USPlabsRep
Board Sponsor
Studies have shown glutamine is useless, I've dropped it recently. Save your money for something else
Could you please post the studies?
PES- Amino IV
- Thread starter bdcc
- Start date
Could you please post the studies?
Wilsy7
Active member
There was a thread about it a while back. Use the search button I'm sure you'll see it there.
USPlabsRep
Board Sponsor
a thread is not "studies"
jswain34
Well-known member
Disagreed! Theyre peer reviewed and everything!
USPlabsRep
Board Sponsor
and Copper is really Einstein
bdcc
Legend
I haven't tried it yet. I am sure someone will soon.
You know how people love combining lol.
The Solution
Legend
Addition of glutamine to essential amino acids and carbohydrate does not enhance anabolism in young human males following exercise.
Wilkinson SB, Kim PL, Armstrong D, Phillips SM.
Exercise Metabolism Research Group, Department of Kinesiology, McMaster University, 1280 Main St. West, Hamilton, ON L8S 4K1, Canada.
We examined the effect of a post-exercise oral carbohydrate (CHO, 1 g.kg(-1).h(-1)) and essential amino acid (EAA, 9.25 g) solution containing glutamine (0.3 g/kg BW; GLN trial) versus an isoenergetic CHO-EAA solution without glutamine (control, CON trial) on muscle glycogen resynthesis and whole-body protein turnover following 90 min of cycling at 65% VO2 peak. Over the course of 3 h of recovery, muscle biopsies were taken to measure glycogen resynthesis and mixed muscle protein synthesis (MPS), by incorporation of [ring-2H5] phenylalanine. Infusion of [1-13C] leucine was used to measure whole-body protein turnover. Exercise resulted in a significant decrease in muscle glycogen (p < 0.05) with similar declines in each trial. Glycogen resynthesis following 3 h of recovery indicated no difference in total accumulation or rate of repletion. Leucine oxidation increased 2.5 fold (p < 0.05) during exercise, returned to resting levels immediately post-exercise,and was again elevated at 3 h post-exercise (p < 0.05). Leucine flux, an index of whole-body protein breakdown rate, was reduced during exercise, but increased to resting levels immediately post-exercise, and was further increased at 3 h post-exercise (p < 0.05), but only during the CON trial. Exercise resulted in a marked suppression of whole-body protein synthesis (50% of rest; p < 0.05), which was restored post-exercise; however, the addition of glutamine did not affect whole-body protein synthesis post-exercise. The rate of MPS was not different between trials. The addition of glutamine to a CHO + EAA beverage had no effect on post-exercise muscle glycogen resynthesis or muscle protein synthesis, but may suppress a rise in whole-body proteolysis during the later stages of recovery.
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Effect of glutamine supplementation combined with resistance training in young adults.
Candow DG, Chilibeck PD, Burke DG, Davison KS, Smith-Palmer T.
College of Kinesiology, University of Saskatchewan, Saskatoon, Canada.
The purpose of this study was to assess the effect of oral glutamine supplementation combined with resistance training in young adults. A group of 31 subjects, aged 18-24 years, were randomly allocated to groups (double blind) to receive either glutamine (0.9 g x kg lean tissue mass(-1) x day(-1); n = 17) or a placebo (0.9 g maltodextrin x kg lean tissue mass(-1) x day(-1); n = 14 during 6 weeks of total body resistance training. Exercises were performed for four to five sets of 6-12 repetitions at intensities ranging from 60% to 90% 1 repetition maximum (1 RM). Before and after training, measurements were taken of 1 RM squat and bench press strength, peak knee extension torque (using an isokinetic dynamometer), lean tissue mass (dual energy X-ray absorptiometry) and muscle protein degradation (urinary 3-methylhistidine by high performance liquid chromatography). Repeated measures ANOVA showed that strength, torque, lean tissue mass and 3-methylhistidine increased with training (P < 0.05), with no significant difference between groups. Both groups increased their 1 RM squat by approximately 30% and 1 RM bench press by approximately 14%. The glutamine group showed increases of 6% for knee extension torque, 2% for lean tissue mass and 41% for urinary levels of 3-methylhistidine. The placebo group increased knee extension torque by 5%, lean tissue mass by 1.7% and 3-methylhistidine by 56%. We conclude that glutamine supplementation during resistance training has no significant effect on muscle performance, body composition or muscle protein degradation in young healthy adults.
