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Testofen...Testofen...1,2,3...Is this thing on?

nightfly71 said:
I'm slightly confused on dosage, at this point. I ordered 80 grams from BN before NP had it. I've been dosing 600 mg. daily, divided into 2 doses. Each 1/4 tsp. is 500 mg. of fenusides, and the concentration is 50% testofen extract.

All that is simple enough, and I was planning to order from NP due to the lower price and larger quantity. The confusion arose when a guy on another board mentioned that his NP testofen lists 750 mg. per 1/4 tsp, and the label is also listing 50% extract.

I could see if the amount of extract were insignificant, but not a full 250 mg. difference for the exact same compound, in a measurement as small of 1/4 tsp.

My question would be how does the NP extract squeeze another 250 mg. into that measurement if the concentration is the same. As stated, I'm planning to order some, but am confused now as to which label is correct. Can someone clarify this issue?
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Different supplier, different makeup of the OTHER 50%, different extraction procedure.

The more pure a material, in general, the denser it is.

Cellulose (plant material) is very light in nature...which is why whole plant material is not very dense, while concentrated extractions are.

Variations in density (and therefore weight for a given volume, ie. 1/4 tsp) are to be expected for different extractions.
 
dsade said:
Different supplier, different makeup of the OTHER 50%, different extraction procedure.

The more pure a material, in general, the denser it is.

Cellulose (plant material) is very light in nature...which is why whole plant material is not very dense, while concentrated extractions are.

Variations in density (and therefore weight for a given volume, ie. 1/4 tsp) are to be expected for different extractions.
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that said, is the other 50 percent extract not a legit claim, since their 50 percent yields 250 mgs less?
 
nightfly71 said:
that said, is the other 50 percent extract not a legit claim, since their 50 percent yields 250 mgs less?
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I am not saying that, nor would I...I am just giving you a possible reason for the discrepancy.

I know BNs attention to detail and their quality control are above question, because those are the standard that I help to build when I was working there.
 
dsade said:
I am not saying that, nor would I...I am just giving you a possible reason for the discrepancy.

I know BNs attention to detail and their quality control are above question, because those are the standard that I help to build when I was working there.
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Well, I'm still confused, then. Both BN and NP have a great reputation for quality control of their bulk powders and both are selling the same herbal extract at the same concentration and same 1/4 tsp. serving size.

Yet, there's a difference of 250 mg. 50% of the active constituent. I know there's some plant matter in these, since the concentration is 50%...but they SHOULD both have the exact same amount of active.

I just can't see how there can be a variance of 50% between them. if it were 5-10%, I'd chalk it up to different extraction methods, etc. that were mentioned, but a full 50%?

It just doesn't seem possible for there to be that much difference. If that's the case, it makes buying standardized herbal extracts largely a hit or miss proposition.
 
moisture content as well as particle size can really sway a powders relative density too. I don't really think its all that unlikely that its that different between the two. its towards the extreme side, but you'd really have to look at and analyze both powders to know.
 
Maybe I'm just overreacting. It just sounded like a pretty big difference. In any case, I'm sure I'll grab it from NP next due to the much lower price per dose.

I'm out of empty caps, so I've been tossing back 1/4 tsps. down the hate 2X a day. DAMN that stuff has a foul taste...lol. Not as bad as HGW or rhodiola, but still.

Maybe some day they'll come out w/ a "flavor system" for bulk herbals like they do for proteins, etc. With this new dosing scheme, I'm up from 600 mg. per day to about 1k mg. Hard to tell much difference yet, but I'm sure that's probably got me just about maxed out as far as free test goes. At these prices, it's affordable to do a gram a day.
 
i'm guessing you don't have a scale all that accurate? i've got one accurate to 10mg, which would be enough for checking that. It would be interesting to check just relative weights of 1/4 tsp of each extract
 
nightfly71 said:
Well, I'm still confused, then. Both BN and NP have a great reputation for quality control of their bulk powders and both are selling the same herbal extract at the same concentration and same 1/4 tsp. serving size.

Yet, there's a difference of 250 mg. 50% of the active constituent. I know there's some plant matter in these, since the concentration is 50%...but they SHOULD both have the exact same amount of active.

I just can't see how there can be a variance of 50% between them. if it were 5-10%, I'd chalk it up to different extraction methods, etc. that were mentioned, but a full 50%?

It just doesn't seem possible for there to be that much difference. If that's the case, it makes buying standardized herbal extracts largely a hit or miss proposition.
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Depends on the extraction, Some companies will extract for 50% and than "wash" the herb that can lead to more than 50% concentration or even filter it to remove more inactives....

Every company extracts differently and even a slight process changes the make up of the herb.....
 
I could've sworn BN's was 40%. They don't have the % on their site anymore, though.

Also, Jacob, you can't filter an extract. Unless, of course you mean to recrystallize it and filter out the solids (or osmosis). I'll try not to pick on you too much, as I'm sure it's one of those instances where you know what you're talking about, but aren't quite sure how to say it. ( I feel ya. That happens to me at least 3x a day).
 
thesinner said:
I could've sworn BN's was 40%. They don't have the % on their site anymore, though.

Also, Jacob, you can't filter an extract. Unless, of course you mean to recrystallize it and filter out the solids (or osmosis). I'll try not to pick on you too much, as I'm sure it's one of those instances where you know what you're talking about, but aren't quite sure how to say it. ( I feel ya. That happens to me at least 3x a day).
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Sorry not the extract but the crude herb...

after reading my post, I never mentioned filtering an extract..
 
Thanks for the further input, everyone. Makes sense to me now. My gf found a 1/8 tsp. measurer today at a kitchen store.

That will make bulk powder dosing a lot easier. I had always just seen 1/4 at the min. This measurer is adjustable, so it'll come in pretty handy.
 
This is probably a dumb question, but there is no PCT required for Testofen, right?

Also, potential for hairloss?

Sorry, I fear some of this stuff. :hammer:

Thanks!
 
also wondering about the DHT or hair loss factor.
what is the verdict here about estrogen issues?
 
So this could be used as a cheaper alternative to Primordial's Phyto Test? Would this also be sourced from Gencor?

From the Gencor Pacific website...
"A lot of these saponins exist as saponin glycosides. Fenuside is a set of potent saponin glycosides unique to us which we have standardised, to give maximum benefits to users. We have done repeated studies and confirmed it's libido promoting properties. In addition to Testosterone support, it also acts like Testosterone by binding to the Testosterone receptor sites and creating Testosterone like activity. So it's activity is two fold. Testosterone is not just like turning on a tap wherein you fill as much of Testosterone as you want. The body has a balancing mechanism and each human body has it's own threshold for basal Testosterone levels. Testofen™ promotes Testosterone levels for people whose Testosterone levels are below their normal basal levels. In addition it acts like Testosterone and promotes libido and muscle mass."
"Testofen™ has demonstrated the following in a double blind, randomised, placebo controlled human clinical study of 60 subjects

Promoted healthy free Testosterone levels in the active group of subjects by 98% "
 
thesinner said:
While I can't speak for dsade, I (for one) am hot, sticky sweet from my head (my head) down to my feet.....so take the bottle, shake it up, add the actives (add 'em up!), and pour some fenugreek extract on me....oh, in the name of love (for things that smell kinda like maple syrup).
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Man - I love Hysteria. Awesome album.

 
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