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    Fruit sugar bad???


    Sup gentlemen,
    Hey I eat alot of fruits. The reason is, I don't eat vegetables b/c they are nasty. For instance I eat a; cup of apples(13g/sugar), cup of grapes(25g/sugar), & one med. banana(14.5g/sugar) per day. Even sometimes if i feel like cutting it, pineapple and thats 36g/sugar per cup too.That's 52.5 grams of sugar in just my fruits and when I add the pineapple it jumps to 88.5g's. So em I doing something wrong here!?

    I was reading online that a man shouldn't have more then 9 teaspoons(37.8g) of sugar. & a woman shouldn't do more then 6 teaspoons(25.2g). I know it's best to cut it completely out, but that's kinda hard to do. I'm not gonna lie!!! (lol) So I'm wondering!? Does that mean all your fruits & fruit drinks like oceanspray cran-grape, tropicana OJ, JuicyJuice or yogurt. That they are only limited to 9 teaspoons of sugar per day in a whole. So basically that's it, pick " a " fruit and that's it for the day. So long as its under 37.8g!?

    Could they be meaning the sugar in your sodas/candy/ice-cream. Or is sugar...sugar it's basically all the same.

    *Remember don't hold this against me!!!! I'm only going off what I've read online. That's all!!! So if I am wrong someone please correct me!!!

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    You can eat as much sugar as you want too, as long as you keep it under your daily kCal-need. Find what works for you, it might perhaps be 200g of sugar, it might be 1g of sugar..

    There's no point of refering to the metabolism or hormonelevels as it differs from individual to individual... It's YOU who know when you eat and how you eat.. So experiment now with the ratio between carbs,fat and protein..As long as you keep under your daily limit you won't gain weight... regardless of what you eat...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eizbear;2803324[B
    ]You can eat as much sugar as you want [/B]too, as long as you keep it under your daily kCal-need. Find what works for you, it might perhaps be 200g of sugar, it might be 1g of sugar..

    There's no point of refering to the metabolism or hormonelevels as it differs from individual to individual... It's YOU who know when you eat and how you eat.. So experiment now with the ratio between carbs,fat and protein..As long as you keep under your daily limit you won't gain weight... regardless of what you eat...
    The sugar in fruit is called fructose and is stored in the liver .the liver can only hold about 100gms so any excess can be stored as fat.
    you should be getting your energy from complex carbs such as oats , pasta and sweet potatoes.Of all the vegetables available im sure you will find one to suit your taste
    Vegetables and fruit are nutritious and full of vitamins , minerals antioxidants, fibre and compounds to prevent cancer.However you should try to get a more balanced diet.imo
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    there is no energy in complex carbs, thats a myth. complex carbs are for the most part highly glycemic and contain gluten and other anti- nutrients.

    fruit is great to obtain vitamins and minerals from. the fructose from the fruit isnt so bad because it has to be processed by the liver and fruit contains fiber, both of which ease the blood sugar hit. only problem with fruit is the agricultural habits of today. fruit is often genetically engineered and grafted. this ends up making the fruit super super sweet, containing way more sugar than its wild growing original version. therefore fruit should be eaten in moderation.

    vegetables are really the best bang for the buck. they contain tons of vitamins and nutrients and much less carbs than fruit. by consuming more vegetables than fruit you will keep a steady blood sugar and have a more desired body composition because excess fructose can definitely be stored as fat as mentioned above.

    try different vegetables. avocados are really good when you add them to other food. baby carrots make an easy snack. use spinach instead of lettuce in salads. possibilities are endless.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    there is no energy in complex carbs, thats a myth. complex carbs are for the most part highly glycemic and contain gluten and other anti- nutrients.
    even if complex carbs are highly glycemic, wouldn't that be an energy source.

    you have blown my mind with that statement because I get good, long lasting energy from complex carbs.

    mind=blown
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    Quote Originally Posted by bakerderek0 View Post
    even if complex carbs are highly glycemic, wouldn't that be an energy source.

    you have blown my mind with that statement because I get good, long lasting energy from complex carbs.

