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How to "pulse" orals

Remember fellas to keep your questions here but neoborn has a thread set up for all pulsing results.... so post em up if your in progress of a cycle or completed one, we need to make sure to show everyone this is a very effective and safer way of running orals.

Invalid Link Removed
 
pman said:
The subject is soo addicting and i can't stop reading it...keep the pulse updates and experiences coming for this will be my first experience in cycling. I'm on a couple other forums and i mentioned pulse cycling and people thought i was crazy...they were ready to hang me at the stake...lol
I have read several times here where guys would stop making gains after about 3 or 4 weeks...so is it possable to run a pulse cycle to when you stop making gains (no more than 6 to 8 weeks) take about 4 weeks off and do it again???
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Yes, that's the whole point really, keeping gains fresh and toxicity low. It just takes some patience and maturity, but it pays off to pulse. You pretty much stay on pulse all the time, with a week or month here and there to break. In reality, your off more time than that because your half-timing on a pulse anyway.

You can dose an oral 3wks, then it stops working so you take a week off and start a different oral OR up the dose of the one you're on to renew gains, right? But at the end of your 8-12wk cycle your going to feel down right toxic having started at 50mg of Anadrol and ending at 150mg barely getting a return for it at that point. Then you stop the cycle, start post cycle therapy and crash bad. Screw that! Let those guys figure it out the hard way on those other boards! This works, try it one time and you'll be sold my friend.
 
edvanp said:
... I plan to "ease" into the cycle and then ease back out or tapper. I'm hoping for minimal or no shutdown.
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Yep, that works. That's the first way I ever tried it and I did a pyramid pulse for a long time. Very safe and still effective. The Res should help too.
 
nycste said:
dr.d most of ur cycles of orals are pulses? or is this a fairly new concept?
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When I first started with this stuff, this is the way I did things so it's an old concept really. You can use orals daily at the beginning of a standard test based injectable cycle if you don't like to front load, and again daily at the end of a cycle to cover your bases while you wait for esters to clear out, but pulse in the middle. It keeps the effects fresh on a cycle with a low toxicity contribution from the orals for many months.

I have recently been reapplying this technique to use with oral only OTC supps because so many guys are doing that now, even mixing and matching multiple orals which can get tricky. Pulsing is a way to fool-proof an oral cycle where guys are much less likely to hurt themselves and the gains are still very satisfactory.

Now with all the awesome AI's, test boosters and anti-corts available, that creates a whole new potential for pulsing where post cycle therapy can truly be avoided and you can just run your favorite test boosting combo with an oral pulsed in also to really punctuate the gains. Very effective, very minimal shutdown if done properly. It really doesn't get much healthier than that.
 
DR.D said:
When I first started with this stuff, this is the way I did things so it's an old concept really. You can use orals daily at the beginning of a standard test based injectable cycle if you don't like to front load, and again daily at the end of a cycle to cover your bases while you wait for esters to clear out, but pulse in the middle. It keeps the effects fresh on a cycle with a low toxicity contribution from the orals for many months.

I have recently been reapplying this technique to use with oral only OTC supps because so many guys are doing that now, even mixing and matching multiple orals which can get tricky. Pulsing is a way to fool-proof an oral cycle where guys are much less likely to hurt themselves and the gains are still very satisfactory.

Now with all the awesome AI's, test boosters and anti-corts available, that creates a whole new potential for pulsing where post cycle therapy can truly be avoided and you can just run your favorite test boosting combo with an oral pulsed in also to really punctuate the gains. Very effective, very minimal shutdown if done properly. It really doesn't get much healthier than that.
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yes this is really interesting ive been following for a while
 
EasyEJL said:
I'm going to as part of my upcoming cycle in november, partially to help protect me from gyno and other estrogen effects while taking Revolt :) I've got arthritis, so I don't want to go with just a dry compound, as i'm concerned about making joints any worse.
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Correction, you had arthiritis! Invalid Link Removed...Invalid Link Removed...

