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Training log revamp ROUND 3 lol

how do you guys not sweat? 😅
I mean ****, I buy undershirts off amazon every 6 months or so to keep my expensive work button downs from getting ruined
 
Dustin07 said:
how do you guys not sweat? 😅
I mean ****, I buy undershirts off amazon every 6 months or so to keep my expensive work button downs from getting ruined
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Lucky I guess, I just burned 600 calories in 47 minutes and only had very light perspiration, not a drop anywhere, even my bald head. Just enough to be a little moist under my shirt but not enough to show through my shirt, and it was gray.
 
MrKleen73 said:
Lucky I guess, I just burned 600 calories in 47 minutes and only had very light perspiration, not a drop anywhere, even my bald head. Just enough to be a little moist under my shirt but not enough to show through my shirt, and it was gray.
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Consider yourself lucky its rather uncomfortable and not very pleasant can be kinda cool during hood sex tho especially if your wife is sweating right along with you..damn I need to get laid...I'm not even on tren yet lol
 
Mikereyn513 said:
Consider yourself lucky its rather uncomfortable and not very pleasant can be kinda cool during hood sex tho especially if your wife is sweating right along with you..damn I need to get laid...I'm not even on tren yet lol
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Quit wasting time with that desk girl and just pull a random grenade.
 
I've bern having ridiculous night sweats lately and have no idea why. All I'm running is 250 test and 2iu gh. I guess it's keeping me lean tho. Still have fully visible abs and more vascularity than ever. Hovering between 228 and 230. Even throwing in random cookies or quest bars or the one protein bar the smores one is off the hook
 
So everything is still going good, consistently beating the log book and So far each workout the new weight doesn't feel any heavier than the previous. Felt froggy today on legs and I was short on time so I jumped from 205 straight to 225 for my 20 rep squats set and it was still fairly easy. Honestly it felt more cardio/endurance then anything. I did choose to skip hack squats after that tho because I was out of breath and low on time. So next leg day IL do 225x20 again and follow it with 3 sets of hack squats. Everything else I beat by 5lbs or added a rep or 2.

204.8lbs this morning.

Work is also starting to get crazy again. I'm doing side work and filling in part time delivering food for my friends restaurant which is kinda on call. So I'm thinking that I don't wanna get off track with the diet too much. I'm already getting close to 4000 on the days I have a cheat or extra meal. Most days I'm right around 3200 tho.

To make things simple for the time being I'm gonna start making breakfast my biggest meal and get about 1000cal and 100gm protein and 100gm carbs and some fat, Wait 1 hour and a half and hit the gym before work.

That meal should be enough for fuel and recovery in case it takes me a while to get to meal 2.

Diet has been very enjoyable at this point too. I'm eating a wide variety of protein from chicken, beef, eggs, whites, Greek yogurt and fairlife milk.

My carbs have been mostly rice and low fat breads and wraps, occasionally some pasta

Fats are just whatever fat I'm getting from the protein sources and cooking oils/sprays.and half and half in my coffee.

And of course I'm throwing in a hearty cheat here and there. Until I see some negative effects on body composition I'm rolling with this. Only change is gonna be the breakfast. I'm gonna need protein powder in that meal to get the 100gm without overly stuffing my face at that meal
 
Weird never-ending problem but my lower back still tires out before I can finish any intense workout. This has been going on for years. I use to think it was lower back pumps in my 20s, then as I got older I thought maybe just underdeveloped low back muscles and I spent a lot of time trying to strengthen the lower back but it doesn't fix the problem. Even if I'm running or hitting the bag or mits my lower back tires before anything else. In my teens and early 20s I did a lot of moving jobs and delivering furniture and refrigerator and washing machines and such and I did hurt my back and do pt back then and I wonder sometimes if there's more damage then I know, like a disc or some kind of compression injury that obviously is a forever problem if that's the case. As I get in better shape the time till my low back fatigue is lengthened and I was at one point significantly smaller, 180lbs, very lean and doing 1.5hr boxing sessions but the sessions always ended with my lower back tiring out first. It's really tough to point a finger as it's Probably been going on for about 15 years or more at this point and it carries over into any activities I do even my job. When I'm in better shape the problem is less significant but it always exists
 
