The Testosterone Revolution Is Here

[musclemaker]

Coming fresh off rumors of a promising new test booster earlier this month, we have confirmation that Antaeus Labs is ready to release Ultra Test this week.

Ultra Test is slated to be the one of the first in the next generation....READ MORE

 

[alvin1]

Any introduction deal on this?

 

[VaughnTrue]

The link provides claims the following:

Source 1 "double testosterone production in animals" - Source one claims that GGOH enhances testosterone and progesterone in I-10 cells. This is an invitro study, not in live specimens.
Source 3 - The study linked here shows performance enhancement in seniors. Is there any data showing performance enhancement in normal demographics, especially in males who are established weight lifters/athletes?
Source 4 - You guys have "source 3" twice in the sources section.

 

[musclemaker]

Any introduction deal on this?

We will be doing a special tomorrow, make sure you are on our email list to get informed: https://www.strongsupplementshop.com/email-sign-up

 

[musclemaker]

The link provides claims the following:

Source 1 "double testosterone production in animals" - Source one claims that GGOH enhances testosterone and progesterone in I-10 cells. This is an invitro study, not in live specimens.
Source 3 - The study linked here shows performance enhancement in seniors. Is there any data showing performance enhancement in normal demographics, especially in males who are established weight lifters/athletes?
Source 4 - You guys have "source 3" twice in the sources section.

Hey Bud,

I am going to get Jake from Antaeus to come help feild questions as he is the product creator and can answer any question way better than I can even attempt to.

 

[JakeAntaeus]

The link provides claims the following:

Source 1 "double testosterone production in animals" - Source one claims that GGOH enhances testosterone and progesterone in I-10 cells. This is an invitro study, not in live specimens.
Source 3 - The study linked here shows performance enhancement in seniors. Is there any data showing performance enhancement in normal demographics, especially in males who are established weight lifters/athletes?
Source 4 - You guys have "source 3" twice in the sources section.

Well, with respect to question 1: It's not (just) an in vitro study.

As for source 3: There are good reviews here and here. The former focuses on the ingredient's ergogenic potential, the latter on its virility enhancing properties.
...And a particularly interesting point -- which is mentioned in the first review -- is that this extract is known to facilitate and accelerate the conversion of progesterone and pregnenolone to testosterone, via activation of CYP17 (17a-hyroxylase/17,20 lyase). So you can see how this would pair well with GGOH; the ingredients of this product were selected to compliment each other.

All that said, I understand where you're coming from, and we're going to put out more detailed write-ups ASAP.

 

[ucheoma]

Well, with respect to question 1: It's not (just) an in vitro study.
View attachment 171356

As for source 3: There are good reviews here and here. The former focuses on the ingredient's ergogenic potential, the latter on its virility enhancing properties.
...And a particularly interesting point -- which is mentioned in the first review -- is that this extract is known to facilitate and accelerate the conversion of progesterone and pregnenolone to testosterone, via activation of CYP17 (17a-hyroxylase/17,20 lyase). So you can see how this would pair well with GGOH; the ingredients of this product were selected to compliment each other.

All that said, I understand where you're coming from, and we're going to put out more detailed write-ups ASAP.

Any bloodwork on this?

 

[Jeremyk1]

Well, with respect to question 1: It's not (just) an in vitro study.
View attachment 171356

As for source 3: There are good reviews here and here. The former focuses on the ingredient's ergogenic potential, the latter on its virility enhancing properties.
...And a particularly interesting point -- which is mentioned in the first review -- is that this extract is known to facilitate and accelerate the conversion of progesterone and pregnenolone to testosterone, via activation of CYP17 (17a-hyroxylase/17,20 lyase). So you can see how this would pair well with GGOH; the ingredients of this product were selected to compliment each other.

All that said, I understand where you're coming from, and we're going to put out more detailed write-ups ASAP.

Did you guys do the original write up here? Because I was thoroughly shocked when they announced it was an Antaeus product. Your write ups are usually a lot better than that. Anyway, looking forward to more info.

 

[musclemaker]

Ultra Test Launch Sale Is On

Jump on it quick, we have a limited supply and will likely run out before the sale is over.

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplement-deals/306236-special-launch-offer.html

 

[ucheoma]

Once again. And I know from experience with other supp companies im probably wasting my time, any bloodwork on this or is it just the rats that have been made buff? Cant work out why it's in iiquid form if it has so much oral bioavailability???

