Anabolic Window Myth

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Borashi

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So I used to be the gym bro that would drink a pwo, intra, post workout shake. Then I read about the anabolic window is up to 24 hrs after you lift, so now I'll do a pwo shake, an amino acid shake intra workout, my thinking being the amino acids will open my body up for protein synthesis, then I'll eat a high protein high fat meal within 2 hrs after lifting. Do you feel their is an anabolic window? I just would rather get my protein from meat vs a shake.
 
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jameschoi

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NUTRITION: While following this program, consume one pound of protein per gram of body weight. Also, I highly recommend consuming 40 grams of simple carbs during your workout and 40 to 100 more grams post-workout, along with 30 to 50 grams of a high-quality whey protein. As for the rest of your diet, split up your calories between carbs and fats however you like, but the goal is to gain two pounds per week.

https://www.muscleandfitness.com/workouts/workout-routines/mass-building-program-look-bigger-three-weeks
 
AntM1564

AntM1564

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So I used to be the gym bro that would drink a pwo, intra, post workout shake. Then I read about the anabolic window is up to 24 hrs after you lift, so now I'll do a pwo shake, an amino acid shake intra workout, my thinking being the amino acids will open my body up for protein synthesis, then I'll eat a high protein high fat meal within 2 hrs after lifting. Do you feel their is an anabolic window? I just would rather get my protein from meat vs a shake.
Muscle protein synthesis is elevated for 48 hours or so after training. You do not need anything intra if your pre workout nutrition is spot on. Post workout, eat or drink what you like. I would make sure to get some carbs in post workout though.
 
BarryScott

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NUTRITION: While following this program, consume one pound of protein per gram of body weight
So a 200lbs guy should be eating 10,000lbs of protein a day, eh?
 
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Jstrong20

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Just get the calories you need in. Doesn’t matter when. I eat all calories in a two hour window usually and works the same as when I ate six times a day.
 
Godstrength

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So a 200lbs guy should be eating 10,000lbs of protein a day, eh?
Lol its his wording ... Comsume 1 lb of protein per gram of body weight...

He meant consume 1 gram of protein per lb. I think lol otherwise yeah 10,000 gram of protein haha
 
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I hear all the time it doesn't matter "when" during the day it is when you get your calories, but I know I have better workouts if I have a couple of meals in me before I hit the weights, vs. fasting for 6-7 hours before the gym then eating after. Not just feeling better, but stronger (more weight and or more reps compared to the prior workout). Sometimes Bro science just works? Placebo effect? I don't know.
 
Chados

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I hear all the time it doesn't matter "when" during the day it is when you get your calories, but I know I have better workouts if I have a couple of meals in me before I hit the weights, vs. fasting for 6-7 hours before the gym then eating after. Not just feeling better, but stronger (more weight and or more reps compared to the prior workout). Sometimes Bro science just works? Placebo effect? I don't know.
No it definitely matter, especially what types of food. You don't wanna have a pizza at night
 
jrock645

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No it definitely matter, especially what types of food. You don't wanna have a pizza at night
Why not at night? Thought kiefer said garbage carbs like that should be eaten at night as part of CBL.
 
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ValiantThor08

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Why not at night? Thought kiefer said garbage carbs like that should be eaten at night as part of CBL.
This.. Simple carbs before bed. Dont eat directly before, or directly after a workout.
 
muscleupcrohn

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This.. Simple carbs before bed. Dont eat directly before, or directly after a workout.
It’s fine to eat after a workout... both studies and decades of anecdotal evidence support this. Hell, studies have shown that consuming EAAs and carbs DURING workouts can increase lean body mass and not lead to fat gain.
 
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ValiantThor08

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It’s fine to eat after a workout... both studies and decades of anecdotal evidence support this. Hell, studies have shown that consuming EAAs and carbs DURING workouts can increase lean body mass and not lead to fat gain.
One can eat after a workout, but it is optimal to wait a couple hours after. From what I have read, listened to, and experienced, it is more optimal. There is no extra benefit to eat immediately after a workout. We apparantly have differing philosophies. I used to worry about getting something in me directly after a workout. I used to eat a different way. Now that I eat fewer meals, and eat about a couple hours after a workout, I have experienced better growth.
 
muscleupcrohn

muscleupcrohn

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One can eat after a workout, but it is optimal to wait a couple hours after. From what I have read, listened to, and experienced, it is more optimal. There is no extra benefit to eat immediately after a workout. We apparantly have differing philosophies. I used to worry about getting something in me directly after a workout. I used to eat a different way. Now that I eat fewer meals, and eat about a couple hours after a workout, I have experienced better growth.
No extra benefit doesn’t mean suboptimal... you don’t have to eat immediately after, but it isn’t detrimental to do so. You do what works for you, but science is on my side in both threads we are discussing similar topics in.
 
muscleupcrohn

muscleupcrohn

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Science^^
Literally nothing he cited said that consuming protein immediately post-workout is suboptimal, only that it isn’t necessary, and you can get the same results eating later after your workout. I don’t think you know the difference between “not more beneficial” and “suboptimal” man.
 
