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Mike Arnold

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Seems pretty simple to me:

If you want to talk to a dude in a dress, the polite thing to do is assign a female reference. If its a butch looking chick, or you are just plain unsure, just stfu because you never know how they identify.
See bold above: And from where I stand, that is the crux of the issue. If I wanted to/had to speak to a "DUDE" (key word: "dude", meaning a male/man) in a dress, I am sure a **** not referring to him as a woman. Just as much as painting myself green and running around saying "hulk smash" doesn't make me the incredible hulk, neither does putting on a dress and high-heels make a man a woman. I could say I "identify" as a ****ing space alien, but it sure as **** doesn't make me one. As far as I'm concerned, someone can "identify" as whatever they want, but don't expect me to conform to their warped version of reality and blindly accept their mental illness as something healthy. When a schizophrenic person is hearing voices, we don't tell him that the voices are real and that his condition is normal/healthy just so he can feel good about himself. No. What we do is treat his mental illness so that he can once again return to reality and function within society as a normal, healthy person. Catering to delusions helps no one and ultimately, endangers us all.

I wonder how many fathers here would be comfortable with a 40 year old man going into the women's changing room with their 13 year old daughter...simply because he says he "identifies" as a "woman" (something he clearly isn't?). Sorry, but if someone has a dick swinging between their legs (or had one at any point), they are not a woman and don't belong in the ladies changing rooms/rest rooms). LOL. I could only imagine telling my 3 year old daughter, when she points out the differences between boys and girls (things that are obvious to even 3 year olds)..."honey, what you are seeing with your eyes and perceiving with your mind is incorrect. Having a penis or a vagina doesn't make someone a boy or a girl. Those are just superficial, meaningless things. You are what you think you are...because gender is only in your head, so if you want to be a boy, that's what you are. Also, anyone who doesn't agree with you...and refuses to refer to you as anything but the gender of your choosing, well...those people are hateful, intolerant, unloving, un-evolved and just don't want people to be happy. In fact, they are a plague to society and holding back our generation from making real progress in the area of greater societal consciousness. ".

I mean, if anyone doesn't see how ****ing sick that is (and that is exactly where society is at today), they have a screw loose somewhere in their head.

When in the hell did we reach the point where someone could literally claim to be something that defies all science and reason...and society accepts it? More importantly, when did we reach the point where society not only condones such deluded beliefs, by supports and even passes laws that COMPELS others to abide by these same deluded beliefs? Wow! I give it 15 more years--tops-- and the United States, in its present incarnation, will collapse from the moral depravity festering within it. We're almost there now. The US has changed so much in the last generation it is scary. What they refer to as progress and conscious evolution is anything but. I'm afraid of what's going to happen to this country.
 

Fork_or_Knife

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See bold above: And from where I stand, that is the crux of the issue. If I wanted to/had to speak to a "DUDE" (key word: "dude", meaning a male/man) in a dress, I am sure a **** not referring to him as a woman. Just as much as painting myself green and running around saying "hulk smash" doesn't make me the incredible hulk, neither does putting on a dress and high-heels make a man a woman. I could say I "identify" as a ****ing space alien, but it sure as **** doesn't make me one. As far as I'm concerned, someone can "identify" as whatever they want, but don't expect me to conform to their warped version of reality and blindly accept their mental illness and something healthy. When a schizophrenic person is hearing voices, we don't tell him that the voices are real and that his condition is normal and healthy just so he can feel good about himself. No. What we do is treat his mental illness so that he can once again return to reality and function within society as a normal, healthy person. Catering to delusions helps no one and ultimately, endangers us all.
This is understood and practiced by anyone who works in a serious mental health profession (we are talking about a mental health issue here, gender dysphoria is listed in the DSM) as well as properly trained LEO. CIT, crisis intervention training specifically geared towards a mental illness population was huge when I used to work in that sector. Unfortunately, for various reasons society has been conditioned to normalize mental health problems.

What we are witnessing is a population that places an inordinate emphasis on intentions rather than outcomes. They are taught to feel bad and pity and they want to help but ultimately when their decisions arent outcome focused they can exacerbate an already deteriorated situation.
 
Cgkone

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See bold above: And from where I stand, that is the crux of the issue. If I wanted to/had to speak to a "DUDE" (key word: "dude", meaning a male/man) in a dress, I am sure a **** not referring to him as a woman. Just as much as painting myself green and running around saying "hulk smash" doesn't make me the incredible hulk, neither does putting on a dress and high-heels make a man a woman. I could say I "identify" as a ****ing space alien, but it sure as **** doesn't make me one. As far as I'm concerned, someone can "identify" as whatever they want, but don't expect me to conform to their warped version of reality and blindly accept their mental illness as something healthy. When a schizophrenic person is hearing voices, we don't tell him that the voices are real and that his condition is normal/healthy just so he can feel good about himself. No. What we do is treat his mental illness so that he can once again return to reality and function within society as a normal, healthy person. Catering to delusions helps no one and ultimately, endangers us all.

I wonder how many fathers here would be comfortable with a 40 year old man going into the women's changing room with their 13 year old daughter...simply because he says he "identifies" as a "woman" (something he clearly isn't?). Sorry, but if someone has a dick swinging between their legs (or had one at any point), they are not a woman and don't belong in the ladies changing rooms/rest rooms). LOL. I could only imagine telling my 3 year old daughter, when she points out the differences between boys and girls (things that are obvious to even 3 year olds)..."honey, what you are seeing with your eyes and perceiving with your mind is incorrect. Having a penis or a vagina doesn't make someone a boy or a girl. Those are just superficial, meaningless things. You are what you think you are...because gender is only in your head, so if you want to be a boy, that's what you are. Also, anyone who doesn't agree with you...and refuses to refer to you as anything but the gender of your choosing, well...those people are hateful, intolerant, unloving, un-evolved and just don't want people to be happy. In fact, they are a plague to society and holding back our generation from making real progress in the area of greater societal consciousness. ".

I mean, if anyone doesn't see how ****ing sick that is (and that is exactly where society is at today), they have a screw loose somewhere in their head.

When in the hell did we reach the point where someone could literally claim to be something that defies all science and reason...and society accepts it? More importantly, when did we reach the point where society not only condones such deluded beliefs, by supports and even passes laws that COMPELS others to abide by these same deluded beliefs? Wow! I give it 15 more years--tops-- and the United States, in its present incarnation, will collapse from the moral depravity festering within it. We're almost there now. The US has changed so much in the last generation it is scary. What they refer to as progress and conscious evolution is anything but. I afraid of what's going to happen to this country.
Well the election of Trump slowed down the decline.
 

Jstrong20

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Doesn’t bother me as long as male to female don’t try to compete with real females. It’s already happening in some sports and is a huge unfair advantage. But what’s happening here is fine because all are the same.
 
Chados

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I think there's a big step walking in to women's dressing room than for me go call you Marie. I will gladly refer to you as a women as long as you respect that society definitely isn't ready to let you walk in to young girls dressing room. We are also not ready to let women walk around with their boobs out which to me is absurd considering men can do it. Im not saying I wouldn't react to a women flashing her boobs in front of my son but that's because society tells me it's not ready. Not long ago women couldn't wear skirts and in many countries they can't show their face properly. I don't know but I see it as a much bigger problem than my male neighbour wanting to wear a dress. I mean why the hell should I even bother?