 

[JakeAntaeus]

Once again. And I know from experience with other supp companies im probably wasting my time, any bloodwork on this or is it just the rats that have been made buff? Cant work out why it's in iiquid form if it has so much oral bioavailability???

We've been using the product here for months, and we've been working on it for years. We've run through a bunch of iterations -- including a very complicated one with chrysin nanoparticles. (That one's a real long story...) The current version, which is the culmination of a long process, has seen a lot of use here -- and we wouldn't release it if feedback and results weren't exceptional.

But don't take it from us. In all things, the best and most reliable results and feedback come from impartial and unbiased third parties. What do you say we send you a free bottle and pay for your blood tests? PM me.

And the product is a liquid because most of the active ingredients are liquid.

The geranylgeraniol comes from a liquid annatto extract, and the ingredient itself is a liquid in pure form. Phytol, similarly, is a liquid in pure form. It's basically impossible to turn those liquid ingredients into solids -- not, at least, without heroic efforts, like adsorption onto aerosil or porous zeolites.

And then there's the fact that Tongkat Ali is actually traditionally taken as a liquid extract, and many of the studies which examine it have used it in liquid form.

Moreover, that K2 and D3 are not only fat-soluble, but should exhibit better and more complete absorption when pre-dissolved into liquid formulations.

Ultimately, it was a pretty simple decision to release it as a liquid. Especially as it doesn't taste like much and is very easy to take.

 

[rowz4broz]

We've been using the product here for months, and we've been working on it for years. We've run through a bunch of iterations -- including a very complicated one with chrysin nanoparticles. (That one's a real long story...) The current version, which is the culmination of a long process, has seen a lot of use here -- and we wouldn't release it if feedback and results weren't exceptional.

But don't take it from us. In all things, the best and most reliable results and feedback come from impartial and unbiased third parties. What do you say we send you a free bottle and pay for your blood tests? PM me.

And the product is a liquid because most of the active ingredients are liquid.

The geranylgeraniol comes from a liquid annatto extract, and the ingredient itself is a liquid in pure form. Phytol, similarly, is a liquid in pure form. It's basically impossible to turn those liquid ingredients into solids -- not, at least, without heroic efforts, like adsorption onto aerosil or porous zeolites.

And then there's the fact that Tongkat Ali is actually traditionally taken as a liquid extract, and many of the studies which examine it have used it in liquid form.

Moreover, that K2 and D3 are not only fat-soluble, but should exhibit better and more complete absorption when pre-dissolved into liquid formulations.

Ultimately, it was a pretty simple decision to release it as a liquid. Especially as it doesn't taste like much and is very easy to take.

I just bought two bottles! Wanna pay for my blood work ��

 

[nasrenegade]

But don't take it from us. In all things, the best and most reliable results and feedback come from impartial and unbiased third parties. What do you say we send you a free bottle and pay for your blood tests? PM me.

Thats a bold move, and I like when companies put their money where their mouth is.

But, that doesnt resolve the question of why you dont have bloodwork now. Surely it would make sense to have that kind of data to use as a part of claims made with your product. Youve had the product for months, why not have some of the people using it get bloods done?

 

[JakeAntaeus]

Thats a bold move, and I like when companies put their money where their mouth is.

But, that doesnt resolve the question of why you dont have bloodwork now. Surely it would make sense to have that kind of data to use as a part of claims made with your product. Youve had the product for months, why not have some of the people using it get bloods done?

Good point. Very observant, too.

Okay, I was hoping to keep this under wraps for now, but...

What do you think the largest market is for Ultratest? Our community, or the much larger community of aging males -- often sedentary -- with declining testosterone levels? Clearly the latter, right?

So, with that in mind, we're working on a preliminary human study, at N=9. We're going to publish our data, which includes blood tests, in a scientific journal in the very near future. We can't post the data before it has been submitted for publication. (Unless we post on a preprint server like Biorxiv, but that's still frowned-upon in chemistry and biology. We are, however, looking into it.) Once we've got a paper in press, we're going to expand our marketing efforts for this product -- because we believe that it's something every man should take. Hopefully, with time and sufficient data, andrologists will come to agree with us.

