3 AD Clone!

[Viperspit]

Don't lose sight that this is still business for these companies. The internet forums are just an extension tool for what a lot of these guys do on the phone, through company emails or in meetings everyday. Now you get to hear about it quicker then the rumor mill is all.
I believe that they all love the industry or else they wouldn't be in it. A lot of these guys could work for large Pharm companies or other arenas that suit their backgrounds, but then the $$ are not necessarily as abundant as owning your own business or being the a major player with a large supp comp. What kills me is the hypocrisy that goes on in the various forums. Calling out companies when your own company is just a guilty. What's funny is when you expose this on certain boards, posts come up missing, links are defunct, legal threats start rolling in, etc etc. It's also funny that it's tolerated on certain companies but not on others, I guess it's all in who you bribe these days

 

[Vitruvian]

PA,
As I should have been days ago, I'm done with this discussion. It seems a bit one-sided, (which side depends on who is doing the reading).
Your continued defensive posture and God-complex shows me nothing I say has any relevance to you...... in one ear, out the other. More readers agree with me than you would ever believe. I'm man enough to admit you, by far, have superior scientific knowledge to me. Which is why none of my argument has been regarding science. It's all about being someone who contributes what they can. I'll also add in that your contribution to this industry could be so much more...... it's a shame.

Viper, Can you PM me a link to that Blog?

 

[ReaperX]

Business is business, your right. Your not in the game NOT to make money, we all need to make a living. I've said this before and I'll say it again since it seems like a lot of individuals have some type of deficiency in understanding this concept.

I don't care if a company gets their feelings hurt, or even does the insulting. Who gives a flying F*CK ?! Supplements are meant to help people get their gains so they need to F*CKING WORK PERIOD ! People can talk all the sh*t they want I could care less. Back up your product with quality and results, because after all that's what I'm paying for. I'm not paying for marketing, advertising, etc, etc, etc. I'm paying for results.

If you are sensative to getting your feelings hurt, eat more red meat. It might make you more of a man.

 

[Vitruvian]

2. Dr. D comes off as a little bit too much like a guy in the industry trying desperately to stake claim to some sort of territory, create a following, and hypes things unnecessarily.

.

Dhuge,

I do not know Dr. D, but I can say without a doubt though that he is a willing friend to forum members who have questions. He goes out of his way to try to explain things many of us do not understand.

 

[superdrollover]

Dhuge,

I do not know Dr. D, but I can say without a doubt though that he is a willing friend to forum members who have questions. He goes out of his way to try to explain things many of us do not understand.

I will back that up!

 

[neoborn]

I will back that up!

I three. I have seen Dr.D answer countless posts and not just about a product his company makes.

Like others have said PA it's a shame you can't see anyones side apart from your own. From what I am able to see, I see clearly you do not fool me. I have stated this several times.

If you're gonna be honest, be honest all the time.

If you're gonna answer questions, answer the whole / all the questions.

Again we just agree to disagree... no hard feelings bud as usual.

Much Love,

Neoborn

 

[matthew76]

3-AD CLONE is the thread - please move all the BS to aanother thread - Thank You

On a side note - I do not take sides, just simply agree with what I feel is right - and to be honest, PA is getting the wrong end of the stick.

NOW BACK TO THE CLONE!

 

[poopypants]

this thread suxxors and has turned into a never ending sides battle.....

suppose we can get a "favor" from one of the bigwigs posting in here to test the new clone for us and verify wether or not its up to par???

 

[matthew76]

"this thread suxxors and has turned into a never ending sides battle....." - poopy



i'm sure you don't have anything to do with it, huh?:think:

PA - any way you can test this stuff from XPN? Or do you have any knowledge of their company?

 

[poopypants]

:think: i merely supplied info for wich people were askking i never started or contributed to whoes the best chemist of the world battle.... when was the last post i made????? thanks

and didnt i just ask for the same thing as you ????

 

[EasyEJL]

"this thread suxxors and has turned into a never ending sides battle....." - poopy



i'm sure you don't have anything to do with it, huh?:think:

PA - any way you can test this stuff from XPN? Or do you have any knowledge of their company?

