The Lean Gains / IF learning and Discussion Log

Platinum_01 said:
Im getting ready to start LG and I too Im worried about the Pre and Post Shakes. I train at (5am) and would like to break the fast at 11am... SO just want to make sure Im understanding properly... The only thing I would consume is BCAA's up to my first meal @ 11am? SO no Pre and Post workout shakes??

Thanks!
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Yup. Bcaas before you work out and they say 10 g/hr after your workout until you break your fast. Pretty simple.
 
jswain34 said:
Yup. Bcaas before you work out and they say 10 g/hr after your workout until you break your fast. Pretty simple.
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Bad A$$!!! As far as Macros Go would a 45/25/30 @ 2000 cals be good to cut without muscle Loss??? Im 5'7" 170lbs, about 19% BF, 30 years old.

Thanks for the replies btw.
 
I do 33/33/33 on w/o days (I don't really like carbs that much) and 40p/40f/20 carb on off days. Do the +10% maintenence w/o days and -30% maintenence on non w/o days. The macro breakdown really depends on the individual, I always get at least .5 g fat/lb because I love almonds, pb, guac, eggs, cheese, steak way more than rice, oats, etc. But it really is user dependent on what you know works for own body.
 
jswain34 said:
I do 33/33/33 on w/o days (I don't really like carbs that much) and 40p/40f/20 carb on off days. Do the +10% maintenence w/o days and -30% maintenence on non w/o days. The macro breakdown really depends on the individual, I always get at least .5 g fat/lb because I love almonds, pb, guac, eggs, cheese, steak way more than rice, oats, etc. But it really is user dependent on what you know works for own body.
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Cool!! Im reading Leangaing approach PDF and Im super stoked about starting LG!! Im on the same Boat I prefer a Low Carb approach because I seem to be Carb sensitive so if I get crazy with carbs it all packs on around the stomach area.. Will keep reading the Approach and hopefully can have a plan by Sunday to start the fast Sunday Night!!

I will be fasting from 7pm to 11am with workout at 5am MON-FRI off on weekends.. I really like to take pre work out stims like JACK3* can I still take this along with the BCAA's starting at 4:30am the the BCAA's every 2 hours up to the Fast break?
 
jswain34 said:
I do 33/33/33 on w/o days (I don't really like carbs that much) and 40p/40f/20 carb on off days. Do the +10% maintenence w/o days and -30% maintenence on non w/o days. The macro breakdown really depends on the individual, I always get at least .5 g fat/lb because I love almonds, pb, guac, eggs, cheese, steak way more than rice, oats, etc. But it really is user dependent on what you know works for own body.
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nice tool:

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OK so I've been reading this thread for about 2 days and I want to start ASAP.. Here is what I have laid out so far.....Would really appreciate Feedback, Tips, and Criticism (but be easy) LOL!!

Stats: 170lbs, 30 years old, 5'7", Bf around 19-20% :sad3: Been lifting steady for 15 months, did a cut early last year Low Carb and got down from 27%bf to 12%bf but mainly was concerned about abs showing so also lost what ever muscle I had, Just came off a Dirty Bulk where I gained some good size on arms, chest, back/lats, but also gained Fat all in the Gut area of course.

LG Plan: Used Calculator on above reply for Macros etc..
Wake at 4:30am, Train 5-6am Mon, Tue, Thurs, Friday, and Sat

Main goal is to keep my muscle and shed the Gut fat so had to go with the fat loss lay out over the Recomp since Im in the high Bf%, Break the fast at 11am-7pm

On work out days: 2400 cal, 200g protein, 250g carbs, 30g fats

Non Workout: 1800 cal, 200g protein, 35g carbs, 70g fats (may do light cardio on off days randomly)

My maintenance is about 2600cals so on NWD -30% and WD -10%

Wake: 4:30am: BCAAs and Pre workout stim like Jacked (fasted)
Lift: 5-6am intra like Xtend (workouts will be more circuit like with maybe a minute rest max in between sets)
8am: Bcaa
10am bcaa
11am-7pm: Break Fast Largest meal @ 11:15, Keep all carbs early last meal high protein and green veggies
Fast: 7pm-11am

Mainly concerned on my Macros as I want to lose the Fat around my stomach area quickly but not lose much muscle..

