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DS Craze Lawsuit and FDA Action

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mr.cooper69 said:
Most notably depolarization of the cell. Put simply, they are needed for proper nervous system function.
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Interesting. So blocking this would obviously as you stated be bad.

What kind if troubles could this cause the nervous system?
 
Dave and Mission: I didn't notice it until I went up to two scoops. This is the dose I stayed at.
 
bdcc said:
Dave and Mission: I didn't notice it until I went up to two scoops. This is the dose I stayed at.
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I've gone threw a couple tubs at 2 scoops and I can't say I've noticed it at all. This is a distinct numbing sensation you experience?
 
Yes, it is very obvious. It doesn't last as long as lidocaine sprays but there is no way you wouldn't notice it if it was as strong as it was on me.
 
bdcc said:
Yes, it is very obvious. It doesn't last as long as lidocaine sprays but there is no way you wouldn't notice it if it was as strong as it was on me.
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Well I'll definitely be looking out for it next time I use it. I'm surprised I can't relate when it seems very clear to some.
 
Patrick Arnold said:
cool. can we do a brain biopsy?
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Sorry to jump in but I have been sitting on the sideline and this got me a little worried. I haven't done 90 days straight but would you ingest these ingredients (in Craze) or regard them too detrimental for your health.
 
redms said:
Sorry to jump in but I have been sitting on the sideline and this got me a little worried. I haven't done 90 days straight but would you ingest these ingredients (in Craze) or regard them too detrimental for your health.
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i am happy with my ephedrine and caffeine and occasional clearshot. I have no desire to mess around with mysterious stim products that i may react unpredictably to
 
996ttelise said:
Do you and Autokal hit the gym seven days a week? If not, why take it on days off?
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Don't want to speak for them, but many other members have taken it for the nootropic effects. Getting more work done, focus, whatever. It's been mentioned in numerous logs.
 
996ttelise said:
Do you and Autokal hit the gym seven days a week? If not, why take it on days off?
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Geoforce said:
Don't want to speak for them, but many other members have taken it for the nootropic effects. Getting more work done, focus, whatever. It's been mentioned in numerous logs.
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I never take it if I don't workout, never have.
I workout 6 days a week, sometimes 7
 
996ttelise said:
Do you and Autokal hit the gym seven days a week? If not, why take it on days off?
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Who said I took it on off days? I'm not even taking it currently. When I was using it, I used it on cardio days as well as lifting days, which had me in the gym 6-7 days a week.
 
AutoKal47 said:
I never take it if I don't workout, never have.
I workout 6 days a week, sometimes 7
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Hence me not wanting to speak for you :) But many users have done this (taken it for its "focus" type effects).
 
southpaw23 said:
Who said I took it on off days? I'm not even taking it currently. When I was using it, I used it on cardio days as well as lifting days, which had me in the gym 6-7 days a week.
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Haha, Autokal said he had one scoop a day for 90 days and you said same here. So I guess not one scoop a day for 90 days. Not that it matters, I probably would take daily if I really liked. Haha, you guys seem a bit Crazed. I like. Is there any place to pick this stuff up locally or can you only buy it online.
 
mr.cooper69 said:
Most notably depolarization of the cell. Put simply, they are needed for proper nervous system function.
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So, are you saying Na+ channels are being blocked, preventing an AP(action.potential)? Or is this a post threshold type of compound?

Curious to see what this specifically does.

Sorry if already been discussed haven't gone through all the pages
 
996ttelise said:
Haha, Autokal said he had one scoop a day for 90 days and you said same here. So I guess not one scoop a day for 90 days. Not that it matters, I probably would take daily if I really liked. Haha, you guys seem a bit Crazed. I like. Is there any place to pick this stuff up locally or can you only buy it online.
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Well, if we want to be anal about it :) I'm at the bottom of my third tub straight,
I take 1 scoop, there are 42 scoops in 1 tub, so a total amount of 120 workouts
Sometimes happens that I workout 7 days a week, usually 6.
Let's say 3 tubs are 100 scoops instead, and that I'm not done with this one yet, I feel safe saying
I took 90 doses in the past 100 days?

