Designer Steroid/prohormone profiles

schuman0408

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hey sinner u should do a write up on methyl XT(methyl 1 alpha) there doesnt seem to be a whole lot of information out there but I always read that a percentage of it converts to
m1t in the body so it was always intriguing to me.
 

russianstar

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cool
 

russianstar

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cool thread i meant
 

russianstar

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thanks for the info btw
 
poopypants

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niiiiice!!! when did this get stickied??? congrats! it needed to be there!
 

livindreamz

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Yeah I agree about the 1,4 AD BOLD it sucks and was a total waste of money....:goodpost:
 

ctrivedi

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You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to thesinner again.
 
poopypants

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Yeah I agree about the 1,4 AD BOLD it sucks and was a total waste of money....:goodpost:
IMO the compound has promise but its severely under dosed. You should be taking at least 600mg (preferably 1000mg) for at least 4-6 weeks(preferably 6-8) given the type of compound this converts too.

Thats why I jumped all over it when it was in bulk at NP. Sad thing is the company wont bump up the dose anytime soon cause people keep buying it as it is now and they know theyll make more money this way...... we need another bulk offering of this compound baaaaaad.
 
thesinner

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IMO the compound has promise but its severely under dosed. You should be taking at least 600mg (preferably 1000mg) for at least 4-6 weeks(preferably 6-8) given the type of compound this converts too.

Thats why I jumped all over it when it was in bulk at NP. Sad thing is the company wont bump up the dose anytime soon cause people keep buying it as it is now and they know theyll make more money this way...... we need another bulk offering of this compound baaaaaad.
It's also not market feasible to sell it properly dosed. At a bulk price, we saw it at $1.50 per gram. An 8 week cycle would cost you $85 (from the bulk price), and that's minus packaging costs.
 
thesinner

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Bump. I added info on 3-AD. When Ergopharm's 1-AD comes out, I'll be sure to add that as well.
 
EasyEJL

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you could call DHEA a prohormone to test, so just saying that means nothing. its all about what % converts to it, and what else it may get converted to at the same time.

That said, I can't imagine PA putting out anything that didn't work well.
 
thesinner

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The old 1-AD converted into 1-Test. I was kinda hoping the newer one to be something else. We will see, I guess.
 
TOYFORDOLET

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bump for info added about methyl xt, there seems to be some confusion about what it is. From what I have found it seems to be a precursor to M1T, but what do I know. Most feedback I have read indicates great strength gains but minimal size.
 
Ziquor

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Methyl XT is methylated 1-AD. The methylation seemed to change the compound quite a bit which is typically true of any compund getting methylated. I've seen the same - incredible strength gains with minimal mass. The compounds that a great for strength but don't pack on mass usually work best for cutting.
 
jpk

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Very nice work Z! I use your chart for reference all the time now.

Question: What if you were to put straight, injectable Testosterone on the chart as a baseline reference? How does test stand up to the designers in terms of pros and cons? For instance, lower liver toxicity but illegal without an Rx. Cheaper, but requires IM injection. I'm sure there's other issues I'm not thinking of right now. Just a thought...
 
TerribleTowel

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Very nice work Z! I use your chart for reference all the time now.

Question: What if you were to put straight, injectable Testosterone on the chart as a baseline reference? How does test stand up to the designers in terms of pros and cons? For instance, lower liver toxicity but illegal without an Rx. Cheaper, but requires IM injection. I'm sure there's other issues I'm not thinking of right now. Just a thought...
Cheaper???
 
Ziquor

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Wow with Test it's tough to really compare it to oral methyls. Typically the standard for orals is methyl-test which has slightly different properties. But I'm sure it's been said numerous times somewhere nothing really can compare to regular test, especially as a base.
 

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Has anybody tried EpioTren by Intense Nutraceuticals. It has the following blend:
19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione and
2a, 3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androsta-17b-ol.

I recognize the Epi, does anybody recognize the first Nomenclature? couldn't find it on the 1st page.

NMN
 
TerribleTowel

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Has anybody tried EpioTren by Intense Nutraceuticals. It has the following blend:
19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione and
2a, 3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androsta-17b-ol.

I recognize the Epi, does anybody recognize the first Nomenclature? couldn't find it on the 1st page.

NMN
The first one is finigex. Try using the search button or google next time. It's not hard to find info on.
 

NeedMassNow

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The first one is finigex. Try using the search button or google next time. It's not hard to
find info on.
Is it really? Interesting lets see..after googling and searching the first time (then reading your comment were you infer that I didn't search to begin with, and doing it again) this is what I found.