    mind=blown
    well if you eat something highly glycemic on its own, your blood sugar will go sky high and then crash..making it a bad energy source. they glycemic load of complex carbs is what makes them so detrimental. it takes just a little piece of bread to initiate the same blood sugar/insulin response as it would from a much bigger serving of fruit.

    the energy source for the body is calories. everything breaks down into glucose. if you are consuming calories then you should have energy. the question is the quality of those calories. complex carbs like pasta/oatmeal/bread are so nutrient depleted, the government actually requires the manufacturers to "enrich" the flour as a last attempt to make the food nutritious. the gluten and other anti nutrients create all kinds of inflammation in the gut leading to IBS, allergies, sinus congestion, and possibly a list of other issues and diseases. this irritation is low so its not noticeable until its accumulated later on in life.

    so in the calorie vs. calorie battle, vegetables/fruit/eggs/meat/fish completely dominate pasta/bread/oats in terms of vitamins and minerals. its actually better to not eat anything than to eat a piece of bread, because the gut uses up valuable enzymes trying to extract nutrients from a nutrient dead food.
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    I second this completely. It was just covered on a recent episode of Super Human Radio, #688 if memory serves, and what Anton is saying is spot on. Also, what people don't realize is that a higher percentage of fat in the diet leads to so many health benefits through hormone optimization and stable levels it is mind blowing. I am not saying I am going to not ever eat complex carbs, but I am going to keep the number to a minimum. Remember, anything that is recommended, high fiber/low fat diet is for a reason. In this case, it is to sell more drugs to battle cholesterol, heart issues, the list goes on and on. If you want to do yourself a favor, take 90% of what you hear from the FDA and the media and dismiss it as completely wrong.

    Case and point, the ketogenic diet was originally developed to combat/control epilepsy in children in the early 1900s (I forget the year). Is it used today even though the insulin stabilization that it provided was very effective, no. I had my friend's wife ask her doctor about it for her epilepsy that is quite bad actually, he said no that is not effective, we have drugs now (dude probably knew very little so used a text book answer). I rest my case, let's avoid root causes and continually band aid problems. Go on and listen to the beloved FDA and popular diet fads (HCG diet comes to mind, what a joke), see how that treats you when you are 60. End rant/

    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    well if you eat something highly glycemic on its own, your blood sugar will go sky high and then crash..making it a bad energy source. they glycemic load of complex carbs is what makes them so detrimental. it takes just a little piece of bread to initiate the same blood sugar/insulin response as it would from a much bigger serving of fruit.

    the energy source for the body is calories. everything breaks down into glucose. if you are consuming calories then you should have energy. the question is the quality of those calories. complex carbs like pasta/oatmeal/bread are so nutrient depleted, the government actually requires the manufacturers to "enrich" the flour as a last attempt to make the food nutritious. the gluten and other anti nutrients create all kinds of inflammation in the gut leading to IBS, allergies, sinus congestion, and possibly a list of other issues and diseases. this irritation is low so its not noticeable until its accumulated later on in life.

    so in the calorie vs. calorie battle, vegetables/fruit/eggs/meat/fish completely dominate pasta/bread/oats in terms of vitamins and minerals. its actually better to not eat anything than to eat a piece of bread, because the gut uses up valuable enzymes trying to extract nutrients from a nutrient dead food.
    If my direct and cynical approach bothers you, just ignore it. I'm just saying what you need to hear ;).
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    well if you eat something highly glycemic on its own, your blood sugar will go sky high and then crash..making it a bad energy source. they glycemic load of complex carbs is what makes them so detrimental. it takes just a little piece of bread to initiate the same blood sugar/insulin response as it would from a much bigger serving of fruit.

    the energy source for the body is calories. everything breaks down into glucose. if you are consuming calories then you should have energy. the question is the quality of those calories. complex carbs like pasta/oatmeal/bread are so nutrient depleted, the government actually requires the manufacturers to "enrich" the flour as a last attempt to make the food nutritious. the gluten and other anti nutrients create all kinds of inflammation in the gut leading to IBS, allergies, sinus congestion, and possibly a list of other issues and diseases. this irritation is low so its not noticeable until its accumulated later on in life.

    so in the calorie vs. calorie battle, vegetables/fruit/eggs/meat/fish completely dominate pasta/bread/oats in terms of vitamins and minerals. its actually better to not eat anything than to eat a piece of bread, because the gut uses up valuable enzymes trying to extract nutrients from a nutrient dead food.
    Correct... Different sources and types of kCals have different impact on the insulinlevels and such...

