oral or inject? whats best

lets say that i dont mind inj every other day. then prop would be the best choice for 1st time bc if sides occur then i could stop and jump on ptc? You talk about the old standard as inj and orals. Why is the new standard all designer orals? Why did the old orals loose popularity.

on a side note. asthma drugs are for tren cough?
 
dbol harsh on the body?

b/w a tren/ h-drol stack vs 12wk test-prop would be much safe on the bod correct. had to ask 1 more time
 
qwerty33 said:
dbol harsh on the body?
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if u have to ask if a methylated steroid is hard on the body then u need way more research under ur belt.

orals and injects affect everyone DIFFERENTLY. a superdrol/phera/epi/hdrol stack could possibly not cause ANY abnormal bloodwork for someone....whereas it could send someone else to the hospital.

there is a risk with ANYTHING we put into our bodies
 
i meant the inj version. is that still methylated . and yes i have alot more research to do

how does x-tren compare to inj test.. based on health? its non meth and gives 15lbs gains
 
PumpDogg said:
I also wanted to come back and add this.. After my post I finished reading the rest of the comments here..
From what I gather most of you have just read about gear and have never really messed with injectables per say..

If you want to run short cycles stick with your orals.. Im not going to type a page of reasons as to why this and that, but this forum is not really a forum of hardcore steroid using bodybuilders.. Its more of a supplement forum.. Just being honest.. I have been a member here for many years, but rarely post..

There are plenty of hardcore bodybuilding forums that if you are looking to use gear will be filled with more knowledge than you can absorb..

An injectable lets just use test e here for example, you are not going to see anything usually till around week 4.. It takes a while for an injectable before you see any progress at all..
12 weeks should be your minimum cycle time when using these compounds.. Your body needs time to adjust to your new found muscle/weight etc.. If you think you will run an 8 weeker and make all these gains etc, and contiune to cycle in that fashion and do well you are sorely mistaken..

Also you should run only test your very first time out.. You need to know what drug is affecting you and how,, The need for an anti estrogen or an aromatose inhibitor is not a necessity either.. You first need to know how your body repsonds to the drug you are injecting..

Thinking that you have to take those drugs in conjunction with your test is not at all accurate.. 6 guys can cycle and maybe only 2 of them would need some estrogen control, but you dont know this until you first cycle. running an anti e or AI will also affect your gains.. and if you use too much AI your joints will suffer.. worth mentioning there is not a set number either.. .25 may be what I need per day and it may be what you need eod..

As you increase dose, you increase sides, however i have found over the years that many of my fellow bodybuilding juicers never had any need for nolva or armidex etc.. I myself do need something as the dose climbs.. this truly is an individual thing

As with any cycle be it pro steroids designers whatever, you need your pct in order before you ever start.. YOu dont make the mistake of starting a cycle and then you need an anti estrogen and now you cant find it... NO NO, its fine to have it on hand, but wait to take it.. No need in taking drugs we dont need

Then you have to look at this whole game like this.. If you are scared be it legal or fear that your test, LH and FSH wont return even with pct then stay the hell away from all of this ****.. I mean really, either man up and deal with the consequences if they happen to come along or leave it to those who are aware and willing to deal with what follows...

I have personally seen friends of mine get themselves in bad shape with chems everyone used to use that were "legal" like 4AD stacked with M1t's.. I am well aware they have been banned, but it still does not matter..

Most of the compounds you see people here using are slipping thru the legal loophole system.. they are steroids, they dont have to be converted by the liver to an active hormone, they are 17 alpha's and yet people are under the impression that they are safer than injectables.. Its funny really

I see all of thes elaborate stacks of so many different compounds.. I honestly dont get it.. Im not knocking anyone so dont get your pantys in a wad, Im just saying i have been here a long time and more or less lurk and read..

Think to yourself about the threads here everyday, this sponsored log, this one unsponsered, stacking this and that compound after compound when a simple SAFE shot of test e bi weekly would yield better results and i am positvie a hell of allot less stress on the liver and kidneys...

I have ran regular cycles of what was once considered the norm of steroids like test, deca, tren,prop, primo, halo,dbol etc etc etc as well as the designers as they have came out.. These are chemicals, not supplements and I wish people truly understood that.. I have my blood work checked every six months..and the worst blood work I ever had was after a designer cycle that i had been off of for 3 months prior to my blood test..