I'm checking to see if this is possible, but I'd like to include some information on the testing and blood tests we've run in the extended writeup, which should be out next month, and will be a PDF download. (It's big.)

In the meantime, we are, of course, still open to paying for a couple of blood tests for the AM community. rowz4broz: PM me.

And I'll add that Ultratest is just the first product in a line of comprehensive anti-aging/male health products that we're working on.

 

[fightnews]

Im in, ill be pct'ing in a week. Ill do this, mtest and clomid... Sound good?

 

[kl1234]

I’m not interested in bloodwork... as I’m all about feel. But, as an agingmale... how would you recommend one to run this? The only thing that concerns me is the hefty dose of k2. Would you recommend maybe a 5 on 2 off? That way- you could possibly run indefinitely?

 

[rowz4broz]

Much respect... I used the laughing emojis but I don’t think they are showing (I was being semi sarcastic haha) I live in NJ and getting paid bloodwork is next to Impossible otherwise I would hop all over that! I did purchase two bottles tho and am eager to see how they effect me. I’m all about that endogenous test production

 

[patrick25]

I think it works but it's very early this will be day 3 but yesterday about an hour and a half after dose I felt great for about 5 hours. Then in the middle of the night I woke up with a hard on that almost hurt. My dosage is 1ml at 3 pm. I have to give it more time though because I hate jumping the gun on things. I will dose this way every day.

 

[GHopkins]

Is there a best time of day to does?

 

[test112]

Any effects on the 5ar enzyme?

 

[JakeAntaeus]

Is there a best time of day to does?

We would suggest that you take it with the last meal of your day, but I don't think that it makes too much of a difference.

 

[JakeAntaeus]

Any effects on the 5ar enzyme?

No known effect. It's extremely likely that there's no meaningful effect at 5-alpha reductase.

There is an old paper which suggests that Vitamin K group compounds are 5AR inhibitors.... But it's a junk paper. The IC50 is so damn high (millimolar) that you'd to eat multiple tablespoons of vitamin K2 before 5AR is affected in the slightest.

 

[rowz4broz]

I thought TA had an effect on DHT?

 

[Jeremyk1]

We would suggest that you take it with the last meal of your day, but I don't think that it makes too much of a difference.

Is there much benefit to doubling the dose? The label seems a little vague. Take one serving per day but don’t exceed two. I’m not familiar with dosing strategies on the new compounds in this product as they are, naturally, new.

 

[JakeAntaeus]

I thought TA had an effect on DHT?

Eurycoma longfolia has a few known mechanisms of action that are of relevance here.

First, it increases the activity of the enzyme CYP17A1. This accelerates and enhances the conversion of progesterone and pregnenolone to androgens. This was the first mechanism of action to be discovered, and it seems to be e.longfolia's primary. It's mediated by small water-soluble peptides. (Which supports the traditional way of taking the herb -- as a water extract. And it's another good reason for a liquid product.)

There's a different active principle called eurycomanone. This one is mildly anti-estrogenic, and it's a PDE inhibitor. As a PDE inhibitor, which prevents the breakdown of cAMP, it works in synergy with geranylgeraniol, which boosts cAMP production. In any case, it's two paths to the same goal... ultimately, whether you increase cAMP levels or prevent cAMP breakdown, you're going to get higher testosterone levels. And it's even better to do both.

Eurycomanone is water-soluble, and present in water extracts, but at fairly low concentrations. Although it has fine bioavailability, its effects are almost certainly secondary to those of the CYP17A1-boosting proteins.

I'm not aware of any components in that plant which inhibit or activate 5AR, though. I don't think they're much of a factor here.

 

[jim2509]

Firstly please excuse my ignorance. I have bought Ultra Test which i cant wait to try by the way being 43 years old this could be just what i need.

My question is in a few weeks ill be finishing my current Invictus VII KT stack and will then look at using Ultra Test and i have some Dermacrine and 4-AD gathering dust in my cuboard. Could I stack Ultra Test with either of these products and if so what would be better and what would one 'expect' benefits wise??

Obviously nobody can be 100% exact on results but i would appreciate your expert opinion/advice. Hopefully us older guys are in for a treat with Ultra Test.

 

[thebigt]

Firstly please excuse my ignorance. I have bought Ultra Test which i cant wait to try by the way being 43 years old this could be just what i need.