I love you E, you know that, I think it's time for you to be healed from your arthiritis eh? I want you to do something for me for yourself. Stop affirming your sickness / dis-ease and confirm your health and wellness instead! Do you really want to keep the arthiritis? I don't think so, so let's focus on the good stuff! I know I may sound a little :fool2: but this stuff works, what you think / focus / give your energy to will become reality.

I would start by taking some Cissus, bulk from NP and affirm that your condition is healed on a daily basis and believe you ARE healed, right now!

I say this in love, what you believe will become true.

Much Love,

Neoborn
 
OK, so after all the advice this is what i have planned (also decided to go 2x4wks instead of 3x3):

Week1-4

ON days (lifting days, 3days/week):

Ramping up to 40mg Epi.
AP post w/o and P-slin before pre w/o meal (which is my breakfast)
1 cap Retain2 pre w/o.

OFF days:
2-4 caps of HDX2.
1 cap retain2 pre w/o which is boxing.
2 6-OXO Extreme 1 in the morning and 1 before bedtime.
AP post w/o


Weeks 5-6 ("post cycle therapy"):

HDX2 2-4 caps ED 6-OXO Extreme 2 caps ED and Anabolic Pump post w/o 3days a week (lifting days) 1 Retain2 ED


week 7(-8?):

Nothing at all.

week 8(9?):
Repeat from week 1.


I just have a few things id like your opinions on (if you dont see any problem with the way i set everything else up):

1: Should i just stop epi at 40mg/day in week 4 and start week 5 as it sais or should lower it to 10mg in week 5 to ramp down (making it an even ½ a bottle per cycle)?

2: Do you think ill need supercissus for my joints?

3: Do you think i will have tolerance issues with AP and P-slin using it the way i do or can i use AP before post w/o meals on off days (boxing training) as well during cycle or should i limit to on days?

Thanks a bunch for all the input everybody, cant tell you how much i appreciate it.
 
1. stop at 40
2. definately, maybe not supercissus but regular cissus will do
3. i would use only on on days, unless you want to spend more.
why so little retain2 and 6oxoextreme? I dont think you would be getting the full benefiets from them.
 
quadrato said:
OK, so after all the advice this is what i have planned (also decided to go 2x4wks instead of 3x3):

Week1-4

ON days (lifting days, 3days/week):

Ramping up to 40mg Epi.
AP post w/o and P-slin before pre w/o meal (which is my breakfast)
1 cap Retain2 pre w/o.

OFF days:
2-4 caps of HDX2.
1 cap retain2 pre w/o which is boxing.
2 6-OXO Extreme 1 in the morning and 1 before bedtime.
AP post w/o


Weeks 5-6 ("post cycle therapy"):

HDX2 2-4 caps ED 6-OXO Extreme 2 caps ED and Anabolic Pump post w/o 3days a week (lifting days) 1 Retain2 ED


week 7(-8?):

Nothing at all.

week 8(9?):
Repeat from week 1.


I just have a few things id like your opinions on (if you dont see any problem with the way i set everything else up):

1: Should i just stop epi at 40mg/day in week 4 and start week 5 as it sais or should lower it to 10mg in week 5 to ramp down (making it an even ½ a bottle per cycle)?

2: Do you think ill need supercissus for my joints?

3: Do you think i will have tolerance issues with AP and P-slin using it the way i do or can i use AP before post w/o meals on off days (boxing training) as well during cycle or should i limit to on days?

Thanks a bunch for all the input everybody, cant tell you how much i appreciate it.
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I don't think you would need to stack both HDX2 and 6-OXO Extreme together, since they both function the same way, just use one or the other, that way you can save either the HDX2 or the 6-OXO for your next cycle.
 
pistonpump said:
1. stop at 40
2. definately, maybe not supercissus but regular cissus will do
3. i would use only on on days, unless you want to spend more.
why so little retain2 and 6oxoextreme? I dont think you would be getting the full benefiets from them.
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price mostly, i guess i could up the dose on both if that seems to be the general opinion to 2caps every day instead.
 
Solitude said:
I don't think you would need to stack both HDX2 and 6-OXO Extreme together, since they both function the same way, just use one or the other, that way you can save either the HDX2 or the 6-OXO for your next cycle.
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So you think that 6-oxo extreme and retain2 is all i will need?