I can't put myself in every transgenders mind just like none of you can but I don't believe every person is unhappy and I doubt everyone is mentally ill. You can look at gay people and it's. Obvious many of them aren't feeling good but what I also know being a young kid once is that the more they open up the more often they get bullied and looked at school.
 
DemntedCowboy

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I think there's a big step walking in to women's dressing room than for me go call you Marie. I will gladly refer to you as a women as long as you respect that society definitely isn't ready to let you walk in to young girls dressing room. We are also not ready to let women walk around with their boobs out which to me is absurd considering men can do it. Im not saying I wouldn't react to a women flashing her boobs in front of my son but that's because society tells me it's not ready. Not long ago women couldn't wear skirts and in many countries they can't show their face properly. I don't know but I see it as a much bigger problem than my male neighbour wanting to wear a dress. I mean why the hell should I even bother?

I can't put myself in every transgenders mind just like none of you can but I don't believe every person is unhappy and I doubt everyone is mentally ill. You can look at gay people and it's. Obvious many of them aren't feeling good but what I also know being a young kid once is that the more they open up the more often they get bullied and looked at school.
Guess I'm used to it. I have been in clubs in Germany where men/woman use the same Restroom. I have been taking a piss and heard someone bombing a small foreign country in the stall next to me only to find out it was a woman. I have also seen nude fields next to grocery stores in Romania and no one making a fuss about it.
 
Chados

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Guess I'm used to it. I have been in clubs in Germany where men/woman use the same Restroom. I have been taking a piss and heard someone bombing a small foreign country in the stall next to me only to find out it was a woman. I have also seen nude fields next to grocery stores in Romania and no one making a fuss about it.
Haha not to mention Mardi gras.. Nah im also used to it, been two times in Thailand where there are let's say a few transgender people giving you compliments.. I'm more like, I appreciate that thank you and I keep walking. Not one second before or after I see this person do I think, hey maybe this 30 year old female looking man might be in the small girls restroom. I have too much of too little to do to have time thinking about that
 
RickyBlobby

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What about pedophiles? They were “born that way” yet society looks at them as being sick and disgusting.
Also people into beastiality. Same shyte.
But a dude that wants to plug another dude in his hairy ass. Balls hangin. Is not sick.

I think all are mental issues. But that’s just me. And 100 years ago, before all the brainwashing liberal propaganda. The vast majority would have agreed with me.

Just sayin.
 
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What about pedophiles? They were “born that way” yet society looks at them as being sick and disgusting.
Also people into beastiality. Same shyte.
But a dude that wants to plug another dude in his hairy ass. Balls hangin. Is not sick.

I think all are mental issues. But that’s just me. And 100 years ago, before all the brainwashing liberal propaganda. The vast majority would have agreed with me.

Just sayin.
Well sure 1000 years ago age didn't matter and still doesn't in some parts of the world but I think that shouldn't be in the same category as a guy finding another guy interesting. There are 3 animals that do that and only humans are being told they are sick. Yes these animals probably doesn't wait until the girl is 18 but I mean it doesn't always have to make sense. Animals kill each other they are cannibals etc etc. We don't agree to that cause we have decided to live in a peaceful society and most of us realized it's better to be friends. Gay people aren't dangerous people or mean people. They just like the same gender. To like someone thats 5 years old is not only extremely rare but also not accepted by the society we live in cause we want our kids to be able to decide for themselves. Humans are social and sex is something we bond with and since we are so developed we realized these things with time.

Another major difference is that a lot of pedophiles actually got raped as kids themselves which is not only a sign that people don't like to get raped but also that it comes from something that happened to them, this I call an illness. I have yet to hear some gay person saying he didn't know he was gay just that he never accepted it.
 
RickyBlobby

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For the record, I’m cool with gay people. I know some good hearted people that are gay.

But the media has an agenda to warp peoples minds into thinking this sort of thing is normal. But looking through pure eyes (I have 2 kids, 8 and 12 that have not yet been corrupted by society). And they are both appalled by gayness. It’s not normal. And it’s upserting when the powers that be warp peoples minds into believing this type of behavior is normal. It’s not. All this will do is lead people further and further down the path of immorality until we are a society of sick fucks that have no moral compass. You have to look at the big picture past the emotions of a few deranged people. Because it may seem like it just about equality. But make no mistake it’s about mind control. Once we let all moral values go, which may be 5 generations from now. We will be a society of animals. That can be controlled just like a dog can be controlled by his master.

It goes deeper than you may realize. Gayness, pedophilia (very very young children), beastiality. Is a mental condition. Society has just made it harmless but the ignorance of the nature of such things, is what will ultimately lead us to self destruction.

In my opinion. �� I’ve been wrong before.
 
DemntedCowboy

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For the record, I’m cool with gay people. I know some good hearted people that are gay.

But the media has an agenda to warp peoples minds into thinking this sort of thing is normal. But looking through pure eyes (I have 2 kids, 8 and 12 that have not yet been corrupted by society). And they are both appalled by gayness. It’s not normal. And it’s upserting when the powers that be warp peoples minds into believing this type of behavior is normal. It’s not. All this will do is lead people further and further down the path of immorality until we are a society of sick fucks that have no moral compass. You have to look at the big picture past the emotions of a few deranged people. Because it may seem like it just about equality. But make no mistake it’s about mind control. Once we let all moral values go, which may be 5 generations from now. We will be a society of animals. That can be controlled just like a dog can be controlled by his master.

It goes deeper than you may realize. Gayness, pedophilia (very very young children), beastiality. Is a mental condition. Society has just made it harmless but the ignorance of the nature of such things, is what will ultimately lead us to self destruction.

In my opinion. I’ve been wrong before.
True I agree . I know tons of gay's and are friends with them, but just cause your trans doesnt mean your gay. If your a MTF and still like women or FTM and still like males does that make you gay? My daughter had a friend in highschool, she is a FTM but is bisexual.
And actually my oldest daughter is 22 and most of the females in her class where bi, must be the new thing to do
 
Chados

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For the record, I’m cool with gay people. I know some good hearted people that are gay.

But the media has an agenda to warp peoples minds into thinking this sort of thing is normal. But looking through pure eyes (I have 2 kids, 8 and 12 that have not yet been corrupted by society). And they are both appalled by gayness. It’s not normal. And it’s upserting when the powers that be warp peoples minds into believing this type of behavior is normal. It’s not. All this will do is lead people further and further down the path of immorality until we are a society of sick fucks that have no moral compass. You have to look at the big picture past the emotions of a few deranged people. Because it may seem like it just about equality. But make no mistake it’s about mind control. Once we let all moral values go, which may be 5 generations from now. We will be a society of animals. That can be controlled just like a dog can be controlled by his master.

It goes deeper than you may realize. Gayness, pedophilia (very very young children), beastiality. Is a mental condition. Society has just made it harmless but the ignorance of the nature of such things, is what will ultimately lead us to self destruction.

In my opinion. �� I’ve been wrong before.
I do agree with what you say about the media but I don't think it's fair to compare your own children to others nor say with certainty you know they aren't gay. It's very common nobody knows and that people even develop relationships with the other gender before coming out as gay. To me it's obvious they are born this way and develop feelings whenever the age is that an heterosexual develop feelings.
 

