Guest viewing limit reached
  • You have reached the maximum number of guest views allowed
  • Please register below to remove this limitation

Us 'Old guys' and PH use

BoneDaddy

BoneDaddy

Well-known member
After talking with a friend yesterday, he suggested I was 'too old' to be taking prohormones and that I had 'missed my window'.:rasp: I did some searching, but no luck. I turn 36 in a month or so. What's your guys take on us 'old guys'and the use of a PH? It seems to me that we could use the edge and benifits of a PH that someone in their mid 20s.
 
You didn't miss your window. The only difference is that perhaps you might want to pay more attention to the impact on your lipid values, liver values, etc. Sounds like your "friend" wants your PH's. :)
 
BoneDaddy said:
After talking with a friend yesterday, he suggested I was 'too old' to be taking prohormones and that I had 'missed my window'.:rasp: I did some searching, but no luck. I turn 36 in a month or so. What's your guys take on us 'old guys'and the use of a PH? It seems to me that we could use the edge and benifits of a PH that someone in their mid 20s.
Click to expand...
Your friend's "argument" is bogus - too YOUNG for PH/AAS is a very real hurdle, and you're over it: you're IN the window *now* - your natural levels are beginning to tail off, though it will probably be months or years before you really start to notice unmistakably.

IMO you're much more likely to get real value out of such things now than you would have 10 years ago. Doesn't mean you don't have to be smart be carefull, do your research & pay attention, but you're good at that stuff by now, right?? :thumbsup:
 
I think the same, given that your test levels are lower you will get more of a boost, and I THINK but am not sure that it is easier to bring test up to a level of 300 than it is to bring it up to 800 after a cycle (as a 21 yo would have to)
 
BodyWizard said:
Your friend's "argument" is bogus - too YOUNG for PH/anabolic steroids is a very real hurdle, and you're over it: you're IN the window *now* - your natural levels are beginning to tail off, though it will probably be months or years before you really start to notice unmistakably.

IMO you're much more likely to get real value out of such things now than you would have 10 years ago. Doesn't mean you don't have to be smart be carefull, do your research & pay attention, but you're good at that stuff by now, right?? :thumbsup:
Click to expand...


Absolutely. I've been debating this and researching it for awhile now. Just placed an order for some final pct stuff a bit ago. Thanks for the reply!:thumbsup:
 
EasyEJL said:
plus you have more maturity as well, and likely more $ to spend on support supps, and blood tests :)
Click to expand...

Without a doubt. I love spending money on supps, too! :head: Which would you guys suggest as a first cycle? I have the original AX PP, a PP clone, and Havoc. I've considered picking up a halo clone but I only have 2 bottle of tamox. cit. and dont want my PH's to outnumber my serms, especially now that I'm scared to buy in light of recent events.
 
all goal dependent really, PP is a wet bulker, halo is a dry recomper/cutter/light bulker.

How old are you? I turn 40 this year.
 
I turn 36 in a few weeks. I thinking I'm going to use the PP to just flat out bulk and around the new year use the havoc.
 
pretty good idea. i'm still pondering what to use for my first cycle. I had planned an epistane / revolt cycle, but i'm less sure now. Might go with halodrol 50
 
EasyEJL said:
pretty good idea. i'm still pondering what to use for my first cycle. I had planned an epistane / revolt cycle, but i'm less sure now. Might go with halodrol 50
Click to expand...

I REALLY like what I've read about Halodrol. I think I might pick up a clone while I can and wait for things to die down before buying a serm. Can't wait for AI's Post Cycle therapy to hit this week as well. Told you like spending $$$ on supps!! :bb3:
 
I've got over 300g of 50% resveratrol in the house :D I had already decided to do high dose resveratrol pre, during and post cycle. I think it may help avoid HTPA suppression to some extent actually. Couple that with a low suppression PH, and it should all work out. I think i may do that plus 6-oxo extreme (still have 1 bottle unopened) and a fadogia based test booster. Or dermacrine sustain
 
Something to consider:

You may be at a point where your endogenous test is declining. Any substantial (or even insubstantial) inhibition may be more detrimental to your HPTA and recovery at this age. You may expedite andropause or at least have a more difficult time re-establishing your HPTA than a guy who is younger.

With the above statement in mind consider that you will elevate your androgen levels quite significantly (relatively more significantly than someone younger using same androgen) by introducing exogenous hormones. If you are able to restore your HPTA back to baseline you will be quite a bit lower than someone younger. This may make retaining your new grown LBM a little harder than someone whose baseline is higher.

Just some food for thought.
 