Finigenix Magnum
Innovators: PharmagenX
Nomenclature: Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione
Dosages: 50-75mg
Side effects: aggrevation of gynecomastia. This is a progestin. Expect tren-like sides.
Reputation: This is a prohormone to dienolone (similar to M-diene). Decent for recomp and increases in strength.

So Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione = 19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione?

People use to make the WRONG assumption about Promagnum-25 and Halodrol 50, they assumed they were the same because they have a nomenclature that is almost IDENTICAL yet they are derivatives to of steroids. I'm not a chemist, but would you educate us and care to explain how a Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione = 19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione?

NMN
 
thesinner

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Is it really? Interesting lets see..after googling and searching the first time (then reading your comment were you infer that I didn't search to begin with, and doing it again) this is what I found.

Finigenix Magnum
Innovators: PharmagenX
Nomenclature: Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione
Dosages: 50-75mg
Side effects: aggrevation of gynecomastia. This is a progestin. Expect tren-like sides.
Reputation: This is a prohormone to dienolone (similar to M-diene). Decent for recomp and increases in strength.

So Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione = 19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione?

People use to make the WRONG assumption about Promagnum-25 and Halodrol 50, they assumed they were the same because they have a nomenclature that is almost IDENTICAL yet they are derivatives to of steroids. I'm not a chemist, but would you educate us and care to explain how a Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione = 19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione?

NMN
They are the same thing. It's an 18 carbon structure (C19 is missing) with a double bond at 4 and 9, and a ketone at 3 and 17.


People often confuse Promagnon and Halodrol because they didn't notice that progmagnon didn't have a 1-ene.
 
TerribleTowel

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So Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione = 19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione?

People use to make the WRONG assumption about Promagnum-25 and Halodrol 50, they assumed they were the same because they have a nomenclature that is almost IDENTICAL yet they are derivatives to of steroids. I'm not a chemist, but would you educate us and care to explain how a Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione = 19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione?

NMN
Yes actually, Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione and 19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione are exactly the same thing. That's one of the problems nowadays. There is so many ways to write the same thing. A company just uses a different name for the same active to make it appear that they have created something new and innovative.

Also it's been proven that Estra-4, 9-diene-3, 17-dione (or 19-Norandrosta-4, 9-diene-3,17-dione) doesn't actually convert to Tren. It's missing a double bond that the body cannot add. It is still active and still converts, but not to tren. PA proved this a while back.
 

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I'm currently stacking halodrol-50 with orastan-A. What do you guys think of throwing some 11-oxo in there for the second half of the cycle? Just wondering.
 
andrew732

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what is 1-ad by ams considered
 
Ziquor

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what is 1-ad by ams considered
Supposed to be 1-DHEA. Should convert to 1-Test in 2 steps as opposed to 1 like the original :banned: 1-AD. 1-DHEA can convert to both 1-Androstenedione & 1-Androstenediol, which then both convert to 1-Test with different efficacy.
 
shlong

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stack With epi =#1 ,#2 would be O.T.or rather it's diol version

what's a good stack with the havoc/epi?
What I'll try to explain in simple terms is EPI is not a pro or a conversion 1st pass compound. It is a steroid with a novel design.With a anabolic Q rating of 1100 and androgenic of 92,nice ratio not to mention it's a DHT derivative dry hard results.
A 4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1,4 dien-3-17-diol...the diol
is the only difference then Oral turinabol...you see OT has a 17b-ol at it's end, the difference is a diol means that on the "A" ring at the 3 position there is a hydroxyl-group (HO) instead of an (O), and a double bond in the 1 and 4 position ,however
the first pass conversion thru the liver yields a 80% turnover
which is damn good compared to all the others Ive dsected molecurley .So what ever they call this one...I think something like Halo da da da something or another it will give you close to the same results as O.T. these 2 are the only ones worth purchasing since they are AAS's
 
CryingEmo

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According to my personal experience h-drol IS NOT oral turinabol, nor does it feel like it in anyway. h-drol for me was WAY more androgenic.
 
Ziquor

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What I'll try to explain in simple terms is EPI is not a pro or a conversion 1st pass compound. It is a steroid with a novel design.With a anabolic Q rating of 1100 and androgenic of 92,nice ratio not to mention it's a DHT derivative dry hard results.
A 4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1,4 dien-3-17-diol...the diol
is the only difference then Oral turinabol...you see OT has a 17b-ol at it's end, the difference is a diol means that on the "A" ring at the 3 position there is a hydroxyl-group (HO) instead of an (O), and a double bond in the 1 and 4 position ,however
the first pass conversion thru the liver yields a 80% turnover
which is damn good compared to all the others Ive dsected molecurley .So what ever they call this one...I think something like Halo da da da something or another it will give you close to the same results as O.T. these 2 are the only ones worth purchasing since they are AAS's
Only 2 worth purchasing? Based on? Halo is a prohormone in reality. Some call it a prosteroid, but this is a generic term coined up by the supplement industry. It still has to undergo conversion to OT, unless you consider its preconversion activity.

