Ask Me Anything AAS/PH/PCT Related

[Mrbolt84]

I'm Currently cursing on test e 250/week. Going to stay on for another 16 weeks.
I have a huge supply of mast e....how long do you recommend running the mast for??..I've heard mast isn't sufficient for long term use so I was planning on adding it in around week 6-16....so 10 weeks total on mast.

 

[fdigioia99]

I'm Currently cursing on test e 250/week. Going to stay on for another 16 weeks.
I have a huge supply of mast e....how long do you recommend running the mast for??..I've heard mast isn't sufficient for long term use so I was planning on adding it in around week 6-16....so 10 weeks total on mast.

What do you mean by not sufficient enough?? Referring masteron

 

[LordGunz]

You still sound the same

Thanks for putting me down. I was just trying to learn thought tgia forum was for help I apologize

 

[Mrbolt84]

What do you mean by not sufficient enough?? Referring masteron

I've had multiple fiends tell me the gains/benefits come to a stop around week 10. Running it longer is just a waste of gear.
This is just what I have heard from a few personal close friends. I have no experience with mast

 

[fdigioia99]

Yeah could be brother everyone reacts differently.

 

[brofessorx]

I've had multiple fiends tell me the gains/benefits come to a stop around week 10. Running it longer is just a waste of gear.
This is just what I have heard from a few personal close friends. I have no experience with mast

Gains from all steroids stop after 6-8 weeks. In order to continue gaining you'll have to increase the dosage of steroids you are using with this will come an increase in side effects.

 

[Danes]

Gains from all steroids stop after 6-8 weeks. In order to continue gaining you'll have to increase the dosage of steroids you are using with this will come an increase in side effects.

I wouldnt say gains stop after 6-8 weeks but it will definitely be "weaker" than first 4-8 weeks due to adaption to the compound.
An anabolic steroid will still stimulate MPS even after 8-12 weeks and stimulating MPS = hypertrophy/gains.

But I do agree its better to take break after 8 weeks than continue due to sides +++

 

[brofessorx]

That's just what the research on steroids have shown, it's also what experts in the field like Patrick Arnold will tell you.
Also from my personal experience, but that doesn't count for much.

 

[Danes]

That's just what the research on steroids have shown, it's also what experts in the field like Patrick Arnold will tell you.
Also from my personal experience, but that doesn't count for much.

Your personal experience is more worth than anything

 

[Cgkone]

Regarding masteron e..
Does anybody get too hard from it.
2 weeks in I felt like I got hurt twice because the mast made me too hard maybe

 

[pyrobatt]

I wouldnt say gains stop after 6-8 weeks but it will definitely be "weaker" than first 4-8 weeks due to adaption to the compound.
An anabolic steroid will still stimulate MPS even after 8-12 weeks and stimulating MPS = hypertrophy/gains.

But I do agree its better to take break after 8 weeks than continue due to sides +++

I'm a huge fan of 16+ week cycles for more keepable gainz. Especially test. Pick a dose and stick with it. The last 8 you should be focusing on peaking strenght wise so that you can go into a deload or lower percentage in pct.

Alot of the time people assume more is better especially in the fitness lifestyle ( look at citruline dosing) but that is not always the case.

Run something 16+ (for new nucli to mature ) gh or more likely mk677 through the cycle and past the pct ( to raise the igf1 ceiling to hold on to mass after pct)also note injectable igf1 doesn't work by its self due to the satellite cell issue so don't waste money.

 

[Cgkone]

I'm a huge fan of 16+ week cycles for more keepable gainz. Especially test. Pick a dose and stick with it. The last 8 you should be focusing on peaking strenght wise so that you can go into a deload or lower percentage in pct.

Alot of the time people assume more is better especially in the fitness lifestyle ( look at citruline dosing) but that is not always the case.

Run something 16+ (for new nucli to mature ) gh or more likely mk677 through the cycle and past the pct ( to raise the igf1 ceiling to hold on to mass after pct)also note injectable igf1 doesn't work by its self due to the satellite cell issue so don't waste money.