    Most people think they need to avoid certain types of food like Pizza, Hamburgers etc etc etc... You can eat pizza every day but still don't gain weight...

    It all comes down to if you eat more or less then the body requires...
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    Quote Originally Posted by oufinny View Post
    I second this completely. It was just covered on a recent episode of Super Human Radio, #688 if memory serves, and what Anton is saying is spot on. Also, what people don't realize is that a higher percentage of fat in the diet leads to so many health benefits through hormone optimization and stable levels it is mind blowing. I am not saying I am going to not ever eat complex carbs, but I am going to keep the number to a minimum. Remember, anything that is recommended, high fiber/low fat diet is for a reason. In this case, it is to sell more drugs to battle cholesterol, heart issues, the list goes on and on. If you want to do yourself a favor, take 90% of what you hear from the FDA and the media and dismiss it as completely wrong.

    Case and point, the ketogenic diet was originally developed to combat/control epilepsy in children in the early 1900s (I forget the year). Is it used today even though the insulin stabilization that it provided was very effective, no. I had my friend's wife ask her doctor about it for her epilepsy that is quite bad actually, he said no that is not effective, we have drugs now (dude probably knew very little so used a text book answer). I rest my case, let's avoid root causes and continually band aid problems. Go on and listen to the beloved FDA and popular diet fads (HCG diet comes to mind, what a joke), see how that treats you when you are 60. End rant/
    The most comical part about your rant is that SHR is as full of crap and as money oriented as the FDA, he'll only do a show on your product if you buy advertising. And every product he talks about is amazing, innovative and paying him thousands of dollars......
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    hey rant or not he is right. high carb diets have ruined millions of people's health
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    hey rant or not he is right. high carb diets have ruined millions of people's health
    I'd prefer stating that as "low fat diets have ruined millions of people's health" as i'm still of the belief that after the threshholds of necessary EAAs and EFAs that the caloric source of the rest of your intake is virtually meaningless
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    Good postings as always Anton
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    Quote Originally Posted by oufinny View Post
    I second this completely. It was just covered on a recent episode of Super Human Radio, #688 if memory serves, and what Anton is saying is spot on. Also, what people don't realize is that a higher percentage of fat in the diet leads to so many health benefits through hormone optimization and stable levels it is mind blowing. I am not saying I am going to not ever eat complex carbs, but I am going to keep the number to a minimum. Remember, anything that is recommended, high fiber/low fat diet is for a reason. In this case, it is to sell more drugs to battle cholesterol, heart issues, the list goes on and on. If you want to do yourself a favor, take 90% of what you hear from the FDA and the media and dismiss it as completely wrong.

    Case and point, the ketogenic diet was originally developed to combat/control epilepsy in children in the early 1900s (I forget the year). Is it used today even though the insulin stabilization that it provided was very effective, no. I had my friend's wife ask her doctor about it for her epilepsy that is quite bad actually, he said no that is not effective, we have drugs now (dude probably knew very little so used a text book answer). I rest my case, let's avoid root causes and continually band aid problems. Go on and listen to the beloved FDA and popular diet fads (HCG diet comes to mind, what a joke), see how that treats you when you are 60. End rant/
    i think yourt out on a limb with this one -high fiber low fat dietso drug companies can sell more drugs -new to me .fiber prevents constipation;lowers blood cholestrol;controls blood sugar

    with regard to fat , it depends which type you refer to -saturated or polyunsaturated and monosaturated. Saturated is known to be bad for health but the latter improve blood cholestrol and lower the risk of heart disease.They also help decrease type 2 diabetes

    for most people who are healthy, complex carbs are not a problem
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eizbear View Post
    Correct... Different sources and types of kCals have different impact on the insulinlevels and such...