Actually, just to avoid more potential for drame, ralph4u2c offered to test some, if someone was willing to give up a few caps. Did you save any of the bottle that had broken open? I don't have any 11-oxo to compare with, I suppose we could see if anyone has a bottle.

I actually hope that this other source being out there leads ergopharm either lower the price, or raise the bottle cap count to 90 caps while keeping the price the same. I'd like to have 75mg caps to dose at lower levels for cortisol control. If 11-oxo did maintain price at 90 caps instead of 6, it would be a 6.75g total content bottle for its $40something vs the 9 gram bottle of the xpn for $50something, i'd gladly pay the premium for the smaller caps.

 

[Viperspit]

3-AD CLONE is the thread - please move all the BS to aanother thread - Thank You

On a side note - I do not take sides, just simply agree with what I feel is right - and to be honest, PA is getting the wrong end of the stick.

NOW BACK TO THE CLONE!

No disrespect and I didn't mean to derail or add to the derailment of the thread. But if you think it's just as simple as a clone coming to the market, you are only seeing a very, very small piece of the picture.

 

[matthew76]

yeah bro, i should get my new bottle mon or tue and am looking into sending some off to be tested...

i also ordered 1 more bottle to run in place of x-lean to compare the two

Actually, just to avoid more potential for drame, ralph4u2c offered to test some, if someone was willing to give up a few caps. Did you save any of the bottle that had broken open? I don't have any 11-oxo to compare with, I suppose we could see if anyone has a bottle.

I actually hope that this other source being out there leads ergopharm either lower the price, or raise the bottle cap count to 90 caps while keeping the price the same. I'd like to have 75mg caps to dose at lower levels for cortisol control. If 11-oxo did maintain price at 90 caps instead of 6, it would be a 6.75g total content bottle for its $40something vs the 9 gram bottle of the xpn for $50something, i'd gladly pay the premium for the smaller caps.

 

[Viperspit]

Actually, just to avoid more potential for drame, ralph4u2c offered to test some, if someone was willing to give up a few caps. Did you save any of the bottle that had broken open? I don't have any 11-oxo to compare with, I suppose we could see if anyone has a bottle.

I actually hope that this other source being out there leads ergopharm either lower the price, or raise the bottle cap count to 90 caps while keeping the price the same. I'd like to have 75mg caps to dose at lower levels for cortisol control. If 11-oxo did maintain price at 90 caps instead of 6, it would be a 6.75g total content bottle for its $40something vs the 9 gram bottle of the xpn for $50something, i'd gladly pay the premium for the smaller caps.

I'd also love to see the results on this. Here's what I don't understand. You obviously have a specific purpose, that being control of cortisol levels with this product(s). When I read logs, it seems 90% of them say "I get nothing out of it, blah, blah". I think people are expecting anabolic-like responses from 11-oxo/3-AD. It ain't going to happen unless you mega-dose it and even then, I'm not sure what results will actually be obtained. Which brings me to my next question. How does one measure cortisol control?

 

[matthew76]

really, the only way to measure it is a cortisol test is that is done to measure the level of the hormone cortisol in the blood. (bloodwork)

anyone else?

 

[Viperspit]

really, the only way to measure it is a cortisol test is that is done to measure the level of the hormone cortisol in the blood. (bloodwork)

anyone else?

lol, sorry it was a rhetorical question. I agree, bloodwork is the only way I would consider hard evidence as well. Although if someone had maintained a solid diet for a period of time and jumped on one of these compounds, kept the same routine/diet and dropped bodyfat, I may be inclined to believe that it has benefited them. Anyone else?

 

[Vitruvian]

Anyone else?

:lol:

 

[Redeemer]

PA,
As I should have been days ago, I'm done with this discussion. It seems a bit one-sided, (which side depends on who is doing the reading).
Your continued defensive posture and God-complex shows me nothing I say has any relevance to you...... in one ear, out the other. More readers agree with me than you would ever believe. I'm man enough to admit you, by far, have superior scientific knowledge to me. Which is why none of my argument has been regarding science. It's all about being someone who contributes what they can. I'll also add in that your contribution to this industry could be so much more...... it's a shame.

