This is important info that everyone running cycles needs to know. There's a lot of good guys that have contributed to this thread as well, I've learned a few things as well.Always doing deeds for the community.
This is important info that everyone running cycles needs to know. There's a lot of good guys that have contributed to this thread as well, I've learned a few things as well.Always doing deeds for the community.
80 mg of nolva Jesus.. Women with breast cancer don't even have a dose near thatNo need for 80mgs of nolva 40-50 should be MORE then plenty
People don't realize how strong nolva is.80 mg of nolva Jesus.. Women with breast cancer don't even have a dose near that
And how toxic... Its linked to lymphoma tooPeople don't realize how strong nolva is.
Lol ok "bro"Lol OK oncologist
Of course Tamoxifene is toxi, is this a joke? This is a genotoxic first gen SERM and not some smarties.Its not toxic.
Who the **** said they were smarties? From a clinical perspective, its NOT toxic. Its amazing how you throw around a word like that if AST/ALT levels are jumping through the roof like popping Halotestin. Woman takes this for YEARS and have zero problems and the only effects of liver toxicity or serious effects have been in women with pre-existing cancer and and increase in fatty liver which was easily reversed. Long term data show outliers, as with all drugs. Its not toxic for any man taking it for 6-8 weeks at reasonable doses. Its not even close.Of course Tamoxifene is toxi, is this a joke? This is a genotoxic first gen SERM and not some smarties.
That's also the reason 1) to use a second gen SERM, if possible (except Raloxifene, which has a teratogenic effect) and 2) do a proper PCT (if its necessary and when using it, do it RIGHT -> not eating 80mg of this stuff when even 20mg/ed works perfectly in men).
I've gotta agree with your comparison to Tylenol as far as toxicity is concerned. It's a long term option for women with cancer...Who the **** said they were smarties? From a clinical perspective, its NOT toxic. Its amazing how you throw around a word like that if AST/ALT levels are jumping through the roof like popping Halotestin. Woman takes this for YEARS and have zero problems and the only effects of liver toxicity or serious effects have been in women with pre-existing cancer and and increase in fatty liver which was easily reversed. Long term data show outliers, as with all drugs. Its not toxic for any man taking it for 6-8 weeks at reasonable doses. Its not even close.
Its a long term option and the only increases in cancer cases were seen in endometrial cells...and it was extremely rare. So I guess its toxic to those men who have a uterus.I've gotta agree with your comparison to Tylenol as far as toxicity is concerned. It's a long term option for women with cancer...
There's a few dudes on here that obviously do lmaoIts a long term option and the only increases in cancer cases was seen in endometrial cells, and it was extremely rare. So I guess its toxic to those men who have a uterus.
You said it. :lol:There's a few dudes on here that obviously do lmao
Then please tell me how its toxic and how thats relevant to anyone on this forum.Well as toxic is not necessarily carcinogenic I agree on the latter not really being a problem. But Tamoxifene is still toxic. Hence the EU-Gefahrstoffkenzeichnung (classifies chemicals in risks) is T (giftig) and that means its toxic!
Week two of PCT on Clomid and I got weepy eyed watching a repeat of America's Got Talent last night. My wife caught me and started laughing. She said "does this mean when we go to bed you're going to want to cuddle and talk about your feelings?"There's a few dudes on here that obviously do lmao
Hahahaha large doses of clomid do me the same way! 100mg made me feel like I grew a vagina overnight, never againWeek two of PCT on Clomid and I got weepy eyed watching a repeat of America's Got Talent last night. My wife caught me and started laughing. She said "does this mean when we go to bed you're going to want to cuddle and talk about your feelings?"
Apparantly, since Clomid makes men grow uterus's it should not be taken in conjunction with Tamoxifen.
hahahahaWeek two of PCT on Clomid and I got weepy eyed watching a repeat of America's Got Talent last night. My wife caught me and started laughing. She said "does this mean when we go to bed you're going to want to cuddle and talk about your feelings?"
Apparantly, since Clomid makes men grow uterus's it should not be taken in conjunction with Tamoxifen.
::crickets::Then please tell me how its toxic and how thats relevant to anyone on this forum.
Not trying to shut anyone down, but the notion that its "toxic" is so overblown and simply not true. I cant imagine if these same people saw the data on blood pressure and cholesterol meds. In their world, it would be considered mega toxic.::crickets::
When you're right you're right. It is considered "toxic" but it just doesn't equate to the bb world. Just kinda funny to me that guys will eat 17a methylated steroids but want to worry about negative effects of serms and their toxicity level. Kinda ironic.Not trying to shut anyone down, but the notion that its "toxic" is so overblown and simply not true. I cant imagine if these same people saw the data on blood pressure and cholesterol meds. In their world, it would be considered mega toxic.
I never stated that it is relevant to the users on this forum. I don't have anything against the responsible use of Tamoxifen and agree that there are much things, including the steroids themselves, to worry more about.Then please tell me how its toxic and how thats relevant to anyone on this forum.
this made me DIE of laughter.Its ignorance such as yours that continue to strengthen the meathead stereotype.
Actually you can because there is a major difference between adverse effects of outliers that are not consistent (the majority of side effects in tamoxifen), vs. side effects that are consistent and proven (ie methylated steroids). One is considered structurally toxic. The other has side effects that can be damaging in rare cases. Its not structurally toxic nor are the side effects the 99% of the people taking them. Its apples and oranges.I never stated that it is relevant to the users on this forum. I don't have anything against the responsible use of Tamoxifen and agree that there are much things, including the steroids themselves, to worry more about.