Smont said:
Weird never-ending problem but my lower back still tires out before I can finish any intense workout. This has been going on for years. I use to think it was lower back pumps in my 20s, then as I got older I thought maybe just underdeveloped low back muscles and I spent a lot of time trying to strengthen the lower back but it doesn't fix the problem. Even if I'm running or hitting the bag or mits my lower back tires before anything else. In my teens and early 20s I did a lot of moving jobs and delivering furniture and refrigerator and washing machines and such and I did hurt my back and do pt back then and I wonder sometimes if there's more damage then I know, like a disc or some kind of compression injury that obviously is a forever problem if that's the case. As I get in better shape the time till my low back fatigue is lengthened and I was at one point significantly smaller, 180lbs, very lean and doing 1.5hr boxing sessions but the sessions always ended with my lower back tiring out first. It's really tough to point a finger as it's Probably been going on for about 15 years or more at this point and it carries over into any activities I do even my job. When I'm in better shape the problem is less significant but it always exists
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Similar situation. Old disc bulge started it and lost a bunch of training time on it while I focused on other areas. Now it’s like an eternal catch up phase lol. I would say my low back is 100% my weak point and I have to train the hell out of it to get it up to snuff when I’m doing heavy lower work.
 
I got a desiccated disc in my back and it’s awful but I hear horror stories about surgery so I don’t want to take the plunge.
 
SSJ4GOD said:
I got a desiccated disc in my back and it’s awful but I hear horror stories about surgery so I don’t want to take the plunge.
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Ya I'm not about surgeries until I have no other options. Or if it needs emergency attention or something but this is livable for sure, it's more annoying then anything
 
Smont said:
Ya I'm not about surgeries until I have no other options. Or if it needs emergency attention or something but this is livable for sure, it's more annoying then anything
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I got bunion surgery (caused by terrible military boots) and my foot has never been the same. Still have no feeling on the top of my foot and nerve issues pushing off on my toes. Sucks.
 
Healthy ish fake cheat meal. It's actually pretty clean. 600 calories and 50gm of protein, very low in fat.

Theses are the smallest tortillas I could find, 55 cal each. I used my fat free Greek yogurt and ranch with some hot sauce for the sauce, 1 dices pineapple ring, some diced deli ham and turkey and about 1 cup shredded skim mozzarella cheese.

Invalid Link Removed
 
Do you have an exercise ball at the gym or home? I wonder if doing Stir the Pot twice a week trying to raise duration of work would help (thereby increasing abdominal endurance) would help support your lower back endurance.

This is a method Brian Carroll advocates for a lot of his back rehab clients. He has Youtube video tutorials.
 
back injuries are absolutely miserable. They create stress and the stress makes the back pain worse and it cycles itself. It is one topic I have researched until I was blue in the face and I'm truly opposed to 90% of back surgeries. I think that the science behind back pain is still completely lacking any solid information. the number of people who have back surgery and then report the exact same pain a mere few months later is ridiculously high. I want to say it was like 66 or 80+% or something stupid.

I'm not enough of an asshole to say all backpain is in the head. I can't say that all of mine was in my head. But I can say I've seen a helluva lot more severe back and shoulder injuries healed in the gym than in surgery or with PT. I only hope the best for you guys and if I had a magic solution I'd give it to you immediately. For me, it was 95lb RDL's at sets of 20. after a year of vomiting trying to lift 135. not being able to play catch with my son, swapping out 2, 3, 4 different mattresses, chiro, pt, massage therapy, x-rays, musculoskeltal dr. everyone. it ended up being the barbell and getting my head straightened out and rested.

but... that was me. i know everyones injuries can be 100% different. I have soft spot in my heart for back pain.
 
Hyde said:
Do you have an exercise ball at the gym or home? I wonder if doing Stir the Pot twice a week trying to raise duration of work would help (thereby increasing abdominal endurance) would help support your lower back endurance.

This is a method Brian Carroll advocates for a lot of his back rehab clients. He has Youtube video tutorials.
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I will check that out, I have no clue whatvitvis but it sounds simple enough to throw in 2x a week and see what happens. If I'm gonna take a crack at better rehab nows the time because once these numbers are back where I want them I'm gonna check my 3rep max bench and squat and a few other exercises and then I wanna Deload and get **** cracking for real. I'm definitely holding water since mk, I can see it in my face, ankles and midsection and I'm sure that's not helping my back much either.
 
Dustin07 said:
back injuries are absolutely miserable. They create stress and the stress makes the back pain worse and it cycles itself. It is one topic I have researched until I was blue in the face and I'm truly opposed to 90% of back surgeries. I think that the science behind back pain is still completely lacking any solid information. the number of people who have back surgery and then report the exact same pain a mere few months later is ridiculously high. I want to say it was like 66 or 80+% or something stupid.