Can i get a second opinion on this maybe?
 
quadrato said:
So you think that 6-oxo extreme and retain2 is all i will need?
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Yeah, at the moment I'm running an epi cycle as well, and I only use 2-3 caps of 6-oxo extreme ED during on-cycle.

For retain 2, probably you should just use like 2 caps on off-days, 1 cap in the morning and 1 cap in the afternoon.

Save the HDX2 for post cycle therapy or for next cycle.

If you haven't read the whole thread I think you should give some time to go back and read all of them, I know it's a long thread, but there a lot of great info that could be very useful for you, I learned so much from this thread alone.
 
neoborn said:
... I know I may sound a little :fool2: but this stuff works, what you think / focus / give your energy to will become reality. ...
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Indeed, you do sounds a little :fool2: much of the time! But you are basically correct. Although our bodies are nothing more than organic machines, they harbor a spirit and the mind connects the two to govern perception.

For as a man thinketh in his heart, so is he. - Proverbs 23:7

Nothing is real until it is observed, and that observation becomes our reality. - Quantum Electrodynamics Theory
 
edvanp said:
Sorry if this has been asked, but is EPI more effective if taken with food or without? Thanks.
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Always take any hormonal compound WITH food. Also I might add that oral anabolics are best and most efficiently absorbed when taken with a meal that has some fat content.
 
quadrato said:
So what would you propose?
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Just to keep the dose low is my main suggestion. Regular 6-oxo seems better suited as far as an anti-e, but I would even keep the dose relatively low with that too (100-200mg). If you're using 2-4 caps of HDX2 already, you don't need the 6-Oxo anyway because it has good amounts an excellent AI in it already called 6-Bromo. I would just use one or the other, and I would favor a product with 6-Bromo over 6-Oxo.
 
DR.D said:
Indeed, you do sounds a little :fool2: much of the time!
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Takes one to know one, neh neh na neh neh Invalid Link Removed

Invalid Link RemovedHeheheh you know I love joo long time D!Invalid Link Removed

and I love this thread!

Much Love,

Neoborn
 
Does anyone see an advantage to making the 'on' days the day after you workout? I.e, I lift on Monday, Wed, Sat, would 'pulsing' on Tues / Thurs / Sun offer more benefit since it would be used more effectively during recovery, following the old 'you don't grow in the gym, you grow when you rest outside of the gym' way of thinking?

Just a thought.
 
Skigazzi said:
Does anyone see an advantage to making the 'on' days the day after you workout? I.e, I lift on Monday, Wed, Sat, would 'pulsing' on Tues / Thurs / Sun offer more benefit since it would be used more effectively during recovery, following the old 'you don't grow in the gym, you grow when you rest outside of the gym' way of thinking?

Just a thought.
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You should check out at DA, there are two logs that does that, the compound used is Trenadrol I believe.

They called it "reverse pulsing".. Apparently they've been getting pretty good result as well...

For me personally, I really like the added boost when taken pre-workout, so I would prefer dosing it on workout days.
 
Solitude said:
You should check out at DA, there two logs that does that, the compound used is Trenadrol I believe.

They called it "reverse pulsing".. Apparently they've been getting pretty good result as well...
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Thanks.

I must have missed them over there, I'll check em out. Just seems to make more sense to me in terms of growth.
 
Skigazzi said:
Thanks.

I must have missed them over there, I'll check em out. Just seems to make more sense to me in terms of growth.
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its compound dependent, a more androgenic compound will give you more of a boost/aggression in the gym so its kind of nice to take that on workout days. otherwise it really doesn't matter which days it is
 
Dr. D, what's your thoughts on dosing of HDX2 during on/off days? I've seen people run 2caps OFF days only before bed time and others run 4caps ON days, 2 caps OFF.

Also, are there any neg effects to taking an Epi dose with a pre-workout meal (approx. 1 hour before lifting)?
 
The purpose of the HDX2 is to control estrogen and boost libido creating the "bounce back" effect of your own test system to boost the HPTA into creating more Test naturally.