I go long also.
With power lifting 16+ is almost mandatory.
I don't think peaking equates to body building.
Usually by the end of a bodybuilding cycle that is 16 weeks These guys are so dry that they are struggling with basic lifts.

 

[BamBam0319]

Gains from all steroids stop after 6-8 weeks. In order to continue gaining you'll have to increase the dosage of steroids you are using with this will come an increase in side effects.

Including EQ? Lol

 

[Cgkone]

Including EQ? Lol

Deca?

 

[BamBam0319]

Deca?

EQ is not deca
I would say deca is better suited for longer cycles, though, like EQ.
If that's what you're trying to ask.

 

[Cgkone]

EQ is not deca

I know
I meant deca obviously needs to ran longer than 8 weeks

 

[pyrobatt]

I go long also.
With power lifting 16+ is almost mandatory.
I don't think peaking equates to body building.
Usually by the end of a bodybuilding cycle that is 16 weeks These guys are so dry that they are struggling with basic lifts.

Peaking comes with every structured program. Are you talking about the templates going around with a bunch of exercises and rep schemes? That's not a structured program.

Advanced trainees almost always need to go into structured programing once they get past 4 or 5 years of strict dedication. Including "bodybuilders"

Usually playing around with different rep schemes, tempo and weight every day, week or per training block.


George the pro maker even has kai peak.

 

[Cgkone]

Peaking comes with every structured program. Are you talking about the templates going around with a bunch of exercises and rep schemes? That's not a structured program.

Advanced trainees almost always need to go into structured programing once they get past 4 or 5 years of strict dedication. Including "bodybuilders"

Usually playing around with different rep schemes, tempo and weight every day, week or per training block.


George the pro maker even has kai peak.

Right
DUP and what not
But if your super dry 6% body fat
There is no way your stronger than you were at 12%
And of course a template isn't a structured program
You can get a structured program from a
Template.......that's what they are for.

 

[Cgkone]

Peaking comes with every structured program. Are you talking about the templates going around with a bunch of exercises and rep schemes? That's not a structured program.

Advanced trainees almost always need to go into structured programing once they get past 4 or 5 years of strict dedication. Including "bodybuilders"

Usually playing around with different rep schemes, tempo and weight every day, week or per training block.


George the pro maker even has kai peak.

My point was( no way disrespect intended) not all people can peak the last 8 weeks of a 16 week cycle.
Body builders are at there weaker before they go onstage.
Now with strength athletes 100% agree to the fullest
I'm on week 8 Now of hypertrophy tissue building phase.
Now we will be blastingg off into a ramping up strength building phase.
We are changing reps and weights daily.
Kinda like one of those high tech structured programs haha
It's all good homie. Next Time I see one of these body builders 2 weeks out from a show I'll be sure and tell them the should be stronger than they were when they were 30lbs heavier

Peaking comes with every structured program. Are you talking about the templates going around with a bunch of exercises and rep schemes? That's not a structured program.

Advanced trainees almost always need to go into structured programing once they get past 4 or 5 years of strict dedication. Including "bodybuilders"

Usually playing around with different rep schemes, tempo and weight every day, week or per training block.


George the pro maker even has kai peak.

 

[Mikelopez]

I plan to run ment (trestolone) as my second cycle, my first was dymethazine and no zero side effects. I plan on using tr3st by Olympic labs 25mg in morning and in afternoon. Anything over 50 a day doesn't seem worth it Not sure how long to run it for yet maybe 4-6 weeks (or 4 weeks on 4 weeks off then repeat, it's an 8 week supply at 50 mgs I believe) with k1ngs guard by Olympic labs as my on cycle therapy followed by k1ngs blood pct. also have sr9009 and rad 140 was thinking Taking with pct. would also be taking fish oil cla createin whey casein bcaa pre and post workout powders any advice?

 

[brofessorx]

Including EQ? Lol

Deca?

EQ is not deca
I would say deca is better suited for longer cycles, though, like EQ.
If that's what you're trying to ask.

