i am lactose intolerant & do not do dairy products...
i always love to learn; if you have some reputable info on nutrition since everyone is so "misinformed" please by all means, share away.
arjun4
Member
the vitC hardening arteries thing is bull****... just so you know.
vitamin E is actually a 'blanket' for 8 separate isomers. 4 tocopherols and 4 tocotrienols.
supplemeing large amount of any single isomer will displace the other isomers in the cells. the gamma isomer occurs in the largest amount in common food... alpha tends to displace gamma. displacing gamma leads to increas risk of heart disease
read this article, and look up the referenced studies on pubmed
Invalid Link Removed
Invalid Link Removed
Invalid Link Removed
more research abstracts:
Invalid Link Removed
magnesium is essential, but what it is bonded to is equally as important. MgO is formed between an ionic bond between magnesium and one oxygen atom. when the body cleaves this, it releases Mg & O... its the O that causes the trouble.
not to mention MgO is very poorly absorbed to begin with. its very cheap, and thats why companies put it in their products.
glycinate is the best absorbed form of magnesium to my knowledge... aspartate, orotate & citrate behind that.
according to the beverly website both their multi tablet & packs contain 30mg of iron per serving.
regardless of the amount, men should NEVER supplement iron. you get more than enough iron from the meat you eat...
just as an example.. im a vegetarian. i dont supplement iron and i make no special attempt to get extra iron in my diet, and my iron levels are perfect (confirmed through bloodwork). the abolity of the male body to hold on to iron is extraordinary and supplementing extra iron can be DANGEROUS.
not to mention that combing iron w/ calcium & zinc just shows a blatant lack of understanding mineral absorbtion. iron (if needed) should always be taken separately because it will interfere with the absorbtion of the other minerals & less of BOTH end up getting abrorbed.
snagency
Banned
yes, i know about the vit C/artery thing, ridiculous, but there are still those that spout that nonsense. :nono:
first of all, let me say that you appear to be very thorough in your research, i give you props for that. i applaud your effort; always nice to see someone else's (rational) point of view on things.
however, let me also state that if you want people to really pay attention to what you say, you can't list as the first thing in your arguement an article that is for the promotion of a supplement product. if i'm a company trying to push my product, then of course i'm going to utilize any study that even vaguely helps my cause. once again, the amazing power of the industry to mislead...
one thing i feel the company is not clarifying in the study at points (where they just say "vit E") is possibly leaving out the fact that they used dl-alpha (synthetic, which is crap & poorly absorbed by the body) in these comparisons; one can never tell w/ advertising hype. companies quote what will help their cause...
i personally have supplemented for over 15 yrs. now @ a minimum of 800 iu d-alpha E daily, more often than not above 1g, and during heavy training/dieting i've been at 1500 or more. that's non-stop for 15+ yrs. man, with no issues. my blood pressure is fine. no prostate probs. no alzheimer's (i don't think anyway... can't remember, jk). haven't been sick in 2+ yrs. now, despite the worst outbreaks of flu in the U.S. (inc. my kids & wife multiple times) over the last 2 winters. not bragging, just feel i'm doing something right here...
i will give credit for the company putting COQ10 in their formula tho, as i am a huge fan of this & supplement w/ 400mg following w/o.
as to the magnesium, you make a good point here. all of the colloidal mineral forms out there (which is the best way to straight-supplement these elements imo) do contain mag, albeit in lesser amounts, and can't really argue to the MgO produced in bonding point you make. that is beyond my realm, and i'll take your word for it...
i do believe the iron issue is over-rated; no, men should not actively seek out additional supplementation of this mineral you are right, but 18mg (yes it is 18, i'm looking at the product right in front of me, and you can verify this on dpsnutrition.net as well as bb.com sites) is a harmless amount, even if you are eating 6 meals daily of red meat -- which i have also done from time to time on a beef & grapefruit diet. you cannot produce any study that contradicts this amount to be safe, period.
i cannot argue the issue of iron/calcium/zinc absorption issues either, as again that is out of my realm.
what i can say is that i will continue to use super pak when heavy training/contest dieting, as i wholeheartedly believe that beverly is right on the money as far as dietary nutrition considerations are concerned. they've been doing this for 40 yrs., and the pros from yesteryear as well as today continue to use these items for their own nutritional needs. this works for me in my situation; the ultra-4 works for me during less stressfull situations (maintainence). i'll alternate the super pak w/ universal animal paks throughout my pre-contest prep, because altho i like the bev profile a bit more, i like the idea of splitting equal amounts of nutrients strategically thru day on certain training days...