    Most people think they need to avoid certain types of food like Pizza, Hamburgers etc etc etc... You can eat pizza every day but still don't gain weight...

    It all comes down to if you eat more or less then the body requires...
    food is being quoted here that has little nutritous value and surely that must be something to consider when buying food.

    there is a saying , you are what you eat and its as relevant today as it ever was
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    The most comical part about your rant is that SHR is as full of crap and as money oriented as the FDA, he'll only do a show on your product if you buy advertising. And every product he talks about is amazing, innovative and paying him thousands of dollars......
    No the FDA is way worse especially if the discussion is about food quality and protection.

    SHR might make money by advertising a product but he does not profit from the continual sales of that product. The government has subsidized grains so much it is profitable to them to recommend it as they make money by doing so.

    It might be a comparison if maybe SHR was funding a supplement company and then telling everyone it's great and this is what you should take for your health all the while secretly profiting from that said company.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    there is no energy in complex carbs, thats a myth. complex carbs are for the most part highly glycemic and contain gluten and other anti- nutrients.

    fruit is great to obtain vitamins and minerals from. the fructose from the fruit isnt so bad because it has to be processed by the liver and fruit contains fiber, both of which ease the blood sugar hit. only problem with fruit is the agricultural habits of today. fruit is often genetically engineered and grafted. this ends up making the fruit super super sweet, containing way more sugar than its wild growing original version. therefore fruit should be eaten in moderation.

    vegetables are really the best bang for the buck. they contain tons of vitamins and nutrients and much less carbs than fruit. by consuming more vegetables than fruit you will keep a steady blood sugar and have a more desired body composition because excess fructose can definitely be stored as fat as mentioned above.

    try different vegetables. avocados are really good when you add them to other food. baby carrots make an easy snack. use spinach instead of lettuce in salads. possibilities are endless.
    Great post bro. You got me curious on this part, any specific reason for spinach over lettuce? Just the slightly higher fiber content?
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    Quote Originally Posted by corsaking View Post
    i think yourt out on a limb with this one -high fiber low fat dietso drug companies can sell more drugs -new to me .fiber prevents constipation;lowers blood cholestrol;controls blood sugar

    with regard to fat , it depends which type you refer to -saturated or polyunsaturated and monosaturated. Saturated is known to be bad for health but the latter improve blood cholestrol and lower the risk of heart disease.They also help decrease type 2 diabetes

    for most people who are healthy, complex carbs are not a problem
    No I'm not but I will let you believe what you want. As for fat, good luck making testosterone and other parent hormones with un-saturated fat. You are aware to utilize fats, you body has to saturate them, right? Nothing wrong with fiber, it is very necessary, I just put it is as that is a common diet that is so grossly wrong in its execution it is not funny.
    If my direct and cynical approach bothers you, just ignore it. I'm just saying what you need to hear ;).
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    No the FDA is way worse especially if the discussion is about food quality and protection.

    SHR might make money by advertising a product but he does not profit from the continual sales of that product. The government has subsidized grains so much it is profitable to them to recommend it as they make money by doing so.

    It might be a comparison if maybe SHR was funding a supplement company and then telling everyone it's great and this is what you should take for your health all the while secretly profiting from that said company.
    Almost all of the people on SHR are on there to get the message out and if they endorse a product it is because they believe in it. Those that do make products, they disclose it because that is just what ethical people do. Is everything on there gospel, no, but it is a great resource to get facts to do further study with. Remember one thing, a lot of time the truth is neither an easy pill to swallow not is it convenient. What you do with it is your own decision but know that I for one will eternally be skeptical about anything coming out of the FDA, that is the miost corrupt organization in the US right next to the EPA .
    If my direct and cynical approach bothers you, just ignore it. I'm just saying what you need to hear ;).
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    Quote Originally Posted by MakaveliThaDon View Post
    Great post bro. You got me curious on this part, any specific reason for spinach over lettuce? Just the slightly higher fiber content?
    no, spinach is jam packed with nutrients and is extremely alkaline which reduces the overall renal acid load (acidity) of your meals. look up PRAL acidity chart
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    Quote Originally Posted by corsaking View Post
    i think yourt out on a limb with this one -high fiber low fat dietso drug companies can sell more drugs -new to me .fiber prevents constipation;lowers blood cholestrol;controls blood sugar