I know
I meant deca obviously needs to ran longer than 8 weeks

You guys are talking esters. This has to be taken into account.
You aren't fully "on" until a few weeks into those longer esters.
The fact still remains the same. 6-8 weeks then results slow or stop. Then something will need to change. Giving that rest, diet and training are all on point, one will need to increase the amount of hormone in order to continue seeing progress.

Pat,

It seems most people recommend running test cycles for the standard 12 weeks + as opposed to 8-10 weeks...what benefits does running 12+ weeks provide compared to say 8-10? I think I saw somewhere that you said gains level off after about 8 weeks. Does 12+ weeks help solidify the gains?

I dont think its gonna do anything more at that point then delay the crash

**

I think it would be more likely to solidify the HTPA shutdown as opposed to the gains

**

Is keeping cycle length less merely to aide in HPTA recovery or is there another reason? Also, why do gains seem to stall after so many weeks?

**

the answer to your first question is that exogenous hormones can have negative side effects other than HPTA suppression

the answer to your second question is because you can only grow up until the point where some limiting factor is going to put a halt to it. There could be many limiting factors. Obviously we cant take steroids and gain 8 pounds every two weeks indefinitely. And this is does not necessarily have to do with insensitivity to androgens. If that were going on then one would expect to lose weight after a while instead of maintaining their gains during the rest of the cycle

**

Would hepatoxicity be one of these factors in the case of PHs (just making sure I understand you)?



Is this why blasting and cruising works? You're letting other factors recover while cruising and then eventually blasting to make another gain.

**

the answer to your first question is yes

the answer to your other question is no. apparently you failed to fully understand what i said

**

I believe this is where my reply was short sighted. What types of limiting factors are we talking about here? Metabolic, genetic? Or am I totally off the ball on this one?

**

metabolic, which ultimately is a consequence of your genes of course. these limits are built into your physiology so no amount of blasting or cruising is gonna matter. the only thing you could do is try to address them via some sort of pharmacological intervention i suppose, but you would have to know what you are addressing to begin with

myostatin inhibitors are interesting because they seem to disable the brakes on a whole slew of physiological processes involved in the limitation of muscle growth, some of which may be responsible for the plateau of growth seen after several weeks of AAS use

**

a better way to look at this is to realize that your muscles are a dynamic tissue - with its amino acids always being broken down for energy as well as always being built up via anabolic processes. how large they get is a function of where this balance lies. diet, training, and drugs can all affect this set point.

So adding anabolic steroids will simply reset your muscles to a different balance of anabolic and catabolic processes, leading to a new baseline of muscle mass.

**

That makes sense. So, even though you're resetting the baseline, has there been any research showing that the baseline has a genetic ceiling? I ask because there is always the debate as to whether a bodybuilder is so big because he's taking XYZ drugs. While that may be true to an extent and using the baseline context, is it fair to say that the bodybuilder is able to obtain a higher baseline because he is genetically able to?

**

everything regarding your physiological potential is determined by your genes.

**

Pat,

So if you were on TRT (therefore HTPA recovery is not a concern) and wanted to obtain maximum muscle mass, would you cycle using 8-10 week cycles and then wait an equal amount of time, check blood work (assuming everything is ok), and cycle again?

**

as opposed to what?

**

As opposed to longer 12+ week cycles? This way you can cycle more times per year and hopefully put on more muscle. If gains slow/stop after approximately 8-10 weeks and continuing with the cycle doesn't help keep the gains...then why not stop, give your receptors and body a break, and then cycle again? If this is the best approach, why does it seem everyone advocates for longer cycles, like the standard 12+ weeks.

**

Why continue with a cycle past 8-10 weeks if the gains have stopped? What benefit is there to continue?

**

if you want to put on the most muscle (and dont care about the downsides) then stay on cycle year around. thats what most of the pros do.