Be smart guys..Its not any different than our training in the gym.. More is not always better.. and simplicity usually yields better results than something elaborate..

Happy injecting
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i find find the articles as im typing this so i wont go into exactly why 12 week cycles arnt always the best bet. But i do believe in what you have to say about waiting on the AI during cycle.
 
Alright, I do like test and in the long run, factoring in health issues, injectables are simply superior. You can run them as long as you can tolerate the shutdown and stack as many as you care to inject, the gains are slower so they're more keepable.

However, I'd like to point out that in terms of gains, orals simply stomp injectables. I made more gains in the first 10 days of Superdrol than on 6 weeks of test prop at 100mg everyday. Test makes me criminally horny, gives me acne, and made me gain at a rate that was just a little better than I can gain naturally.

Orals produce massive, explosive gains in strength and weight. Really there is no comparison, orals blow test out of the water when it comes to gains.

Also contrary to what even I teach here at AM, superdrol gave me LESS SIDES than test prop. Test prop gives me acne and estrogen sides even at a moderate dose, necessitating an anti-E. Superdrol gave me a few back pumps, which were easily ignorable.
I'd rather have a few back pumps than worry about keeping my estrogen down, and have to scrub my face down TWICE A DAY cuz of the ****ing acne.


Bottom line: once again, individual response varies so greatly that no conclusion can be made!
Currently i'm stacking test prop with the PH "tren" and I think it's the absolute $HIT cuz I've got no expectations for the test, it's just a base to help out a little. The oral is doing all the work.
 
I am sold and have been sold on injectables. I just wish they weren't so difficult to acquire. You are either buying them off the street or oversees (where you're probably only going to get half your order) which is shady. Unless you have a script, then you're golden.
 
Unreal... what is a stronger drug in ur opinion. Dbol or anavar?
 
Haven't used those. Have to go with Dbol for obvious reasons though. It's methylated, stronger mg/mg, and generally better for strength and size. It's definitely associated with more side effects. I'd say it's "stronger"

Dbol is usually run 4-6 weeks, Var is run for 6-10 or sometimes more
 
qwerty33 said:
how does x-tren compare to inj test.. based on health? its non meth and gives 15lbs gains
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honestly it sounds like you are looking for someone to guarantee your safety, and theres just no way to know what will happen regardless of what you take. If you can get true prescription testosterone from a doctor, then probably your health is safe. Outside of that, nothing is safe and trying to compare degrees of safety is silly
 
I wouldnt touch any more orals if I could convince my gf of the safety of injectables. The sides are so much easier to combat in my opinion. I'd much rather combat estrogen from an aromatization standpoint rather than from a different pathway. Just my .02
 
im a little lost on where this si going, are we talking about "orals" as in the legal ph/ps on the market today. or are we talking about illegal aas orals.
 
i was asking about legal orals in the post above but illegal are also being discussed

"you more than likely are not going to enjoy the pin cushion effect of pinning every other day"

what does this mean
 
qwerty33 said:
i was asking about legal orals in the post above but illegal are also being discussed

"you more than likely are not going to enjoy the pin cushion effect of pinning every other day"

what does this mean
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Say you pinning prop, so EOD you are jabbing yourself in the arse or quad, etc.
 
If you don't like injecting then that's too bad... I pinned ed for 6 weeks and honestly it's not a big deal at all. I would LOOK FORWARD to my injections, the thought of it helps me wake up in the morning.

I get to do another tomorrow morning. It excites me. It's really easy too. People think it's dangerous or complicated or something... no, it's easy, it's painless, and IDK what kind of test prop people are getting but from my experience "prop pain" is really weak. I mean it's barely worse than a muscle that's really sore from working out, and I like that sore feeling anyway...

