To Infinity.... and Beyond!

Didn't want to clutter @Hyde s thread as his wife gets ready to compete but seeing biolayne is there today wanted me to share the signed pic he has sent me years ago. He actually sent two, I keep one in my office one is at home Invalid Link Removed
 
Dustin07 said:
Didn't want to clutter @Hyde s thread as his wife gets ready to compete but seeing biolayne is there today wanted me to share the signed pic he has sent me years ago. He actually sent two, I keep one in my office one is at home Invalid Link Removed
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Cool, so what is the story behind him sending you the pics?
 
so @SkRaw85 , @MrKleen73 @Hyde I'd like to screw around with the transdermals some more.
Dermacrine and Sustain Alpha both recommend 3 pumps for up to like 190lbs. But I chill at 190 now, and today 191+
With sustain Alpha I definitely did notice improved energy and aggression in the gym but at 4 pumps it was super noticeable.

Iconic has so many cool options and this lets me play with more things without injecting... y'all have any favorites you'd recommend I try? Icon One looks like a supercharged dermacrine with the 1DHEA and has great reviews. I "weaned" myself into dermacrine light with only 2 pumps and now I wish I was just taking 3-4+ lol.

https://iconicformulations.com/collections/topicals

MrKleen73 said:
Cool, so what is the story behind him sending you the pics?
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I'm trying to remember exactly how it went down. I want to give my ex props cause I sorta think back in the days of DVD's we were one of the first ones to order his and I got her to tell him it was for fathers day and that I was a fan. I can't remember exactly but I think it was something like that....?
 
Been watching his youtube channel a lot lately. When I was looking for a coach emailed them but they don't do powerlifting coaching :(
 
SkRaw85 said:
I’ve only ran a couple DHEA products so far. Gear cream by IronMagLabs Labs is a supercharged version that I definitely felt in action.

https://www.apex-alchemy.com/products/hyperion-1

Dermacrine I’ve been using low dose in conjunction with TRT and feeling good about.

Hyperion by Apex is one of my next curiosities after Dermacrine runs out. I am sold on every apex product I’ve tried to date.

https://www.apex-alchemy.com/products/hyperion-1
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Any thoughts on iconics epi+ ando TDs? Too strong for a newb like me or worth playing with? The reviews on all their products are fantastic but I only half trust reviews these days.

I'd like to get something on order this week and probably hammer out a 4+6 week cycle before I get snipped end of April and have a few days of forced rest
 
Meal prepping for four days again this week. I have a biz golf outting tomorrow so I'll make that a fasting day since I'll be distracted easier

Took my wife out for a fancy Italian dinner last night. The waitress looked at me like I was crazy when I asked for extra meatballs lol. But they were good

Weighed in at 192 today. Not sure where I plan to pull in the reigns. Invalid Link RemovedInvalid Link Removed
 
Warm up
DB laterals, forwards, kickbacks, curls

Bench
10 x 95, 135, 175
2 x 205
225 x 9, 8, 7, 6, 5
185 x 13

SS
225 x 10

Machine dips
+200lbs x 3 sets to failure

Some curls

Notes
Gym day with my boy. He finally put up 135 and I added 1 more rep to my 225 sets from last week.
 
Dustin07 said:
Any thoughts on iconics epi+ ando TDs? Too strong for a newb like me or worth playing with? The reviews on all their products are fantastic but I only half trust reviews these days.

I'd like to get something on order this week and probably hammer out a 4+6 week cycle before I get snipped end of April and have a few days of forced rest
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Buy with confidence. Anything Rob makes is legit.

But I will warn you that you may get pretty dry skin about halfway through, so be prepared for that.
 
Segansational said:
Buy with confidence. Anything Rob makes is legit.

But I will warn you that you may get pretty dry skin about halfway through, so be prepared for that.
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Dude I'm so dry now I'm lotioning my nipples daily and my slingshot was rubbing then raw today. I ran out of fish oil and you can see it in my forearms and back of my hands. Every single year I run out around January and get dry skin and somehow never learn
 
Segansational said:
Buy with confidence. Anything Rob makes is legit.