**

the benefit is that you will stay at that level. and by manipulating other aspects of your program with diet, training, or different kinds of drugs you can still coax yourself to slowly keep gaining even

by stopping you will lose a good part of your gains and then when you cycle again you pretty much will just end up at the same sticking point. You will have lost a few months where you could have gained a little more

thats why the pros dont go off.

with that said, its a very unhealthy thing to do

 

[Brandinooooo]

I plan to run ment (trestolone) as my second cycle, my first was dymethazine and no zero side effects. I plan on using tr3st by Olympic labs 25mg in morning and in afternoon. Anything over 50 a day doesn't seem worth it Not sure how long to run it for yet maybe 4-6 weeks (or 4 weeks on 4 weeks off then repeat, it's an 8 week supply at 50 mgs I believe) with k1ngs guard by Olympic labs as my on cycle therapy followed by k1ngs blood pct. also have sr9009 and rad 140 was thinking Taking with pct. would also be taking fish oil cla createin whey casein bcaa pre and post workout powders any advice?

You'll have to dose the Oral Trest 3x a day. Anything above 50 per day doesn't seem worth it? That's like saying there is no point in going over 250 of test a week.

Plus, with an all oral cycle, you'll need a pharma ai.

Do not take SARMs during pct. They are suppressive and will cancel the pct.

You really need to research Trest and those sarms before proceeding. Trest is very different from DMZ. Whole different ball park.

 

[Woody]

Yeah it didn't sound right to me at all, the no SERM business. Thanks again for the insight man. I'll be getting blood work done (first time) right after my move! In early July. Or whej would it be best? Right after PCT or wait a couple of weeks??

Stores can't legally recommend someone take a prescription drug for an off-label purpose.

 

[pyrobatt]

My point was( no way disrespect intended) not all people can peak the last 8 weeks of a 16 week cycle.
Body builders are at there weaker before they go onstage.
Now with strength athletes 100% agree to the fullest
I'm on week 8 Now of hypertrophy tissue building phase.
Now we will be blastingg off into a ramping up strength building phase.
We are changing reps and weights daily.
Kinda like one of those high tech structured programs haha
It's all good homie. Next Time I see one of these body builders 2 weeks out from a show I'll be sure and tell them the should be stronger than they were when they were 30lbs heavier

I never said they would be stronger. You can peak easily with percentages, resets and rpe while sub 9%.

 

[Cgkone]

I never said they would be stronger. You can peak easily with percentages, resets and rpe while sub 9%.

You said the last 8 was for strength peaking.
I was just reminding you body builders don't end stronger....usually bulk to cut.
When your smaller your weaker.

 

[pyrobatt]

You said the last 8 was for strength peaking.
I was just reminding you body builders don't end stronger....usually bulk to cut.
When your smaller your weaker.

Peaking for strenght based off of percentages, resets and rpe is doable. I'm not talking about prs... who would risk that pre contest?

I'm talking about doing something similar to...

50% (starting point)
65% ( increasing weights decreasing reps)
75% (look above)
85 to 90% (depending on how you feel)
75 ( back off from peak)
75 (stay here )
65% (back off concentrate on tempo)
50% (deload, reps , pre contest pump work if applicable)
(PCT or reset)

Calculate your new 1rm in a calc on your 85 to 90% and base your % off of the theoretical 1rm.

 

[Mikelopez]

You'll have to dose the Oral Trest 3x a day. Anything above 50 per day doesn't seem worth it? That's like saying there is no point in going over 250 of test a week.

Plus, with an all oral cycle, you'll need a pharma ai.

Do not take SARMs during pct. They are suppressive and will cancel the pct.

You really need to research Trest and those sarms before proceeding. Trest is very different from DMZ. Whole different ball park.

Yea I plan on taking an AI and thanks for the sarm info. I only said 50 because of what I've seen and read people tried more and went back to 50 due to side effects given that was injection so 3 times oral doesn't seem bad. I tend to be more conservative Ive been doing research everyday and won't start until I have everything and fully ready. I've ready some people say they use sarms during pct but i am not now thanks to you Any other tips and advice

 

[Cgkone]

Peaking for strenght based off of percentages, resets and rpe is doable. I'm not talking about prs... who would risk that pre contest?

I'm talking about doing something similar to...