Invalid Link Removed
Wilkinson SB, Kim PL, Armstrong D, Phillips SM.
Exercise Metabolism Research Group, Department of Kinesiology, McMaster University, 1280 Main St. West, Hamilton, ON L8S 4K1, Canada.
We examined the effect of a post-exercise oral carbohydrate (CHO, 1 g.kg(-1).h(-1)) and essential amino acid (EAA, 9.25 g) solution containing glutamine (0.3 g/kg BW; GLN trial) versus an isoenergetic CHO-EAA solution without glutamine (control, CON trial) on muscle glycogen resynthesis and whole-body protein turnover following 90 min of cycling at 65% VO2 peak. Over the course of 3 h of recovery, muscle biopsies were taken to measure glycogen resynthesis and mixed muscle protein synthesis (MPS), by incorporation of [ring-2H5] phenylalanine. Infusion of [1-13C] leucine was used to measure whole-body protein turnover. Exercise resulted in a significant decrease in muscle glycogen (p < 0.05) with similar declines in each trial. Glycogen resynthesis following 3 h of recovery indicated no difference in total accumulation or rate of repletion. Leucine oxidation increased 2.5 fold (p < 0.05) during exercise, returned to resting levels immediately post-exercise,and was again elevated at 3 h post-exercise (p < 0.05). Leucine flux, an index of whole-body protein breakdown rate, was reduced during exercise, but increased to resting levels immediately post-exercise, and was further increased at 3 h post-exercise (p < 0.05), but only during the CON trial. Exercise resulted in a marked suppression of whole-body protein synthesis (50% of rest; p < 0.05), which was restored post-exercise; however, the addition of glutamine did not affect whole-body protein synthesis post-exercise. The rate of MPS was not different between trials. The addition of glutamine to a CHO + EAA beverage had no effect on post-exercise muscle glycogen resynthesis or muscle protein synthesis, but may suppress a rise in whole-body proteolysis during the later stages of recovery.
Invalid Link Removed
Effect of glutamine supplementation combined with resistance training in young adults.
Candow DG, Chilibeck PD, Burke DG, Davison KS, Smith-Palmer T.
College of Kinesiology, University of Saskatchewan, Saskatoon, Canada.
The purpose of this study was to assess the effect of oral glutamine supplementation combined with resistance training in young adults. A group of 31 subjects, aged 18-24 years, were randomly allocated to groups (double blind) to receive either glutamine (0.9 g x kg lean tissue mass(-1) x day(-1); n = 17) or a placebo (0.9 g maltodextrin x kg lean tissue mass(-1) x day(-1); n = 14 during 6 weeks of total body resistance training. Exercises were performed for four to five sets of 6-12 repetitions at intensities ranging from 60% to 90% 1 repetition maximum (1 RM). Before and after training, measurements were taken of 1 RM squat and bench press strength, peak knee extension torque (using an isokinetic dynamometer), lean tissue mass (dual energy X-ray absorptiometry) and muscle protein degradation (urinary 3-methylhistidine by high performance liquid chromatography). Repeated measures ANOVA showed that strength, torque, lean tissue mass and 3-methylhistidine increased with training (P < 0.05), with no significant difference between groups. Both groups increased their 1 RM squat by approximately 30% and 1 RM bench press by approximately 14%. The glutamine group showed increases of 6% for knee extension torque, 2% for lean tissue mass and 41% for urinary levels of 3-methylhistidine. The placebo group increased knee extension torque by 5%, lean tissue mass by 1.7% and 3-methylhistidine by 56%. We conclude that glutamine supplementation during resistance training has no significant effect on muscle performance, body composition or muscle protein degradation in young healthy adults.
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The Solution
Legend
The effects of high-dose glutamine ingestion on weightlifting performance.
Antonio J, Sanders MS, Kalman D, Woodgate D, Street C.
Sports Science Laboratory, University of Delaware, Newark, Delaware 19716, USA.