Viper, Can you PM me a link to that Blog?

:goodpost:

PA you don't care, I know, but you lost what respect i had for you when you said that kind of crap about Dr. D

 

[matthew76]

:whiner: so he said something about someone (not you) and you're going to bash him?

i have no propblem with dr.d, he has helped me out when i have a question, but i'll leave PA and him to discuss their differences for themselves

grow up dude!

 

[matthew76]

damn - so this clone is everywhere now!

found a funny intro for it at fitfu.... you know - here it is

The 3-AD Clone is here!

Everyone has been waiting for 3-AD by Anabolic Xtreme and it's release keeps getting delayed and delayed. Will it ever become available? Well unfortunately for Anabolic Xtreme, XPN has released a 3-AD clone before 3-AD is even available! This is the same product!

DAMN!

 

[Viperspit]

:whiner: so he said something about someone (not you) and you're going to bash him?

i have no propblem with dr.d, he has helped me out when i have a question, but i'll leave PA and him to discuss their differences for themselves

grow up dude!

agreed!

There is so much $hit talking in this industry it's incredible. Everyone knows everyone and pretty much everyone muthafuks each other behind their back. You'll see new bonds formed every year, witness the "The Day the Earth Stood Still" bull$hit thread at bb. Rich makes it seems like everyone is bothers in arms when in fact, all they did was license 6-oxo from PA because their product sucked ass and sales were a failure.

I've met Dr. D personally and he's a great guy to talk with. Very personable. I tried to meet Patrick at the AC this year, but he was out of the booth everytime we went over to see him. I'm sure he's a great guy as well. Everyone has to protect their interests, bottom line!

 

[Patrick Arnold]

Supposedly you're here to help......... take the time to help the little companies that are trying their hardest to make an honest, respectable living. Supplement users don't want to exist on Ergo products alone.......

i gotcha. the way a large software company takes the time to help out an up and comer

or a large soft drink company gives tips and good words to the small guys

the way the big shots were oh so kind to me back in the 1990's

what fairyland do you live in?

 

[Patrick Arnold]

PA,
As I should have been days ago, I'm done with this discussion. It seems a bit one-sided, (which side depends on who is doing the reading).
Your continued defensive posture and God-complex shows me nothing I say has any relevance to you...... in one ear, out the other. More readers agree with me than you would ever believe. I'm man enough to admit you, by far, have superior scientific knowledge to me. Which is why none of my argument has been regarding science. It's all about being someone who contributes what they can. I'll also add in that your contribution to this industry could be so much more...... it's a shame.

get over it man. jeezus

 

[Patrick Arnold]

Dhuge,

I do not know Dr. D, but I can say without a doubt though that he is a willing friend to forum members who have questions. He goes out of his way to try to explain things many of us do not understand.

what is more important, a ready answer or the right answer?

 

[Patrick Arnold]

"this thread suxxors and has turned into a never ending sides battle....." - poopy



i'm sure you don't have anything to do with it, huh?:think:

PA - any way you can test this stuff from XPN? Or do you have any knowledge of their company?

being this a direct competitor to 11-oxo it is probably inappropriate (if even just from a legal standpoint) for me to get involved with testing and reporting.

though i might get some to test for private purposes. If it comes out bad then i would have to consult with legal counsel on what to do

 

[Patrick Arnold]

Actually, just to avoid more potential for drame, ralph4u2c offered to test some, if someone was willing to give up a few caps. Did you save any of the bottle that had broken open? I don't have any 11-oxo to compare with, I suppose we could see if anyone has a bottle.

I actually hope that this other source being out there leads ergopharm either lower the price, or raise the bottle cap count to 90 caps while keeping the price the same. I'd like to have 75mg caps to dose at lower levels for cortisol control. If 11-oxo did maintain price at 90 caps instead of 6, it would be a 6.75g total content bottle for its $40something vs the 9 gram bottle of the xpn for $50something, i'd gladly pay the premium for the smaller caps.