Beside that (I'm joking about it of course), I do feel way LESS crazed now then before using it,
why? Because since I use it I cut 90% of the supplements I was using before, I don't need them anymore (assuming
any supplement is "needed"), and all the others put together didn't improve my performance in the gym as this one alone,
not by any stretch.
I kept my aminos, vits and fish oil as my basics and literally 2 other supplements, and only 1 i take daily, the other
I run a bottle every other month.

I use to take a lot of caffeine before, I don't do that anymore, there is some in craze, 80/90mg a scoop,
I use to take 3/500mg a day, even more.. I mixed diff preworkouts, and with any other I always had to A) up the dose
after a while, B) switch product from every month to keep them effective.

So my "supplements intake" is now down by 80% compared to what I use to run just three months ago,
I'm bigger, leaner, stronger, happier and I'm saving quite some money too..

This is the picture for me, I'm no rep and I've never got anything free form DS aside from a t-shirt,
now is probably more understandable why I like it this much.
I've never done drugs in my life, I don't drink, and I've always been a natty bb, never touched AAS/PHs

I'm not reckless with what I take, quite the opposite, but damn if I need solid proof the product is dangerous/harmful
in order for me to decide not to take it anymore.

Geoforce said:
Hence me not wanting to speak for you :) But many users have done this (taken it for its "focus" type effects).
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Oh I know :) and it's true I read about people taking it
outside of the gym
 
mr.cooper69 said:
The inability/reduced ability to fire action potentials and thus transduct signals.
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I see, makes sense to me. Just like sodium for your muscles, without proper sodium your muscles wont contract as hard or be able to fire/contract like they should. Is that a good analogy? lol

Thanks though for taking the time to explain it to me, its much appreciated.

Patrick Arnold said:
dumb questions are ok if you admit u know the question might be dumb
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Id much rather admit the question is stupid so people realize who they are dealing with. haha
 
3clipseGT said:
I see, makes sense to me. Just like sodium for your muscles, without proper sodium your muscles wont contract as hard or be able to fire/contract like they should. Is that a good analogy? lol

Thanks though for taking the time to explain it to me, its much appreciated.



Id much rather admit the question is stupid so people realize who they are dealing with. haha
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That is a reasonable analogy, yes :). There are distinctions between the roles of various channels (i.e. voltage-gated), but that's a different story.
 
mr.cooper69 said:
That is a reasonable analogy, yes :). There are distinctions between the roles of various channels (i.e. voltage-gated), but that's a different story.
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:)...
 
AutoKal47 said:
Well, if we want to be anal about it :) I'm at the bottom of my third tub straight,I take 1 scoop, there are 42 scoops in 1 tub, so a total amount of 120 workoutsSometimes happens that I workout 7 days a week, usually 6. Let's say 3 tubs are 100 scoops instead, and that I'm not done with this one yet, I feel safe sayingI took 90 doses in the past 100 days? Beside that (I'm joking about it of course), I do feel way LESS crazed now then before using it,why? Because since I use it I cut 90% of the supplements I was using before, I don't need them anymore (assumingany supplement is "needed"), and all the others put together didn't improve my performance in the gym as this one alone,not by any stretch. I kept my aminos, vits and fish oil as my basics and literally 2 other supplements, and only 1 i take daily, the other I run a bottle every other month.I use to take a lot of caffeine before, I don't do that anymore, there is some in craze, 80/90mg a scoop,I use to take 3/500mg a day, even more.. I mixed diff preworkouts, and with any other I always had to A) up the doseafter a while, B) switch product from every month to keep them effective.So my "supplements intake" is now down by 80% compared to what I use to run just three months ago,I'm bigger, leaner, stronger, happier and I'm saving quite some money too..This is the picture for me, I'm no rep and I've never got anything free form DS aside from a t-shirt,now is probably more understandable why I like it this much.I've never done drugs in my life, I don't drink, and I've always been a natty bb, never touched AAS/PHsI'm not reckless with what I take, quite the opposite, but damn if I need solid proof the product is dangerous/harmful in order for me to decide not to take it anymore.Oh I know :) and it's true I read about people taking it outside of the gym
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I am wanting some now. Can I pick it up at Vita shop, G*C or can I only get online?
 