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ValiantThor08

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Literally nothing he cited said that consuming protein immediately post-workout is suboptimal, only that it isn’t necessary, and you can get the same results eating later after your workout. I don’t think you know the difference between “not more beneficial” and “suboptimal” man.
Could of sworn I read it somewhere. I'll look around. Study more. If I dont find anything, I concede.
 
Bagofturdwind

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Could of sworn I read it somewhere. I'll look around. Study more. If I dont find anything, I concede.
In that carb backloading YouTube video he literally says he eats very ripe bananas and a protein shake immediately post-workout. Then follows up with something like an entire pizza 30 min after that.
 
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ValiantThor08

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In that carb backloading YouTube video he literally says he eats very ripe bananas and a protein shake immediately post-workout. Then follows up with something like an entire pizza 30 min after that.
I dont agree with his timing. But I do agree with the evening simple carb timing.
 
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ValiantThor08

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And in reality, if one consumes enough protein, and enough calories, timing is not a huge deal, keto, or non keto is not a huge deal. What is sustainable to someone is where it is at.
 
Chados

Chados

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Why not at night? Thought kiefer said garbage carbs like that should be eaten at night as part of CBL.
You don't wanna spike bloodsugar when you're sleeping. The reason to time meals is to keep bloodsugar stable during the day. Its also not smart to eat right before bed, maybe 1-2 hours before so you're body doesn't have to work to digest when it should be focusing on sleeping.

I'm not saying carbs at night won't help to build muscle cause as far as building muscle you can eat whatever whenever, but do you want to add fat and then have to lose weight to cut and arguably lose muscle at the same time?. Not worth it.
 
Bagofturdwind

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You don't wanna spike bloodsugar when you're sleeping. The reason to time meals is to keep bloodsugar stable during the day. Its also not smart to eat right before bed, maybe 1-2 hours before so you're body doesn't have to work to digest when it should be focusing on sleeping.

I'm not saying carbs at night won't help to build muscle cause as far as building muscle you can eat whatever whenever, but do you want to add fat and then have to lose weight to cut and arguably lose muscle at the same time?. Not worth it.
I mean yes, that’s the thinking of the past. Whether that still holds true or not is the question. I’m not saying the 2 limited studies we have on carb back-loading are golden, but we need do further research and not just adhere to potential broscience going forward.
 
The Solution

The Solution

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So I used to be the gym bro that would drink a pwo, intra, post workout shake. Then I read about the anabolic window is up to 24 hrs after you lift, so now I'll do a pwo shake, an amino acid shake intra workout, my thinking being the amino acids will open my body up for protein synthesis, then I'll eat a high protein high fat meal within 2 hrs after lifting. Do you feel their is an anabolic window? I just would rather get my protein from meat vs a shake.

Eat a meal or drink a shake. I personally eat a meal because I love to eat.

Good Powerpoint on why here:
https://www.slideshare.net/.../optimal-protein-intake-and...

You want to aim to acquire 3g of leucine per meal that contains at (Optimal amount to stimulate MPS). If you constantly are spiking MPS and not allowing it to reach refractory stages it does less benefit from a MPS (Muscle Protein Synthesis) Standpoint.

P-Ratio and MPS May be skewed if you are "Enhanced", but that is a different ballgame. for the most a good rule of thumb is below from Alan A. and Brad S.
Cliffs:

When are Carbs and Protein VERY Important Post-workout?

Carbs:
- During leg Training + HIIT Cardio or doing a 2-3 hour intense workout session
Protein:
-Resistance Training in a fasted state (no meal consumed at least 3-4 hours prior)

When are Carbs and Protein of lesser importance Post-workout?

Carbs:
- 1-2 hour training session after a pre-workout meal (Small or mixed 2-3 hours prior to session)
Protein:
- Training after a meal composed of 20-40g Protein at least 1-2 hours prior to a workout in a fed state.

Overall Cliffs:

- Nutrient Timing can be beneficial but the anabolic window is not as important as we believed.
- Provided protein rich meal 3-4 hours prior to training, there is no stress about immediate post-workout protein supplement or meal
- Consume .4-.5g/kg of LBM in a pre/post workout exercise window spaced 4-6 hours depending on meal size.
- Post workout carb intake does not meaningful increase anabolism unless doing a 2 a day workout session involving same muscle groups. Glycogen is not a limiting factor if you can consume enough Carbohydrates daily in the 24 hour period.
 
Old Witch

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Why eat a meal OR drink a shake, when you can eat a meal AND drink a shake???
 

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