The purpose of this study was to determine if high-dose glutamine ingestion affected weightlifting performance. In a double-blind, placebo-controlled, crossover study, 6 resistance-trained men (mean +/- SE: age, 21.5 +/- 0.3 years; weight, 76.5 +/- 2.8 kg(-1)) performed weightlifting exercises after the ingestion of glutamine or glycine (0.3 g x kg(-1)) mixed with calorie-free fruit juice or placebo (calorie-free fruit juice only). Each subject underwent each of the 3 treatments in a randomized order. One hour after ingestion, subjects performed 4 total sets of exercise to momentary muscular failure (2 sets of leg presses at 200% of body weight, 2 sets of bench presses at 100% of body weight). There were no differences in the average number of maximal repetitions performed in the leg press or bench press exercises among the 3 groups. These data indicate that the short-term ingestion of glutamine does not enhance weightlifting performance in resistance-trained men.
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Facts and fallacies of purported ergogenic amino acid supplements.
Williams MH.
Department of Exercise Science, Physical Education, and Recreation, Old Dominion University, Norfolk, Virginia, USA. [email protected]
Although current research suggests that individuals involved in either high-intensity resistance or endurance exercise may have an increased need for dietary protein, the available research is either equivocal or negative relative to the ergogenic effects of supplementation with individual amino acids. Although some research suggests that the induction of hyperaminoacidemia via intravenous infusion of a balanced amino acid mixture may induce an increased muscle protein synthesis after exercise, no data support the finding that oral supplementation with amino acids, in contrast to dietary protein, as the source of amino acids is more effective. Some well-controlled studies suggest that aspartate salt supplementation may enhance endurance performance, but other studies do not, meriting additional research. Current data, including results for several well-controlled studies, indicated that supplementation with arginine, ornithine, or lysine, either separately or in combination, does not enhance the effect of exercise stimulation on either hGH or various measures of muscular strength or power in experienced weightlifters. Plasma levels of BCAA and tryptophan may play important roles in the cause of central fatigue during exercise, but the effects of BCAA or tryptophan supplementation do not seem to be effective ergogenics for endurance exercise performance, particularly when compared with carbohydrate supplementation, a more natural choice. Although glutamine supplementation may increase plasma glutamine levels, its effect on enhancement of the immune system and prevention of adverse effects of the overtraining syndrome are equivocal. Glycine, a precursor for creatine, does not seem to possess the ergogenic potential of creatine supplementation. Research with metabolic by-products of amino acid metabolism is in its infancy, and current research findings are equivocal relative to ergogenic applications. In general, physically active individuals are advised to obtain necessary amino acids through consumption of natural, high-quality protein foods.
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Exercise-induced immunodepression- plasma glutamine is not the link.
Hiscock N, Pedersen BK.
Copenhagen Muscle Research Centre and Department of Infectious Diseases, Rigshospitalet, University of Copenhagen, DK-2100 Copenhagen, Denmark.
The amino acid glutamine is known to be important for the function of some immune cells in vitro. It has been proposed that the decrease in plasma glutamine concentration in relation to catabolic conditions, including prolonged, exhaustive exercise, results in a lack of glutamine for these cells and may be responsible for the transient immunodepression commonly observed after acute, exhaustive exercise. It has been unclear, however, whether the magnitude of the observed decrease in plasma glutamine concentration would be great enough to compromise the function of immune cells. In fact, intracellular glutamine concentration may not be compromised when plasma levels are decreased postexercise. In addition, a number of recent intervention studies with glutamine feeding demonstrate that, although the plasma concentration of glutamine is kept constant during and after acute, strenuous exercise, glutamine supplementation does not abolish the postexercise decrease in in vitro cellular immunity, including low lymphocyte number, impaired lymphocyte proliferation, impaired natural killer and lymphokine-activated killer cell activity, as well as low production rate and concentration of salivary IgA. It is concluded that, although the glutamine hypothesis may explain immunodepression related to other stressful conditions such as trauma and burn, plasma glutamine concentration is not likely to play a mechanistic role in exercise-induced immunodepression.
Invalid Link Removed
Antonio J, Sanders MS, Kalman D, Woodgate D, Street C.
Sports Science Laboratory, University of Delaware, Newark, Delaware 19716, USA.