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True I agree . I know tons of gay's and are friends with them, but just cause your trans doesnt mean your gay. If your a MTF and still like women or FTM and still like males does that make you gay? My daughter had a friend in highschool, she is a FTM but is bisexual.
And actually my oldest daughter is 22 and most of the females in her class where bi, must be the new thing to do
It has become the new thing to do. Mechanisms of society have normalized and morallized (by attributing victim status and morallizing victimhood) deviant lifestyles and we have seen those lifestyles multiply.

The question is whether or not it is healthy for society and will lead to better outcomes for families and by extension their children's futures. I'd argue that rising rates of mental health disorders and across the board increases in suicide rate are not signs of a healthy society. We also know that children born out of wedlock and raised in single parent homes have worse outcomes than other children. There is nothing wrong or amoral with being a single parent, but since it leads to worse outcomes as a society I would hope that we wouldnt seek to normalize or morallize that lifestyle and instead look to practice behavior that results in better outcomes.

It's all about placing an inordinate emphasis on outcomes rather than intentions.
 
DemntedCowboy

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It has become the new thing to do. Mechanisms of society have normalized and morallized (by attributing victim status and morallizing victimhood) deviant lifestyles and we have seen those lifestyles multiply.

The question is whether or not it is healthy for society and will lead to better outcomes for families and by extension their children's futures. I'd argue that rising rates of mental health disorders and across the board increases in suicide rate are not signs of a healthy society. We also know that children born out of wedlock and raised in single parent homes have worse outcomes than other children. There is nothing wrong or amoral with being a single parent, but since it leads to worse outcomes as a society I would hope that we wouldnt seek to normalize or morallize that lifestyle and instead look to practice behavior that results in better outcomes.

It's all about placing an inordinate emphasis on outcomes rather than intentions.
I was adopted and never knew my real parents till I met my real mother in my 20's. And there have been many of my buddies in the Army that have committed suicide since the war started. 22 per hour to be exact. I turned out fine, and have a BSBA, MBA, and 2 certificates and work in a hospital. Does that sound like I have a mental disorder. You choose to be a victim, just like Veterans that choose suicide because of too many deployments choose that option. I have 3 deployments 2 to Iraq, 1 to Afghanistan. I have spent 3 1/2 years of my 10 years in the military deployed. I have been blown up 49 times, shot twice, and stabbed once. I fought in one of the worse firefights since Vietnam, and the first battle since Vietnam to fight Hand to Hand combat. Yet instead of taking my life, I chose life, and improved my life since I got hurt. It is a mental interpretation not a mental disorder.
 

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I do agree with what you say about the media but I don't think it's fair to compare your own children to others nor say with certainty you know they aren't gay. It's very common nobody knows and that people even develop relationships with the other gender before coming out as gay. To me it's obvious they are born this way and develop feelings whenever the age is that an heterosexual develop feelings.
When you say things like "born this way" bear in mind that homosexuality should be an intrinsically very difficult genetic trait to pass on. A practicing homosexual would be assumed to be "infertile" or atleast their relationship would never produce offspring and the one genetic trait that is impossible to pass on is infertility. I understand there is a percentage of homosexual people who would reproduce, but on a long enough time line (and human evolution is a pretty long timeline) the trait should be largely bred out of existence.

Ive only heard of one reasonable explanation for why homosexuality could have been a beneficial trait for primitive human society (having to do with the known correlation between your chances increasing relative to the number of older brothers you have) but the fact remains that the rate at which homosexuality is currently presenting in our population makes no sense from a purely evolutionary stand point. I'd suspect an environmental factor like modern culture or fetal exposure to endocrine disruptors to be playing a huge role.

Also, to make it clear if it needs to be I could care less about an individuals lifestyle choices, but want society in as healthy a state as possible and don't believe all outcomes to be equally deserving of praise.
 
DemntedCowboy

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When you say things like "born this way" bear in mind that homosexuality should be an intrinsically very difficult genetic trait to pass on. A practicing homosexual would be assumed to be "infertile" or atleast their relationship would never produce offspring and the one genetic trait that is impossible to pass on is infertility. I understand there is a percentage of homosexual people who would reproduce, but on a long enough time line (and human evolution is a pretty long timeline) the trait should be largely bred out of existence.

Ive only heard of one reasonable explanation for why homosexuality could have been a beneficial trait for primitive human society (having to do with the known correlation between your chances increasing relative to the number of older brothers you have) but the fact remains that the rate at which homosexuality is currently presenting in our population makes no sense from a purely evolutionary stand point. I'd suspect an environmental factor like modern culture or fetal exposure to endocrine disruptors to be playing a huge role.

Also, to make it clear if it needs to be I could care less about an individuals lifestyle choices, but want society in as healthy a state as possible and don't believe all outcomes to be equally deserving of praise.
Homosexuals would be infertile yes, unless they are bisexual which most gay people are whether they believe it or not.
 

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I was adopted and never knew my real parents till I met my real mother in my 20's. And there have been many of my buddies in the Army that have committed suicide since the war started. 22 per hour to be exact. I turned out fine, and have a BSBA, MBA, and 2 certificates and work in a hospital. Does that sound like I have a mental disorder. You choose to be a victim, just like Veterans that choose suicide because of too many deployments choose that option. I have 3 deployments 2 to Iraq, 1 to Afghanistan. I have spent 3 1/2 years of my 10 years in the military deployed. I have been blown up 49 times, shot twice, and stabbed once. I fought in one of the worse firefights since Vietnam, and the first battle since Vietnam to fight Hand to Hand combat. Yet instead of taking my life, I chose life, and improved my life since I got hurt. It is a mental interpretation not a mental disorder.
Mental health needs are evaluated on a demographic level and one personal anecdote is largely irrelevant to the general needs of a society. You may be capable of rational decision making, but many are not, and so policies should be based upon demographic needs rather than individual.

Im painfully aware of the rate of veterans taking their own lives and cant count how many suicide watches i pulled while enlisted.
 
DemntedCowboy

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Mental health needs are evaluated on a demographic level and one personal anecdote is largely irrelevant to the general needs of a society. You may be capable of rational decision making, but many are not, and so policies should be based upon demographic needs rather than individual.

Im painfully aware of the rate of veterans taking their own lives and cant count how many suicide watches i pulled while enlisted.
How about the fact that I'm also 80% service Connected for PTSD, TBI, broken neck, and broken back. And I was the NCOIC on many of those Suicide watches to include a suicide on my watch. Again, Mental Interpretation.
 

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How about the fact that I'm also 80% service Connected for PTSD, TBI, broken neck, and broken back. And I was the NCOIC on many of those Suicide watches to include a suicide on my watch. Again, Mental Interpretation.
Ultimately, Id have to somehow look at the rate of people who experience extreme trauma and rate at which they commit suicide and decide what rate is an acceptable rate before deciding to what extent you are or are not an outlier.

My point was that if you assume everyone is capable of rational decision making, you are wrong.
 
DemntedCowboy

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Ultimately, Id have to somehow look at the rate of people who experience extreme trauma and rate at which they commit suicide and decide what rate is an acceptable rate before deciding to what extent you are or are not an outlier.