But I will warn you that you may get pretty dry skin about halfway through, so be prepared for that.
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SkRaw85 said:
I’ve only used Dermacrine from iconic but looks like @Segansational nailed it
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The two that have me the most interested right now are Ultra Hard with Epiandro and Androsterone
https://www.strongsupplementshop.com/ultra-hard-by-iconic-formulations

and Alpha Four wtih 4 HDEA and also Androsterone.
https://www.strongsupplementshop.com/alpha-four-by-iconic-formulations

I still have a lot to learn though and I'd like to better understand the risks (?) and rewards of both before I go balls deep on it.
Is it true that a benefit to TDs that that my liver is more protected compared to orals and pinning since it's removed from the process?

Seems like with something like Epi I should be learning more about on cycle support and pct as well
 
I'm golfing with the older guys today and poked my 8 iron about 190 yards on the second or third hole, overshooting the green by like 30.

One of the guys goes "woah I guess he took his steroids this morning"

And I'm sitting there contemplating the four pumps of dermacrine I had this morning like hmmm does DHEA really count? Invalid Link Removed
 
Dustin07 said:
Hell yeah man I told him getting a full plate on each side was monumental and next two major benchmarks are bodyweight and two plates
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Shoot, even 185 with the 25s on is a major benchmark coming from 135. I was stoked to get the quarter on there. Funny how after 225 there is nothing until 315 but by that time you should be pretty happy with smaller gains.
Dustin07 said:
The two that have me the most interested right now are Ultra Hard with Epiandro and Androsterone
https://www.strongsupplementshop.com/ultra-hard-by-iconic-formulations

and Alpha Four wtih 4 HDEA and also Androsterone.
https://www.strongsupplementshop.com/alpha-four-by-iconic-formulations

I still have a lot to learn though and I'd like to better understand the risks (?) and rewards of both before I go balls deep on it.
Is it true that a benefit to TDs that that my liver is more protected compared to orals and pinning since it's removed from the process?

Seems like with something like Epi I should be learning more about on cycle support and pct as well
Click to expand...
Out of the 2 mentioned if only going with one I would have to ask are you trying for strength or size? Also are you willing to increase the doses over the recommended doses? If strength and keeping leaner looking then probably the UltraHard. It is basically androhard by another name. If size then maybe the 4-Andro product.

Most of those will give a boost at recommended doses but to really see a lot of effect 1.5-2 x the recommended dose is where it is at. Of course at that level you are actually risking a bit of shut down, or suppression, and would probably want / need a SERM.

Something like Gear Cream or another product with 1-Andro would be nice and effective too. I had really good results with 1-Andro and 4-Andro stacked together so I would have some estrogen alongside the 1-Andro.

Also there are plenty of good oral products out there that will not have a negative effect on your liver. All of the andro products are pretty much easy on the system, or at least the liver. Only the methylated Orals are the problem when it comes to the liver and all of the complaints you hear us talking about with orals. So you could say run the TD you want and supplement an oral like a 1-Andro product or something on top of that without issue.

All of that being said if strength is your main focus then UltraHard is probably going to get you there with the least amount of new muscle mass added.
 
MrKleen73 said:
Shoot, even 185 with the 25s on is a major benchmark coming from 135. I was stoked to get the quarter on there. Funny how after 225 there is nothing until 315 but by that time you should be pretty happy with smaller gains.

Out of the 2 mentioned if only going with one I would have to ask are you trying for strength or size? Also are you willing to increase the doses over the recommended doses? If strength and keeping leaner looking then probably the UltraHard. It is basically androhard by another name. If size then maybe the 4-Andro product.

Most of those will give a boost at recommended doses but to really see a lot of effect 1.5-2 x the recommended dose is where it is at. Of course at that level you are actually risking a bit of shut down, or suppression, and would probably want / need a SERM.

Something like Gear Cream or another product with 1-Andro would be nice and effective too. I had really good results with 1-Andro and 4-Andro stacked together so I would have some estrogen alongside the 1-Andro.

Also there are plenty of good oral products out there that will not have a negative effect on your liver. All of the andro products are pretty much easy on the system, or at least the liver. Only the methylated Orals are the problem when it comes to the liver and all of the complaints you hear us talking about with orals. So you could say run the TD you want and supplement an oral like a 1-Andro product or something on top of that without issue.