I'm not enough of an asshole to say all backpain is in the head. I can't say that all of mine was in my head. But I can say I've seen a helluva lot more severe back and shoulder injuries healed in the gym than in surgery or with PT. I only hope the best for you guys and if I had a magic solution I'd give it to you immediately. For me, it was 95lb RDL's at sets of 20. after a year of vomiting trying to lift 135. not being able to play catch with my son, swapping out 2, 3, 4 different mattresses, chiro, pt, massage therapy, x-rays, musculoskeltal dr. everyone. it ended up being the barbell and getting my head straightened out and rested.

but... that was me. i know everyones injuries can be 100% different. I have soft spot in my heart for back pain.
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My brother in law had back surgery about a year ago. The pt is so slow passed they still don't want him lifting any significant weight. ( Which is completely untrained in weightlifting and never was big into weights) so there is no significant amount he's going to lift anyway. But they tell him it's OK to go running? He's 6'3 250lbs. Running is gonna put more stress on his spine then probably 90% of weightlifting exercises
 
It’s funny you mention that @Smont because when I was at my worst, my military doctors would say “don’t push pull or lift greater than 5lbs” “but you can run your PT test”… I was like, I don’t think you understand how back pain works
 
Smont said:
I will check that out, I have no clue whatvitvis but it sounds simple enough to throw in 2x a week and see what happens. If I'm gonna take a crack at better rehab nows the time because once these numbers are back where I want them I'm gonna check my 3rep max bench and squat and a few other exercises and then I wanna Deload and get **** cracking for real. I'm definitely holding water since mk, I can see it in my face, ankles and midsection and I'm sure that's not helping my back much either.
Click to expand...

Look it up, but Stir the Pot is a plank where your forearms rest on an exercise ball instead of the floor. Then, with clasped hands, you very minutely “stir” the ball in little circles for “reps” or time, which lights the hell out of your abs and obliques. Shoot for 30 seconds your first go, or 15 reps each way.
 
Smont said:
My brother in law had back surgery about a year ago. The pt is so slow passed they still don't want him lifting any significant weight. ( Which is completely untrained in weightlifting and never was big into weights) so there is no significant amount he's going to lift anyway. But they tell him it's OK to go running? He's 6'3 250lbs. Running is gonna put more stress on his spine then probably 90% of weightlifting exercises
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SSJ4GOD said:
It’s funny you mention that @Smont because when I was at my worst, my military doctors would say “don’t push pull or lift greater than 5lbs” “but you can run your PT test”… I was like, I don’t think you understand how back pain works
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People are idiots. I really think running is one of the worst things you can do (long distance at least) in terms of how it beats your body up vs the ROI. My dad's back flared up this weekend (unusual for him) after a weekend of nerf wars with the grandkids. I told him to get into the gym and do some RDL's. he was fine 2 days later. again... just one tiny sampling but I've fired more PT's than I've gained valuable improvement from... he's 61

my dads stress is also very high because of business/recession/cost of capital these days and I think it plays a direct results on sleep and back pain, IMO. <-- again. almost impossible to prove, I just feel very strongly about it.
 
Dustin07 said:
People are idiots. I really think running is one of the worst things you can do (long distance at least) in terms of how it beats your body up vs the ROI. My dad's back flared up this weekend (unusual for him) after a weekend of nerf wars with the grandkids. I told him to get into the gym and do some RDL's. he was fine 2 days later. again... just one tiny sampling but I've fired more PT's than I've gained valuable improvement from... he's 61

my dads stress is also very high because of business/recession/cost of capital these days and I think it plays a direct results on sleep and back pain, IMO. <-- again. almost impossible to prove, I just feel very strongly about it.
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I don't know if you have any trainers with some basic boxing knowledge, what'something that we've done With the over 55 crowd which the group I'm talking about is actually mostly in their seventies. But basically we teach them some basic boxing footwork , how to move side decide and pivot, How to duck and slip punches. Once they can get a basic understanding for how to do this they can get a whole work out in Just moving around the heavy bag and throwing combinatissues or hitting the mitts Or even someone using a pair of pool noodles cut down to sizes to throw little flat punches at them. There's a little more to it than that but overall it makes for a great car DO and conditioning workout Where the person can control how much energy they want to exert
 
I recorded that whole last message via talked to text while driving so forgive me if it looks crazy. I'm gonna stop now before I crash and get myself killed
 
3 herniated discs checking in. 1 cervical and 2 lumbar. Been through the gauntlet of rehab and am doing everything in my power to stave off the inevitable surgery for as long as possible. Yoga for mobility, and pallof presses and bird dogs *done correctly* have been the best things for me.