My point was that if you assume everyone is capable of rational decision making, you are wrong.
Well apparently for the Military it is 22 people a day
 

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No offense but I think you're making an argument for my side with the Mr. Rogers meme. Appealing to the authority of a childrens TV show host as an argument in favor of normalizing deviant lifestyles is the perfect example of how modern society has been conditioning us for a long time.
 
DemntedCowboy

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No offense but I think you're making an argument for my side with the Mr. Rogers meme. Appealing to the authority of a childrens TV show host as an argument in favor of normalizing deviant lifestyles is the perfect example of how modern society has been conditioning us for a long time.
Mr. Rogers was a Vietnam Sniper with over 30 comfirmed kills. And Capt. Kangaroo was a Korean War sniper. Just saying
 
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When you say things like "born this way" bear in mind that homosexuality should be an intrinsically very difficult genetic trait to pass on. A practicing homosexual would be assumed to be "infertile" or atleast their relationship would never produce offspring and the one genetic trait that is impossible to pass on is infertility. I understand there is a percentage of homosexual people who would reproduce, but on a long enough time line (and human evolution is a pretty long timeline) the trait should be largely bred out of existence.

Ive only heard of one reasonable explanation for why homosexuality could have been a beneficial trait for primitive human society (having to do with the known correlation between your chances increasing relative to the number of older brothers you have) but the fact remains that the rate at which homosexuality is currently presenting in our population makes no sense from a purely evolutionary stand point. I'd suspect an environmental factor like modern culture or fetal exposure to endocrine disruptors to be playing a huge role.

Also, to make it clear if it needs to be I could care less about an individuals lifestyle choices, but want society in as healthy a state as possible and don't believe all outcomes to be equally deserving of praise.
Saying you would be Infertil is like saying you would be that by not having kids which millions of people do. And I mean there are people suffering from infertility everywhere and I dont know have you seen any statistic that gay people don't have this? Do all gaypeople ever find out if they can have kids even? See how you really can't know. I don't think anyone is able to love from the first breath but when the brain has developed enough I don't think we humans even know how to reproduce anymore cause our instincts are almost gone. If you have nobody or nowhere to learn if say it's very likely you'd be gay if that's all you knew. I think we know ourselves when we reach the point of being able to understand the meaning.
 
BarryBondsHOF

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What about pedophiles? They were “born that way” yet society looks at them as being sick and disgusting.
Also people into beastiality. Same shyte.
But a dude that wants to plug another dude in his hairy ass. Balls hangin. Is not sick.

I think all are mental issues. But that’s just me. And 100 years ago, before all the brainwashing liberal propaganda. The vast majority would have agreed with me.

Just sayin.
You compared people diddling little children to a grown man ****ing another grown man on equal mental understanding for pleasure. DAMN dude. I think if you can even try to draw a comparison between the two you have some screws loose. You’re acting as if homosexuality hasn’t been rampant for centuries. Every minority is inherently inferior if you’re basing this on 100 year old logic, come up with something better. I don’t mean to insult you, Ricky. I respect your knowledge and opinions in general. Just some faulty logic I believe was employed comparing the two, and mentioning social norms 100 years ago. That could open a huge nonsensical rabbit hole, lol. I just don’t know how lasting emotional, and potentially physical harm to children who don’t want that to happen to them and are unable to grasp what’s going on most times is comparable to consenting adults doing something we find gross. I think imagining a mans ******* is gross too, lol. I think my own ******* is gross. I’m sure they feel the same way about vaginas
 
BennyMagoo79

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What about pedophiles? They were “born that way” yet society looks at them as being sick and disgusting.
Also people into beastiality. Same shyte.
But a dude that wants to plug another dude in his hairy ass. Balls hangin. Is not sick.

I think all are mental issues. But that’s just me. And 100 years ago, before all the brainwashing liberal propaganda. The vast majority would have agreed with me.

Just sayin.
When a dude wants to plug another dude in the butt, it's none of your business.
When a paedophile tries to rape a child (i dont what the circumstance, sex with a child is rape) get your shotgun.
 
BennyMagoo79

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For the record, I’m cool with gay people. I know some good hearted people that are gay.

But the media has an agenda to warp peoples minds into thinking this sort of thing is normal. But looking through pure eyes (I have 2 kids, 8 and 12 that have not yet been corrupted by society). And they are both appalled by gayness. It’s not normal. And it’s upserting when the powers that be warp peoples minds into believing this type of behavior is normal. It’s not. All this will do is lead people further and further down the path of immorality until we are a society of sick fucks that have no moral compass. You have to look at the big picture past the emotions of a few deranged people. Because it may seem like it just about equality. But make no mistake it’s about mind control. Once we let all moral values go, which may be 5 generations from now. We will be a society of animals. That can be controlled just like a dog can be controlled by his master.

It goes deeper than you may realize. Gayness, pedophilia (very very young children), beastiality. Is a mental condition. Society has just made it harmless but the ignorance of the nature of such things, is what will ultimately lead us to self destruction.

In my opinion. I’ve been wrong before.
Dude, homosexuality IS normal. It has existed for as long as there is written record Ffs, even chimps engage in homosexuality.

In your previous statement yoy claim that society is brainwashed by liberal media and compare your position with that of society's 100yrs ago. Who do you think brainwashed society back then? Religion!

Fact is, society's attitude regarding homosexuality has changed because we have more information and better access to it. It does far more good than harm to accept homosexuality and gay culture.
 
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Why if they can do it why not.
Makes sense, they have their own "division" here to compete go nuts.

And perhaps this logic should be applied when (biologically born) males transition to 'female' (or she-male in less PC terms) and still want to mess up gender based sports competition like track & field or basketball for actual girls.

Saw a video of two she-males running in 100m dash in CT high-schools' state level championship race... Guess who won? The biological males. Two years straight, one set a record, on paper... as newly minted female.

Yet these she-males would not have placed in the top 50 with their biological bretheren.

No one wants to be "stigmatized" or set apart yada yada... but it's really not fair to the actual biological girls and their families, who trained for years to compete, to "lose" that way.

Perhaps the non offensive category could be called "enhanced" (surgical or drug based) lol. No one is stigmatized, everyone gets to compete on level biological playing field.

And about this whole bathroom non-sense... logistics and signage and locked doors solves this. Make all bathrooms "we don't care" just lock the door and stay away from the kids. Seriously, one may believe anything and one can "fixed" by a surgeon, but let's not screw up the young ones...

On one hand, I feel bad for those who suffer from an internal mental confusion, about their biological identity... that must suck. I can also believe the moon is made of cheese, doesn't make it so.

Now for some utter Bullshyt from a law professor, isn't amazing how powerful scientifically false word-smithing is - especially when backed by state anti-discrimination law as a threat to he school who got many parents petitioning , “A transgender girl is a girl and ought to be treated like a girl,” Erin Buzuvis, the*law professor who is the director of the Center of Gender and Sexuality Studies at Western New England College,*told the Courant. “If you start to put limitations or exclusions on their participation, not only do you run the risk of violating state anti-discrimination law but also you are disregarding and disrespecting a population of students based on a core aspect of their identity (how about DNA and biological identity which differs from their mental state) which is something that schools should not be in the practice of..."