All of that being said if strength is your main focus then UltraHard is probably going to get you there with the least amount of new muscle mass added.
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Thank you! Hyde was just telling me I think basically the same thing. Sounds like Ultra Hard is a very safe way to go so I think I want to run with that for a month. I'll plan on a full dose say 2 hours pre-workout since I feel the dermacrine hits me best about 2hours after it's applied. I'll not worry about any kind of additional support beyond my normal vitamins, creatine, maybe the otc libido stuff like maca, horny goat weed etc since those all seem to give me a boost at the gym (placebo or not).

After that i'll get my procedure done, see where I am and maybe give Gear Cream a try since you and @SkRaw85 have both recommended that one now...

And yeah I think strength is my biggest priority. I don't feel huge in my clothes but in the mirror I'm pretty happy with my size and the rate of growth I have right now even at 40, it actually shocks me some to see how big my boobies are. I told my wife if I outgrow her I'll buy her bigger ones too.

I feel like with sustain alpha I noticed nothing at 2 pumps. something at 3 pumps, and I was hooked at 4 pumps.
With Dermacrine it's been basically the same. I'm now at 190-191lbs so I'm right at their 4 pump recommended dosage level. I haven't tried 5.

I'm done feeling bad about having to be completely natural for small garage comps but not ready to pin so I'm looking for that happy medium to dabble.
 
squats
10 x bar, 95, 135
5 x 185
3 x 225, 250, 275, 275
2 x 285
3 singles x 300 about 1 min rest

speed/form practice
5 x 225
13 x 185
3 x 3 x 185

notes
weight 190.x
weight belt barely made 3rd hole lol
my lifting buddy squatted with me today. was hoping he'd find me to be a train wreck but he said my form is actually holding really well. we made some changes though:

wrapping thumbs instead of thumbs over. this took adjusting my grip so I could still get the bar lower. first attempt felt damn near high bar.

working on driving ass/hips out of the hole and back more. he said my pace (which I've told y'all here) is like TUT the whole way down and back. He's helping me to drive some explosive activation out of the hole.

wish I had more time to do accessories but today is crammed with meetings so we jammed out a lunch session. Felt great though. next week I'd like to repeat this exact session but hit that 300lb for doubles or trips.
 
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One thing you might try adding if you are having a bit of an issue exploding out of the hole is to do a set of 2-3 reps on a jump squat then hit your squats. The jumping right before will wake up the type 2 fibers and have them ready to be explosive out of the bottom.

Also if not getting the bar very far down on your back it might be harder to push the ass out and back when coming up out of the hole. Low bar almost forces you to fold in half pushing the butt out. High Bar almost cements the movement into a more upright position like an Olympic Squat. Working on the ability to get the bar down lower will probably help in forcing that movement but it isn't easy if you don't already have the shoulder mobility. Right now my left shoulder keeps me from getting low bar, so I have to squat oly style. Heck even squatting with a regular barbell is a lot for me right now. Shoulder is still to tight to get comfortable with enough weight to work my legs.
 
MrKleen73 said:
One thing you might try adding if you are having a bit of an issue exploding out of the hole is to do a set of 2-3 reps on a jump squat then hit your squats. The jumping right before will wake up the type 2 fibers and have them ready to be explosive out of the bottom.

Also if not getting the bar very far down on your back it might be harder to push the ass out and back when coming up out of the hole. Low bar almost forces you to fold in half pushing the butt out. High Bar almost cements the movement into a more upright position like an Olympic Squat. Working on the ability to get the bar down lower will probably help in forcing that movement but it isn't easy if you don't already have the shoulder mobility. Right now my left shoulder keeps me from getting low bar, so I have to squat oly style. Heck even squatting with a regular barbell is a lot for me right now. Shoulder is still to tight to get comfortable with enough weight to work my legs.
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Back in Jan I did that xfit drop in with my wife and my shoulder was a bit wonky for like 8 weeks. i think I rehabbed it really well with kb armbars but both forward delts tend to stay 'tight' but with zero pain (knock on wood). I try to get my low bar as far as it will physically go and years ago I did have an issue with collapsing but I credit the good mornings and RDLs to that not being an issue. My buddy was sorta laughing saying most people drive their hips up and fail to raise their chest (the squat-morning) but I for some reason am having no issue with the chest collapsing, just failing to shoot my hips up.

when I squat thumb over the bar, I can get the bar a little lower. I worked my grip a little further out each set with thumb wrapped today until I felt like the bar was low enough. I'd still like it a tiny bit lower but the last few sets felt awesome although hella tight on the shoulders.