Thanks in advance for the replies.

In the mean time I will keep reading thru this Amazing Thread just wish it wasn't so close to 200 pages.. But its a good read for sure!
 
I've fallen back into IF for my cut. 186 pages and I don't think there is much more to talk about Freez... I'm not sure whether it is actually losing steam or not.
 
madds87 said:
What about a 6 hour on and a 6 hour off schedule? How eould somone follow this diet?
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IMO I don't think you would get enough time for the fasting portion. But one thing IF seems to promote is do what works for you. Right now I get up at 5:30, eat around 8-8:30, then don't eat again until 5. So I get around 8 hours during the day, and then 14 hours after dinner. Probably not the best setup, but it works for me and I like it, so it's easier to stick with. In your case I would try to go a little longer with the fasting portion. My two cents.
 
my thing right now is my big meal jsut makes me too damn tired so i kinda jsut have a little bit throughout the day once my fast break hits , it also tends to be a few hours after my workout, do you think this matters? the fact that im not gettin a meal right after my workout and also that im not really having a huge influx of calories right away when i break fast but more or less just eating throughout the window
 
Will having 2 more serving of BCA's during fast (further to a pre-workout serving) affect results?
The BCA's help curb hunger and keep me with it.....
 
Bcaa's are not required, however, are recommended by Leangains...
They will not affect your fast in the usual doses...
 
Yep, posted this on another topic not too long ago as well; have been using it and loving it. I added ECA / ECY to this and I feel no hunger at all, waking up at 6:30 and then go all the way till 4PM when I take a well done protein shake as a pre-workout, no carbs, workout and then load it all up on the meal following and a smaller meal to wrap up the day. Has been great to me and been seeing great results.
 
bla55 said:
Yep, posted this on another topic not too long ago as well; have been using it and loving it. I added ECA / ECY to this and I feel no hunger at all, waking up at 6:30 and then go all the way till 4PM when I take a well done protein shake as a pre-workout, no carbs, workout and then load it all up on the meal following and a smaller meal to wrap up the day. Has been great to me and been seeing great results.
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Thinking about following a similar pattern for a cut. I wake at 5AM for work, and usually workout at 4/430PM. Go to be around 10PM. I'm thinking about LG/IF running fasted all day until 3:30 (Protein shake) followed by workout and eating all of my calories until 9/930 PM. Im 6'3'', 23 yrs old, 215/220 right now. maintaining at around 3100 cal. Going for a recomp/ cutting so I was thinking +/-0 WOD -20 NWOD. Plan on running: Anabeta elite, DAA, Alphamine, Vanillean, cissus, fish oils, multi, and various others (MBCAA+ during fast). Any suggestions?
 
804 said:
Thinking about following a similar pattern for a cut. I wake at 5AM for work, and usually workout at 4/430PM. Go to be around 10PM. I'm thinking about LG/IF running fasted all day until 3:30 (Protein shake) followed by workout and eating all of my calories until 9/930 PM. Im 6'3'', 23 yrs old, 215/220 right now. maintaining at around 3100 cal. Going for a recomp/ cutting so I was thinking +/-0 WOD -20 NWOD. Plan on running: Anabeta elite, DAA, Alphamine, Vanillean, cissus, fish oils, multi, and various others (MBCAA+ during fast). Any suggestions?
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Might want a little bit of carbs with that 3:30 whey shake... Does anabeta increase hunger? Might want to hold off on that till after you adjust to the fast....
 
huggy77 said:
Might want a little bit of carbs with that 3:30 whey shake... Does anabeta increase hunger? Might want to hold off on that till after you adjust to the fast....
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Maybe I'll adjust to a preworkout meal. 2-9 feeding window with the workout in the middle (1 meal pre, 2 meals post). Anabeta (and elite apparently) do increase hunger.. but you dose them pre/post workout. Thanks for the input.
 
the first week of IF might be pretty brutal, by the second week its pretty easy to get through the fast... Some people can workout w/out carbs in their system, i am not one of those people....