Since all 3,17-diols (& diones) attach directly to the androgen receptor before converting, they are a bit more andorgenic than their parent, and a little less anabolic. Like Halodrol is more androgenic than OT, and less anabolic. 4-AD (diol) is more andorgenic than test and less anabolic, & so on.

Out of curiousity where did you come up with an 80% conversion rate for Halo? Generally speaking diones convert at roughly 5.61% in vivo since they're processed through 17HSD. Diols use 3HSD and convert more efficiently at 15.76% in vivo. Even though these hormones all have different levels of their own activity pre-conversion, this wouldn't effect their conversion rates to the parent compound.
 
shlong

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Only 2 worth purchasing? Based on? Halo is a prohormone in reality. Some call it a prosteroid, but this is a generic term coined up by the supplement industry. It still has to undergo conversion to OT, unless you consider its preconversion activity.

Since all 3,17-diols (& diones) attach directly to the androgen receptor before converting, they are a bit more andorgenic than their parent, and a little less anabolic. Like Halodrol is more androgenic than OT, and less anabolic. 4-AD (diol) is more andorgenic than test and less anabolic, & so on.

Out of curiousity where did you come up with an 80% conversion rate for Halo? Generally speaking diones convert at roughly 5.61% in vivo since they're processed through 17HSD. Diols use 3HSD and convert more efficiently at 15.76% in vivo. Even though these hormones all have different levels of their own activity pre-conversion, this wouldn't effect their conversion rates to the parent compound.
The info I used is what was discussed briefly in steran molecule ph applications used in the supplement industry to yield anabolic properties ,however not truly of a native origin of common steran applications , but DIOL OT has a protection from 3hsd& 5a RED. via double bond A ring@ 1,4 and 4 chloro protects this one from most convertion/degradation..it is not reduced to a lesser metabolite, but there is a 20% loss,in the liver ,up the dose 20%. All the others I and colleges have scrutinized don't do much at all speaking only of the still legal ones, exception if still available would be Methylmasteron, 1-T was designed for injection (cypionate version), having a terrible BV rating ORALLy you'ld
have to take 300-400 mg ED for a little activity.
I hope this helps with your future purchases
 
Ziquor

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The info I used is what was discussed briefly in steran molecule ph applications used in the supplement industry to yield anabolic properties ,however not truly of a native origin of common steran applications , but DIOL OT has a protection from 3hsd& 5a RED. via double bond A ring@ 1,4 and 4 chloro protects this one from most convertion/degradation..it is not reduced to a lesser metabolite, but there is a 20% loss,in the liver ,up the dose 20%. All the others I and colleges have scrutinized don't do much at all speaking only of the still legal ones, exception if still available would be Methylmasteron, 1-T was designed for injection (cypionate version), having a terrible BV rating ORALLy you'ld
have to take 300-400 mg ED for a little activity.
I hope this helps with your future purchases

Do you have any links to these articles? Interesting info. But dosing Halodrol in the real world would put its conversion nowhere near 80%. Most who used it feel it exerts great effects at 100mg-125mg (which would be 80-100mg of OT at your #'s). I know someone who's currently running Halodrol now, and found his sweet spot at 225mg. With your 80% figure this would have him dosing 180mg of Turinabol/day which would be absurdly high.
 

JBerto

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What I'll try to explain in simple terms is EPI is not a pro or a conversion 1st pass compound. It is a steroid with a novel design.With a anabolic Q rating of 1100 and androgenic of 92,nice ratio not to mention it's a DHT derivative dry hard results.
A 4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1,4 dien-3-17-diol...the diol
is the only difference then Oral turinabol...you see OT has a 17b-ol at it's end, the difference is a diol means that on the "A" ring at the 3 position there is a hydroxyl-group (HO) instead of an (O), and a double bond in the 1 and 4 position ,however
the first pass conversion thru the liver yields a 80% turnover
which is damn good compared to all the others Ive dsected molecurley .So what ever they call this one...I think something like Halo da da da something or another it will give you close to the same results as O.T. these 2 are the only ones worth purchasing since they are AAS's
The info I used is what was discussed briefly in steran molecule ph applications used in the supplement industry to yield anabolic properties ,however not truly of a native origin of common steran applications , but DIOL OT has a protection from 3hsd& 5a RED. via double bond A ring@ 1,4 and 4 chloro protects this one from most convertion/degradation..it is not reduced to a lesser metabolite, but there is a 20% loss,in the liver ,up the dose 20%. All the others I and colleges have scrutinized don't do much at all speaking only of the still legal ones, exception if still available would be Methylmasteron, 1-T was designed for injection (cypionate version), having a terrible BV rating ORALLy you'ld
have to take 300-400 mg ED for a little activity.
I hope this helps with your future purchases
:goodpost: Interesting, thanks for the info!!!
 