I was afraid you'd recommend jumping squats. they seem like such a foreign idea. I probably need to give them a try.
 
I also sorta wonder if I need a quads only day. like maybe I take a bonus day to focus on quads and use that to throw in back work. but I'm just not a quad dominant lifter and I think it's my major weak point in the squat.
 
You can use Sustain Alpha year round. It’s not hormonal.

Gear Cream or any 1DHEA product will be suppressive. I would count it as a steroid cycle and be ready to PCT.

Transdermals still have to get processed by the liver during second pass from the blood stream, same as injectables once they’re absorbed into the blood. Orals have an extra first pass, and the issue there is they’re often methylated so they can better survive that pass, but that’s where the extra liver stress comes in and why duration of exposure should be limited.

Try some frontsquats if you need more quad drive for squats. You don’t need a dedicated quad day - no amount of leg extensions will raise a squat 1RM.
 
Hyde said:
Transdermals still have to get processed by the liver during second pass from the blood stream, same as injectables once they’re absorbed into the blood. Orals have an extra first pass, and the issue there is they’re often methylated so they can better survive that pass, but that’s where the extra liver stress comes in and why duration of exposure should be limited.

Try some frontsquats if you need more quad drive for squats. You don’t need a dedicated quad day - no amount of leg extensions will raise a squat 1RM.
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thanks man I appreciate that. just based on that post from you sent me down a rabbit hole reading up on 1dhea vs dhea. and, I do like the sustain alpha so it's nice to hear I can use it indefinitely lol

I think you're right on front squats. mine have never reached 80% of my back squat and while I know that's only a reference number it's something for me to think about and work on.
 
Dustin07 said:
thanks man I appreciate that. just based on that post from you sent me down a rabbit hole reading up on 1dhea vs dhea. and, I do like the sustain alpha so it's nice to hear I can use it indefinitely lol

I think you're right on front squats. mine have never reached 80% of my back squat and while I know that's only a reference number it's something for me to think about and work on.
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That 80% number is BS. I mean not for a weightlifter with that tremendous frequency and pattern specificity, but the truth is it’s not necessary. If your fronts go up, you can expect your squat probably is too, but it doesn’t have to stay so close.
 
Resolve10 said:
I’m not really following the hips out of the hole thing (I’m not visualizing what’s going on well), but as far as explosiveness that’s just going to come down to lots of practice. Working to find the right bounce out of the hole and always trying to drive explosively regardless of the weight, variation, etc. should be done imho (unless specifically working some tempo variation). Theres a whole lot you can get lost in with velocity measures and tracking, but I don’t want to get too off track. I’m not sure Jump squats would address that issue as you are probably looking for speed out of the hole and jump squats (while useful for increasing lifting velocity in general in certain situations) aren’t typically done on a full range of motion. You could always still warm up with them I guess to prime yourself if it gets your mind and body right I suppose.
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Honestly I'm not really sure how to type the mental cue he sorta helped me with but essentially the end result was that when I broke parallel, found bottom, I was able to shift my ascent into a more explosive start to get my hips moving and create more momentum out of the hole I think vs my normal pattern of dropping down painfully slow then switching to the ascent slowly as well. The difference in speed at 185lbs and 275lbs is damn near zero for me when warming up. I should get one of those monitors to measure barbell velocity for fun.

No mobility issues on front squats, after years of oly lifting mobility isn't really an issue there, if anything a2g is too easy. But to give you an idea of my deficit there; when I had a back squat of 345 my top front squat was 245 (about 70%) yet I could power clean and jerk 270+ LOL.
 
Okay, so it sounds like he is just saying you are working so hard to control the contraction you are not just exploding out of the hole. I was trying to picture what it meant too. Coming off of pause squats explosively is a good way to build that explosiveness. Think of the bottom of the squat as the bottom of a clean and explode when changing direction. It should be a violent contraction even if the resulting movement is slowed by the resistance.
 