    with regard to fat , it depends which type you refer to -saturated or polyunsaturated and monosaturated. Saturated is known to be bad for health but the latter improve blood cholestrol and lower the risk of heart disease.They also help decrease type 2 diabetes

    for most people who are healthy, complex carbs are not a problem
    there is no connection of saturated fat to heart disease, you wont find a single study. saturated fat is actually protected from becoming rancid and most of your cells are consisted of saturated fat. you have been reading USDA food pyramid, there is lots and lots of new research out there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    there is no connection of saturated fat to heart disease, you wont find a single study. saturated fat is actually protected from becoming rancid and most of your cells are consisted of saturated fat. you have been reading USDA food pyramid, there is lots and lots of new research out there.
    And I rest my case .
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    I'd prefer stating that as "low fat diets have ruined millions of people's health" as i'm still of the belief that after the threshholds of necessary EAAs and EFAs that the caloric source of the rest of your intake is virtually meaningless
    what do you think made USA so obese then? an absence of EAA's and EFAs? i firmly believe its excess carbohydrates. bread, buns, pasta, sugars, pastries, etc this is what people gorge on during their journey to become fat. i know for my own body, carbohydrate restriction has led me to obtain the abs and oblique definition that i have now. during my days of eating bread/pasta/oatmeal i had a much higher bf %
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    what do you think made USA so obese then? an absence of EAA's and EFAs? i firmly believe its excess carbohydrates. bread, buns, pasta, sugars, pastries, etc this is what people gorge on during their journey to become fat. i know for my own body, carbohydrate restriction has led me to obtain the abs and oblique definition that i have now. during my days of eating bread/pasta/oatmeal i had a much higher bf %
    Excess calories. whether it was from fats or carbohydrates doesn't particularly matter, its the mentality of "a bigger portion is a better value". Its not like if the excess calories would have been from bacon and cheese they wouldn't be as obese as the calories coming from donuts.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    what do you think made USA so obese then? an absence of EAA's and EFAs? i firmly believe its excess carbohydrates. bread, buns, pasta, sugars, pastries, etc this is what people gorge on during their journey to become fat. i know for my own body, carbohydrate restriction has led me to obtain the abs and oblique definition that i have now. during my days of eating bread/pasta/oatmeal i had a much higher bf %
    I have to agree with this. More and more research is being presented to support this and links to many diseases that don't show up in the third world where cultivated grains aren't present support this even further. Diabetes in so many cases is preventable through diet but people refuse to change and then spend a lifetime managing a preventable disease.

    And to the OP, I eat fruit and continue to lean out. Find vegetables you like or learn how to cook them so you do. The whole they taste yucky crap is a childish excuse, not saying that is your response, but I don't know anyone who won't eat vegetables that is healthy. Your colon will thank you if you do.
    If my direct and cynical approach bothers you, just ignore it. I'm just saying what you need to hear ;).
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    Quote Originally Posted by corsaking View Post
    i think yourt out on a limb with this one -high fiber low fat dietso drug companies can sell more drugs -new to me .fiber prevents constipation;lowers blood cholestrol;controls blood sugar

    with regard to fat , it depends which type you refer to -saturated or polyunsaturated and monosaturated. Saturated is known to be bad for health but the latter improve blood cholestrol and lower the risk of heart disease.They also help decrease type 2 diabetes

