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EvoMuse Presents: Epitome™

MidwestBeast said:
Part of it is if you're utilizing Basic or Rebirth, too -- when I dosed Rebirth it was first thing AM and right before bed; the Epitome being spaced out had more leptin control throughout the day.

What I would say is feel free to take it first thing upon rising if it benefits you getting the 2nd dose in prior to working out. However, if it's a true off day, wait a couple hours and then take dose 1.
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Taking pre workout won't be an obstacle to the anabolic effects of lifting?
 
thebody47 said:
Taking pre workout won't be an obstacle to the anabolic effects of lifting?
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Rebirth?

Not that I recall, but I can't remember for sure (whereas I know Epitome you want away to keep from hindering protein synthesis).

I didn't stick with it very long because I am lazy and didn't like having to mix one more shaker cup lol.
 
MidwestBeast said:
Rebirth?

Not that I recall, but I can't remember for sure (whereas I know Epitome you want away to keep from hindering protein synthesis).

I didn't stick with it very long because I am lazy and didn't like having to mix one more shaker cup lol.
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Sorry about that. I was speaking of epitome.
 
Ah yes, you want 3-4 hours of separation with Epitome before or after lifting
 
What's the best way to dose with ammo ? Might be buying that stack today
 
Ammo when you wake up and go to sleep. Epitome mid morning and mid-afternoon, but a couple of hours away from any lifting workout.
 
dsade said:
Ammo when you wake up and go to sleep. Epitome mid morning and mid-afternoon, but a couple of hours away from any lifting workout.
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Ok thanks I pmed you
 
AndrewMcD said:
Should there be any fear of inhibition of MPS with this? Like there is with berberine?
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Yeah, that's why the recommendation to avoid taking it around workouts, unless it's not a concern and you're just going for a fat loss blitz.
 
dsade said:
Yeah, that's why the recommendation to avoid taking it around workouts, unless it's not a concern and you're just going for a fat loss blitz.
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It is a concern. I work out around 8am every morning. When would you recommend taking this? Currently at 10% bf and finishing a few bottles of some fat loss products and need new ones!
 
Wait until around noon, then second dose around 6
 
I work out at 5:45 and am done at 7:30. I normally dose 11 and then 3 or 4 PM
 
dsade said:
Wait until around noon, then second dose around 6
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awesome! Anything else you recommend in addition to get to 8% ish? Weather its increased fat burning or muscle preservation!

Im currently using Ketoinduce! Went from 12% bf to 10% in the last week. Freaking insane!
 
AndrewMcD said:
awesome! Anything else you recommend in addition to get to 8% ish? Weather its increased fat burning or muscle preservation!

Im currently using Ketoinduce! Went from 12% bf to 10% in the last week. Freaking insane!
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That's really freakin impressive!

AMMO and Epitome have major, major synergy together. I would definitely recommend bringing it in.
 
Just brought AMMO back in (have been on Epitome quite a while) and it's noticeable.

At your bf%, Eviscerate will likely really make a visual difference, too.
 
dsade said:
That's really freakin impressive!

AMMO and Epitome have major, major synergy together. I would definitely recommend bringing it in.
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Actually just finished a 4 week run of AMMO ;) Have also been running BRITE now for 4 months and ran PES Shift and Lipomorph for the past 6 weeks. Although for the first 2.5 weeks of my cut I got the flu and wouldnt even really consider it a cut but still ran those sups.
 
AndrewMcD said:
Actually just finished a 4 week run of AMMO ;) Have also been running BRITE now for 4 months and ran PES Shift and Lipomorph for the past 6 weeks. Although for the first 2.5 weeks of my cut I got the flu and wouldnt even really consider it a cut but still ran those sups.
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What sort of diet are you on?
 
Anyone get a headache from epitome ? I'm wondering if it's epitome or just allergies and it should be taken on an empty stomach correct ?
 
I got headaches but I increased water intake a decent amount and they seemed to subside.
 
I am Reffing basketball and I did about 12 games yesterday and my head was killing me , I'll take an allergy today but I did drink my normal gallon of water hopefully it's just allergies , I am sweating so much on this stuff
 
Afi140 said:
I got headaches but I increased water intake a decent amount and they seemed to subside.
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This. The others that reported headaches increased hydration and they went right away.
 
Good morning my wife already lost 2lbs on ammo/epitome stack no cardio just weights. I may have to get in on this next month, I took one dose of each to show her how it should be taken and she's loving it. 4 days in and she's down 2lbs is impressive.
 
luckylefty811 said:
Good morning my wife already lost 2lbs on ammo/epitome stack no cardio just weights. I may have to get in on this next month, I took one dose of each to show her how it should be taken and she's loving it. 4 days in and she's down 2lbs is impressive.
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Glad to hear it! It's a heck of a stack and both of them are play in my personal arsenal right now.
 
luckylefty811 said:
Good morning my wife already lost 2lbs on ammo/epitome stack no cardio just weights. I may have to get in on this next month, I took one dose of each to show her how it should be taken and she's loving it. 4 days in and she's down 2lbs is impressive.
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It's some good stuff. Keep us updated on the progress!
 
My wife is saying she gets really hungry by 6pm is that some of the signs it's working , her schedule is ammo wake up , epitome 10:30am and 3:30pm and comes home hungry each day. We hit the gym around 6-630 pm.
 
Yeah, most definitely. Bump the afternoon dosage up to 4, and it should put a damper on the cravings.