we can dissect the finer points of nutrition all day long, bottom line is preference i guess.
let's agree to disagree...
thanks for the info.
arjun4
Member
while i agree with that in general, i used the AOR website for 2 reason... 1) AOR is the single most science backed supplement company in the world. period. the company is run by & the products formulated by scientists. they are at the fore-front of supplement science... 2) the real reason i used that link is rather than me post 20 pubmed studies, they have a compounded list of abstracts...its just easier to read that way.
read the abstracts, most of the give specific chemical compositions of the tocopherol isomers used.
then you are putting yourself at risk... despite the 'perceived' lack of detriment. do the the research, read the science... you'll see im right. you could just as easily use a balanced tocopherol product and get the same benefits, and eliminate the risk... a lot of companies make them now.
read up on ubiquinol.. you could cut your coq10 dose by 1/4 and get higher blood levels.
wrong.
Invalid Link Removed
Mild iron deficiency has been hypothesised to reduce risk of heart disease risk,1 while a high concentration of body iron has been suggested as a risk factor for myocardial infarction
Sullivan JL. The iron paradigm of ischaemic heart disease. Am Heart J 1989;117:1177-88. [Medline]
Salonen JT, Nyyssönen K, Korpela H, Tuomilehto J, Seppänen R, Salonen R. High stored iron levels are associated with excess risk of myocardial infarction in eastern Finnish men. Circulation 1992;86:803-11.
Salonen JT. Is there a continuing need for longitudinal epidemiologic research?–the Kuopio ischaemic heart disease risk factor study. Ann Clin Res 1988;20:46-50. [Medline]
Salonen JT. The role of iron as a cardiovascular risk factor. Curr Opin Lipidology 1993;4:277-82.
Salonen JT. Body iron stores, lipid peroxidation and coronary heart disease. In: Hallberg L, Asp N-G, eds. Iron nutrition in health and disease. London: John Libbey, 1996: 293-301.
Invalid Link Removed
Invalid Link Removed
Invalid Link Removed
i could go on, but i'll stop.
there have been more advances in human dietetics in the past 10 years than there have been in the past 100... just cos someones been around for a long time, doesnt mean they stay up to date on what science is teaching us TODAY.
word
snagency
Banned
word
you have to tell me how to do that quoting format like that - i'm diggin it.
arjun4
Member
arjun4
Member
decent stuff... vitamin E thing is still an issue but its better than 99% of the other stuff out there.
AOR makes a powder thats more balanced.
warbird01
Well-known member
Have you seen the studies about how 1g+ of vit C can decrease streangth levels?
ill try to dig it up
arjun4
Member
i'de be willing to bed that has a lot to do with timing...
you dont wanna decrease free radical production immediately before or after lifting...
freakabe
New member
So is 500mg of Vit C a day OKAY???
Also, I think I'm gonna get hit by many forummers, but I just love Animal Pak!!! Just my personal experience!:nutkick:
arjun4
Member
yea 500-1000mg is perfect, i just wouldnt take it directly before or after you lift.
animal pack is such garbage, i really dont understand why everyone likes it so much... i could pick that apart even worse than the beverly multi
ALUISLUGO
New member
So besides AOR what else do you recommend?
snagency
Banned
snagency
Banned
yes bird, please dig that one up.
you're telling me that i can actually increase my 365 max. bench if i decrease my C intake level?
and i word this carefully, because i don't wish to come across boastful here at all; i am just stating facts: but how many guys can bench 2x their bodyweight? i weigh 182...
so show me this info, really, because i'd really like to know how i'm hurting my strength gains here...
snagency
Banned
no hit here buddy...
arjun4
Member
depends on the product, just a straight multivitamin?
AOR ortho-core or multi basics (generally accepted as the best)
mhp activite
pioneer 1+
LEF
NOW adam is decent
dr. weil or invite packs (same thing)
some of the NSI synergy range
too much E, not enough folic acid for the amount of other B's, WAYYYyy too much calcium, enough b6 to cause nerve damage (PAK is b6 but not listed as b6), too much choline
yada yada
mooch2321
Well-known member
can someone explain the benefits of taking CoQ10 post workout as opposed to any other time of the day? I thought that in addition to cardio health this also acts as an antioxidant. So following this line of reasoning that Vit c is not good to take pre or post workout, wouldnt CoQ10 be counterproductive as well?
johnyq
Active member
I recently started taking aor ortho*core. Its really a toss up between that, LEF, and MST MVP36/ZMK.