I found that some oatmeal and a protein shake 2 hours before training worked really well...

The one thing you have to guard against is under eating calorie wise.....
 
I'm new to the IF i have a question. do you count fasting during sleep? if so is the best method the 16:8 or 20:4 or 24 fasting? I know someone who does 24 hours of fasting and 1 dirty meal for fat loss.

How would CKD + IF work if so can someone give an example?
 
sina said:
I'm new to the IF i have a question. do you count fasting during sleep? if so is the best method the 16:8 or 20:4 or 24 fasting? I know someone who does 24 hours of fasting and 1 dirty meal for fat loss.

How would CKD + IF work if so can someone give an example?
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Sleeping counts...
Start off 16:8
A cheat meal will be fine after the fast.... I would do it the next morning...
i would start off straight IF first before doing CKD on a IF schedule.... IF is mostly a schedule, dont over think it...

DO NOT UNDEREAT BECAUSE YOUR ON IF...

Its so easy to undereat on certain days, sounds wierd but its true... Be vigilant, hit your calorie marks...

check this out:
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Going to start LG protocol for an evening trainer in about 3 weeks, looking forward to it. So I will be having 2 meals pre-workout. My question is how should my BCAA's be taken? Should I sip upon waking right through to meal 1 or should I just take them intra-workout? It looks like BCAA's are intended for training fasted to aid in protein synthesis, but I'm not training fasted. Could I even get away with skipping them altogether, although not what I'd prefer to do.
 
JConWRX said:
My question is how should my BCAA's be taken?
...
It looks like BCAA's are intended for training fasted to aid in protein synthesis, but I'm not training fasted.
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You answered your own question. Per Martin, the BCAAs are specifically for encouraging muscle protein synthesis during fasted training. I can't find anywhere on leangains.com where he recommends BCAAs for any other scenarios. I don't think it will hurt you in other scenarios, but IMO it's a waste of money compared to just getting enough high quality protein in your meals (which will give you enough BCAAs automatically).
 
JConWRX said:
Going to start LG protocol for an evening trainer in about 3 weeks, looking forward to it. So I will be having 2 meals pre-workout. My question is how should my BCAA's be taken? Should I sip upon waking right through to meal 1 or should I just take them intra-workout? It looks like BCAA's are intended for training fasted to aid in protein synthesis, but I'm not training fasted. Could I even get away with skipping them altogether, although not what I'd prefer to do.
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BCAA usage is only encouraged for fasted WEIGHT/HIIT training. Consume 10 g pre, 10 g post training & 10g every hour after training until you break your fast. If its LISS cardio, off day pre fast, or any other scenario you don't need them. You CAN use them whenever you want, they just simply aren't in the LG protocol any other time than what I layed out above.
 
There is evidence to suggest that BCAAs,and especially Leucine, have an insulinogenic effect albeit not a huge one...if true, BCAAs may have a mild detrimental impact on fat loss....i would therefore avoid them except around your workouts to maximize fat loss during the fasting periods.
 
jswain34 said:
BCAA usage is only encouraged for fasted WEIGHT/HIIT training. Consume 10 g pre, 10 g post training & 10g every hour after training until you break your fast. If its LISS cardio, off day pre fast, or any other scenario you don't need them. You CAN use them whenever you want, they just simply aren't in the LG protocol any other time than what I layed out above.
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I thought it was 10g pre-WO and 5g per hour until first feeding?
 
Could be, that's just not what I recall but you could be right. I don't have time to look it up right now, go to leangains.com and see what it says.
 
He doesn't say that specifically, but:
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Whew! I was hoping I didn't need to spend any more money on BCAA's.
 