She getting the cravings Preworkout, during, or after?
 
dsade said:
Yeah, most definitely. Bump the afternoon dosage up to 4, and it should put a damper on the cravings.

She getting the cravings Preworkout, during, or after?
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Pre workout, she wanted to eat before we left I was like no just drink some water wait until after. I made kale wontons and devoured them. I'll tell her to wait until 4-430 and see what happens , thanks
 
Do they go away during/after the workout?
 
dsade said:
Do they go away during/after the workout?
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She said like a starving hungry feeling , not stomach pains but just that she needs to eat something.
 
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Maybe they could use some Epitome
 
Article goes into some mention of leptin sensitivity
 
Avengeme said:
What ever happened to keeping the dosing away from protein intake because of the hindrance on protein synthesis?
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Not protein intake, per se, just workouts. There's always going to be a hard interplay between AMPk activation and mTOR activation, since AMPk activation is a low energy state signal (burn fat, no extra resources towards MPS) and mTOR activation (protein/caloric intake high, expend resources building muscle.)
 
Scand J Med Sci Sports. 2013 Jun;23(3):355-66.
Differentiated mTOR but not AMPK signaling after strength vs endurance exercise in training-accustomed individuals.
Vissing K1, McGee S, Farup J, Kjølhede T, Vendelbo M, Jessen N.
Author information
Abstract

The influence of adenosine mono phosphate (AMP)-activated protein kinase (AMPK) vs Akt-mammalian target of rapamycin C1 (mTORC1) protein signaling mechanisms on converting differentiated exercise into training specific adaptations is not well-established. To investigate this, human subjects were divided into endurance, strength, and non-exercise control groups. Data were obtained before and during post-exercise recovery from single-bout exercise, conducted with an exercise mode to which the exercise subjects were accustomed through 10 weeks of prior training. Blood and muscle samples were analyzed for plasma substrates and hormones and for muscle markers of AMPK and Akt-mTORC1 protein signaling. Increases in plasma glucose, insulin, growth hormone (GH), and insulin-like growth factor (IGF)-1, and in phosphorylated muscle phospho-Akt substrate (PAS) of 160 kDa, mTOR, 70 kDa ribosomal protein S6 kinase, eukaryotic initiation factor 4E, and glycogen synthase kinase 3a were observed after strength exercise. Increased phosphorylation of AMPK, histone deacetylase5 (HDAC5), cAMP response element-binding protein, and acetyl-CoA carboxylase (ACC) was observed after endurance exercise, but not differently from after strength exercise. No changes in protein phosphorylation were observed in non-exercise controls. Endurance training produced an increase in maximal oxygen uptake and a decrease in submaximal exercise heart rate, while strength training produced increases in muscle cross-sectional area and strength. No changes in basal levels of signaling proteins were observed in response to training. The results support that in training-accustomed individuals, mTORC1 signaling is preferentially activated after hypertrophy-inducing exercise, while AMPK signaling is less specific for differentiated exercise.

PMID:
23802289
[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
 
I work out at 5 AM. Finish by 7:30. Dose 1 is 11 AM. Dose 2 at 4 PM. Bed around 9 PM.
 
Also here....no copy/paste for this on, though.

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EDIT: Key section:

Recent evidence indicates that mTORC1 and AMPK may represent two antagonistic forces governing muscle adaptation to nutrition, starvation, and growth stimulation [15]. Activation of AMPK leads to the inhibition of mTORC1 in a TSC1/2-dependent or ‐independent mechanism [10], [16] and [17]. Moreover, in animal models with impaired mTORC1 signaling, AMPK is highly activated [18], suggesting a negative crosstalk between these two pathways. A study by Rivas et al. showed that diet-induced mTORC1 over-stimulation and skeletal muscle IR were reversed by 4 weeks of exercise training, which was associated with enhanced muscle AMPK activation [13]. All of the above results raise the intriguing possibility that AMPK-dependent mTORC1 signaling inhibition in skeletal muscle may be a critical mechanism in the process of endurance exercise ameliorating IR. However, direct evidence of the molecular link between AMPK and mTOR, especially in the insulin-resistant state, and the role and underlying mechanisms of this interaction in the regulating process of aerobic exercise ameliorating IR still need to be determined.
 
If I workout at 830am is it okay I take Epitome at 6am? Or too close to gym time? I also take Ammo at 6am and bed time.


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Also does anyone's appetite run wild on Epitome and\or Ammo? Holy crap I end up pigging out every night after dinner. Not sure if its a coincidence.

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Epitome ramped my hunger up big time at first. I'm guessing my leptin levels were just all jacked up. Since then I get the exact opposite -- solid appetite suppression (e.g. no cravings)
 
Yeah I need to stop using this stuff because I'm eating thousands of extra calories it's insane

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My mom is just getting back into things and I had hooked her up with a bottle of F95 that she just finished up. I had some bulk caps of garcinia cambogia and raspberry ketones I'd sent her along with, too, but she told me she was ready for the big guns. Just shipped her a bottle of Epitome and AMMO that she'll get on Thursday.

I'll report back on her progress :)
 
MidwestBeast said:
My mom is just getting back into things and I had hooked her up with a bottle of F95 that she just finished up. I had some bulk caps of garcinia cambogia and raspberry ketones I'd sent her along with, too, but she told me she was ready for the big guns. Just shipped her a bottle of Epitome and AMMO that she'll get on Thursday.

I'll report back on her progress :)
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Can I be your mom?
 
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