996ttelise said:
I am wanting some now. Can I pick it up at Vita shop, G*C or can I only get online?
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Depends if its carried or not. I highly doubt *** has it
 
Patrick Arnold said:
i am happy with my ephedrine and caffeine and occasional clearshot. I have no desire to mess around with mysterious stim products that i may react unpredictably to
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I am also a little nervous... Could any of this really cause brain damage? I have great respect for PA and although I love craze... nothing is worth that... thanks guys!
 
bdcc said:
Dave and Mission: I didn't notice it until I went up to two scoops. This is the dose I stayed at.
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I getthe numbing sensation at one scoop. I was never paricularly worred, i used to drink a lot of Kava, so this was a familiar feeling to me.
 
Afi140 said:
I am also a little nervous... Could any of this really cause brain damage? I have great respect for PA and although I love craze... nothing is worth that... thanks guys!
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stimulants dont really cause brain damage, at least not directly. they can by promoting strokes of course. any cns stimulant can increase the risk of stroke
 
thermolife.***/forum/post37917-11.html

Replace "***" with "com" and you have a link to a whistleblower on another forum revealing e-mails from DS Sports to Chinese manufacturers, asking them to synthesize the PEA derivative n-ethyl-beta-methylphenylethylamine.

Why go through the trouble of obtaining a quote and doing QA on the synthesized product if it is just an inactive ingredient to bulk out the label? Does anyone else notice more and more products are including the same phenylethylamine derivatives as well, even newbie supps like Stacker 2? I can only conclude it's for the same reason that geranium is almost a standard ingredient; they work.
 
DHT420 said:
thermolife.***/forum/post37917-11.html

Replace "***" with "com" and you have a link to a whistleblower on another forum revealing e-mails from DS Sports to Chinese manufacturers, asking them to synthesize the PEA derivative n-ethyl-beta-methylphenylethylamine.

Why go through the trouble of obtaining a quote and doing QA on the synthesized product if it is just an inactive ingredient to bulk out the label? Does anyone else notice more and more products are including the same phenylethylamine derivatives as well, even newbie supps like Stacker 2? I can only conclude it's for the same reason that geranium is almost a standard ingredient; they work.
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I'd love to hear Patrick's opinion on the ingredients mentioned in that post, regardless if those mails are legit or not,
just out of curiosity, or better, some sort of "worst-case scenario", like, if they are in craze what possible side fx/consequences we would be looking at?

I know you said n-benzyl-2-phenylethylamine is ineffective/not dangerous (if I got it right),
there there would be the N-ethyl-Beta-Methylphenylethylamine?
 
DHT420 said:
thermolife.***/forum/post37917-11.html

Replace "***" with "com" and you have a link to a whistleblower on another forum revealing e-mails from DS Sports to Chinese manufacturers, asking them to synthesize the PEA derivative n-ethyl-beta-methylphenylethylamine.

Why go through the trouble of obtaining a quote and doing QA on the synthesized product if it is just an inactive ingredient to bulk out the label? Does anyone else notice more and more products are including the same phenylethylamine derivatives as well, even newbie supps like Stacker 2? I can only conclude it's for the same reason that geranium is almost a standard ingredient; they work.
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lots of stuff is on labels cuz people think they work, but they really dont. they look nice on labels though
 
AutoKal47 said:
I know you said n-benzyl-2-phenylethylamine is ineffective/not dangerous (if I got it right),
there there would be the N-ethyl-Beta-Methylphenylethylamine?
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I said i think its not effective or dangerous

i wouldnt expect the second compound to be any different

you need alpha methyl for activity, beta methyl is not gonna do much
 
DHT420 said:
Why go through the trouble of obtaining a quote and doing QA on the synthesized product if it is just an inactive ingredient to bulk out the label?
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how do you know if it works or not unless you get a sample to begin with and validate it?
 
AutoKal47 said:
I don't care what's in it, I'm at my third tub straight and I've never felt better
and most important I've never had workouts like these..
And then, wtf is going on?? FDA, MHRA, what are they gonna ban next? Freakin' CHICKEN??
Don't they have more important things to b#tch about??
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I haven't read the entire thread, but why don't you care what is in your supplements? I've had some pretty intense workouts after popping 25mg of Librium and insufflating a 30mg roxicet, but I wouldn't necessarily want benzos or opiates in my 'Strive' or some other pre-workout. I'm sure you've never felt better. I was pretty invincible and invulnerable on meth and I can see the parallels between your reaction to them pulling 'Craze' from the market to my reaction when my dealer was dry. I don't think that the comparison to synthetic, amphetamine analogs to chicken is to accurate either for some reason. It's like comparing apples and crack.
 