    for most people who are healthy, complex carbs are not a problem
    Unfortunately, this is all conventional wisdom that we are all taught that is completely wrong. You know what else controls blood sugar: not taking in a large amount of carbohydrates.
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    Quote Originally Posted by oufinny View Post
    I have to agree with this. More and more research is being presented to support this and links to many diseases that don't show up in the third world where cultivated grains aren't present support this even further. Diabetes in so many cases is preventable through diet but people refuse to change and then spend a lifetime managing a preventable disease.
    Where in the third world is this? Can you point to that research? because I don't know of any third world countries that don't have a huge reliance on rice (and potentially beans) for most of their populace, which would fall into "cultivated grains".
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Unfortunately, this is all conventional wisdom that we are all taught that is completely wrong. You know what else controls blood sugar: not taking in a large amount of carbohydrates.
    Love it! And take a look at Rodja certifications, he kind of knows what he is talking about.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Excess calories. whether it was from fats or carbohydrates doesn't particularly matter, its the mentality of "a bigger portion is a better value". Its not like if the excess calories would have been from bacon and cheese they wouldn't be as obese as the calories coming from donuts.
    alright thats weight gain. how bout body composition? its very possible to become fat without gaining much weight. check out the infamous "skinny fat guy physique". there are tons of people (like my coworkers for example) who claim to be the same weight they used to be since college but they are sporting a gut. im not a scientist but obviously the calories they've been eating have caused them to lose LBM and gain fat. they are not blowing up to astronomical sizes but they are fat.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    alright thats weight gain. how bout body composition? its very possible to become fat without gaining much weight. check out the infamous "skinny fat guy physique". there are tons of people (like my coworkers for example) who claim to be the same weight they used to be since college but they are sporting a gut. im not a scientist but obviously the calories they've been eating have caused them to lose LBM and gain fat. they are not blowing up to astronomical sizes but they are fat.
    their lack of physical activity is probably what cause them to lose lean mass and gain fat. its not what they've been eating, but what they haven't been doing that they used to do back in college.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Where in the third world is this? Can you point to that research? because I don't know of any third world countries that don't have a huge reliance on rice (and potentially beans) for most of their populace, which would fall into "cultivated grains".
    there are populations like this out there. there are islands where people live off fish and coconut and hardly ever suffer from diabetes and other western diseases. its a sad truth that USDA has been pushing pro-grains information for decades and it hasnt led to anything good. sure rice and beans can sustain a large population that is able to pro-create but still suffers a great deal of ailments. there are proven anti-nutrients in grains and a complete lack of vitamins/minerals. believe it or not, grains make people fat and sick.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    their lack of physical activity is probably what cause them to lose lean mass and gain fat. its not what they've been eating, but what they haven't been doing that they used to do back in college.
    oh come on dude! you honestly think that exercise would have prevented their michelin man body type?? not a diet thats rich in hydrogenated fats, HFCS, and highly glycemic grains?
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Excess calories. whether it was from fats or carbohydrates doesn't particularly matter, its the mentality of "a bigger portion is a better value". Its not like if the excess calories would have been from bacon and cheese they wouldn't be as obese as the calories coming from donuts.
    I think the problem here is your generalization of people who eat high protein diets. Yes there are many who eat extra protein in hopes of gaining more muscles but that's not the only reason. My mom eats a high protein and fat diet. Why? Well it's not because she is a body builder it is because through her diet she has been able to come off of many different medications she was previously on. Recently my wife started eating the way I do too. High protein diets aren't just for body builders and "too het huge" isn't the only reason to eat this way

    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Where in the third world is this? Can you point to that research? because I don't know of any third world countries that don't have a huge reliance on rice (and potentially beans) for most of their populace, which would fall into "cultivated grains".
    You do realize we export a majority of those grains to those third world countries right? They didn't use to eat a diet high in grains before but since now America can grow grains at below cost we have effectively put the farmers in these other countries out of businesss