The purpose of this study was to determine if high-dose glutamine ingestion affected weightlifting performance. In a double-blind, placebo-controlled, crossover study, 6 resistance-trained men (mean +/- SE: age, 21.5 +/- 0.3 years; weight, 76.5 +/- 2.8 kg(-1)) performed weightlifting exercises after the ingestion of glutamine or glycine (0.3 g x kg(-1)) mixed with calorie-free fruit juice or placebo (calorie-free fruit juice only). Each subject underwent each of the 3 treatments in a randomized order. One hour after ingestion, subjects performed 4 total sets of exercise to momentary muscular failure (2 sets of leg presses at 200% of body weight, 2 sets of bench presses at 100% of body weight). There were no differences in the average number of maximal repetitions performed in the leg press or bench press exercises among the 3 groups. These data indicate that the short-term ingestion of glutamine does not enhance weightlifting performance in resistance-trained men.
Invalid Link Removed
Facts and fallacies of purported ergogenic amino acid supplements.
Williams MH.
Department of Exercise Science, Physical Education, and Recreation, Old Dominion University, Norfolk, Virginia, USA. [email protected]
Although current research suggests that individuals involved in either high-intensity resistance or endurance exercise may have an increased need for dietary protein, the available research is either equivocal or negative relative to the ergogenic effects of supplementation with individual amino acids. Although some research suggests that the induction of hyperaminoacidemia via intravenous infusion of a balanced amino acid mixture may induce an increased muscle protein synthesis after exercise, no data support the finding that oral supplementation with amino acids, in contrast to dietary protein, as the source of amino acids is more effective. Some well-controlled studies suggest that aspartate salt supplementation may enhance endurance performance, but other studies do not, meriting additional research. Current data, including results for several well-controlled studies, indicated that supplementation with arginine, ornithine, or lysine, either separately or in combination, does not enhance the effect of exercise stimulation on either hGH or various measures of muscular strength or power in experienced weightlifters. Plasma levels of BCAA and tryptophan may play important roles in the cause of central fatigue during exercise, but the effects of BCAA or tryptophan supplementation do not seem to be effective ergogenics for endurance exercise performance, particularly when compared with carbohydrate supplementation, a more natural choice. Although glutamine supplementation may increase plasma glutamine levels, its effect on enhancement of the immune system and prevention of adverse effects of the overtraining syndrome are equivocal. Glycine, a precursor for creatine, does not seem to possess the ergogenic potential of creatine supplementation. Research with metabolic by-products of amino acid metabolism is in its infancy, and current research findings are equivocal relative to ergogenic applications. In general, physically active individuals are advised to obtain necessary amino acids through consumption of natural, high-quality protein foods.
Invalid Link Removed
Exercise-induced immunodepression- plasma glutamine is not the link.
Hiscock N, Pedersen BK.
Copenhagen Muscle Research Centre and Department of Infectious Diseases, Rigshospitalet, University of Copenhagen, DK-2100 Copenhagen, Denmark.
The amino acid glutamine is known to be important for the function of some immune cells in vitro. It has been proposed that the decrease in plasma glutamine concentration in relation to catabolic conditions, including prolonged, exhaustive exercise, results in a lack of glutamine for these cells and may be responsible for the transient immunodepression commonly observed after acute, exhaustive exercise. It has been unclear, however, whether the magnitude of the observed decrease in plasma glutamine concentration would be great enough to compromise the function of immune cells. In fact, intracellular glutamine concentration may not be compromised when plasma levels are decreased postexercise. In addition, a number of recent intervention studies with glutamine feeding demonstrate that, although the plasma concentration of glutamine is kept constant during and after acute, strenuous exercise, glutamine supplementation does not abolish the postexercise decrease in in vitro cellular immunity, including low lymphocyte number, impaired lymphocyte proliferation, impaired natural killer and lymphokine-activated killer cell activity, as well as low production rate and concentration of salivary IgA. It is concluded that, although the glutamine hypothesis may explain immunodepression related to other stressful conditions such as trauma and burn, plasma glutamine concentration is not likely to play a mechanistic role in exercise-induced immunodepression.