Utter Bullshyt, just like lawyers do.

Like if enhance myself with drugs or surgeries, ethical code means I should not be in any clean competitive sport. Ruins the sport.
 

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Dude, homosexuality IS normal. It has existed for as long as there is written record Ffs, even chimps engage in homosexuality.

In your previous statement yoy claim that society is brainwashed by liberal media and compare your position with that of society's 100yrs ago. Who do you think brainwashed society back then? Religion!

Fact is, society's attitude regarding homosexuality has changed because we have more information and better access to it. It does far more good than harm to accept homosexuality and gay culture.
What about homosexuality is normal? Or do you just mean it exists so its normal, like down syndrome, or paranoid schizophrenia? I'm not convinced it existed outside of extreme outliers historically. Sure there was man on man sex in ancient Rome but they coupled longterm with women and believed marriage was a sacred institution. Their "homosexuality" was mostly an extension of rampant hedonism. Chimps engage in homosexuality as an extension of in-group posturing. It isnt known or assumed that there are male chimps who love male chimps and dont have interest in females.

It's not a matter of whether or not society is or is not being "brainwashed" by an external force. The majority of people are not capable of rational decision making, and will always act according to external influence from their environment. The question is whether those influences are producing better outcomes for the society. Some people dont possess impulse control or the ability to delay gratification and must be coerced into acting in their best interest.

Society's attitudes are shifting on gay culture because wealthy people have been funding campaigns to make that happen. Youve got to provide an actual argument as to how this will lead to better outcomes. Im not convinced that society is on a healthy trajectory currently. My main argument for that is that mental health issues (anxiety, depression, anti social personality, autism, schizophrenia) are on the rise across the board as well as suicide. I dont believe those to be markers of an increasingly healthy society.
 
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What about homosexuality is normal? Or do you just mean it exists so its normal, like down syndrome, or paranoid schizophrenia? I'm not convinced it existed outside of extreme outliers historically. Sure there was man on man sex in ancient Rome but they coupled longterm with women and believed marriage was a sacred institution. Their "homosexuality" was mostly an extension of rampant hedonism. Chimps engage in homosexuality as an extension of in-group posturing. It isnt known or assumed that there are male chimps who love male chimps and dont have interest in females.

It's not a matter of whether or not society is or is not being "brainwashed" by an external force. The majority of people are not capable of rational decision making, and will always act according to external influence from their environment. The question is whether those influences are producing better outcomes for the society. Some people dont possess impulse control or the ability to delay gratification and must be coerced into acting in their best interest.

Society's attitudes are shifting on gay culture because wealthy people have been funding campaigns to make that happen. Youve got to provide an actual argument as to how this will lead to better outcomes. Im not convinced that society is on a healthy trajectory currently. My main argument for that is that mental health issues (anxiety, depression, anti social personality, autism, schizophrenia) are on the rise across the board as well as suicide. I dont believe those to be markers of an increasingly healthy society.
Well chimps are not as developed as humans, very developed yes but not nearly as much as us. It is very known that animals have a drive to reproduce. humans probably wouldn't have any idea what reproduction was if they got locked in to a basement all alone for 20 years. The fact that chimps might not actually be gay has nothing to do with humans. Dogs jump on other dogs not because they are gay but because they have a drive to reproduce, humans do it because they want to and yes religion plays a major part here but also the fact that back in the ancient Rome I don't think people really understood what gay really was. Society barely accepts it now, sure in the western world it's pretty good but in the overall world its just not as accepted and I have no doubt there was an attraction back then but undoubtedly a need to reproduce also, maybe for extra working hands, maybe because of the love to your own child or maybe because it's just natural for any animal to do. I also think back then it was more accepted to sleep around so experimenting with a woman was probably not something awkward like it would be for a gay person today. Basically what I'm saying is that thousand of years ago humans were still developed as an overly intelligent animal but we didn't care as much about the morals, values rules that we have today and as I stated before it's very common that gay people come out as gay but they always knew, I don't think the romans ever said hey mom I'm gay. Religion is what really made it be considered wrong, even to this day people say a marriage is between a man and a woman because of a two thousand year old religion called Christianity
 

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Well chimps are not as developed as humans, very developed yes but not nearly as much as us. It is very known that animals have a drive to reproduce. humans probably wouldn't have any idea what reproduction was if they got locked in to a basement all alone for 20 years. The fact that chimps might not actually be gay has nothing to do with humans. Dogs jump on other dogs not because they are gay but because they have a drive to reproduce, humans do it because they want to and yes religion plays a major part here but also the fact that back in the ancient Rome I don't think people really understood what gay really was. Society barely accepts it now, sure in the western world it's pretty good but in the overall world its just not as accepted and I have no doubt there was an attraction back then but undoubtedly a need to reproduce also, maybe for extra working hands, maybe because of the love to your own child or maybe because it's just natural for any animal to do. I also think back then it was more accepted to sleep around so experimenting with a woman was probably not something awkward like it would be for a gay person today. Basically what I'm saying is that thousand of years ago humans were still developed as an overly intelligent animal but we didn't care as much about the morals, values rules that we have today and as I stated before it's very common that gay people come out as gay but they always knew, I don't think the romans ever said hey mom I'm gay. Religion is what really made it be considered wrong, even to this day people say a marriage is between a man and a woman because of a two thousand year old religion called Christianity
Religion is just a packaged set of societal norms, its irrelevant where a society derives its norms. My argument is that societies flourish when they enforce their norms and fail when they normalize/morallize deviant behavior while demorallizing normative behavior.

Societies benefit from structure because the majority of people are not capable of rational decision making.
 
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Religion is just a packaged set of societal norms, its irrelevant where a society derives its norms. My argument is that societies flourish when they enforce their norms and fail when they normalize/morallize deviant behavior while demorallizing normative behavior.

Societies benefit from structure because the majority of people are not capable of rational decision making.
I mean we're speculating aren't we? My belief is just different form yours I assume. My point is just that I don't think it's a disease and I don't think it's abnormal for humans to feel this way but I think it is for many animals that goes by instinct. Many women are sort of lesbian because they can sleep in the same bed, make out with other women etc and still claim they're straight and were just experimenting. This I think can have to do with society and acceptance and I think guys are taught from an early age everything not manly is gay which makes us unable to imagine even experimenting with another guy, or maybe it's just the fact that evolution did something different with men and women. I am still very convinced that comparing us to animals just doesn't work cause even our closest relatives aren't nearly as developed as we are and I'm also quite positive that people are born this way and it's simply cause we are humans and have a very different thinking than other animals. Lastly talking about women experimenting, there are many guys experimenting to some degree but you don't hear them saying, I had sex with another man once but you hear women saying it all the time.
 

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I mean we're speculating aren't we? My belief is just different form yours I assume. My point is just that I don't think it's a disease and I don't think it's abnormal for humans to feel this way but I think it is for many animals that goes by instinct. Many women are sort of lesbian because they can sleep in the same bed, make out with other women etc and still claim they're straight and were just experimenting. This I think can have to do with society and acceptance and I think guys are taught from an early age everything not manly is gay which makes us unable to imagine even experimenting with another guy, or maybe it's just the fact that evolution did something different with men and women. I am still very convinced that comparing us to animals just doesn't work cause even our closest relatives aren't nearly as developed as we are and I'm also quite positive that people are born this way and it's simply cause we are humans and have a very different thinking than other animals. Lastly talking about women experimenting, there are many guys experimenting to some degree but you don't hear them saying, I had sex with another man once but you hear women saying it all the time.
I think you're overestimating how "developed" humanity actually is.
 