I went with orthocore because the vitamin E mix had tocotrienols, and it contains the well studied amount of Chlorophyllin, AND coq10. Pretty ridiculous stack IMO, good value.
I went with orthocore because the vitamin E mix had tocotrienols, and it contains the well studied amount of Chlorophyllin, AND coq10. Pretty ridiculous stack IMO, good value.
warbird01
Well-known member
No prob.
Just found it. Actually it was a mens health article
I just remember skimming over it a couple months back but didint see the Means health, lol
my bad
good thread: Invalid Link Removed
snagency
Banned
No prob.
Just found it. Actually it was a mens health article
I just remember skimming over it a couple months back but didint see the Means health, lol
my bad
good thread: Invalid Link Removed
no man, we should all adhere to the mens health recommendations, stuff's great info to live by... :rofl:
that was a good thread you referred me to. found interesting the mention of high levels of iron usage interacting w/ high dose C - now that makes perfect sense to me.
interesting topic, and i'll concede the issue. i'll also continue to do what i'm doing, cuz it works for me...
didn't mean to snipe man, my test levels are elevated. :aargh:
berlin
New member
Super Nutrition Opti-Paks?
bigrobbierob
Active member
Subbing because I'm interested in the write up.
Count me as a confused one...specifically confused in how you cant take certain vitamins together because they hinder each other, yet other need to be taked to increase absorbtion, and they often contradict each other.
Example (even though I may be in error, its been awhile since I read this): Zinc is taken with Magnesium because Magnesium aids in Zinc absorbtion. Calcium aids in Magnesium absorbtion, yet inhibits Zinc absortion.
See why it makes my head hurt? And it seems like a lot of vitamins work or don't work like that.
Eagerly waiting for the write up!
alphaIII
New member
arjun4
Member
Invalid Link Removed for anything AOR related... i know the guy that owns/runs it, hes a good guy and his service & pricing are top notch.
i havent had any time to do that writeup yet, its been a busy semester... but if anyone has questions, feel free to PM me.
the MV i use is alpha-base by orthomolecular products, its one of the best on the market imo and a cheaper alternative to ortho-core. i dose it at 4caps a day.
Invalid Link Removed
i havent had any time to do that writeup yet, its been a busy semester... but if anyone has questions, feel free to PM me.
the MV i use is alpha-base by orthomolecular products, its one of the best on the market imo and a cheaper alternative to ortho-core. i dose it at 4caps a day.
Invalid Link Removed
terminator
Member
I like Pure Essence Lab's Longevity Multi for Men.
It has the Co-enzymated B complex vitamins, all of mother natures vitamin E (tocopherols and tocotrienols),whole food Vitamin C, which gives you more than just the plain anti-oxidant benefits of ascorbic acid; it also provides the bioflavinoids and other co-factors of vitamin C from nature, ionic minerals, plus super foods like spirulina, wheat grass juice, etc.
It has the Co-enzymated B complex vitamins, all of mother natures vitamin E (tocopherols and tocotrienols),whole food Vitamin C, which gives you more than just the plain anti-oxidant benefits of ascorbic acid; it also provides the bioflavinoids and other co-factors of vitamin C from nature, ionic minerals, plus super foods like spirulina, wheat grass juice, etc.
lutherblsstt
Guest
I have been using Rainbow Light's Men's One,which was recommended to me by an herbalist a few years back.
This guy behind it is an herbalist lnamed Chrisopher Hobbs.