Warm up
DB laterals, forwards , curls

Bench
10 x 95, 135
3 x 5 x 165 paused

Reverse grip
3 x 10 to 135lb

CGBP
10 x 135, 155, 165

Machine curls
3 x 10

Ez bar curls
3 sets

21s
One set for da pump

Dips
Bw x 10
+25lbs on belt x 8
+50lbs on belt x 2 x 8

Cable curls
3 x 10


Notes
Weight 192.x

Experimental / bro day. Testing reverse grip. Focused on speed on flat and finishing with arms etc.

Wanted to get the work in, without feeling "worked". Testing what that actually looks and feels like.

Didn't think I could take my shirt off after tho lol
 
What did you think about those reverse grips? They really hammer pec/lats once you find perfect hand position and figure it out a bit.
 
SkRaw85 said:
What did you think about those reverse grips? They really hammer pec/lats once you find perfect hand position and figure it out a bit.
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Haha they worked me, I went light since I have no idea what I'm doing and didn't have my spotter today. I honestly had to figure out what was getting worked cause the whole thing is so new

Started out with too narrow of a grip but once I found the sweet spot my shoulder was happy and I could pound out an effective set. They will return in my programming for sure!!!
 
I remember when I used to work at the gym Anthony Clark trained at. Seeing him reverse bench over 700 in training was just stupid. He was such a nice guy. Truly a gentle giant. it was awesome to get to train with him and his crew. My father in law trained him for a while too. Crazy I had this father in law who was a record holder and well known but our hate for each other could not be bridged even with the love of the lift. Then again the guy was a bit of a nut, steroid and gun dealer on top of owning a butt nekkid club. Just a winner all over. LMAO.
 
Invalid Link Removed

Here is Anthony's World Record Bench back then 750 reverse grip. The yahoo with the porn mustache and red and white striped bodybuilder pants was my father in law. He had over a 600lb bench in the 242 class. It was crazy when Anthony died, we were all sad. He would visit the schools all the time deadlifting cars and motivating kids to do positive things instead of all the negative things that are so easy to slide into as a teenager.
 
MrKleen73 said:
Invalid Link Removed

Here is Anthony's World Record Bench back then 750 reverse grip. The yahoo with the porn mustache and red and white striped bodybuilder pants was my father in law. He had over a 600lb bench in the 242 class. It was crazy when Anthony died, we were all sad. He would visit the schools all the time deadlifting cars and motivating kids to do positive things instead of all the negative things that are so easy to slide into as a teenager.
Click to expand...

Ain’t nothin but a peanut! Holy hell the way it exploded up is insane!
 
Dustin07 said:
Thank you! Hyde was just telling me I think basically the same thing. Sounds like Ultra Hard is a very safe way to go so I think I want to run with that for a month. I'll plan on a full dose say 2 hours pre-workout since I feel the dermacrine hits me best about 2hours after it's applied. I'll not worry about any kind of additional support beyond my normal vitamins, creatine, maybe the otc libido stuff like maca, horny goat weed etc since those all seem to give me a boost at the gym (placebo or not).

After that i'll get my procedure done, see where I am and maybe give Gear Cream a try since you and @SkRaw85 have both recommended that one now...

And yeah I think strength is my biggest priority. I don't feel huge in my clothes but in the mirror I'm pretty happy with my size and the rate of growth I have right now even at 40, it actually shocks me some to see how big my boobies are. I told my wife if I outgrow her I'll buy her bigger ones too.

I feel like with sustain alpha I noticed nothing at 2 pumps. something at 3 pumps, and I was hooked at 4 pumps.
With Dermacrine it's been basically the same. I'm now at 190-191lbs so I'm right at their 4 pump recommended dosage level. I haven't tried 5.

I'm done feeling bad about having to be completely natural for small garage comps but not ready to pin so I'm looking for that happy medium to dabble.
Click to expand...
I keep going back and forth on getting back on some type of cycle. It's been 5 years since I used anything. I never used to feel this way, but at some level I feel like I'd be dishonest with the lessons I'm trying to teach my kids. Just my thoughts for myself.
 