B5150 said:
Something to consider:

You may be at a point where your endogenous test is declining. Any substantial (or even insubstantial) inhibition may be more detrimental to your HPTA and recovery at this age. You may expedite andropause or at least have a more difficult time re-establishing your HPTA than a guy who is younger.

With the above statement in mind consider that you will elevate your androgen levels quite significantly (relatively more significantly than someone younger using same androgen) by introducing exogenous hormones. If you are able to restore your HPTA back to baseline you will be quite a bit lower than someone younger. This may make retaining your new grown LBM a little harder than someone whose baseline is higher.

Just some food for thought.
Click to expand...

B5150, have you seen documented evidence to that? I can't really find any. I have often wondered whether restoration of HPTA is easier given that you are only trying to get back to a relatively low level vs trying to get back to a high level. I would have assumed that shut down is shut down, and the lower starting point wouldn't make substancial difference as to how bad endogenous androgens would affect a person.
 
Its a question i've wondered. Is it easier to refill the testosterone production "glass" when it started at 300, vs when it started at 1100... who knows :)
 
My point is not entirely related to restoring. The additional point is; can that low value (even if restored) maintain that new LBM as easily as someone whose baseline was 500 or 600? Anecdotally, no.
 
I was going to make the same point as B5150. At an older age the body has a harder time recovering from damage to lipids and liver. Moreover, restoration of HPTA may be more sluggish.

IMHO, these should be the primary concerns of taking these products as one gets older.

Taking these into consideration, I'd only do lightly suppressive compounds for reasonable periods of time with solid gold PCT.
 
BodyWizard said:
Your friend's "argument" is bogus - too YOUNG for PH/anabolic steroids is a very real hurdle, and you're over it: you're IN the window *now* - your natural levels are beginning to tail off, though it will probably be months or years before you really start to notice unmistakably.

IMO you're much more likely to get real value out of such things now than you would have 10 years ago. Doesn't mean you don't have to be smart be carefull, do your research & pay attention, but you're good at that stuff by now, right?? :thumbsup:
Click to expand...

I agree with this idea. The age factor should make PH/PS use more sensible in regards to physical "gain", as you're assisting yourself in testosterone at a time when natural T levels are declining.

Taking care and being diligent about safety are key, of course. Since you're old and wise now, this won't be a prob (as BW has pointed out).
 
ah. hmm true, that is just as depressing. you are talking for people beyond their genetic limits tho right? I'm still more in the phase of trying to reach my genetic limit
 
My take on this subject

Guys, for me the difference is really notable. I'm not sure whether it is age or not. I think it may be more from my hospitalization in '05. Seems that these days I can work just as hard or harder in the gym and as far as diet goes. The results of my efforts are less and less though. Its like night and day from when before I ended up in the hospital till after. Of course I have not done a cycle since than but I am just talking results from diet and exercise.
 
EasyEJL said:
Its a question i've wondered. Is it easier to refill the testosterone production "glass" when it started at 300, vs when it started at 1100... who knows :)
Click to expand...

I'm wondering the same thing as well.

B5150, I agree, what do you think of lower dosed cycles(Cutting down on sides like BP etc.) and following up w/PCT of choice, and then other mild cycles to further compliment steady gains?
 
yeahright said:
I was going to make the same point as B5150. At an older age the body has a harder time recovering from damage to lipids and liver. Moreover, restoration of HPTA may be more sluggish.

IMHO, these should be the primary concerns of taking these products as one gets older.

Taking these into consideration, I'd only do lightly suppressive compounds for reasonable periods of time with solid gold post cycle therapy.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I just read your post....
FX
 
Wow! I really appreciate all the input and feedback from you guys. I agree with the solid gold PCT. Thats one reason I don't mind plopping down the $$$ for the things I need. I guess one way to find all of this out is to be the guinea pig, so to speak! :head:
 
yeahright said:
Taking these into consideration, I'd only do lightly suppressive compounds for reasonable periods of time with <b>solid gold post cycle therapy</b>.
Click to expand...

What would you guys consider a solid gold PCT? I have Nolva and will be using Retain, Activate Extreme, and Hyperdrol, Cycle Support as staples. Should I add something else in your opinion?
 
yeahright said:
I was going to make the same point as B5150. At an older age the body has a harder time recovering from damage to lipids and liver. Moreover, restoration of HPTA may be more sluggish.

IMHO, these should be the primary concerns of taking these products as one gets older.

Taking these into consideration, I'd only do lightly suppressive compounds for reasonable periods of time with solid gold post cycle therapy.
Click to expand...

Lightly suppressive like furazadrol or hdrol solos?
 
I think it's funny that we are talking about possibly being too old for a cycle because from what I see a lot of people around are too young to need a lot of the cycles that they do IMO.I mean there are loads of guys around who never give themselves enough time to develop naturally.
 