Supplement Facts
Serving Size: 1 Tablet
Amount Per Serving % Daily Value
Vitamin A (as 50 % Beta-Carotene, 50 % Palmitate) 5,000 Iu 100 %
Vitamin C (as Ascorbic Acid) 120 mg 200 %
Vitamin D (as D3 Cholecalciferol) 800 IU 200 %
Vitamin E (as d-alpha Tocopheryl Succinate) 100 IU 333 %
Vitamin K (as Phytonadione) 100 mcg 125 %
Thiamin (Vitamin B-1) 25 mg 1667 %
Riboflavin (Vitamin B-2) 25 mg 1471 %
Niacin (as Niacinamide) 25 mg 125 %
Vitamin B-6 (as Pyridoxine HCI) 25 mg 1250 %
Folic Acid 800 mcg 200 %
Vitamin B-12 (as cyanocobalamin) 25 mcg 417 %
Biotin 150 mcg 50 %
Pantothenic Acid (Vitamin B-5) 25 mg 250 %
Calcium (as Carbonate) 50 mg 5 %
Magnesium (as Oxide) 25 mg 6 %
Zinc (as Citrate) 20 mg 133 %
Selenium (as Selenomethionine, Amino Acid Chelate) 200 mcg 286 %
Copper (as Amino Acid Chelate) 2 mg 100 %
Manganese (as Citrate) 2 mg 100 %
Chromium (as Amino Nicotinate) 200 mcg 167 %
Molybdenum (as Amino Acid Chelate) 75 mcg 100 %
Choline (as Bitartrate) 20 mg *
Inositol 20 mg *
Citrus Bioflavonoids 25 mg *
Men's Strengthening Blend (equivalent to 150 mg food and herbal powder) Saw Palmetto [berry] 2:1 Extract, Organic Spirulina 100 mg *
Lycopene (from Tomato narural) 1,000 mg *
4:1 Vegetable Juice Complex (equivalent to 40 mg of vegetable powder) Kale, Spinach, Dandelion Greens, Beet 10 mg *
Complete Digestive Support
Protease 664 HUT *
Amylase 226 DU *
Lipase 2 LU *
Cellulase 3 CU *
Lactobacillus Sporogenes 25,000,000 CFU *
Betaine HCI 10 mg *
* Daily Value (DV) not established.
Natural mineral or vegetable source cellulose, stearic acid (vegetable), magnesium stearate, modified cellulose, silica. Coating: vegetable food glaze. Contains soy lecithin in vegetable glaze.
Guarantee: 100% natural - free of artificial colors, flavors, sweeteners, preservatives and other objectionable additives often found in vitamin products Contains no sugar, lactose, wheat, gluten or yeast.
This guy behind it is an herbalist lnamed Chrisopher Hobbs.
Supplement Facts
Serving Size: 1 Tablet
Amount Per Serving % Daily Value
Vitamin A (as 50 % Beta-Carotene, 50 % Palmitate) 5,000 Iu 100 %
Vitamin C (as Ascorbic Acid) 120 mg 200 %
Vitamin D (as D3 Cholecalciferol) 800 IU 200 %
Vitamin E (as d-alpha Tocopheryl Succinate) 100 IU 333 %
Vitamin K (as Phytonadione) 100 mcg 125 %
Thiamin (Vitamin B-1) 25 mg 1667 %
Riboflavin (Vitamin B-2) 25 mg 1471 %
Niacin (as Niacinamide) 25 mg 125 %
Vitamin B-6 (as Pyridoxine HCI) 25 mg 1250 %
Folic Acid 800 mcg 200 %
Vitamin B-12 (as cyanocobalamin) 25 mcg 417 %
Biotin 150 mcg 50 %
Pantothenic Acid (Vitamin B-5) 25 mg 250 %
Calcium (as Carbonate) 50 mg 5 %
Magnesium (as Oxide) 25 mg 6 %
Zinc (as Citrate) 20 mg 133 %
Selenium (as Selenomethionine, Amino Acid Chelate) 200 mcg 286 %
Copper (as Amino Acid Chelate) 2 mg 100 %
Manganese (as Citrate) 2 mg 100 %
Chromium (as Amino Nicotinate) 200 mcg 167 %
Molybdenum (as Amino Acid Chelate) 75 mcg 100 %
Choline (as Bitartrate) 20 mg *
Inositol 20 mg *
Citrus Bioflavonoids 25 mg *
Men's Strengthening Blend (equivalent to 150 mg food and herbal powder) Saw Palmetto [berry] 2:1 Extract, Organic Spirulina 100 mg *
Lycopene (from Tomato narural) 1,000 mg *
4:1 Vegetable Juice Complex (equivalent to 40 mg of vegetable powder) Kale, Spinach, Dandelion Greens, Beet 10 mg *
Complete Digestive Support
Protease 664 HUT *
Amylase 226 DU *
Lipase 2 LU *
Cellulase 3 CU *
Lactobacillus Sporogenes 25,000,000 CFU *
Betaine HCI 10 mg *
* Daily Value (DV) not established.
Natural mineral or vegetable source cellulose, stearic acid (vegetable), magnesium stearate, modified cellulose, silica. Coating: vegetable food glaze. Contains soy lecithin in vegetable glaze.
Guarantee: 100% natural - free of artificial colors, flavors, sweeteners, preservatives and other objectionable additives often found in vitamin products Contains no sugar, lactose, wheat, gluten or yeast.
briancogs888
New member
Do you know where these multis come from and if their potency levels are tested? You say 100% natural, but is it 100% organic?