    And as for your question who? The inuits. They have been studied and followed for a long time now and have next to no dieases like we do here and their diets are all rich in fat and protein with little to no carb intake
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    there are populations like this out there. there are islands where people live off fish and coconut and hardly ever suffer from diabetes and other western diseases. its a sad truth that USDA has been pushing pro-grains information for decades and it hasnt led to anything good. sure rice and beans can sustain a large population that is able to pro-create but still suffers a great deal of ailments. there are proven anti-nutrients in grains and a complete lack of vitamins/minerals. believe it or not, grains make people fat and sick.
    How long has china been a rice based diet culture, and then why don't they have obesity rates and diabetes anything like ours? How often do you see a skinnyfat chinese native? You are forcing specious logic from an example that fits the solution you like, when there are much larger more statistically significant examples that contradict that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    How long has china been a rice based diet culture, and then why don't they have obesity rates and diabetes anything like ours? How often do you see a skinnyfat chinese native? You are forcing specious logic from an example that fits the solution you like, when there are much larger more statistically significant examples that contradict that.
    yeah the chinese are also the shortest nation and the least athletic. they are all lactose intolerant. look at any older chinese person, he is definitely going to be skinny fat. they are not consuming as many calories as americans, therefore they are not huge. i am simply looking at facts that state that agriculture hasnt been around longer than 10000 or so years. we have evolved into this body 500,000 years ago as hunters gatherers who wouldnt waste their time cultivating crops for months when there is a delicious and nutritious animals to eat. there is gluten and other PROVEN anti nutrients in grains, they are there to protect them from being eaten. its a never ending debate really.
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    Yeah But again, evolution doesn't optimize the individual either, it merely does its best to ensure species survival. So that doesn't really lend any weight either.

    I did a month no grains no dairy and couldn't particularly tell a difference other than that I had to eat a ****load of nuts to get in the same calories i would otherwise.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    How long has china been a rice based diet culture, and then why don't they have obesity rates and diabetes anything like ours? How often do you see a skinnyfat chinese native? You are forcing specious logic from an example that fits the solution you like, when there are much larger more statistically significant examples that contradict that.
    .....

    Quote China is facing an obesity epidemic. Between 1992 and 2002, the prevalence of overweight and obesity increased in all gender and age groups and in all geographic areas of the country. Using the World Health Organization body mass index cutoff points, the combined prevalence of overweight and obesity increased from 14.6 to 21.8% during this period. [An increase of about 50%, which pretty much mirrors what has happened in the US, although from a lower starting point. quote
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    and that was a serving size change and economic change, not a dietary change. China has relied primarily on rice for thousands of years.
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    Crap, I was about to go on, but poor Torq (the original poster) is getting his thread overrun

    Anyhow Torq, keep eating the fruit, its definitely no worse for you than other caloric sources.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Yeah But again, evolution doesn't optimize the individual either, it merely does its best to ensure species survival. So that doesn't really lend any weight either.

    I did a month no grains no dairy and couldn't particularly tell a difference other than that I had to eat a ****load of nuts to get in the same calories i would otherwise.
    grains arent part of the evolution though. they are simply a food that can sustain a very large population, regardless of health.

    it takes more than a month to feel the full benefits. ever since i stopped eating grains/milk i became much leaner, seasonal allergies went away, i sleep and recover better, immune system is stronger. i dont take 5 sh!ts a day anymore after eating all that insoluble fiber, therefore i have better levels of healthy bacteria in my gut. i just feel overall better. sometimes a month isnt enough to realize the true benefits of this diet. if it didnt work for me and people around me, i wouldnt be pushing it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    and that was a serving size change and economic change, not a dietary change. China has relied primarily on rice for thousands of years.
    Just an FYI for someone who has spent some time in China, both north and south parts as well, rice is not what sustains China. You need to take a geography lesson, the climate north of Shanghai is too cold to grow rice and the crop they used is wheat to make noodles. And that is only because it was cheap and people are so poor they had no choice, especially during the cultural revolution when protein and vegetables were luxuries. You know what middle class Chinese eat now, MEAT AND VEGETABLES because they grew up only eating rice or noodles.

    In all the time I was there, 9 out of 10 meals was meat, vegetables and fruit. If noodles were consumed, it was because the city I was in was famous for it and we wanted to try them. You make some good points but your facts are not 100% correct.

    And as to why the obesity rate is up, in all major cities US and European fast food companies are there doing the same thing to the Chinese as they do to those in America and Europe. Green tea can only keep you so thin and their skinny selves are so malnourished it is no shock they are all short and have the WORST teeth of any place I have been. Oh, and it is the cool thing to drink coke and sugary beverages there now that people have access to them. Again, look at America for what that does to a populations health.
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