Invalid Link Removed
The Solution
Legend
With the exception of supplemental glutamine's beneficial role in gastrointestinal disorders (and general gut health), sepsis, and for the recovery from trauma and or surgery.... there's not much sense in administering a product that is very much limited in it's availability for physiological uptake, due to the fact that it's endogenous levels (prior to supplementation) are double the concentration of any other amino acid within the human body (1). Besides.... it's already synthesised within the body in large amounts, found in food, and found in significant amounts within a protein shake.
Endogenous glutamine plays a detrimental role in physiological homeostasis. It plays an equally important role in immune system functions, and most of the glutamine that is utilized for this purpose is naturally synthesized in vivo, and is supplied by the plasma glutamine. In healthy adults, the standard reference ranges for plasma glutamine are around 500-1000 mol/L (2), and do not require supplementation to maintain those figures.
Supplemental glutamine would only benefit us if our intracellular muscle glutamine concentrations were depleted. There are numerous studies that indicate no intracellular muscle glutamine depletion whatsoever following extensive exercise, but even if we do experience some glutamine attenuation.... we are still producing it within us, and getting it through our diet.
In healthy adults, dietary consumption of glutamine has been estimated to be around 5 grams per day (3). Foods such as meat, fish, dairy products, eggs, beans, cabbage, spinach, parsley, beets, ect. are all common sources. A single 3-oz serving of meat contains around 3-4 grams of glutamine. (4)
Now let's add on top of all that, the fact that an average 50 gram protein shake, there's about 4.5+ grams of glutamine. So for a 150 lb individual at only 2 protein shakes a day, that's around 9-10 grams of supplemental glutamine.
So for those of you that feel that glutamine is worth supplementing, we're looking at a minimum of around 15+ grams of glutamine intake per day, in addition to what is being produced endogenously
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Endogenous glutamine plays a detrimental role in physiological homeostasis. It plays an equally important role in immune system functions, and most of the glutamine that is utilized for this purpose is naturally synthesized in vivo, and is supplied by the plasma glutamine. In healthy adults, the standard reference ranges for plasma glutamine are around 500-1000 mol/L (2), and do not require supplementation to maintain those figures.
Supplemental glutamine would only benefit us if our intracellular muscle glutamine concentrations were depleted. There are numerous studies that indicate no intracellular muscle glutamine depletion whatsoever following extensive exercise, but even if we do experience some glutamine attenuation.... we are still producing it within us, and getting it through our diet.
In healthy adults, dietary consumption of glutamine has been estimated to be around 5 grams per day (3). Foods such as meat, fish, dairy products, eggs, beans, cabbage, spinach, parsley, beets, ect. are all common sources. A single 3-oz serving of meat contains around 3-4 grams of glutamine. (4)
Now let's add on top of all that, the fact that an average 50 gram protein shake, there's about 4.5+ grams of glutamine. So for a 150 lb individual at only 2 protein shakes a day, that's around 9-10 grams of supplemental glutamine.
So for those of you that feel that glutamine is worth supplementing, we're looking at a minimum of around 15+ grams of glutamine intake per day, in addition to what is being produced endogenously
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The Solution
Legend
The purpose was to determine if glutamine supplementation would prevent a loss of lean mass in athletes during a 12-day weight reduction program. It was hypothesized that supplementation would spare lean body mass. Subjects (n=18) exercised and dieted to create a 4186kJ·day-1 energy deficit and a 8372 kJ·day-1 energy deficit on days 1-5, days 6-12, respectively. The glutamine (GLN) group (n=9) ingested 0.35 g·kg-1 body mass of glutamine while a placebo was administered to the remaining subjects. Body mass (BM), lean body mass (LBM) and fat mass (FM), were measured at days 0, 6, and 12. GLN and placebo groups both lost significant amounts of BM, LBM and FM. There were no significant differences between groups. The findings indicate little benefit for retention of lean mass with supplementation of glutamine during a short-term weight reduction program.
Glutamine supplementation did not benefit athletes during short-term
weight reduction
Kevin, J. Finn, Robin Lund and Mona Rosene-Treadwell
Glutamine supplementation did not benefit athletes during short-term
weight reduction
Kevin, J. Finn, Robin Lund and Mona Rosene-Treadwell
USPlabsRep
Board Sponsor
thank you.