I also do the McGill big 3 daily.
 
Smont said:
I don't know if you have any trainers with some basic boxing knowledge, what'something that we've done With the over 55 crowd which the group I'm talking about is actually mostly in their seventies. But basically we teach them some basic boxing footwork , how to move side decide and pivot, How to duck and slip punches. Once they can get a basic understanding for how to do this they can get a whole work out in Just moving around the heavy bag and throwing combinatissues or hitting the mitts Or even someone using a pair of pool noodles cut down to sizes to throw little flat punches at them. There's a little more to it than that but overall it makes for a great car DO and conditioning workout Where the person can control how much energy they want to exert
Click to expand...

Immediately my brain began also thinking about the neural pathway creation and positive mental growth this would create as these humans develop new motor skills! unfortunately I know of none. I've actively sought a boxing club locally for years and we had one that was ghetto AF in Tacoma on hilltop, notorious bloods/crips warzone... my playground. but its gone now. only other one I found is for minors unfortunately. my brain doesn't need the battering but i'd love to take up boxing.

Mr Green said:
3 herniated discs checking in. 1 cervical and 2 lumbar. Been through the gauntlet of rehab and am doing everything in my power to stave off the inevitable surgery for as long as possible. Yoga for mobility, and pallof presses and bird dogs *done correctly* have been the best things for me.

I also do the McGill big 3 daily.
Click to expand...

I have a burst disc at L5 and xrays revealed a bone spur that supposedly is rubbing against the sciatica creating the pain that ran down my left side from above the belt to my toes for 2 years. it requires a surgery to fix, maybe the disc, but definitely grind down the bone spur that's rubbing the nerve. It magically disappeared and I haven't had pain in probably 4 years now. never got the surgery. again, everyones mileage will vary, but i have strong opinions just based upon my own experiences and the number of quacks I have met with PHDs. the only thing that holds me back is my own dedication to the work I need to put in.
 
Mr Green said:
3 herniated discs checking in. 1 cervical and 2 lumbar. Been through the gauntlet of rehab and am doing everything in my power to stave off the inevitable surgery for as long as possible. Yoga for mobility, and pallof presses and bird dogs *done correctly* have been the best things for me.

I also do the McGill big 3 daily.
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What makes you think surgery is inevitable? I’m not saying it shouldn’t happen, just curious why in your case specifically.
 
that said I'm 5'9" and when I was 18-20 I was 5'10" 😅😅😅
I raced BMX competitively (sponsored) and snowboarded intensely which led to concussions, blindness, unconsciousness, and I think my diminished height. at 13% BF I look like 16%+ and I believe firmly it's because of that area around my lower belly where the body is compressed an inch, so I have to work a bit harder to look as lean as I actually am. no biggy. just work.
 
Dustin07 said:
back injuries are absolutely miserable. They create stress and the stress makes the back pain worse and it cycles itself. It is one topic I have researched until I was blue in the face and I'm truly opposed to 90% of back surgeries. I think that the science behind back pain is still completely lacking any solid information. the number of people who have back surgery and then report the exact same pain a mere few months later is ridiculously high. I want to say it was like 66 or 80+% or something stupid.

I'm not enough of an asshole to say all backpain is in the head. I can't say that all of mine was in my head. But I can say I've seen a helluva lot more severe back and shoulder injuries healed in the gym than in surgery or with PT. I only hope the best for you guys and if I had a magic solution I'd give it to you immediately. For me, it was 95lb RDL's at sets of 20. after a year of vomiting trying to lift 135. not being able to play catch with my son, swapping out 2, 3, 4 different mattresses, chiro, pt, massage therapy, x-rays, musculoskeltal dr. everyone. it ended up being the barbell and getting my head straightened out and rested.

but... that was me. i know everyones injuries can be 100% different. I have soft spot in my heart for back pain.
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You know I am actually researching the chronic pain and brain connection especially with back issues. I am actually looking into some compounds such as nsi-189 that causes neurogenesis in the hippocampus. Chronic pain is associated with a reduced hippocampus size. So there might be something there. Plus nsi happens to work really well for depression and stuff too.
 
Smont said:
Healthy ish fake cheat meal. It's actually pretty clean. 600 calories and 50gm of protein, very low in fat.

Theses are the smallest tortillas I could find, 55 cal each. I used my fat free Greek yogurt and ranch with some hot sauce for the sauce, 1 dices pineapple ring, some diced deli ham and turkey and about 1 cup shredded skim mozzarella cheese.