As per the AD for HDX2:


» Hyperdrol X2 Highlights:

» Xtreme Gains in Strength and Size
» Massively Raised Testosterone Levels
» Increased Muscle Mass
» Supercharged Sex Drive
» Increased Fat Loss
» No Gyno Or Estrogen Effects – due to the estrogen blocker
» No Hair Loss
» No POST CYCLE THERAPY needed
» Incredible Sense of Power That Comes from a Boost in Testosterone

The day you would use HDX2 would either be just before bed on an "on" day or on your "off" day. Start at 2 caps ramping up to 4 caps on a day ( Not ED but either before bed on "on" days or on "off" days ).

You SHOULD take Epi with a meal containing some fat / EFA's etc this will help absorbtion. You could also take it / drink it down with some Grape Fruit Juice which will help for absorbtion as well. You could also purchase some Trisorbagen from NP and this will also help absorbtion.

You "should" see no negative effects from dosing hour before / immediately after working out.

Much Love,

Neoborn
 
neoborn said:
The day you would use HDX2 would either be just before bed on an "on" day or on your "off" day. Start at 2 caps ramping up to 4 caps on a day ( Not ED but either before bed on "on" days or on "off" days ).
Neoborn
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So just to confirm:
2-4 caps before bed on ON days
OR
2-4 caps OFF days before bed

Not ED.

For the four caps, do you take them all at once? Seems like a lot before bed...

Thanks Neoborn!
 
twswift said:
So just to confirm:
2-4 caps before bed on ON days
OR
2-4 caps OFF days before bed

Not ED.

For the four caps, do you take them all at once? Seems like a lot before bed...

Thanks Neoborn!
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It depends on what you want to get out of the HDX2, if you want to use it just as extra insurance to get "the bounce", you could run 1 or 2 caps ED, or 2 caps on Off-Days only, if you want maximum test boosting from the HDX2 then take 4 caps ED.

With 1 or 2 caps dosing just dose it at night, for 4 caps dosing ED, use 1 in the morning, 1 in the evening and 2 at night, or you could spread it out evenly throughout the day.

I've asked this question before to Dr.D a couple of pages back. I'll get you the quotes.

DR.D said:
I think using HDX2, or your test booster of choice, as your whole cycle is good (I just updated the original pulsing post to make this point better) so basically 4 caps/day is my favorite system so far. That way, you're really supplementing a daily test booster as your main core of the cycle with a potent oral to act like the octane booster on w/o days. Epi and HDX2 are not a problem together, they actually stack quite well. Epi does not lower estrogen as many think, just the opposite if anything, so don't confuse the SERM effect of Epi with the AI mechanism of HD. That said, 2 HDs on the off nights are probably plenty for most guys if you just want some insurance to keep bouncing, but 4 caps/day if you wanna kick test into high gear to add another dimension of gains to the pulse.
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Solitude said:
But Dr. D, I have a question, say if I use 4 caps of HDX2 for my 8 weeks pulse cycle and then I want to do another 4 weeks post cycle therapy also with HDX2, that would totaled in 12 weeks on HDX2, would that be too long and excessive to be on an AI at that dosage?

And second question how do you dose 4 caps during on-cycle, just take all 4 before bedtime everyday or spread it out evenly throughout the day?
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DR.D said:
You won't need HD wks 9-12. You won't need post cycle therapy at all with 4 caps of HD in the mix! But tor/MFX would be more than enough for a smooth, fast post cycle therapy later if needed. I really doubt you'll need it though.

As for dosing, I take 1 cap every six hours (6am, noon, 6pm, midnight - that's right I never sleep! :)) or 1 in the morning, 1 afternoon, 2 before bed spaced out/8hrs if I'm on a 3x/day dosing regimen.
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neoborn said:
Just to clarify

1. HDX2 dose 4 caps a day - 1 morn, 1 afternoon, 2 pre bed

2. Milk Thistle? NAC or SAM-e only on off days???

3. HDX2 Not needed in post cycle therapy but go MFX weeks 9-12

4. Which is safer in relation to sides and / or has better gains 1,4AD bulk from NP or SuperDuperDrol?

Thanks much love

Neoborn
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DR.D said:
This is crazy talk Neo! OK, here goes:

1. Yes, best plan for gains and enhancing bounce simultaneously IMO.

2. No MT if it's me, NAC yes & SAMe yes, preferable off days or post anabolic dose if daily.

3. Yes, for his plan. MFX is a sweet bridge with any plan.

4. SuperDuperDrol? Hmmm, who makes this stuff! 1,4-AD is nice, just takes so much of it to do anything. It's a mild AI though so it's a great pulsing option, like weak formestane in effect basically. I liked the diol version better.
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Solitude said:
It depends on what you want to get out of the HDX2, if you want to use it just as extra insurance to get "the bounce", you could run 1 or 2 caps ED, or 2 caps on Off-Days only, if you want maximum test boosting from the HDX2 then take 4 caps ED.

With 1 or 2 caps dosing just dose it at night, for 4 caps dosing ED, use 1 in the morning, 1 in the evening and 2 at night, or you could spread it out evenly throughout the day.

I've asked this question before to Dr.D a couple of pages back. I'll get you the quotes.
Click to expand...

Thanks Solitude...that was exactly what I was looking for (and I knew I'd read it somewhere in this 37 page thread!).

Started this 8wk pulse today...can't wait for the gains!
 
Hey all, first I would like to say thanks for the awesome thread. It's very informative.

I have a question with regard to results. How long does it take for you guys to know if you should up the dose or not? I ask because I have tried regular cycles of 1-Testosterone (not M1-T), PP and Gaspari Hyper-Drol. I didn't feel anything with the 1-T and H-Drol. The PP kicked in with strength gains at the end of the four week cycle.

Let me ask a more clear question. If I start EPI three times per week at 20/20, should I expect to feel a strength increase during the workout on the first day, at the end of the week or at some other time? And if I don't feel anything at the end of the first week how will I know to up the dosage during the second week?

Sorry for the long question and yes I am a Noob when it comes to this stuff.
 
pistonpump said:
D, can you just briefly state why you think 6bromo is superior? science wise and experience wise?
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6a-Br is a competitive inhibitor of aromatase, with an apparent Ki of 3.4 nM. This is 126x stronger than 6-oxo!

6b-Br is a mechanism-based irreversible inhibitor with an apparent Ki of 800 nM. This is only half as strong as 6-oxo but qualitatively quite superior in my experience.

6-Oxo is strictly a competitive inhibitor with an apparent Ki of 430 nM. It has no protracted activity either. Once you stop taking it, it's effects are done. Plus if forms 6a-OH-Testosterone as a metabolite!

Basically, 6-Br is the same as 6-Oxo but has a bromine substituted for the oxygen.
 
pistonpump said:
D, can you just briefly state why you think 6bromo is superior? science wise and experience wise?
Click to expand...

6a-Br is a competitive inhibitor of aromatase, with an apparent Ki of 3.4 nM. This is 126x stronger than 6-oxo!

6b-Br is a mechanism-based irreversible inhibitor with an apparent Ki of 800 nM. This is only half as strong as 6-oxo but qualitatively quite superior in my experience.

6-Oxo is strictly a competitive inhibitor with an apparent Ki of 430 nM. It has no protracted activity either. Once you stop taking it, it's effects are done. Plus if forms 6a-OH-Testosterone as a metabolite!

Basically, 6-Br is the same as 6-Oxo but has a bromine substituted for the oxygen.

This is going on in another thread so look up what I said there for more elaboration.
 
DR.D said:
6a-Br is a competitive inhibitor of aromatase, with an apparent Ki of 3.4 nM. This is 126x stronger than 6-oxo!

6b-Br is a mechanism-based irreversible inhibitor with an apparent Ki of 800 nM. This is only half as strong as 6-oxo but qualitatively quite superior in my experience.

6-Oxo is strictly a competitive inhibitor with an apparent Ki of 430 nM. It has no protracted activity either. Once you stop taking it, it's effects are done. Plus if forms 6a-OH-Testosterone as a metabolite!

Basically, 6-Br is the same as 6-Oxo but has a bromine substituted for the oxygen.
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very interesting...
 
Skigazzi said:
... following the old 'you don't grow in the gym, you grow when you rest outside of the gym' way of thinking?