GreenMachineX said:
I keep going back and forth on getting back on some type of cycle. It's been 5 years since I used anything. I never used to feel this way, but at some level I feel like I'd be dishonest with the lessons I'm trying to teach my kids. Just my thoughts for myself.
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I stayed natty because of the events I was competing in and the dreams I had. At my peak I was earning top 100 positions out of 7000+ competitors and I was gearing up to join a regionals team. Even with the torn ligament in my back, had I not moved and got remarried I have no doubt I would have been competing in Iceland a few years ago and I would have been tested.

That's gone now and since the MLB hasn't yet called me up to come play third base for anyone my need to be natural is fading. But my drive is through the roof and as long as I can outlift my little brothers, earn the admiration of the elderly, and carry my wife to the bedroom like a caveman it's all good in the hood. (y)

for what it's worth, I've seen really interesting positivity from those around me even in the last couple months since playing around with even these minor transdermals. maybe it's coincidence, or maybe I'm carrying myself different or maybe my pheromones are putting everyone in heat idk.
 
Dustin07 said:
I stayed natty because of the events I was competing in and the dreams I had. At my peak I was earning top 100 positions out of 7000+ competitors and I was gearing up to join a regionals team. Even with the torn ligament in my back, had I not moved and got remarried I have no doubt I would have been competing in Iceland a few years ago and I would have been tested.

That's gone now and since the MLB hasn't yet called me up to come play third base for anyone my need to be natural is fading. But my drive is through the roof and as long as I can outlift my little brothers, earn the admiration of the elderly, and carry my wife to the bedroom like a caveman it's all good in the hood. (y)

for what it's worth, I've seen really interesting positivity from those around me even in the last couple months since playing around with even these minor transdermals. maybe it's coincidence, or maybe I'm carrying myself different or maybe my pheromones are putting everyone in heat idk.
Click to expand...
Which transdermals have you used? Just like sustain alpha and dermacrine?
 
GreenMachineX said:
Which transdermals have you used? Just like sustain alpha and dermacrine?
Click to expand...

Yup, that's it. just barely even dabbling. and even with those mild TDs I have weaned myself on slowly to see what happens. one pump, 2 pumps, 3 pumps. at my weight I'm rx'd as a 3 pumper. when I had a few heavy days over 192lbs I did go for 4 pumps. at 3 and 4 I truly notice it kicking in. winter is my worst time of the year (SAD) and these two TDs have made the last couple months feel awesome. zero winter blues, great lifting sessions, a lot of focus, positive and aggressive mindset, crazy solid libido (never really been an issue but it's just better somehow).

I did order the ultra hard earlier this week as well and my plan there is probably only to use it on lifting days. I might take it to work with me and attempt to put it on 1-2hrs pre-workout to see if the timing makes a large difference since I feel like 3-4 pumps of dermacrine kick in around 2 hours later when I'm at my desk at work)
 
Today is likely a rest day for me cause my body is trashed so even if we go in and deadlift I'll keep it light and work on some accessories like RDL's etc so I only went 2 pumps of each the dermacrine and sustain. when I go for my big bench day I'll likely hit 3 or 4 of the dermacrine.

my weight is magically down to 189 today as well which is weird. I've been consistently around 191 lately and even 194. so that bump down without fasting or anything is sorta odd.
 
Hyde said:
Clark was a real one!
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Yeah he was, I remember him bleeding out of his eyes, or getting bloody noses on some of those attempts. Just unreal.
Dustin07 said:
you married Tony Soprano's daughter?
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Basically but the Greek version. He even put out a contract to have my legs broken at one point. I rolled up on him at his butt nekkid club when I found out and called him out to do it himself. So quite the contentious relationship. Looking back now I am amazed i didn't get myself shot. To be fair I didn't know he was dealing weapons at that point or I would have probably just avoided him. LOL
GreenMachineX said:
I keep going back and forth on getting back on some type of cycle. It's been 5 years since I used anything. I never used to feel this way, but at some level I feel like I'd be dishonest with the lessons I'm trying to teach my kids. Just my thoughts for myself.
Click to expand...