Invalid Link Removed
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Dude not even gonna lie to you because your my boy and all but that's the first thing you've made that just doesn't look appetizing to me. I mean I'd eat it for the gains and all but compared to some of your other creations i dunno bro..I think it's the pineapple on pizza thing..not into it
 
Dustin07 said:
Immediately my brain began also thinking about the neural pathway creation and positive mental growth this would create as these humans develop new motor skills! unfortunately I know of none. I've actively sought a boxing club locally for years and we had one that was ghetto AF in Tacoma on hilltop, notorious bloods/crips warzone... my playground. but its gone now. only other one I found is for minors unfortunately. my brain doesn't need the battering but i'd love to take up boxing.



I have a burst disc at L5 and xrays revealed a bone spur that supposedly is rubbing against the sciatica creating the pain that ran down my left side from above the belt to my toes for 2 years. it requires a surgery to fix, maybe the disc, but definitely grind down the bone spur that's rubbing the nerve. It magically disappeared and I haven't had pain in probably 4 years now. never got the surgery. again, everyones mileage will vary, but i have strong opinions just based upon my own experiences and the number of quacks I have met with PHDs. the only thing that holds me back is my own dedication to the work I need to put in.
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You have any residual nerve issues from 2 years like that? I’m going on 16 months and unfortunately think I may have permanent nerve damage in my foot.
 
Mikereyn513 said:
Dude not even gonna lie to you because your my boy and all but that's the first thing you've made that just doesn't look appetizing to me. I mean I'd eat it for the gains and all but compared to some of your other creations i dunno bro..I think it's the pineapple on pizza thing..not into it
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IT’S ALL ABOUT THE PINEAPPLE!!!!

#threadderailed
 
Mikereyn513 said:
Dude not even gonna lie to you because your my boy and all but that's the first thing you've made that just doesn't look appetizing to me. I mean I'd eat it for the gains and all but compared to some of your other creations i dunno bro..I think it's the pineapple on pizza thing..not into it
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I can understand that, Hawaiian pizza is my absolute favorite novelty pizza tho
 
Mikereyn513 said:
Dude not even gonna lie to you because your my boy and all but that's the first thing you've made that just doesn't look appetizing to me. I mean I'd eat it for the gains and all but compared to some of your other creations i dunno bro..I think it's the pineapple on pizza thing..not into it
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I'd like to introduce you to my liver meatballs
 
Hyde said:
What makes you think surgery is inevitable? I’m not saying it shouldn’t happen, just curious why in your case specifically.
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I’ve met with multiple neuro surgeons and highly regarded athletic medical personnel that have gone over my mri with me. Pretty much all conclude that I’ll eventually need it, but bc of my age (27) to do everything I can to avoid it for as long as possible.
 
Stressed out job hunting today… and then there is this guy who doesn’t pay any damn bills lol Invalid Link Removed
 
Dustin07 said:
You know what's funny... IDK if it's cause I grew up on a small beef farm or what but if I'm having a steak my choices are ribeye or fillet mignon. My wife loves leaner cuts, NY I believe is usually her go to. But if I get to choose any meat at all, I'm typically going with a ground beef or ground lamb for burgers or something... or if I have the time to do a low and slow smoke I will eat myself into a coma with a big fat brisket or pork butt.... I like to throw something thats over 7-8lbs on the smoker early in the morning and let it go at least an hour per lb, then finish wrapped in foil for another 2hrs.. I can easily eat a pound or more of that by myself for days on end lol
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Ribeye is where it’s at as far as steak. Nothing wrong with fillet either. Smoked meats are great. I cook a lot of pork butts and ribs. Did a brisket a few months ago for the first time. Turned out great.
 
Hyde said:
Look it up, but Stir the Pot is a plank where your forearms rest on an exercise ball instead of the floor. Then, with clasped hands, you very minutely “stir” the ball in little circles for “reps” or time, which lights the hell out of your abs and obliques. Shoot for 30 seconds your first go, or 15 reps each way.
Click to expand...

Most underrated exercise ever
 
Mr Green said:
I’ve met with multiple neuro surgeons and highly regarded athletic medical personnel that have gone over my mri with me. Pretty much all conclude that I’ll eventually need it, but bc of my age (27) to do everything I can to avoid it for as long as possible.
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If it’s disc trauma, if it’s manageable now the discs actually desiccate & callus with age. Shattered bone can even heal (Brian Carroll took the appropriate time off to rehab and went from squatting 1,200 to 1,300).