Sorry but its impossible for us to compete on price against a brand that sells direct. Thats just a common business fact

 

[matthew76]

sweet - thanks PA!

being this a direct competitor to 11-oxo it is probably inappropriate (if even just from a legal standpoint) for me to get involved with testing and reporting.

though i might get some to test for private purposes. If it comes out bad then i would have to consult with legal counsel on what to do

 

[Patrick Arnold]

I'd also love to see the results on this. Here's what I don't understand. You obviously have a specific purpose, that being control of cortisol levels with this product(s). When I read logs, it seems 90% of them say "I get nothing out of it, blah, blah". I think people are expecting anabolic-like responses from 11-oxo/3-AD. It ain't going to happen unless you mega-dose it and even then, I'm not sure what results will actually be obtained. Which brings me to my next question. How does one measure cortisol control?

you really see 90% saying they get nothing from it? where are you reading these?

not easy to gauge cortisol control but one thing you may notice first is a reduction in waist circumference. also, if you could measure blood sugar you would notice a drop in the average readings

 

[Patrick Arnold]

really, the only way to measure it is a cortisol test is that is done to measure the level of the hormone cortisol in the blood. (bloodwork)

anyone else?

with an 11beta-HSD inhibitor you probably would not see much of a change in blood cortisol. you would see a decrease in the urinary tetrahydrocortisol/tetrahydrocortisone ratio

 

[Patrick Arnold]

:goodpost:

PA you don't care, I know, but you lost what respect i had for you when you said that kind of crap about Dr. D

Jimmy cracked corn and guess what else

 

[riseboi]

Jimmy cracked corn and guess what else

LMAO!!!:toofunny:

 

[Patrick Arnold]

agreed!

There is so much $hit talking in this industry it's incredible. Everyone knows everyone and pretty much everyone muthafuks each other behind their back. You'll see new bonds formed every year, witness the "The Day the Earth Stood Still" bull$hit thread at bb. Rich makes it seems like everyone is bothers in arms when in fact, all they did was license 6-oxo from PA because their product sucked ass and sales were a failure.

actually their product sold very well but they were worried about the legality of the AI in there so they switched to 6-oxo which has solid legal support

we would not have bothered making the deal if the product was not a good seller, it would not have been worth our time

 

[Patrick Arnold]

I've met Dr. D personally and he's a great guy to talk with. Very personable. I tried to meet Patrick at the AC this year, but he was out of the booth everytime we went over to see him. I'm sure he's a great guy as well. Everyone has to protect their interests, bottom line!

Dr. D is the kind of guy that will tell people what they want to hear, so they love him

OTOH i tell them the truth, which does not always go over so well

 

[EasyEJL]

Sorry but its impossible for us to compete on price against a brand that sells direct. Thats just a common business fact

Oh well, mostly wishful thinking. Its hard for me to pay 2x as much per gram as a generic. I could manage 1.3-1.5x as much tho. I may anyhow, as i'd prefer to keep steady level of adresnosterone in blood as far as cortisol control goes (just for a short while) and with these xpn caps it means I have to take the 450mg/day to do that or even more 8 hour spacing means 450mg. Really the 6 hour spacing seems more appropriate for steady level, but I didn't want to take 600mg a day, not looking for anabolic effect, just want to get rid of VAT + SAT. If I wanted anabolic effect, i'd be taking superdrol.

 

[Patrick Arnold]

Oh well, mostly wishful thinking. Its hard for me to pay 2x as much per gram as a generic. I could manage 1.3-1.5x as much tho.

PRICES PER 12 GRAMS

adrenosterone XTN (island supplements) 52.99

adrenosterone ERGOPHARM (*************) 2 X 35.99 = 71.98

thats less than 1.5. so i guess you will be buying 11-oxo now?