Just curious, outside of it being illegal what are the other things that make you feel like it would be dishonest? You aren't cheating anything or anyone. You are doing what it takes to go after your goals, and as long as you aren't being an asshat you aren't taking anything away from their life experience.

I kind of feel like to be a parent you are required to be hypocritical to a degree in order to protect your children's innocence while they are young. We teach them hard and fast rules that we expect them to follow to a T, knowing as they mature they will have to use their own decision making skills to discern the appropriate course of action in the context of the situation. I find it funny we are required to teach them never to lie, while lying to them about Santa Claus, or the Easter bunny. It just doesn't make sense. I remember having a heartbraking conversation with Sage when they found out we lied to them about Santa. They were like but you taught me never to lie. Why did you lie to me. UHM... I got nothing...

As an adult I think we all know there are times where it is appropriate to be honest and times to be dishonest.

Example
Wife - Does this dress make my ass look big?
Husband - Lie = No baby your ass doesn't look fat in that dress. Honesty = No, it is your big ass that makes your ass look big.
Which one would you go with?
 
MrKleen73 said:
Yeah he was, I remember him bleeding out of his eyes, or getting bloody noses on some of those attempts. Just unreal.
Basically but the Greek version. He even put out a contract to have my legs broken at one point. I rolled up on him at his butt nekkid club when I found out and called him out to do it himself. So quite the contentious relationship. Looking back now I am amazed i didn't get myself shot. To be fair I didn't know he was dealing weapons at that point or I would have probably just avoided him. LOL


Just curious, outside of it being illegal what are the other things that make you feel like it would be dishonest? You aren't cheating anything or anyone. You are doing what it takes to go after your goals, and as long as you aren't being an asshat you aren't taking anything away from their life experience.

I kind of feel like to be a parent you are required to be hypocritical to a degree in order to protect your children's innocence while they are young. We teach them hard and fast rules that we expect them to follow to a T, knowing as they mature they will have to use their own decision making skills to discern the appropriate course of action in the context of the situation. I find it funny we are required to teach them never to lie, while lying to them about Santa Claus, or the Easter bunny. It just doesn't make sense. I remember having a heartbraking conversation with Sage when they found out we lied to them about Santa. They were like but you taught me never to lie. Why did you lie to me. UHM... I got nothing...

As an adult I think we all know there are times where it is appropriate to be honest and times to be dishonest.

Example
Wife - Does this dress make my ass look big?
Husband - Lie = No baby your ass doesn't look fat in that dress. Honesty = No, it is your big ass that makes your ass look big.
Which one would you go with?
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Well, I wasn't even talking about the illegal ones necessarily. But in our home, we discuss optimal health often and the ways to pursue it. We also talk about health risk often and ways to minimize it. So, if I say "we eat the way we do 80-90% of the time because we want to live long and strong as long as possible", then using PEDs would be counter to that. Also, it's not about what anyone else does; it's about how we're raising our kids...no judgment regarding what anyone else does (unless it's actually cheating like a football player using PEDs).
 
Deads
10 x 135
5 x 185, 225

Deficit one plate
5 x 225

Deficit two plates
3 x 5 x 225
3 x 275, 315

Cybex t bar rows
Narrow grip
3 x 10

Wide grip
3 x 10

Back ext
3 sets with 45lb plate on chest

Notes
189lbs (?)
My buddy talked me into lifting vs rest day. Left my belt and flats at home so I was forced to go light. Kept all deads double overhand no belt. The cybex machine is legit. Never used it before. Invalid Link RemovedInvalid Link RemovedInvalid Link Removed
 
GreenMachineX said:
Well, I wasn't even talking about the illegal ones necessarily. But in our home, we discuss optimal health often and the ways to pursue it. We also talk about health risk often and ways to minimize it. So, if I say "we eat the way we do 80-90% of the time because we want to live long and strong as long as possible", then using PEDs would be counter to that. Also, it's not about what anyone else does; it's about how we're raising our kids...no judgment regarding what anyone else does (unless it's actually cheating like a football player using PEDs).
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No, that makes total sense to me. With that being a major topic in your household you are correct it would go directly against what you are teaching them. In that case I think you should avoid using them again outside of actual prescribed TRT if needed. I was just curious on what parts of it conflicted with how you were raising them just to hear your thoughts on the topic.
 