My limited understanding is things like bone spurring or chronic disorders like that are what can really require surgery, or when total reconstruction/replacement is needed post trauma obviously but if you are managing now that’s not you.

I am not trying to be obtuse in any way because I am only replying based on what you have shared, I just want to impart the idea that a lot of medical specialists are flat out wrong when it comes to human potential for recovery. They try to set reasonable expectations so you don’t get blindsided if it comes time to pay the piper, but this can also unnecessarily eliminate hope from a lot of people.
 
Hyde said:
My limited understanding is things like bone spurring or chronic disorders like that are what can really require surgery, or when total reconstruction/replacement is needed post trauma obviously but if you are managing now that’s not you.

I am not trying to be obtuse in any way because I am only replying based on what you have shared, I just want to impart the idea that a lot of medical specialists are flat out wrong when it comes to human potential for recovery. They try to set reasonable expectations so you don’t get blindsided if it comes time to pay the piper, but this can also unnecessarily eliminate hope from a lot of people.
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sorta building off this, when I broke my clavicle into three pieces my surgeon was old school, probably 70 back then even (circa 2006) and he did NOT want to surgerize me unless he absolutely had to. I sat in a butterfly brace/cast for 2 months and basically begged him to screw my bones back together so I could get back in the gym. I asked why not do the surgery, you don't like to do it? "No, it's a very interesting surgery and I enjoy it, but I don't want to cut you open if I don't have to". I now have a 6" steel plate in my shoulder which tends to hurt badly when I'm lean, but I haven't broken it again.

6 months later when I tore my ACL we did the same song and dance, but since I had full mobility, with a blown out ACL he said lets not do the surgery unless there is a catastrophic event. after more than a decade of fitness sports, xfit comps, oly lifting and everything else, I still have not had my acl surgery and my left knee is great.

7 years ago my bone spur was discovered via x-ray at that L5 and they were convinced I needed surgery. Never got it, zero back pain.

I guess everything is just personal opinion and situation but I lean heavily against surgery when possible. my former mother in law gets a surgery annually and I'm not sure shes needed any of them.
 
Dustin07 said:
sorta building off this, when I broke my clavicle into three pieces my surgeon was old school, probably 70 back then even (circa 2006) and he did NOT want to surgerize me unless he absolutely had to. I sat in a butterfly brace/cast for 2 months and basically begged him to screw my bones back together so I could get back in the gym. I asked why not do the surgery, you don't like to do it? "No, it's a very interesting surgery and I enjoy it, but I don't want to cut you open if I don't have to". I now have a 6" steel plate in my shoulder which tends to hurt badly when I'm lean, but I haven't broken it again.

6 months later when I tore my ACL we did the same song and dance, but since I had full mobility, with a blown out ACL he said lets not do the surgery unless there is a catastrophic event. after more than a decade of fitness sports, xfit comps, oly lifting and everything else, I still have not had my acl surgery and my left knee is great.

7 years ago my bone spur was discovered via x-ray at that L5 and they were convinced I needed surgery. Never got it, zero back pain.

I guess everything is just personal opinion and situation but I lean heavily against surgery when possible. my former mother in law gets a surgery annually and I'm not sure shes needed any of them.
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I mean I have heard the weirdest stuff with back pain, having tried to listen to a lot of lifters stories when dealing with my rehabs. JM Blakley became a Bench specialist after he couldn’t squat or pull anymore, but after years of terrible chronic, defeating pain…it just stopped at some point. The pain went away, no explanation, but it never came back.

Usually surgery is the right call when right now things are totally unmanageable. Chad Wesley Smith and Cory “Swede” Burns have stories where they had surgeries because they absolutely could not operate acutely - that makes a lot of sense to me.

But I would give up squatting before I got spinal surgery. And anyone who knows me knows I would give up my marriage before squatting (my wife understands this).
 
Hyde said:
But I would give up squatting before I got spinal surgery.
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I agree with that. There are some really interesting studies indicating a LOT of it can be in the head. Doesn't mean it's just controllable mental consciousness but could be fuckery in neural receptors. One of the best theories I had from a PT was "I believe you had a serious injury and your body is essentially still trying to protect an area where an injury no longer exists".

I have no idea how to define surgery worthy injury vs non because mine was vomit inducing and yet here I am setting PRs finally a few years later surgery free. But like you, my inclination is to avoid unnecessary back surgery at all costs and just keep finding a million things that don't fix it until you find the one that does.
 
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