However a substance is toxic if a defined (low compared to the amount of food intake) dosage of the substance will damage the body.
And that just is true in regards to Tamoxifen.
You can't just say something isn't toxic because its not that toxic that it will hurt you in the way you are using it. Saying Tamoxifen is not toxic is just plain untrue.
I actually thought that guy was going to be ok for a bit.... Turns out he's been kicked off a few forums and is in the flames over on Meso right now.Dr. Kiwigear, paging Dr. Kiwigear, you're needed in the Rumor Perpetuation Department please, thank you!
He acts like a know it all prick. Yeah i'll run 5g of gear then say tamoxifen is toxic GENIUS.I actually thought that guy was going to be ok for a bit.... Turns out he's been kicked off a few forums and is in the flames over on Meso right now.
Some guys just don't play nice with others I suppose
I think it's because he brews his own gear. A lot of guys who do that think they're scientists or doctors all of a sudden. I guess if I was running 5 grams of product I would think I was the top dog/always right too hahaHe acts like a know it all prick. Yeah i'll run 5g of gear then say tamoxifen is toxic GENIUS.
OMG is that a scary thought.I think it's because he brews his own gear. A lot of guys who do that think they're scientists or doctors all of a sudden. I guess if I was running 5 grams of product I would think I was the top dog/always right too haha
Oh I'm sure it's not that bad once he disinfects his bath tub with Lysol wipes..OMG is that a scary thought.
I just discovered this thread and, as a newbie, found it to be a very concise and informative guide into the use of SERMS in a PCT, and think it probably saved me months of research and asking redundant/annoying questions...I think oncologists know more dude lol
TUDCA and NAC.I just discovered this thread and, as a newbie, found it to be a very concise and informative guide into the use of SERMS in a PCT, and think it probably saved me months of research and asking redundant/annoying questions...
After a couple hours of reading this thread, I get to the childish and bullsh1t snarky f*ckn remark (and the others that followed) that is making me laugh my ass off...
Anyway, insofar as liver toxicity is concerned with respect to a standard dosage of tamoxifen during PCT, what OTC sup or ingredients would be best to run to help get enzymes back in check?
And opiates. They put people on pain management and thrash their freaking liversNot trying to shut anyone down, but the notion that its "toxic" is so overblown and simply not true. I cant imagine if these same people saw the data on blood pressure and cholesterol meds. In their world, it would be considered mega toxic.
That's my personal protocol that I've used a few times now to deal with gyno. It works great for me. How bad is your gyno?Has anyone tried the gyno reversal protocol? Was gonna use letro but **** crashing my estrogen.
That's my personal protocol that I've used a few times now to deal with gyno. It works great for me. How bad is your gyno?
Anything that interacts with the androgen receptors can cause high estrogen sides, lots of people find that out the hard way. My gyno protocol should at least shrink your gyno a good deal and you will just need to be ready with all the proper ancillaries any time you decide to cycle.Ehh not too bad but bad enough to where it bugs me. It's not bad to the point where you stop and stare or day "dayum". But it's noticeable. I had it during puberty, and then it went away and came back when I ran ostarine and the guy who sold it to me assured me i wouldn't need an AI. Learned my lesson the hard way.
You shouldn't have any issues on lgd especially that low a dose. I would recommend ramping that dose up to at least 10mg after a few weeks. Don't use any ai on cycle unless your gyno starts to get aggravated but if it does start bothering you 12.5mg eod is a good starting place for aromasin.Yeah I plan on running Lgd this winter at 5mg. I'll have everything on hand. Gonna use aromasin for ai and clomid for pct. What dose of the aromasin would you recommend using for that cycle? It'll be 4 weeks, maybe 6 if I feel I can go longer.
Btw, been following a lot of the guides and stuff you've put up and it's very much appreciated. I just wish I had found it sooner lol.
I ran 30 mg ostarine and that's how I got the existing gyno. Is lgd less prone to estrogen sides? Because I should have been on the aromasin on that dose of ostarine, but I was told I shouldn't have to be.You shouldn't have any issues on lgd especially that low a dose. I would recommend ramping that dose up to at least 10mg after a few weeks. Don't use any ai on cycle unless your gyno starts to get aggravated but if it does start bothering you 12.5mg eod is a good starting place for aromasin.
It's all user dependant but I have heard nothing about esteogen sides on lgd. It is always possible to get high estrogen sides any time you use a compound that interacts with the androgen receptors.I ran 30 mg ostarine and that's how I got the existing gyno. Is lgd less prone to estrogen sides? Because I should have been on the aromasin on that dose of ostarine, but I was told I shouldn't have to be.
I ran Eric Potraz 16 week Androhard protocol for my gyno. My gyno wasn't that bad, but it bugged me quite a lot.Has anyone tried the gyno reversal protocol? Was gonna use letro but **** crashing my estrogen.
The two that immediately come to mind are a greater chance of losing more of what he gained on cycle, and T levels not recovering to what they were before cycle.Out of curiosity... I know a dude who has run 2 cycles of PH, and used an OTC PCT each time to recover. Since a SERM springs you back faster, what are the risk that he is running from just using an OTC only.