Dustin07 said:
Deads
10 x 135
5 x 185, 225

Deficit one plate
5 x 225

Deficit two plates
3 x 5 x 225
3 x 275, 315

Cybex t bar rows
Narrow grip
3 x 10

Wide grip
3 x 10

Back ext
3 sets with 45lb plate on chest

Notes
189lbs (?)
My buddy talked me into lifting vs rest day. Left my belt and flats at home so I was forced to go light. Kept all deads double overhand no belt. The cybex machine is legit. Never used it before. Invalid Link RemovedInvalid Link RemovedInvalid Link Removed
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Oh Snap, you are using big ol bumper plates, much bigger deficit than I initially pictured.
 
MrKleen73 said:
Basically but the Greek version. He even put out a contract to have my legs broken at one point. I rolled up on him at his butt nekkid club when I found out and called him out to do it himself. So quite the contentious relationship. Looking back now I am amazed i didn't get myself shot. To be fair I didn't know he was dealing weapons at that point or I would have probably just avoided him. LOL
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Ha my ex father in law came at me once with his fist in the air. (actually back in high school he wouldn't even let me in the house cause I had blue hair and he assumed I was a punk. I got a business degree and have been running the business with my dad for 21 years lol). When he did that I just sorta laughed and walked away and took my wife on a date and it took me like a half hour to figure out he was angry. he's just an emotional dude, we are on good terms now actually and talk a lot despite his daughter and I having split up.

Example
Wife - Does this dress make my ass look big?
Husband - Lie = No baby your ass doesn't look fat in that dress. Honesty = No, it is your big ass that makes your ass look big.
Which one would you go with?
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in my house it's
Wife - I'm so damn fat, I'm the fattest I've ever been, it's miserable
Me - if this is the fat you then it all went to the right places and I never ever want you to lose a single lb.
Also Me - Am I not on top of you like a spider monkey enough? do I need to make you feel more desired??
My Wife - <quickly back tracking> oh no, we are good there 😅😅😅

GreenMachineX said:
Well, I wasn't even talking about the illegal ones necessarily. But in our home, we discuss optimal health often and the ways to pursue it. We also talk about health risk often and ways to minimize it. So, if I say "we eat the way we do 80-90% of the time because we want to live long and strong as long as possible", then using PEDs would be counter to that. Also, it's not about what anyone else does; it's about how we're raising our kids...no judgment regarding what anyone else does (unless it's actually cheating like a football player using PEDs).
Click to expand...

My wife and I do the same thing and REGULARLY refer to a primal life. Anything that is moving, eating meat, breeding, positive hormones. caveman style. We typically will go to Pho and hot toddys as cold remedies before we go to dayquil etc even. But I can't honestly answer what PEDs are bad for you and what PEDs are good for you.

Did you know Nicotine has been shown to help Alzheimer's patients? I stayed away from PEDs for the reasons I mentioned before but also because I don't know enough about them from a health perspective, but I'm learning what i can and dabbling and if it makes me feel a little more primal I'm for it as long as it's not at the risk of my heart.

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MrKleen73 said:
Oh Snap, you are using big ol bumper plates, much bigger deficit than I initially pictured.
Click to expand...

I normally only run one plate but I told my buddy that I just want to do 225 for a 3x5 today and we may as well go double plate since it's so light. they felt faster and more explosive with 2 plates than one so I said dude I gotta try 275 and 315.

my ass was so low in the setup though a part of me sorta feels like it could help me getting out of the hole with squats too.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Well, I wasn't even talking about the illegal ones necessarily. But in our home, we discuss optimal health often and the ways to pursue it. We also talk about health risk often and ways to minimize it. So, if I say "we eat the way we do 80-90% of the time because we want to live long and strong as long as possible", then using PEDs would be counter to that. Also, it's not about what anyone else does; it's about how we're raising our kids...no judgment regarding what anyone else does (unless it's actually cheating like a football player using PEDs).
Click to expand...

I really don't disagree with you and I don't know enough to offer any kind of counter. All I know is that if I'm not taking life by the balls then I need to make and adjustment somewhere in my life. memento mori right?
 
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