Just a thought.
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Yes, mainly in the first 6hrs after a w/o, that's when you want a highly anabolic environment. That's your window of max growth potential as far as nutrient incorporation.
 
bigmidge said:
Hey all, first I would like to say thanks for the awesome thread. It's very informative.

I have a question with regard to results. How long does it take for you guys to know if you should up the dose or not? I ask because I have tried regular cycles of 1-Testosterone (not M1-T), PP and Gaspari Hyper-Drol. I didn't feel anything with the 1-T and H-Drol. The PP kicked in with strength gains at the end of the four week cycle.

Let me ask a more clear question. If I start EPI three times per week at 20/20, should I expect to feel a strength increase during the workout on the first day, at the end of the week or at some other time? And if I don't feel anything at the end of the first week how will I know to up the dosage during the second week?

Sorry for the long question and yes I am a Noob when it comes to this stuff.
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sounds to me like at the least you have a diet problem and myabe more man... 1-t and H drol are both strong enough on there own... and PP.... well PP totally kicked ass for me i gained 15 lbs in 3 weeks and a TON of strength starting week 2.... it sounds like you need to work a lil on your basics (diet and training routine) then do a lot more homework on your supplements your taking... the answers to your questions are there just use the search feature.....
 
twswift said:
Dr. D, what's your thoughts on dosing of HDX2 during on/off days? I've seen people run 2caps OFF days only before bed time and others run 4caps ON days, 2 caps OFF.

Also, are there any neg effects to taking an Epi dose with a pre-workout meal (approx. 1 hour before lifting)?
Click to expand...

Ideally, take 1 cap every 6hrs on a daily basis. Then it's like stacking test/epi because you get a good test surge too. If you're just trying for inhibited shutdown, 2 caps on the off nights is probably sufficient.
 
bigmidge said:
Hey all, first I would like to say thanks for the awesome thread. It's very informative.

I have a question with regard to results. How long does it take for you guys to know if you should up the dose or not? I ask because I have tried regular cycles of 1-Testosterone (not M1-T), PP and Gaspari Hyper-Drol. I didn't feel anything with the 1-T and H-Drol. The PP kicked in with strength gains at the end of the four week cycle.

Let me ask a more clear question. If I start EPI three times per week at 20/20, should I expect to feel a strength increase during the workout on the first day, at the end of the week or at some other time? And if I don't feel anything at the end of the first week how will I know to up the dosage during the second week?

Sorry for the long question and yes I am a Noob when it comes to this stuff.
Click to expand...

Not really enough info here to say what went wrong with your other cycles (doses, diet, training style, etc..) but I would say you should probably detect 40mg of epi from the first w/o or two. It's a mental energizer for me at that dose.
 
poopypants said:
sounds to me like at the least you have a diet problem and myabe more man... 1-t and H drol are both strong enough on there own... and PP.... well PP totally kicked ass for me i gained 15 lbs in 3 weeks and a TON of strength starting week 2.... it sounds like you need to work a lil on your basics (diet and training routine) then do a lot more homework on your supplements your taking... the answers to your questions are there just use the search feature.....
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1T used to hit me fast! Sometimes I would look bigger the day after I started. Great glyco loader.
 
DR.D said:
1T used to hit me fast! Sometimes I would look bigger the day after I started. Great glyco loader.
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i know PP wasnt known for it like SD was with the glyc loading but i think that helped contribute a ton to my added strength.. i ate like 2 2serving bowls ED of malto meal and ate a ton of tuna... also added 30g carbs to my shakes with oats.... blew up real nice that cycle and had it stacked with prostan so i didnt hold hardly any water weight.....man i wish i could run that cycle agian.
 
DR.D said:
Ideally, take 1 cap every 6hrs on a daily basis. Then it's like stacking test/epi because you get a good test surge too. If you're just trying for inhibited shutdown, 2 caps on the off nights is probably sufficient.
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Sweet! So just to confirm stacking Epi + HDX2 @ 1cap/6hrs would still not require anything more PCT than perhaps MFX at best after an 8wk pulse? I realize it's probably symantics at this point but I'm just crossing and dotting all my t's and i's!
 
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