shlong

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Do you have any links to these articles? Interesting info. But dosing Halodrol in the real world would put its conversion nowhere near 80%. Most who used it feel it exerts great effects at 100mg-125mg (which would be 80-100mg of OT at your #'s). I know someone who's currently running Halodrol now, and found his sweet spot at 225mg. With your 80% figure this would have him dosing 180mg of Turinabol/day which would be absurdly high.
OT is not a strong aas to begin with ,50 androgenic and slightly
over 100 anabolic. the common dosage would be in the 70- 140mg
range anyway since it has a very low hepatic load and is considered
a weaker compound it was dispensed at 7- 14 tabs a day (10mg)
it's not a anavar or D-bol by no means.4-chloro-dihydromethyltestosterone
 
Ziquor

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OT is not a strong aas to begin with ,50 androgenic and slightly
over 100 anabolic. the common dosage would be in the 70- 140mg
range anyway since it has a very low hepatic load and is considered
a weaker compound it was dispensed at 7- 14 tabs a day (10mg)
it's not a anavar or D-bol by no means.4-chloro-dihydromethyltestosterone
I agree it's a milder methyl, but 140mg? Wow I've never seen anyone dose over 100mg, and that was in an extreme in vivo testing with rats. I assume your not in the US and by ,50 I assume you mean 0.5? I've seen OT's androgenic # listed anywhere from ~0 to 8.
 

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1, 4 AD Bold 200 + Epistane stacked together. run bold 200 weeks 1-8, and epistane weeks 5-8
 

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im currently back in lifting mode after a 5 year break (high school)
football lol , any way i lost alot of mass and since i havent been in a gym for a while i thought i take a short cut , the pro-hormone way which is stupid once u hear my stack , i should just go with the real stuff but unfortunately i dont have any reliable sources ,


stack
20mg of sd
20mg of pp
10 mg of fini
(btw this is ridiculous on ur liver and i strongly dont recommend this stack for endomorphs .... )


i realized i have a problem eating as well is this gonna be a problem with the stack im taking ??
im seriously itching to get jakked so far ive been on this stack for 8 days and vasculars are serious , pumps look crazy and ill but with out eating as much as i should i feel like its a waste ??
 
Ziquor

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im currently back in lifting mode after a 5 year break (high school)
football lol , any way i lost alot of mass and since i havent been in a gym for a while i thought i take a short cut , the pro-hormone way which is stupid once u hear my stack , i should just go with the real stuff but unfortunately i dont have any reliable sources ,


stack
20mg of sd
20mg of pp
10 mg of fini
(btw this is ridiculous on ur liver and i strongly dont recommend this stack for endomorphs .... )


i realized i have a problem eating as well is this gonna be a problem with the stack im taking ??
im seriously itching to get jakked so far ive been on this stack for 8 days and vasculars are serious , pumps look crazy and ill but with out eating as much as i should i feel like its a waste ??
Eat more. AAS won't give you **** if you don't eat enough anyhow, except a smaller wallet. Just eat more, period.
 

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eat eat eat eat!!! lucky for me, my mom's making arroz y pollo every other night, so i'm getting a steady supply of protein and carbs. . . gotta love chicken, rice and beans. . . yum
 
EasyEJL

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Eat more. AAS won't give you **** if you don't eat enough anyhow, except a smaller wallet. Just eat more, period.
wait, beyond a smaller wallet it could also give you gyno. you left that out....

If you are worried about eating enough to gain the weight, don't forget that you also will need to eat more after gaining 10lbs of muscle, and your daily protein need will be higher, so your long term eating expenses go up as well....
 

RoidGracie

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Compound - H-drol
Side effect (putting that mildly) Diverticulitis
Not fun at all.
Moral: No more of any of these "mild" compounds, ever.
Good luck.
 

RoidGracie

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I'm amazed ziqour didn't lose all his rep points while I was gone.
Truly fascinating.

You look small for someone who's done all you claim to have done and such an expert.....Did you buy a bow flex?
 

RoidGracie

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I really do, I had suspicions, and now my googling shows a definite connection.
 

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