I was 35 and did M1T, grew like a weed. BUT it shut my system down to 30 on a scale of 230-800. Regret doing it. Don't do anything unless you plan on using recovery meds as well. Not something I read in a book, I lived it and it SUCKED!
 
Nemesis RR said:
I was 35 and did M1T, grew like a weed. BUT it shut my system down to 30 on a scale of 230-800. Regret doing it. Don't do anything unless you plan on using recovery meds as well. Not something I read in a book, I lived it and it SUCKED!
Click to expand...

Damn. That sucks-I'm glad the worst i fooled with was Sdrol and between that and probably too much ATD I was screwed up for a good while as far as libido.Glad I used Nolva too cause at the time not everyone knew about gyno from Sdrol.
 
EasyEJL said:
given that i'm already a candidate for TRT, what kind of harm can suppression do?
Click to expand...

I hope when I'm 40 I can do hrt , maybe I'll have the money then and insurance now sux even at 3500/yr. Oh well. Do insurances cover hrt? BTW if you wanna take out your slong for anything more than taking a piss, being really suppressed won't matter.
 
cardiffgiant said:
I hope when I'm 40 I can do hrt , maybe I'll have the money then and insurance now sux even at 3500/yr. Oh well. Do insurances cover hrt? BTW if you wanna take out your slong for anything more than taking a piss, being really suppressed won't matter.
Click to expand...

yeah, I was partially being facetious. I'm not sure what my insurance would conver, its been a few years since my last testosterone test too
 
I got picked to do an x-factor log, so i have to put it off till after that. So that means december now.... I'm also back to not entirely sure of which designer to run now, it will depend on how lean I am by then.
 
EasyEJL said:
given that i'm already a candidate for TRT, what kind of harm can suppression do?
Click to expand...

If you are a candidate for TRT then just go on that. You will get more out of that than any PH use. Once on the TRT you can always add PH and see if you get any added benefit.
 
EasyEJL said:
I got picked to do an x-factor log, so i have to put it off till after that. So that means december now.... I'm also back to not entirely sure of which designer to run now, it will depend on how lean I am by then.
Click to expand...

Why fool with that stuff, especiallly after doing something healthy-mega fish oils.I get sore enough from workouts I don't need something to make that worse-I would die.And for what? for me I bet nothing. If anything I was thinking of eventually tring high dosed HMB. I really think it helped me way back when cause recovery is always the issue for me. i just push hard in workouts,especially when highly stimulated, which is most of the time.BCAAs is what I'm trying now plus some high quality WPI and WPI,egg,Micellar casein blend.
 
I figure 2 months on x-factor to try it, then back onto fish oils :) The university studies look good for it as a lean muscle gain/recomper, and its still healthier than any of the designers, at least in terms of liver + lipids.

Its not really MD particular I don't like so much, its the magazines in general. They are so littered with "4 page special reports" that are ads, and so filled with ultra hype that it irritates me. Basically it ruins my journalistic trust of them - are they potentially ripping into AA because molecular nutrition signed a huge advertising deal with another magazine? its possible, as their ethics are questionable. Same reason why Anabolic xtreme irritated me with superdrol ng. Just a chip out of their integrity.
 
Looks like i'm gonna be the guinea pig for you guys :twisted: I'm pre-loading with Hawthorn/Milk thisltle now and will be starting the PP a week from Monday. Picked up some Alpha Drive and some Resveratrol to add to my PCT. Gonna shoot for around 4000 calories or slightly more while on. Do PCT, wait a month, then try a recomp/cut cycle with Havoc. :bb:
 
BoneDaddy said:
Looks like i'm gonna be the guinea pig for you guys :twisted: I'm pre-loading with Hawthorn/Milk thisltle now and will be starting the PP a week from Monday. Picked up some Alpha Drive and some Resveratrol to add to my post cycle therapy. Gonna shoot for around 4000 calories or slightly more while on. Do PCT, wait a month, then try a recomp/cut cycle with Havoc. :bb:
Click to expand...

Time between cycles should be AT LEAST as long as your cycle plus post-cycle-therapy.

For example: 1 month cycle + 1 month pct = wait an additional two months before starting a new cycle.

This is especially true if you're an old fart and your body is recovering from the first cycle slower than the average 23 year old.
 
EasyEJL said:
I figure 2 months on x-factor to try it, then back onto fish oils :) The university studies look good for it as a lean muscle gain/recomper, and its still healthier than any of the designers, at least in terms of liver + lipids.