T-Bone
Banned
What about "Old human males"?
jbryand101b
Banned
Can I smoke this instead of intravenously injection?
bdcc
Legend
Both of these methods would waste the flavouring system.
jbryand101b
Banned
Then snort it?
rosemont83
Active member
Still haven't been able to get any insider emails and it won't let me re register my email since its already registered.. 
Can someone fix me please lol
Can someone fix me please lol
BPjohn123
Well-known member
Still haven't been able to get any insider emails and it won't let me re register my email since its already registered..
Can someone fix me please lol
Invalid Link Removed
Wilsy7
Active member
The thread is full of studies
The Solution
Legend
Anytime
I enjoy research, but in the end its just a grain of salt we can consider, its not the know it all. Some people work with different things, yet they may prove points via research we all know that human application can be totally different in all aspects of life.. Training Supplementation and Diet...
Hey i fall into that category too.
We are hopeless!
kissdadookie
Well-known member
If you're old then I'm practically both foot in the grave!
AnabolicHolic
Banned
Well than DON'T TRIP! be fcking careful lol
AnabolicHolic
Banned
Can I have your intravenous amino stuff from PES? If you end up dead anyways, would go to waste...........
AppJeff
Member
same here, very curious to try this.
The Solution
Legend
Half way to 50. all down hill brother!
jbryand101b
Banned
will amino iv increase the size of my penis?
T-Bone
Banned
What Penis?
AnabolicHolic
Banned
Its a micro, get out your magnifying glass.
The Solution
Legend
Cooper dropped some awesome info:
I've been cleared to release one of the studies behind Amino IV. Yay!
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For those wondering why we picked the EAAs that we did, we chose based off this study. Why? This is the only study done in trained humans consuming EAAs during the workout. These are legit, military-trained personnel doing both resistance and endurance work.
The findings?
"In summary, consumption of a 10-g dose of EAA enriched with leucine during moderate endurance-type exercise stimulated increased MPS when compared with an isonitrogenous EAA supplement with an amino acid profile consistent with high-quality proteins. These data indicate that increasing leucine availability during steady state exercise promotes skeletal muscle protein anabolism and spares endogenous protein."
Cliffs:
These EAAs increased postworkout MPS by 33% when consumed during exercise
The drink with the highest leucine content spared muscle to the greatest degree
Amino IV has the same EAAs at a higher dose (nearly the same ratios too), and an even higher amount of leucine. Hmmm....
LiveToLift
Legend
Sure it's not because you just came off 3 compounds? Haha! I kid!
LiveToLift
Legend
Too cool!
bdcc
Legend
jbryand101b
Banned
jbryand101b
Banned
I wish, haven't been on since June-July
jbryand101b
Banned
If this won't make my penis bigger, will it make my hands smaller?
You know, so it seems bigger
You know, so it seems bigger
LiveToLift
Legend
mr.cooper69
Legend
It's called a crossover design, and it's very common in clinical practice. There is a world outside this one you know
De__eB
Well-known member
It's called a crossover design, and it's very common in clinical practice. There is a world outside this one you know
Well, I'm just saying that in this case, it looks suspect.
Because the MPS results in the non-enriched EAA group are not significantly outside of what one would expect in the post-exercise MPS increase under no supplementation at all.
To me, this makes the study read as 'leucine increases MPS'
I'm just saying that if they wanted to demonstrate that EAA increases MPS or for the study to be used to say that, then they would need to be testing it against the non-presence of EAA.
AnabolicHolic
Banned
Word. I'm probably gonna add additional leucine to it since I have several bottles of the G-N-C brand I got really cheap not to long ago....might as well use both since I have them and purchased them on sale. But its probably fine with the profile as is, which I assume by what I've read in here is 10g EAA and 5g Leucine per 2 scoops....
The Solution
Legend
Why not dose the leucine between meals? Kind of like Layne Norton's MPS Study with 5g between meals 4-6 hours apart?
AnabolicHolic
Banned
That is kinda sorta what I am doing.....whenever there is a long interval of time between eating (or I am fasted), I will take either IV or Bcaa/leucine.....for instance pre-WO when I am fasted overnight, When at school from 9:30-1:45 and I drink whey protein at 7:30 and don't eat until 2:30, etc. I figure those are opportune times to take advantage of EAA and Leucine/Bcaa while cutting and on a relatively low calorie and moderate protein diet.