My question is in a few weeks ill be finishing my current Invictus VII KT stack and will then look at using Ultra Test and i have some Dermacrine and 4-AD gathering dust in my cuboard. Could I stack Ultra Test with either of these products and if so what would be better and what would one 'expect' benefits wise??

Obviously nobody can be 100% exact on results but i would appreciate your expert opinion/advice. Hopefully us older guys are in for a treat with Ultra Test.

dermacrine stacks well with 'ALMOST' everything...at 43 you should see some nice benefits from it!!!

 

[jim2509]

dermacrine stacks well with 'ALMOST' everything...at 43 you should see some nice benefits from it!!!

Thanks buddy i shall give Dermacrine a whirl alongside Ultra Test and see how that goes.

 

[jrock645]

dermacrine stacks well with 'ALMOST' everything...at 43 you should see some nice benefits from it!!!

I’m unclear on this... I’d thought you’re supposed to run sustain after dermacrine, but now I see you can stack it. Which way is it?

 

[rowz4broz]

Dermacrine is an interesting product. I’ve seen it touted as both a test base for on cycle and as an off cycle test booster that doesn’t require pct. However, ive also see that dhea products should be followed with a pct. So I’m unsure how to properly use it lol, saving the bottle I have for a future cycle

 

[AdelV]

Thats a bold move, and I like when companies put their money where their mouth is.

But, that doesnt resolve the question of why you dont have bloodwork now. Surely it would make sense to have that kind of data to use as a part of claims made with your product. Youve had the product for months, why not have some of the people using it get bloods done?

Jake offered me this 4-6 months ago, I'd have to check my email to be sure of an exact date.

At the time I was, am taking a break from supplements.

 

[JakeAntaeus]

Is there much benefit to doubling the dose? The label seems a little vague. Take one serving per day but don’t exceed two. I’m not familiar with dosing strategies on the new compounds in this product as they are, naturally, new.

That's a good question, and the point needs clarification.

The product was designed so that the recommended dose of 1ml would be optimal for most people. But if you're very different from most people in size -- particularly if you're over 250 pounds (which is 99th percentile in military-age adults, by the way, so quite rare) -- then you might want to start with a 1.5ml dose.

There wasn't much space on the label for this sort of information, but we'll add this to the FAQ.

 

[JakeAntaeus]

Firstly please excuse my ignorance. I have bought Ultra Test which i cant wait to try by the way being 43 years old this could be just what i need.

My question is in a few weeks ill be finishing my current Invictus VII KT stack and will then look at using Ultra Test and i have some Dermacrine and 4-AD gathering dust in my cuboard. Could I stack Ultra Test with either of these products and if so what would be better and what would one 'expect' benefits wise??

Obviously nobody can be 100% exact on results but i would appreciate your expert opinion/advice. Hopefully us older guys are in for a treat with Ultra Test.

Ultratest and Dermacrine compliment each other, and they should work exceptionally well together. Sounds like a great combo to me.

The 4AD question is complicated.

The easy answer is that it would be sub-optimal to use Ultratest alongside anything suppressive, like 4AD.

Having said that, geranylgeraniol's effects are cAMP/PKA-mediated, and there's a lot of cross-talk between cAMP/PKA and the androgen receptor. From this study: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20813184

Several studies in the mid-late 1990s demonstrated that AR could
be stimulated by elevated cAMP levels. In 1994, Ikonen et al.
demonstrated that rat AR transactivation by testosterone could be
enhanced by the PKA stimulators; forskolin (an activator of adenylate
cyclase) and 8-bromo-cAMP (8-Br-cAMP, a cAMP analogue) in
monkey kidney CV-1 cells cotransfected with an AR expression
plasmid [20]. Synergistic stimulation of AR by androgen and PKA
activators was dependent upon intact AR DNA- and ligand-binding
domains. Two years later, Nazareth and Weigel demonstrated
androgen-independent stimulation of human AR by forskolin in
both CV-1 cells, and PC-3 prostate carcinoma cells transfected with AR
[21]. Nazareth and Weigel observed that neither R1881 (methyltrienolone,
a synthetic androgen analogue) nor forskolin increased AR
protein levels, but rather enhanced the AR activity by increasing AR–
DNA binding. These results suggested that other aspects of AR
interactions with additional co-activators and/or transcription factors
may also be affected by forskolin/cAMP, however the exact mechanisms
underlying this androgen-independent stimulation remained
unclear
[. . .]
In a 2005 study by Kim and others, a novel mechanism of PKA–AR
cross-talk was uncovered and confirmed that PKA activation can
enhance androgen-dependent transcription.