Its not really MD particular I don't like so much, its the magazines in general. They are so littered with "4 page special reports" that are ads, and so filled with ultra hype that it irritates me. Basically it ruins my journalistic trust of them - are they potentially ripping into AA because molecular nutrition signed a huge advertising deal with another magazine? its possible, as their ethics are questionable. Same reason why Anabolic xtreme irritated me with superdrol ng. Just a chip out of their integrity.
Click to expand...

Yeah I think all the mags can be called into question at times. Interestingly though is that Bill L. is a writer for MD and owns MN (no?).I have seen different articles by different writers on MD disagreeing as well. The mags were originally and I guess still are made to support bodybuilding and sell supps. years ago it was worse though no?,because weider owned it all and sold it all I think.Also supps have advanced light years since then so at least some prods advertised actually work.There are an amazing amount of ads anymore though.I used to really be into MM2k back in the day.Think I threw out a bunch of them on last move(stupid I think but it was a move across country and I had a load of ****).There was an article in MD a while back that I glanced at in the store but did not buy-it had a big article on PHs. At the time I thought I was done with using them now I wish I bought the mag. Oh well trying to get more info on that without paying for it we'll see.
 
I don't think I would ever try AA BTw because I get sore as hell from training alone, nevermind with what people have said when taking AA. It will be interesting to see how it works for you-good luck.Oh and with all the fears about bans i would still wanna get a cycle in while legal, even if you bought already. I have dealt with legal issues in the past and one thing for sure is you never wanna give the govt an excuse to screw you cause they will-the system blows and staying out of it by staying legal is always anyones best bet.peace.
 
In my experience, PHs/PSs have an exagerrated effect on us old farts. Since I turn 66 this weekend and have done over a half dozen cycles of SD not to mention many different precursors over the years I have some background. With their help I have gone from 149 lbs in 2000 to 218 today. My strength has gone through the roof and I now can do reps at 360 on the Hammer Strength BP ( much safer for an old fart who works out alone and suffers from partial paralysis of his left hand, hence has problems controlling regular BBs). I am a firm believer that for us, the arrival of things like Epistane and Formastane have virtually eliminated the worst side effects and accentuated the best in our favor. I can honestly say that besides the strength gains, I have found outstanding libido enhancement and very, very quick and easy PCT recovery. FWIW.
 
Dutchman said:
In my experience, PHs/PSs have an exagerrated effect on us old farts. Since I turn 66 this weekend and have done over a half dozen cycles of superdrol not to mention many different precursors over the years I have some background. With their help I have gone from 149 lbs in 2000 to 218 today. My strength has gone through the roof and I now can do reps at 360 on the Hammer Strength BP ( much safer for an old fart who works out alone and suffers from partial paralysis of his left hand, hence has problems controlling regular BBs). I am a firm believer that for us, the arrival of things like Epistane and Formastane have virtually eliminated the worst side effects and accentuated the best in our favor. I can honestly say that besides the strength gains, I have found outstanding libido enhancement and very, very quick and easy post cycle therapy recovery. FWIW.
Click to expand...

thanks Dutch. Hey what did you do for Sdrol PCT and how was libido after cycle and PCT? Thanks
 
Bone I'm currently on H-Drol right now and it's going pretty well. After doing research myself, I think it's a good one to use as a first time PH experience. I'm not your age, but for the lack of side effects it has compared to others and its steady results, it might be for the better.

The only difference is I stacked H-Drol with Axis Labs Furazadrol. I do have a log up if your interested.

Invalid Link Removed
 
I still can't decide which compound to use first. I really would like to find some 1ad at a reasonable price, then I would probably just do that.
 
EasyEJL said:
I still can't decide which compound to use first. I really would like to find some 1ad at a reasonable price, then I would probably just do that.
Click to expand...

I kept debating-Hdrol with fura/fura solo/or epi solo/i chose fura and formastane. Price did play a role. Havoc was tempting but I did not wanna use a SERM. I may do HDROL with no SERM down the road. BTW does everyone think it's being paranoid not to wanna fool with SERMs?
 
tried a little 1ad can't remember exactly, my brother gave me what was left in a bottle don't remeber anything great but it must have been too little for too short.A lot of people rave about it. Wish I woulda maybe gave it a real go-sorry PA too expensive. Same reason I still never tried 6oxo(bulk now though right?) maybe for PA I'll try cause i hear PA can get me in the Inner Circle. I'll go to bed now. peace.
 
yeahright said:
Time between cycles should be AT LEAST as long as your cycle plus post-cycle-therapy.

For example: 1 month cycle + 1 month post cycle therapy = wait an additional two months before starting a new cycle.

This is especially true if you're an old fart and your body is recovering from the first cycle slower than the average 23 year old.
Click to expand...

Thanks bro. I've been asking that question but could never get an answer. 2 months in between sounds better for us old farts! :toofunny:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top