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I think you're overestimating how "developed" humanity actually is.
How? We can fly to space, create computers, cure diseases, have restaurants, drive cars, airplanes, smoke cigarettes, take steroids and talk about them on this forum which is on the internet, an invisible web of information. Satellites, radio, TV, 8k resolution. I mean anything you take for granted every day would to any animal be on the verge of godlike. As you if you're not religiously invested would think that God created earth is silly, a dog, an insect, even a monkey would if they could understand consider you as much of a god as the god in the bible. No I do not think I'm overestimating how developed we are. The only knock back to our evolution is that we lost our instincts and we make choices due to what we believe is logical in today's society.
 

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How? We can fly to space, create computers, cure diseases, have restaurants, drive cars, airplanes, smoke cigarettes, take steroids and talk about them on this forum which is on the internet, an invisible web of information. Satellites, radio, TV, 8k resolution. I mean anything you take for granted every day would to any animal be on the verge of godlike. As you if you're not religiously invested would think that God created earth is silly, a dog, an insect, even a monkey would if they could understand consider you as much of a god as the god in the bible. No I do not think I'm overestimating how developed we are. The only knock back to our evolution is that we lost our instincts and we make choices due to what we believe is logical in today's society.
Obviously human civilizations and technology are extremely advanced in relation to the rest of the animal kingdom, but our brains are largely unchanged since well before any of those things existed. Unfortunately the vast majority of our behavior and decisions occur on an unconscious level. We may have more complicated social structures but we are still prehistoric animals responding to incentives and rewards.

We don't make choices (Im talking on a demographic level, not just an individual anecdotal level) based on logic. The massive majority of the population is incapable of rational decision making. That might be an uncomfortable thing to come to terms with.
 
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Obviously human civilizations and technology are extremely advanced in relation to the rest of the animal kingdom, but our brains are largely unchanged since well before any of those things existed. Unfortunately the vast majority of our behavior and decisions occur on an unconscious level. We may have more complicated social structures but we are still prehistoric animals responding to incentives and rewards.

We don't make choices (Im talking on a demographic level, not just an individual anecdotal level) based on logic. The massive majority of the population is incapable of rational decision making. That might be an uncomfortable thing to come to terms with.
Well the thing is that this (most people can't think logical or aren't smart enough to vote as I've heard before or make rational decision like you said now) is not anything new but should be taken with a grain of salt because everybody doesn't want the same and rational thinking I don't think is hard for people but coming to a solution fast is another thing. If you're talking about a baby deer being able to run and know it's enemy from birth and be able to run at first breath isn't something we have but the brain you say hasn't changed much has changed so much from animals that we can learn what fear are and even beyond what our logical instincts would tell us. Now we know that the sun is dangerous because it can cause skin cancer but we are completely blind and can barely mvoe at birth.
 
BennyMagoo79

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Homosexuality is normal insofar as it is not phenomenal. It is certainly not an extreme outlier historically, and there are many examples of long term openly gay relationships in ancient Greece and Egypt (and probably elsewhere but I am not so familiar with anything beyond the classical paradigm).

With regard to how decriminalising homosexuality and gay marriage is beneficial to society:
If society oppresses gay people, who is harmed and who benfits? Gay people are harmed, but nobody benefits.
If society does not oppress gay people, who is harmed and who benefits? Nobody is harmed, and gay people benefit because now they can enjoy the same rights as heterosexuals.

With regard to increasing diagnoses for mental disorders:
This may not be a sign of an unhealthy society. Consider the fact that DSM has only existed since 1952, and we are now up to the fifth revision, one may draw the conclusion that we have simply become better at diagnosing mental illness. In fact, this argument cannot be properly refuted until we have observed more than two generations under the same DSM.

The most disturbing thing from your post is the line that people "must be coerced into acting in their best interest". This moves beyond the jurisdiction of a healthy society. A healthy society upholds individual freedom while protecting its citizens FROM EACH OTHER, not from themselves. We should all be free to **** up, because in the absense of mistakes, we do not grow and develop as individual, sentient beings. Humans are not animals, as you further imply in your next post, they are, in every moment, capable of rational decision making.
 
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If society oppresses gay people, who is harmed and who benfits? Gay people are harmed, but nobody benefits.
If society does not oppress gay people, who is harmed and who benefits? Nobody is harmed, and gay people benefit because now they can enjoy the same rights as heterosexuals.
This was simple but beautifully said (no homo) lol
 

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The most disturbing thing from your post is the line that people "must be coerced into acting in their best interest". This moves beyond the jurisdiction of a healthy society. A healthy society upholds individual freedom while protecting its citizens FROM EACH OTHER, not from themselves. We should all be free to **** up, because in the absense of mistakes, we do not grow and develop as individual, sentient beings. Humans are not animals, as you further imply in your next post, they are, in every moment, capable of rational decision making.
I understand that my frank pragmatism might make you uncomfortable, but people respond to and are conditioned by incentives and reward systems. You think way too highly of humanity or are blinded by idealism. If you think we've evolved past that or something, I mean saying humanity is "in every moment capable of rational decision making" just sounds like you've watched way too much TV.

No offense but Im guessing however you earn a living it isnt in the law enforcement, federal government, or military sector.
 
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I understand that my frank pragmatism might make you uncomfortable, but people respond to and are conditioned by incentives and reward systems. You think way too highly of humanity or are blinded by idealism. If you think we've evolved past that or something, I mean saying humanity is "in every moment capable of rational decision making" just sounds like you've watched way too much TV.

No offense but Im guessing however you earn a living it isnt in the law enforcement, federal government, or military sector.
I am not uncomfortable with what you perceive as your pragmatism. I am simply trying to change your mind with a rational argument.
 

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I am not uncomfortable with what you perceive as your pragmatism. I am simply trying to change your mind with a rational argument.
Lol, I wish more people could. I think moderately intelligent people often assume everyone is capable of what they are, but when there are entire countries whose average IQ is below 70, and after having worked with certain populations in my own country I've become pretty jaded.
 
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If you are born gay it’s not your fault. If you’re born with a desire to bang sheep or jack off to little boys. It’s not your fault.

But it’s ok to be gay. Because the media and subsequently the media have brainwashed you into believing this.

Mark my words. If the media started pushing beastiality and pedophilia y’all she’ll would eventually jump on board.

Because you can’t think for yourselves. Sorry if that sounds harsh. But reality is harsh.
 
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If you are born gay it’s not your fault. If you’re born with a desire to bang sheep or jack off to little boys. It’s not your fault.

But it’s ok to be gay. Because the media and subsequently the media have brainwashed you into believing this.

Mark my words. If the media started pushing beastiality and pedophilia y’all she’ll would eventually jump on board.

Because you can’t think for yourselves. Sorry if that sounds harsh. But reality is harsh.
Why do you even group these behaviours?
Dude, I think you might be the one who is a little brainwashed.
 
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whats interesting is African Americans used to be the group most opposed to homosexuality.