In short, cAMP/PKA can potentially enhance androgen receptor signalling -- and this effect seems to be independent of whether that testosterone is endogenous or not.

So it's at least possible that Ultratest can enhance "on-cycle" effects. We plan on looking into this with animal experiments over the coming year. Of course, the primary and intended use of the product is as a testosterone booster which augments endogenous production...

 

[jim2509]

Thanks Jake for taking the time to explain the complexities regarding my question. I shall indeed run a Ultra Test/Dermacrine stack starting in a few weeks. I hope it'll put a spring in my step and a shot in the arm regarding training. I look forward to peoples logs on this product and more information from your good self.

 

[Jeremyk1]

Ultratest and Dermacrine compliment each other, and they should work exceptionally well together. Sounds like a great combo to me.

The 4AD question is complicated.

The easy answer is that it would be sub-optimal to use Ultratest alongside anything suppressive, like 4AD.

Having said that, geranylgeraniol's effects are cAMP/PKA-mediated, and there's a lot of cross-talk between cAMP/PKA and the androgen receptor. From this study: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20813184



In short, cAMP/PKA can potentially enhance androgen receptor signalling -- and this effect seems to be independent of whether that testosterone is endogenous or not.

So it's at least possible that Ultratest can enhance "on-cycle" effects. We plan on looking into this with animal experiments over the coming year. Of course, the primary and intended use of the product is as a testosterone booster which augments endogenous production...

Thank you for clarification on dosing!

As far as taking alongside PHs, I believe in some of the reading I did, it said that forskolin could boost levels of beta-HSDs as well as sTAR via its effects on cAMP. Other reading suggested these enzymes are involved in the conversion of DHEA to testosterone. I’m not sure what all PHs would be using these enzymes, but one assumes geranylgeraniol could potentially increase the conversion rates as well, as it sounds like it will function similar to forskolin but with improved bioavailability. I don’t remember ever seeing any info on dosing forskolin alongside any PHs or andros, except I think LG Sciences includes forskolin in one of their products. Anyway, between this and the improvement in AR signaling, this could, in theory, be a fantastic addition to a cycle. I would like to see more information about this.

 

[thebigt]

I’m unclear on this... I’d thought you’re supposed to run sustain after dermacrine, but now I see you can stack it. Which way is it?

either or is fine...personally I don't feel dermacrine requires a pct, especially after a short run of a month or even 2, but running sustain alpha after dermacrine would have the pct base covered really well.

...adding ultratest would definitely take it to another level.


btw-it's amazing that with all the test boosters on the market that no one has used the name ULTRATEST....very cool name, which I would have thought of it for one of the naming contests I've entered!!!!

 

[ucheoma]

We've been using the product here for months, and we've been working on it for years. We've run through a bunch of iterations -- including a very complicated one with chrysin nanoparticles. (That one's a real long story...) The current version, which is the culmination of a long process, has seen a lot of use here -- and we wouldn't release it if feedback and results weren't exceptional.

But don't take it from us. In all things, the best and most reliable results and feedback come from impartial and unbiased third parties. What do you say we send you a free bottle and pay for your blood tests? PM me.

And the product is a liquid because most of the active ingredients are liquid.

The geranylgeraniol comes from a liquid annatto extract, and the ingredient itself is a liquid in pure form. Phytol, similarly, is a liquid in pure form. It's basically impossible to turn those liquid ingredients into solids -- not, at least, without heroic efforts, like adsorption onto aerosil or porous zeolites.

And then there's the fact that Tongkat Ali is actually traditionally taken as a liquid extract, and many of the studies which examine it have used it in liquid form.

Moreover, that K2 and D3 are not only fat-soluble, but should exhibit better and more complete absorption when pre-dissolved into liquid formulations.

Ultimately, it was a pretty simple decision to release it as a liquid. Especially as it doesn't taste like much and is very easy to take.

Have sent you a PM. I hope I fit the profile
What are we testing for? If you want free test throw in an extra bottle and we're on. Cost of the bloodwork is easily double 2 bottles but i like that you're willing to put your product to the test!