50% (starting point)
65% ( increasing weights decreasing reps)
75% (look above)
85 to 90% (depending on how you feel)
75 ( back off from peak)
75 (stay here )
65% (back off concentrate on tempo)
50% (deload, reps , pre contest pump work if applicable)
(PCT or reset)

Calculate your new 1rm in a calc on your 85 to 90% and base your % off of the theoretical 1rm.

That's what powerlifters do for sure

 

[Cgkone]

Peaking for strenght based off of percentages, resets and rpe is doable. I'm not talking about prs... who would risk that pre contest?

I'm talking about doing something similar to...

50% (starting point)
65% ( increasing weights decreasing reps)
75% (look above)
85 to 90% (depending on how you feel)
75 ( back off from peak)
75 (stay here )
65% (back off concentrate on tempo)
50% (deload, reps , pre contest pump work if applicable)
(PCT or reset)

Calculate your new 1rm in a calc on your 85 to 90% and base your % off of the theoretical 1rm.

That's light years away from a hypertrophy program

 

[Cgkone]

Peaking for strenght based off of percentages, resets and rpe is doable. I'm not talking about prs... who would risk that pre contest?

I'm talking about doing something similar to...

50% (starting point)
65% ( increasing weights decreasing reps)
75% (look above)
85 to 90% (depending on how you feel)
75 ( back off from peak)
75 (stay here )
65% (back off concentrate on tempo)
50% (deload, reps , pre contest pump work if applicable)
(PCT or reset)

Calculate your new 1rm in a calc on your 85 to 90% and base your % off of the theoretical 1rm.

And since bodybuilder s don't care about their one rep max or a percentage of a one-rep Max none of that applies

 

[Cgkone]

Peaking for strenght based off of percentages, resets and rpe is doable. I'm not talking about prs... who would risk that pre contest?

I'm talking about doing something similar to...

50% (starting point)
65% ( increasing weights decreasing reps)
75% (look above)
85 to 90% (depending on how you feel)
75 ( back off from peak)
75 (stay here )
65% (back off concentrate on tempo)
50% (deload, reps , pre contest pump work if applicable)
(PCT or reset)

Calculate your new 1rm in a calc on your 85 to 90% and base your % off of the theoretical 1rm.

Also I recommend undulating a little more than that program ask for

 

[Brandinooooo]

Yea I plan on taking an AI and thanks for the sarm info. I only said 50 because of what I've seen and read people tried more and went back to 50 due to side effects given that was injection so 3 times oral doesn't seem bad. I tend to be more conservative Ive been doing research everyday and won't start until I have everything and fully ready. I've ready some people say they use sarms during pct but i am not now thanks to you Any other tips and advice

No, you will have to dose the Oral 3x per day. Its half life is very short. Oral dose is higher than injectable as well. Not a while lot but higher.

 

[Mikelopez]

No, you will have to dose the Oral 3x per day. Its half life is very short. Oral dose is higher than injectable as well. Not a while lot but higher.

I understand 3 times a day lol, so I'd be taking 75 mg a day. 25 morning noon and dinner. Do you recommend any particular AI? I was going to get eradicate by black stone labs but not 100 percent sure about them yet. I've heard mix reviews

 

[Brandinooooo]

I understand 3 times a day lol, so I'd be taking 75 mg a day. 25 morning noon and dinner. Do you recommend any particular AI? I was going to get eradicate by black stone labs but not 100 percent sure about them yet. I've heard mix reviews

An otc ai won't work. You need a pharma ai. Aromasin or Arimidex.

 

[Woody]

I understand 3 times a day lol, so I'd be taking 75 mg a day. 25 morning noon and dinner. Do you recommend any particular AI? I was going to get eradicate by black stone labs but not 100 percent sure about them yet. I've heard mix reviews

Exemestane or Adex. Nothing OTC.

 

[mike33511]

Mikelopez

I think you will find a cycle of just oral trest to be underwhelming, to say the least. I would do 150mg a day with each dose 3 hours apart. Or stack it with the TD version.