Now it is the opposite. Because they latch onto the liberal agenda which appears to have their best interests in mind. When I’m actuality they are just fishing for votes.

I’m going to stop. Because when it comes to politics most everyone is set in their ways. I’m wasting my time.
 
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Why do you even group these behaviours?
Dude, I think you might be the one who is a little brainwashed.
Lol its all sexual deviancy. Man with another man goes against nature (if at the very least you believe in evolution) and isn't capable of reproducing. If it is genetic then surely they would just die off.

It's cultivated and has become more prevalent because its encouraged. A weird turn for our country and times for sure. And we wonder why theres so much depression and suicide in the country today? Just maybe it's due to the moral decay and behavioral norm that's often encouraged and what is deemed acceptable. We sure didnt have those problems at the rate we do today 30 years ago or more.
 
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Lol its all sexual deviancy. Man with another man goes against nature (if at the very least you believe in evolution) and isn't capable of reproducing. If it is genetic then surely they would just die off.

It's cultivated and has become more prevalent because its encouraged. A weird turn for our country and times for sure. And we wonder why theres so much depression and suicide in the country today? Just maybe it's due to the moral decay and behavioral norm that's often encouraged and what is deemed accaptable. We sure didnt have those problems at the rate we do today 30 years ago or more.
Well, fundamentally I don't believe it is cultivated. From my understanding, homosexuslity is very likely determined by genetic expression - non-reproductive traits can easily be transferred gentically since we all have two copies of chromosomes containing active and inactive genes.

I truly believe that if you researched this, or have known gay people from an early age, you would agree with me.
 
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Lol its all sexual deviancy. Man with another man goes against nature (if at the very least you believe in evolution) and isn't capable of reproducing. If it is genetic then surely they would just die off.

It's cultivated and has become more prevalent because its encouraged. A weird turn for our country and times for sure. And we wonder why theres so much depression and suicide in the country today? Just maybe it's due to the moral decay and behavioral norm that's often encouraged and what is deemed acceptable. We sure didnt have those problems at the rate we do today 30 years ago or more.
Yes but goes against nature is also having sex for pleasure and I'm sure most humans can agree that they see nothing wrong with that (it's normal). Humans have a much stronger bond to other humans than most if not all animals cause of evolution.
 
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So a man turns in to a women.. He can't compete vs women right? Not that bodybuilding is clean but that would be cheating.

A women competing against men would be unfair so why not?

It's strange to separate it in to a specific category cause it feels like we're separating ourselves from them as humans.

They all take steroids obviously so why not have transgender women compete vs women?

Anyways I really couldn't care less, whatever makes people happy.

It's funny how they get prescribed steroids while others have to go to the black market so in bodybuilding terms they really could never pretend to be natty haha..
Im not reading all the way through this thread bc i dont agree with the way the world accepts this now but i read your comment and it reminded me. There was a man who transitioned to being a woman and was competing against women in mma and was knocking girls out left and right. Messed up. Fallon fox is the name. Not sure if he/she/it is still competing though
 
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I do understand your point. Let me first point out that the LGBTQIA community (how many letter are they going to add?), as well as a significant portion of the leftist/ liberal community, vehemently argues that gender is not determined by physical characteristics (e.g. the possession of male/female genitalia or male/female chromosomes, for example), but is a "mental" state of being. Therefore, one can have a penis and male chromosomes, yet technically be a "female"...according to them. The TG community feels very strongly about this...and a TG person will take great offense to anyone who says or even infers that they are anything but the sex of their choosing.

One thing that is important to understand here is that the TG community believes that all TG people are "fully" woman/man, according to the sex of their choosing (a belief that that has gained widespread support from the entire LGBTQIA community, as well as a large portion of the leftist/liberal community). In fact, they believe this so strongly that it has become a political movement, with the formation of activist groups, public "educational" meetings being held all over college campuses, propaganda being spread all over the country/world through as many avenues as possible, etc...

So, if the TG community truly believes they are FULLY the sex of their choosing (they are very adamant about this), then they would NEVER kill themselves for the reason you proposed (you proposed that the post-op suicide rate is so high because they know they will never actually be a man/woman and therefore feel life is pointless). In other words, the TG community completely disagrees with you! Remember, according to them, being a man or a woman is all in one's head and therefore, if one believes they are a man/woman, that is exactly what they are. Sound silly? Of course it does, but this is EXACTLY what they are proposing and it has potentially dire consequences for everyone who disagrees with them. As it is now, anyone who isn't on board with their philosophy is labeled as intolerant and if someone happens to disagree publicly, they are accused of using "hate speech".

Did you know the LGBTQIA, leftist/liberal communities are now hard at work trying to OUTLAW the practice of referring to TG people by anything other than terms of their own choosing? They actually want to make it ILLEGAL for anyone to refer to them by their natural sex...and they've already succeeded in Canada! In Canada an actual LAW was passed, making it not only illegal to refer to TG people by their natural sex, but compelling the general public to refer to them by a name(s) of their own choosing...and a failure to do so is considered a CRIME enforceable by law! This is government mandated compelled speech and violates free speech!

This is actually the crux of the issue..because if the government officially proclaims that these people are not actually men/women, then society (including the LGBTQIA/ leftist/ liberal community) would be forced to admit the truth, which is that these people are actually mentally ill and in dire need of help. On the other hand, if the government says these people are indeed men/women, then referring to them as anything but the sex of their choosing is considered intolerance/ hate speech and (if they get their way here in the U.S.) a crime punishable by law. This is only the tip of the proverbial iceberg; a small part of a MUCH larger agenda intended to corrupt the moral/ethical standards society has held to for millennia. They proclaim old moral standards to be outdated and ignorant...while referring to their own standards as a leap forward in human evolution and understanding, but I digress...

Getting back to the point at hand, I think it is important to emphasize the fact that these people are fighting tooth and nail for their beliefs to be societally and legally accepted. This either makes your reason for their depression/suicide rate utter rubbish...or it makes them a bunch of LIARS who are doing everything they can to push their own distorted view of reality down everyone's throats. This is absolutely SICK! Even you have the good sense to see (probably without even knowing all the issues going on) that these people are not actually men/women. You even said yourself that they KNOW they aren't really men/women and that it is the reason for their depression/suicide rate! It was your entire point! Why do you think you thought that? Because it is blatantly obvious to anyone that doesn't live in denial that a person can't become a man/woman just because they want to be--that there is a whole lot more to being a male/female than just outward appearance and hormones.

You know what I think? I think a significant percentage of the TG community believes the same thing you and I do; that they know they aren't really the sex of their choosing, but they will never admit it because it would destroy everything they are working towards, both politically and societally. Instead, they're trying to force people--by way of law and through societal condemnation--to not only accept their delusion, but to publicly approve of it through government mandated compelled speech...and even worse, to criminalize anyone who refuses to comply with their false view of reality--a reality many of them don't even believe in themselves! Unbelievable!!!

In my opinion, anyone who tries to legally force someone--via threat of criminalization--to accept a belief that they don't even believe themselves, is the worst of the worst. I don't care what someone wants to believe...and I believe people should be able to do what they want (within reason), but I don't want anyone telling me what I have to believe. It's even worse when they try to force this belief on me to through legal means...and even worse still when they try to force a belief on me they don't even believe themselves! This is perverse wickedness and it typifies a large portion of the TG community, who are not only mentally ill, but morally corrupt as well. Anyone who attempts to coerce another human being to believe what they want, especially in the absence of their own belief, is morally reprehensible.