RegisterJr said:
He doesn't say that specifically, but:
<img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=77897"/>

Whew! I was hoping I didn't need to spend any more money on BCAA's.
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Yea I understand what your saying. Thanks for posting that.
 
Carb backloading suggests the possibility of an insulin spike with taking those during the fasted state if not mistaken, and also kinda tosses away any plausible issues that may arise from going without it, so I just skip it.
 
inda11 said:
Do you need to perform carb refeeds at any point?
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I haven't read where it's required or not according to Martin's IF, but I haven't read the whole site. I do a refeed, or high carb, on all lift days. And once a week I go all out with cheez puffs, beer, and whatever else I can find. That said, I think I could cut faster, but I'm gaining size in the right places and loses inches in the waist.
 
Hey quick question guys. When recovery on rest days starts to become an issue and progressive increases of weight for lifts stall in the gym where would you add calories? On rest days or training days? I apologize if this is a dumb question. Currently doing the Recomp method at the sedentary activity level due to college. Training MWF: HLM Full Body Routine. Body weight @ 165lbs ~8-9% bf.
 
gkusa001 said:
Hey quick question guys. When recovery on rest days starts to become an issue and progressive increases of weight for lifts stall in the gym where would you add calories? On rest days or training days? I apologize if this is a dumb question. Currently doing the Recomp method at the sedentary activity level due to college. Training MWF: HLM Full Body Routine. Body weight @ 165lbs ~8-9% bf.
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I would add the extra calories on lifting days. That's what I had to do a few weeks ago also. I stopped dropping fat so fast, but I am still dropping and I don't appear to be losing any lean mass.

However, I also do a high carb/calorie day on Sundays (rest day).
 
Yeah my problem is I'm still dropping weight but it seems like its dropping to fast and I actually had to decrease the weight on my squat, conventional deadlift and bench (but increased weight on weighted pull-ups go figure).
I know im meeting my caIs and macros cause I track everything on my excel spreadsheet to the T.
I just have shoot coming up in may and I don't want to go into that bit weak.
I'll try adding cals to training day and see how that goes.
 
I enjoyed IF and ran it for a long time, but just wasn't getting gains like I wanted. Giving carb back loading a try. Similar but different.
 
Rucksdaddy said:
Interesting, John Kiefer just spoke out against IF in a recent article. I forget what magazine.
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In the book he says IF is like a precursor to CBL. In the book he talks about how gaining muscle is hard because of the extra long fast. CBL calls for about a 12 eat 12 fast window. ANyway, like I said I liked IF but giving CBL a go.
 
Rucksdaddy said:
Interesting, John Kiefer just spoke out against IF in a recent article. I forget what magazine.
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I just read one this morning by a DH Keifer. He was against BCAA's, but not a fast. Don't know if there is any relation. Invalid Link Removed

Like any diet, it may not be for everyone.
 
Hey guys, Im doing Intermittent Fasting (LG) over 1,5 years, usually counting calories etc... But I have one question. I dont do cardio at all. But its summer and I want to! My feeding starts about 3pm and I want to go run early in the morning (5-6am or about lunchtime).
1) Should I take any BCAA before/after?
2) HIIT or non-HIIT?

Im not bulking, my goal is re-composition...

Thanks yall :))
 
gnvch said:
Hey guys, Im doing Intermittent Fasting (LG) over 1,5 years, usually counting calories etc... But I have one question. I dont do cardio at all. But its summer and I want to! My feeding starts about 3pm and I want to go run early in the morning (5-6am or about lunchtime).
1) Should I take any BCAA before/after?
2) HIIT or non-HIIT?

Im not bulking, my goal is re-composition...

Thanks yall :))
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1) Should I take any BCAA before/after? Yes (running / jogging is pretty intense. No, if walking, light bike riding etc..
2) HIIT or non-HIIT? Preferably HIIT, but with running you may notice that much of a difference in the beginning. When the results slow, bring on the HIIT for sure.
 
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