 

[Mikelopez]

An otc ai won't work. You need a pharma ai. Aromasin or Arimidex.

you recommend AI during cycle? Some people wait if sides show but I read that's absurd

 

[Mikelopez]

Mikelopez

I think you will find a cycle of just oral trest to be underwhelming, to say the least. I would do 150mg a day with each dose 3 hours apart. Or stack it with the TD version.

I still have sr and rad140 what do u think about stacking them with it instead?

 

[Brandinooooo]

you recommend AI during cycle? Some people wait if sides show but I read that's absurd

Dude, oral Trest will have your nipples hurting in the first week. Stack it with transdermal. Do 50mg transdermal each day with the 50mg oral preworkout. Its awesome as a pre.

Mikelopez

I think you will find a cycle of just oral trest to be underwhelming, to say the least. I would do 150mg a day with each dose 3 hours apart. Or stack it with the TD version.

And it would be a pain dosing so much. 150 is pretty high for a first time. Id say 100.

 

[Mikelopez]

Dude, oral Trest will have your nipples hurting in the first week. Stack it with transdermal. Do 50mg transdermal each day with the 50mg oral preworkout. Its awesome as a pre.


And it would be a pain dosing so much. 150 is pretty high for a first time. Id say 100.

If it's 50 pre oral and 50 td it's just twice a day? Or 50 pre then 25 td 2 times after Also if I take it pre would u not recommend using it with an actual pre

 

[Brandinooooo]

If it's 50 pre oral and 50 td it's just twice a day? Or 50 pre then 25 td 2 times after Also if I take it pre would u not recommend using it with an actual pre

You would dose 25 td in the morning and 25 td at night. Then oral dose about 40 minutes before the gym. You could take it with a pre but you would have to pay close attention to your blood pressure. Start with half a scoop and work your way up.

 

[Mikelopez]

You would dose 25 td in the morning and 25 td at night. Then oral dose about 40 minutes before the gym. You could take it with a pre but you would have to pay close attention to your blood pressure. Start with half a scoop and work your way up.

With the AI and on cycle support?

 

[Brandinooooo]

With the AI and on cycle support?

Yes you still have to run cycle support and an ai.

 

[Mikelopez]

Yes you still have to run cycle support and an ai.

Weeks 1-4...clomid at 50mg per day
Weeks 1-2...nolvadex at 40mg per day
Weeks 2-4...nolva at 20mg per day

How's that for my pct? If I run ment for 4 weeks

 

[Mikelopez]

Weeks 1-4...clomid at 50mg per day
Weeks 1-2...nolvadex at 40mg per day
Weeks 2-4...nolva at 20mg per day

How's that for my pct? If I run ment for 4 weeks

With a post cycle support as well

 

[Woody]

Weeks 1-4...clomid at 50mg per day
Weeks 1-2...nolvadex at 40mg per day
Weeks 2-4...nolva at 20mg per day

How's that for my pct? If I run ment for 4 weeks

If by ment you mean Trest, I would extend that to 8-10 weeks.

PCT I'd do a lower but longer dose of Clomid. Nolva at 20/20/10/10.

 

[franks009]

Speaking of taking a pwo with a pwo dose of oral trest.. im on my 3rd week of LGD and on week 6 adding TD and oral trest til week 12. Anyone have experience usin a hardcore pwo like meso wit oral trest 50mg or would that be too risky on bp

 

[Woody]

Speaking of taking a pwo with a pwo dose of oral trest.. im on my 3rd week of LGD and on week 6 adding TD and oral trest til week 12. Anyone have experience usin a hardcore pwo like meso wit oral trest 50mg or would that be too risky on bp

I would monitor your BP. Are you using Meso with LGD - if so, how is your BP? If you haven't started Meso, I would start with a low dose and monitor BP and increase from there.

 

[Mikelopez]

If by ment you mean Trest, I would extend that to 8-10 weeks.

PCT I'd do a lower but longer dose of Clomid. Nolva at 20/20/10/10.

Would I be running nolva at 20mg throughout the cycle as well?

 

[Woody]

Would I be running nolva at 20mg throughout the cycle as well?

Nope. If you run it during cycle, run it 5-10 mg.