 

[EasyEJL]

PRICES PER 12 GRAMS

adrenosterone XTN (island supplements) 52.99

adrenosterone ERGOPHARM (*************) 2 X 35.99 = 71.98

thats less than 1.5. so i guess you will be buying 11-oxo now?

Hmm yeah probably now that you mention it.

 

[Redeemer]

Jimmy cracked corn and guess what else

Sorry PA I might have been out of line. Must be roid rage.

 

[Viperspit]

you really see 90% saying they get nothing from it? where are you reading these?

not easy to gauge cortisol control but one thing you may notice first is a reduction in waist circumference. also, if you could measure blood sugar you would notice a drop in the average readings

Patrick, yes, I really do see the vast majority saying they see no effects. But again, I truly believe it's because they are using it at recommended dosages for a cortisol regulator and are expecting anabolic effects.

 

[neoborn]

And nooooowwwwwwww back to 3-AD Teh Clone Wars!

<3

 

[Viperspit]

actually their product sold very well but they were worried about the legality of the AI in there so they switched to 6-oxo which has solid legal support

we would not have bothered making the deal if the product was not a good seller, it would not have been worth our time

Well increased sales is increased sales for Ergo in my book, I won't debate Gaspari's sales of HLG. My point was more the fact that they acted like you guys were almost sharing each others spouses in the write-up.

 

[FitnFirm]

Dr. D is the kind of guy that will tell people what they want to hear, so they love him

OTOH i tell them the truth, which does not always go over so well

We didnt talk supps we talked general topics so there was no need to tell me what I wanted to hear, I like the truth regardless and he has also helped me a few times when I needed some information without wanting anything in return. SO I disagree The internet brings out the bad in some people, me included but meeting in person is totally different. Regardless he is built like a mack truck at 5% BF when I met him, watched him get his BF tested right in front of me. I touched him he is hard all over


Patrick was not around, although we tried several times to hunt him down Its ok I met Darnell who is awesome and he got me drunk on the clear

 

[Patrick Arnold]

Sorry PA I might have been out of line. Must be roid rage.

quick, grab some phenibut

 

[Patrick Arnold]

Patrick, yes, I really do see the vast majority saying they see no effects. But again, I truly believe it's because they are using it at recommended dosages for a cortisol regulator and are expecting anabolic effects.

i recommend at least 6 per day for just about everyone now

 

[ReaperX]

Sharing spouses. Cool.

 

[Patrick Arnold]

Well increased sales is increased sales for Ergo in my book, I won't debate Gaspari's sales of HLG. My point was more the fact that they acted like you guys were almost sharing each others spouses in the write-up.

Kneller wrote the write up

need i say more?

 

[Patrick Arnold]

We didnt talk supps we talked general topics so there was no need to tell me what I wanted to hear, I like the truth regardless and he has also helped me a few times when I needed some information without wanting anything in return. SO I disagree The internet brings out the bad in some people, me included but meeting in person is totally different. Regardless he is built like a mack truck at 5% BF when I met him, watched him get his BF tested right in front of me. I touched him he is hard all over

wow he helped you by giving you information without wanting anything in return? thats amazing. he sounds incredible

wait a minute, thats just what i did for 3 freaking hours this afternoon in town today

big whoopee kathy

 

[FitnFirm]

wow he helped you by giving you information without wanting anything in return? thats amazing. he sounds incredible

wait a minute, thats just what i did for 3 freaking hours this afternoon in town today

big whoopee kathy

Well you are a busy guy too but would ya help me translate a 200 page book from French to English like he did ?

Dude, I like everyone until they give me a reason not to, very few people have given me reason not to in life. I prefer the easy going lifestyle where there is no turmoil and hate, afterall thats what all 3 of our Son's have been serving in the Marines and Airforce for, PEACE !!!!!!!

And........... You owe me lunch still

 

[Patrick Arnold]

Well you are a busy guy too but would ya help me translate a 200 page book from French to English like he did ?

can't say i would babe

 

[FitnFirm]

can't say i would babe

would you read me a cat in the hat book at least

 

[mania905]

so this product (androxtrme) really contains same compound as 11-oxo?