The way I see it is, you're doing steroids, you have no right to be a pu$$y. So man up, inject, and enjoy it.
 
sounds legit. prop pain or any test?.. is like a tetanus shot? like gets the area around the inj point sore for awhile? or na
 
to answer some more questions.
Asthma meds are used for fat burn.. ie.. clenbuterol a non FDA approved drug for use in US.
Prop would be fine for ur first run if u can afford it and have a good sourc
 
doing this from phone so limited.
The pin cushion statement refers to what u will feel like injecting 3/4 x every wk.
Lastly orals are not stronger/better than an injectables that makes roflmao
 
qwerty33 said:
sounds legit. prop pain or any test?.. is like a tetanus shot? like gets the area around the inj point sore for awhile? or na
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The injection site becomes kinda sore, it feels just like the soreness from lifting (DOMS = delayed onset muscular soreness), except it's a bit more acute and makes the area feel tighter. It's not really painful though, not with my prop anyway.

I don't remember the exact cause of the soreness, I know that the shorter esters tend to produce more soreness, with esterless steroids like test suspension and and winstrol hurting the most...
 
UnrealMachine said:
The injection site becomes kinda sore, it feels just like the soreness from lifting (DOMS = delayed onset muscular soreness), except it's a bit more acute and makes the area feel tighter. It's not really painful though, not with my prop anyway.

I don't remember the exact cause of the soreness, I know that the shorter esters tend to produce more soreness, with esterless steroids like test suspension and and winstrol hurting the most...
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I thought some of the sting came from the oil/junk it is in. ALso I have a feeling pumping a part of your muscle full of any liquid would have a bit of a painful feeling LOL.
 
whats the rel price difference b/w e and prop roughly? like is prop 4x more exp or something?

so for ex a pin in the butt would make me not want to do a seated leg press or sit in a meeting that day? or is that overboard as a comparison.
 
qwerty33 said:
whats the rel price difference b/w e and prop roughly? like is prop 4x more exp or something?

so for ex a pin in the butt would make me not want to do a seated leg press or sit in a meeting that day? or is that overboard as a comparison.
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The difference is in the ester. Prop is much shorter than ethanate ester wise. Prop has I think a 3 day active life, and Test E has about a 15 day active life. Me thinks those are about the right #s

Prop is usually cheaper than ethanate per ml, but is also dosed lower from what I have seen per ml due also to it requiring more pinning.
 
Sources will determine the cost of your drug of choice.. Where I am at, most dealers and yes is just what they are... like to charge more for 100mgs/ml of prop in a 10 cc bottle than 250mgs/ml of test e in a 10 cc bottle.. It truly is source dependent!!!

Expect to pay anywhere from 50-110 dollars for either depending on source etc etc.. I dont want to break any board rules so I think that is enough clarification and keeping within the rules..

Shot pain has allot of variables.. The more BA in your mix the more pain you can have, the esters, if the needle went in straight or at an angle, if you pierce a vain, if your muscle is flexed instead of relaxed.. yada yada yada
 
PumpDogg said:
Shot pain has allot of variables.. The more BA in your mix the more pain you can have, the esters, if the needle went in straight or at an angle, if you pierce a vain, if your muscle is flexed instead of relaxed.. yada yada yada
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i think you should clarify that "if the needle went in straight or at an angle" really means you just go into straight and smooth and dont move it around when its inside, tearing tissue. because i doubt anyone is ever sitting there with a level or a 90' degree right angle trying to see if they are going in "straight" LOL
 
also too sort of interesting, doing more frequent shots of less volume (like dosing .5ml every day instead of 1ml EOD) lessens site pain
 
Also, I just tried out something Easy said earlier, i shot my quad with a 23g instead of a 25g, noticed it even less... Like you said, you don't have to push as hard so the oil emits at a lower velocity. The shot was easier and i felt it even less than the 25g.

Test prop is going to be more expensive on a mg/mg basis because it's never as concentrated

I believe the half lives are 4.5 days for test prop and 10.5 days for enanthate
 
you know what a friend of mine tried out? He has some test prop that was made at 100mg/ml, but about half ethyl oleate, half grapeseed, so its very thin. He tried drawing .25ml with a 29ga slin pin and although slow wasn't really bad (like a minute maybe). He's pondering daily dosing like that for TRT, as that ends up at 175mg/wk, but should be minimal fluctuation. only issue of course is if he has to travel. He mentioned the nice thing was that with a slin pin even though its daily he has 5x as many sites to hit as front delts, tris, bis, even pecs aren't bad with a 29
 
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