With that said, do you still think the reason for their depression/ suicide rate is because they know they can never really be the sex of their choosing and therefore see life as pointless? If so, then at the very minimum you are calling them liars...and after learning what they are trying to do both politically and societally, you would also be forced to admit that they are a threat to everyone (including yourself) who does not entertain their delusions.



It is also interesting to point out that not only are TG people equally as depressed/unhappy post-op, but a significant portion of them transition back later in life. If not being "fully" male/female was the main reason for their depression/ suicide rate, why would they transition back? Wouldn't that be the worst possible decision if happiness was the goal?

Personally, it seems to me that if their unhappiness stemmed from not being fully male/female, the LAST thing they would want to do is make it even more obvious they aren't the sex of their choosing.

As more and more time goes by, the research is revealing that neither societal nor self-acceptance of one's natural sex is the reason for their suicide rate. It is because they hate themselves, period. This is exactly why they are no happier post-op...and why they often choose to transition back. Unfortunately, despite expressing the desire to transition back, many cannot afford to. There are also others who, while they don't want to transition back, they wish they never would have transitioned in the fist place. The reason they don't want to transition back isn't because of money, it's because they have built their entire life around their post-op sex...and believe they would encounter even more problems if they transitioned back. So, they just stay the way they are, but wish they never would have done it in the first place.

You see, a lot of these people don't realize that their unhappiness isn't gender related until AFTER they make a full transition. Then, after a while, when their lives don't improve, they start to ask themselves why they are still unhappy and have no peace. Many of them eventually come to the truth, which is that gender was never the core reason for their unhappiness. They simply confused what they thought was a gender issue with a much deeper issue; one of self-acceptance/ self-love. It is not difficult to understand how this happens to people.

Let's look at a fictitious young girl named Brittany, as an example. There are many girls and boys, like Brittany, whose gender confusion starts at a very young age and continues to progress until they come to the belief that they should be/are the opposite sex. For Brittany, it started when her Mom started saying things like "why don't you like to wear dresses like all the other little girls?" and only got worse as society's expectations continued to conflict with her own nature. Before long, Brittany realized she wasn't like other girls. She didn't want to play with dolls like other girls, play dress-up, put on make-up, or even watch the same TV shows that other girls liked to watch. At the same time, she started to realize that she was naturally drawn to many of the activities and interests that boys seemed to be involved in.

By her late teens Brittany felt completely out of touch her her female body and started to think she should have been born a boy instead. She related better to boys and it seemed that if she could just be a boy, everything would "make sense". At that point it didn't take much for her to start entertaining the thought that maybe she had a male brain and that it was her body that didn't belong. She reasoned that maybe, somewhere in the womb, a mistake had occurred, and what should have entered this world as a boy, accidentally came into it with a girls' body. She was never supposed to have a girl's body. She was the victim of an unfortunate genetic amalgamation...a mix up. Nature "got it wrong" and it needed to be corrected.

Because Brittany thought she had a male brain, she believed that becoming a male would be the key to lifting her chronic depression and would finally enable her to fit-in in the world and be the person she was always supposed to be. Yes, she was certain that going under the knife was the only solution to her problems, but what Brittany did not realize at that time is that being a girl was never the source of her unhappiness. It was her perceived self-assessment (who she thinks she is/should be), based on society's "typical" understanding of what constitutes male/female behavior and desires, that ultimately led to gender confusion and consequently, her unhappiness. In the end, it was her false understanding of what a girl is/must be that caused her to believe she had a male brain and make the decision to undergo gender reassignment surgery.

Often, it isn't until after the surgery, when their depression isn't lifted, that TG people realize gender was not the core source of their unhappiness. So, while it may be true that part of their unhappiness is due to the things you've pointed out, they certainly aren't the main reason. These people aren't killing themselves because they can never fully be the sex they wanted to be. They are killing themselves because they hate themselves at a level that goes beyond gender. They need help. What they don't need is to be told that their delusions are real...and then further enforce those delusions by structuring society around them. That is why I am opposed to things such as "transgender bodybuilding contests"--because it enforces these delusions. Also, based on what has been going on recently, it is also apparent that they serve to further embolden the extreme far leftist/ liberal lunatics (I said "extreme" leftist/liberals, as I certainly do NOT believe all leftists or liberals are lunatics) in their pursuit of an "anything goes" society, which I do not think is healthy or sustainable.
I totally agree here. While i do believe that some mentally ill people will believe that they were born the wrong sex and want to change. But i find it very hard to believe with how widespread it is that all these people really believe that and how acceptance of it is shoved down peoples throats really bothers me. I dont really care what people do unless its effecting me and my family? I dont like the fact that im raising my children in a world where you can just change your sex on a whim if you're confused as a teen, men can marry men, and women can marry women. My mom up and decided she was a lesbian after being married 20 years and raising 4 kids and now shes married to a woman and my little brother who is 12 years younger tham me was raised in this household and their all about equality and pushing the LGBTQ agendas and my brother is a weirdo because of it. My kids are weirded out about how grandma is married to grandma and all that but whatever. I think we need to change the fact that everyone thinks we need to accept everything. Men are not born women and women are not born men. Something happens in their head that needs to be treated not just saying oh good for you for transitioning and going with how you felt when you were 16 years old when most parents know that you're not old enough to make big decisions like that. I know i made some pretty dumb decisions at that age. Namely getting hooked on drugs and "identifying" as a drug addict. Which btw still isnt socially accepted as its just who you are. Its a choice that you make that has consequences.
 
Chados

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Im not reading all the way through this thread bc i dont agree with the way the world accepts this now but i read your comment and it reminded me. There was a man who transitioned to being a woman and was competing against women in mma and was knocking girls out left and right. Messed up. Fallon fox is the name. Not sure if he/she/it is still competing though
I definitely do not agree with that but I dont see why we shouldn't accept a person wanting to change their gender. We don't have to agree the woman is now a man but at least for me personally I don't mind calling them that because as you stated what doesn't affect my family shouldn't bother me. The US is quite Christian as a nation and many people who don't follow the bible still says I believe in a higher power, marriage between a man and a women is to many the only really right thing. I've lived in the US but I'm back in Scandinavia and I could see friends having gay friends in the US but when they're not there they could say things like, i think it's more of a thing to be gay nowadays and people are following a trend or I don't mind gay people but I don't think a wedding is okay. What's striking about this is that these people are following a religion but they aren't Christian. In Scandinavia nobody cares and you know Im not the only voice of truth but thats how we were raised and that's why I have such a hard time not accepting it. The people you say are accepting too much are a very small bunch of people but they are the only ones that are loud and this pc agenda people have is slowly going away because people like you and me don't care anymore and then these extreme people who many of them probably don't really care but just want you to talk about them cause they have nothing going in in their life, these people that are annoying shouldn't affect our opinion about another person. Most gay people aren't in parades with rainbow colours, it's the straight people from the overprotective side of society who creates hate and anger towards people who really don't deserve it.
 

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