Est1969 said:
Craze is my first PWO experience. What is the typical time between when these actions take place and when product is pulled off the shelves. How much time do I have?
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Was Craze used along with your Intimidate and Erase Pro stack? I'm not bein sarcastic, but your transformation was VERY impressive. Especially given the little time it took to see such results. Your results are on par with that of someone who busted their ass, ate clean, and had some good supplemental aid (Erase Pro and Intimidate both seem solid and I use Erase). You may want to drop the Craze. I have been on a month long hiatus from my usual intense workouts and with my self-image issues, I debate on filling my old Dexedrine IR script because I feel fine without it, but I know that with 30 tablets (10mg, 2x a day for 15 days) will get me absoutey freakin shredded with little to no work in the gym. But after stopping it comes the usual suspects (depression, post acute withdrawal syndrome, etc).
 
kingdong said:
I dont know how against this I am. I mean, supplements are supposed to be natural supplements. If a company whants to make its own chemicals that affect your brain in a weird way, it should label its product "Somethig new. not natural" or something like that.
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Take a look through page after page of unclassified stimulants with nothing except chemical structure and CAT#. There are thousands. Something new and not natural? A company could just take a crap in a tub and call it 'Steamer' and label it as: It will effect your body in a weird way. It's new and somewhat natural. lol
 
Ive been taking this stuff as well. I take it Every other day. will i be fine or should i wait until they find out if its tainted?
 
996ttelise said:
Erowid and legalhighs are two others with some really sharp chemist. A couple if them disappeared over the last couple of years. I think their MDMA labs got busted.
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A couple hardcore bluelighters disappeared? Ever look at some of the people's combinations of things that they take, have taken, and are planning on trying? ...maybe they... overdosed?
 
T-Bone said:
I knew this would happen from the start. Saw this coming months ago!
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A friend of mine (old friend just from the boards) had all of his meth dealers drop dead or get locked up. I told him to pick up Craze, as from a glance it looked to me like the closest thing to OTC amphetamines.
 
Force of Green said:
A friend of mine (old friend just from the boards) had all of his meth dealers drop dead or get locked up. I told him to pick up Craze, as from a glance it looked to me like the closest thing to OTC amphetamines.
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Definitely sounds scientifically definitive. And all this from a "glance." I knew I should have stared at more sh*t growing up.
 
AutoKal47 said:
The more I read the more it sounds like a lot of people would luuuuv for craze to be taken off the market,
and all of them sounds like DS competitors, and no i'm not referring only about people here on AM
I personally trust DS 100%, the product has been tested for a long time before being release..
I also think DS knew they had a great product that probably was about to piss a lot of people off,
I think they were expecting something like this to happen, I doubt they were not prepared..
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I can respect the loyalty that you have for a company, but nothing is 100%. Government is out to make money and what do you think a business is for? To make friends? Connect the dots.
 
southpaw23 said:
Definitely sounds scientifically definitive. And all this from a "glance." I knew I should have stared at more sh*t growing up.
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Did I say that it was scientifically definitive? I was stating an observation, like I said 'at a glance'. You ever glance at woman (or man, whatever) and draw comparisons in your mind about their features and who they resemble, etc? T-Bone said he saw this coming months ago. Did I get angry and say something like, "oooh! look at the board psychic!" Come on, pal.
 
Iron_Will said:
how long will it take for them to find out? do you have any idea? thanks
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I honestly don't know and I don't think anyone can give a real answer. I just saw this thread today and am enjoying reading through the responses on the issue ranging from intelligence and logic to outrage and stupidity, with everything in between.
 
Geoforce said:
You really think an established company who had products with great reviews like Triazole, Activate Extreme, Lean Extreme, Craze, would risk becoming known as an untrustworthy company by trying to spark short term sales with a fake lawsuit?

Doesn't seem to make much sense to me at all. They would be much better off with the building positive word of mouth Craze had going.

I for one was very interested in giving Craze a go and am know holding off (even if its cheap) to see what this is all about. Can't be too careful with what you're putting into the body.
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Well, it took Michael Richards one incident to end his entire career. Some still love him and move past it and some hate on him. Then there's the people who aren't effected by it (like me in both cases: I'm caucasian and I didn't purchase Craze, though I've tried all their other products).
 
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